West Asia News and Discussions

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vishvak
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Re: West Asia News and Discussions

Post by vishvak »

from How terror funds are pumped in from Saudi

http://www.rediff.com/news/special/how- ... 110811.htm
Salar only reiterates what had been said in one of the cables released by Wikileaks. The cable had also stated that Saudi Arabia is a major hub for terror financing and the funds that are generated from there go straight into the hands of the Lashkar-e-Tayiba [ Images ] and Al Qaeda [ Images ].

According to sources in the Intelligence Bureau, curbing financing from Saudi for terror activities is going to be extremely tough.

"However, that is not the case when it comes to Saudi Arabia. There are a large number of people who share the ideology of terror groups and feel that it is their responsibility to support their people in such a war. Issues such as Kashmir [ Images ], Babri Masjid [ Images ] and also Godhra continue to stir up emotions and people are more than willing to part with money to fund terror activities in India," the sources add.

Sources in IB also say that they can name at least 40 different charitable organisations that are set up in various parts of Saudi Arabia whose primary job is to raise money for funding terror in India.

The links to Saudi Arabia became extremely clear when the police tracked a hawala transaction of $10,000 (about Rs 4,60,000) which was used to carry out the July 11, 2006 serial train blasts in Mumbai [ Images ] that killed 209 people.

Security agencies say that there is a need for the Saudi government to monitor such activities more closely. Prime Minister Manmohan Singh [ Images ] had also addressed the same concern during his previous visit to that country.

In addition to this what the police have found in Kerala is that the terror operatives are making the job even tougher. Money is directly wired into the state and is not picked up by a member of a terror outfit.

Instead there are some financers who pick up this money and keep it in circulation by lending it at huge rates of interest. These transactions then do not look fishy which makes the job of police difficult.

Sources in the IB say that this pattern is being used in the other states as well.
In other words, not only Saudi individuals are directly financing terror in guise of charity, but also making it tougher for police by making it look legitimate & not fishy, in many states of India.
brihaspati
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Re: West Asia News and Discussions

Post by brihaspati »

ldev wrote:
brihaspati wrote:
Sure. The refineries would be protected. How does it alter the matrix? As follows:
(1) the investments yield profits which partially backflows into jihadi channels, which in turn support terror on India
I had totally missed out your response. Here goes.

At 10 million barrels of oil a day at say $115 per barrel (based on Brent pricing) , the Saudis alone are grossing over $400 billion per annum. You seriously think the profits from their stake in 2 refineries in India is going to make any difference to terror funding. Big question ofcourse is does the Saudi state provide state funding to terrorist activities against India? Do you have any proof of that, any links you can provde? Private Saudi citizens donate zakat part of which is certainly leaking for terror funding.
There have been many posts on this forum as to how extensions of the royal family, co-related business and financial fronts, and saudi protection and patronage of theologians who are directly for jihad - directly and indirectly help terror on India.
(2) however terror happens on the aam, and not the big shareholders of the refineries, or the GOI which gets corporate income which it can splurge on giving X^N protection to its functionary pyramid or try to buy votes through dynastically named pseudo-charities from which again party functionaries can extract a further cut at the distribution level. So yes the refineries remain protected.
Why this diatribe? This is India. No point in fulminating against Indian institutional problems in this thread.
This is not about any institutional problem. You may need to twist the real argument into another channel - but this is about attitude of a certain establishment, a nexus between mercantile interests and a class of political interests with a particular ideological soft spot for Gulf sourced islamism. If the same financial flow was coming from a non-Christian or non-Muslim entity - all these institutional problems would vanish.
(3) as with the US, and the non-action by successive US gov's on Saudi covert terror supporting ops because of Saudi investments in USA, and possible direct but perfectly legitimate investments into political leadership which of course did not prevent a 9/11 - such investments will be a similar incentive for successive regimes at New Delhi not to take action against Saudis for their supportive role in perpetrating Islamist terror on aam Indians.
You appear to have no faith in India or Indians, that the country will learn from mistakes commited by others such as the US and guard against similar mistakes by increasing security and vetting.
You appear to have this overwhelming need to paint the regime, its functional rashtryia apparatus and functionaries as part of a homogenous single India and "Indians". I have faith in Indians - but not the persistent dominant ruling interests of India, which has repeatedly shown its viciousness against any funding sources funding terror if and only if that funding source is not related to Islam or Christianity.
(4) Saudi sourced investments will spread around to social-work in the form of further Madrassah scents. Because Saudis have invested, already unchallengeable and uncriticiz-able mullahcracy can be even less challenged or criticized.
Refer again to point 1. With existing revenues of $400 billion plus, will 2 more refineries make any difference in terms of their income assuming they are going to use them for terror funding. Its like saying that a multi billionaire is going to use his next 2 million to buy dal chawal .
Every such venture is linked to a thousand and one local connections and excuses for monetary flow. Even more than the Saudis, it will be the regime related forces which will use the presence of the refineries as reasons to give more and more concessions to mullahcracy. We have already seen the trend in even when talk of "warming up" between Sauds and Congrez start up - hardcore, Saudi regime linked theologians who have fulminated against India in the past - are warmly taken into the regime's heart and allowed free voice and addressing Islamic crowds. The investments will be iconic tools to justify more such freedoms and greater claim of Arab peninsular theologians over Indian muslims.
(5) A minuscule percentage of Indian populations will get a cut from processing the investment flows, and who will promptly invest that in gold and off-shore banks, and take out a dhamaaka star-nite on how Gulf investments will provide in the unknown future gazillions of jobs and prosperity and growth.
Dhamaka star-nite is enjoyed by many Indians. If they do not enjoy this dhamaka they will not buy tickets. Who am I or you to say whether there should or should not be dhamaka? If you do like dhamaka star nite, do not buy tickets.
I have no objection to dhamaka star nites. In this case, as you deliberately chosen to ignore the irony - it is a reference to the loud shrill cries like yours and others along your line that champion such investments.
You are right. The refineries are worth protecting. They will be protected. s*** happens. What's the big deal? Any non Z^N security and non-financial-processor Indian life is worth even less than s***. A refinery holding potential billions for all the Z^N categories and the financial-flow-processors is gazillions worthier than that aaam s**** life.
Do you think that absent these refineries India will suddenly become a egalitarian society and abolish all its ills?
Again, I think you deliberately side-step the main point. It is not about non-egalitarianism. It is about providing more resources and more excuses to allow foreign imperialist and hostile ideologies greater leeway - in return for personal protection and a cut of the profits.

For you - since inequality and criminal abuse of position and entrenched rashtryia nexus already exists, how does it matter if some more cover and resources is added to it. This is the attitude and mentality of the regime in power - which you illustrate in your post nicely as an exemplar. Thanks for it.
RamaY
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Re: West Asia News and Discussions

Post by RamaY »

ldev wrote: Nobody cares about any other country. One should get over entitlement issues about other countries caring for India or India caring for other countries. Its not a family relationship. As I said in my earlier post, its about selective commonality of interests - a long term customer relationship for long term energy security. Nothing more.
You are jumping all over the place Idevji. Why this much hungaama if it is just a trade relationship? Do we have a separate thread for Reliance's relationships with its suppliers? How are they managing that relationship without the INC party, GCC benevolent relationship, Al-Qaida, Mossad, Mecca Masjid and so on?

