Solutions to Making India a Safer Place

Arjun · Post by **Arjun** » 06 Jan 2013 12:46

Bade wrote:Saar, I think I made it very clear and my opinion on what US does has no relevance.

If you think the US has an issue with rape (maybe it does not, as I see no mass protests here regarding it even though clearly it is happening regularly and getting reported as well) then please do suggest what they should do to improve the situation.

If I understood you, your peeve is that it is recommending something to Indians, that is not acceptable to you. Please elaborate what is it that you find objectionable in what is being suggested that is a cultural affront to India ? Some of it by Indians themselves in the media.

I don't find anything objectionable at all with the US attitude..its only a whole bunch of Indian RNI / NRI retards that I am objecting to.

a) While this has no relevance to the subject matter of this thread - the separation of 'Christian values' and 'American values' where the latter is usually regarded as the more liberal parts derived from Christian underpinnings, is exactly the way to go as far as the relationship between 'Hindu values' and 'Indian / Indic values'. And the respect for these values from media in India should be the same as in the US.

b) Molestation and daily harassment of women in India is much worse than in the US - while the actual rate of rape is much lower. Indian media and analysts need to constantly highlight both the relative positives and negatives of the Indian situation. A consistent focus on either the negatives or the positives ONLY is ultimately counter-productive.

c) Either Indian media can, like the US, restrict analysis of such events to law & order / governance issues and seek to derive insights based on statistics and data. OR they can go beyond what is the Western norm and look into their own 'cultural issues', which is not a bad attitude at all - however the latter course should be accompanied by a clear recognition and consistent highlighting by media that Indian attitude of self-criticism / improvement is of a much higher standard than the West.

Sanku · Post by **Sanku** » 06 Jan 2013 13:10

Theo_Fidel wrote:Meanwhile a fair commentary....

http://www.thehindu.com/arts/magazine/a ... 269070.ece

A letter to young men who protested against rape

This first came on rediff around the time, the protestors vs the govt battle was being fought on the streets and on in the media. Yet another article which says that no one can protest against the govt till they pass the self appointed test of govt chamchas, basically accessory to the dacoity which INC is carrying out on India.

Ack thoo on the article from me.

Yet another pathetic attempt to put the blame everywhere but at the real source.

Gus · Post by **Gus** » 06 Jan 2013 13:11

I can definitely see more police on the streets in Chennai. I also saw some patrol vehicles doing actual patrolling. Checkposts were all manned and today was a sunday to boot.

Sushupti · Post by **Sushupti** » 06 Jan 2013 15:21

A moral lesson

It appears that one may get to see many changes in Delhi after the gangrape of the 23-year-old. One change that is visible is in the UPA Government’s way of thinking. The Prime Minister’s Office (PMO) has directed the Ministry of Human Resource Development (HRD) to make moral education a must in schools.

It has taken the Government eight years to awaken and take a step in this direction. During the NDA regime the then HRD Minister Murli Manohar Joshi had made suggestions to schools to impart moral education, yoga, Vedic Math and astrology. But the Congress had been opposed to this idea at that time.

When the Congress came to power Arjun Singh became HRD Minister and spent five years of his tenure to push for Joshi’s agenda. The reason that the Congress gave for opposing the move was that it would only promote communal agenda.

But finally, the PMO has woken from its slumber and given instructions to promote morality in schools. Definitely, a right move.

http://dailypioneer.com/sunday-edition/ ... later.html

Sanjay · Post by **Sanjay** » 06 Jan 2013 19:27

Is there any problem with recruiting a large number of women SPOs specifically to deal with crimes against women and children (specifically harassment and molestation) this might enable a link between the police and public to emerge.

SriKumar · Post by **SriKumar** » 06 Jan 2013 19:45

^^^ Chaguanas, eh? I suppose you must have met the man, then? You can respond in nukkad, if needed.

Sushupti wrote:
A moral lessonThe Prime Minister’s Office (PMO) has directed the Ministry of Human Resource Development (HRD) to make moral education a must in schools. http://dailypioneer.com/sunday-edition/ ... later.html

Very interesting find, sushupti. A class on cultural or civic Morals for kids in schools.....? I had thought about this a bit but did not really expect it as a truly practical step because of the enormousness of the task. So, I am flabbergasted that the central govt. is even considering this step. IMHO, cultural instruction across the board, can be done formally, only in schools and that would require a fiat from the govt. This can get interesting......the attempt is to change a specific social behavior via a specific class. If the subject matter is aligned as a civics topic, it just might work.

