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Re: India Nuclear News and Discussion 4 July 2011

Posted: 04 Jul 2023 18:14
by drnayar
Tanaji wrote:https://www.newindianexpress.com/nation ... 91202.html

Keen to engage with India on nuclear test ban treaty
CTBT Organization executive secretary Dr Robert Floyd defends US on subcritical N-tests, would like New Delhi to have observer status on Comprehensive Test Ban Treaty

Reading between the lines, he has been told to get lost.

Why would india agree to this when pakis have access to Chinese and no ko data on weapon tests.. the latter is very much a reality.

Re: India Nuclear News and Discussion 4 July 2011

Posted: 16 Aug 2023 21:22
by bala
Former Principal Scientific Advisor Rajagopala Chidambaram interview (in Hindi). He talks about Pokhran-1 (18 May 1974) and Pokhran-2 (11 and 13 May 1998). He shares how India became a nuclear power and when India did a nuclear test, how the whole world saw it.


Re: India Nuclear News and Discussion 4 July 2011

Posted: 20 Aug 2023 22:29
by drnayar



Interesting stuff about Rosatom ..one stop shop for *all* nuclear requirements !!

i suspect if the French and Americans do not do their job with their respective sites in India those would go to Rosatom as well !!.. also the local "opposition" to kudankulam ..the fishermen led by their Christian bishops all makes sense.

https://www.eurasiantimes.com/india-fra ... -fire-due/
Seven years after a Memorandum of Understanding (MoU) was signed between India and France for setting up the largest nuclear power plant in the world at Jaitapur (Maharashtra), the project is still hanging fire.

as for the americans.,

https://www.powermag.com/india-eyes-maj ... ear-power/

The U.S. and India in 2019 signed a deal in which the U.S. pledged to support construction of at least six nuclear power plants in India, and the two countries in February revisited previous agreements from as long ago as 2008 that could facilitate U.S. backing of India’s nuclear power program. Officials in India also have signed civil nuclear cooperation agreements with another dozen countries, including Russia, Canada, and France, that would support the deployment of additional reactors. The Nuclear Power Corp. of India (NPCI) has received government backing to build a series of 700-MW PHWR reactors as part of the country’s domestic nuclear power program. Westinghouse and the NPCI in 2016 had a broad agreement for the U.S. company to build as many as six reactors in India, but the deal collapsed after Westinghouse declared bankruptcy in 2017.

Why not just give both Jaitapur and the one in AP to the Russians who will get the job done. who cares about politics., just give some piecemeal order for Rafales or civil aircraft.

Re: India Nuclear News and Discussion 4 July 2011

Posted: 03 Sep 2023 23:50
by Cyrano
Largest indigenously developed N-plant unit in Gujarat starts ops at full capacity
This comes a little over three years since the unit achieved its ‘first criticality’ – a technical term that signifies the initiation of a controlled, but sustained nuclear fission reaction – in July 2020. On June 30 this year, the unit had started commercial operations.
Written by Anil Sasi


https://indianexpress.com/article/india ... y-8918642/
The third unit of the indigenously developed 700-megawatt electric (MWe) nuclear power reactor at the Kakrapar Atomic Power Project (KAPP3) in Gujarat has commenced operations at full capacity.

Prime Minister Narendra Modi said on social media platform X, “India achieves another milestone. The largest indigenous 700 MWe Kakrapar Nuclear Power Plant Unit-3 in Gujarat starts operations at full capacity. Congratulations to our scientists and engineers.”

This comes a little over three years since the unit achieved its ‘first criticality’ – a technical term that signifies the initiation of a controlled, but sustained nuclear fission reaction – in July 2020. On June 30 this year, the unit had started commercial operations.

In India’s civilian nuclear programme, this is seen as a landmark event, given that KAPP-3 is the country’s first 700 MWe unit and the biggest indigenously developed variant of the Pressurised Heavy Water Reactor (PHWR). The PHWRs, which use natural uranium as fuel and heavy water as moderator, constitute the mainstay of India’s nuclear power fleet. Till now, the biggest reactor of indigenous design was the 540 MWe PHWR, two of which have been deployed in Tarapur, Maharashtra.

For India, the operationalisation of its first 700MWe reactor is a significant scale up in technology, both in terms of the optimisation of its PHWR design — the new 700MWe unit addresses the excess thermal margins (thermal margin refers to the extent to which the operating temperature of the reactor is below its maximum operating temperature) — and also marks an improvement in the economies-of-scale, without significant design changes to the 540 MWe reactor.

