Re: The Levant crisis.(Israel,SYRIA,Lebanon,etc)

johneeG · Post by **johneeG** » 16 Nov 2015 12:28

But, why should ISIS attack Europe at all when they are being hit mainly by Russia?

Satya_anveshi · Post by **Satya_anveshi** » 16 Nov 2015 12:35

expressed reason of the attackers is France is hitting ISIS. <my last on this>

TSJones · Post by **TSJones** » 16 Nov 2015 12:37

johneeG wrote:But, why should ISIS attack Europe at all when they are being hit mainly by Russia?

they haven't been mainly hit by Russia until recently. They been hitting the Free Syrian Army which is more of a danger to Assad. In other words they been taking care of their boy. Now they are starting to bomb ISIL forces in northeast Syria not northwest Syria.

https://www.bellingcat.com/news/mena/20 ... -in-syria/

habal · Post by **habal** » 16 Nov 2015 12:52

Only thing that can save ISIS is, if their main sponsors viz Britain, France, USA, Saudi Arabia, Turkey send their boots in the ground in Syria. So that in cover of destroying ISIS, they can resuscitate it. And block Syrian Army from acting against it.

So basically this terror strike was intended to kill far more people than 150 it did manage to. Maybe intended target was 1500-2000 people or even 5000 if they got lucky. Something didn't work out well for the terrorists.

1. First attack was a distraction to lure any police (SWAT teams) away from the main event. It was around 9:00 hours. Shooting at cafe's and terraces was a distraction.
2. One suicide bomber was going into the football stadium, but got stopped and decided to detonate himself with security man that was checking him. MISSION FAIL. Mission was detonate inside stadium and cause a stampede. With possibly more victims.
3. Once the people would rush out of the stadium the 2 other suicide bombers would blow themselves up outside the stadium between the fleeing people. MISSION FAIL.
4. Attack on "Angels of Death" concert. Succeeded, but got stormed too fast. So they killed only 80 people out of 1500.
5. Forgot to block the exists in the stadium, did not use smoke grenades. Why suicide bombers didn't have guns to shoot security guards upon detection.

Atleast 500 people would have been killed if these steps went according to plan.

Conclusion: the entire mission was pretty hurried, and there was no plan B. Either it was ISIS revenge on French for not killing enough Syrians and not preventing ISIS rout by SAA. Or this was a move to use public outrage to get NATO boots into Syria.

If it is the latter, then this could be first amongst many attacks all over Europe.

Bhurishrava · Post by **Bhurishrava** » 16 Nov 2015 12:58

I have said this before and will say this again.
Please stop calling the french surrender monkeys or anything similar.

This is Anglo-American propaganda. France has a more martial history than either England or America.

Americal martial glory starts by joing a winning war at the fag end and defeating under 14 and over 70 year old Germans on the western front. If the French surrendered, didnt the English run away with their tails between their legs at Dunkirk. The 2nd world war was won by the Russians. The Americans and the English were sidekicks only.

If French lost Dien Bien Phu, did the Americans win Vietnam ?!

Please stop furthering Anglo-American propaganda.

Gus · Post by **Gus** » 16 Nov 2015 13:24

Charles Martel stopped moors and saved western EU. That and the medieval Vienna siege were the two pivotal moments which if went the other way, EU would be all Balkan.

member_20453 · Post by **member_20453** » 16 Nov 2015 13:57

well gents this attack sure is from ISIS but the weapons are coming courtesy of KGB/FSB, here's why...

Roughly 3 weeks ago, an ill-fated Russian aircraft is bombed, 200+ killed and Russia is in deep mourning and few days later, Charlie Hebdo releases an image mocking the Russian dead, more so mocking Putin. Putin is pissed, hell all of Russia is pissed. Knowing Putin and Russia, this is not to go unpunished. Initial plans probably wanted Charlie HQ to be bombed but it serves no purpose but then the plan smoothens out to arming the N number of cells active in Western EU. With Russia dolling out the biggest punishment on ISIS in Syria they have plenty of Intel on their cells in EU including those in Belgium, France & Germany. They get in touch through various other means I.e low level mafia gun runners, they arrange for around 3-4 duffel bags of weapons and kit suddenly made available for these plans to be carried out. These nut jobs probably got the weapons couple of days prior. Now, KGB touch is feather lite so no evidence will ever be found off course. Now the cells know once they have the weapons, the plan needs to be set in motion because the longer they wait, the higher the risk being busted. So a car is rented, a group of rag-tag nut jobs get in, drive to Paris in 3 hrs. and execute the plan. They are rag tag, run off the mil poorly trained terrorists who have seen some action in Syria. They are no way as trained as the ones in Mumbai who had plenty of SSG Navy & ISIS training. These dip shites go in kill a few and blow themselves up.

