Positive News from the USA

[Shreeman]

The daily diet:

Revelry:
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1, 2, 3, 4,5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10.

Valentines day preparation:
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1, 2, 3, 4,5,6,7, 8, 9, 10.
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Revelations:
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What is rape vs. what is sexual assault ? What is an atomic weapon or atom bomb and what is a nukular weapon? What is an indian and what is a south asian ? When are these terms used?

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A story:
chapter 0. The initiation.
chapter 1. The dictionary.
chapter 2. The White house takes lead in promoting the United States leadership in robotics.
chapter 3. The United States takes lead in high-technology -- haptics, robotics, and healthcare.
chapter 4. An editorial: the value of satire.
chapter 5. The Freedoms: Thou shalt not take the lord's name in vain.
chapter 6. The Law: In whom shall we place blind faith.
chapter 7. The Zeal: Where humans aim to imitate and excel upon sheep.
chapter 8. Hiatus to observe pastafarian sabbath.

and, an anecdote for the young'uns, and a FAQ and why it is important to you.

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With no particular dates in mind, to come:
chapter 09. The essence of verification in journalism, publication, and everything; and the myth of peer-review.
chapter 10. The lure of money.
chapter 11. On the dangers of speaking out.
chapter 12. And in conclusion.
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Please re-read the FAQ, before making any judgements and inferences. The intent is not to have the reader conceive, but to perceive what is in plain sight. Inferences are your own, and please resist the temptation of 140 character conclusions. You may not have yet perceived much more that is relevant. All the yak butter will not give you the essence of what is above. I dont know, and I wrote it.

The thread is established and this adds only little additional value now. It is always there at the admin's discretion to remove it. This was all that was handy at the time. And pasta willing, more of your preconceptions will be proven false, in less than 140chars.

Hussain HankPsnky
U-NSN
Silicone Valley Wilds

[shiv]

and, an anecdote for the young'uns,

Would this be immediately after a man with tresses was asked to remove his shoes and certified safe by the high priests of the temple of air travel?

[Shreeman]

and, an anecdote for the young'uns,

Would this be immediately after a man with tresses was asked to remove his shoes and certified safe by the high priests of the temple of air travel?

Everyone went through regular security (shoes off). He went through what everyone went through as far as I can tell. There is an exemption (for shoes etc) for TSA/Pre now, there was none back then. I suspect he didn't really think much of it.

I don't think they had started trying to make an example out of him on this trip, if that's what you were asking. The dates are in the BBC reports (two mouse click distance, though, not one), . That was THE point and I wonder if anyone got it, if you have only now caught on.

For the curious, my interaction was during this first visit -- Monday October 15 morning, Delta Flight 6175 (an RJ145), on his way to NASA Goddard. The second stop (two days later) was :

http://www.cmu.edu/news/archive/2007/Oc ... alam.shtml

He had just barely stepped down as president, had gone through regular security, and traveled like an ordinary individual as far as I could tell. Not a soul recognized him.

In the following visits though, things got much worse (the example bit):

http://articles.timesofindia.indiatimes ... ity-checks
http://www.ibtimes.com/us-officials-sac ... far-371782

[RCase]

I am surprised that Jen Paki did not spin Ms. Nuland's comment as 'F*** You' to her colleague over the phone, which is SOP for friendly exchanges between colleagues at SD. Or better still ''F***, yew!', which can be considered PG13.

[gakakkad]

So in a sense, doctors are responsible for the lack of availability of health care in the USA

There.. corrected.

With the US claiming to lead the world and people in the US speaking as if what occurs there is the standard for the rest of the world to follow, it it important to make the point that this is a problem created by the US for the US.

As I said - doctors were overpaid to start with. It is OK to be grateful to doctors for services rendered but when you convert the value of a doctor's work into money and give him the license to charge pretty much whatever sum he can think of, the country is beginning the process of a self-cavity search.

Doctors are only one small part of a US tendency to convert everything into a value in dollars. How much do you want for telling your story? How much do you want to shut up? How much will you give me to shut up? How much will you pay me for an accident which I choose to blame on you?

This is an American problem. It is an "American doctors" problem only insofar as it is their fate to be in the US in the 21st century and not back in the 1960s when money could be made and no questions asked.

Funnily enough it is a sign that there is less money to go around now - an admission that I do not expect from the US for a few more decades while people tell me how the monetary value of everything today exceeds by many fold the monetary value of everything yesterday.

Actually physician fees make only 1.5% of the total healthcare cost ...26 billion of the total 1.6 trillion...The main culprit is the oligopoly of pharmaceutical and medical equipment manufacturing company....doctors in UK/Australia etc are extremely well paid too...but the per capita healthcare costs are far lower than Unkil....

Doctors in part do play a big role ...American treatment guidelines are illogical and unnecessary...for example serial CT scans for head injury...I know people who came up with a small haemorrhagic contusion in frontal lobe on initial ct scan ,with GCS of 15/15 been subjected to daily CT scans...when there is entirely no shred of evidence that it could have been beneficial to the patient.

Similarly subjecting the entire adult population with colonoscopy or double contrast barium enema in the name of 'preventing' colorectal cancer is absurd and raises cost without providing tangible benefits..

Australians and oiropeans have a way better system..and in most places doctors are equally well paid...

american's have the tendency to blame everyone and there uncle for there misfortunes...and the medical malpractice industry has raised costs like hell...a neurosurgeon in florida needs to pay premium of about 100,000 dollars ...that is 20% of what he makes...surely it ll be passed on to the patients...

