Newbie Corner & Military Miscellaneous

AmitR · Post by **AmitR** » 08 Feb 2009 13:10

I have a question for the more experienced members of this board.
India is on purchase spree for many different types of weapons and weapon systems. Every time I read a defence journal my mind gets boggled by the sheer number and types of deals that India is always involved in. Now my question is, isn't India asking for trouble by creating such a vast variety of disparate weapons sources. Or does it fare better in terms of emergency situations.

KrishG · Post by **KrishG** » 08 Feb 2009 22:18

Is Google[Bot] Ramana or RahulM ?? I am confused. The other must be Yahoo[Bot] from what I have been noticing.

Rahul M · Post by **Rahul M** » 08 Feb 2009 22:22

A Googlebot is a search bot used by Google. It collects documents from the web to build a searchable index for the Google search engine.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Googlebot

similarly for the other search engines like yahoo and alexa.

KrishG · Post by **KrishG** » 08 Feb 2009 22:25

Rahul M wrote:
A Googlebot is a search bot used by Google. It collects documents from the web to build a searchable index for the Google search engine.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Googlebot

similarly for the other search engines like yahoo and alexa.

Good Heavens!! I thought that the mods use such hidden names!

Rahul M · Post by **Rahul M** » 08 Feb 2009 22:33

what do you think we are doing ? playing spy-spy on internet ??

KrishG · Post by **KrishG** » 08 Feb 2009 22:38

Rahul M wrote:what do you think we are doing ? playing spy-spy on internet ??

For a sec, I thought I busted you mods!
I knew I shouldn't have read too much Sherlock Holmes!

Prasad · Post by **Prasad** » 09 Feb 2009 00:00

Folks,
This was mentioned in another thread -

The Defence Ministry canceled a bid to purchase a successor to the Swedish-made L-70 air defense guns because only the state-owned Ordnance Factories Board, in partnership with Rheinmetall Defense of Germany, had submitted the bid. The $1.2 billion contract to buy transportable radars is also heading for cancellation as Rafael was the only bidder.

In such cases where there is only a single vendor bidding for the contract and the whole thing is so specific or obscure that only vendor comes up, what happens then? Does MoD cancel the tender and re-issue the tender? Do they change requirements or do they just hope for a fat chance that someone else might bid and get teh CAG may get off their back?

ticky · Post by **ticky** » 10 Feb 2009 00:26

Rahul M wrote:what do you think we are doing ? playing spy-spy on internet ??

Good riposte

I nearly burst my spleen there

AmitR · Post by **AmitR** » 10 Feb 2009 09:42

MoD has given order for Milan 2T. I am unable to understand that if more advanced Milan 3 and ER are available why have we chosen to use 2T? Can some gurus shed some light on that.

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 11 Feb 2009 01:23

You buy what meets your requirements or else will end up buying latest greatest stuff and subsidise the other guy. If you need a commute car will you buy a Toyota or go for the Bentley?

AmitR · Post by **AmitR** » 11 Feb 2009 12:46

ramana wrote:You buy what meets your requirements or else will end up buying latest greatest stuff and subsidise the other guy. If you need a commute car will you buy a Toyota or go for the Bentley?

If I have the money I will buy a Jaguar why should I buy a Toyota or Maruti. And India has the money to buy and then produce these weapons, hence the question. India buys an old system which then get obsolete in a few years and then again we are staring at depleting weapons levels and file pushing.

Dmurphy · Post by **Dmurphy** » 11 Feb 2009 18:46

Hey guys, why is this MARCOS guy carrying bow and arrows on his back? And that too when he has an MP5 in hands

On a lighter note, does he belong to the RAMBO regiment?

sum · Post by **sum** » 11 Feb 2009 19:23

From what i had read somewhere(or was it BR??) that the bow and arrow is for sentry silencing (though not sure why a silencer gun wont work).

Edit: maybe, it for silencing the sentry from the water. They are MARCOS after all.

Rahul M · Post by **Rahul M** » 11 Feb 2009 19:27

guys, read the BR articles on MARCOS.
those are cyanide tipped arrows for silent killing.

simply follow the caption with the pic.
http://www.bharat-rakshak.com/LAND-FORC ... &Itemid=26

vikassh · Post by **vikassh** » 11 Feb 2009 22:35

Can some one tell me about good books around military strategy, Indian Army, Pakistan army and wars in South Asia?

Dmurphy · Post by **Dmurphy** » 11 Feb 2009 22:54

Rahul M wrote:guys, read the BR articles on MARCOS.
those are cyanide tipped arrows for silent killing.

simply follow the caption with the pic.
http://www.bharat-rakshak.com/LAND-FORC ... &Itemid=26

Thank you RM.