Now, as for the French, well they were very quick to blame Mumbai police and India security establishment as a whole for poor response during the Mumbai attack. They are lucky they didn't have better trained nut jobs.

Now pre-attack, everyone was bitching against Russia, but now they want a partnered action towards the whole thing. Secondly, Putin gets the message across, mocking the victims isn't nice now that the French too have victims. Russian bombing campaign is all of sudden the way to go.

http://www.theguardian.com/world/2015/n ... h-cartoons

http://www.ibtimes.com/russian-plane-cr ... st-2172878

chetak · Post by **chetak** » 16 Nov 2015 14:15

maybe this is what the turkish islamists actually wanted??

ISIS Fighters Could Gain “Legal” Entry into EU, Thanks to Europe’s New Schengen Visa Deal for Turkey

ISIS Fighters Could Gain “Legal” Entry into EU, Thanks to Europe’s New Schengen Visa Deal for Turkey

It doesn’t get any more backward than this. Potentially, this is the dumbest move yet by bureaucrats in Brussels.

Turkey is set to pick up a few big sweeteners from Brussels if it ‘tries’ to stop refugee flow into Europe – even though it’s nearly impossible for Ankara to actually come good on its lofty promise to ‘contain’ the large refugee flow through Turkey into the European promise land.

It’s true that Turkey has accommodated roughly 2 million Syrian refugees, and is said to have spent over nearly $8 billion on the crisis thus far.

What they are not telling us however, is that Turkey has been the primary facilitator of the Syrian conflict, mainly by hosting terrorist and ‘rebel’ training and equipping for tens of thousands of fighters since 2011, as well as providing a continuous safe haven for terrorist fighters – freely coming and going over its southern border with Syria.

Islamic-State-ISIS-fighters-363480
FREE EU ENTRY: Turkish passport holders from ISIS will now be free to enter the whole of Europe.

The public got a shocking glimpse of the casual relationship between Turkish authorities and ISIS last year after video surfaced showing Islamic State militants having a friendly chat with a group of Turkish border guards near the besieged Syrian city of Kobane. The fact that Turkey is a NATO member makes this crime all the more egregious.

In short, Turkey is a “bad actor” in the Syria story. Now they are being rewarded with what essential has most of the features of a ‘fast-track’ provisional membership into the EU. Cries from European leaders like David Cameron to halt the flow of immigrants and to ‘not risk the security of Europe’ are sounding more hollow than ever right now.

1-Turkey-tayyip-erdogan-ISIS

ISIS ENABLER: Turkish President Recep Tayyip Erdogan has managed to fool a clueless EU.

‘Easy’ EU Entry For Turkish Terrorists?

The terms of this latest deal are almost unbelievable. Incredibly, EU official seem to be completely ignorant of the fact that most of the new ISIS recruits are now coming from Turkey. This completely insane new proposal from Europe effectively gives legal access into the entire EU for any Syria or Turkey-based ISIS and al Nusra Front terrorists who either have, or can acquire a Turkish passport.

With Russian airstrikes now crushing ISIS infrastructure in Syria, fleeing terrorist fighters are looking for an easy escape over Syria’s northern border into Turkey – and now, thanks to this deal from Brussels – they are one step closer to the streets of Europe.

Brussels appears clueless to the reality of what is happening on the ground in Turkey. This might be the stupidest move that the EU has ever made in its history.

Perhaps this is exactly what Brussels wants in order to erect the next phase of its technocratic security state?

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 16 Nov 2015 14:18

french were also in forefront of the crusades. infact most of the crusader cities on the palentine, lebanese and syrian coasts coasts were run by french nobles.

vijaykarthik · Post by **vijaykarthik** » 16 Nov 2015 14:23

Is it that UK and US security services are really tight and nothing can happen there or is it that stuff is tried but they get busted by the time its too late. Its been running on my mind since yday. It cant be that France is just picked out of the ordinary to be taught a lesson. Quite unlikely, IMO.

And I am primarily discounting Septimus's ideas. Sorry.

But an attack in France in very short time after the first one either means that there is something more sinister [directly attributable to US / UK awareness / sponsoring terrorism etc etc. Or its possible that French security is lax visavis other equal / higher powered nations and an easy tgt.