[UlanBatori]

IMO, both those airplane incidents were because of the extremely poor handling by GOI (and Kalam's own staff). The people they put at the airport gate boarding area at 2AM are not there by choice, they are probably not the top of the class. They HAVE to follow SOP, and in ANY deviation, they are expected to get uber-paranoid and bump up the search process, not give in to "chalta hai".

You and I may recognize President Abdul Kalam, but can you be 100% sure that if Abdul bin Kabul comes along with his VIP full of RDX instead of pakistan, and in a professionally made disguise, you can tell for certain? Neither can those poor sods. If they relax their alert for an instant, 300 people and who knows how many more, will die, and of course their own families will starve.

Those people at the gate must have iron-clad orders to expect, and how to recognize, VVIPs. And India should not keep sending VVIPs dressed like slobs from Somalia (Defence Minister George F) or the esteemed APJAK with his trademark simplicity and elegant hairdo (to airline gate people he would look like a T-3 visa person), without proper escort. That is where the utter slobbishness of the planning and preparation comes in. I am sorry to have to say this, but I do have some experience of how his retinue "operates". Kindergartners are better organized.

It is always hard to reconcile Special Treatment for VVIPs, with the need to protect against ever-more-sophisticated terrorism. The Indian approach of genuflexing and groveling before any pompous oiseule "VIP" and disregarding elementary security, is a recipe for disaster. It's only a matter of time before... (never mind, I don't want them coming after me when the obvious happens).

I just do not believe there was any "lesson" or "example" or any other stunt involved in the treatment that these Indian VVIPs received. Just frightened people at the airport gates, making extremely tough choices and doing their jobs conscientiously.

If I am standing guard at 2AM, and someone comes up and acts strange, I AM going to give them a lot more attention - and not of a genuflecting kind, but more a cavity-searching kind.

A body pat-down is a positive assurance that the person has been checked, and so his flight is safer to get on. Just don't make a big deal of it.

When Yuri Gagarin and John Glenn went to Space and returned, they had to carry their own pakistan attached to their $10M space suits, hey? Not very glamorous, just don't make a big issue of it.

Either give the VVIPs proper escorts with proper planning, and assigned people at the gates everywhere with direct, clear, verified orders from sufficiently top people to ensure smooth protocol, or quit whining about what everyone goes through. In fact APJAK NEVER complained, he is an aerospace engineer and knows what one has to go through to get inside secured facilities. It's the idiots around him, and the media, who make all the fuss.

In the DK affair, the #1 reason for the gross initial lack of sympathy among IAs, was the "they put her in a cell with COMMON CRIMINALS!"

OK, in the US, I don't think police stations have Special VIP Cells. Not even in S. Manhattan. Maybe in India they do have such Special Fajilities since they have such Uncommon Criminals. New Party Conversation Item:

Ooo! When I got caught for DUI they put me with very special Stock Market Insider Traders, Top International Spies, Jackal-class Assassins and Indian Ministers and IAS aphsars. Very UNCOMMON criminals onlee! "

[member_22733]

UBji,

Truly what you said is true. You know I was talking to a dude from the south who mentioned that African Americans should be thankful and grateful to white people like himself because white people showed them the meaning of freedom and gave them civil rights. I looked deep into his eyes to detect a hint of sarcasm and looked desperately for a sly smile that gives away a joke, but no... he was dead serious... as serious as serious can be. He was pi$$ed off at black people who dont give respect to white people.

We Indians should also be grateful of the Americans and respect what they dish out to us, for they allow us to live here and make money, and they have a great culture.

As an example, Our own MMS has thanked the Brits and payed his respects for showing us English and giving us knowledge. We should follow his footsteps.

[UlanBatori]

Sarcasm noted, thx Lokesh. But sadly, what I say IS actually true. If you check into the Continental Airlines "incident", you will probably find that the ppl who "exceed their briefs" in searching President Kalam were INDIANS, not Americans, and that they probably did not recognize Dr. Kalam either from pictures or when they saw his name and ID.

Next time at an airline counter in desh, look carefully at the competence level of the staff. There is so much turnover that most of the staff are like on their first day not just on the job, but on the planet. The organizations work because they have 1 or 2 "aphsars" running around putting out fires and patiently showing these newbies what keys to press.

And those are the ppl at the front counters, posh jobs wearing nice clothes in the daytime. Not the poor sods at the Gate at 2AM.

"Respect" and "protocol" with 21-gun salutes and red carpets don't happen out of spontaneous respect. They happen because of minute, advance planning.

As for Americans, yes, most countries are shocked when they see the virtual invasion that precedes a POTUS visit. But to the WHOTUS, this seems like the absolute minimum, to ensure that everything possible has been done to ensure a smooth visit. Even then, they failed to provide a seat belt and barf bag when Dubya slid under a table at a Japanese State Dinner.

In India, they have given blanket orders that visiting goras have Meet and Greet (did u read about the MeetnGreet being FREE for vijiting diplos until very recently?) and those people take care of detailed planning. India sends its ex-presidents and Ministers abroad with no such preparation, they expect spontaneous genuflexion by the staff everywhere, with no advance planning or notice.

[member_22733]

UB Saar! I agree with you! Don't get me wrong. My understanding was that this thread is sarcasm onlee, so your legitimate points about commanding respect instead of expecting it is valid... but not on this thread. I made that post in that gist onlee (trying to move it to sarcasm territory).

[Shreeman]

Sarcasm noted, ....

I am not sure what is going on here, but I really doubt that UB has actually read the anecdote. Or he has private knowledge of events I am not privy to.

