Beheading of Indian Soldiers in Aug 2011 and Aman ki Asha

member_22872 · Post by **member_22872** » 17 Jan 2013 04:36

Rudradev ji, I doubt that Aman ki asha is going to take a hit. I agree that Maino dynasty really wants to turn around things for baba to get the gaddhi. I think this truce is just to keep Aman ki asha alive. Now the peace crowd can say TSPA and gov both want peace with India so I think this Aman ki asha is going to multiply in strength and will grow and prosper.

Rudradev · Post by **Rudradev** » 17 Jan 2013 04:46

Venug ji, No, it won't take a permanent hit. "Damage control" is already under way. Salman Cur-shite is still adamant about "uninterrupted and uninterruptible" peace process. Everyone from a 70-year-old grandmother to the Brigadier in charge of the sector have been slandered and blamed. Pravin Scummy and others are spinning the Aman Ki Asha angle dizzily.

But in taking the explosive rape-aftermath story off the front burner, an initial leak of the beheading story proved useful to the Maino regime. My point is, that's the only reason this particular beheading came to light... many more have happened, and all have been suppressed because our criminal government believes it's perfectly ok for our soldiers to be mutilated and beheaded at the altar of Aman ki Asha. The only time this pet project of Manmohan Singh can be jeopardized, is when Maino madam's own personal and family interests are even more directly threatened than Pakistani and American interests.

member_22872 · Post by **member_22872** » 17 Jan 2013 04:56

Rudradev ji, now I understand. Aman ki asha seems to be a 'soft kill' meaning shower excessive love and bhaichara and suffocate India to death in the death embrace. India can keep its costly toys and in fact can buy hazar more rafales but AkA will achieve for TSP what 4 wars couldn't. But thanks to all the traitors without whose help AkA is a failure.

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 17 Jan 2013 05:26

RD, While agree that the beheading story took the gang-rape atrocity from the headlines it has not transferred the heat onto TSP but to "grand reconciliator" MMS and his coterie in UPA and outside. It has even transferred on to Gen Bikram Singh.

And TSP did behead the soldiers inside the LoC.

The epsiode has revealed the dysfunctional govt apparatus which leaks tales against its own soldiers.

In a way it has tipped the hand of all the "peace at any cost" faction(in govt, in media, in politicial parties) and exposed them to be also anti-nationals to boot.

devesh · Post by **devesh** » 17 Jan 2013 05:49

these are not calculated moves. and if they are, then the logic behind them is poor and hasty.

these are signs of a govt that is loosing "control". they are screwing up on all fronts, incapable of forming a coherent narrative that convinces the nation and the people that their leadership knows what it's doing.

chanakyaa · Post by **chanakyaa** » 17 Jan 2013 07:29

these are not calculated moves. and if they are, then the logic behind them is poor and hasty.

these are signs of a govt that is loosing "control". they are screwing up on all fronts, incapable of forming a coherent narrative that convinces the nation and the people that their leadership knows what it's doing.

Sir, the govt is loosing control because people like you are not the Prime Minister of India, either by choice or convenience. In fact, the Kangres govt. never had control of anything except the control over ignorant and lazy population, who have decided not to rule the nation, instead letting thugs let Sonia and her goons take control. If you feel hurt by my statements I apologize but if people like you or me or other were the Prime Minister, those 2 brave soldiers would be alive today.

French may have just sent an SOS to Americans to help them save their ass in Mali. Americans will send their drones from hundreds of miles and kill all Islamic crooks to protect their interests. And we are crying on what to do with our neighbor. Again, my apologies on picking on your post. Jai Hind.

SSridhar · Post by **SSridhar** » 17 Jan 2013 07:33

I agree with peter. The Hindus put up a very determined and successful resistance not only against the Arab but also the Turkish jihadi invaders. This lasted for four centuries. From the first attack in the 8th century AD, until the Delhi Sultanate was established in the 13th century, they faced stiff resistance everywhere. Of course, the Islamist jihadi invaders left a trail of destruction but that did not mean they were not resisted forcefully. Ghazni might have invaded 17 times but he and his successors could not establish a rule beyond the borders of Punjab.

RamaY · Post by **RamaY** » 17 Jan 2013 07:43

devesh wrote:IA should not have accepted the "truce". what the hell does that mean anyway?
what truce, and how come TSPA is sitting on the high gaddi offering this and that?
there was no real conflict, for either party to offer any truce.
and TSPA has no moral basis to offer it.