...
Is it written in the Kuran / old anal litureature that French is the earliest civvy and needs destroying? Its plain stupid that they get attacked without some clear reason.

chetak · Post by **chetak** » 16 Nov 2015 14:25

Magic Passports Redux: Syrian Passport Allegedly Discovered on Paris Suicide Bomber

Magic Passports Redux: Syrian Passport Allegedly Discovered on Paris Suicide Bomber

We’ve heard this one before, but this time they are doubling down on this all-too familiar set piece.

Details are emerging after last night’s horrific events in Paris, and one particular item of investigation is all too familiar.

AFP, RT, Reuters, ITV, Sky News, AP, Fox News and Sputnik, are all reporting that a Syrian passport was found either on, or near, the body of one of the suicide bombers in Paris.

For those of you unaware, this story is a mirror image of another that surfaced on the morning of Sept. 11, 2001.

Watch a video of this report here:

https://youtu.be/EZfpeLQjdxY

https://youtu.be/919jc7ggDyQ

Apparently, according to CBS, “a passerby found the passport of one of the hijackers” on the street just hours after the 9/11 attacks.

Interestingly, in the same breath, a FOX News reporter speaking about the story says that the building it supposedly came from was completely engulfed in fire.

How would a passport survive the ordeal of being crashed into a building while inside a plane loaded with jet fuel?

This story was eventually buried and given very little coverage at all by media outlets.

This theme was repeated last January in the wake of the Charlie Hebdo Attack, when one of the alleged gunman’s ID card was magically left on the seat of their ‘get-away’ car. This convenient placement was used to establishment the ‘terrorists link’ to Yemen and the illusive “al Qaeda in the Arabian Peninsula”.

However, with events in Paris, mainstream media seems to be doubling down on this latest ‘magic passport’ story.

With ISIS already allegedly claiming responsibility, and Hollande saying this is an act of war, this supposed Syrian passport will probably be used as the physical evidence required to condone an attack on Syria.

Instead of blindingly accepting this story from French authorities, mainstream media would do themselves far better by asking the following questions:

Was the passport found on, or nearby, the suicide bomber? If it was not physically on their person, it is possible that is did not belong to them.

Speaking of not belonging to them, just because someone is in possession of an object does not necessarily make them the owner of it.

Who exactly found this passport? Is the passport real? If it is real, is it valid?

When was the passport last used to make entry into France?

What condition is the passport in?

Is it possible that the passport was planted by a third party?

Could the passport have ever survived in the conditions under which it was supposedly exposed to?

These are all questions that any real investigator should, and hopefully will, be asking. The consequences of this alleged Syrian passport being used as evidence can only be dire.

With Russian operations intensifying in Syria, any Western escalation could have serious ramifications and heightens the potential for wider, if not global, conflict.

Gus · Post by **Gus** » 16 Nov 2015 14:32

France has 15% and possibly more off the grid and complete with no go ghettos and arms network, travel network and safe houses and stashes etc. this sort of stuff was predicted long back , after Spain and London. Spain immediately withdrew and capitulated. London does its thing ..buy people, coopt , arrest a few who don't coopt etc. French cannot capitulate and withdraw as that means retreat against UK (whom they consider historic equal/competitor) and they are not having the UK kind of tactics. So this sort of stuff may happen again.

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 16 Nov 2015 14:35

people claim if you have right contacts can go to molenbeek and buy a automatic rifle for 500-1000 Euros. surplus arms from the yugoslav conflict are sold to gangsters, though pistols would be more in demand, ak56 can be arranged.

Lalmohan · Post by **Lalmohan** » 16 Nov 2015 14:49

france has very open borders and a large disgruntled maghrebi community - much easier to get weapons in and out from other countries. belgium is probably a softer target for creating a base from which to infiltrate france given that french police are fairly intrusive (and robust)

uk has the advantage of being an island - much harder to smuggle weapons in to.

something to note - european police forces have been preparing like crazy since mumbai and despite that, the swarming attack is almost impossible to prevent. habal pointed out that the security at the stade de france actually did its job and prevented the mission from going ahead. uk police managed to stop one on london in early stages of planning due to intel. also the police stormed bataclan within an hour - probably saving many lives. despite all that, in a free society - you cannot stop a mumbai style attack. our SDRE pandus and TFTA faujis did the best job they could.

finally - americans deriding the french would do well to remember that france was their first military ally, and that were it not for problems back at home (aka the revolution) they may well have been speaking french (or german) today. and its worth remembering also that a lot of military jargon and practice actually stems from the napoleonic era... (do the maths)

and the brits would do well to remember that the english actually lost the 100 year war and gave up their french possessions which they only got because of guillhome (william) the normandian breaking the saxon shield wall at hastings.

vijaykarthik · Post by **vijaykarthik** » 16 Nov 2015 15:00

^ not just in free societies. What a lot of people might have missed: In China there was some terror attack in Uighur. And 48 died. This was as recent as the last 2/3/4 days. And there have been scores of events like this in the past too.

