Exclusive: UK Government urged to reveal its role in getting Saudi Arabia onto UN Human Rights Council
Liberal Democrat and Green Party leaders call on David Cameron to reveal whether British government supported Saudi bid
Adam Withnall, Charlie Cooper |
Prime Minister David Cameron meets with The Saudi Foreign Minister Prince Saul Al Faisal inside 10 Downing Street
The Government has been called upon to clarify the role it played in voting Saudi Arabia’s onto the UN Human Rights Council, after the kingdom executed 47 people in a single day sparking a backlash across the Middle East.
Diplomatic cables released by Wikileaks last year purported to show that the UK was involved in a secret vote-trading deal to help ensure both countries a place on the influential panel.
The exchanges, related to the November 2013 vote in New York, were published by The Australian newspaper and have never been commented on by UK officials. Both Britain and Saudi Arabia were later named among the 47 member states of the UNHRC, following the secret ballot.
Saudi protesters sentenced to death as children 'could be next'
David Cameron has been accused by human rights campaigners of “turning a blind eye” to Saudi abuses, particularly in light of the killings this weekend that included the prominent Shia cleric Sheikh Nimr al-Nimr.
And speaking to The Independent, there were cross-party calls for the Government to issue a full response to last year's alleged leak.
The Green Party leader, Natalie Bennett, said the Saudi kingdom’s role on the UN council was “one of many issued raised by the mass executions”.
She called for a public inquiry into the leaked diplomatic cables and the UK’s alleged decision to support Saudi Arabia in spite of its human rights record.
She said: “In light of the weekend's events, the government should be launching an inquiry to establish who made the decision to so abuse the UN process and the principle of universal human rights. The results of this inquiry must be published.
10 examples of Saudi Arabia's human rights abuses
“And the government must immediately suspend exports of arms to Saudi Arabia, and strengthen its currently extremely weak diplomatic response.”
Tim Farron, the leader of the Liberal Democrats, said: "It is time the Prime Minister came clean about whether the Government supported Saudi Arabia's election to the UN Human Rights Council.
"It would make a utter mockery of the values we hold dear if they did support them. We must be stronger with our supposed allies and say that systematic abuses of human rights will not be tolerated.
"If the Government did support the Saudi bid - it would show once and for all that the Government puts profit above fundermental human rights."
Iran: Angry protesters set fire to Saudi embassy in Tehran
Amid widespread condemnation from the international community, the British government’s response to the Saudi executions has been limited.
Issued through the Foreign Office, it read: “The UK opposes the death penalty in all circumstances and in every country. The death penalty undermines human dignity and there is no evidence that it works as a deterrent.
“The foreign secretary regularly raises human rights issues with his counterparts in countries of concern, including Saudi Arabia. We seek to build strong and mature relationships so that we can be candid with each other about those areas on which we do not agree, including on human rights.”
An FCO spokesman said: "Saudi Arabia took part in an uncontested election for a seat as one of the Asian Group members in the UN's Human Rights Council.
"So while the UK never publicises how it votes, this was not a contested election within the Asian Group and the UK's vote was immaterial."
Re: The Levant crisis.(Israel,SYRIA,Lebanon,etc) - II
Posted: 04 Jan 2016 16:56
by Paul
Sudan follows Bahrein and KSA in cutting diplomatic ties with Iran.
I say things are going to get interesting for Pakiland further. Wait and watch
Re: The Levant crisis.(Israel,SYRIA,Lebanon,etc) - II
Posted: 04 Jan 2016 17:26
by Samay
Philip wrote:The Bahraini caged parrot has to echo its master! Now Russia offers to mediate between the Soothi Barbarians and Iranians.
Exclusive: UK Government urged to reveal its role in getting Saudi Arabia onto UN Human Rights Council
Liberal Democrat and Green Party leaders call on David Cameron to reveal whether British government supported Saudi bid
Adam Withnall, Charlie Cooper |
Prime Minister David Cameron meets with The Saudi Foreign Minister Prince Saul Al Faisal inside 10 Downing Street
The Government has been called upon to clarify the role it played in voting Saudi Arabia’s onto the UN Human Rights Council, after the kingdom executed 47 people in a single day sparking a backlash across the Middle East.
Diplomatic cables released by Wikileaks last year purported to show that the UK was involved in a secret vote-trading deal to help ensure both countries a place on the influential panel.
The exchanges, related to the November 2013 vote in New York, were published by The Australian newspaper and have never been commented on by UK officials. Both Britain and Saudi Arabia were later named among the 47 member states of the UNHRC, following the secret ballot.
Saudi protesters sentenced to death as children 'could be next'
David Cameron has been accused by human rights campaigners of “turning a blind eye” to Saudi abuses, particularly in light of the killings this weekend that included the prominent Shia cleric Sheikh Nimr al-Nimr.
