C-17s for the IAF?

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Re: C-17s for the IAF?

Post by Dmurphy »

http://www.globalaircraft.org/planes/c- ... ter_iii.pl

No figures here, but check out the "achievements"
During normal testing, C-17s set 22 world records, including payload to altitude time-to-climb and the short takeoff and landing mark
Added later: http://www.boeing.com/history/mdc/c-17.htm
With its 160,000-pound payload, the C-17 can take off from a 7,600-foot airfield, fly 2,400 nautical miles and land on a small, austere airfield in 3,000 feet or less. The C-17 can be refueled in flight. On the ground, a fully loaded aircraft, using engine reversers, can back up a 2 percent slope.

During normal testing, C-17s have set 33 world records, including payload to altitude time-to-climb and the short takeoff and landing mark, in which the C-17 took off in less than 1,400 feet, carried a payload of 44,000 pounds to altitude and landed in less than 1,400 feet.
Last edited by Dmurphy on 16 Nov 2009 18:07, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: C-17s for the IAF?

Post by KrishG »

JTull wrote: As I recall, the airstrip had developed cracks. Quick googling does not give me any specifc links except this one

This link mentions Carnic runway had 1500ft available while 200ft was submerged.
A C-17 cannot land on a 2000 ft runway with a meaningful load let alone 1500 ft (not that anything else can do it).
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Re: C-17s for the IAF?

Post by putnanja »

Australia Wants $2 Billion C-17 Deal
The Defense Security Cooperation Agency today notified Congress of a possible $2 billion sale of C-17 Globemaster cargo aircraft and related equipment to Australia.

In a statement, DSCA said Australia had requested four C-17s, up to 18 Pratt & Whitney F117-PW-100 engines, as many as four AN/AAQ-24V(13) Large Aircraft Infrared Countermeasures (LAIRCM) systems and up to 15 AN/AVS-9 night vision goggles and related services and support equipment.
...
So, including spares and support, the Australian contract worked out to around $500 million per aircraft (2006 prices). Of course, if more aircrafts were ordered, it may come down a little. Still it is quite a big amount for those birds!

As for US, with existing support system in place, it still cost them around $350 million per plane in 2008
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Re: C-17s for the IAF?

Post by GeorgeWelch »

RaviBg wrote:As for US, with existing support system in place, it still cost them around $350 million per plane in 2008
The problem with prices on the web is that you can find any price you want.

http://www.govexec.com/story_page.cfm?a ... dcn=e_gvet
House Defense Appropriations Subcommittee Chairman John Murtha, D-Pa., said Wednesday that he expects the fiscal 2010 Defense spending bill will include funding to buy about 10 C-17 Globemaster III cargo planes, but signaled he is worried about the $250 million price tag for each aircraft.

Before he signs off on the additional planes, Murtha said he wants Boeing Co., the plane's maker, to give the government a price more comparable to the roughly $200 million per plane the government paid as part of the last multiyear procurement deal for C-17s, which ended in 2007.

The House-passed Defense Appropriations bill included $674 million to buy three C-17s, or $225 million per plane. The Senate version added $2.5 billion for 10 planes.
Three different prices in one article ;)

http://www.defensenews.com/story.php?i=4361097
India is negotiating the purchase of 10 C-17 aircraft . . . The $1.7 billion deal . . .
$1.7 billion / 10 = $170 million per plane

It said so on the web so it must be true.
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Re: C-17s for the IAF?

Post by rajeshks »

C17 may not be for the NE theatre. MTA is for that purpose, afterall 10 or 20 MBTs airlifted by C17s wont have any significance in a war with China. I think its main duty will be to support an overseas deployment. With 3 million Indians in Gulf countries such a need can come anytime. IA has one strike corps earmarked for overseas deployment, IN is coming with 2 ACs and now IAF is playing their part with heavy lift capability + Su 30 MKIs. This may be part of a larger game wherein India slowly start projecting its power in IOR.
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Re: Indian Military Aviation

Post by Gilles »

GeorgeWelch wrote: Now: Please backup your assertion that the C-17 has a high Vmcg relative to other planes
I know you are just trying to annoy me.
Do you learn that method in "Arms Sales 101" ? I'm asking because I met your type several times before and I know the technique you are using very well. You question everything I write, and although I reply to everthing in detail, its long and boring, people get lost in it, and you can just reply "BLA BLA BLA" and attempt to make people believe I am just talking a bunch of sh.t. I'm afraid I'm not the one who is guilty of that.

