Telangana Monitor

RayC · Post by **RayC** » 12 Dec 2009 15:41

PMK wants to bifurcate Tamilnadu.

Check the TV news.

Gandharva,

When will it cease?

We are Indic.

RayC · Post by **RayC** » 12 Dec 2009 15:43

PMK wants to bifurcate Tamilnadu.

Check the TV news.

Gandharva,

When will it cease?

We are Indic.

Am I wrong to be worried?

shaardula · Post by **shaardula** » 12 Dec 2009 16:02

halsoor. ulsoor means nothing in no language.

SSridhar · Post by **SSridhar** » 12 Dec 2009 16:39

19th century politics over Telengana

Stan_Savljevic · Post by **Stan_Savljevic** » 12 Dec 2009 16:44

Guys and Ramana,
I am not a fanboi of Shri P. Chidambaram, but the posts on this thread are bordering on the insane. Someone made a schadenfreude-laden post, then folks started blaming PC, and ergo TN. There was no violence in 1956 from Tamils when AP was carved out of the erstwhile Madras Province. The relationship between Tamil and Telugu-speakers even today in TN goes much further than folks here make it sound. There is a BIG % of Telugu-speakers in TN, somuchso that many of our famous Tamil-film heroes have Telugu as the mother tongue and that is not bothering Mu. Ka or DK-folks or me and you.

I must put it that at least posters on this thread are manufacturing a storm in a tea-cup by pitting this as a Telugu-speakers vs. Rest of India, and much of the blame seems to fall on TN. What is going on? What is bothering people here? And ramana, are you out of your mind to compose such a post that you did, with so much responsibility as an admin?! To be honest, after I read your post, I felt like puking at the verbal diarrhoea.

While I cant really do too much about what the people in AP feel on the ground, posts bordering on spreading the victim game onto others dont cut it.

For the record, the Ministry of Home Affairs webpage says that
http://mha.nic.in/pdfs/OrginationalChart(E).pdf
1) there are two Ministers of State for Home Affairs: one, Shri Mullapally Ramachandran, MP from Vadakara constituency (Kerala);
2) two, Shri Ajay Maken, MP from New Delhi.
3) The able Home Secretary Shri GK Pillai is from Kerala,
4) the Secretary (border management) Shri Vinay Kumar is a 1975-batch IAS officer who had earlier headed the Naxal Division in the home ministry.
5) Special Secretary (Internal Security) is Shri UK Bansal, a 1974-batch IPS officer from the UP cadre.
6) Additional Secretary (Centre-State relations) is Smt. Anita Chaudhary, a 1976-batch IAS officer of the Haryana cadre.
7) Additional Secretary (Naxal Management) is Shri Dileep Raj S. Chaudhary, a 1977-batch IAS officer from the MP cadre.
And so on....

Stop the blame game, TN people did not ask the Telengana folks to ask for a new state and this has been going on for ages. Certain uncomfortable questions remain and noone has bothered to answer these: six of the eight TOP Maoist functionaries that Hindustan Times posted are Telugu-speakers from the Dandakaranya region bordering Telengana. Why has the Maoist cult take firm root in that region? If coastal Andhra == Telengana == Rayalaseema, why has the maoist cult taken firm root there alone? Certainly, these are questions that would come in the mind of anyone who watches internal security firmly, whether he be a Tamil-speaker or not. And even if PC is an ass as the posts here make it out to be, there is no reason for spreading such calumny, let alone from an admin. And you all make it sound like PC decides everything, the Cabinet Committee on Security, and the babus have no role to play. Why is there no dissing at KCR who went on a fast and actually pushed things to this extent? Please do answer.

