Phone, Tablet and Gizmo Thread #0x02

Raja Bose · Post by **Raja Bose** » 12 Aug 2013 20:50

archan wrote:Was looking to get any leftover stock of pureview 808 on the cheap, but none to be found on desi sites. Any in khanland?

Perhaps eBay. Get the 1020 if camera is what you are looking for - 1020's camera is far far soup-e-rear than 808 even if it may not always seem so on paper.

Mort Walker · Post by **Mort Walker** » 12 Aug 2013 20:50

anmol wrote:Asha and Lumia (and Pureview) are just brands like Samsungs Galaxy brand.

Lumia uses Windows Phone
Asha will mostly be Smarterphone OS.
Nokia bought the company that made Smaterphone OS : http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Smarterphone
Asha 501 uses that OS http://techcrunch.com/2013/05/08/asha-501/

What is the battery life on Asha phones? I need a phone for the kids that have excellent battery life.

Mort Walker · Post by **Mort Walker** » 12 Aug 2013 20:53

Raja Bose wrote:Perhaps eBay. Get the 1020 if camera is what you are looking for - 1020's camera is far far soup-e-rear than 808 even if it may not always seem so on paper.

Yes. Although the sensor is slightly smaller on the 1020 than the 808, the 1020 offers better image stabilization, camera ergonomics, AF and AE. I'm still trying to get one...

anmol · Post by **anmol** » 12 Aug 2013 21:21

Mort Walker wrote:
anmol wrote:Asha and Lumia (and Pureview) are just brands like Samsungs Galaxy brand.

Lumia uses Windows Phone
Asha will mostly be Smarterphone OS.
Nokia bought the company that made Smaterphone OS : http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Smarterphone
Asha 501 uses that OS http://techcrunch.com/2013/05/08/asha-501/
What is the battery life on Asha phones? I need a phone for the kids that have excellent battery life.

I haven't seen / used one in person so I dont know but my guess is that with all the compromises at least that should be really good.

hanumadu · Post by **hanumadu** » 12 Aug 2013 21:28

Mort Walker wrote:
What is the battery life on Asha phones? I need a phone for the kids that have excellent battery life.

Maximum 2G standby time: 1152 h
Maximum 2G talk time: 17 h
Music playback time: 56 h

Looks like its not 3g capable. I think the next Asha phones in the 500 series will be 3g capable.

hanumadu · Post by **hanumadu** » 12 Aug 2013 21:29

Mort Walker wrote:
Raja Bose wrote:Perhaps eBay. Get the 1020 if camera is what you are looking for - 1020's camera is far far soup-e-rear than 808 even if it may not always seem so on paper.
Yes. Although the sensor is slightly smaller on the 1020 than the 808, the 1020 offers better image stabilization, camera ergonomics, AF and AE. I'm still trying to get one...

And a better OS with a better ecosystem.

Mort Walker · Post by **Mort Walker** » 12 Aug 2013 22:35

It looks like the beginning of the end for Black Berry
BlackBerry Mulls Putting Itself up for Sale

Speculation about possible foreign bidders has focused on Lenovo Group Ltd., the Chinese maker of personal computers, which is looking to expand its mobile-devices business. Lenovo Chief Financial Officer Wong Wai Ming told Bloomberg News in January that his company was looking at “all opportunities,” including BlackBerry. Brion Tingler, a Lenovo spokesman, said today the company has no comment.

anmol · Post by **anmol** » 12 Aug 2013 22:59

^ Dont think that is going to happen, they have LOT of cryptography related stuff, I think they also own http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ECC_patents

Mort Walker · Post by **Mort Walker** » 12 Aug 2013 23:04

Who knows. The company could be sold without the algorithms and patents.

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 13 Aug 2013 07:30

US govt could lean on blackberry to let those stuff we purchased in a separate deal by a canadian or US co and sell off the rest to lenovo. it makes sense for lenovo as they want to get into cellphones and are already targeting the corporate cellphone market with models featuring big batteries and rugged thinkpadish looks. BB does have pretty good build quality and official looks.

eg, note the huge batteries and talktime
http://shopap.lenovo.com/in/en/smartpho ... index.html

the P770 is going in flipkart for 12500 which imo is a good deal.