IA should have rejected this "truce" and called for an unconditional admission of crime and apology from TSPA.

that is the only acceptable "truce". make the Pakis own up to their crime and demand an unconditional apology.

otherwise, it's just drama as usual and TSPA back to its usual nautanki in a couple of weeks.

Devesh ji,

The dialogue is between TSPA and GoI. IA will have to follow GoI directions/commands. Nothing wrong with this setup. The problem is with the people who are GoI. There is only one way to correct this. Defeat C-system in 2014 elections.

RamaY · Post by **RamaY** » 17 Jan 2013 08:03

Rudradev ji - AWMTA

RamaY wrote:The C-System is doing as per their Karmic script.

Everytime it is cornered for its nepotism, sycophancy, corruption, mis-governance and apathy to Indian interests it presented a new crisis so the national focus is diverted.

But it's incompetance is such that it is failed to manage every diversion it created on its own. The unintended consequences of Napunsak's dhimmitude are adding fuel to the karma of C-System.

The only sad part in this whole saga is the self-proclaimed reformists, secularists, liberals and path finders of modern India still follow and die for this C-system.

I used to wonder why would the 72nd Akshauhini of Ravana would go into war with Rama's Vanarasena even after seeing 71 Akshauhinis of Asurics along with their commanders are slayed infront of their own eyes. Now I see the whole Ramayana play infront of my eyes.

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 17 Jan 2013 08:50

I just noted Philip's new word castratti to describe the euunuchs in the DIE

Good word.

shiv · Post by **shiv** » 17 Jan 2013 09:39

ramana wrote:I just noted Shiv's New word castratti to describe the euunuchs in the DIE

Good word.

No Ramana! The word is Philips. Credit must go to him.

Philip · Post by **Philip** » 17 Jan 2013 09:43

The Chindu has roped in Nirupama.S to come to the defence of the castrati in today's issue.Time we sent her a polite rebuttal of her viewpoint that "normality" in the valley has been the result of the "piss initiative".She has conveniently forgotten about the 750,000 Kashmiri Pandits languishing in refugee camps elsewhere,and Pak perfidy from Kargil,the attack on parliament,26/11,the various bomb blasts in Indian cities and the daily toll of innocents and Indians in uniform in J%K and Pak's floodiong the nation with counterfeit currency and aid to the Naxalites/Maoists and other Indian rebel groups.

abhishek_sharma · Post by **abhishek_sharma** » 17 Jan 2013 09:46

^^ One of the TV analysts said: Govt has not done anything to bring back lakhs of Kashmiri pandits who live like refugees in all parts of the country. But they are making special efforts to bring back jihadis from PoK.

abhishek_sharma · Post by **abhishek_sharma** » 17 Jan 2013 10:13

Shiv Aroor ‏@ShivAroor
Pak suddenly anxious to de-escalate tensions on LoC. Has realised Indian Army given free hand to respond with unapologetic force, unlike b4.

Anujan · Post by **Anujan** » 17 Jan 2013 10:15

When whipped, rabid dogs yelp and run away with tail between its legs.

On the other hand, you cannot pet and be friends with rabid dogs expecting better behavior.

Sachin · Post by **Sachin** » 17 Jan 2013 10:22

abhishek_sharma wrote:Govt has not done anything to bring back lakhs of Kashmiri pandits who live like refugees in all parts of the country. But they are making special efforts to bring back jihadis from PoK.

To be quite honest many people still do NOT know the plight of Kashmiri Pandits. I am sure people in BRF knows, perhaps most of the people in the Defence Forces know it. But in many southern states no one has a clue. There was a facebook campaign triggered by the commie jokers of Kerala talking about refugee problem in Palestine and how Israel should be controlled. Some one (even if it was for political reasons) then started another campaign asking the commies to lecture with the Pakis and think about resettling Kashmiri Pandits, and then they can worry about Palestine. The commies immediately went into a "radio silence" mode. Such campaigns should continue using the new social media.

abhishek_sharma · Post by **abhishek_sharma** » 17 Jan 2013 10:24

>> But in many southern states no one has a clue.