Could anybody explain how a CAEWS being rallied by the IAI at AI 2009 is different (capapbility wise) from PHALCON AWACS?

Any possibility of this CAEWS bagging the order for the next batch of AWACS instead of the PHALCONS??

Dmurphy · Post by **Dmurphy** » 11 Feb 2009 23:23

The MiG-25s, I'm told, have been replaced by the Su-30 MKIs for their Recon role. So here's a question...

A recon mission would need a radar in switched ON mode, something we were wary of at the Red Flag Exercises. So if the MKI is gonna fly around near the Chinese border with its Bars radar in a switched ON mode, is it not inviting the Chinese to snoop in on its radar signature?

jaladipc · Post by **jaladipc** » 11 Feb 2009 23:41

Dmurphy wrote:The MiG-25s, I'm told, have been replaced by the Su-30 MKIs for their Recon role. So here's a question...

A recon mission would need a radar in switched ON mode, something we were wary of at the Red Flag Exercises. So if the MKI is gonna fly around near the Chinese border with its Bars radar in a switched ON mode, is it not inviting the Chinese to snoop in on its radar signature?

After the armed forces got their hands on sats, they retired the Mig-25
but the duties were nt transfere to MKI......

Shameek · Post by **Shameek** » 12 Feb 2009 00:01

Dmurphy wrote:So if the MKI is gonna fly around near the Chinese border with its Bars radar in a switched ON mode, is it not inviting the Chinese to snoop in on its radar signature?

What is the source for that information? Besides recon roles require camera pods. The Foxbat had the camera ports inbuilt. Dont see why they would need their radars.

Dmurphy · Post by **Dmurphy** » 12 Feb 2009 00:52

Shamee and Jaladipc

here's the source : Indian Express : With MiG 25’s gone, Sukhois to become eye in the sky

Shameek · Post by **Shameek** » 12 Feb 2009 01:58

Dmurphy wrote:here's the source : Indian Express : With MiG 25’s gone, Sukhois to become eye in the sky

As that article says there are special pods to be fitted onto the MKI. They will be used for imaging. To answer your question, the radar would not play a role here.

Raja Bose · Post by **Raja Bose** » 12 Feb 2009 03:20

Rahul M wrote:guys, read the BR articles on MARCOS.
those are cyanide tipped arrows for silent killing.

simply follow the caption with the pic.
http://www.bharat-rakshak.com/LAND-FORC ... &Itemid=26

The arrows were favoured over silenced guns in order to have longer range without compromising accuracy. These are not your Ram Lila mela-type arrows ...they are precision manufactured and made of fibreglass. And ofcourse they are cyanide tipped

KiranM · Post by **KiranM** » 12 Feb 2009 16:00

Not sure where to post this, but an interesting read on the 1971 Indo-Pak war:
http://www.ndu.edu/nesa/docs/Gill%20atl ... ersion.pdf

Rahul M · Post by **Rahul M** » 12 Feb 2009 20:27

RB, does anyone other than shibu shoren use ramlila type bows and arrows nowadays ?

also it was a crossbow IIRC.

jaladipc · Post by **jaladipc** » 13 Feb 2009 03:07

Dmurphy wrote:Shamee and Jaladipc

here's the source : Indian Express : With MiG 25’s gone, Sukhois to become eye in the sky

Even from the day 1 of induction of MKI, it been used as a mini awacs.But not like for clik chiking pics over the chinky territory.
Its ground mode has a detection range of over 50km.so it can easily detect targets upto 50km in chikom territory staying inside indian land mass.

Raja Bose · Post by **Raja Bose** » 13 Feb 2009 03:25

Rahul M wrote:RB, does anyone other than shibu shoren use ramlila type bows and arrows nowadays ?

also it was a crossbow IIRC.

Yes they used/use crossbow...much more powerful and truer aim. These crossbows are made of composites and have a trigger mechanism just like a gun (no handles and stuff like medieval times).

Nobody uses longbow except Rambo

CalvinH · Post by **CalvinH** » 13 Feb 2009 03:51

^^ thats a very old snap. From 80s/early 90s if I am not wrong. There was an article in India today and IIRC i saw the snap there.

I dont think they use it anymore.

Raja Bose · Post by **Raja Bose** » 13 Feb 2009 05:21

You are right. That is actually the 1st pic of a MARCO that was probably publicly published. They did say they dont use the crossbow anymore....but only Allah (and the hapless enemy sentry for a few millisecs) know.