If the relationship is not strategic (we defined it already) then it is just a trade relationship at the best. All the parties know what they want and the payment is made in one (or very few) specific format (currency?).

The second point is who rules customer-seller relationship. This thread is hijacked to show that (1) India is at the mercy of the sellers when it comes to buying it's needs, and (2) India is at the mercy of the customers when it comes to selling its produce. This world-view is built on prejudice and dhimmitute to put it mildly. It shows the fact that India is not sure of its comparitive advantage and cannot demand right price for its trade, on both sides of the bargain. At the same time this thread wants to sell this old wine, in the new bottle of India being an emerging power. What an oxymoron - an emerging world power without any self-awareness.

The third point is that the West-Asia countries are projected as benevolent rules which are constrained by local realities (it becomes a centuries long TRADITION if it is Christian or Islamic in nature, but becomes a social-ill when it comes to Hindu culture). We are asked to adjust our world views in the following way

1. The interests of GCC are Indian interests
2. Our energy needs make us a slave of GCC
3. We must not look for other energy sources such as IRAN, but rely on GCC only
4. Whatever GCC does is good for India.
5. Our 5+ million expats in ME are hostage in GCC hands, because GCC can kick them out if we don't play ball, hurting ~$50b/yr remittances. But at the same time we are told that these expats have unlimited social, cultural, political and religious freedoms.
6. The rulers of GCC have no/little control over the religious and jihadi forces that are hurting Indian interests. But somehow they are very much an extension of GCC foreign policy in Syria, Iran etc.,
...
svinayak
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Re: West Asia News and Discussions

Post by svinayak »

India has to define how the transaction happens and what are the agreements
Austin
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Re: West Asia News and Discussions

Post by Austin »

Free Syrian Army Drops Annan's Peace Plan – Al Jazeera
An opposition Free Syrian Army (FSA) said on Saturday it would not adhere to the peace plan, brokered by the UN and Arab League envoy Kofi Annan, unless the UN Security Council ensures safety for civilians, Al Jazeera reported.

"We announce that unless the UN Security Council takes urgent steps for the protection of civilians, Annan's plan is going to go to hell," Al Jazeera cited the FSA’s statement.

The statement comes the next day after the deadliest act of violence in Houla, a town in Homs province, where over 90 people were reported to be killed by the pro-government forces.


"Some of the victims were hit by heavy artillery while others, entire families, were massacred," Al Jazeera quoted the Syrian National Council's head of foreign relations, Bassma Kodmani as saying.

The city was shelled by the troops loyal to the Syrian President Bashar Al-Assad during the anti-government rally, the UK-based Syrian Observatory for Human Rights reported.

The state-run SANA news agency however said that it was al-Qaeda-linked militant group that was behind the attack on Houla.

British Foreign Secretary William Hague condemned the massacre on Saturday, saying that it was necessary "to move swiftly to ensure that those responsible are identified and held to account."

Syria's UN mission chief, General Robert Mood called the Friday's killings "brutal tragedy" that could “create more instability, more unpredictability and may lead country to civil war.”

Houla’s slaughter came as the UN Secretary General Ban Ki-moon said in a report to the Security Council that the situation in Syria “remains extremely serious” and UN efforts to end the political crisis in the country have seen only “small progress.”

Although the scale of violence has decreased compared to the period before April 12, when U.N.-Arab League envoy Kofi Annan six-point plan was implemented in the country, “the Syrian army has not ceased the use of, or pulled back their heavy weapons in many areas,” Ban said on Friday.

According to unconfirmed reports by Syrian activists, more than 12,600 people have been killed in Syria since a revolt against Assad’s regime started in March last year. The U.N. says up to 10,000 have been killed.
Austin
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Re: West Asia News and Discussions

Post by Austin »

Both parties guilty in Houla massacre – Lavrov
Russian foreign minister Sergey Lavrov said some political players are undermining the UN-brokered ceasefire in Syria. He also said both opposition groups and regime troops “had a hand” in the Houla massacre.

“It is clear that both sides had a hand in the Houla incident that left civilians dead, including women and children,” he said following bilateral talks with his English counterpart William Hague.

He went on to state that artillery and tank shells were found in Houla and that many of the bodies showed evidence of a violent death, including some that had been shot in the head at close-range.

He said that the area was controlled by militants but there was a strong presence of government troops there.

William Hague accepted that while the Assad regime bears the brunt of the blame for violence in the country, it is not wholly responsible. Previously he had stated there were “credible and horrific reports that a large number of civilians have been massacred at the hands of Syrian forces in the town of Houla.”

During the press conference with UK minister William Hague, Lavrov stated that talk of the removal of Assad’s regime threatens the implementation of the UN peace plan. He expressed “deep concern” that the UN-Arab League initiative “is being fulfilled unsatisfactorily,” but emphasized regime change was not the answer.

“When some countries, particularly those closest to Syria suggest the only solution to the conflict is regime change, it makes me doubt their commitment to the ceasefire,” said Lavrov.

William Hague said if the UN peace plan is not upheld, the only alternative for Syria will be civil war.

He went on to say that pressure should be put on the regime and the Syrian opposition to comply with Kofi Annan’s six-point peace plan.

“We are not concerned with who is in power in Syria, our current aim is to bring an end to the violence and loss of life… everything else is secondary,” stressed Lavrov.

William Hague said that Russia and the UK would ratchet up their efforts to ensure Assad complies with the peace plan.

"The Annan plan is the best hope for Syria, at the moment the only hope for Syria, to try and break the cycle of violence,” said Hague.

However, in order for negotiations to progress Hague stated “there needs to be a fundamental change in the approach of the Assad regime if Syria is to be saved from ever greater chaos and disorder."

The UN Security Council issued a statement on Sunday condemning the massacre in the Damascus suburb of Houla, but did not lay the blame the feet of the regime or the opposition. The emergency meeting was called by Russia.

The Syrian government has categorically denied that government troops were involved in the Houla massacre and has laid the blame at the feet of terrorist groups operating in the area.
Philip
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Re: West Asia News and Discussions

Post by Philip »

The attitude of certain western nations who desperately want regime change in Syria,"at any cost",is why the carnage is taking place.The so-called Free Syrian Army,supported by outside forces,is refusing to toe the Annan peace plan and civil war is what is about to happen unless some miracle takes place.Syria is also going to see an opposition of policy between Russia and NATO/US that will resemble former Cold War proxy wars.The name of the game today is to create massacres,situations so dark that absolute chaos rules and the outsiders can use this bloodshed (which they helped create) to enter into the conflict as was done in Libya.Whiel NATO,etc.,condemn Syria for the killings,they are unconcerned at the latest civilian deaths caused by their drone strikes in Af-Pak! The ultimate hypocrisy .