The short reply is that on the widebodied airliner I fly, reducing VMCG would do nothing to improve take-off performance. In the C-17, it does, or else Boeing would not attempt to improve it as they claim they are in their C-17B presentations. Now please spare people here your constant feigned ignorance and move on. I will no longer reply to your questions.

I stand by what I wrote. No need to prove it to you or to your kind. You are not the ones I need to warn. You guys could go to the Arctic and sell freezers to Eskimos in Igloos. Yes, the Indians are smart, but I thought the Canadians were smart also. Yet they swallowed the Boeing pitch lock, stock and barrel and purchased the Boeing that "take-off from a 7,400 foot runway, fly 2400 nm with a 160,000 lbs payload and can, day or night, land on a 3,500 foot unpaved runways" but that hasn't even seen dust since the day they were purchased in 2007.
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Re: Indian Military Aviation

Post by GeorgeWelch »

Gilles wrote:The short reply is that on the widebodied airliner I fly, reducing VMCG would do nothing to improve take-off performance.
That only means that Vmcg is less than V1 for your plane (although I bet it is a limiting factor for say a lightly-loaded ferry flight)

If Vmcg is the limiting factor for V1, that doesn't necessarily mean Vmcg is high. It could mean V1 is low. which would make sense considering the C-17 is optimized for, you know short takeoff performance.
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Re: Indian Military Aviation

Post by GeorgeWelch »

Gilles wrote:Yet they swallowed the Boeing pitch lock, stock and barrel and purchased the Boeing that "take-off from a 7,400 foot runway, fly 2400 nm with a 160,000 lbs payload and can, day or night, land on a 3,500 foot unpaved runways"
Which it can do

(the exact quote is slightly different but I'm not going to quibble)
Gilles wrote:but that hasn't even seen dust since the day they were purchased in 2007.
That's not a limitation of the plane, that's a limitation of your government's willingness to use the plane.

USAF C-17s most definitely see dust.


------------edit--------------

Don't want to be accused of postcount padding, so I'll just edit this one instead of adding a new post, but real-life operations have shown the C-17 to be enormously useful

http://www.airliners.net/aviation-forum ... in/113437/
Cargotanker wrote:
Keesje wrote: It's also bad news for the C-17 sales team. (C17's are hardly used in theatre).
Incorrect. Two squadrons are continuously in theater, along with dozens of aircraft transiting from German fields directly into OEF/OIF.

I have a link from 3 years ago that describes the 2 EAS concept:

http://www.baseops.net/militarylife/c17-deployment.html

Since then I would say that TDY(flying away from home station) rates have increased as whatever efficiencies that were realized by the 2 EAS concept were filled with other taskings.

Back when I was in C-141s I was a huge C-17 critic, stating that it would never be used for everything it was designed for. Wrong.

The US was very fortunate to have C-17s in significant numbers at the start of OEF. Its geographic isolation, lack of decent fields, and 'bad guys' with rpgs and SAMs made it into the type of conflict the C-17 was designed for.
http://www.618tacc.amc.af.mil/news/stor ... =123174067
C-17s flying TDD (Theater Direct Delivery) missions have flown nearly 12,000 sorties in 2009, delivering more than 421,000 passengers and 113,000 tons of cargo throughout the U.S. Central Command area of responsibility.