Philip · Post by **Philip** » 12 Dec 2009 16:53

Guys,are we displaying our tribalism in part ,making Churchill chuckle in his grave? The big Q is not what chunk of a state should be carved off and how the map of India should be redrawn,one can go on arguing about who came first,etc.,aad nauseum just as the Israelis and Palestinians dispute the ownership of Palestine/Israel.We are now an independent sovereign INDIA,one nation and we should display the characteristics of being firstly Indians and only then our ethno-socio-religious background.As a member roightly pointed out in a previous post,if the nations of Europe with all their legacy of history can unite into the EU,why can't we now display the same ?I fear that the numerous protagonists of their own patch of a new state have more personal ambition in the pot rather tha the welfare of their kind and in this respect they are behaving exactly like our good friend MAJinnah!

shaardula · Post by **shaardula** » 12 Dec 2009 17:12

Manny wrote:Lingustic map

See how trivandrum, Kanyakumari, Nagerkoil and Bangalore is Tamil. So if states were based on Lingustics, this should have been the state partition. No?

no i dont see how. can you point where in the map is bangalore shown as tamil area? bangalore is NE of mysore. see map carefully.

shaardula · Post by **shaardula** » 12 Dec 2009 17:22

agree with stan. in years of reading i had never heard of anybody in ka speak of the overbearing presence of telugu.

in general i have sensed that there are a lot of rumours and fear mongering going on. everybody i know is mostly talking about conspiracies and fears. what i observe people are mainly concerned about hyderabad.

joshvajohn · Post by **joshvajohn** » 12 Dec 2009 17:39

PMK for bifurcation of Tamil Nadu

http://www.ptinews.com/news/420107_PMK- ... Tamil-Nadu

At the end of the day we are all Indians. We are within India!

Pondicherry and Tamil Nadu have shown a good way of coexistence with same language with two states style though Pondi is more of a UT.

enqyoob · Post by **enqyoob** » 12 Dec 2009 17:43

Has a map been posted showing the proposed new states? Actually, is there an OLD map showing the "Telangana" demand that, IIRC, spawned the TDP in the first place?

What is the connection if any between the death of the CM and this event? I have to wonder - if Telangana sentiment was so strong, how come a single party got so many seats in the AP assembly just a year ago? Was there any Telangana promise made as part of the election campaign?

I hope ppl will post some facts on these, and quit bickering over Language Divisions of 1,700,000,000 years ago.

ravit · Post by **ravit** » 12 Dec 2009 18:10

Stan_Savljevic wrote:Guys and Ramana,

I must put it that at least posters on this thread are manufacturing a storm in a tea-cup by pitting this as a Telugu-speakers vs. Rest of India, and much of the blame seems to fall on TN.

Please no. I think what they mean by saying "water blocked to TN ; PC, Pillai ..." is just posting latest happening in local news here. All they are doing is reporting news. Not manufacturing storm of Telugu vs everyone.

Entire seema-andhra seems to be on fire. What Chidu-Pillai said added oil in that fire. I don't think you can expect people to be logical when they go on rage. People here are blaming PC/Pillai/TN for following reason. Also this is just news, not my opinion.
* PC giving announcement without informing any Congress leaders in State apparently.
* Pillai saying next day, when Seema-Andhra is just starting a riot, that Telangana process started already and that Hyderabad is Telangana's capital.
* PC after 4 hours said that Pillai made the statement without his knowledge and then retracting the statement. This looked like a cat-mouse game played by both to most here.
* By this time seemingly low-key riot went into big-rage tenfold.

ravit · Post by **ravit** » 12 Dec 2009 18:17

enqyoob wrote: I have to wonder - if Telangana sentiment was so strong, how come a single party got so many seats in the AP assembly just a year ago? Was there any Telangana promise made as part of the election campaign?

Every party made that promise. Congress/TRS said it will give Telangana in 2004 election and dislodged TDP. TDP/PRP agreed in 2009 election.

Don't remember exactly. But, Congress in 2009 was in favour of Telangana until Phase-I elections which was in Telangana and immediately changing its promise and said Andhra people have to take passport to come to Hyd if Telangana comes. Thus, riding on both pro-Telangana and anti-Telangana sentiments.