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldne ... sacre.html

Syria plunges towards civil war after Houla massacre
Violence sweeps Syria as scores more troops and civilians die and Assad regime intensifies attack on opposition.
By Richard Spencer, and Ruth Sherlock in Beirut
28 May 2012

Kofi Annan, the UN-Arab League envoy to Syria, arrived in the capital Damascus following Friday's massacre in Houla in which 108 people – including 49 children and 34 women – were killed.

He called on "every individual with a gun" to lay down their arms before Syria collapsed into full-scale civil war.

But his words went apparently unheeded as scores more civilians and regime troops lost their lives, with fresh clashes erupting all over the country between two sides that were supposed to have agreed a ceasefire six weeks ago.

At least 36 people were said to have been killed, with fighting everywhere from Idlib, to Dera'a to Damascus. Another 30 people died overnight on Sunday as regime troops shelled residential areas of Hama in retaliation for attacks by the Free Syrian Army. Rebels said there was open discussion of retaliatory attacks against regime forces and minority Alawite villages in revenge for Houla, while the country's main opposition group said its fighters should "be prepared to liberate Syria from the hands of Assad's gangs".

The danger of the outside world being dragged into a protracted and bloody struggle was highlighted when an Iranian general confirmed for the first time, in an interview with a state news agency subsequently withdrawn from its website, that Iran had sent its own forces to Syria.
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28 May 2012

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28 May 2012

Syria: both sides to blame for massacre, says Russia
28 May 2012

Massacred Syrian children were 'bound before being shot'
28 May 2012

Kofi Annan in last ditch effort to save Syria peace plan
28 May 2012

William Hague: Kofi Annan's plan is still 'only hope' for Syria
28 May 2012

"If the Islamic republic was not present in Syria, the massacre of people would have happened on a much larger scale." Ismail Gha'ani, the deputy head of the Revolutionary Guard's Quds force, was quoted as saying.

The last two weeks have seen a clear escalation in violence, which had lessened but never disappeared with the start of the ceasefire brokered by Mr Annan on April 12. Regime forces have attacked a number of towns where rebels used the lull in fighting to re-establish control, but they are now responding to attacks with indiscriminate force.

At least 30 people died on Sunday afternoon and Monday morning as regime troops shelled residential areas of the city of Hama, north of Houla, into which FSA troops had fled after attacking government check-points.

Video footage showed rooms filled with casualties. The mutilated bodies of men, women and children lay on blood-stained floors, some dead, some still alive, as doctors looked on helplessly. "They can only do basic first aid and try to stop the bleeding. There is almost no equipment, or medicines," said an activist calling himself Abu Adnan al-Hamwi.

The Syrian regime has denied responsibility for the Houla massacre, blaming Islamist militants in a letter to the UN Security Council last night. But UN observers described wounds compatible only with heavy artillery and tank fire available only to regime forces.

Others died at close quarters, by gunfire and, it is alleged, by knife wounds - killed afterwards, survivors said, by "Shabiha" militia from neighbouring villages inhabited by Alawites, member of the minority sect to which the Assad family belongs.

"People were so angry, so shocked. Some started to say why don't we attack a whole Alawite village?" Yasser al-Homsi, a local activist said. "We believe the Shabiha do not have any morals or any religious ethics."

Mr Annan, who met Syria's foreign minister, Walid Muallem, in Damascus, said he was "shocked and horrified" by events in Houla. "I urge the government to take bold steps to signal that it is serious in its intention to resolve this crisis peacefully, and for everyone involved to help create the right context for a credible political process," he said. "And this message of peace is not only for the government, but for everyone with a gun."

Video of one group of the 49 children killed suggested some of them had been tied up beforehand. Their wrists were bound with blue ties, a common substitute for handcuffs. Although it was not possible to verify whether this had been done before or after death, the Syrian Network for Human Rights cited a witness saying the militia was punishing the father of some of the children.

"One eye witness, who is a lady in her late 50s from Houla, confirmed that the Shabiha handcuffed the children of Abbara family, and told the father to look at their children, how they will be killed in front of his eyes before they killed him," a spokesman said.

Activists say that the majority of the 108 people who died lived in eight houses belonging to an extended family called Abdulrazzaq, to whom the Abbaras were related by marriage.

Human Rights Watch said it had interviewed one 10-year-old boy from the Abdulrazzaq family who survived by hiding in a barn.

“Across the street I saw my friend Shafiq, 13 years old, outside standing alone,” he said. “An armed man in military uniform grabbed him and put him at the corner of a house. He took his own weapon and shot him in the head.

“His mother and big sister — I think she was 14 years old — went outside and started shouting and crying. The same man shot at both of them more than once.”

Syria’s main opposition coalition called last night for countries that support the anti-regime uprising to honour their promises by helping Syrians defend themselves.

“The Syrian National Council calls (on) brothers and friends of the Syrian people to help before it’s too late,” the exiled group said.
Philip
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Re: West Asia News and Discussions

Post by Philip »

BBC lies yet again!

The British Bullsh*t Corporation,infamous for using Chechen war footage as events in J&K are at it again.Leopards do not their spots change! Further damage to its credibility has now come with Iraq footage being used as if it were the carnage in Syria! 'Lies and damn lies...'!

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/culture/tvan ... sacre.html

BBC News uses 'Iraq photo to illustrate Syrian massacre'
The BBC is facing criticism after it accidentally used a picture taken in Iraq in 2003 to illustrate the senseless massacre of children in Syria.
The photograph was actually taken by Marco di Lauro in Iraq in 2003

By Hannah Furness

27 May 2012

Photographer Marco di Lauro said he nearly “fell off his chair” when he saw the image being used, and said he was “astonished” at the failure of the corporation to check their sources.

The picture, which was actually taken on March 27, 2003, shows a young Iraqi child jumping over dozens of white body bags containing skeletons found in a desert south of Baghdad.

It was posted on the BBC news website today under the heading “Syria massacre in Houla condemned as outrage grows”.

The caption states the photograph was provided by an activist and cannot be independently verified, but says it is “believed to show the bodies of children in Houla awaiting burial”.

A BBC spokesman said the image has now been taken down.
Related Articles

Russia refuses to change its stance on Syria
28 May 2012

Mr di Lauro, who works for Getty Images picture agency and has been published by newspapers across the US and Europe, said: “I went home at 3am and I opened the BBC page which had a front page story about what happened in Syria and I almost felt off from my chair.

“One of my pictures from Iraq was used by the BBC web site as a front page illustration claiming that those were the bodies of yesterday's massacre in Syria and that the picture was sent by an activist.

“Instead the picture was taken by me and it's on my web site, on the feature section regarding a story I did In Iraq during the war called Iraq, the aftermath of Saddam.