http://www.c17foramerica.com/pdf/CRS_Re ... ngress.pdf
CRS wrote:The C-17’s ability to operate from austere airfields in Albania and Macedonia was
demonstrated during Operation Allied Force in March-June 1999, when C-17s achieved
a 96% mission-capable rate. In joint testimony before the Senate Armed Services
Committee, Secretary of Defense William Cohen and Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of
Staff General Henry Shelton extolled the C-17’s contributions to the Kosovo conflict
stating, “...the C-17 was the workhouse of the airlift force, providing for the rapid
deployment of critical warfighting and humanitarian materiel.” They further testified that

-----------
Throughout Operation Allied Force, U.S. forces had to overcome many limitations in
transportation infrastructure. Poor airport surface conditions in Tirana, Albania, for
example, slowed aircraft turnaround times, limited throughput, and slowed the onward
movement of forces and humanitarian supplies. Our transportation and other logistic
assets proved to be flexible, effective, and efficient in responding to these limitations.
In particular, the C-17 made the concept of direct delivery — the strategic air
movement of cargo from an aerial port of embarkation to an airfield as close as
practicable to the final destination, a reality.
-----------

When Turkey declined access to attack northern
Iraq from bases in Turkey, C-17s enabled a U.S. ground presence in northern Iraq, as 15
C-17s
airdropped 1,100 paratroopers from the Army’s 173rd Airborne Brigade before
buttressing the force with an additional million pounds of equipment, M-1 Abrams tanks,
and an additional 1,000 soldiers. In late 2004, C-17s stepped into the tactical airlift role
along side C-130s to counter increasing convoy ambushes helping to “relieve nearly 3,500
vehicles and 9,000 convoy operators per month.”
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Re: C-17s for the IAF?

Post by RayC »

IA has one strike corps earmarked for overseas deployment
Any links?

That is a new one.
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Re: C-17s for the IAF?

Post by rohitvats »

RayC wrote:
IA has one strike corps earmarked for overseas deployment
Any links?

That is a new one.
XXI Corps. It is believed that in case of foreign deployment, XXI is the candidate. IIRC, it is ex-IPKF and hence, the assumption. I do not think there is any GOI/IA document(public) asserting the same.
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Re: C-17s for the IAF?

Post by Rahul M »

wasn't the I corps mentioned as a candidate when there was speculation about deployment to afghanistan ?
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Re: C-17s for the IAF?

Post by RayC »

In the olden days, Corps were identified as XXXIII Corps and so on. Now it is done with normal numerals.

21 Corps has an important role to play. Could that role be relegated for foreign deployment?! It would create a void in India's strike capability!

54 Inf Div alone of 21 Corps was IPKF since it was closest to SL and the situation per force demand that deployment. Other Divs came from elsewhere.
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Re: C-17s for the IAF?

Post by Aditya G »

IMHO, the only true expeditionary troops we have is the 50 Inde Parachute Bde.
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Re: C-17s for the IAF?

Post by rajeshks »

Strike corps dont have any business inside Indian territory, in that sense all 3 are for overseas/foreign deployment only.

It is good that our defence establishment also started thinking big. We have a lot of economic/political/human interests in Indian ocean region countries, so better be prepared.
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Re: C-17s for the IAF?

Post by putnanja »

rajeshks wrote:Strike corps dont have any business inside Indian territory, in that sense all 3 are for overseas/foreign deployment only.

It is good that our defence establishment also started thinking big. We have a lot of economic/political/human interests in Indian ocean region countries, so better be prepared.
er, strike corps are used for making thrust across the border when attacked. They are the ones who will take the fight into enemy territory( pakistan or china) as opposed to holding corps, which are defensive, in the sense that they hold the defences when attacked to prevent the enemy forces from gaining Indian territory.

Please look into various sources available on the web for terminologies and Indian ORBAT ( Order of Battle).
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Re: C-17s for the IAF?

Post by rajeshks »

RaviBg wrote: er, strike corps are used for making thrust across the border when attacked. They are the ones who will take the fight into enemy territory( pakistan or china) as opposed to holding corps, which are defensive, in the sense that they hold the defences when attacked to prevent the enemy forces from gaining Indian territory.
Exactly... thats what i also meant but didnt bother to explain..
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Re: C-17s for the IAF?