I am wondering whether this will be for only Delhi schools, or across the nation. Will it be just for central board schools or state board schools also. Will it be a weekly-once class or more like a daily class (probably un-necessary). And lastly, the biggest demographic for gropers and eve-teasers (my personal prejudice showing here) is likely to be college-age students and older (17 to 55). What about them? But this factor should not dissuade the govt. from going ahead- kids currently 15 years, in 15 years, will be 30, and we might expect fewer rapes then. So, this is a long-term solution and something that is needed- in parallel with something in the immediate and near term. We cannot wait for 15 years and uncertain behavioral changes as rapes and gropes continue.

Determining the content of the syllabus can become controversial, if not handled correctly. We are familiar with the NCERT controversies......I am hoping that the GOI recognizes the gravity of the situation and keeps the syllabus strictly 'business' and not politicize it. I think it can be kept apolitical if this is done quickly i.e. in a few months time, when people are still in the state of outrage and in some fear of public opinion (especially among the politicians and the 'intellectual' chatterati in the TV media) and everyone knows the reason and purpose of the morals class. If this gets pushed out by one year, the outrage and attention dies, then anything can get into the syllabus. (OT but I used to have a 'moral science' class in my 4th and 5th class! The school board was ICSE, I think (was not CBSE). I still recall some parts of the class. There used to be a test and marks were given, just like any other subject we were taught).

Overall, if this news article is correct, I think it might be a step in the right direction, though one key factor, as always with any GOI initiative is, when will this project be executed. Setting up a commission of inquiry and waiting 5 years for a report (or even 1 year) is nothing more than delaying tactics by another name.

The author of the article 'Hari Shankar Vyas' supports it. Does anyone know his positions on cultural issues?

svinayak · Post by **svinayak** » 06 Jan 2013 21:28

Arjun wrote:

a) While this has no relevance to the subject matter of this thread - the separation of 'Christian values' and 'American values' where the latter is usually regarded as the more liberal parts derived from Christian underpinnings, is exactly the way to go as far as the relationship between 'Hindu values' and 'Indian / Indic values'. And the respect for these values from media in India should be the same as in the US.

These are all very recent after the civil rights act of 1964. Non of the liberal values are any american and they are a product of the cultural revolution. They may not stay as it is since there is large scale opposition to it from the hardline conservatives.
Economic value is built inside the American liberal/anti liberal debate.

chaanakya · Post by **chaanakya** » 06 Jan 2013 21:59

Sanjay wrote:Chaanakya, that incredibly helpful list at http://forums.bharat-rakshak.com/viewto ... e#p1387518 - I am sure you had a major role in its drafting (or sole role) - is it complete or is there more to it found elsewhere ?

Dear Sanyay

Did you notice the word Quote at the beginning. This is a document which will be used as roadmap in future for changes which of course will take time . Prepared by those who are concerned and should do that. Not by me though. just like Harbans started this thread and has been incredibly helpful in consolidating the thoughts despite some attempts to derail it.
And yes there is more to it but cant be revealed online. Hope you undertsand . Thanks.

chaanakya · Post by **chaanakya** » 06 Jan 2013 22:06

Sanjay wrote:Is there any problem with recruiting a large number of women SPOs specifically to deal with crimes against women and children (specifically harassment and molestation) this might enable a link between the police and public to emerge.

need to provide quota for them . 33% is being talked about. Right now it would be 1-5% in total police force.

krisna · Post by **krisna** » 06 Jan 2013 22:24

http://forums.bharat-rakshak.com/viewto ... 3#p1388633
posted under police brutality section in gdf.

Sachin wrote:
RamaY wrote:
It is a law and order issue and it is the responsibility of Delhi police to act.

I am not denying that. The Delhi Police should shape up. No doubts. But what has the society in Delhi done to force them to change their behaviour or improve their performance? If the citizens in a place decide to scoot away from certain issues, the police are also going to take the same route. After all what is their incentive on this? The victims would be most likely people who don't know about this.