Anujan · Post by **Anujan** » 13 Aug 2013 08:13

rohitvats wrote:Interesting article.

CHART: Consumers Love Samsung's Huge Screens, And That's Changing The Smartphone Market

http://www.businessinsider.com/samsung- ... emailshare

Didnt fruitco claim that they dont need a bigger screen because their UI was soup-e-rear? That was even before the iPhone 5 lengthening.

Apparently there is a sep 10 grand unveiling. Better produce something decent, the stocks I hold are taking a thumping.

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 13 Aug 2013 08:23

they need a 4.5" on 5S to stay in the game.
mahdi might have swung 4.3" and convinced the faithfool but not bawarchi.
4.3" would DOA for such a pricey phone...even phones half its unlocked price have such screens...like lumia820 and many many more...the faithfool need to feel different and superiah, if not in absolute screen size atleast in the ppi thing.

Raja Bose · Post by **Raja Bose** » 13 Aug 2013 08:24

^^^I am right now profitable even on FB and GB, FruitCo needs to take a lot more thumping before I lose money on it - Mahdi Jai Ho!

Raja Bose · Post by **Raja Bose** » 13 Aug 2013 08:25

Mort Walker wrote:Who knows. The company could be sold without the algorithms and patents.

Yeah but who would buy such a defunct shell then? Its not like BB has any other assets worth a dime.

Raja Bose · Post by **Raja Bose** » 13 Aug 2013 08:27

As per recent report from chaiwallah's fourth cousin twice removed, after Sir Jony took over, its been a real mess in FruitCo design land both SW and HW. Deadlines may slip or features may get ruthlessly cut (or look sloppy). If either happens, Bawarchi better do something incredible to parade the faithfools.

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 13 Aug 2013 14:23

well finally a sikular and negotiated solution to the never ending smartphonecam vs P&S war here...

read on and be amazed http://www.gizmodo.in/gadgets/Leaked-Ph ... 786302.cms

both sides can claim victory now. it is a high end P&S superzoom and it is a smartphone too. only separate

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 13 Aug 2013 17:48

is there any weather app in the vaunted android market that allows me to monitor weather for a list of indian cities and get proper updates ? "millions of apps" as they say...

accuweather - this comes stock in android widgets section of samsung - had the list of cities fine and claimed to update, but I couldnt see the temp in blr go below 27 even at night when it was 19
weatherbug - this again claimed to take data from TRICHY for blr and was a real hoot - download it at your peril. again claimed 27 when it was 19 yesterday night.
indian meteorological org official app - this sounded promising, despite the disclaimer they had of being a beta effort and working with IBM. I insist people download it themselves...biggest laugh I had i years. even a college kid could have done better, typical sarkari effort with zero UI and just a waste of raw data which they sit on.
JHAM - this is some other indic app. someone copied the hello world popup pgm from a android for dummies book and made this one. brings up a popup window when you click on it than being widget.

gave up at this point. the vaunted market has 99% sub standard app-crap that makes people waste their time. I dunno how anyone makes any money writing apps and what % of people make money in that vile mess.

I am just waiting for the 625, 725 and 825 to appear in a couple months with 4.5-5.2" screens to select my sidearm and throw my samsung in the bin.

Mort Walker · Post by **Mort Walker** » 13 Aug 2013 19:55

^^^There is no good weather app on any platform (mobile or desktop) for Indian cities. There is very little data as well.
The best you can do is www.weatherunderground.com and put in your city. Weather underground will use satellite imagery and reporting from a local station such as a regional airport. I've noticed that in smaller 2nd tier cities, the automated airport weather station, basically an anemometer and thermometer, is often out of service and no one at the airport really cares to put it back in to service. Chaltha hai attitude. In the US we have all sorts of radar and satellite apps that show weather at the street level. They are very accurate, but are only available on iOS and Android. Development for WP is not being done yet and I'm not aware of anyone doing so. As RB said, most people don't care and are not interested in scientific, medical and engineering apps. Some of us do, and it keeps us from seriously considering WP. So far, WP only offers a good camera, everything else is less than satisfactory.