The anecdote is not about commanding respect, it is not about handling state visits, and it is not about asking for privileges. It was not 2AM in the morninng.

What I wrote, is about a gent simply handling a fairly unusual situation -- one even the lowly mayor of Ulan Bator will not face -- with great grace. Leave aside wanting to travel as mere mortal and being able to freely mix like this with us "ordinary" mortals.

Why does it need any defending and what is there to criticize? And I will take an APJAK any day over an average Bubba. We should be so lucky!

I dont think his status made things any "worse" that particular time. But the times were remarkably bad for everyone brown back then. And he went through it like you and me. In later visits, he was being made an example, in my humble opinion. I have no idea as to why. I am not singling out the later visits, merely distinguishing them.

FYI, It took practically an act of congress before I myself was able to travel remotely normally. And they usually drag me around in a wheel chair! I have also had to turn entire facilities upside down for a TV "begging bit" for both netas and leaders. Some of it is still on youtube. Re. the later incidents -- why can't one distinguished individual be grouped with other seniors? Or is it really different than when they grab and grope a different skin color grandmother? This is all entirely out of scope.

My little story is a simple statement on observing core human values -- among them respect towards me. There is nothing controversial about it, unless I am somehow less than human now. You will probably not get another person of those values in that chair anytime soon. On either side. And I will not write any more about it. The admins can take the anecdote off if it offends the readers sensibilities. I would rather have people not know about it than extrapolate.

[UlanBatori]

Shreeman & Lokesh: I still say that the whole "example" bit is probably giving too much credit to the intelligence and knowledge of the ppl involved. If I were in charge of security, the only way I would refrain from searching someone who came there with a note saying "don't search me!" is if my boss' boss 3 levels up accompanied the person and gave me written orders saying don't search this person.

And that is what was missing in these events. As for international air travel, sure, the pakis have taken the fun out of it, with the Box Cutter, the Shoe bum, the bum-bum, the Gatorade bum, and now the toothpaste bum. Indian reaction is an individual pat-down. The American is the remove-shoe, remove VIP, remove lord knows what else if the Pakis demonstrate it. Maybe Cavity Search 4 All. Plus, at airports outside the Yoo-Ess where one does not have to remove shoes or show Little One-Quart-RoohAfza Bag, they do a secondary search/questioning at the Gate. Maybe in the jetway. Keep it surprising I guess.

But I would like to relate some experiences too. The first international flight we boarded after the nau-gyarah events was an Ulan Bator Airlines one, of course. There was a long line snaking its way to the 777, and they had set up two rows of desks to get ppl to open their hand baggage while the owners went through "secondary search". This is one of those lines where experienced Uighurs smile and allow others to cut in b4 them, no problem, until all the stations are occupied with ppl waiting 3-deep in front of them.

The selection was random. They picked Phisht Class passengers equally frequently as they did Cattle Class (May ATM give M Atta and his 18 a few seconds off from their enjoyment of the fires of Lower Houristan, because they sat in First Class, not where I sit!). I was curious as to what would happen when
a) the gents in the long Ayrab costumes and turbans came up
b) the ladies in the Pakistan Army Uniforms (Burkhas) came up
c) the frail old, old ladies came up (these were, shall we say, very native Ulan Batoris)

Of these 3, only (c) were "selected", (a) and (b) breezed through. So, By the Grace of ATM, did we. So were the ppl there being stupid? Blind? Or just following SOP, with some random picking frequency? A lottery mark on the boarding card?

The same in desh - sitting at a Gate in BOM watching the boarding for internal flights - the same respectful but watchful treatment from the guards for everyone, and what a diverse bunch THAT was!

So are these SNAFUS? Of course. The baby sent through the X-ray machine in ATL because the worthy at the machine snapped at and ordered the flustered young mother who didn't speak Angreji with Uighur accent, to do so. The Malloo-American gent in New York circa Dec. 2001, who called up the Opera ticket place to book 2 seats for him and his very pregnant Bibi on their Anniversary, and when asked what seats he wanted, responded, "Oh, any seat is fine, thx!" When he came up to the counter to pick up the tickets (Bibi was still sitting in car), 3 of NYC's finest Cavity Searchers leaped on him, hugged him tight so he could not move his hands to the presumed soosai vest and carried him far from the theater b4 he could ask what was going on. "You think YOU were scared, man, what about us? We expected to be blown to bits" was their explanation.

The Paki-Amreeki bijnejman from Phoenix, starting on a trip after his mother passed away, who was off-loaded from First Class after the Delta Airlines captain refused to take off with a brown terrist sitting on his plane.

The I-A US Army Doctor veteran who was sitting in Bijnej class on an internal US flight - the Marshalls jumped on and sat on some OTHER passenger. The doc turned around to look - and they jumped on him too and sat on him. They put him in a urine-smelling VIP Waiting Lounge aka cell for a while before they asked any questions. Last I heard, he was suing the airline.

The Malloo filmy houri and her entourage who all craned their pretty necks to look out the window and pointed down (at the Statue of Liberty) and "spoke in this strange language, probably Ayrabik". Gori lady co-passenger kindly reported them to flt attendants, and they were arrested on arrival.