There are 2 ways to go about--
1) top to bottom approach-- the law and order should be tight and make sure it works. This ensures the security and safety of citizens. This should be the rule.
2) bottom to top appraoch-- this is usually the last resort as has happened in Delhi. The citizens asking the authorities to do their act. This should be an exception.

Overall law and order should be the priority of the govt of the day. They should not expect that society does not want it or other nonsense and be complacent. This is pure incompetence.
yes law and oder personnels are made up of people from society no doubt about it.
Society is handicapped by thinking along individual perosnal/families etc hence the repsonse time is slow and may take years for all to spontaneously respond as in Delhi or the revolutions in the past.

law and order has all the details of the crimes done, there are lot of meetings done in the dept throughout year along with govt taking stock of the situation.

If the govt shirks the situation, one should not blame the society.

http://forums.bharat-rakshak.com/viewto ... 7#p1388637

^^^^
example-- as a hakim, my duty is to treat the patient to the best I can, if I cannot then I have to excuse myself from the case, ask my colleagues more competent to look after the patient.

Here one should not expect that patient should demand the hakim should treat the patient properly. This is not the right way.
Here also hakim are from the society itself and not from mars or jupiter.

By very nature of hakim, we are trained to deal with the patients. This is our duty and responsibility.

Similarly law and oder are trained for this specific purpose, this is their duty and responsibility.
No escaping from it.

Either the govt should make way for elections or shape up and give good governance.

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 06 Jan 2013 23:32

I watched the DP JCP claiming to have been prompt in the DP response to the rape victims. He looked very arrogant and could have sued a dose of humility considering that it almost brought the govt down.

harbans · Post by **harbans** » 07 Jan 2013 00:36

Chaanakya ji, folks here have covered up a lot of ground. Consolidating that info and categorizing it is in an organized manner is not an easy job. Objectivity in posting makes it easier to consolidate and categorize. We still have some way as the responses to the incident and others unfurl in the coming weeks.

What also must be observed is that those driven by agenda than the outrage will push their agenda as if that will automatically stop the outrage women face daily in our country. From women must be confined to homes to segregating girls and boys in schools, moral policing, banning alcohol, nightclubs type of narrow minded, impractical and nonsensical solutions will keep emerging. These deflect the blame from the elements within their very folds to making victims themselves guilty of crimes against them.

There are grey areas too that this thread has to tackle. That of juvenile crime and a centralized sex offender list and cell where info on offenders by category is made. Juveniles committing crimes and being released after a few years must be made public. The public for one has a right to know that a 30 year old in their society had spent 5 years in prison for sexual offenses as a juvenile. I doubt the present day Govt has any list of any sort on sex offenders released into the public. These lists must be made public too. All convicted sexual offenders must be publicly listed on the net till their death.

The age group 15-19 (not 18) must be made a little flexible on lower level sex convictions, but much harder on extreme cases where they must be treated on par with adults. So while our educational system focuses and tries to lower low level sexual misconduct, whereby we lower 15-19 sex offenses in
society, we show flexibility in systemic approach for lower level offense for this age group, yet simultaneously we pull out the hammer for higher category offense on par with applicable adult law in anything more.

This leniency and hammer must be out soon in weeks as law. That is the only way to convict this juvenile who will get away under the present set up for sure. And this guy will rape and murder again for sure. This is a very important piece of legislation that must be done up in the next few weeks itself.

harbans · Post by **harbans** » 07 Jan 2013 00:48

X Posting Varunkumar ji's excellent post from Burkha:

^^^ The main problem in Delhi is the lack of corporatization of public transport. The politicians don't allow reputed corproate groups to run taxis, autos and buses. They have a policy of giving permits to individual operators which have one or two buses each. This creates a gravy train. Most of these buses, taxis and autos are owned by politicians, police men and bureaucrats. It is crony capitalism where these people capture certain areas of the economy by making self-serving policies. In Delhi, most parking slot contracts go to MPs and MLAs and they charge double or triple of what is printed in the parking slip. Lot of cash is generated this way.

This is a mafia which has captured the transport system of every city in India. They are determined not to allow reputed private companies like Tatas to step in to manage the bus or taxi service. It is a business for them. As a result, drunk goons drive these buses. Fly-by-night operators are rampant. There is no structured employment with PF etc. for bus drivers who are paid on a daily basis and hired and fired at will.