Even in northern states, I don't think people around me know much about Kashmiri Pandits' problems.

krishnan · Post by **krishnan** » 17 Jan 2013 10:36

GoP wants Mr Khar to meet Mrs Khushid

http://www.rediff.com/news/slide-show/s ... 130117.htm

abhishek_sharma · Post by **abhishek_sharma** » 17 Jan 2013 10:49

Shiv Aroor ‏@ShivAroor
Govt on Pak's talks offer: Pakistan must first accept responsibility for what happened on Jan 8. Then we'll see. Breaking on @HeadlinesToday

Manas · Post by **Manas** » 17 Jan 2013 11:17

I think GOI should continue to scale back on defense investment and modernization programs. No point in investing billions of $$s in MRCA, P3I ASW assets, AWACS, Air to Air Refuellers, Aircraft carriers, Mountain strike corps etc. The hapless defense forces will never get to use them. Leave alone China, they are not able to use any of these against the repeat offender, the terrorist neighbhor.

All of the money can be diverted to social justice and poverty elimination programs such as NREGA (free money scheme), continue to care and feed the news media slaves, fixing and winning elections - BTW an art the Congress party has mastered.

The people that are out on the streets protesting the rape or expressing their "outrage" against TSP for the be-headings have themselves to blame. I would bet that a vast majority of them are "no shows" at the polling booths on election day.

Sushupti · Post by **Sushupti** » 17 Jan 2013 13:03

Is the LoC attack part of America's plan B?

Colonel Anil A Athale

But the same Saeed was sent to Saudi Arabia in 1980s by Punjab [ Images ] University for higher studies where he met Saudi sheikhs. They inspired him to join his colleague, Professor Zafar Iqbal, in taking an active role supporting the mujahideen in Afghanistan.

Saeed is an admirer of the West. While Pakistan's political elite were 'living like kings and princes in palatial government houses,' Saeed wrote in a petition, Britain's prime minister lived in a 'four-bedroom flat.'

'When the sun never set on the British Empire,' he wrote, 'the chief executive of that great country lived in the same house in a small street. That is truly Islamic, that is like following the Sunnah of the Holy Prophet.'

Saeed's venom is reserved for India and not the West. The American bounty on him is mere window dressing to assuage the Indians, for despite this he roams around freely in Pakistan and addresses public meetings openly.

All in all, the American game plan appears to be to try and 'bribe' the Pakistan army with aid to make it desist from helping the Taliban in Afghanistan.

But should that fail, as is likely, keeping Pakistan engaged with India will help the survival of the Hamid Karzai-led regime in Kabul.

This goes against the conventional logic of the talking heads on television channels, but one must remember in international affairs the 'real' as opposed to open strategy is very different.

The US will make appropriate noises about peace between India and Pakistan, but will be secretly happy if Pakistan is forced to fight on two fronts in 2014.

http://www.rediff.com/news/column/is-th ... 130116.htm

shyamd · Post by **shyamd** » 17 Jan 2013 13:16

Yawn ! I said the same after 26/11. US wants a face saving exit and show the people they achieved something. Thankfully IA has been preparing for this scenario. Although I think it matters less to the Obama admin since elections are over but he may want some legacy of some sort

Neela · Post by **Neela** » 17 Jan 2013 13:46

My wife said this earlier today.
You need the head for the last rites before cremation in Hindu tradition.
For women, seeing the face is somehow an image/feeling they want to hold to after the death of the husband.

RajeshA · Post by **RajeshA** » 17 Jan 2013 14:19

I think PMO should answer why earlier incidents of beheading of our jawans were not disclosed.

Doesn't PMO think that it is an issue of national importance?
If it is not, then how does PMO explain the current anguish and anger at this Pak barbarity on Lance Naik Hemraj Singh?
If PMO thinks that this outrage is all politically motivated at the behest of some Hindu nationalist parties, then the PM should say this explicitly, that such an incident is no reason for the country to be outraged and it is all a conspiracy by the opposition.
On the other hand if the issue is indeed of national importance, then why this silence earlier?
If suppressing of such news was for a higher cause, then one should let the nation and analysts debate whether this higher cause is compatible with this Pakistani behavior?
Otherwise suppressing such news of national importance is CRIMINAL on the part of PMO!

The PM should give a detailed and full account to the Parliament in a live public telecast of ALL such incidents on the LoC, on the international border with Pakistan, within Kashmir and within rest of India, where Pakistani Army and their sponsored terrorists have beheaded and/or tortured Indian military men!