Post by rohitvats »

rajeshks wrote:Strike corps dont have any business inside Indian territory, in that sense all 3 are for overseas/foreign deployment only.

It is good that our defence establishment also started thinking big. We have a lot of economic/political/human interests in Indian ocean region countries, so better be prepared.
Can you first try and understand in what context the post was made, what a Strike Corps is and then make the grand statement?
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Re: C-17s for the IAF?

Post by Rahul M »

/adding a bit of ghee to the embers. :mrgreen:

rohit, wasn't there a certain GOC of 1 corps mathura who said something like "my formation has no job inside India's borders " ?! :wink:
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Re: C-17s for the IAF?

Post by rohitvats »

Rahul M wrote:/adding a bit of ghee to the embers. :mrgreen:

rohit, wasn't there a certain GOC of 1 corps mathura who said something like "my formation has no job inside India's borders " ?! :wink:
You too Brutus.....yes..very true..but that statement and one by gentleman above...well....poles apart is an understatement...
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Re: C-17s for the IAF?

Post by RayC »

Rohit,

Drop it.

You don't have an idea what 21 Corps is all about!
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Re: C-17s for the IAF?

Post by rohitvats »

RayC wrote:Rohit,

Drop it.

You don't have an idea what 21 Corps is all about!
And nor have I claimed to know anything about it.

If it is my statement (reply to post by rajeshks) that you are taking about, well, it has nothing to do with 21 or any other Corps. It was a reply to the grand statement the gentleman made with out bothering to check the context (about deploying forces overseas) and make a extremely general and erreneous remark.

I think the least one expects from the posters is to read the statements, understand the context and then reply. And in case you feel I am playing the cop here, that is not the idea. It is pertinent that there is some sort of seriousness shown while posting/replying. I come here to try and learn something. Post such as above do not contribute anything to the discussion and only betray lack of seriousness/effort put while replying/posting the material.
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Re: C-17s for the IAF?

Post by rajeshks »

rohitvats wrote: And nor have I claimed to know anything about it.

If it is my statement (reply to post by rajeshks) that you are taking about, well, it has nothing to do with 21 or any other Corps. It was a reply to the grand statement the gentleman made with out bothering to check the context (about deploying forces overseas) and make a extremely general and erreneous remark.

I think the least one expects from the posters is to read the statements, understand the context and then reply. And in case you feel I am playing the cop here, that is not the idea. It is pertinent that there is some sort of seriousness shown while posting/replying. I come here to try and learn something. Post such as above do not contribute anything to the discussion and only betray lack of seriousness/effort put while replying/posting the material.
Rohit bhai please dont take things too seriously. we all are friends in this virtual world.
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Re: C-17s for the IAF?

Post by rohitvats »

rajeshks wrote:
Rohit bhai please dont take things too seriously. we all are friends in this virtual world.
Nothing against you, rajeshks. We are friends..no doubt.
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Re: C-17s for the IAF?

Post by RayC »

rohitvats wrote:
RayC wrote:Rohit,

Drop it.

You don't have an idea what 21 Corps is all about!
And nor have I claimed to know anything about it.

If it is my statement (reply to post by rajeshks) that you are taking about, well, it has nothing to do with 21 or any other Corps. It was a reply to the grand statement the gentleman made with out bothering to check the context (about deploying forces overseas) and make a extremely general and erreneous remark.

I think the least one expects from the posters is to read the statements, understand the context and then reply. And in case you feel I am playing the cop here, that is not the idea. It is pertinent that there is some sort of seriousness shown while posting/replying. I come here to try and learn something. Post such as above do not contribute anything to the discussion and only betray lack of seriousness/effort put while replying/posting the material.
I am not saying anything that you have stated.

I am only trying to state that one must not state things which are not quite in keeping with the Nation's claimed policy.

If 21 Corps goes off, there will be a void!

I cannot say more than that!

Sorry if I ruffled feathers!
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Re: C-17s for the IAF?

Post by rohitvats »

RayC wrote:
I am not saying anything that you have stated.