The transport problems of Delhi can be easily solved by inviting corporates to manage the bus and taxi fleets, with trained drivers in uniform on proper payrolls and GPS-enabled vehicles. But this can be only over the dead body of these mafia men of the transport deptt,, police and MLAs. Delhi tried corporatization of taxis through radio taxis -- these are the safest mode of travel in the city today after the metro, with polished drivers, printed bills, proper training and uniforms, GPS monitoring, and complaint helplines.

As an example, I accidentally left my laptop behind in one of these taxis in the night. I called up the company, gave them the time and area in which the taxi dropped me, and in ten minutes the driver called me on my mobile to say he is coming to my house to hand over my laptop. I paid him the fare for the journey and tipped him Rs 100 extra, and the guy just drove away with a polite thank you. This is the difference between corporatization and giving individual permits to random operators.

It is just now that we are seeing radio taxi's and some elements of bringing this into an organized kind of set up emerge. Bringing services into organized,audited frameworks helps in increased safety. Still this is going to be opposed by vested groups that remain enamored of the license, permit raj system.

Got Varuns full post in quotes ..

saip · Post by **saip** » 07 Jan 2013 00:51

Why dont these folks go to Pakistan or Saudia and stay there? Atleast they did not say abolish girls schools and make girl stay at home. Idiots

Abolish co-education: Jamaat-e-Islami Hind's solution to rape

krisna · Post by **krisna** » 07 Jan 2013 02:18

http://news.oneindia.in/2009/06/06/acid ... fosys.html

How the fear of law and order can create peace. Criminals are kept in abeyance. Justice delivered quickly.
In warangal, AP 3 persons were killed by police action. the 3 criminals had poured acid on 2 college girls. one girl sadly died, other survived.
The police confronted them, but the suspects had weapons and ?fired them. in retaliation all the suspects died in 2008 december.
There was also people support to the police.
Since then there is no reported acid attack in AP for the last 4 years.

SaiK · Post by **SaiK** » 07 Jan 2013 03:16

I suggest all indic men & wimmen to carry a pocket knife (well: advanced kirpan) for safety. Call it a new age religion to tackle the evil forces out there in public. When it comes to force, only an equivalent force and deny and defy the evil forces.

Take this as the step to avoiding a gun culture in the future... call it slash culture. Now, people can divert off and argue about the counter evil thoughts here.. but given a situation, only a sharp object can remove a thorn in one's feet. We need tools and equipment to keep ourselves safe in the public.

Stun guns are the next step., and nice to have. multi purpose that is housed in a torch light or an umbrella is excellent to have. Such designs should come up in the market place, and people should buy it for safety.

Distress button services are required on all cell phones. a one button held for 3-5 seconds should send distress signal with GPS coordinates.

Educational awareness of these is also important.. every one should feel safe and the same time attackers need to know, that everyone is armed to the core.

Theo_Fidel · Post by **Theo_Fidel** » 07 Jan 2013 03:29

What, no rape whistle?

---------------------------------------------

Chanakya,

Justice must be done. But justice must also be seen to be done. Every aspect of this crime must be recreated and validated. If I were the defense attorney the timeline inconsistency between the GPS and the friends announced timeline would easily allow one the discredit and throw doubt on the case. The truth of what happened must be demonstrated for all to see. Lets see if prosecution is up to it.

SaiK · Post by **SaiK** » 07 Jan 2013 03:36

The only truth they can demonstrate is the girl is raped and killed by those men. Truthfully, they are guilty as charged, and when none is around in the vicinity, and no video tapes or CCTV is available, what kind of truth are you expecting?

Even if couple of guys from the gang, who are closer in ranks and chelas with cops and babooze, would be the ones with lesser truth than the rest of the rapist and murderers.

Forensic science should help get the semen and dna analysis reports matching all those rapes. Finger prints can help too, but one can't really prove that this is the rod they used or that exactly[perhaps they can depending on type of analysis]. But, none can defy a truth in the stupid legal framework, that denies punishment to rapists and murders... this is the sadest part of Indian democratic setup.

eklavya · Post by **eklavya** » 07 Jan 2013 03:44

Interesting read:

India finally speaks about sexual violence

In a country where an unborn girl faces the threat of annihilation, why did the tragedy of one woman resonate so deeply? The answer, I suspect, has a lot to do with the multiple empowerments under way in India: of women, of youth, of the middle class. This was visible in the village where a Jat girl, a schoolmate of the victim, shared information on the rape accused by men from her own community, choosing sisterhood over caste.