SaiK · Post by **SaiK** » 12 Dec 2009 18:29

^^^ splitting is fine, but this joker is really funny..

tamil as medium of instruction, and English is yet another link language?

the intentions are not correct from this guy. he wont succeed.

Stan_Savljevic · Post by **Stan_Savljevic** » 12 Dec 2009 18:32

Ravit, I am bothered with ramana's post, where he openly blames "TN elites" when he specifically says:

Thanks for the scharadenfeude post for its very revealing the mindset of TN elite even when they are located far away from Madras.

One jingo poster on brf reveals the mindset of "TN elite", and as if this elite are all acting in sync. Followed by dissing the man of the moment:

PC is at core a very selfish man. He looted Indian Bank and pretends to be so holy and humble with his fake traditional clothes. His motive was to cut AP to size and divert investments to TN and revive INC prospects there. All those Rahul Gandhi visits make sense as DMK is in transition and JJ is a spent force.

Do we even know what "people in the know" think about the current situation on the ground? Openly accusing PC and ergo TN of casting eyes on AP's economic prosperity with thin proof will get the hellfire, if it were from a normal poster. Since it comes from an admin, it gets official sanction and there were three or four posts which followed the same tone: "neighbor's envy, owner's pride" yada yada. [Hello, if you read ananda vikatan or kumudham or vernacular press in TN, Telengana was hardly, if ever, mentioned. Folks are bothered about LTTE, Vai ko's idiocy, Stalin vs Azhagiri, Doctor unkil's health charades, Raja's stealing, the Maaran brothers and their antics, JJ consulting numerologists, followed by the regular dose of whose waist-size is how much, etc etc.]

Are posters here absolutely sure that it is only PC who is responsible for this decision? This I ask because posts on the forum border on "one person controls the destiny of India." I have hardly seen such misinformed opinion anywhere, and coming from people who have seen this game played over decades, I must say that I am totally rockingly amused. When YSR died, there were theories floating around that the maoists could have been responsible. There was an open dissing session of his ej credentials, now he has become the Saviour keeping the state united till he existed. People seem to sing both ways, as and when situations demand it.

Lack of irrigation, lack of development etc have suddenly vanished in 3 seconds.... and all the blame fell on PC's feet.

And finally, finishing it off with a flourish like:

Andhras (Telugu and non Telugu speaking) will rise again and take over Deccan and the rest just as they did time again.

is open flame-baiting. [Luckily, noone latched on to it.] I want AP to prosper, just like every part of India. "Taking over Deccan", yeh sab kyaa hai? Sure, I can understand statements made as "atma-gauravam" and what not, should nt great power go with great responsibility?! I ask because I usually ask, ordinary poster or admin-does nt matter, dont read too much into it.

vina · Post by **vina** » 12 Dec 2009 18:40

There is a BIG % of Telugu-speakers in TN, somuchso that many of our famous Tamil-film heroes have Telugu as the mother tongue and that is not bothering Mu. Ka or DK-folks or me and you

Stan, what you left out was that the "grand father" of the DK/DMK, the old Justice Party was basically made of a large percentage of Telegus, Malayalis and Kannadigas.. Check out the leading lights.. Raja of Panagal, Sir Thyagaraya ..(all Telugu), Shenoy (Mallu), EV Ramaswamy aka Periyar (Kannadiga).

I somehow could never put my finger on exactly why, but Tamil Nadu seems to invoke some very primordial fears , a mixture of envy , outrage, all the competitive instincts and easily able to get everyone's backs up among the Mallus, Telugus , Kannadigas and why even the Sri Lankans (all takes is o single Editorial in The Hindu for firestorms to rage in Colombo, and I would think Al_hundi editorials are very very closely monitored there), maybe because historical reasons, maybe because of the brashness/ chutzpah and as a friend tells me "Oh so superior" (Tamils are arrogant consider themselves to be "superior" to everyone else were his exact words , he is a Telugu with his parents having spent a loong time in Chennai, but from coastal Andhra and he speaks Tamil well gramattically but with a quaint delivery and accent), dont know why. I guess it is very similar to the feeling that America invokes around the world or India in it's neighborhood and hence all the YYY Kaanspiracy equivalents.