And speaking to The Independent, there were cross-party calls for the Government to issue a full response to last year's alleged leak.
The Green Party leader, Natalie Bennett, said the Saudi kingdom’s role on the UN council was “one of many issued raised by the mass executions”.
She called for a public inquiry into the leaked diplomatic cables and the UK’s alleged decision to support Saudi Arabia in spite of its human rights record.
She said: “In light of the weekend's events, the government should be launching an inquiry to establish who made the decision to so abuse the UN process and the principle of universal human rights. The results of this inquiry must be published.
10 examples of Saudi Arabia's human rights abuses
“And the government must immediately suspend exports of arms to Saudi Arabia, and strengthen its currently extremely weak diplomatic response.”
Tim Farron, the leader of the Liberal Democrats, said: "It is time the Prime Minister came clean about whether the Government supported Saudi Arabia's election to the UN Human Rights Council.
"It would make a utter mockery of the values we hold dear if they did support them. We must be stronger with our supposed allies and say that systematic abuses of human rights will not be tolerated.
"If the Government did support the Saudi bid - it would show once and for all that the Government puts profit above fundermental human rights."
Iran: Angry protesters set fire to Saudi embassy in Tehran
Amid widespread condemnation from the international community, the British government’s response to the Saudi executions has been limited.
Not a word from khan is heard on these brutal executions, and nothing from amenesty international of saudi arabians. UN is officially dead now. UNHRC is for non-munnas only. What was to be done is a series of sanctions on these barbarians/savages , but nothing is happening. US of some A is crying loud , requesting whole world not to depend on it for solving problems, but no one is listening, except rusis who always take matters in their own hands.
Its high time that UNSC be amended from its current form and shape.
Re: The Levant crisis.(Israel,SYRIA,Lebanon,etc) - II
Iran’s ‘staggering’ execution spree: nearly 700 put to death in just over six months
Iran is just as dirty as the Saudis.
We can snark at each other forever about phony moral symmetry but the fact (which you ought to have been aware of since you have hung around here forever) is that, as Indians we have a stronger civilizational affinity with Iranians than with Saudis, and we generally believe that Iranians haven't totally let go of their core civilizational values and are hence more redeemable than the Saudis for whom the current state represents the acme of what they have achieved or are likely to achieve in creating a humane civilization.
Re: The Levant crisis.(Israel,SYRIA,Lebanon,etc) - II
Posted: 05 Jan 2016 00:16
by IndraD
@ T S Jones
You accepted yourself Saudi is as worse as Iran
then why does US support Saudi, why UK helped Saudi get on human right panel ?
Obviously you know two wrongs do not make a right.
Re: The Levant crisis.(Israel,SYRIA,Lebanon,etc) - II
Posted: 05 Jan 2016 04:07
by TSJones
IndraD wrote:@ T S Jones
You accepted yourself Saudi is as worse as Iran
then why does US support Saudi, why UK helped Saudi get on human right panel ?
Obviously you know two wrongs do not make a right.
Obviously you should be just as offended at Iran. But you are not. Be true to your own values before you start pointing at others.
In a statement, US state spokesman John Kirby appealed to Saudi Arabia's government to respect and protect human rights, and to ensure fair and transparent judicial proceedings.
Mr Kirby also urged the Saudi government to permit peaceful expression of dissent and, along with other leaders in the region, to redouble efforts to reduce regional tensions.
Re: The Levant crisis.(Israel,SYRIA,Lebanon,etc) - II
Posted: 05 Jan 2016 04:27
by shaun
it's futile to convince this particular "what ever " that even if evidence are thrown at "its " face, that the regime it support kill its own people , the weapon supplied kill its own soliders , the dictators it supports gives safe sanctuary to its most wanted , it will remain devoid of emotion and pain .
Re: The Levant crisis.(Israel,SYRIA,Lebanon,etc) - II
Posted: 05 Jan 2016 05:49
by devesh
I hope both regimes weaken themselves and expose the underlying murderous greed of the theocracy, whether Shia or Sunni. This unmasking is necessary.
Re: The Levant crisis.(Israel,SYRIA,Lebanon,etc) - II
Posted: 05 Jan 2016 07:07
by Satya_anveshi
Trump: Hillary Clinton created ISIS together with Obama - uploaded Jan 04, 2016
"The SDF are basically taking areas that are of vital interest to the FSA. This falls within a Russian, Assad regime and SDF strategy to disconnect FSA from the IS front line, which would make them irrelevant in the eyes of the West," Hatahet said. This loss would deprive the FSA of bargaining power in the next negotiations on Syria.