Until it was cut short, even the life of the anonymous 23-year-old woman contained the same kernel of promise: she was bright enough to inspire her father to sell his small parcel of land in the village to fund her college education.

Even the most cynical of urban, affluent Indians could not look away. India’s urban middle class is notoriously apathetic. It safeguards its hard-earned prosperity by cocooning itself from the country’s daily cruelties. It can be berated for not caring about sexual violence in the conflict zones of Kashmir and Chhattisgarh, but as the recent events show it has at least begun to care about what happens in its cities.

Would this new restlessness of the middle class go beyond expressions of outrage and pose a deeper, more sustained challenge to the detritus of Indian politics? Would the young find the courage to question misogyny in their own families?

The day the 23-year-old woman passed away, thousands turned up to light a candle in her memory. An old man quietly held up a banner that said, “This is the first time I have felt hopeful in a long time.”

Sanjay · Post by **Sanjay** » 07 Jan 2013 05:20

chaanakya wrote:
Sanjay wrote:Is there any problem with recruiting a large number of women SPOs specifically to deal with crimes against women and children (specifically harassment and molestation) this might enable a link between the police and public to emerge.
need to provide quota for them . 33% is being talked about. Right now it would be 1-5% in total police force.

That's the regular force. I am talking about a supplemental force. Part-timers more to establish a presence with some authority. India uses SPOs all the time - against the Maoists, J&K etc.

Kind of a civilian protection force.

krisna · Post by **krisna** » 07 Jan 2013 05:55

Thane students device 'robotic sandal' for women to tackle crimes

Thane: In the backdrop of rising cases of crime against women, four Thane students have come up with a 'Robotic sandal' for the rescue of women in distress. Four students of class VII and IX have made a ladies sandal by fitting certain devices at the bottom of the normal footwear used by women. The device consists of a metallic rivet having a voltage of 5V.

While displaying the 'robotic sandal' before media on Saturday, the children showed that in time of distress, if the sandal is hit twice on the ground, it gets activated, triggering a wireless alarm connected to the instrument, which can be ideally kept in a bag or purse. The moment the alarm is set off, the device sends alert SMSes to already specified numbers and the location of the woman in distress can easily be detected.

Also, it was claimed that if a woman hits the assaulter with the sandal, it gives a shock to him as the rivet is activated. The gadget first came to limelight during a competition held in Thane in December 2012 where children had to showcase the scientific gadgets made by them.

Tested by about half-a-dozen women, this sandal costs Rs 2,000, he said, adding that it is not being commercially produced.

good one as every women usually uses footwear to go outside.
cost can come down if volumes increase.

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 07 Jan 2013 06:05

RajaBose is this feasible or enthusiastic ware?

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 07 Jan 2013 06:07

Lilo, How does your data compare with this map from IBN?

http://ibnlive.in.com/news/rape-map-of- ... 62-53.html

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 07 Jan 2013 06:16

Even women cops are not safe in Delhi:
http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/city ... 919077.cms

shiv · Post by **shiv** » 07 Jan 2013 06:31

Sanjay wrote:Is there any problem with recruiting a large number of women SPOs specifically to deal with crimes against women and children (specifically harassment and molestation) this might enable a link between the police and public to emerge.

Sanjay I have some empirical observations. Recruitment is easy, but manning stations has to be 24x7. That means fit women police personnel have to work in shifts of say 8 AM to 4 PM. 4 PM to 8 PM 8 PM to 8 AM etc to make it safest for these women to go home by public transport. If the hours are changes it gets worse with women having to come and go at odd hours when there are more drunks and fewer decent citizens on the road.

The security of women police personnel itself is at risk IMO. Women police cannot simply be armed because the people who attack them will be rich and well connected and a woman police constable who hits one such rapist will have her life screwed up forever by interference of the rich and powerful.