BTW note the telescopic sight on the crossbow.

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 13 Feb 2009 10:19

Does anyone have acess to this paper?

Air Force magazine, March 1993, Vol 76, No.3
"Nuclear Standoff on the sub-continent", Richard Mackenzie.

Dmurphy · Post by **Dmurphy** » 13 Feb 2009 14:34

whats that black, grease like cream they apply on the face? What is it used for?

KiranM · Post by **KiranM** » 13 Feb 2009 18:54

What is the genesis of the word 'Mohatarma'? What does it exactly mean?

TIA,

Kiran

Shameek · Post by **Shameek** » 13 Feb 2009 20:23

Dmurphy wrote:whats that black, grease like cream they apply on the face? What is it used for?

It is face paint. It is uaually available in the form of paint sticks or compacts. It is used for camouflage.

munna · Post by **munna** » 13 Feb 2009 20:28

KiranM wrote:What is the genesis of the word 'Mohatarma'? What does it exactly mean?

TIA,

Kiran

Hi Kiran in Urdu the word Mohtarma is used for lady (honourable way of address) alongwith its synonym Khawateen. Similarly for men words like Mohtaram and Hazraat are used. In SDRE terms Mahila (HIndi) == Mohtarma(Urdu). But for TFTA 100 Mahila == 1 Mohtarma

vijyeta · Post by **vijyeta** » 13 Feb 2009 20:50

shameekg wrote:
Dmurphy wrote:here's the source : Indian Express : With MiG 25’s gone, Sukhois to become eye in the sky
.

The MKI now stands for Milking Kow of Iaf.

Roles - Air Dominance, SEAD, Precision Attack, Maritime stike, Recon, ELINT, Mini-Awacs, Deep Penetration Strike, Nuke delivery.

What's next? An ASAT launch using the air launched Brahmos against an LEO sat?

atreya · Post by **atreya** » 13 Feb 2009 21:08

errr...SEAD? maritime strike? deep penetration strike? ELINT?
am i an uninformed fool? are so many roles really fulfilled by Su 30s?

NOTE: sarcasm unintended..i am only asking....please furnish some details also..
thank u

vijyeta · Post by **vijyeta** » 13 Feb 2009 21:14

atreya wrote:errr...SEAD? maritime strike? deep penetration strike? ELINT?
am i an uninformed fool? are so many roles really fulfilled by Su 30s?

NOTE: sarcasm unintended..i am only asking....please furnish some details also..
thank u

SEAD - KH31?
Maritime - Air Launched Brahmos?
Why is Deep penetration strike tough to comprehend?

Details are right here on BR...... refer to the SU30 thread.

sum · Post by **sum** » 13 Feb 2009 22:06

vijyeta wrote: The MKI now stands for Milking Kow of Iaf.

Roles - Air Dominance, SEAD, Precision Attack, Maritime stike, Recon, ELINT, Mini-Awacs, Deep Penetration Strike, Nuke delivery.

What's next? An ASAT launch using the air launched Brahmos against an LEO sat?

He he...thats one thing remaining which the MKI has not yet done!!!

HariC · Post by **HariC** » 13 Feb 2009 22:08

munna wrote:
KiranM wrote:What is the genesis of the word 'Mohatarma'? What does it exactly mean?

TIA,

Kiran
Hi Kiran in Urdu the word Mohtarma is used for lady (honourable way of address) alongwith its synonym Khawateen. Similarly for men words like Mohtaram and Hazraat are used. In SDRE terms Mahila (HIndi) == Mohtarma(Urdu). But for TFTA 100 Mahila == 1 Mohtarma

plus BR - Mohtarma and MotorHam are both used on the fly to mean the same thing.

KiranM · Post by **KiranM** » 13 Feb 2009 22:27

HariC wrote: plus BR - Mohtarma and MotorHam are both used on the fly to mean the same thing.

Is MotorHam a tongue twisting interpretation of Mohtarma by some firangi birather of BR? Or is there some other legacy behind it?

KiranM · Post by **KiranM** » 13 Feb 2009 22:30

Raja Bose wrote:
Rahul M wrote:RB, does anyone other than shibu shoren use ramlila type bows and arrows nowadays ?

also it was a crossbow IIRC.
Yes they used/use crossbow...much more powerful and truer aim. These crossbows are made of composites and have a trigger mechanism just like a gun (no handles and stuff like medieval times).

Nobody uses longbow except Rambo

One thing that always puzzled me was how a small arrow head of Rambo had the explosive potential of 155mm 52 cal shell. But then it is Rambo..