So, this is a menace that can cut across flavors of societies. As long as the organizational skills are there and men are resourceful, this is a serious problem as for the perpetrator, there is nothing called saving his skin in the process. And therein lies the danger. The person is prepared for all eventualities. That's something that the security orgn in any country will do well to realize and try and eradicate the infrastructure, the supply chain, the supporting pillars. Everything. Just trying to catch hold of 20 useful idiots as a passive laid back after-the-event exercise wont cut it.

And unless strong qns are asked to the leadership of Pak / KSA / ....

Lalmohan · Post by **Lalmohan** » 16 Nov 2015 15:05

very true and i am omitting beslan and the moscow theatre incidents too

chetak · Post by **chetak** » 16 Nov 2015 15:06

johneeG wrote:But, why should ISIS attack Europe at all when they are being hit mainly by Russia?

why poke an already enraged bear??

especially a bear that cannot be controlled by the people controlling the fake attacks on ISIS and funding, supporting and arming the ISIS on the sly.

rsingh · Post by **rsingh** » 16 Nov 2015 15:10

Major operation going on in Monebeek. Police asking somebody to surrender. Molenbeek is NOT in suburbs of Brusselabad. It is Brussels. 10 min walk from Grand Place. Ex Burgamister of Molenbeek is blamed for the situation. This guy won election from 1992 till 2012. Made this municipality green. Not many question asked. Muslims like to live in ghettos. Every street corner has meat and vegetable shop. Street are not cleaned regularly. Schools have muslim majority. Federal Interior Minister has promised tho clean the area.

ashvin · Post by **ashvin** » 16 Nov 2015 15:15

Dear rsingh you mean Molenbeek (Sint-Jans-Molenbeek) in Brussels?

Things "not under control" in Molenbeek

http://deredactie.be/cm/vrtnieuws.engli ... /1.2496884

chetak · Post by **chetak** » 16 Nov 2015 15:16

vijaykarthik wrote:^ not just in free societies. What a lot of people might have missed: In China there was some terror attack in Uighur. And 48 died. This was as recent as the last 2/3/4 days. And there have been scores of events like this in the past too.

So, this is a menace that can cut across flavors of societies. As long as the organizational skills are there and men are resourceful, this is a serious problem as for the perpetrator, there is nothing called saving his skin in the process. And therein lies the danger. The person is prepared for all eventualities. That's something that the security orgn in any country will do well to realize and try and eradicate the infrastructure, the supply chain, the supporting pillars. Everything. Just trying to catch hold of 20 useful idiots as a passive laid back after-the-event exercise wont cut it.

And unless strong qns are asked to the leadership of Pak / KSA / ....

re India, when your own mala and vibhuti wearing yindoo brethren are aiding and abetting the jehadists at every level for their thirty pieces of silver, how can the supply chain and infrastructure be eradicated??

well known nationally celebrated icon cops have vigorously and enthusiastically pushed the idea of saffron terror, above and beyond the call, on the say so of their congi and commie masters. a pox on their houses.

less said about the Pak /KSA /... leadership the better. at least, they have the honesty of their evil purpose and you know where they are coming from.

member_20453 · Post by **member_20453** » 16 Nov 2015 15:19

vijaykarthik wrote:Is it that UK and US security services are really tight and nothing can happen there or is it that stuff is tried but they get busted by the time its too late. Its been running on my mind since yday. It cant be that France is just picked out of the ordinary to be taught a lesson. Quite unlikely, IMO.

And I am primarily discounting Septimus's ideas. Sorry.

But an attack in France in very short time after the first one either means that there is something more sinister [directly attributable to US / UK awareness / sponsoring terrorism etc etc. Or its possible that French security is lax visavis other equal / higher powered nations and an easy tgt.

...
Is it written in the Kuran / old anal litureature that French is the earliest civvy and needs destroying? Its plain stupid that they get attacked without some clear reason.