Designing, developing, building and networking weather stations is a project that all of the private engineering colleges can do for minimal cost. I'm surprised no one has done that because it brings many disciplines together. The power source can be solar, the sensors and boards could be designed by students, and computer hardware could be a commercial purchase. The software and networking can be developed by the students. They can not only monitor atmospheric conditions, but soil conditions as well.

chandrasekaran · Post by **chandrasekaran** » 13 Aug 2013 20:01

Try the "Android Weather and Clock Widget". In the App's settings, chose weather provider as "OpenWeatherMap". Reasonably accurate

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 13 Aug 2013 21:38

I tried yahoo weather app and it seems to be accurate enough. I want to keep close tabs on mysore weather for next month.

talk about shitting bricks to get simple stuff done. I checked my wife's 820 and one swipe brought up the app menu which already had weather installed and working just fine in great detail about blr like sunrise, sunset, wind speed etc

some of these old school grandpa cos like yahoo or nok may not have the bratty "I am stanford phd" attitude of the gen-next cos but they did get a lot of solid and useful work done in their own way.

Raja Bose · Post by **Raja Bose** » 13 Aug 2013 22:29

Singha wrote:I am just waiting for the 625, 725 and 825 to appear in a couple months with 4.5-5.2" screens to select my sidearm and throw my samsung in the bin.

....and so another turd from Sammy hits the trash bin

tsk tsk....what will Mortu tau think

People here who think Sammy is so successful today becoz it is doing something revolutionary and magical which has never been done before, have probably never studied the history of this industry. History repeats itself. You can be successful for a while despite dishing out turds but that doesn't buy you customer loyalty or stickiness. And it doesn't matter if you design your own SoCs or cardboard packaging - all those are secondary when yellow stuff hits the fan. GB learned that the hard way, perhaps Sammy is next. Simple lesson history teaches us: $hit don't stick but it sure stinks.

Suraj · Post by **Suraj** » 13 Aug 2013 22:48

I instinctively dislike the blingy look of Sammy stuff. I've never bought any of their phones or tablets. One look at them reminds me of the old Treo days, when they had a bunch of poorly differentiated phones with no outstanding features that made you feel 'a lot of people will WANT this phone'. The HTC One or Google phones generate that sentiment among android ones, but Sammy doesn't. Just a matter of personal taste.

Mort Walker · Post by **Mort Walker** » 14 Aug 2013 01:47

Pyaare,

Itna gusa kyon ho? Haamare galti ko maaf kar do. Hum saamjhe aap kuch din GHQ ke ghar me rukh ke tension relief kar liya. Likin ulta haamre upar utar diya? Koi baath nahi.

Raja Bose wrote:People here who think Sammy is so successful today becoz it is doing something revolutionary and magical which has never been done before, have probably never studied the history of this industry. History repeats itself. You can be successful for a while despite dishing out turds but that doesn't buy you customer loyalty or stickiness. And it doesn't matter if you design your own SoCs or cardboard packaging - all those are secondary when yellow stuff hits the fan. GB learned that the hard way, perhaps Sammy is next. Simple lesson history teaches us: $hit don't stick but it sure stinks.

Nothing revolutionary or magical. The mahdi said it best and I paraphrase, "it's not that we're better than everyone else, it's just that everyone else is so bad." Sammy segments the market and it does make a lot of crap, but they have consistently been incrementally improving their flagship devices on a regular basis since 2011. You may ask so what, so has everyone else? Well, they haven't done it in the time frame Sammy has and all indications are that Sammy is continuing this trend for the next few years. Further, Sammy has the ability to leverage hardware improvements better than others as they make their own components and buy from others as well. Be it DRAM, SoCs, displays and cardboard packaging. One can say yeah, so did Moto and Nokia? Well, Sammy has coupled one other thing, they see their weakness and try to address it instead of dismissing it. I don't think BB, Moto, or Nokia have done that.

