India-US Strategic News and Discussion

The Strategic Issues & International Relations Forum is a venue to discuss issues pertaining to India's security environment, her strategic outlook on global affairs and as well as the effect of international relations in the Indian Subcontinent. We request members to kindly stay within the mandate of this forum and keep their exchanges of views, on a civilised level, however vehemently any disagreement may be felt. All feedback regarding forum usage may be sent to the moderators using the Feedback Form or by clicking the Report Post Icon in any objectionable post for proper action. Please note that the views expressed by the Members and Moderators on these discussion boards are that of the individuals only and do not reflect the official policy or view of the Bharat-Rakshak.com Website. Copyright Violation is strictly prohibited and may result in revocation of your posting rights - please read the FAQ for full details. Users must also abide by the Forum Guidelines at all times.
A_Gupta
BRF Oldie
Posts: 13961
Joined: 23 Oct 2001 11:31
Contact:

Re: India-US Strategic News and Discussion

Post by A_Gupta »

I think this blog post is important.
http://blogs.cfr.org/asia/2011/10/19/in ... -it-alone/

Key excerpts:
Beijing is not trustworthy

An overarching theme was China’s growing “confidence, hubris and economic ascension.” Some Indians argued that China is challenging the existing power equation and trying to limit the extent of any other power in the region, particularly the United States and India.

.....
The U.S. is also untrustworthy

Generally, our Indian interlocutors—many of whom have spent significant time living in the United States—appreciate the free and frank dialogue that they have with their U.S. counterparts. They recognize the shared value of democracy as a key component of the relationship and see cooperating to advance common ideals such as freedom of navigation, transparency, etc.

They worry greatly, however, about the steadfastness of America’s commitment to India, particularly if the United States is forced to choose between India and China.

....

Ergo India will find its own way forward


Not surprisingly, the end-game is that India will chart its own course, relying overwhelmingly on no-one but itself.
chackojoseph
BRF Oldie
Posts: 4297
Joined: 01 Mar 2010 22:42
Location: From Frontier India
Contact:

Re: India-US Strategic News and Discussion

Post by chackojoseph »

Our sort of welcome message to National Security Advisor Thomas E. Donilon

US stretches India to East Asia
Altair
BRF Oldie
Posts: 2620
Joined: 30 Dec 2009 12:51
Location: Hovering over Pak Airspace in AWACS

Re: India-US Strategic News and Discussion

Post by Altair »

svinayak
BRF Oldie
Posts: 14222
Joined: 09 Feb 1999 12:31

Re: India-US Strategic News and Discussion

Post by svinayak »



The US president backed India's bid to have a permanent seat on the U.N. Security Council during his first stop on a 10-day trip to Asia. Deepa Ollapally, of George Washington University, and Charles Kupchan from the Council on Foreign Relations discuss whether that is a realistic goal.

Nobody talks about Indian interest here
Interesting conversation with Kupchan wary about Indian interest
PrasadZ
BRFite
Posts: 122
Joined: 11 Apr 2010 08:42

Re: India-US Strategic News and Discussion

Post by PrasadZ »

Came across this interview of edward luttwak by chance. Sounded a little like an old doc on this forum :)

http://www.tabletmag.com/news-and-polit ... wak/?all=1
CRamS
BRF Oldie
Posts: 6865
Joined: 07 Oct 2006 20:54

Re: India-US Strategic News and Discussion

Post by CRamS »

Acharya wrote: Nobody talks about Indian interest here
Interesting conversation with Kupchan wary about Indian interest
You expect some intellectual midget like Deepa Ollapally to talk about Indian interests and yet survive with kushy job at George washington university or wherever? I have listened to her, and she shivers at the thought of deviating from US-scripted narrative on "South Asia". She is not worth listening to.
ramana
Forum Moderator
Posts: 60325
Joined: 01 Jan 1970 05:30

Re: India-US Strategic News and Discussion

Post by ramana »

PrasadZ wrote:Came across this interview of edward luttwak by chance. Sounded a little like an old doc on this forum :)

http://www.tabletmag.com/news-and-polit ... wak/?all=1

Some members may recognize similar libraries!