I am only trying to state that one must not state things which are not quite in keeping with the Nation's claimed policy.

If 21 Corps goes off, there will be a void!

I cannot say more than that!

Sorry if I ruffled feathers!
My reply was on the assumption that you're trying to admonish me for reply to rajeshks. I was trying to say exactly what you've said. Peace.
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Re: C-17s for the IAF?

Post by Airavat »

UPI

No details of the deal have been disclosed by India's Ministry of Defense. But local and international media experts say the negotiation centers on the purchase of 10 C-17 aircraft made by the U.S.-based Boeing, the world's second-largest plane maker. While reports pegged the deal price at $1.7 billion, analysts question the size of the discount that the United States could be offering to India.

Specifically, each aircraft costs $250 million and the U.S. Congress has authorized $2.5 billion for 10 of the heavy-lift transport planes for the country's air force. The plane, though, is an aircraft that the U.S. Department of Defense does not want to retain for domestic use.

In a joint-lift exercise, the U.S Air Force flew the Globemaster in India last month. The joint maneuver, in Agra, was intended to allow Indian defense experts to familiarize themselves with the plane.

"Indian military needs to do three things: augment its ability to quickly lift larger numbers of troops as it views possible threats on its border with China, strengthen its presence on the Pakistani border, and fight terrorism and low-intensity warfare," a senior Defense Ministry official was quoted as saying by Defense News.
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Re: Indian Military Aviation

Post by Gilles »

GeorgeWelch wrote:
CRS wrote: The C-17’s ability to operate from austere airfields in Albania and Macedonia was demonstrated during Operation Allied Force in March-June 1999, when C-17s achieved a 96% mission-capable rate. In joint testimony before the Senate Armed Services Committee, Secretary of Defense William Cohen and Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff General Henry Shelton extolled the C-17’s contributions to the Kosovo conflict
stating, “...the C-17 was the workhouse of the airlift force, providing for the rapid deployment of critical warfighting and humanitarian materiel.” They further testified that
Throughout Operation Allied Force, U.S. forces had to overcome many limitations in transportation infrastructure. Poor airport surface conditions in Tirana, Albania, for nexample, slowed aircraft turnaround times, limited throughput, and slowed the onward movement of forces and humanitarian supplies. Our transportation and other logistic assets proved to be flexible, effective, and efficient in responding to these limitations.
In particular, the C-17 made the concept of direct delivery — the strategic air
movement of cargo from an aerial port of embarkation to an airfield as close as practicable to the final destination, a reality.
-----------
I am familiar with this report. It is a pure example of the kind of B/S that is delivered to both lawmakers and taxpayers.

Tirana was used as an example of a place where poor runway conditions allowed the C-17 to demonstrate its direct delivery capability. This report has been quoted many times as proof that the C-17 can do what it was made to do. It looks fine on the surface, unless you decide to look up what Tirana airport is all about:

Tirana, also called Rinas airport, is the main airport of the capital city of Albania. It has a 2,735 meter concrete runway. Any airplane in the World can land there, including the An-124, the An-225 and the C-5 Galaxy.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tirana_Int ... %AB_Tereza

The concept of Direct delivery by C-17 was demonstrated there you say ???????

Question and verify everything you are told by these people. EVERYTHING!
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Re: Indian Military Aviation

Post by GeorgeWelch »

Gilles wrote:Tirana was used as an example of a place where poor runway conditions allowed the C-17 to demonstrate its direct delivery capability.
Incorrect.