Well, living in Belgium and travelling quite often to London and all major cities by car due to work, I know personally that there are hardly any checks on cars while crossing the channel, I have yet to stopped even once for checks on my car and I have done the journeys tens of times. Moreso, finding these weapons & explosives in numbers is not easy regardless of what any one says, its hard enough to find weapons legally in Belgium let alone illegally. The areas near Brussels where a lot of these nut jobs came from are under heavy sophisticated watch since they were known for extremist hot beds way before 9/11. Its very unlikely they had these weapons for a while.

Now, if you really understand the utter mockery of the dead in those images that Charlie published, I myself was pissed enough to hope KGB would blow up Charli HQ and I am not even Russian. Those images were mocking the dead not even a week after the incident while the nation mourns. Do you really think Putin, KGB or any 'not to be ****** with Russian' would take this lightly? No way, this is not the way Russia works, thankfully they still live in a world where there are consequences. Also, Charlie basically raised a middle finger to Putin himself when he himself called this blasphemy. Heck seeing Putin pissed after seeing those images would have been enough indication for the KGB folks to start pushing things forward, by now they know the man's mood well enough to know this shouldn't go unpunished.

Russian covert involvement shouldn't be a surprise, if anything, with one swell swoop they got everyone else on the table pushing the political process forward. As for the innocents who died, well innocents always die, they are the price you pay for state craft. Either ways those attacks would have happened at one point, regardless of Russian involvement. Sure, they would be of a much smaller scale but the scale, the weapons, the explosives and the timing suggests KGB just nudged it forward, a few simple encrypted msgs to high ranking Mafia members around Western/Eastern Europe to allocate a couple of bags of ****** shit up to a few low level gun runners frequented by jihadists, gangs, drug dealers etc. who in turn with sudden availability of fresh stock in quantity will automatically forward the duffel bags to the nutjobs. No one will ever find out since even the high ranking mafia members don't know that their long time dear friends are actually KGB/FSB. For them this is business as usual since they have been running guns forever across the planet. As said, no one will ever find out, this is actually child's play for KGB.

There is plenty of KGB/FSB presence in all of Western Europe particularly in Belgium, Germany, France & UK.

rsingh · Post by **rsingh** » 16 Nov 2015 15:21

ashvin wrote:Dear rsingh you mean Molenbeek (Sint-Jans-Molenbeek) in Brussels?
Things "not under control" in Molenbeek
http://deredactie.be/cm/vrtnieuws.engli ... /1.2496884

Yes it is known as Molenbeek onlee.

BTW one person has been arrested and police had to de-mine the area to arrest this person.

chetak · Post by **chetak** » 16 Nov 2015 15:24

Lalmohan wrote:france has very open borders and a large disgruntled maghrebi community - much easier to get weapons in and out from other countries. belgium is probably a softer target for creating a base from which to infiltrate france given that french police are fairly intrusive (and robust)

uk has the advantage of being an island - much harder to smuggle weapons in to.

something to note - european police forces have been preparing like crazy since mumbai and despite that, the swarming attack is almost impossible to prevent. habal pointed out that the security at the stade de france actually did its job and prevented the mission from going ahead. uk police managed to stop one on london in early stages of planning due to intel. also the police stormed bataclan within an hour - probably saving many lives. despite all that, in a free society - you cannot stop a mumbai style attack. our SDRE pandus and TFTA faujis did the best job they could.

finally - americans deriding the french would do well to remember that france was their first military ally, and that were it not for problems back at home (aka the revolution) they may well have been speaking french (or german) today. and its worth remembering also that a lot of military jargon and practice actually stems from the napoleonic era... (do the maths)

and the brits would do well to remember that the english actually lost the 100 year war and gave up their french possessions which they only got because of guillhome (william) the normandian breaking the saxon shield wall at hastings.

It was just a lucky coincidence. The french president was inside and the security was solely for him and only him. they were caught as unawares as we were in Bombay. They were armed and equipped much better than the bombay cops and despite all that they made no headway during the initial stages of the encounters.

yes, their response was faster and coordinated but that comes from learning bitter lessons.

member_20453 · Post by **member_20453** » 16 Nov 2015 15:26

Singha wrote:people claim if you have right contacts can go to molenbeek and buy a automatic rifle for 500-1000 Euros. surplus arms from the yugoslav conflict are sold to gangsters, though pistols would be more in demand, ak56 can be arranged.