You said it best yourself that devices like phones are commodities. Nokia, BB, and Apple have had loyalty because they put out a quality device with a great UX and support, but sales are lagging. Nokia is trying to come back, BB is in the hole and Apple is falling behind despite customer loyalty. Sales have shown otherwise because people get a phone and when the next new best thing is out, they get another. That simple and loyalty is gone. Sammy knows this well and is having its day in the sun. Perhaps they will suffer in the long run, but then Sammy is big enough to jump on to the next CE trend when the fashion for phones and tablets goes away just like it did for VCRs, PCs, DVD players and flat screen TVs.

I see it first hand in children who are pre-teen and younger to treat all devices the same and use whatever works best for them in their current situation. Mobile CE devices are consumable commodities for them. In the mean time I await for the Note III turd coming Sept. 4.

Raja Bose · Post by **Raja Bose** » 14 Aug 2013 01:55

Arrey Mortu tau, aap to bura maan gaye.

Mort Walker wrote: Well, Sammy has coupled one other thing, they see their weakness and try to address it instead of dismissing it. I don't think BB, Moto, or Nokia have done that.

Actually they all did...go back and read up. No company is headed by fools. And you are talking about their record from 2011 - 2013 (3 years) and extrapolating on basis of that?

Don't forget while dishing out turds GB dominated from 2001 - 2008 (8 years) and still crashed in less than 2 years. So going back to my point, is Sammy doing something different which makes it currently successful and more failure-proof than others? Nope, don't see anything to indicate that.

Suraj · Post by **Suraj** » 14 Aug 2013 02:43

AAPL went up 5% today when billionaire Carl Icahn stated that he has accumulated a significant position in the stock, and considers it undervalued.

Mort Walker · Post by **Mort Walker** » 14 Aug 2013 02:47

^^^Carl Icahn is a crook. He has the reverse Midas touch. He sells assets of companies he gets control of to maximize share holdings. I think he's done a lot of damage to American capitalism.

Mort Walker · Post by **Mort Walker** » 14 Aug 2013 02:53

Raja Bose wrote:Arrey Mortu tau, aap to bura maan gaye.

Mort Walker wrote: Well, Sammy has coupled one other thing, they see their weakness and try to address it instead of dismissing it. I don't think BB, Moto, or Nokia have done that.
Actually they all did...go back and read up. No company is headed by fools. And you are talking about their record from 2011 - 2013 (3 years) and extrapolating on basis of that? Don't forget while dishing out turds GB dominated from 2001 - 2008 (8 years) and still crashed in less than 2 years. So going back to my point, is Sammy doing something different which makes it currently successful and more failure-proof than others? Nope, don't see anything to indicate that.

Koi burra nahi maan gaye. Durr lagaye haamne kuch galat bol diya aap ko WP ke mamble mein.

Sammy actually started when the original GS came out, so it's closer to 4 years. Nevertheless, being a chaebol they can fall back to something else once they are done with phones and tablets. Don't be surprised Sammy starts cranking out Galaxy WPs should it gather steam.

Raja Bose · Post by **Raja Bose** » 14 Aug 2013 04:22

^^^Whether they can fallback to making tractors or sprockets as a Chaebol and having the SoKo government in their pocket is besides the point. "Too Big to fail" is not the equivalent of "They are doing wonderful magical things which have never been done before".

WP ka kya hai....woh Mickey ka stake in the ground hai in mobile. Just like ChromeOS is for Chacha. Anyhow finally J00T00b war ended today with Mickey releasing a J00T00b Windows Phone app which Chacha approves of.

SaiK · Post by **SaiK** » 14 Aug 2013 04:52

when you say tau for mort, what does it mean? math, physics, bio, ...?