“What I am really astonished by is that a news organization like the BBC doesn't check the sources and it's willing to publish any picture sent it by anyone: activist, citizen journalist or whatever. That's all.

He added he was less concerned about an apology or the use of image without consent, adding: “What is amazing it's that a news organization has a picture proving a massacre that happened yesterday in Syria and instead it's a picture that was taken in 2003 of a totally different massacre.

“Someone is using someone else's picture for propaganda on purpose.”

A spokesman for the BBC said: “We were aware of this image being widely circulated on the internet in the early hours of this morning following the most recent atrocities in Syria.

“We used it with a clear disclaimer saying it could not be independently verified.

“Efforts were made overnight to track down the original source of the image and when it was established the picture was inaccurate we removed it immediately.”
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Re: West Asia News and Discussions

Post by anmol »

abhischekcc
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Re: West Asia News and Discussions

Post by abhischekcc »

That image is bullshit. Why would a child be playing among corpses? It is clearly propaganda.
KLNMurthy
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Re: West Asia News and Discussions

Post by KLNMurthy »

"what difference does it make?" or differential analysis is something often seen from Indian analysts when shooting down national interest related concerns that are raised about things like GCC refinery deals etc. ldev says that saudi is so rich that the piddly amount they get from the refineries won't change anything if they are going to fund wahabism in India.

I wonder if there is any type of dubious decision at all questioning of which cannot be shot down by this method regardless of the merits of the case. Argumentation like this differential analysis is called sophistry. It sounds logical but fails a version of popper's falsifiability test.

Healthy viable organizations make and justify decisions based on an assertion of values of the organization and how those values are served by the decision. Ldev did do this earlier when he said what India values is oil availability; what I am pointing out is the dangers of differential analysis which was also offered by him.
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Re: West Asia News and Discussions

Post by shyamd »

The Fasih Mehmood mystery
Posted on May 29, 2012

Pic by-sunday-guardian.com

Fasih Mohammad is a name in circulation and in investigation circles he is considered to be a primary player for the Indian Mujahideen based out of Jubail in Saudi Arabia. The police say that he would be probed for his alleged role in the Chinnaswamy stadium blasts at Bangalore. However the more important aspect today is the whereabouts of this man who is an engineer by profession.

A fortnight ago it was reported that Mehmood was brought down to India in an undercover operation carried out by the Indian agencies. His family members too confirmed this fact that Mehmood was taken away by the Indian agencies. He is said to have been brought down to Delhi first and then questioned later by the Bangalore police for his role in the stadium blasts.

However since this incident none of the Indian agencies have confirmed this fact and say that the man in question is still at Jubail. There is information regarding his involvement in the blasts, but we are still working out the formalities for his deportation officially. The Intelligence Bureau says that a red corner alert will be issued in a couple of days and after this process is completed he would be deported to India with the help of the Saudi authorities.

Mehmood is an engineer working at Jubail. He is said to have been arrested first by the police of Saudi Arabia and then taken away by the Indian agencies. His name is said to have cropped up during the interrogation of Kafeel Akthar who is in the custody of the Bangalore police for his alleged role in the stadium blasts. The Bangalore police is however tight lipped regarding the exact conversation they had with Akthar, but sources say that the name of Mehmood came into the picture when they found his name and number stored in Akthar’s cell phone.

The preliminary investigations regarding Mehmood go on to show that he was part of this network and could have contributed in a small way towards the stadium blasts. The police are also probing his role for any financial transactions that could have possibly been made from the Gulf. Further the other point of suspicion arose when they realised that he had done his education in Bhatkal, a town in Karnataka which had once a upon a time housed the Bhatkals- Yasin, Riyaz and Iqbal.

The journey for his family has been a hard one. The day he was said to have been taken away by the Indian police, they also said that on the same day his wife too had been deported to India. His family members say that the government has a responsibility to inform them about his whereabouts. Some even suspect that from Saudi he was taken to Delhi and later to Bangalore.

The Jamia Teachers’ Solidarity Association which has been helping the family members in their fight to find Mehmood say that it has been over two weeks that Fasih Mahmood practically disappeared from his residence in Jubail, Saudi Arabia, where he worked as an engineer. On 13th May, Sunday, Mahmood was taken away by a group of Indian and Arab men, all in civil dress, and their house searched, while his wife, Nikhat Perveen, was held in a room by an Arab woman.

While his wife and family have received no official communication from the Indian government, speculation has been rife in the press that Mahmood has been arrested—a wholly wrong usage, as it can only be termed illegal detention—for being financier to the alleged terror plots of the shadowy organistaion, Indian Mujahideen. While pleas of Nikhat seeking the details of her husband’s whereabouts are falling on deaf ears, unnamed ‘sources’ are zealously leaking allegations against Mahmood to the press. So far, MHA, MEA and NHRC have all obstinately stonewalled Nikhat entreaties, feigning ignorance. The Home Secretary has refused to give any assurance to Nikhat that her husband would be produced; indeed, he claimed to have no information on him.

Fasih Mahmood’s illegal detention in an undisclosed location, possibly on foreign land, is in gross violation of all established legal procedures.

We demand that Fasih Mahmood must be immediately produced in an Indian court, and that the Indian government officially own up to this illegal ‘arrest’. Fasih Mahmood must be given immediate access to his family and lawyers.

The Indian establishment however are in denial regarding the arrest/detention of this man. We are following a proper procedure to ensure that he is brought down to India in order for us to probe his role in the stadium blasts. We have sufficient proof to seek the extradition of Mehmood and once he is brought down it would be made public, sources also point out.

Investigators say that he had visited India at the time of the attack. We need to question him to find out about his role and even ascertain whether he was involved or not. However the allegations by the family members that he is in our custody is wrong and time would tell the correct picture, the police also add.
This is why security cooperation needs to be kept secret.
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Re: West Asia News and Discussions

Post by ramana »

Nightwatch, 30 May 2012

Iran -Saudi Arabia: Haaretz reported today, "Former senior US diplomat Dennis Ross confirmed for the first time on Tuesday night that Saudi Arabia's King Abdullah has explicitly warned the U.S. that if Iran obtains nuclear weapons, Saudi Arabia will seek to do so as well.

{n+1th country syndrome that Gilpatric commission hoped to stop by leaning against India in the mid-sixties!}

'If they get nuclear weapons, we will get nuclear weapons,' Abdullah told Ross during a meeting between the two in April 2009. Ross said he responded to the King's assertion with a lengthy appeal against nuclear proliferation, but after hearing him out, the king responded by repeating the same line: 'If they get nuclear weapons, we will get nuclear weapons.'"

Comment: Ross made the confirmation while promoting a new book in a public appearance in New York with his co-author. However, rumors of Saudi possession of or readiness to acquire nuclear weapons and delivery systems date to the first Gulf War. None have been confirmed. :mrgreen:

Ross is the first authoritative source to disclose the Saudi strategic decision to meet Shiite Persian nukes with Sunni Arab nukes.