The PIGS/DOO who took out and read conspicuously through a Terrorism Manual in the window seat of a flight, so that his co-passenger ratted and had him taken off the flight b4 takeoff.
The Ulan Batori jeenius who decided he'd forgotten something, so ran back down the up escalator at Ulan Bator airport. They closed down the airport (and last heard, were suing him for the costs).
The Californian who was arrested for saying: "don't u dare touch my junk!"
The 3-year-olds who have been put on No Phly Lists for being terrorists.
The parents offloaded because their 3-year-olds would not sit down and shut up.
The singing group (in Ayrab costumes) who were offloaded because they were a team of M*** Men Traveling Together.
Once I got on a jehaz-e-hava in Seattle returning to Ulan Bator, and my associate, who was not upgraded to bijnez class (and looked Ayrabic) waved and made some joke as he went past me. The gent next to me was obviously freaking out, until he found out what I was (a mere Uighur goatherd). The guy was a senior captain on UB Airlines.
I could go on and on, VERY long list of Tee Ess Ay stories. But all of these are combinations of fear, paranoia and SOP run wild. aka Human. Usually they are just ppl, once in a while they show a sense of humor
One of my associates was shocked as she went through the metal detector, and the guy squinted and said: let's see - there is a medallion in your bag that says.. "International isbace ishtashun!" (He had opened the bag of a prior passenger and guessed that she was returning from the same event).
I am just saying that incidents of Indian VVVIPs not getting the salaam treatment with no security, are just poor planning by the Indian organizers. No bojitive neuj there.

But we digress. There is so much bojitive neuj to discuss.

[Shreeman]

Shreeman....

UB - In no uncertain terms, let me emphasize that I was on THE list of lists, despite being in a wheel chair. I have a special contempt for what the TSA did to me personally. This is a place for those details some day. The act of congress bit was not overstated, it was understated. Other positive news takes precedence for noe, and I am no fan pf endless positive news. Am hoping for the justification bit to show up sooner than later.

Re. APJAK, anyone who interprets that story as anything other than an exemplary example of grace is itching for a fight. I am allowed to fight in this thread (admins be praised) and am obsessive-compulsive. Unless the admins remove the privilege, that does not pass. I am contributing hard facts and facts alone. Readers can make up their own minds, but there is no scope for speculation in written word here on my accord.

I also have less sympathy for DK minus the cheer haran compared to APJAK. I am open about that. it was not right even without the cheer haran, but if attention had been paid to APJAK, Dayal, and Shankar, DK would never have happened. Part of it, taking references for SR by DK during selection was poorly done too.

By comparison, this gentlemen was well past the established senior age. You do not see people like this rescreened after doors have been closed. Stop trying to find excuses for that. There is no such procedure to my knowledge and no way of crew/staff knowing what was or was not done once doors are closed. There is no checklist of jackets by passenger.

For your reference, before I personally broke my spine in two, I have many dozen hours on the tarmak -- before and after the big event. Not in anything big, but no rules left unread. And all kinds lined up with, behind, and ahead of. This was fifteen years ago, so am not claiming to be an expert. I understand both cockpit and tarmak issues, and am again TSA/Pre now. Not unfamiliar with terminal issues. Until the most recent setback, was putting healthy people to shame with shuttling around stubbornly to meet extensive commitments despite obvious health risks and pain. I need more interaction than most people with terminal staff and I KNOW mistreatment. Not the rectal-inquiry there yet (though doctors have substituted in that role as for most people), but nothing else left to imagination. Every bit worse than most folks here.

I am not inserting that perspective in harmless anecdotes either. This was never a place to apologize or extrapolate. Last several dozen posts on multiple threads, I see you turning mellow, even in unexpected places like this. A mere satire space, and it greatly surprises me. I thought I knew you better, through all your previous personas here and elsewhere. I wonder if people are given a perspective at some point that I have not yet been qualified to obtain. But then I am not a routine keyboard warrior.

Incompetence is nowhere in the constitution that I raised my hand to -- here or there. And I will not use it as an excuse. Incompetence, by my government or people, is still just more cause for me having to apologize more profusely and to set it right if within my abilities. There is nothing wrong with saying sorry when you goof up bad. It has not happened yet in the recent incident.

[UlanBatori]

rescreened after doors have been closed.

Ah! THAT was the "beyond their brief"? I am Didn't see that there. I thought the "screening" was all in the gate jetway.

So that was flight crew/Marshals. That was the part where they interpreted their instructions as "if the ground ppl don't search someone, search them after they are on board." They should have asked for instructions from company HQ if nothing else sufficed.

The ******s should (have been/be) fired, and arrested by PiB. And yes, GOI should be even more, if they didn't stop Continental Airlines from flying into India, with a delay of 3 months to allow an announcement to passengers to rebook. Banned for 5 years. Absolutely true that with event after event, to ministers, ex-prez, Ambassador, the GOI did nothing but "don't do this next time". MMS and his whole troop needs to be swept out.

I understand, no one who has been victim of this nonsense can be asked to accept that. Deeply sorry.

[shiv]

Before 9-11, when during one grand family reunion when everyone came from America, a cousin of mine - a man of my age who grew up with me from an age when we had no pants and only T-shirt to help keep us cool from above and dry from below was cursing the fact that he had to reach Bangalore airport 2 hours before the flight. He said, "Bloody Indians will never become efficient. In Chicago, Minnesota I simply check in my bags at the entrance to the airport 15 minutes before the flight."

As an Indian in India there is no answer to such a stupid statement, especially from a guy who has himself been imported to America as an ejjucated employee (ejjucation paid for by daddy) to work for a humongous salary in a manpower shortage area.

Then came 9-11.