Most of what he says applies to Indians too. Suggest people read the article in full and think it over.
PrasadZ
BRFite
Posts: 122
Joined: 11 Apr 2010 08:42

Re: India-US Strategic News and Discussion

Post by PrasadZ »

ramana wrote:
PrasadZ wrote:Came across this interview of edward luttwak by chance. Sounded a little like an old doc on this forum :)

http://www.tabletmag.com/news-and-polit ... wak/?all=1
Some members may recognize similar libraries!
Most of what he says applies to Indians too. Suggest people read the article in full and think it over.
Could you make it clearer, ramana?
I meant similarities in "shot gun murugan" style one liners and non PC talk. Dont know his background or thoughts on other subjects - the interview, itself, is interesting as an example of american thoughts.
ramana
Forum Moderator
Posts: 60325
Joined: 01 Jan 1970 05:30

Re: India-US Strategic News and Discussion

Post by ramana »

Again you handicapped us by not posting the whole interview.
His remarks about the cycle of Palestine intafida is same as Kashmir terrorism cycle.
His remarks about Israelis (~2000 years stateless) is same as Indians. Only there was a 1000 year difference.
His remarks about the lifafa book skills of Henry bhai are also insightful.

One can go on and on.
About similar libraries its an inside joke for some members.

He is number # 1 Strategist in US. He teaches that at Georgetown. And he follows India like a hawk. I have read his writings on India since 1988.

His book Grand Strategy of Byzantium is a very good book to read.

I wish I could do that for the Chalukya-Cholas of Eastern India who had a similar long regnal period from 450-1300 AD.
vijayk
BRF Oldie
Posts: 9436
Joined: 22 Jun 1999 11:31

Re: India-US Strategic News and Discussion

Post by vijayk »

ramana wrote:
PrasadZ wrote:Came across this interview of edward luttwak by chance. Sounded a little like an old doc on this forum :)

http://www.tabletmag.com/news-and-polit ... wak/?all=1

Some members may recognize similar libraries!

Most of what he says applies to Indians too. Suggest people read the article in full and think it over.
Great interview...
They killed Bin Laden simply because of the inconvenience of a trial?

They killed him because of the fact that if we captured Bin Laden, every Jihadist in the world would have been duty-bound to kidnap any American citizen anywhere and exchange him for Bin Laden.
Very essential strategic thinking. If only we had eliminated the 4 scums we had to trade during IC814 hijacking, we could have avoided so much takleef.

The only people who would have cried are: Dhoti Roy, Aruna Roy, Burkha Dutt, Teesata, Dogvijay, NAC members, anti-national traitors who thirst for Indian blood on railway platforms and markets.

Unfortunately, we don't even go anywhere near that line of thinking.
ramana
Forum Moderator
Posts: 60325
Joined: 01 Jan 1970 05:30

Re: India-US Strategic News and Discussion

Post by ramana »

A friend of mine said last week that Indian courts are the most corrupt for they delay trials interminably and thus weaken the state. The state weakens itself by delaying the implementation of the court orders for other reasons including corruption of the mind.
PrasadZ
BRFite
Posts: 122
Joined: 11 Apr 2010 08:42

Re: India-US Strategic News and Discussion

Post by PrasadZ »

ramana wrote:Again you handicapped us by not posting the whole interview.
His remarks about the cycle of Palestine intafida is same as Kashmir terrorism cycle.
His remarks about Israelis (~2000 years stateless) is same as Indians. Only there was a 1000 year difference.
His remarks about the lifafa book skills of Henry bhai are also insightful.
Thanks, ramana!
Will post and highlight next time.
vijayk
BRF Oldie
Posts: 9436
Joined: 22 Jun 1999 11:31

Re: India-US Strategic News and Discussion

Post by vijayk »

ramana wrote:
PrasadZ wrote:Came across this interview of edward luttwak by chance. Sounded a little like an old doc on this forum :)

http://www.tabletmag.com/news-and-polit ... wak/?all=1

Some members may recognize similar libraries!