Funny part is that the current day TN has none of the leverage (economic /political or whatever) to do even a minute fraction of such YYY Kanspiracies.

I think best to chuckle at such flights of fancy , have a good laugh and let it slide , like the proverbial water off the duck's back.

Stan_Savljevic · Post by **Stan_Savljevic** » 12 Dec 2009 18:43

vina wrote: Stan, what you left out was that the "grand father" of the DK/DMK, the old Justice Party was basically made of a large percentage of Telegus, Malayalis and Kannadigas.. Check out the leading lights.. Raja of Panagal, Sir Thyagaraya ..(all Telugu), Shenoy (Mallu), EV Ramaswamy aka Periyar (Kannadiga).

I did post the same in the link language thread, and after some strange back and forth, with posters from AP nonetheless, have decided to let people read history on their own, rather than me explaining what things were. History is there for people to read, why should I waste my energy explaining things to people who are already convinced that TN is the monster? If it is the monster, it IS the monster, so be it.

Here you go: http://forums.bharat-rakshak.com/viewto ... 00#p743800

ShyamSP · Post by **ShyamSP** » 12 Dec 2009 18:51

Stan_Savljevic wrote:
vina wrote: Stan, what you left out was that the "grand father" of the DK/DMK, the old Justice Party was basically made of a large percentage of Telegus, Malayalis and Kannadigas.. Check out the leading lights.. Raja of Panagal, Sir Thyagaraya ..(all Telugu), Shenoy (Mallu), EV Ramaswamy aka Periyar (Kannadiga).
I did post the same in the link language thread, and after some strange back and forth, with posters from AP nonetheless, have decided to let people read history on their own, rather than me explaining what things were. History is there for people to read, why should I waste my energy explaining things to people who are already convinced that TN is the monster? If it is the monster, it IS the monster, so be it.

Stan,
Take it easy. They are protesting against PC and DMK because they are in current government and saw they are conspiring against AP whether it is true or not.

They are pissed of now and want to show their displeasure against PC and DMK, nothing more.

Added later: There is another thing. The resigned people are Congresswallahs also. Congresswalas can't yet utter word against or use abuse language against Sonia. So they have to find another one to blame. PC who made announcement became the target and TRS of course.

TDP guys have no problem so they are shouting against Congress and Sonia and TRS

Stan_Savljevic · Post by **Stan_Savljevic** » 12 Dec 2009 18:59

ShyamSP wrote: They are protesting against PC and DMK because they are in current government and saw they are conspiring against AP whether it is true or not. They are pissed of now and want to show their displeasure against PC and DMK, nothing more.

As I said, people on the ground have their own logic, which sometimes is tied to reality and sometimes is divorced from it. At the end of the day, all of us on this forum are paper-elites with no to microscopic say in ground reality matters. What I am bothered is what is happening on this forum: whipping of emotions as if doomsday has arrived and somehow TN has played a monumental role in this. The only crime DMK has perhaps done is to be part of the coalition govt at the centre, do we have "Ram engg college" type rants from the man who is supposed to have retire by now? I have nt seen any, he is just shutting off his valve lest their be violence inside the state. So what crime is the DMK's, at least as per the forum-elites?

PC is wearing the thorn of being the Home Minister and taking on the maoists. From what he has done so far, he has done a fairly reasonable job, much better than what could have been expected of Shri Shivraj Patil, as per opinion that flows on the "internal security watch" thread. The big crime of PC is that he is from TN, that is how it seems like to me?! If PC were called Thokchom Palani Singh, TN would nt be in the cross-fire as it is now. Trinamool Congress is in the govt, where is the bile against Mamta didi? I am just plain confused, that is all.

Surya · Post by **Surya** » 12 Dec 2009 19:07

People need to stop taking forum elites seriously and stop raising them on a pedestal

Eventually one by one they all overextend themselves.