The PM should also give a detailed account of how his Government reacted after each incident, what new measures they put in place, what policy corrections they made, and what lessons they learned.

The Parliament of India and the Indian people deserve to know a full account of Pakistani barbarity on the Indian people.

All the names of our fallen and maimed heroes need to spoken out loudly and what they suffered for the nation be told!

SSridhar · Post by **SSridhar** » 17 Jan 2013 16:07

RajeshA wrote:I think PMO should answer why earlier incidents of beheading of our jawans were not disclosed.

Absolutely. I would request the ex-Chiefs to list out the incidents and names.

This PMO cannot be held reposnsible for at least one case, that of Lance Naik Bhausaheb Maruti Talekar of the Maratha Light Infantry in c. 2000. Though there seems to have been retribution by the IA, the incident itself was rather whitewashed.

rohitvats · Post by **rohitvats** » 17 Jan 2013 16:19

Altair wrote: Gurkhas are experts on our side for this beheading business. You ask 10 they will deliver 100. Guaranteed everytime. We need to send them over.

Altair - I would give that honor to Naga soldiers. And that too from countryside.

Let me share an anecdote I heard - PA had started keeping dogs to sniff out and indicate positions of Indian teams waiting in ambush on our side of LOC. These ambushes were set up along expected lines of ingress of militants being pushed by the PA in J&K. Now, these dogs would pick up faintest of movement in the woods/overgrowth and alert PA about likely movement/position of own troops. IA was looking at ways to curb this development as it was effective to our detriment.

The CO of an Assam Regiment asked for suggestions and one of the Naga johnnies in the paltan offered to tackle the same - his only request was to be given fresh raw meat from lungar and not be asked about it for next one week. The CO agreed and it was arranged for the said solider to be given extra raw meat. And as promised, the Naga soldier managed to control this menace...and this is how.

This fellow starting putting the meat close to the LOC to entice the dog to come and take it. The dog developed a habit over next couple of days and then, one fine day, the soldier got hold of him - and killed the dog. He then proceeded to butcher the dog in front of Paki troops, cooked it and ate the same - he and fellow Naga soldiers. Rest assured, Pakis in that sector never kept a dog again on the post.

Gus · Post by **Gus** » 17 Jan 2013 17:08

if any of these worthies are personally assaulted, they would move heaven and hell for retribution and justice. But here they are blithely spouting nonsense when the nation is assaulted.

Philip · Post by **Philip** » 17 Jan 2013 17:32

Yes Rohit,much to my chagrin as a doggie lover,tales about our Nagas enjoying "poodle" as a delicacy are true and a v. close IAS pal of mine,veteran of the IPKF,has often told me stories-with full actions,about the disappearance of poor doggies in Jaffna,including the pet of a not well-liked CO!

Altair · Post by **Altair** » 17 Jan 2013 18:50

Couple of observations.
1. As usual, our media management is completely f*kcedup. We need to get our act together.
2. Also, our chain of command got exposed and how GoI reacts to Paki sponsored terrorism midst of so called peace process.

Was the entire beheading a planned baloon launched by PA for coming days to test our response?

RajeshA · Post by **RajeshA** » 17 Jan 2013 18:59

I think the PM has every right to continue the peace process with Pakistan. It should remain "uninterrupted and uninterruptible".

However just as we face terrorism and beheadings from Pakistan, and we still continue with the "uninterrupted and uninterruptible" peace process, in the same way Pakistan should reciprocate and continue with the "uninterrupted and uninterruptible" peace process regardless of shittt we start beating out of them, or any land acquisitions we start making across the border. After all we should keep on talking to each other. In fact due to our military operations there, there will be even more to talk about.

The peace process should not be made prisoner to the military pow-wow going on! We all want peace in South Asia!

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 17 Jan 2013 19:44

krishnan wrote:GoP wants Mr Khar to meet Mrs Khushid

http://www.rediff.com/news/slide-show/s ... 130117.htm

This could result in Mrs Kurshi* loss.

habal · Post by **habal** » 17 Jan 2013 19:45

Look at it this way, UPA has tied up with TSPA to teach recalciterant IA a lesson.