Very true, but these contacts are usually low level gunner runners getting their stuff from various low level sections of the Russian mob. Russia mob is one of the biggest if not the biggest global organized crime organizations which has close ties to the Russian state. Heck Russian mob is but one of the instruments of the Russian state.

rsingh · Post by **rsingh** » 16 Nov 2015 15:29

Bomb alert in Brussels.
Looks like main suspect has been arrested.

chetak · Post by **chetak** » 16 Nov 2015 15:36

Septimus P. wrote:
vijaykarthik wrote:Is it that UK and US security services are really tight and nothing can happen there or is it that stuff is tried but they get busted by the time its too late. Its been running on my mind since yday. It cant be that France is just picked out of the ordinary to be taught a lesson. Quite unlikely, IMO.

And I am primarily discounting Septimus's ideas. Sorry.

But an attack in France in very short time after the first one either means that there is something more sinister [directly attributable to US / UK awareness / sponsoring terrorism etc etc. Or its possible that French security is lax visavis other equal / higher powered nations and an easy tgt.

...
Is it written in the Kuran / old anal litureature that French is the earliest civvy and needs destroying? Its plain stupid that they get attacked without some clear reason.
Well, living in Belgium and travelling quite often to London and all major cities by car due to work, I know personally that there are hardly any checks on cars while crossing the channel, I have yet to stopped even once for checks on my car and I have done the journeys tens of times. Moreso, finding these weapons & explosives in numbers is not easy regardless of what any one says, its hard enough to find weapons legally in Belgium let alone illegally. The areas near Brussels where a lot of these nut jobs came from are under heavy sophisticated watch since they were known for extremist hot beds way before 9/11. Its very unlikely they had these weapons for a while.

Now, if you really understand the utter mockery of the dead in those images that Charlie published, I myself was pissed enough to hope KGB would blow up Charli HQ and I am not even Russian. Those images were mocking the dead not even a week after the incident while the nation mourns. Do you really think Putin, KGB or any 'not to be ****** with Russian' would take this lightly? No way, this is not the way Russia works, thankfully they still live in a world where there are consequences. Also, Charlie basically raised a middle finger to Putin himself when he himself called this blasphemy. Heck seeing Putin pissed after seeing those images would have been enough indication for the KGB folks to start pushing things forward, by now they know the man's mood well enough to know this shouldn't go unpunished.

Russian covert involvement shouldn't be a surprise, if anything, with one swell swoop they got everyone else on the table pushing the political process forward. As for the innocents who died, well innocents always die, they are the price you pay for state craft. Either ways those attacks would have happened at one point, regardless of Russian involvement. Sure, they would be of a much smaller scale but the scale, the weapons, the explosives and the timing suggests KGB just nudged it forward, a few simple encrypted msgs to high ranking Mafia members around Western/Eastern Europe to allocate a couple of bags of ****** shit up to a few low level gun runners frequented by jihadists, gangs, drug dealers etc. who in turn with sudden availability of fresh stock in quantity will automatically forward the duffel bags to the nutjobs. No one will ever find out since even the high ranking mafia members don't know that their long time dear friends are actually KGB/FSB. For them this is business as usual since they have been running guns forever across the planet. As said, no one will ever find out, this is actually child's play for KGB.

There is plenty of KGB/FSB presence in all of Western Europe particularly in Belgium, Germany, France & UK.

In 1986, driving from paris to munich, we were stopped twice by the french police on that single journey and the car was virtually ripped open, seats removed, luggage rudely dumped on the road and inspected, what not up to but not including a cavity search. They did not even take a second look at the official white passports and one diplomatic passport that was being carried by people on board. All occupants were members of the Indian military.

this was the polite french for you. racist to the core, even today. Indians are often refused service in many restaurants there.

member_20453 · Post by **member_20453** » 16 Nov 2015 15:38

chetak wrote:
Lalmohan wrote:france has very open borders and a large disgruntled maghrebi community - much easier to get weapons in and out from other countries. belgium is probably a softer target for creating a base from which to infiltrate france given that french police are fairly intrusive (and robust)

uk has the advantage of being an island - much harder to smuggle weapons in to.

something to note - european police forces have been preparing like crazy since mumbai and despite that, the swarming attack is almost impossible to prevent. habal pointed out that the security at the stade de france actually did its job and prevented the mission from going ahead. uk police managed to stop one on london in early stages of planning due to intel. also the police stormed bataclan within an hour - probably saving many lives. despite all that, in a free society - you cannot stop a mumbai style attack. our SDRE pandus and TFTA faujis did the best job they could.

finally - americans deriding the french would do well to remember that france was their first military ally, and that were it not for problems back at home (aka the revolution) they may well have been speaking french (or german) today. and its worth remembering also that a lot of military jargon and practice actually stems from the napoleonic era... (do the maths)

and the brits would do well to remember that the english actually lost the 100 year war and gave up their french possessions which they only got because of guillhome (william) the normandian breaking the saxon shield wall at hastings.
It was just a lucky coincidence. The french president was inside and the security was solely for him and only him. they were caught as unawares as we were in Bombay. They were armed and equipped much better than the bombay cops and despite all that they made no headway during the initial stages of the encounters.

yes, their response was faster and coordinated but that comes from learning bitter lessons.