{The reality is the Sunni Arab nukes are th eones driving the Shia Persian nukes acquisition. Really Ptomkin's analysis of wrong causation.}

The confirmation also is significant because it puts new light on the Iranian nuclear program and the fighting in Syria that has not been reported in main stream media. The main stream media usually report about a potential conflict between Israel and Iran and the struggle for democracy in Syria. Both narratives are far from accurate.

The Ross confirmation signifies that the actual existential strategic threat is a nuclear war between Sunni and Shia Islam. The Sunni champion is Saudi Arabia. Iran champions the Shii. This is the conflict that must be prevented. Israel is a powerful player on the side of the Saudis against Iran, but it is not the strategic target. The Sunni imams consistently describe the Shiite heresy as a worse offense against Allah than the Jews.

This strategic struggle explains how the Syrian opposition, which holds no territory and has no bases, continues to receive sufficient ammunition and supplies to sustain the proxy war against the Syrian armed forces. The Saudis apparently are the financiers of the opposition. The only channels for support run through Lebanon.

Nothing in Syria is as it is reported in mainstream media, including most of the images of destruction from fighting. There are few images of actual fighting by either side.

The opposition struggle in Syria is not about establishing democracy or human rights; it is about establishing Sharia in the Sunni interpretation. The Asad government, in fact, protects minorities far better than a Sunni regime would, as illustrated by the harassment of Iraqi Christians and Egyptian Copts. :rotfl:

The consistent US support for the Sunni opposition in Syria implies that the US supports the Saudi vision of the Middle East, which includes no role for democracy and slight respect for human rights.

{Metternich's Ghost of stability drives the US policy}

Similarly, the Iranian nuclear weapons issue has more to do with stopping the proliferation of nuclear weapons and delivery systems in Saudi Arabia and other Sunni Arab states than it does with the security of Israel. King Abdallah was not bluffing.

The commitment of the Saudis to reversing the spread of the Shiite heresy is a dimension of the strategic struggle in the Middle East that receives no coverage in mainstream US media. It portends a future struggle in Iraq to remove the pro-Iranian government.
I will go out on a limb and say this. The after almost 1500 years the Iranians have fashioned Shia sectarianism to fight the Arab monopoly over Islam. What we are seeing is the revivial of ancient Persia in Middle East thorugh Shia Sect of Islam.

Note Shia Islam was founded by Ali in Iraq. All the Shia holy sites are in Iraq. Iranian Shia have not been able to get support from Arab Shias during the Iran-Iraq war also.
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Re: West Asia News and Discussions

Post by Philip »

The US threatens to "intervene" in Syria despite Russian warnings.This is an ominous sign.Putin hs snubbed the Brits and will not attend the Olympics because of the UK harbouring disgraced,on-the-run anti-Russian oligarchs in London,who are trying to destabilise Russi from the safe haven of London and allegedly wiht the connivance of British/western security entities.This will also be before the US elections where Ombaba wants to appear as a "macho man" whop can kick ass anywhere on the globe,appealing to the baser instincts of Americans.

The Saudis have already got the bomb,manufactured by the Pakis in secret and need only to unveil it if and when the Iranians test.Fr decdes they helped bankroll the Paki bomb,explaining the extremeley close relationshp between the two.

When will the US intervention take place? It may also involve an attack on Irean too,either from the US or Israelis too.Expect the dogs of war unleashed in July,from the augurs!

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldne ... Syria.html

US raises prospect of intervention in Syria
America has raised the possibility of intervening in Syria without United Nations approval and accused Russia of pushing the country into civil war.
US raises prospect of intervention in Syria
America has raised the possibility of intervening in Syria without United Nations approval and accused Russia of pushing the country into civil war.

Hillary Clinton said the absence of UN support for action in Syria, due mainly to Russia's opposition, 'makes it harder' to respond to the crisis Photo: AFP/GETTYBy Ruth Sherlock, Beirut and Richard Spencer, Middle East Correspondent
7:42PM BST 31 May 2012
Hillary Clinton, the US secretary of state, bluntly criticised Russia's continued backing for President Bashar al-Assad's regime yesterday. This support was illustrated last night by the disclosure that a Russian cargo ship carrying weapons had docked in Syria last Saturday, one day after the massacre in Houla which claimed at least 108 civilian lives.

Addressing students in Denmark, Mrs Clinton urged Russia to use its influence on Mr Assad to curb the fighting.

"The Syrians are not going to listen to us. They will listen - maybe - to the Russians, so we have to keep pushing them," she said.

Russian officials, added Mrs Clinton, "are telling me they don't want to see a civil war. I have been telling them their policy is going help to contribute to a civil war." Western governments believe that diplomatic cover afforded by the Kremlin has emboldened Mr Assad and encouraged him to resist pressure to negotiate a settlement of the conflict.

Earlier, Susan Rice, the American ambassador to the UN, said that Russia's veto-wielding membership of the Security Council would not necessarily prevent international action. If the violence worsened and the peace plan proposed by Kofi Annan, the former UN secretary general, made no progress, some countries would consider whether to bypass Russian and Chinese opposition in the UN.

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S
"Members of this Council and members of the international community are (then) left with the option only of having to consider whether they're prepared to take actions outside of the Annan plan and the authority of this Council," said Ms Rice.

Leaders of the Free Syrian Army, the rebel movement, issued a statement giving the regime until Friday (today) to obey the Annan plan, or they would formally abandon a ceasefire.

But Mrs Clinton noted the obstacles to any Western military intervention, starting with the probable Russian and Chinese vetoes that would prevent any action from having UN support. "We're nowhere near putting together any type of coalition other than to alleviate the suffering," she said. "We have very strong opposition from Russia and China - but it's primarily from Russia - and that makes it harder to put together an international coalition."

There are growing fears that Syria risks becoming a "failed state" comparable to Iraq during the worst days of its conflict, when different sects battled for power and militant Islamist groups allied to al-Qaeda also rose to the surface.

Ban Ki-Moon, the UN secretary general, spelled out the dangers, saying: "The massacre of civilians of the sort seen last weekend could plunge Syria into a catastrophic civil war - a civil war from which the country would never recover."

One day after the killings in Houla, a Russian cargo vessel, the Professor Katsman, landed in the Syrian port of Tartous carrying weapons for the regime. Russian arms sales to Mr Assad totalled about $1 billion last year and outstanding contracts are believed to be worth three or four times that total. The Syrian army relies on Russia for most of its tanks, armoured vehicles and heavy weapons.

The UN has deployed 290 observers in the country to monitor a ceasefire called for by the Annan plan. But Mr Ban added: "Let me state plainly: the UN did not deploy in Syria just to bear witness to the slaughter of innocents. We are not there to play the role of passive observer to unspeakable atrocities." Some countries want more observers to be sent, noting that violence falls wherever they are deployed.