(How would a govt subdue such a crises in favor of Pakis

Make a few noises warning Pakis and then likes of Mrs. Khurshid make hints warning Indian commentators and Army from speaking out of turn. After which sit tight and do nothing

..

which means original intent was to punish IA for not coming to the same page on Siachin/Core issue, for which help was sought from TSPA. Even after appointing their 'yes man' Bikram Singh they couldn't manage it. Their next step is to punish common man by hiking diesel prices.)

UPA using TSPA as a extra-territorial military extension of it's internal naxal mafia.

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 17 Jan 2013 19:47

Neela wrote:My wife said this earlier today.
You need the head for the last rites before cremation in Hindu tradition.
For women, seeing the face is somehow an image/feeling they want to hold to after the death of the husband.

Am glad some one still understands 'kapala moksha'. But witout having performed pitru or matru yagnya one wouldnt know.

RajeshA · Post by **RajeshA** » 17 Jan 2013 19:50

From the OIT Thread, I have learnt that Khur is an Indian ass. Lately it has often been seen around South Block listening to the call of nature!

member_22872 · Post by **member_22872** » 17 Jan 2013 19:52

Rajesh ji, unfortunately, land acquisition and talks are mutually exclusive and land acquisition is born dead concept as gov can't proceed with the it, GoI has invested too much in Aman ki Asha and track II diplomacy, Kurshid, our journos, our 'artists' all are part of this. I think as someone said, Aman ki Asha is is game plan created by GoI, GoP and US, they dont want it to fail. It is a silent, non-violent way of giving away bits and pieces of India in the form of Siachen, Sir Creek.

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 17 Jan 2013 19:55

Nightwatch,

Nightwatch 16 Jan 2013

Some data points to consider the motivations.

India-Pakistan: Update. The directors-general of military operations from the two countries spoke on the telephone about the recent ceasefire violations along the Line of Control in Kashmir. Press outlets report they reached an understanding on de-escalating the tension. The two generals ordered strict observance of the November 2003 ceasefire to their respective forces.

Pakistani Foreign Minister Khar said Pakistan is open to discussion to ensure the ceasefire.
{What is there it discuss? Just observe the ceasefire lest it becomes open season.}

Comment: This outcome was fore-ordained two weeks ago. The unanswered questions are who prompted the increase in border tension and for what purposes.

The timing of the attacks corresponds to the multiple internal political crises besetting the government of Prime Minister Ashraf, which were addressed in last night's NightWatch.

Some coalition of interest groups wants to bring down the Zardari presidency and the Pakistan People's Party-led coalition government before the elections in March. They seem to want to re-create in Pakistan the Arab Spring uprising that brought the Muslim Brotherhood to power in Egypt, but with much stronger Pakistan Army influence.

Readers are urged to keep in mind that the Pakistan Army is Islamist and consistently has opposed secular, elected government. The Army is the party that made Pakistan an Islamic Republic.

Be that as it may, still the GOI shocked non-response is a telling fact. And the super-quick US and PRC admonishment to India when TSP is the aggressor is also a telling fact.

As most castratti, the GOI turned on its own citizens who pointed that "the emperor has no clothes."
This is the equivalent of the Delhi Bullice beating up the gang-rape protestors.
Only the hurt is more grevious and long lasting.

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 17 Jan 2013 20:03

Altair wrote: Gurkhas are experts on our side for this beheading business. You ask 10 they will deliver 100. Guaranteed everytime. We need to send them over.

and Rohitvats on Nagas.

Guys these is an uncalled for equal equal and does not fit the facts.

Gurkhas and Nagas behead in close combat in times of war.
The Pakis Kamandus and jihadis behead as a religious rite derived from actions of the Muhammad even in non-combat.

My point is this equates the dispicable miscreants with our honorable soldiers.
Dont do that on this forum.

Thanks, ramana
And no argues.

Altair · Post by **Altair** » 17 Jan 2013 20:39

ramana wrote: My point is this equates the dispicable miscreants with our honorable soldiers.
Dont do that on this forum.

Thanks, ramana
And no argues.

My apologies. This is what happens in revenge business. We loose ourselves.

Sagar G · Post by **Sagar G** » 17 Jan 2013 21:17

ramana wrote:I just noted Philip's new word castratti to describe the euunuchs in the DIE

Good word.

No offence to anyone but are you crediting Philip garu for creating the word or using it ???

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 17 Jan 2013 21:28

Creating I guess. Is it already in existence?