Their response was faster sure they were also facing suicidal rag tag nut jobs who blew themselves up. Had they been trained quite like the Mumbai attackers, we would be looking at a bigger massacre with over 300 dead, these guys now essentially emptied a few mags and blew themselves up. They didn't move much, they committed to a location while Mumbai attackers were on a hit and move tactic. The shit stains at Mumbai settled eventually at a final location, then they were on confuse, evade, fight and repel tactic, attempting to play it as long as possible.

7 out 8 guys in Paris blew themselves up. Quite quickly. What NSG, Mumbai Police and Marcos achieved on 26/11 was quite exemplary, they were the first to face such an attack and we came out on top while rescuing over 600+ hostages. Mumbai has been a learning point and we are now much better equipped to deal with such attacks.

nandakumar · Post by **nandakumar** » 16 Nov 2015 15:40

The latest issue of New York Review of Books has an article reviewing Ayyan Hirsi Ali's book, Heretic: Why Islam Needs a Reformation Now. The Central point of the book is that Islam too needs to undergo a process of 'Reformation' the way Christianity and Judaism did in an earlier era. The reviewer disagrees. His contention is that radical islam is not the mainstream view. Rather it represents a miniscule minority's violent response to the moderate majoritarian inclination. As he sumps up in the concluding paragraph of his review:
http://www.nybooks.com/articles/archive ... y-muslims/
Quote: The very shrillness of today’s zealots may reflect an underlying fear that conservative orthodoxies are under threat as never before, facing a growing backlash not so much from the outside world as from within the faith. It is noteworthy that thirty-five years of self-declared “Islamic” rule in Iran have fostered not greater religiosity but creeping secularization, with ever fewer people observing religious rites. The more recent excesses of Islamist terrorism and sectarian rivalry have accelerated a far wider wave of doubt. Muslims with such doubts will not need Hirsi Ali’s hectoring to feel “uncomfortable,” and to consider new approaches to their faith. Unquote.

member_20453 · Post by **member_20453** » 16 Nov 2015 15:47

In 1986, driving from paris to munich, we were stopped twice by the french police on that single journey and the car was virtually ripped open, seats removed, luggage rudely dumped on the road and inspected, what not up to but not including a cavity search. They did not even take a second look at the official white passports and one diplomatic passport that was being carried by people on board. All occupants were members of the Indian military.

this was the polite french for you. racist to the core, even today. Indians are often refused service in many restaurants there.[/quote]

Sorry, I have only lived in Belgium since the year 2000 so don't know much about years past, I travel to France at least 4-5 times year by car, my father-in-law often 2-3 times a month, we never have been stopped or checked. I only have passport checks while entering Switzerland on main highways but so does everyone or UK (through Ferry at Dunkerk). Never had issues in France so far, can't say the same going forward.

IndraD · Post by **IndraD** » 16 Nov 2015 16:00

French officials name ring leader of Paris attack -- he is a Belgian national now in Seeria

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldne ... aaoud.html

IndraD · Post by **IndraD** » 16 Nov 2015 16:05

Recently I was in Berlin, to attend a conference and in spite of being nicely dressed, some women walking on footpath whom I approached to find location of venue, avoided me like rattle snake, I don't blame them, refugee crisis was in full swing then and they must have mistaken me for one ...
There is huge local anger against refugee drama across Europe, working with Polish/Hungarian/Greece I realise , they are livid in anger, one common point raised by all is 'we can;t take care of our own people and country, we are bankrupt why should we be taking refugee in a war which is not ours?'
If one goes through comment section of daily mail UK there is swarming sympathy for Russa for ruthlessly attacking ISIS and they hold their & US govt responsible for ME mess.

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 16 Nov 2015 16:28

Septimus I must ask you officially to stop these CTs of kgb being behind the paris bombings.

hnair · Post by **hnair** » 16 Nov 2015 16:46

Septimus P. wrote:Do you really think Putin, KGB or any 'not to be ****** with Russian' would take this lightly?