State politicians DO NOT want police reforms They DO NOT want to lose control over the police

member_23651 · Post by **member_23651** » 07 Jan 2013 06:52

shiv wrote:State politicians DO NOT want police reforms They DO NOT want to lose control over the police

Agree Sir, and no amount Candle Light marches is going to make politicos enact these police reforms, a dhimmi police is what allows politicos cling to their seat.

shiv · Post by **shiv** » 07 Jan 2013 09:41

Beleive it or not. From 2010
http://newsblaze.com/story/201011030755 ... story.html

But cited records of horrific consequences like abuse and murders of police women alarms the public recently.The risk of discharging their duties at odd hours surrounded by foul mouthed and drunk colleagues is high. Sexual harassment is inevitable especially in a working environment where men dominate.

One record of gruesome murder is that of one young female constable who obtained five stabs on her body, three on the neck and one on each breast. There were two gaping cuts on her head. Her fingers were chopped off and a bunch of hair was yanked out of her scalp. It was indeed the most brutal murder.Two policemen had raped and killed young constable Maya Yadav, 22, in a police guesthouse room at the Chechat police station in Kota district.

also from same source

Sexual harassment of women constables at the workplace is increasing in the same proportion as their numbers in the force. Today, women constitute 5.6 per cent of Rajasthan's constabulary and this change has largely come about because of 30 per cent reservation for women in the recruitment of constables. Eventually women are expected to make up 30 per cent of the constabulary. This of course is a positive trend. The 'Safe Cities For Women & Girls' campaign's Bogota Declaration specifically called for and increase in the number of police officers, especially to attend to cases of violence against women and girls. The 'Safe Cities For Women & Girls' is an international campaign which is in work tandem with Jagori, a national women's resource centre, in India.

Police officers admit that the sexual harassment of women constables does occur but most cases don't get reported.When women discuss it with their colleagues, they are advised to keep quiet and be more careful in future.

A woman constable has to perform all the duties that her male colleagues do. Every SHO wants at least 50 per cent of police station staff to be on call so they insist on these women staying at the station's premises. It is for this reason that women's rest rooms are now being constructed at police stations for women constables.

Today, out of the 711 police stations in the state, about 350 already have rest rooms for women. But Singh admits that there's a lot that still needs to be done to create a more enabling environment for women in the force.

Sanku · Post by **Sanku** » 07 Jan 2013 13:51

On that note --

What has Sonia Maino's whose heart bled for the victim done about this

http://incredibleorissa.com/en/woman-co ... upporters/

Female cop caned kicked

The “Call for Change” campaign of Odisha Pradesh Congress Committee (OPCC) turned violent on Thursday as the police went after the party activists who attempted to gherao the State Assembly, leaving many, from both sides, injured here on Thursday.

http://www.indianexpress.com/news/oriss ... ole/999648

Senior police officials said it was pre-planned violence as the Congress workers had come armed with stones and bamboo poles. “The crowd seems to have reacted after Tytler egged them on with words like ‘todo, todo’ and ‘what have you come here for’,” said a police official.

Remember Tytler is the same goon who is being tried as being responsible for death, rape and murder of many Sikhs in 1984.

svinayak · Post by **svinayak** » 07 Jan 2013 15:16

Anderson Cooper in CNN has the show for monday at 8PM on the Rape case and international outrage

Check if he mentions rape in US and other places.
Big propaganda is being started when they have ignored the rape cases in media in other countries

vishvak · Post by **vishvak** » 07 Jan 2013 18:05

At the same time allows for selling products related to personal security. Hopefully such products are sold in good quantity in USA regardless of sorry state of law and order in USA.

rkirankr · Post by **rkirankr** » 07 Jan 2013 18:27

Well well media made to eat crow

Sagarika Ghose ‏@sagarikaghose
In fact Bhagwatji was referring to marriages as contracts. Very sorry to Bhagwatji for presuming that his statements were insulting to women

Retweeted by Kanchan Gupta

rkirankr · Post by **rkirankr** » 07 Jan 2013 18:29

Some others rubbing it in

Ornab Goswami ‏@justicearnab
This is why i advice ladies not to drink OLD MONK in night.. https://twitter.com/sagarikaghose/statu ... 9398883328 …

vishvak · Post by **vishvak** » 07 Jan 2013 18:47

A march was organized in Hydrabad also, at midnight. link.