Bade · Post by **Bade** » 12 Dec 2009 19:10

vina wrote: The "natural" scheme is a vast highly developed and indutrialized belt stretching from Kochi, Coimbatore, Salem, Mysore, Banagalore, Chittoor, Tirupati, Chennai, Nellore, Guntur, all the way to Vizag , developing if the natural trade and competitive clusters are allowed. What prevented that from happening is the "near soverign" states and their autarkic nature in all things ranging for resources, indutrial base, people and revenue base. We should start learning to manage things like the Tri State area , the Chicago, Minnesotta, Iowa and the the Great Lakes belt or even like Cincinatti where the airport and the GE engine plant are in the Kentucky side, while the city is in Ohio.

Very well said vina, this should be the counter balancing force to returning to core identities of tribes that as a whole constitute India. This has to be nurtured more and more by the central govt with participation of the states. The smaller the states become, more the inter-dependence across the newer state boundaries for viability of trade. The only losers would be those not willing to pick up and move where the opportunities are.

The fall side to this is that local identities become so strong and overpowering that prohibits people from other areas from resettling. This becomes an issue if the people who move to the new areas, want to maintain the purity of their identities even in the new environment without integration. This can lead to situations already being witnessed in movements like MNS. Time will tell if this experiment leads to more equitable development or not.

ShyamSP · Post by **ShyamSP** » 12 Dec 2009 19:13

Surya wrote:People need to stop taking forum elites seriously and stop raising them on a pedestal

Eventually one by one they all overextend themselves.

Right now some protesters are thinking Tamil politicians are conspiring against AP so they are going to the extent to stop water to Tamilnadu *.

Let's not blame forum people for highlighting that aspect.

* Krishna water release itself is at risk for Rayalaseema if they split state why should they (Rayalseema) provide water to Tamilnadu/Chennai.
You need to understand this chain effect also.

vina · Post by **vina** » 12 Dec 2009 19:19

I am just plain confused, that is all

Dont be. This is just "manufactured outrage" particularly by the politco/business (they are usually one and same these days) from Rayalseema and Coastal who poured their kaala dhan in Hyderabad real estate in massive billions. Probably 1000 times the Satyam /Ramalinga Raju scam. Ever wonder why in a country where every two bit criminal gets bail, Raju bros are still in prison, albeit with 5 star comfort ?

I saw KCR's interview with Barkha Dutt on TV and he put his finger right on the reasons. And of course for these politocos, it will be the usual whipping boy to divert outrage to.. Sort of like Yankee, Yindoos and Yehudis did it, after every excess vacuum in Pakiland.

ShyamSP · Post by **ShyamSP** » 12 Dec 2009 19:34

vina wrote:
I am just plain confused, that is all
Dont be. This is just "manufactured outrage" particularly by the politco/business (they are usually one and same these days) from Rayalseema and Coastal who poured their kaala dhan in Hyderabad real estate in massive billions. Probably 1000 times the Satyam /Ramalinga Raju scam. Ever wonder why in a country where every two bit criminal gets bail, Raju bros are still in prison, albeit with 5 star comfort ?

I saw KCR's interview with Barkha Dutt on TV and he put his finger right on the reasons. And of course for these politocos, it will be the usual whipping boy to divert outrage to.. Sort of like Yankee, Yindoos and Yehudis did it, after every excess vacuum in Pakiland.

KCR becomes truth-teller suddenly?

Central Congress suddenly put this drunkard and foul-mouthed on the pedestal and are ducking themselves by manufacturing "KCR did it"

Stan_Savljevic · Post by **Stan_Savljevic** » 12 Dec 2009 19:39

ShyamSP wrote: Right now some protesters are thinking Tamil politicians are conspiring against AP so they are going to the extent to stop water to Tamilnadu.

Let's not blame forum people for highlighting that aspect.

The basic issue is: the forum people are not just highlighting any of the blame game from the hoi polloi, but led by ramana and others, the accusations have come from the forum people TOO. For example,

His motive was to cut AP to size and divert investments to TN and revive INC prospects there.