Four units of the 700MWe reactor are being constructed at Kakrapar (KAPP-3 and 4) and Rawatbhata (RAPS-7 and 8) site in Rajasthan currently. The 700MWe reactors are slated to be backbone of a new fleet of 12 reactors that the NDA government accorded administrative approval and financial sanction in 2017 and that are to be set up in fleet mode.

As India works to ramp up its existing nuclear power capacity of 7,480 MWe to 22,480 MWe by 2031, the 700MWe capacity would constitute the biggest component of this expansion plan. Currently, nuclear power capacity constitutes around 2 per cent of the total installed capacity of 4,17,668 MW (May 31).

Significantly, as India’s civilian nuclear sector gears up to its next frontier — building a 900 MWe Pressurised Water Reactors (PWRs) of indigenous design – the experience of executing the larger 700MWe reactor design would come in handy, especially with respect to the improved capability of making large-size pressure vessels, alongside India’s own isotope enrichment plants being developed to supply a part of the required enriched uranium fuel to power these new generation reactors over the next decade or so, according to DAE officials.

The first ‘pour of concrete’ for laying the foundation of KAPP-3 happened in November 2010 and this unit was originally expected to be commissioned in 2015. State-owned Nuclear Power Corporation of India Ltd (NPCIL), which operates the bulk of India’s nuclear power fleet, had awarded the reactor building contract of both KAPP Unit 3 and 4 to Larsen & Toubro at an original contract value of Rs 844 crore. The original cost of two 700 MWe units was pegged at Rs 11,500 crore and the tariff per unit was originally calculated at Rs 2.80 per unit (kWh) at 2010 prices (roughly a cost of about Rs 8 crore per MWe). The costing is expected to have seen some escalation, given the project delays.

The capital investment for these nuclear power projects is being funded with a debt-to-equity ratio of 70:30, with the equity part of NPCIL being funded from internal resources and through budgetary support.

In terms of safety features, the PHWR technology scores high, with the biggest advantage of the PHWR design being the use of thin walled pressure tubes instead of large pressure vessels used in pressure vessel type reactors. This results in a distribution of pressure boundaries to a large number of small diameter pressure tubes and thereby lowers the severity of the consequence of an accidental rupture of the pressure boundary than in a pressure vessel type reactor.

Additionally, the 700 MWe PHWR design has enhanced safety through dedicated ‘Passive Decay Heat Removal System’, which has the capability of removing decay heat (the heat released as a result of radioactive decay) from the reactor core without requiring any operator actions, on the lines of similar technology adopted for Generation III+ plants to negate the possibility of a Fukushima type accident that happened in Japan in 2011. The 700 MWe PHWR unit, like the one deployed in KAPP, is equipped with a steel-lined containment to reduce any leakages and a containment spray system to reduce the containment pressure in case of a loss of coolant accident.

Re: India Nuclear News and Discussion 4 July 2011

Posted: 09 Sep 2023 00:51
by Amber G.
xpost (See other items in the joint statement I posted in US dhaga)

^^^ Also India, US welcomed "intensified consultations" to expand opportunities for facilitating India-U.S. collaboration in nuclear energy, including in development of next generation small modular reactor technologies in a collaborative mode
(See the joint statement posted above)

Re: India Nuclear News and Discussion 4 July 2011

Posted: 18 Sep 2023 10:13
by bala
Understanding the quest for Thorium Energy



India has the largest reserves of Thorium. The material is extractable from the beach sand minerals (Ilmenite, monazite, zircon) of Kerala. Besides Kerala, Odisha, AP, TN, WB, Jharkhand also have decent amounts of monazite. A molten salt reactor (first created in 1940 in the US) is required for Thorium. Stage 1: use uranium in PHWR. Stage 2: Plutonium obtained from the spent fuel in PHWR will be used in Fast Breeder Reactors. Stage 3: Thorium is converted to U-233 in reactor. This is used as fuel.

India: 1st Stage: PHWR is done and indigenous. 2nd Stage: Fast Breeder Stage at Kalpakkam. 500 MWe construction of reactor to begin soon. 3rd Stage: we have research reactors 30MW - Kamini reactor in IGCAR used U233 as fuel. Efforts are currently on to enlarge to bigger scale.

BARC has an Advanced HWR 300 MW that utilizes Thorium. Limited Plutonium is the thing that stops thorium cycle reactors to being scaled up in India. What can India do? India can hasten things a) buy plutonium from other nations b) enhance plutonium production.