Most of what he says applies to Indians too. Suggest people read the article in full and think it over.
Shimon Peres says, “Iran is a decaying corpse of a country and the idea that they are any long-term threat to anybody, based on demographics and based on the rickety state of their economy, is a joke. So yes, it would be terrible if they ended up with an atomic bomb, but otherwise, Iran is not a long-term strategic threat to anybody.”

I think to get a good view on Iran you have to put yourself in the shoes of Hezbollah. Hezbollah is wholly dependent on Iran. Without Iran, Hezbollah is just a band of hotheads with a few thousand highly trained men. So, view Iran from Hezbollah’s point of view. What do you see? It’s a regime that has been around since 1979 in one way or the other. Is it consolidated? Is it functioning better and better and getting more and more support? It’s not. Is it getting more dependent on police repression or less? The answer is more. So, from the Hezbollah point of view, you realize that your days are counted because the regime is in a downward spiral.

There is a good measure of social control in Iran, and that is the price of genuine imported Scotch whiskey in Tehran, because it’s a) forbidden, and b) has to be smuggled in for practical purposes from Dubai, and the only way it can come from Dubai is with the cooperation of the Revolutionary Guard. The price of whiskey has been declining for years, and you go to a party in north Tehran now and you get lots of whiskey. And it’s only slightly more expensive than in Northwest Washington.

But on the other hand, the regime is doing something for which they will have my undying gratitude—that is, they have been manufacturing the one and only post-Islamic society. They created a situation in which Iranians in general, worldwide, not only in Iran, are disaffiliated. They are converting Muslim Iranians into post-Muslim Iranians.
What does he mean by it?
Prem
BRF Oldie
Posts: 21234
Joined: 01 Jul 1999 11:31
Location: Weighing and Waiting 8T Yconomy

Re: India-US Strategic News and Discussion

Post by Prem »

Bharath.Subramanyam
BRFite
Posts: 132
Joined: 28 Jul 2009 00:17

Re: India-US Strategic News and Discussion

Post by Bharath.Subramanyam »

ramana wrote:Again you handicapped us by not posting the whole interview.
His remarks about the cycle of Palestine intafida is same as Kashmir terrorism cycle.
His remarks about Israelis (~2000 years stateless) is same as Indians. Only there was a 1000 year difference.
His remarks about the lifafa book skills of Henry bhai are also insightful.

One can go on and on.
About similar libraries its an inside joke for some members.

He is number # 1 Strategist in US. He teaches that at Georgetown. And he follows India like a hawk. I have read his writings on India since 1988.

His book Grand Strategy of Byzantium is a very good book to read.

I wish I could do that for the Chalukya-Cholas of Eastern India who had a similar long regnal period from 450-1300 AD.

Ramana ji: Many a times I get confused by US Foriegn Policy. If they had people like Edward Luttwak then why did they do all the intervention stuff in the last 50 years (Vietnam war, Iraq, 2001 Afghan). Wasn't there anybody telling the Democrats & Republicans that Kissinger, Brzezinski, Greenspan way will take them to bankruptcy ? Was there ever a anti-kissinger & anti-greenspan policy group in US?
ramana
Forum Moderator
Posts: 60325
Joined: 01 Jan 1970 05:30

Re: India-US Strategic News and Discussion

Post by ramana »

No.

HAK did something unthinkable. He said that nuke war can be fought in an escalatory manner. Before that it was MAD with Dr. Strangelove images. He then came up with the China card.

HAK is enamoured with Metternich who in the post Napoleonic era brought peace in Europe which lasted one hundred years ie till WWI.

Luttwak was stuck teaching strategy and not practice it.

Koi baatt nahin. Luttwak is right in longer run >100 years. And should follow him.

HAK bought only two decades with his China card.
shyamd
BRF Oldie
Posts: 7100
Joined: 08 Aug 2006 18:43

Re: India-US Strategic News and Discussion

Post by shyamd »

^^ Ramana ji is his book about the byzantine empire worth getting?