After that Americans quietly put up with this shit. No more talk of inefficiency. Now its the opposite. "Hey that stupid fat paandu in Mumbai did not even squeeze my balls. I could have been carrying a bomb there"

I recall a similar discussion about related things on another board where one MATA/MUTU pointed out, "Well America has had no further attacks since 9-11. That is what efficiency means" Once again, there is no arguing with this logic. America is safe because American security forces (that includes the police) have extraordinary powers and the intelligence apparatus has extraordinary access to information.

If one were to draw a graph plotting safety from terrorism and personal liberty I am sure you will find that safety comes at the price of personal liberty. So yes the US is safe, but it is no longer free on many counts. I recall the claim made by someone that his brand is world famous in Bangalore. Americans are totally, totally free to live their lives within very rigid boundaries set by US law and interpreted by the law enforcement apparatus. The law is like a cake recipe. It is a good thing to follow, but using that recipe to make something good depends on the baker. You can boast about the best laws but that is no use if you only have oiseaules enforcing the law. And if those oisealues are successful in preventing terrorism 100% of the time they have something to boast about.

It reminds me of the convulsions that the US army went through after WW 2 when research showed that many men hardly used their weapons. These findings were used to create new training methods so that the US army has almost never come out losing a firefight. The opponent invariably has more dead and the US has fewer or none dead. The army can never be blamed for losing a war. Wars are lost by politicians. US law enforcement has become that efficient. They pre empt by pulling up a lot of innocent people and when they react they react with great ferocity and overwhelming force that often simply takes out a lot of innocent bystanders. Since they are generally not killed - just humiliated or cavity searched, they have to sit back and accept the situation as "GOTUS knows best. They keep us safe"

I am amazed that the US population has been beaten down into a state of dhimmitude where they are unable to forcefully protest loss of freedom. It appears to me that the US population have forgotten the meaning of freedom, or they have simply been brought up to imagine that what they enjoy is freedom. It is not by a long shot. But US actions outside the US are so atrocious that there is no way the US can be safe unless draconian internal security is maintained. TS Jones' paranoia is real and appropriate. Too many people dislike the US. It is Ok that the US does not like them either but none of this makes the US safe without stifling internal security and snooping.

That country is heading up uncharted territory by using its power to make more and more enemies and then using the same power to maintain a semblance of internal security and freedom from all the enemies who might want to hit the US in some way or other. A paranoid nation state. No one in power in the US is allowed to say this - other than a few people like Noam Chomsky - a man who is dismissed as a crank - that was done even on here on BRF

[UlanBatori]

shiv: Bojitive Neuj. U really need to read "The Kill List" by Frederick bin Forsyth Bilayati ul Yankasskissi. He seems to have morphed into a Tom bin Clancy, except with half as many pages.

[Shreeman]

In my very humble and useless braying , it is a matter of principles. When they don't apply to the high and mighty there is no chance of a poor donkey like me every getting one applied to me ever again .

Or to any others reading, even those who still think they have graduated to the high and mighty form. Precedents are everything, this is what mission creep is.

You think you are safe? It is as good as offering your honestly earned dollar to the deity. Go ahead, stick it in his bronze ear, say your prayer and it will surely save you from misfortune.

By the time DK happened a million similar incidents had already taken place. I really could care less about the DK incident itself. Screw the batman culture. But the principles are worth pretending. Civilization is only pretending that we are better than animals. Always imperfect, but it is the pretense of being clothed, washed, cooked, married, and so on that makes a difference. If not, let's open a Nigerian-thigh-and-wings restaurant chain already, the business opportunity beacons.

Shiv: Re. the US being safe -- why do you think I write up the daily diet? It literally takes two minutes to search google news and most of that is cut and paste. Safe my ass. How many times do I have to wake up in the night hearing sirens? I am not even remotely in the middle of any city (there is a fire station close by, but none the less).

And how often are *any* crimes solved? Does safety from pakistanis not being allowed to create a pakistan here now substitute for all other improvement in safety? Not by your highness the queen's long mile. And racism is bubbling hotter than my uncle's curries again. I can add as many categories (or as many numbers) to the daily diet as you like. And more categories of daily diet have been created by this safety circus than those that have been removed.

The big event was bad, but industry took advantage of it to re-budget national resources and fool the **** out of the individual citizens in ways not previously imaginable. You can't turn back that clock either. If ever there was a banana republic, it is one that I am now sworn to.

And those in their comfortable tenured positions should realize too that their profession went from a shining example of civilization to the most stinking pakistan ever imagined. And they will wallow in it forever and not be able to open their mouths. You think process X will work for you? Think again. At least I can get out.

Back to regularly scheduled programming please. I would rather stay in this cave now, and promise not to interrupt the learned discourse outside. Not even in the strat-e-jic threads. Everything else, slavery included, is happily out of bounds.

ps- A simple hyperlink in the right place can make the difference. A higher google page score is the missing ingredient.

[UlanBatori]

Shreemanji, yak-herding eej also under grave threat for all the reasons you said, no argument. Y do u think not possible to have chai-biscoot without slight burkha? Even aphter living in cave phor teen saal? But the fault, say, in 1940s was never in the brainwashed ***ler Jugend, it was in those who organized the brainwashing and gave the orders. Shivering in dhotis did not do much good for anyone then either, the ones that spoke up at least went relatively quickly, hanging from the hooks-e-meat. As for freedom of speech, the Pakistani Jarnail said it best:

In Bakistan aljo we are having Phreedom Oph Sbeech.
It eez Phreedom APHTER Sbeech that eej highly doubtphool onlee

Phreedom APHTER sbeech eej in grave danger in Dera Great Satan.
Phreedom APHTER sbeech eej in even more grave danger in Dera Harischandra.