Re: India Nuclear News and Discussion 4 July 2011

Posted: 18 Sep 2023 22:20
by drnayar
As far as i know India is sitting on some of the biggest Pu stockpiles in the world !! ~ 9.9 tons of separated Pu

but apparently geared towards weapon programmes

https://fissilematerials.org/

Re: India Nuclear News and Discussion 4 July 2011

Posted: 25 Oct 2023 00:41
by Amber G.
IAEA Chief Rafaelmgrossi meets EAM Jaishankar & call on PM Modi in Delhi Image

(IMO, This visit is a positive development and it is likely to lead to closer cooperation on a range of nuclear issues.
The visit of the IAEA Chief to India is also significant in the context of the current global energy crisis. Nuclear energy is a clean and reliable source of energy, and it can play an important role in helping countries to reduce their reliance on fossil fuels. India's growing investment in nuclear energy is therefore a positive step towards a more sustainable and secure energy future)

Re: India Nuclear News and Discussion 4 July 2011

Posted: 08 Nov 2023 00:57
by bala
Padma Vibhushan Dr.Anil Kakodkar's, the luminary at the forefront of nuclear physics and mechanical engineering, talk at IIT Madras. With an illustrious career, he's been the guiding force behind India's atomic energy journey, holding pivotal roles such as Chairman of the Atomic Energy Commission of India, Secretary to the Government of India, and Chairman of the Board of Governors at IIT Bombay. His contributions to scientific knowledge have earned him India's highest civilian honors – the Padma Shri, Padma Bhushan, and Padma Vibhushan.

Dr. Kakodkar's work is more than just groundbreaking science; it's an inspiration. As we grapple with soaring energy demands and the urgency of climate change, he underscores the importance of ramping up our nuclear energy ambitions.

Time to raise India's ambition in Nuclear Energy.



Currently consumption stands around 6580 THHr/yr, requirement is around 28000 THHr/yr, renewable potential is 8000 THHr/yr and rest from Nuclear.

Re: India Nuclear News and Discussion 4 July 2011

Posted: 13 Feb 2024 11:30
by sanman
Is this a useful new nuclear fuel to exploit Thorium, or is it just hype?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MjTwgo_l88Y

Gemini/Bard summary:
This video talks about a new type of nuclear fuel called ANEEL that can potentially help India use its thorium reserves.

India has a lot of coal but it is not an ideal fuel because it emits a lot of carbon dioxide. So, India is looking for alternative fuels, and thorium is a good candidate. However, there were challenges in using thorium as a fuel before. This video talks about a new type of nuclear fuel called ANEEL that can help India use its thorium reserves. ANEEL is a mixture of uranium and thorium, but it uses very little uranium and more thorium. This means that it does not need a lot of uranium 235 or plutonium 239, which are difficult to get. ANEEL also burns up much longer than conventional fuel, and it produces less nuclear waste. Additionally, there is no concern of this being diverted to weapon use.

The speaker of the video, M.Rames, interviewed the CEO of Clean Core Thorium Energy, which is the company that developed ANEEL. The CEO, Mr. Sha, explained that ANEEL is almost market ready and they anticipate commercializing it in 2026. Overall, this video is about a new type of nuclear fuel that has the potential to help India use its thorium reserves and transition to green energy.

I hope this summary is helpful!

Re: India Nuclear News and Discussion 4 July 2011

Posted: 13 Feb 2024 21:22
by JTull
LE Uranium is the problem here. We've never invested that much in centrifuge tech to be able to produce it at industrial scale (to power 15-20GW of PHWRs with this ANEEL fuel), for fear of attracting attention.

Re: India Nuclear News and Discussion 4 July 2011

Posted: 04 Mar 2024 06:31
by bala
PM Modi to inaugurate indigenous nuclear prototype fast breeder reactor at Kalpakkam, Tamil Nadu. Prime Minister Narendra Modi to witness initiation of core loading.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F8NMCL1Uhvc

Re: India Nuclear News and Discussion 4 July 2011

Posted: 18 Apr 2024 07:51
by bala
INDIA'S THORIUM LEAP TOWARDS SELF SUFFICIENT NUCLEAR ENERGY by LT GEN P R SHANKAR (Retd)



LT GEN P R SHANKAR explains a complicated matter (Thorium Nuclear Fuel program Cycle) in a simple manner and also tells the viewer about the strategic implications - Thorium Reactors are a game changer for Bharat. Lots of research material from the outcome of twenty year scientific research and trials. Very detailed and in-depth coverage of fast breeder technology.