TIA
ramana
Forum Moderator
Posts: 60325
Joined: 01 Jan 1970 05:30

Re: India-US Strategic News and Discussion

Post by ramana »

No. Its more like a long review of Byzantium history. Essentially he says they saved their military for the decisive battles and used intrigue and war by other means. Where as Rome used i military as first option and that led to frittering the resources.

In long run I think they didn't have the military when the Turks came knocking at the gates. But then they still hadn't recovered from the sack of Constantinople by the Crusaders about a 100 years before.

More apt for India is to study the long duration dynasties like Satavahanas, Chalukya-Cholas 450-1300 AD.
pgbhat
BRF Oldie
Posts: 4172
Joined: 16 Dec 2008 21:47
Location: Hayden's Ferry

Re: India-US Strategic News and Discussion

Post by pgbhat »

Over-Rated Thinkers
PARAG KHANNA

Parag Khanna’s online bio is the Platonic ideal of puffed-up nonsense. Khanna is described as a “leading geo-strategist,” “an accomplished adventurer,” and “an active and advanced tennis player.” We further learn that he speaks five foreign languages, has traveled in more than 100 countries, and “has climbed numerous 20,000-foot plus peaks.” What’s more, he’s “a frequent speaker at international conferences” who briefs “corporations on global trends, systemic risks and emerging market strategies.” He has hosted an MTV show, was the first video blogger at ForeignPolicy.com, and directs something called the “Hybrid Reality Institute.” His recent book is actually called How to Run the World. It is a self-congratulatory anthology of clichés and platitudes—the life of the mind, Davos-style.
FAREED ZAKARIA

Fareed Zakaria is enormously important to an understanding of many things, because he provides a one-stop example of conventional thinking about them all. He is a barometer in a good suit, a creature of establishment consensus, an exemplary spokesman for the always-evolving middle. He was for the Iraq war when almost everybody was for it, criticized it when almost everybody criticized it, and now is an active member of the ubiquitous “declining American power” chorus. When Obama wanted to trust the Iranians, Zakaria agreed (“They May Not Want the Bomb,” was a story he did for Newsweek); and, when Obama learned different, Zakaria thought differently. There’s something suspicious about a thinker always so perfectly in tune with the moment. Most of Zakaria’s appeal is owed to the A-list aura that he likes to give off—“At the influential TED conference ...” began a recent piece in The New York Times. On his CNN show, he ingratiates himself to his high-powered guests. This mix of elitism and banality is unattractive. And so is this: “My friends all say I’m going to be Secretary of State,” Zakaria told New York magazine in 2003. “But I don’t see how that would be much different from the job I have now.” Zakaria later denied making those remarks.
devesh
BRF Oldie
Posts: 5129
Joined: 17 Feb 2011 03:27

Re: India-US Strategic News and Discussion

Post by devesh »

it's good to see someone making an honest judgement on FZ. he is nothing more than an establishment mouthpiece with a fierce urge to GUBO to every passing wind that he thinks is "powerful". he is a lightweight at "international relations". he has no solid contribution to the field wrt ideas and theories or even knowledge. he is a third-rate "intellectual" who has excellent skills in chamchagiri. that is his qualification.
CRamS
BRF Oldie
Posts: 6865
Joined: 07 Oct 2006 20:54

Re: India-US Strategic News and Discussion

Post by CRamS »

CRamS told you this about FZ a long, long time ago. But anyway, why this sudden FZ bashing again? Did he make a fool of himself on today's show? Lets leave him to make all that moolah as an establishment mouthpiec.
Avik
BRFite
Posts: 228
Joined: 06 Oct 2009 00:16

Re: India-US Strategic News and Discussion

Post by Avik »

^^^^^^

In the main, Fareed Zakaria says a lot of things that reflect well on India. He is pro-India, and part of the Washington establishment. He may occasionally say things that we take offense at or doesnt reflect reality from the Indian perspective, but in the main, he is pro-India.