However, there is a real risk of Syria's fighting spreading into neighbouring Lebanon. Hizbollah, the Shia extremist group based in south Lebanon, is believed to have brought weapons into the country from Syria, including medium range missiles. The arrival of these arms in Lebanon will raise tensions between Sunni and Shia, already inflamed by the crisis in Syria.

In London, David Cameron convened a meeting of the National Security Council to discuss the situation. Britain will consider pushing for "further sanctions", but the possibility of military action was not on the table.
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Re: West Asia News and Discussions

Post by RajeshA »

Before taking on Iran, they will have to take down Syria. They want to avoid that Iran gets to attack Israel through the Shia corridor passing through Iraq, Syria, Lebanon.
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Re: West Asia News and Discussions

Post by shyamd »

THey have surrounded Israel already. Golan, Lebanon Sinai and Gaza. Iran will strike on the borders if Israel strikes Iran.

Meanwhile, obama adviser says:
Dennis Ross: Russia key to ending Syria crisis, but "safe haven" plan needed
(CBS News) Dennis Ross, a former American diplomat and top adviser to President Obama's administration on the Middle East, says Syria is already in a civil war, and the only way to end it is to convince President Bashar Assad that his support - from inside the country and from Russia - has eroded.

"The danger of the current track is that you will end up with a failed state," Ross tells "CBS This Morning."

Ross stresses the importance of working to "move the Russians" into abandoning their support for Assad, but says the options - short of Russian President Vladimir Putin telling Assad he must go - are limited.

"If it turns out he doesn't have an insurance policy (in the form of backing from Russia), then I think the reality will change," says Ross.

In the meantime, the long-time diplomat says the U.S. must start to consider and plan for a means by which a "safe haven" can be established inside northern Syria.

"We need to start planning for it," says Ross, adding that such a bold move - which would likely entail some foreign troop presence on Syrian soil - may be necessary to convince Assad his days in power are coming to an end. In Ross' own words, it would change the "psychological balance of power."
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Re: West Asia News and Discussions

Post by Austin »

Putin warns against attempts to decide Syria’s future for its people
Russian President Vladimir Putin has warned France and the world community against attempts to try to decide the future of Syria for its people.

“We find acceptable everything that is acceptable for the Syrian people,” he said at a joint news conference with Francois Hollande following talks at the Champs Elysee palace on Friday.

Violence must be brought to an end on both sides, the parties to the conflict persuaded to take seats at the negotiating table, and a situation created in which they will be able to come to terms,” he explained.

“But we cannot decide that for the Syrian people,” Putin said.

As an example Putin pointed to other countries in the region, including Libya and Iraq.

“Have they become safer places, better places? Where are they moving? No answer,” Putin said. “We suggest acting delicately and in a balanced way at least in Syria.”

“Why do you think that if we oust somebody from power, tomorrow there will be Earth’s paradise?” he asked the media audience. Putin recalled the situation in Libya, where after the overthrow of Gaddafi the situation has got merely worse.


“We are neither for Assad nor for his opponents,” Putin said, adding that actions to be taken in Syria should be delicate and accurate.

“Our choice is not between friends or foes. We wish to bring about a situation where there will be possible a peace political settlement of the conflict,” he said, adding that Bashar Assad had been a more frequent guest in Paris than in Moscow.

Putin dismissed the speculations Russia had some sort of special relationship with Syria.

“We have an old-time relationship to share, but when I hear that we have some special interests there, it is sheer delusion,” Putin said. “The sole thing that we are concerned about is the risk of a radicalization of the situation there. Loss of control. Civilian casualties,” Putin said.
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Re: West Asia News and Discussions

Post by shyamd »

IDF military intel says 1500 or around 15% reported defection per division in Golan.
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Re: West Asia News and Discussions

Post by Kati »

^^^^^^
Defection from which side? IDF? Golan is under IDF control.
or, is it from the Syrian side - on the other side of Golan heights?
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Re: West Asia News and Discussions

Post by ramana »

Defection form Syrian armed forces. Could be psy-ops too.
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Re: West Asia News and Discussions

Post by Philip »

The manner in which the Yanquis have been hounding those infidel rulers in the "turd" and Arab world,and the call for a safe haven" for Assad and co., are so reminiscient of the manner in which that "noble savage",the native American "Indian" was similarly deprived of his ancestral habitat in the most deplorable and shameful manner,corralled into "reservations" where the inability to roam free drove him into depression and drink,cheap moonshine provided by his saviours! The Yanquis then stole the riches of his land to fatten themselves while the proud native Am-Ind slipped into poverty and obscurity ,displayed for the tourists as a shining example of Yanqui culture!
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Re: West Asia News and Discussions

Post by shyamd »

yes Syrian side. IMO 15% isnt huge, but its significant - Just in golan alone 6000 people with guns and arms running around causing problems.

Meir Dagan interview for Shalom TV, last week. Excellent interview with frank discussion of what all this means for the region and Israeli relations with EU US.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B6E5NVXGl-M
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Re: West Asia News and Discussions

Post by Philip »

Syrian rebels slaughter 100 soldiers.Peace proposal in tatters.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldne ... efire.html

Syrian rebels kill 100 government soldiers as they repudiate UN ceasefire
Syria's rebels said they had killed as many as 100 government soldiers in the most ferocious opposition offensive of the uprising against President Bashar al-Assad as they announced a formal repudiation of the UN-backed ceasefire.
By Adrian Blomfield, Tom Parfitt in Moscow and Ruth Sherlock in Beirut
7:58PM BST 04 Jun 2012
The Free Syrian Army declared that it was no longer bound by a ceasefire plan brokered by Kofi Annan, the UN and Arab League special envoy to Syria, who was yesterday struggling to salvage international backing for his efforts .

Rebel leaders said they had authorised the resumption of full-scale military operations after the Syrian leader ignored their ultimatum to comply with the terms of Mr Annan's plan by last Friday.

"We have decided to end our commitment to this (plan)," Maj Sami al-Kurdi, a spokesman for the Free Syrian Army, said.

Given free rein and determined to avenge the massacre of 108 people in the town of Houla last month, the rebels overran six army checkpoints in the northern province of Idlib, killing scores of soldier, and mounted a series of ambushes close to the capital Damascus. There were reports of operations elsewhere in the country as well.

The attacks killed at least 80 soldiers over the weekend alone, according to the Syrian Observatory for Human Rights, a pro-opposition watchdog, which said its death toll was based on reports from local doctors. The rebels themselves claimed to have killed more than 100 members of the security forces.

Mr Annan yesterday conceded that his plan is not being implemented by either side and may have to adjusted.

"The time may have to come to review the situation and the international community has to decide what measures it can take to ensure implementation of the plan," his spokesman, Ahmad Fawzi, said.

Mr Annan is due to hold talks with Hillary Clinton, the American Secretary of State, and Arab League officials in Washington on Friday but it is uncertain what scope for progress remains.

The surge in violence raised renewed fears that Syria was sliding ever closer to civil war, with the rebels' offensive likely lead to merciless retaliation both by Mr Assad's forces and by the pro-regime Shabiha militia accused of carrying out the Houla massacre and others like it. Fighting continued on Monday, although it was unclear to what extent the death toll had mounted.