Tirana allowed the C-17 to demonstrate it's direct delivery capability, but it had nothing to do with poor runway conditions (or very little anways, they do specifically quote the poor surface conditions of the runway, but that's not the main point as we will see)

The issue seems to be that you don't understand what direct delivery is.

http://www.globalsecurity.org/military/ ... s95026.pdf
Direct delivery involves bypassing a main operating base to land directly at another base in the theater
of operations. This base may or may not be a small, austere airfield.
So right off the bat, direct delivery does not necessarily have anything to do with it being a bad surface (even though it wasn't the best in this case).


http://www.afa.org/media/reports/april.asp
The ramp was soon handling more than four times the acceptable load.
We have a very congested airport that was also running C-130 missions and Apache flights.

http://www.globalsecurity.org/military/ ... 92/PBW.htm
Also, the C-17's superior ground maneuvering allows more aircraft to be on the ramp offloading supplies to our forces. Eight C-17s can park in the space required for 3 C-5s (C-17/C-5 payloads are about the same). In addition, the C-17 has a smaller turning radius than the C-141 and C-5, and backs up like a C-l30. This means that the C-17 offers a 3 to 1 advantage over C-5 in cargo throughput on a 500,000 square foot ramp.
You can see why a C-5 would NOT have worked in Tirana. The airport was already severely overextended so there simply wasn't room to deal with them.

Also, they mentioned '96% mission-capable rate' for a reason. When trying to support high-tempo operations into a crowded airfield, you simply CANNOT afford to have planes breakdown at that airfield. Not only do they consume valuable ramp space, but then you have to send in a special flight to bring the parts to fix it.

The C-17 has several attributes that make it work well for TDD. Rough field capability is there if you need it. At crowded airports its compact footprint (the C-17 wingspan is only 1.3m wider than the Il-76 and its fuselage is 0.2m shorter than the stretched Il-76MF while still carrying more cargo), ease of ground maneuver and speed of loading and unloading allow a high throughput of material. It's intercontinental range and aerial refueling capability (which the Il-76 doesn't have) enable it to reach anywhere. It's defensive aids and NVG support (another thing the Il-76 lacks) enables it to go into hostile zones.

While not every attribute is needed in every situation, the portfolio of capabilities adds up to a very potent combination that allows extreme flexibility and capability.
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Re: C-17s for the IAF?

Post by GeorgeWelch »

http://www.financialexpress.com/news/Ce ... et/544262/

Centre okay with Boeing aircraft to replace ageing IL-76 fleet
Keen on replacing the ageing Russian IL-76 transport aircraft in the Indian Air Force (IAF), the ministry of defence has approved in principle the purchase of the US-based Boeing's C-17 heavy-lift Globemaster III. The deal is worth over $2 billion.

"The C-17s have been short listed after IAF carried out a thorough study on its capability to take-off and land on short runways with heavy loads. The defency ministry has sent a letter to the US administration seeking a formal offer for these machines," highly placed sources on conditions of anonymity told FE. This development comes ahead of Prime Minister Manmohan Singh's visit to the US.

Sources said the C-17 deal was discussed and cleared at a recent meeting of the Defence Acquisition Council chaired by defence minister AK Antony. The deal, likely to be inked in few months, will be discussed during Prime Minister Manmohan Singh's visit to the US.

. . .

"Demands on the airlift fleet are growing due to enhanced national and international commitments that will only increase in the future," said a senior IAF officer.

According to the former Air Chief Fali Homi Major, "… with India emerging as a global economic power, it is necessary that the IAF enhance its capabilities to fulfill new responsibilities. And, to meet these new security challenges, the IAF needs strategic reach, there is a necessity to build up our strategic assets …"
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Re: C-17s for the IAF?

Post by srai »

GeorgeWelch wrote:http://www.financialexpress.com/news/Ce ... et/544262/

Centre okay with Boeing aircraft to replace ageing IL-76 fleet
...
Initially, the IAF will place an order for 10 C-17s through the US government's foreign military sales (FMS) route, and may later go in for a follow-on order, sources said.

...

"If accepted, the aircraft should be inducted in about three years after the contract is signed ," sources added.

...
I wonder how many will be in the "follow-on" order? If IAF is replacing all the IL-76s (and heavy lift capacity), then we could see another 4 to 10 C-17s in the follow on order.