Re: India Nuclear News and Discussion 4 July 2011

Posted: 01 May 2024 02:26
by sanman
bala wrote: 18 Apr 2024 07:51 INDIA'S THORIUM LEAP TOWARDS SELF SUFFICIENT NUCLEAR ENERGY by LT GEN P R SHANKAR (Retd)
I watched that live video stream when he gave it.

I wanted to ask him - or even anyone here - whether any of you have heard of the hybrid fusion-thorium design concept, whereby a fusion reaction operating below breakeven serves as the neutron source for a thorium blanket, producing energy to feed the fusion reaction. No uranium is required in this process.

https://phys.org/news/2020-01-scientist ... actor.html

https://transpowerusa.com/wordpress/cle ... -reactors/

Re: India Nuclear News and Discussion 4 July 2011

Posted: 03 May 2024 08:54
by sanman
bala wrote: 18 Apr 2024 07:51 INDIA'S THORIUM LEAP TOWARDS SELF SUFFICIENT NUCLEAR ENERGY by LT GEN P R SHANKAR (Retd)

...

LT GEN P R SHANKAR explains a complicated matter (Thorium Nuclear Fuel program Cycle) in a simple manner and also tells the viewer about the strategic implications - Thorium Reactors are a game changer for Bharat. Lots of research material from the outcome of twenty year scientific research and trials. Very detailed and in-depth coverage of fast breeder technology.
I posted a comment to his video which he replied to:
Me: Has anyone heard of the hybrid fusion-thorium design, where a fusion reaction operating below breakeven acts as the neutron source for a thorium blanket, thus producing energy to feed/sustain that same fusion reaction. No uranium is required!

Him: Fusion is next generation...

Me: thanks for your reply, sir! Fusion below breakeven (running at an energy deficit instead of net energy output) is something that can certainly be done right now. And it would enable us to breed more Plutonium & U233 in the meantime, just like the rest of Phase 2 -- but it does not require any Uranium, and thus bypasses that limitation which you had pointed to.

Re: India Nuclear News and Discussion 4 July 2011

Posted: 03 May 2024 15:24
by JTull
sanman wrote: 03 May 2024 08:54
I posted a comment to his video which he replied to:
Me: Has anyone heard of the hybrid fusion-thorium design, where a fusion reaction operating below breakeven acts as the neutron source for a thorium blanket, thus producing energy to feed/sustain that same fusion reaction. No uranium is required!

Him: Fusion is next generation...

Me: thanks for your reply, sir! Fusion below breakeven (running at an energy deficit instead of net energy output) is something that can certainly be done right now. And it would enable us to breed more Plutonium & U233 in the meantime, just like the rest of Phase 2 -- but it does not require any Uranium, and thus bypasses that limitation which you had pointed to.
Using hybrid and fusion in the same sentence can be confusing to many.

Hybrid fuels are common used but hybrids with Thorium need further investigation. Using the hybrid isn't straightforward as achieving initial criticality may not be easy with Thorium absorption. Studies must be conducted on neutron flux and how it changes with thorium conversion.

Fusion carries different meaning in case of nuclear science. It is not a jugalbandi. I see many problems with idea. Why would you want to bring Thorium into the mix when a sustainable fusion reaction can give you for an energy source for eternity? Let humanity first build commercial fusion reactors before we worry about the rest.

Re: India Nuclear News and Discussion 4 July 2011

Posted: 04 May 2024 05:01
by sanman
JTull wrote: 03 May 2024 15:24 Using hybrid and fusion in the same sentence can be confusing to many.

Hybrid fuels are common used but hybrids with Thorium need further investigation. Using the hybrid isn't straightforward as achieving initial criticality may not be easy with Thorium absorption. Studies must be conducted on neutron flux and how it changes with thorium conversion.

Fusion carries different meaning in case of nuclear science. It is not a jugalbandi. I see many problems with idea. Why would you want to bring Thorium into the mix when a sustainable fusion reaction can give you for an energy source for eternity? Let humanity first build commercial fusion reactors before we worry about the rest.
The problem is that there is no sustainable fusion reaction yet. There have long been plenty of devices producing fusion below breakeven, but no devices yet which produce fusion above breakeven. Such devices have existed even since 1950s & 60s.

As general-sahib pointed out, our main constraint in our 3-stage program has been lack of uranium.
If uranium had not been a constraint, India's nuclear energy program would have proceeded much faster.