Maybe yak-herders also decided that it eej better to live briefly but free than to live long as a dhimmi?

[UlanBatori]

There was an old man of Lyme
Who lived with three wives at a time
When asked why the third
He said, Ones's absurd!
And bigamy, sir! is a CRIME!!

[Shreeman]

The daily diet: The revelry and lovefest sections are new in every post, in case you haven't noticed.
Revelry:
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1,
2,
3,
4,
5,
6,
7,
8,
9,
10.

Lovefest:
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1,
2,
3,
4,
5,
6,
7,
8,
9,
10.
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Revelations: What is rape vs. what is sexual assault ? What is an atomic weapon or atom bomb and what is a nukular weapon? What is an indian and what is a south asian ? When are these terms used?
------------
A story:
chapter 0. The initiation.
chapter 1. The dictionary.
chapter 2. The White house takes lead in promoting the United States leadership in robotics.
chapter 3. The United States takes lead in high-technology -- haptics, robotics, and healthcare.
chapter 4. An editorial: the value of satire.
chapter 5. The Freedoms: Thou shalt not take the lord's name in vain.
chapter 6. The Law: In whom shall we place blind faith.
chapter 7. The Zeal: Where humans aim to imitate and excel upon sheep.
chapter 8. Hiatus to observe pastafarian sabbath.

and, an anecdote for the young'uns, and a FAQ and why it is important to you.

------
With no particular dates in mind, to come:
chapter 09. The essence of verification in journalism, publication, and everything; and the myth of peer-review.
chapter 10. The lure of money.
chapter 11. On the dangers of speaking out.
chapter 12. And in conclusion.
------
Disclaimer: Please re-read the FAQ, before making any judgements and inferences. The intent is not to have the reader conceive, but to perceive what is in plain sight. Inferences are your own and please resist the temptation of 140 character conclusions. You may not have yet perceived much more that is relevant. All the yak butter will not give you the essence of what is above. I dont know, and I wrote it. The thread is established and this adds only little additional value now. It is only there at the admin's discretion. This was all that was handy at the time. And pasta willing, more of your preconceptions will be proven false, in less than 140chars.

Hussain HankPsnky
U-NSN
Silicone Valley Wilds

[Rahul Mehta]

The thread looks like a homeless guy laughing at a man who has a broken roof in of of his rooms in his 10 BHK bungalow.

You all can laugh as much as you want. US's justice system has seriously deteriorated in past 30 years due to fake war on drugs , and reduction in Jury Trials, and corruption prone plea bargaining. But still it is far far less bad than India. It is hilarious to see people from India making fun at injustices in India.

USA has miles to go before it can degenerate to level of India. And India has miles to go before it can reach level of US, whatever it is.

[menon s]

Running joke on Obama goes like this, if illegal aleins can be called undocumented immigrants, then, in a few years, drug peddlers will be called------- unlicensed pharmacists.

[Shreeman]

The thread looks like a homeless guy laughing at a man who has a broken roof in of of his rooms in his 10 BHK bungalow.

You all can laugh as much as you want. US's justice system has seriously deteriorated in past 30 years due to fake war on drugs , and reduction in Jury Trials, and corruption prone plea bargaining. But still it is far far less bad than India. It is hilarious to see people from India making fun at injustices in India.

USA has miles to go before it can degenerate to level of India. And India has miles to go before it can reach level of US, whatever it is.

We apologize, most humbly. I am sure no one will read the thread and it will vanish into oblivion by tomorrow.

[member_22733]

The thread looks like a homeless guy laughing at a man who has a broken roof in of of his rooms in his 10 BHK bungalow.

You all can laugh as much as you want. US's justice system has seriously deteriorated in past 30 years due to fake war on drugs , and reduction in Jury Trials, and corruption prone plea bargaining. But still it is far far less bad than India. It is hilarious to see people from India making fun at injustices in India.

USA has miles to go before it can degenerate to level of India. And India has miles to go before it can reach level of US, whatever it is.

We apologize, most humbly. I am sure no one will read the thread and it will vanish into oblivion by tomorrow.

Shreeman,

Why are you apologizing? There is no need to be sorry.

We are already crossing the chasm between India and US, especially in the area of slavery. US had millions of slaves when they were a young nation. We are now being accused of being slave drivers as a rather young nation. That is a big step. In that sense we are getting there, the arrest and cavity search of DK was indeed a postive sign.

However the US were also mass murdering native Americans. I dont think we can ever catch up in that area though, given how weak our Hindoooo phundamentalists are.

[Shreeman]

....

Rahul is an old member. This was a hello, howdy.

And before the interruptions, you will recall, we were mainly satire.

[Neela]

Where are they selling licenses to criticize USA? Can I have one? I dont mind waiting in front of that apphice from 5.30 AM in the morning.

[shiv]

The thread looks like a homeless guy laughing at a man who has a broken roof in of of his rooms in his 10 BHK bungalow.

You all can laugh as much as you want. US's justice system has seriously deteriorated in past 30 years due to fake war on drugs , and reduction in Jury Trials, and corruption prone plea bargaining. But still it is far far less bad than India. It is hilarious to see people from India making fun at injustices in India.

USA has miles to go before it can degenerate to level of India. And India has miles to go before it can reach level of US, whatever it is.

Rahulbhai! You mean there is a hole in the roof of one of the rooms? What a come down. That on top of fake war on drugs, and reduction in Jury Trials, and corruption prone plea bargaining. And failed gun control and out of control gun violence. And rape of the first and fourth amendments? I thought the foundations were being eaten away but at least the cover on top was good. Now you say there is a hole in the roof, through which homeless people are coming in and gawking. Do you need to compare with India to say how good things are? With India? Tsk tsk tsk. I am shocked! Shocked as homeless people are wont to be when the home they were trying to burgle looks as bad as my pavement dwelling.