It was neighbour's envy and owner's pride. The envy took over and the pride is hurt.

Telugus want to expand their pie. That is Takleef for the Center and DMK/Chidambaram Center wants to cut Telugus. That is Takleef for Telugus.

A unified progressive Telugu land (there was no linguistic or divisive bs from here) is percieved as a threat from many quarters in the Indian core and hence the fast forward decision here.

TDP was the principle opposition party in 1985. {not to mention that INC had 400+ seats in the Lok Sabha following the massive sympathy wave in the post-IG phase. All oppn combined together had 100 seats and TDP had ~30 of those seats. Takleef sure goes a long way, like people will see ghosts even in the dark.}

Clamors are there everywhere in India. But the sequence and timing is what needs to be analyzed. {Did this sequence get analyzed when AP became the first state to be formed on pure linguistic reasons? }

You may not read that Telengana people, not poltical elites, were enthusiastic to join other Telugus. That sense of Telugus was slowly brain-washed away from Telengana people. {who brainwashed it, Central govt?!}

It is for everyone to analyze and find the answer. Why is the world the regional lords like Sharad pawar, Karunanidhi, Laloo and BT supported Telangana while they vehemently want to save their state boundaries as is? {so why is the bile more specific towards just the DMK and TN people?}

If the IT-experts can grant a giant smiley like this:

for some of these remarks, I will use it happily.

Muppalla · Post by **Muppalla** » 12 Dec 2009 19:42

The undercurrent at political level between AP politicos and Tamil ones exist. PC, Moopanar vs. Telugu MPs goes a long way. When PC and Moopnar were inside INC it was due to sheer size of AP INC MPs, first south of vindhyas PMship came to PVNR as opposed to generally-Perceptionwisel-South-Indian-flag holders. Ok that was numbers based and no issue. Later comes the downfall of INC and rise of NF, UF and in general third front governements. During these times, TDP was always kingmaker. CBN chose Deva Gowda over Moopnar for the first UF government and later when Sitaram Kesri pulled the rug, Moopnar is supposed to become CM. Using some straw logic, they decided on not allowing the first Tamil PM of India and instead went all the way to make I.K.Gujral as PM.

Whether we like it or not - The cold war between Tamils and Telugus was always there and otherwise the split from Madras state would not have been persued at that time. However, it is not a open war like the Cauvery riots. Hope it never becomes that way.

Surya · Post by **Surya** » 12 Dec 2009 19:57

ShyamSP

One would think that forum people(especially elites) would be smarter than the rabble rousers on the street???

Thank god for my growing up in Bombay.

Have more in common with Tanaji than with Vina or Dileep

Stan_Savljevic · Post by **Stan_Savljevic** » 12 Dec 2009 19:59

Muppalla wrote:The undercurrent at political level between AP politicos and Tamil ones exist. PC, Moopanar vs. Telugu MPs goes a long way.

Congress is a joke in TN, right from the time of DMK's win in 1962. Never has it won enough seats to become anything other than a bit-role player in state politics. GK Moopanar may have been the tallest Congress leader in the post-Bhatavatsalam/Kamaraj phase, but he was a "nobody" in TN politics. His becoming the first Tamil PM et al is another big joke, how can a party with < 39 seats get the PM-ship? May be he had his own takleef, but extending it to TN pride issues is contrary to facts on the ground. In fact, I hear his being in the frontline for PM-ship only after you told me and quickly I checked it to be true

. Unlike AP, INC has close to zero popularity on the ground in TN, the major players are the *MK parties. So how come this tussle between one joker party and one major party in AP determines "the undercurrent of tussle between AP politicians and Tamil politicians", beats me.

Whether we like it or not - The cold war between Tamils and Telugus was always there and otherwise the split from Madras state would not have been persued at that time.