So, why this rush to pull down someone who is good for us. I mean if intellectual capability was a parameter, then 95% of the China boosters in the US establishment wouldnt have a job. There are Paki mouthpieces galore, but yet we choose to denigrate a couple of people, who, in the main, are good to India
vera_k
BRF Oldie
Posts: 4508
Joined: 20 Nov 2006 13:45

Re: India-US Strategic News and Discussion

Post by vera_k »

All due to India's messy democracy. Zakaria only supports one part of the political spectrum in India, so gets no respect from the others. China boosters conveniently avoid this problem due to the one party state.
svinayak
BRF Oldie
Posts: 14222
Joined: 09 Feb 1999 12:31

Re: India-US Strategic News and Discussion

Post by svinayak »

In The Rush To Deport, Expelling U.S. Citizens
by TED ROBBINS
http://www.npr.org/2011/10/24/141500145 ... ns?ps=cprs

A drop house raid yielded several suspected illegal immigrants on April 29, 2010, in Phoenix. Northwestern University political science professor Jacqueline Stevens says some of the nearly 400,000 people deported during the past fiscal year weren't illegal immigrants.

The government is not shy about its success deporting people from the United States. Immigration and Customs Enforcement recently sent out videos of early-morning raids conducted across the country. Uniformed ICE agents are shown planning to capture suspects, followed by shots of the suspects being handcuffed and put into vehicles.

A record 396,000 people were deported from the country during the federal fiscal year that just ended. Some were caught in raids, while others were detained by ICE after being arrested by local police. But Northwestern University political science professor Jacqueline Stevens says some of those held weren't illegal immigrants at all.

"I think it's pretty fair to say that there's a low but persistent rate of people who are being held by ICE in violation of the law, who are U.S. citizens," Stevens says.

Mark Lyttle was deported to Mexico in 2008. Lyttle, who has a history of mental illness, gave ICE agents conflicting stories, telling them that he was a U.S. citizen and also that he was a Mexican to avoid an argument.

ICE apparently ignored records showing that he was born in North Carolina and had no relatives in Mexico. Eventually Lyttle returned to the U.S.

Earlier this year, the government admitted that another deported man named Andres Robles was a citizen.

It sent Robles a letter, with an odd offer.
svinayak
BRF Oldie
Posts: 14222
Joined: 09 Feb 1999 12:31

Re: India-US Strategic News and Discussion

Post by svinayak »

Check China using imperilist language
http://english.peopledaily.com.cn/90780/7625634.html
China's global business needs backup of military power
By Mo Luo (Global Times)
10:57, October 25, 2011

I read on a microblog the other day that it is dangerous to be an extremist country. The author argues that people will shun it as they will shun an extreme person, and that China needs friends. He accuses people who want to use China's military might to guard its business of being stuck in an imperialist 19th century mentality that China suffered from when invaded by Britain during the opium wars.

I'd like to talk about such narratives. The West has used military operations to guard its business interests for the past 500 years, from the era of open piracy to the current days of the market economy.

The West opened Chinese markets with cannons in the Qing Dynasty (1644-1911). To preserve its Indian market, 50,000 British and 200,000 Indian soldiers were stationed in India. The idea of literally conquering foreign markets has not lost momentum in the 21st century. Take the US interventions in the Middle East, for instance.

On the other hand, Chinese companies are left to face foreign markets without the sense of security granted by a military presence. Stood in the market defenseless, we are facing fierce Western competitors who bullied their way into the market and so can set the rules of the game. A noticeable recent example is the military intervention by the West in Libya that posed a grand total of over $10 billion of investment from China at great risk.
svinayak
BRF Oldie
Posts: 14222
Joined: 09 Feb 1999 12:31

Re: India-US Strategic News and Discussion

Post by svinayak »

http://english.peopledaily.com.cn/90780/7621120.html
Unlike Japan, India’s intervention into the affairs in the South China Sea is at most to just show its presence there. India’s top priority in terms of national security lies in the Indian Ocean instead of the South China Sea. The U.S. Diego Garcia naval base in the Indian Ocean as well as the results of the wars in Afghanistan and Iraq in the early 21st century have proven that India has a long way to go to control the ocean.

Furthermore, India has to keep an eye on the military power of its neighbors in the north. India’s high-profile intervention into the South China Sea is at most to copy the diplomatic strategy that was adopted by the United Kingdom in 1902 to work with Japan to contain Russia in a hope to contain China in the East because the politics in the South China Sea have no strategic value for India.