Since it will take 3 years for the aircraft delivery (which is the time typically required to order parts, set up assembly, assemble, etc.), these C-17s are going to be separate from the USAF order unlike the Australian AF order which was directly delivered from USAF order, and they receiving it within 9 months of contract signing. Reports on the IAF's C-130Js order also stated around 3 years for aircraft delivery once contract was signed. Given that it takes around 2-3 years to reach FOC for a new aircraft type, we are looking at 2015/16 (3 years for delivery and 2-3 years for FOC) when these C-17s can begin replacing the IL-76s,which will be around 20+ to 30 years old in 2015.
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Re: C-17s for the IAF?

Post by srai »

This C-130J article gives an example of how long it takes to reach "independent" full operational capability for a new aircraft type.

India’s Lockheed Martin C-130J Super Hercules Airlifter
This is India’s first experience with C-130s so the package being provided by the U.S. government is a complete solution. The package includes six aircraft, three years of initial support, training of aircrew and maintenance technicians, spares, ground support and test equipment, servicing carts, forklifts, loading vehicles, cargo pallets, and a team of technical specialists who will be based in India during the three year initial support period.
Philip
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Re: C-17s for the IAF?

Post by Philip »

The IL-76s are great aircraft,though in need of much upgrading.Their track record in IAF colours is superb.Remember the Maldives op.? The problem is that much of the Soviet era transports were built outside Russia and the Russians haven't as yet got their act together to build these excellent machines at home totally.Whether the giant C-17 is the right replacement is another matter.The giant Antonov's are another option if gigantic size is paramount.,but are these still in poduction.A sensible approach would be to upgrade a large number of IL-76s and acquire an initial small number of C-17s,3-4 to evaluate them.
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Re: C-17s for the IAF?

Post by VishalJ »

We saw a USAF C-17 depart Mumbai on the evening of Nov 20th, spotted another readying for departure yesterday evening.
What are these flights about ?
Philip
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Re: C-17s for the IAF?

Post by Philip »

Pit stops on the way to the battlefields of Iraq and Afghanistan to supply the grunts with mineral water,big Macs and hamburgers me supposes,lus a goodly load of ***** and popcorn for the DX.
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Re: C-17s for the IAF?

Post by VishalJ »

well they've been in Iraq & Af-Pak for ages now, we never saw em before so i doubt that this is a pit-stop.
Actually it would be more of a detour rather than a pitstop to come to BOM.

Another reason ............?
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Re: C-17s for the IAF?

Post by putnanja »

If the Financial Express report is true, then it looks like IAF is slowly moving away from the IL76 platform. That might explain why it decided to go for Airbus A330 MRTT instead of IL-78 based tanker it currently operates.

But the C-17 is still big compared to IL-76. There will be a huge gap between the AN-32s and C-17s. So is IAF planning on ordering more C130s? C-17s are not exact replacements for IL-76s. And using those big aircraft to carry half its capacity cargo is just waste of fuel.
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Re: C-17s for the IAF?

Post by GeorgeWelch »

RaviBg wrote:There will be a huge gap between the AN-32s and C-17s. So is IAF planning on ordering more C130s? C-17s are not exact replacements for IL-76s. And using those big aircraft to carry half its capacity cargo is just waste of fuel.
MRTA
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Re: C-17s for the IAF?

Post by vishnu.nv »

How many IL-76 we do have?

The BR quotes 28, wiki -40 ( including 6 IL-78MKI and 3 for Phalcons) hence 31, recent news articles post numbers such as 23, 26 .....
What is the exact number?
putnanja
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Re: C-17s for the IAF?

Post by putnanja »

GeorgeWelch wrote:
MRTA
The MRTA project with Russia appears to be a replacement for AN32s , not IL-76s.
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Re: C-17s for the IAF?

Post by srai »

RaviBg wrote:
GeorgeWelch wrote:
MRTA
The MRTA project with Russia appears to be a replacement for AN32s , not IL-76s.
Well ... the MTA can transport between 15-20 tons of cargo ... so in the same category as C130s.

IAF down the road may buy a handful (~12) of new gen light transport a/c as well in the 5k to 7k class. Some forward areas in the North/NorthEast may only be able to support light transport planes.
Locked