[A_Gupta]

When considering effects of hole in the roof, one should consider the climate. No matter how big the hole, one is unlikely to die from exposure to the elements in say, sunny Kerala. When the temperature is averaging -10C, the hole in the roof is life-threatening.

[darshhan]

The thread looks like a homeless guy laughing at a man who has a broken roof in of of his rooms in his 10 BHK bungalow.

You all can laugh as much as you want. US's justice system has seriously deteriorated in past 30 years due to fake war on drugs , and reduction in Jury Trials, and corruption prone plea bargaining. But still it is far far less bad than India. It is hilarious to see people from India making fun at injustices in India.

USA has miles to go before it can degenerate to level of India. And India has miles to go before it can reach level of US, whatever it is.

Yeah Absolutely. Since you were talking about Homelessness, just look at the dedication of American Cops who Protect and Serve American Homeless citizens at all costs. Not to mention a stellar judiciary which goes all out to ensure fairness.
Liberation of a Homeless man by US Cops

An Orange County jury Monday found two former Fullerton police officers accused of killing a schizophrenic homeless man, Kelly Thomas, not guilty.

Manuel Ramos and Jay Cicinelli were charged with striking Kelly Thomas with a baton and a stun gun in a beating that left him comatose. He died five days later.

[Updated at 4:25 p.m.: Ramos, Cicinelli and their families were swiftly escorted out of the courtroom.

PHOTOS: The Kelly Thomas trial

Ron Thomas, Kelly Thomas' father, said he was stunned by the verdict, saying he'd never seen such a miscarriage of justice.

Thomas also suggested that federal authorities should look into the case.

Ramos' attorney, John Barnett, told reporters: "These peace officers were doing their jobs...they did what they were trained to do."

PHOTOS: The Kelly Thomas trial

Orange County Dist. Atty. Tony Rackauckas said prosecutors would not pursue charges against a third Fullerton officer accused in the Thomas case. That officer's trial was pending.

"I don't intend to proceed with another trial when the two officers here were acquitted," he told reporters.

The jury took less than a full day of deliberation to reach the not-guilty verdicts.

Rackauckas told jurors the former officers had abused their authority on the July evening when they confronted Thomas.

Ramos was facing second-degree murder and involuntary manslaughter charges, and Cicinelli was charged with involuntary manslaughter and excessive use of force under the color of authority.

The incident, captured on surveillance tape, was shown repeatedly during the trial, but each side drew different conclusions as to what it showed.

Prosecutors said the video captured a real-time homicide with the officers beating a homeless man, even as he called out for help. Defense attorneys said it showed two policeman trying to restrain a violent suspect who possessed abnormal strength.

The coroner's office determined that Thomas died of brain damage from lack of oxygen caused by chest compression and other injuries sustained during his struggle with police.

Defense attorneys suggested that Thomas' death could be tied to a diseased heart damaged by previous drug use.

Here is the video of Cops doing their duty to Protect and serve the above homeless man. Kudos to American Judiciary


Here is the photo of the homeless man after the cops had done their job



PROTECTED & SERVED BY US COPS

[UlanBatori]

I am 400% with Rahul (namaste!) on this. However bad things may look in the US of A, they are still better than those in Somalia and Uganda. They don't allow wimmens in the military in those places, for instance. Yup! We can all take great pride and comfort in this. VERY Bojitive Neuj indeed!

[Rony]

[Rony]

[UlanBatori]

Looney Toons - Mouth Organ Concerto

[ramana]

Another shooting trial in Florida going on.

Don't visit Florida if you are not a middle aged white male.
You could be shot if they dont understand you.

[Shreeman]

The daily diet: The revelry and lovefest sections are new in every post, courtesy of google uncle, in case you haven't noticed.
Revelry:
-------------
1,
2,
3,
4,
5,
6,
7,
8,
9,
10.

Lovefest:
--------------
1,
2,
3,
4,
5,
6,
7,
8,
9,
10.
------------

Revelations: What is rape vs. what is sexual assault ? What is an atomic weapon or atom bomb and what is a nukular weapon? What is an indian and what is a south asian ? When are these terms used?
------------
A story:
chapter 0. The initiation.
chapter 1. The dictionary.
chapter 2. The White house takes lead in promoting the United States leadership in robotics.
chapter 3. The United States takes lead in high-technology -- haptics, robotics, and healthcare.
chapter 4. An editorial: the value of satire.
chapter 5. The Freedoms: Thou shalt not take the lord's name in vain.
chapter 6. The Law: In whom shall we place blind faith.
chapter 7. The Zeal: Where humans aim to imitate and excel upon sheep.
chapter 8. Hiatus to observe pastafarian sabbath.

and, an anecdote for the young'uns, and a FAQ and why it is important to you.

------
With no particular dates in mind, to come:
chapter 09. The essence of verification in journalism, publication, and everything; and the myth of peer-review.
chapter 10. The lure of money.
chapter 11. On the dangers of speaking out.
chapter 12. And in conclusion.
----
12. In Conclusion (U-NSN, author silenced, and escorted for demented writing): This can be written sooner, out of sequence. For it is pretty clear already -- don't drink the water, there is something wrong in it. There is no other explanation for it.