Yes. Russia and Putin has been lampooned very vigorously in the past and they just shrugged off

We will wait for the Brussels investigation to end, before giving out clean chits to your own borough and go after KGB/FSB et al

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 16 Nov 2015 16:51

CNN - belgium seems run by its own version of the MMS/Gujral doctrine.

At least two roads in Molenbeek, a suburb of the Belgian capital, were cordoned off by the police in an active standoff Monday morning, according to the CNN team in the neighborhood.

Police in balaclavas surrounded a building and were using a megaphone to command an occupant to come out, the CNN team reported.

Roads were sealed off, with about 70-80 police officers on the Rue Delaunoy, CNN staff said. Ambulances and fire brigades were at the ready.

...
In an interview with CNN terrorism analyst Paul Cruickshank in August, Alain Grignard, a senior member of the counterterror unit in the Brussels federal police and a lecturer on political Islam at the University of Liege, said the perpetrators of the Verviers plot fitted a typical profile of Belgian jihadists: “men in their early twenties mostly from the Molenbeek district of Brussels moving in circles with a track record of delinquency and petty crime.”

“They were radicalized very quickly, and when they came back from Syria they had no fear of death,” Grignard said in the interview, published in the Combating Terrorism Center’s publication, the CTC Sentinel. Cruickshank is also editor-in-chief of the CTC Sentinel.

“These guys had maybe more experience in gunbattles than our own commandos.”

Like many European jihadists, they were an outgrowth of the “inner-city gang phenomenon,” he said, who had already revolted against Western society through petty crime and delinquency before having their antisocial approach “legitimized” by a radical strain of Islam.

“These youngsters are getting quickly and completely sucked in. The next thing they know they’re in Syria and in a real video game,” he said.

He told Cruickshank that the terror threat in Belgium, fueled by the trail of young jihadists to fight in Syria and Iraq, had “never been higher in all the years I’ve been working on counterterrorism.”

“To give you an idea of the scale of the challenge, in the past two years we’ve charged more people with terrorism offenses than in the 30 years before that,” he said. “It’s impossible to do surveillance on everybody.”

rsingh · Post by **rsingh** » 16 Nov 2015 16:54

this was the polite french for you. racist to the core, even today. Indians are often refused service in many restaurants there.

Where is that. Which restaurant is refusing Indians?

BRao · Post by **BRao** » 16 Nov 2015 16:56

rsingh wrote:
this was the polite french for you. racist to the core, even today. Indians are often refused service in many restaurants there.
Where is that. Which restaurant is refusing Indians?

French are openly racists. Multiple experiences about CDG airport as well. Even the French I have had the misfortune of dealing with here in India are quite aloof & supremacists.

member_20453 · Post by **member_20453** » 16 Nov 2015 17:10

hnair wrote:
Septimus P. wrote:Do you really think Putin, KGB or any 'not to be ****** with Russian' would take this lightly?
Yes. Russia and Putin has been lampooned very vigorously in the past and they just shrugged off

We will wait for the Brussels investigation to end, before giving out clean chits to your own borough and go after KGB/FSB et al

Well Brussels/Paris investigation will only show that ISIS planned and executed this attack. They'll probably find some low level gun runners eventually. As for KGB, well no one will go after them as there will be no evidence found. KGB is in the big league, they wrote the book on the game.

The investigation will also show that Molenbeeke which is currently about 10 mins from where I am sitting needs proper attention. That place has been neglected by the Govt. for over 30 years.

member_20453 · Post by **member_20453** » 16 Nov 2015 17:15

Singha wrote:Septimus I must ask you officially to stop these CTs of kgb being behind the paris bombings.

Yes, sorry if I come across making them look bad with my controversial claims. For all I care, their actions or inactions are justified as part of state craft. I'll refrain from mentioning them again. In the end death to ISIS infidels.

IndraD · Post by **IndraD** » 16 Nov 2015 17:17

There are several ghettos like Molenbeek in London, going by how dense and complex London suburb is , UK police has done excellent job of safeguarding their people, what conspires behind curtain we can only speculate, but after 7/7 they have kept the country clean, this morning Cameroon said UK police has prevented 7 major terror attacks. Which means they are far superior in intel collection .

rsingh · Post by **rsingh** » 16 Nov 2015 17:24

Question was which restaurant is refusing to serve Indians.
when you say racist. My own experience is they have an inferiority complex with English speakers (you know the history). British,American or Indian. They know that their country was crushed by Germany two times. Both of the times France was liberated by English speakers. That is the sole reason.