It is irrational for India, which is near the oil-rich Persian Gulf, to have a special demand for oil and gas resources in the South China Sea. By contrast, the South China Sea is vital to Japan and the country once took actual control of Taiwan in history. If Japan supports the "Taiwan independence" forces to take office in Taiwan, all of East Asia will face a disaster.
Christopher Sidor
BRFite
Posts: 1435
Joined: 13 Jul 2010 11:02

Re: India-US Strategic News and Discussion

Post by Christopher Sidor »

^^^^
By this same logic, it is senseless for PRC to buy gas and oil from Persian gulf when Russian Far East and Siberia are nearby and the Chinese actually share a land border with the Russians. South China sea is important for India as our Oil from Russian far east travels through this sea to reach India. Further India's trade with Korea and Japan goes again via this route. So we have a national interest in seeing that nobody controls south china sea, especially not on basis of some tom-dick-harry reading of history.

Yes control of South-china sea will allow the PLAN/PLAAF to enforce a blockade of oil and gas to Japan. So it is essential for japan that South-china sea ought not be controlled by China. After all we have seen recently the so called rare-earth-minerals ban against japan work it out to its logical conclusion. Yesterday it was the rare-earth-minerals. Tomorrow it will be the oil/gas from the Gulf.
svinayak
BRF Oldie
Posts: 14222
Joined: 09 Feb 1999 12:31

Re: India-US Strategic News and Discussion

Post by svinayak »

Christopher Sidor wrote:^^^^
By this same logic, it is senseless for PRC to buy gas and oil from Persian gulf when Russian Far East and Siberia are nearby and the Chinese actually share a land border with the Russians. South China sea is important for India as our Oil from Russian far east travels through this sea to reach India. Further India's trade with Korea and Japan goes again via this route. So we have a national interest in seeing that nobody controls south china sea, especially not on basis of some tom-dick-harry reading of history.
Who made the PRC to source from the land route to Gulf. It is the western nations who have encouraged it
But the PRC expansion has been without any obstacles for the last 30 years
RamaY
BRF Oldie
Posts: 17249
Joined: 10 Aug 2006 21:11
Location: http://bharata-bhuti.blogspot.com/

Re: India-US Strategic News and Discussion

Post by RamaY »

I was reading this and it reminded me of many Asura kingdoms that we read in Puranas
http://www.tabletmag.com/news-and-polit ... wak/?all=1

Well, any dictatorship creates an unnatural environment, analogous to that of taking peasants from the field and putting them in an army, where they get uniforms and are drilled and disciplined. Dictatorships attempt to turn entire populations into well-drilled regiments. The North Korean regime takes it to the logical extreme of actually having the entire population drilled in regiments. The Ben Ali and Mubarak dictatorships were attempting to regiment their populations by having state structures imposed on them. Both of them, for example, were able to create loyal police forces.

Once the regiment dissolves, then the people are released and they revert to their natural order. They stop wearing uniforms, they put on the clothes they want, and they manifest the proclivities that they have. A few Egyptians are Westernized, hence they have exited Islam whatever their personal beliefs may be. But otherwise, there is no room for civilization in Egypt other than Islam, and the number of extremists that you need to make life impossible for the average Westernized or slightly Westernized Egyptian who wants to have a beer, for example, is very small. The number you need to close all the bars in Egypt is maybe 15 percent of the population. 8)
The Kabila has to be destroyed completely to release the populations that are held and exploited by the Kabila.

Then the -ism should be destroyed using cultural transformation.
The Iraq War, with the defeat, humbling, and execution of a dictator, was a big blow with a pickax.
OBL killing is another one IMO.