While Mr Annan's six-point plan, which came into force on April 12th, never succeeded in ending hostilities, it did cause the bloodshed to recede a little.

But with both sides openly in defiance of the agreement, its survival will again be called into question.

Despite the setbacks, Arab League officials have privately spoken of their desire to see the plan broadened by bolstering the 300-monitor observer mission presently operating in Syria and giving them more sweeping powers.

Mr Annan indicated yesterday that he did not favour the proposal, which is likely to be rejected by the Syrian government in any case. It would also divide the international community.

Vladimir Putin, the Russian president, appeared to be in no mood to soften his support for the Syrian regime when he met European Union officials at a summit in St Petersburg yesterday.

Mr Putin failed to mention Syria at all and Sergei Lavrov, the Russian foreign minister, curtly rebuffed questions over a change in Russia's stance. He said: "I don't think so."

Efforts by Mrs Clinton in recent days to persuade Russia to agree to Mr Assad's departure were given short shrift.

Moscow has consistently refused to countenance any solution to the Syria crisis that involves a forced exit for Mr Assad, saying that such a solution would amount to interference in the affairs of a sovereign state.

The Syrian National Council, the main opposition political front, urged Russia to adopt a more "constructive" approach.

"Russia has the ability to influence this regime and it has the ability to contribute to a rapid transfer of power," said Bassma Kodmani, the council's principal spokesman. "Russia has heard very clearly the demands and aspiration of the Syrian people. This is not a regime that it can continue to defend without losing its credibility."
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Re: West Asia News and Discussions

Post by Kati »

Assad is digging his heels for a long haul as long as Putin is there......

Is there any report on the regime filling in the armed forces ranks with more alawaite recruits?
I heard a rumor that it has started on an emergency basis.......
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Re: West Asia News and Discussions

Post by RamaY »

Philip wrote:Syrian rebels slaughter 100 soldiers.Peace proposal in tatters.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldne ... efire.html

Syrian rebels kill 100 government soldiers as they repudiate UN ceasefire
I wonder how only the soldiers got killed. Does it mean the syrian soldiers didn't fight at all or is it a wajab-ul-cutlet operation?
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Re: West Asia News and Discussions

Post by ramana »

Latter. W-e-C.
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Re: West Asia News and Discussions

Post by shyamd »

An alawite give himself up to a Sunni to be WeC'd? I don't think so, dynamics are different here. Article clearly says ambushes and attacks on checkpoints.
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Re: West Asia News and Discussions

Post by devesh »

it will be dead when it is wiped from the collective consciousness of Indians. as long as there remain Indians who have delusions of being "Aryan", it is not dead.
ramana
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Re: West Asia News and Discussions

Post by ramana »

^^^ Wrong thread devesh.
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Re: West Asia News and Discussions

Post by nachiket »

Cross posting from inferiority thread since it deals with Saudi Barbaria
RajeshA wrote:Published on May 23, 2012
By Brigadier General (Retd) Mehboob Qadir, Pakistan Army
Miskeen: Racism in Saud-Family "Occupied Arabia" Against Pakistanis, Indians, Bengladeshis, and Sri Lankans: Pakistan ThinkTank
ramana
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Re: West Asia News and Discussions

Post by ramana »

Can you post the full text so folks can read without having to visit the site!
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Re: West Asia News and Discussions

Post by nachiket »

Sure

Miskeen: Racism in Saud-Family "Occupied Arabia" Against Pakistanis, Indians, Bengladeshis, and Sri Lankans: Pakistan ThinkTank
Saudi Arabia was almost the last to end slavery officially in 1974 yet by nature retain all the instincts of slave-running alive Miskeen — by Mehboob Qadir Miskeen is a spoken Saudi equal of ‘poor wretch’ used to denote mainly the Asian labour force, coloured workers and expatriates from Pakistan, India, Sri Lanka, Bangladesh, Philippines, Indonesia, etc. For those of African and North African origins, they have different titles. More than a word, it shows a whole Saudi racial, social and national attitude and a rancid hubris. In this context, Ummah is either a misnomer or merely a convenience for the Arab. They are Saudis, Iraqis, Egyptians, Yemenis, Kuwaitis Bahrainis, Emiratis or whatever, but brothers in the Ummah. That notion is basically a political convenience. We, in the subcontinent, are emotionally more transparent and excitable. An Arab, like his camel, is emotionally frigid except when he is slighted or his female space is threatened. Despite a strangely adversarial disposition towards females, they count them among their possessions like the black tent, camels and cattle. One realised that the Saudi men’s honour and prestige seem to be tied more to their ability to control their women by diamond necklaces and gold biscuits than any equation of a sublime human relationship. Their family canvas is a sorry mess because of institutionalised licentiousness through a flood of divorces and multiple marriages. A society short of familial affiliations and internal gravitation disintegrates sooner or later.

Saudis, and Arabs for that matter, have an obsessive love for money, matched in our part of the world by the Pathan or the Sikh somewhat, if not fully. The difference is that Pathans and Sikhs both have plenty in the lands they live in, not the Saudis. Less the oil, they have always been short of food and means of livelihood as hardly anything grew in their deserts. Their harsh unsupportive environment forced them to become highwaymen for hire, ferrying the trade goods of richer nations on the ends of the desert and beyond. Those who were not involved in running trade caravans were busy raiding the same. Their land bridge geographical location between productive Asia, Africa and Europe helped them to become exchange traders or midway transit men. Since they produced literally nothing but had to sell others’ goods, therefore they developed excellent linguistic skills, which is why Arabic is such an eloquent language.

Arabs are racial exclusivists and the Saudis, a degree more, arrogant too. However, Kuwaitis excel in both fields. This racist arrogance does not stem from any real world class achievement but their age old ability to ply one’s merchandise to the other at exorbitant rates, making the other believe that the deal was fair, employing a clever-merchant syndrome. The other reason has been the inelasticity of their bare bones social capsule, which was unable to absorb any external influence or people. Their mercantile ability was polished after the advent of Islam with a large dose of missionary zeal and truth on the pain of divine condemnation forever. However, a few centuries on, this zeal waned and skillful statecraft replaced the art of salesmanship. Both required nearly the same neuro transmissions.

I have been Director General (SPAFO) of Pakistan Armed Forces deputationists, mainly, doctors and engineers, to the Saudi Armed Forces from 1998 to 2002.This was one of the most privileged positions for a non-European/American military officer in the Kingdom. I used to sit in the Ministry of Defence sharing the floor with US, British and French military missions. Another unique privilege that I enjoyed was that I could move anywhere in the Kingdom without the indispensible written permission and saw them closely in both urban and rural landscapes. That regretfully shattered many a myth that we Muslims in the subcontinent carry almost as articles of faith, and along with that a part of my better self too. However, it was an invaluable education in reality and measurement of one’s worthiness or otherwise.