Bade · Post by **Bade** » 07 Jan 2013 23:50

Better late than never.

"We are planning to start it in Delhi. Photographs, names and addresses of the rapists will be uploaded on Delhi Police website also," he said in New Delhi on Thursday. Singh said that subsequently the plan will cover all states and Union Territories and websites of state police forces will carry photographs, names and addresses of the rape convicts.

http://ibnlive.in.com/news/government-t ... 650-3.html

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 07 Jan 2013 23:59

Coupled with above database reform of juvenile act is needed:

SaiK wrote:
timesofindia.indiatimes.com/india/Of-all-juvenile-crimes-64-by-16-18-yr-olds/articleshow/17907886.cms Across the country, Madhya Pradesh, Maharashtra , Chhattisgarh, Andhra Pradesh, Rajasthan and Gujarat accounted for close to 70% of all juvenile crimes registered in 2011. Madhya Pradesh led the pack in rape cases with 271 cases, followed UP (146) and Maharshtra (125). Delhi recorded 47 cases of rapes by juveniles. All together make for over 50% of all rape cases by juveniles.
60-70% of juvenile criminals are aged 16-18.

Enough data to consider them as adults.

svinayak · Post by **svinayak** » 08 Jan 2013 00:06

Acharya wrote:Anderson Cooper in CNN has the show for monday at 8PM on the Rape case and international outrage

Check if he mentions rape in US and other places.
Big propaganda is being started when they have ignored the rape cases in media in other countries

Lookout for propaganda style coverage in CNN
Check if there is any group behind this coverage

Bade · Post by **Bade** » 08 Jan 2013 00:09

^^^ I thought I saw an IE article a few days back, which mentioned relaxing the juvenile age too.

I recall Harbans made a detailed post on having the flexibility to prosecute juveniles based on the brutality of the crime committed.

There was an article which mentioned another juvenile who raped and killed a 6 yr old in Delhi brutally and chopped the body and disposed off in a public toilet did not get the extreme treatment by the law recently.

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 08 Jan 2013 05:01

Its the NOIDA case. Soem policemen have been suspended also.

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 08 Jan 2013 06:43

RamaY, Re-read the first chapter of Mesquita's Predictioneer's game and draw parallels.

MurthyB · Post by **MurthyB** » 08 Jan 2013 08:18

Some random thoughts on the horrible Delhi rape episode (since the other thread is locked).

1) In most societies, men are honor-bound to protect their women. Even in the Colorado shooting last year, 3 men died protecting their girlfriends by literally taking the bullet for them. In all three cases it appeared that the women they saved had better jobs and higher pay. Paradoxically, this desire to protect is also what makes men do horrible things to women as a way of humiliating their men. In cases of war, rape is used as a weapon it seems, more to humiliate and emasculate the males on the other side. Given a choice between assaulted and killed (but the womenfolk left unharmed), versus assaulted but rendered impotent while their womefolk are tortured and raped while the men folk are forced to watch, there is no doubt all men would choose the former, and the latter would be considered the most horrific a thing to endure. This is why the choicest insults also involve cursing the female relations. So all that leads to the question of whether this rape would have occurred if there were two-three women in a group, instead of a girl and a boy.

2) It is not clear what happened before the ugly incident. There was an altercation, triggered no doubt by the louts. How did the couple respond to this, especially the male? There is a huge class difference in India. The rapists are slum dwellers. The couple were coming out of an upscale mall having watched "life of Pi', which even in the US is a movie of high culture. The class difference in India has previously enabled the upper classes to interact with lower classes in ways that can only be considered rude and arrogant. Certainly, in the US, there is a healthy fear of low class bums of the sort on may find in a subway; you certainly wouldn't want to pick a fight with them. My feeling is that sense of fear of lower classes has not been there among the upper classes in India generally. So when the altercation and harassment began, I wonder how the couple reacted to this. Did they react with fear and thought of ways of escape, or did they think they could take these louts on and show them their place? None of it excuses what happened, and certainly they should be hanged. But it seems to me that it is not just a case of "disrespecting women" as it is made out. Ironically, if men had no sense of honor for protecting women at all, and women were just seen as a weaker, lesser being, it is not clear whether rape as a power play would be used by psychopaths as often.