It works both ways. If Taliban/ISI assassination of Ahmad Shah Massoud or Rabbani destroys a certain possible future scenario, pointed assassination of OBL or MO also can result in an alternative future scenario.
Therefore, if we in the Z.O.G. didn’t really run everything, and there was no Zionist influence, then this solid mass of foreign-aware Americans, who also happen to be Bible-believers—we’re talking 50 million people—to them, the only foreign policy that counts is America’s support for Israel. Period.
Seeds of American foreign policy...
Lenin taught, “Power is mass multiplied by cohesion.” Arab violence generates Jewish cohesion. Cohesion turns mass into power. Israel has had very small mass, very high cohesion. If only the Palestinians understood that, they would have attacked the Jews with flowers.
Think in Indian context.

Also think in Pakistan context.
But on the other hand, the regime is doing something for which they will have my undying gratitude—that is, they have been manufacturing the one and only post-Islamic society. They created a situation in which Iranians in general, worldwide, not only in Iran, are disaffiliated. They are converting Muslim Iranians into post-Muslim Iranians.
BR Speak on Iran :mrgreen:
Ramanaji, Bji - take a bow!
Hillary Clinton and her staff are not fools. Therefore, they must know that the Turkish foreign minister is a fool. I know him personally. The man is an idiot. Hillary Clinton and her advisers are not idiots. No advantage would be served for the United States to recognize where Erdogan is really going. It’s much better to pretend that he’s a member of NATO and North Atlantic Alliance and all the rest of it.
On Turkey :rotfl:
If you want peace, prepare for war. If you actively want war, disarm yourself, and then you’ll get war. Virile and martial elites understand that kind of thinking instinctively.
What is Indian Elite's wish :?:
By contrast, what does it take to become a U.S. Senator? You have to eat rubber chicken dinners, you have to impress some rich people who are generally pretty stupid about politics, and smile in TV commercials. The penalties for failure are hardly so dire. And so, American leadership generally sucks, and America is perennially in the position of being the sucker in the global poker game. That’s the thesis. So, tell me why it’s wrong.

Even if your analysis is totally correct, your conclusion is wrong. Think about what it means to work for a Putin, whose natural approach to any problem is deception. For example, he had an affair with this athlete, a gymnast, and he went through two phases. Phase one: He concealed it from his wife. Phase two: He launched a public campaign showing himself to be a macho man. He had photographs of him shooting a rifle, and as a Judo champion, and therefore had the news leaked that he was having an affair. Not only an affair with a young woman, but a gymnast, an athlete. Obviously such a person is much more wily and cunning and able to handle conflict than his American counterpart. But when such a person is the head of a department, the whole department is actually paralyzed and they are all reduced to serfs and valets. Therefore, what gets applied to a problem is only the wisdom of the aforementioned wily head of the department. All the other talent is wasted, all the other knowledge is wasted.

Now you have a choice: You can have a non-wily head of a department and the collective knowledge and wisdom of the whole department, or else you can have a wily head and zero functioning. And that is how the Russian government is currently working. Putin and Medvedev have very little control of the Russian bureaucracy. When you want to deal with them, and I dealt with them this morning, they act in very uncooperative, cagey, and deceptive ways because they are first of all trying to protect their security and stability and benefits from their boss. They have to deceive you because they are deceiving their boss before he even shows up to work. And they are all running little games. So, that’s the alternative. You can have a wily Putin and a stupid government. Or an intelligent government and an innocent head. There’s always is a trade-off. A Putin cannot be an inspiring leader.
This is for people who complain about not-smart project managers and bosses.

We are trying to save your talent, you dumbos :P

Now I know MMS's strategy :mrgreen:
There was no deal with the Pakistanis. There’s no institutional integrity. Therefore you cannot make deals with the Pakistani system. They would betray each other. There was no deal.
This is for BRaman garu.
abhischekcc
BRF Oldie
Posts: 4277
Joined: 12 Jul 1999 11:31
Location: If I can’t move the gods, I’ll stir up hell
Contact:

Re: India-US Strategic News and Discussion

Post by abhischekcc »

Lutwak's assessments are mostly that - Ass-Ass-Cement.

His observation on Putin is correct, but his conclusion is wrong - that he is a shifty guy. If someone in the west managed his image as well as Putin, he would be hailed as a political genius. case in point - Reagan. But does not depend on antics for popularity, he has brought order to post soviet chaos. Fortunately, the Russians never had a Nehru, so they know the benefit of order over freedom.