Raja Bose · Post by **Raja Bose** » 14 Aug 2013 05:02

^^^Tau as in Tau-ji. Not greek symbol.

Mort Walker · Post by **Mort Walker** » 14 Aug 2013 05:22

SaiK wrote:when you say tau for mort, what does it mean? math, physics, bio, ...?

Mort Walker · Post by **Mort Walker** » 14 Aug 2013 05:30

Raja Bose wrote:^^^Whether they can fallback to making tractors or sprockets as a Chaebol and having the SoKo government in their pocket is besides the point. "Too Big to fail" is not the equivalent of "They are doing wonderful magical things which have never been done before".

Matlab hai, ke Sammy will start making other CE, which is related after all. From what little I've learned in components that Sammy is working on, they are attempting to integrate everything from basic electronic components, more complex components such as batteries, SoCs & touch screen displays all the way up to Sammy services. Others have done it, but have they done it to the extent of Samsung Electronics? See Samsung Received The Most Mobile Patents In 2012, Now Leads The World Overall

Raja Bose · Post by **Raja Bose** » 14 Aug 2013 05:41

^^Short answer: Yes. GB has done it to that very level and perhaps more (whether fab, design of SoCs/peripheral modules, manufacturing, services or IP etc. etc.). Its not something new and is directly related to economies of scale. When you sell something like half a billion devices or more a year, it makes sense to do all the critical stuff in-house. That doesn't mean one is easily able to jump to some new form of CE or even dominate when things shift - history has shown that already.

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 14 Aug 2013 06:58

meantime the note-III specs have been leaked sort of. very heavy on the engine side. they are sparing no effort to make it the biggest and baddest toy around, though the screen is not unique anymore. the specs rival that of a decent laptop though perhaps laptops might use faster memory and hard drive pathways due to higher power available.

http://www.gsmarena.com/samsung_galaxy_ ... s-6561.php

not sure what kind of apps need that much cpu and memory but who knows, people might one day put their personal RDBMS or simulation tools to work on phablets...

Mort Walker · Post by **Mort Walker** » 14 Aug 2013 07:00

Pyaare,

True. But if you're Sammy, then you're already making a Galaxy of refrigerators, dishwashers, microwave ovens, ovens, cooktops, vacuums, washing machines, dryers, TVs, stereos, cameras, PCs, laptops, and tablets.

That really is unprecedented and the only parallel in history I see is GE.

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 14 Aug 2013 07:12

Haier, panasonic & LG are other example. panasonic makes good kit across a range of sectors...incl mundane stuff like rock solid mixer-grinders. not a problem in 8 yrs on my setup.

Mort Walker · Post by **Mort Walker** » 14 Aug 2013 07:12

Singha wrote:meantime the note-III specs have been leaked sort of. very heavy on the engine side. they are sparing no effort to make it the biggest and baddest toy around, though the screen is not unique anymore. the specs rival that of a decent laptop though perhaps laptops might use faster memory and hard drive pathways due to higher power available.

http://www.gsmarena.com/samsung_galaxy_ ... s-6561.php

not sure what kind of apps need that much cpu and memory but who knows, people might one day put their personal RDBMS or simulation tools to work on phablets...

Who knows, they'll probably pull some crap like "Life Companion" or something else and they may need it for all of the Sammy bloat ware. Some of it is good, some of it is bad.

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 14 Aug 2013 07:14

have sammy tablets been rooted by the xda forum tribe? would make a great pure android product given the high hw specs.

Mort Walker · Post by **Mort Walker** » 14 Aug 2013 07:24

^^^Don't know exactly, but most likely they have.

The Nexus 10 is a Sammy tablet running pure Android. It is quite good, but has limited sales due to the way Google handled it. The next one that comes out, I may get it.

Vayutuvan · Post by **Vayutuvan** » 14 Aug 2013 07:29

^^^^^ (5 posts back) Arrey bhai, yeh to PI Rho hona chahiye.