Sure, the Telugu-speakers needed breathing space and a separate identity, and I dont recall the Tamil-speakers grudging them for 1956. The bickering was wrt Madras and that too only because Madras was the MAJOR tax-collection base in all of Madras Province. The tit for tat, at least the way it was sold, was "You have Tirupati, we have nothing." Not like Madras was 90-10 in favor of Telugu-speakers in Madras province. It was more like 50-50. People from all over flocked to Madras cos it was the capital of the province and a port, not to mention that. And a good number of those Telugu-speakers stayed back and still exist happily interspersed speaking in Telugu at home and Tamil on the road. Quite a few of the non-jokerly leaders and film-stars are Telugu speakers. Vai ko for all his bile on Eelam is a Telugu speaker at home as is Vijayakanth.

The cold war, as you mention, is primarily a Rayalaseema pride issue cos they lost out on an important tax collection base. And it is usually revived by such people. If TN gets partitioned into two like Ramadoss demands, parts of Rayalaseema will be happy to stick with North TN and form another gigantic monolith. Trust me, this could indeed happen. But Ramadoss, who is like KCR in TN -- a joker, should do what KCR did. Being a doctor, I am sure he knows what effect a fast will have on his body.

Muppalla · Post by **Muppalla** » 12 Dec 2009 20:08

Stan,

my reference to Moopnar+PC was after they exited from INC. They were part of the same UF that Dev Gowda and CBN belong too. DMK was also part of that setup. CBN used MK against Moopnar. The logic they used is "we are all pure third fronters" and Moopnar is having INC blood becasue he is ex-INC. MK did not like to the idea of receiving a Tamil PM in his state.

In addition, the split from Madras state was actually led by the Telugu stalwards from southern AP ( it is still AP for some more time

). Potti Sriramulu is from Nellore (technically not Rayalaseema but eventually it can be part of Rayalaseema if such state forms). Also, get some folklore stories how they protested/agitated against Tamils in Madras. I don't want to put them here at this time

negi · Post by **negi** » 12 Dec 2009 20:11

^ But in massa the way Federal government and state government work are different i.e. only when states be made to generate their own revenue and manage the state exchequer's bills within the generated income qualities like competitiveness and intelligent investment of money and resources can be fostered . In the current baki form where every year the parliamentary sessions resemble a fish market with every state standing in queue with a 'katora' for Central aid, I see the growth engine chug along at the same usual pace.

Its a shame that a resource rich state like Jharkhand has not been able to grow and develop at a pace which was expected after it was carved out of Bihar. On the contrary we hear about increased naxal activity in the state and with people like Kamlesh Singh and Madhu Koda around it definitely does not help our cause.

PM MMS ji made an interesting comment on his US trip i.e. something on the lines of things move slowly in democracy but in the end development is inclusive (I guess when asked about China's rapid growth vis a vis India in Infra) I hope that it holds true for the situation on the ground as well.

enqyoob · Post by **enqyoob** » 12 Dec 2009 20:14

PC giving announcement without informing any Congress leaders in State apparently.

Is this credible? Aren't the AP CongI netas just claiming innocence? I mean, given the election promises and the high-frequency side-switching, I can't see any reason to believe any of these guys.

ShyamSP · Post by **ShyamSP** » 12 Dec 2009 20:21

enqyoob wrote:
PC giving announcement without informing any Congress leaders in State apparently.
Is this credible? Aren't the AP CongI netas just claiming innocence? I mean, given the election promises and the high-frequency side-switching, I can't see any reason to believe any of these guys.

Yes. CM Rosaiah himself is saying. He said he got some thing else in writing (didn't reveal what it is)

PC announced without CM knowing, forget about other MLAs/MPs.

Muppalla · Post by **Muppalla** » 12 Dec 2009 20:24

enqyoob wrote:
PC giving announcement without informing any Congress leaders in State apparently.
Is this credible? Aren't the AP CongI netas just claiming innocence? I mean, given the election promises and the high-frequency side-switching, I can't see any reason to believe any of these guys.

No one will really know what goes behind but I tend to beleive that. If YSR was alive, they would not have dared to ask him to pass such a resolution.