His other pronouncements, whether you agree with him or not, reek of egomania bordering on narcissism - not a strong foundation for balanced judgement.

For example, the best administrator India has had was PVNR, a man known for being a wily politician, an uninspiring leader, and more of a policy wonk than a rockstar politician. Yet, he laid the foundation for the strong India that we are all so proud of.
ramana
Forum Moderator
Posts: 60325
Joined: 01 Jan 1970 05:30

Re: India-US Strategic News and Discussion

Post by ramana »

Only if they pass muster.
svinayak
BRF Oldie
Posts: 14222
Joined: 09 Feb 1999 12:31

Re: India-US Strategic News and Discussion

Post by svinayak »

Afghanistan-India pact doesn't concern just Pakistanis; Afghans wonder, too


BY SHASHANK BENGALI

MCCLATCHY NEWSPAPERS

KABUL, Afghanistan — The wide-ranging "strategic partnership" that Afghanistan signed with India this month would seem only logical: South Asia's economic heavyweight cementing its longstanding political, cultural and trade ties with the region's neediest nation.
But this is Afghanistan, and nothing is that simple.
The deal, which included Indian training of Afghan security forces, immediately angered neighboring Pakistan, India's blood enemy. But many Afghans also were left concerned, wondering whether Afghan President Hamid Karzai, in agreeing to the accord, wasn't merely provoking Pakistan — the country with which Afghanistan shares its longest border, the source of some 80 percent of Afghan consumer goods, the main supply line for U.S.-led NATO forces and the linchpin of efforts to negotiate peace with the Taliban and other Afghan insurgents.
Fears about the India-Afghanistan agreement illustrate the challenges facing Afghanistan and the United States as they seek to end a decade-long war and enlist other countries in the region to help shoulder the burden of Afghan reconstruction and security.
Landlocked not just by Pakistan but also Iran, China and three former Soviet republics, seemingly every diplomatic move carries major potential costs for Afghanistan and the Obama administration, which is drawing down U.S. troops in the hope of ceding full responsibility for security to Afghan forces by 2014.
In a sign of the administration's growing outreach to regional players, Secretary of State Hillary Clinton's trip through the region last week included stops in two of the ex-Soviet republics, Tajikistan and Uzbekistan.
To some Afghan analysts and former officials, Karzai's pact with India, while a good idea on paper, is freighted with risk.
"Afghanistan should not be part of the regional competition between India and Pakistan, the United States and Iran," said Ahmad Saeedi, a former Afghan diplomat in both India and Pakistan. "But after signing this agreement, we've become part of the game. ... The contents are very important and very significant. But it is definitely going to create some problems."
Indian officials say the deal formalizes an increasingly close relationship under which India has contributed $2 billion in aid to Afghanistan over the past decade, mostly for infrastructure projects such as roads, a hydroelectric dam and a new parliament building. The bond annoys Pakistan, particularly when India, which has been the target of several deadly insurgent attacks in Afghanistan, sent paramilitary forces to guard Indian construction workers.
For India, the stakes are huge. It doesn't want Afghanistan to revert to a haven for Muslim extremists who would target Kashmir, the border region disputed by India and Pakistan. As a fast-growing economy, India's also hungry for access via Afghanistan to the vast natural gas reserves of Central Asia.
And experts say New Delhi — which has rarely projected itself on the world stage — wants to bring Afghanistan into its sphere of influence to counteract Pakistan.
"India can't claim to be a regional power, much less a global power, if it can't manage to achieve some modicum of its strategic goals in Afghanistan," said Christine Fair, a South Asia expert at Georgetown University
.


Read more: http://www.miamiherald.com/2011/10/25/2 ... z1bqYlr5Zv
JE Menon
Forum Moderator
Posts: 7144
Joined: 01 Jan 1970 05:30

Re: India-US Strategic News and Discussion

Post by JE Menon »

^^^ The quotes in the second article above, attributed to US embassy official Geoff Pyatt displays a breathtaking ignorance of people at the highest level in India and a very very superficial analysis of their personalities.

I hope this continues.
Post Reply