Within weeks, I realised that for a self-respecting person, it was nearly impossible to work honourably with those men. But for the call of duty to the fellow deputationists and mutuality between our two countries, I seriously considered repatriation. Hardly an occasion goes by without making an expatriate realise the tentative nature of his lower stature among these stiff-lipped, stuffy men. Our best, even a PhD in Space Sciences, weighs invariably less than a Saudi camel-herder from the Empty Quarter.

Saudi Arabia was almost the last to end slavery officially in 1974 yet by nature retain all the instincts of slave-running alive. The Iqama (work permit) is the principal instrument and is issued on behalf of the Saudi employer (Kafeel) for one year at a time. This is literally a dog collar that provides the Saudi master unlimited and rather coercive powers over the hapless expatriate. Regardless of innocence, merit, right to be heard and the number of years of hard work, one could be packed off and deported within hours. An expatriate has practically no legal stature, let alone the much talked about basic human rights. I know of a senior Pakistani banker who helped set up a renowned Saudi bank, rose to the position of vice-president and after 29 years was ordered out at a week’s notice, his invaluable service and lifetime of hard work notwithstanding. His fault? None except the sweet pleasure of his employer and the weapon, the guillotine of Iqama. Once your Iqama is withdrawn you are an immediate nonentity and must leave the country posthaste before they imprison you for an indefinite period. Moreover, one could see horrible exploitation of female expatriates by their masters, particularly that of Sri Lankans and Philippinas. Pathetic insensitivity that was. (why you people keep coming here? reply I got from a close Saudi friend)

Peculiarly, Saudis have a cold and impersonal system of designating expatriates that they hire. Miskeen is a derisive phrase of pity and loathing that tends to massage their ego in a kind of perverted manner. It tends to be a device of superiority, distancing from the mass of toiling expatriate men and women working in the Saudi households, farms, factories, shops, hotels, offices and all places where an ordinary Saudi considers it below his dignity to work. The next lower phrase in their not so civil glossary is siddique, which very eloquently conveys: ‘You work for me but mind your place. No liberties to be taken.’ Siddique is a belittling way of directly addressing one out of innumerable expatriates already held as miskeen.

European and American expatriates are a different and far superior category. For them notions of pity are transformed into a view of admiration and longing. They are considered and addressed as rafique, meaning ‘dear friend’. Americans top this list, followed closely by the British and other Europeans, depending upon how much they can benefit materially. There are cogent reasons for this preferential treatment. Americans and Europeans negotiate their terms of reference very carefully and hard. They are better networked, bring in more lucrative business, have better work ethics and their parent governments are unrelenting should Saudis maltreat one of their citizens.

There is a third but unspoken class who are mentioned with a smile and a wink. These are fair-skinned Central Asians, Lebanese, and blonde-haired Syrians. They are neither miskeen nor rafique but have the privilege of being the pleasure mates of a superior sort but not equals. They have half an access to the privacies of Saudi households; some even married in. Late Rafique Hariri was a kinsman of the Saudi royal family.

In all this business of labelling who was who in the shoddy Saudi esteem, they missed the forest for the trees. They know but never acknowledge that all of the Kingdom’s infrastructure, services and amenities were built by expatriates from all over the world. Saudi oil money drew the best of the foreign societies into their service but tragically, they failed to absorb them into their own society. It was because they were unfortunately blind to the power of diversification, induction of new talent and ideas. Their genetic disability had been that want and scarcity of thousands of years had made their tribal society grow inwards with no scope or space for expansion and accommodation. The net result is that not only the Saudis floundered a once in centuries chance to enrich their country and society with a mix of talented foreign men and women but also have a huge rootless foreign mass in their midst that can go out of hand any moment. The consequences could be devastating. More about this some other time.
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Re: West Asia News and Discussions

Post by Surya »

Just in golan alone 6000 people with guns and arms running around causing problems.

Golan ????


Also did I see more tin cans with turret blown away??
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Re: West Asia News and Discussions

Post by pgbhat »

Syrian airhostesses clash causing flight delay :mrgreen:
What began as a disagreement between the two flight attendants, one enamoured with the Syrian regime and the other opposed to it, turned into a fist-fight.

The hostesses' flight was delayed as the women slugged it out in Dubai Airport in a brawl that had to be broken up by security officers, said airport sources quoted in the Arab media.

This is thought to be one of more than a dozen brawls and heated debates between Syrian flight attendants that have increased the cabin pressure in the months since the conflict in Syria began.
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Re: West Asia News and Discussions

Post by shyamd »

US SOC has begun training of opposition to secure chemical weapon depots.

Iraqi Shia militants spotted conducting ops against rebels.

No one has seen Assef Shawkat since his reported poisoning/assassination.

Standby for Maliki's fall, in progress. Sadr on board for Maliki's removal (key player) and Iran for the past few weeks is pulling out all the cards to save him. Don't be surprise to wake up and see news of clashes between Sadr and Maliki supporters.
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Re: West Asia News and Discussions

Post by Philip »

Devastating indictment on the Saudis by a very insightful Paki.He most probably will be beheaded if he ever dares to visit the kingdom again! Maltreatment of inferior Asians is legendary in the kingdom.It will all come to pass.....downfall.
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Re: West Asia News and Discussions

Post by Fidel Guevara »

Alawites are an interesting bunch, far more than just another Muslim sect. From Wikipedia:

distinct Alawi beliefs include the belief that prayers are not necessary, they don't fast, nor perform pilgrimage, nor have specific places of worship.

the Alawi "absorbed elements" from the different religions that influenced their area from Hellenistic times onward,[41] while maintaining their own beliefs, and "pretended to adhere to the dominant religion of the age." Alawites are reported to celebrate certain Christian festivals, "in their own way",[41] including Christmas, Easter, and Palm Sunday, and their religious ceremonies make use of bread and wine.

"The Christian elements in the Nusayri religion are unmistakable. They include the concept of trinity; the celebration of Christmas,

Glasse writes that they also practice a religious feast called by the Persian name Naw Ruz and that they believe in a "trinity"[23] or "schema"[41] of `Ain-Mim-Sin, which stands for `Ali, Muhammad, and Salman al-Farsi, the Persian Companion of Muhammad.

induced Syrian leader Hafez al-Assad and his successor son to press their fellow Alawi "to behave like 'regular Muslims', shedding or at least concealing their distinctive aspects."
Seems that the Alawites are the ultimate masters of Taqqiya...fooling the followers of the religion that invented Taqqiya. Like the English language, just absorbing any new idea that seems to make sense, and not tightly bound by rules.

All the more reason not to support an overthrow by Sunni rebels. If only they can stop killing women and children!
devesh
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Joined: 17 Feb 2011 03:27

Re: West Asia News and Discussions

Post by devesh »

apologize for that seemingly random post!!! clearly, I was reading something about that topic in one of the threads but somehow managed to post in the wrong thread! sorry again.
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