Growth of YSR inside INC was also visible to PC type southern politcos inside INC during the past five years. The pustch against "lets cut down AP" otherwise these Telugus make us look miserable forever cannot be ruled out.

Stan_Savljevic · Post by **Stan_Savljevic** » 12 Dec 2009 20:30

Muppalla wrote: Also, get some folklore stories how they protested/agitated against Tamils in Madras. I don't want to put them here at this time.

I thought they were protesting Nehru/Rajaji and their initial adamance on not wanting language-based reorganization. Any link?

SwamyG · Post by **SwamyG** » 12 Dec 2009 20:34

Muppalla wrote:. Potti Sriramulu is from Nellore

From wikipedia:

He was born to Guravayya and Mahalakshmamma on 16 March 1901 in house no. 165, Annapillai street, Chennai. His ancestors belonged to the Patampalle village of Nellore District. He studied in Madras until he attained the age of 20.

Bade · Post by **Bade** » 12 Dec 2009 20:35

Change that and there will be no envy and outrage as you put it.

{Bade, I am deleting the rest of that post. Attacks against people based on some primordial or intra-musharraf envy etc. cannot be rationalized. People who go around conducting such attacks must be hunted down and killed, no mercy needed. Otherwise civilization cannot survive.

AFAIK, there is nothing in the Constitution of India that tells ppl that they must "assimilate" with the locals, speak their lingo, not speak languages from elsewhere, dress (or undress) like the locals, or marry anyone other than their own cousins and become mongoloids.

People who can't accept that others have rights, are the only ones that need be eliminated. It's one thing to burn down State Road Transport buses - that comes under Infrastructure Improvement. But attacks against private citizens and their property should be dealt with, by shoot-at-sight, and hanging from lampposts. Period. }

svinayak · Post by **svinayak** » 12 Dec 2009 20:39

Stan_Savljevic wrote: The big crime of PC is that he is from TN, that is how it seems like to me?!

Do we even know what "people in the know" think about the current situation on the ground?

Lot of info has come from the ground and some BR members are in HYD at this very moment and understanding the situation.
First of all this is a inter congress fight between the center (represented by SG, PC etc) and Andhra congress (ex YSR,, Jagan etc). Nobody is discussing this at all in the media. And BR is avoiding criticizing congress and party leaders.

Muppalla · Post by **Muppalla** » 12 Dec 2009 20:43

Stan,
I don't have links but you will get from mom-pop storied regarding how the restaurents owned by Tamils were attacked and what they did with the food there etc. There may be some literature available regarding the details og how the agitation was persued.

Muppalla · Post by **Muppalla** » 12 Dec 2009 20:51

SwamyG wrote:
Muppalla wrote:. Potti Sriramulu is from Nellore
From wikipedia:
He was born to Guravayya and Mahalakshmamma on 16 March 1901 in house no. 165, Annapillai street, Chennai. His ancestors belonged to the Patampalle village of Nellore District. He studied in Madras until he attained the age of 20.

What is the point you are trying to make here? You want to correct some technicalities to prove that he is not from Nellore? Nellore district was renamed after his name for his association with that district.

SwamyG · Post by **SwamyG** » 12 Dec 2009 20:52

We are discussing a whole lot of sub-topics in this dhaaga - political conspiracies {BJP favored smaller states} , lingual differences, cultural hegemony, administrative and ithiyadi issues. Only a very few posts talk about long term security implications for the country. I raised it earlier in another thread and was told it was not the right time and things were still being studied. Now things have moved forward, is this right time to raise that question again?

What are the security implications of having smaller states? What sort of national integration problems will this Telangana creation cause?

As a forum dedicated to nationalist discussions, why are we not talking about the security and national integration parts more? Instead we are taking pot shots at each other and being more divisive.

SwamyG · Post by **SwamyG** » 12 Dec 2009 20:55

If a person is born in a place and lives there for the first 20 years; then we can not say he is from elsewhere. His/her ancestors might be from a different place.