For example:

• INDIA!!! -- You can't visit half of it, or choose to live in 90% of it, and this just counting the parts people are not defecating openly in. Yet the nationalism is strong on the keyboard. Go see something, step out of your comfort zone for a bit. Then come and advise someone else. Those intense feelings you feel right now are because you will likely never see Arunachal Pradesh, or most of Kashmir, or Lakshdweep, or Andaman and Nicobar, or a hundred other places that need permits . Claim what is yours, or someone else will. Then come advise others on how they should view India. Name one thing that you did that resulted in others being able to see more of it, and be proud of it.
• USA!!! -- I can't even hear you above the blaring sirens. Do you know how many are dead today, or assaulted, or robbed (sorry, mugged!)? The 100 mile exclusion zone; the number of coffins that flew back today; the forced cancer screenings at the airport; your food bill; who is serving it to you or where it came from; what you are earnings and where they are going; how about your kids' day today? Still feel superior and upset over random internet anonymities and feel like banging on your keyboard -- you need to talk to your doctor about Ritalin.
• Zbkrfrankistania!!!! --- Really? With a name like that, you expect us to take you seriously. Go home, this is not a place for you. When you allow the flying spaghetti monster the same rights, come back and we can talk.

This is not a p__sing match. Not clear yet? Lets try another time. If you can't tell when someone is trying to help you just because the medicine is unsavory, you are ______. If you feel like you need to win on the internet: ding!ding!ding, you have WON!, and you are ______. If you feel blind nationalism will improve the lives of your loved ones, you are ________. If you think you actually understood half of what went on above, you are _____. You need to abuse someone else for their ____ orientation or opinion, you are _____. You think religion is the answer, you are __________. If you think keyboard activism actually does something, you are _______.

There are so many qualities that will fill in the blanks above. Let me remind again that a cheer haran happens so often in your country, you can't count it humanly. Which country? And why? Because it offends you only depending upon who was subjected to it. What was given as examples above, contains more legalese and facts directly relevant to you than the cheer haran discussion because this was not about any one issue. Didn't make you go look or understand though, did it?

We don't have standards we apply to anything. We eat dogs here, but we would rather risk a human life there than kill a dog. But if the dog ran away, then it is toast. We pretty much can't count to 10 anymore, and yet everyday we pass more laws to force people into compliance of things they do not comprehend or have the remotest chance of being able to understand. And then we apply them blindly.

Stay away from crowds, there is too much methane in them. The brain was given for a reason. If money makes you exercise it, it must still function. Try using it for other reasons as well. All of what you believe in, is at least inaccurate. And most of all, be civil, be generous, and be forgiving. Do something about one cause without using a computer. Let it cost you something without earning you plaudits or money. That is 90% of the solution to all problems, right there.
------
Disclaimer:Please re-read the FAQ, before making any judgements and inferences. The intent is not to have the reader conceive, but to perceive what is in plain sight. Inferences are your own and please resist the temptation of 140 character conclusions. You may not have yet perceived much more that is relevant. All the yak butter will not give you the essence of what is above. I dont know, and I wrote it. The thread is established and this adds only little additional value now. It is only there at the admin's discretion. This was all that was handy at the time. And pasta willing, more of your preconceptions will be proven false, in less than 140chars.
-----
Hussain HankPsnky
U-NSN
Silicone Valley Wilds

[shiv]

The daily diet: The revelry and lovefest sections are new in every post, courtesy of google uncle, in case you haven't noticed.
Revelry:
-------------
1,
2,
3,
4,
5,
6,
7,
8,
9,
10.

These are policemen? The police, who protect you, must be protected. What is there in a country that requires this, so that policemen are protected?

[member_22733]

They are SWAT team members. Usually engaged against "heavily armed" 'suspect':

The definition of heavily armed varies by race:

1) Black guy:-
A wallet -- armed and dangerous, get the AK-47
A handgun (pistol) -- heavily armed, get the M-107 Bareta and a armored bulletproof cruiser and SWAT team.
AK-47 ---- that is a WMD -- call national guard and declare emergency.
2) White guy:-
AK-47 ---- practising second amendment, respects to you
AK-47, M-107 sniper rifle, hand grenades (yes these are legal in the US) -- armed, but still ... second amendment and all.

Suspects also vary by race, as would have been obvious by now.

[member_22733]

More on heavily armed blacks, who deservedly get shot.

[Shreeman]

Not aimed at anyone, just lamenting.

Ye, Gods. What fun you folks are having in the strat-e-jic forum and outside the cave in general. Hordes of immigration lawyers will give you first party initial assessment free. Why doest one practice this "housekeeper" visa lark. Tenure/blah/blah/JNU - Are you tenured to comment? Have you participated in reviewing a tenure application? Yes, or No. Yes? ok, I have some charitable work for you. Have you heard of the two-body problem? Qualified to comment on quantum physics AND wine philosophy? Need two people to have jobs to feed the little children, no? What purpose runnning the discussion off the rails? Cant find anything wrong in NYC so now you need the remaining 36000 miles AND geneology? Circl-e-jerk to justify NYC tamasha? You are the victim in DK, and INFY, and APKAK, and Dayal but still have to argue?

Oh what fun it is to be outside the cave!!! And TSJ is not even joining in. Ahem, sorry to have disrupted the regular programming. 1000 stribes to me.

[member_22733]

Shreemanji,

Take a deep breath and relax! You should be alright, since there is no slavery in the USofA. Not even a bit of it is left now

[member_22733]

Free vocational training for teenagers, US style.... Justice for all (especially for the prison system in the US, justice gives them a lot of money by way of teenagers )