The hybrid fusion-thorium approach does not require uranium as a starting point. All you need is thorium, and the ability to produce a fusion reaction that acts as a neutron source. Here, the thorium is producing energy and also producing the U233 needed for phase 3 of our program, with the help of the fusion reaction which produces no net energy output.

Re: India Nuclear News and Discussion 4 July 2011

Posted: 04 May 2024 21:36
by JTull
Arrey Bhai, let's say we produce enormous amount of energy using fusion with 1g of tritium inside thorium blanket. You need neutrons and not entire neuclides, and that too at right velocity and flux to allow capture. How do you plan to sustain the reaction at just the right criticality, and transfer thermal energy?

Please research a little bit on how a real world reactor works, some reactions and the quantities of fuel and energy involved.

Re: India Nuclear News and Discussion 4 July 2011

Posted: 06 May 2024 15:09
by wig
https://m.rediff.com/news/interview/dr- ... 240506.htm
interview with Dr Anil Kakodkar. worth while to read the complete article
Dr Anil Kakodkar was chairman of the Atomic Energy Commission from 2000 to 2009, during which India signed the civilian nuclear agreement with the United States. Before that, from 1996 to 2000, he was director of the Bhabha Atomic Research Centre, a period during which India conducted two nuclear tests in May 1998.
discussion on the 1998 TN test
I asked my colleagues, after these doubts to develop a 3-D model, to look at the rock movement consequently shock, arising out of a nuclear blast.

These movements are different from a normal blast because the strain rates are high, hence the equations to be used are not the same.

Mind you at that time, nobody had developed such a model, including in the US.

Outsiders cite the profile of a test site from satellite pictures after the test and the teleseismic data from some earthquake monitoring stations like they have in Uppasala, Sweden, etc to talk with so much confidence and create doubts about our claims.

So to call that bluff, I said. We not only developed a 3D model but also qualified by using data from Baneberry test (external link) in the US which unfortunately had vented -- leaked radiation.

Because it had vented there was an enquiry and hence a lot of data came out in the public domain.

So we used the Baneberry data and our predictions and sent a paper to a well-known US journal.

Re: India Nuclear News and Discussion 4 July 2011

Posted: 23 May 2024 23:14
by Amber G.
wig wrote: 06 May 2024 15:09 https://m.rediff.com/news/interview/dr- ... 240506.htm
interview with Dr Anil Kakodkar. worth while to read the complete articlequote]
Dr Anil Kakodkar was chairman of the Atomic Energy Commission from 2000 to 2009, during which India signed the civilian nuclear agreement with the United States. Before that, from 1996 to 2000, he was director of the Bhabha Atomic Research Centre, a period during which India conducted two nuclear tests in May 1998.


So to call that bluff, I said. We not only developed a 3D model but also qualified by using data from Baneberry test (external link) in the US which unfortunately had vented -- leaked radiation.

Because it had vented there was an enquiry and hence a lot of data came out in the public domain.

So we used the Baneberry data and our predictions and sent a paper to a well-known US journal.
Thanks for posting the interview. (In physics world most of what he says is well known)

----
I mentioned my visit to Nevada National Security Site <see link in other dhaga>, a place steeped in history with over 100 atmospheric nuclear tests and 1000s of underground tests.. Apart from the first Atom bomb tested in New Mexico's Trinity site (which i visited in the past) *all* atomic tests inside USA were tested here. This includes the infamous Baneberry test...

(The Nevada Test Site tours typically cover several historical and significant locations within the site, including the remains of test towers, craters from various explosions, and other notable landmarks etc.. these tours are still difficult to get as they do not happen much often for ordinary folks)

The Baneberry nuclear test was an underground nuclear test conducted by the United States on December 18, 1970, at the Nevada Test Site (now known as the Nevada National Security Site). The test was part of the Operation Emery series and took place in Area U8.

Here are some key details about the Baneberry test:

Date: December 18, 1970
Location: Nevada Test Site, Area U8
Yield: 10 kilotons

The Baneberry test is notable because it resulted in an unexpected release of radioactive material into the atmosphere. This was due to a failure in the geological containment of the test, which caused a fissure to open on the surface, allowing radioactive gases and debris to escape. The release of radiation led to the exposure of test site workers and prompted significant public concern and environmental monitoring.

The incident led to changes in testing procedures and increased attention to the containment and environmental impact of nuclear tests.

(For those who have some interest, one can see details on pp 57 of:
https://nnss.gov/wp-content/uploads/202 ... 5_Rev1.pdf

PPP57:
Image

some info also at : https://www.brookings.edu/nuclear-testi ... test-site/