Re: The Levant crisis.(Israel,SYRIA,Lebanon,etc) - II
Posted: 05 Jan 2016 07:57
by Singha
if the YPG pocket in the NW and Aleppo SAA forces can link up across the narrow green isthmus, the FSA and IS would be isolated as feared in the above. the Rus are probably already supplying arms to the YPG and the aleppo govt forces are getting the best units and equipment even if it means temporary losses on other fronts like IS reclaimed that black pocket in middle of map (maheen and surrounding) after 1st line forces withdrew.
Re: The Levant crisis.(Israel,SYRIA,Lebanon,etc) - II
Posted: 05 Jan 2016 08:23
by Satya_anveshi
posting here only because Shia-Sunni underpinnings in Levant crisis:
Day and night, for years, an overwhelming force has been battering this quiet nation, one of the cradles of human civilization.
Hundreds of thousands have died, and millions have been forced to flee abroad or have been internally displaced. In many cities and villages, not one house is left intact.
But Syria is, against all odds, still standing.
During the last 3 years I worked in almost all of Syria’s perimeters, exposing the birth of ISIS in the NATO-run camps built in Turkey and Jordan. I worked in the occupied Golan Heights, and in Iraq. I also worked in Lebanon, a country now forced to host over 2 million (mostly Syrian) refugees.
The only reason why the West began its horrible destabilization campaign, was because it “could not tolerate” Syria’s disobedience and the socialist nature of its state. In short, the way the Syrian establishment was putting the welfare of its people above the interests of multi-national corporations.
*
More than two years ago, my former Indonesian film editor demanded an answer in a somewhat angry tone:
“So many people are dying in Syria! Is it really worth it? Wouldn’t it be easier and better for Syrians to just give up and let the US have what it is demanding?”
Chronically petrified, this young woman was always searching for easy solutions that would keep her safe, and safe with significant personal advantages. As so many others in this time and age, in order to survive and advance, she developed a complex system resting on betrayals, self-defenses and deceptions.
How to reply to such a question?
It was a legitimate one, after all.
Eduardo Galeano told me: “People know when it’s time to fight. We have no right to tell them … but when they decide, it is our obligation to support them, even to lead them if they approach us.”
In this case, the Syrian people decided. No government, no political force could move an entire nation to such tremendous heroism and sacrifice. Russians did it during World War Two, and the Syrians are doing it now.
Two years ago I replied like this: “I have witnessed the total collapse of the Middle East. There was nothing standing there anymore. Countries that opted for their own paths were literally leveled to the ground. Countries that succumbed to the dictates of the West lost their soul, culture and essence and were turned into some of the most miserable places on earth. And the Syrians knew it: were they to surrender, they would be converted into another Iraq, Yemen or Libya, even Afghanistan.”
And so Syria rose. It decided to fight, for itself and for its part of the world.
Again and again, it retained itself through the elections of its government. It leaned on its army. Whatever the West says, whatever the treasonous NGOs write, the simple logic just proves it all.
This modest nation does not have its own powerful media to share the extent of its courage and agony with the world. It is always the others who are commenting on its struggle, often in a totally malicious way.
But it is undeniable that whilst the Soviet forces stopped the advance of the German Nazis at Stalingrad, the Syrians have managed to stop the fascist forces of Western allies in its part of the world.
Of course Russia got directly involved. Of course China stood by, although often in the shadow. And Iran provided support. And Lebanon-based Hezbollah put up, what I often describe as, an epic fight on behalf of Damascus against the extremist monsters invented and armed by the West, Turkey and Saudi Arabia.
But the main credit has to go to the Syrian people.
Yes, now there is nothing left of the Middle East. Now there are more tears than raindrops descending on this ancient land.
But Syria is standing. Burned, wounded, but standing.
And as is being widely reported, after the Russian armed forces came to the rescue of the Syrian nation, more than 1 million Syrian people were able to return home … often to encounter only ashes and devastation, but home.
Like people returned to Stalingrad, some 70 years ago.
*
So what would my answer be to that question now: “whether it would be easier the other way”, to surrender to the Empire?
I guess something like this:
“Life has meaning, it is worth living, only if some basic conditions can be fulfilled. One does not betray great love, be it love for another person or love for one’s country, humanity or ideals. If one does, it would be better not to be born at all. Then I say: the survival of humankind is the most sacred goal. Not some short-time personal gain or ‘safety’, but the survival of all of us, of people, as well as the safety of all of us, humans.”
When life itself is threatened, people tend to rise and fight, instinctively. During such moments, some of the most monumental chapters in human history are written.
Unfortunately, during these moments, millions tend to die.
But the devastation is not because of those who are defending our human race.
It is because of the imperialist monsters and their servants.
Most of us are dreaming about a world without wars, without violence. We want true kindness to prevail on earth. Many of us are working relentlessly for such a society.
But until it is constructed, until all extreme selfishness, greed and brutality are defeated, we have to fight for something much more “modest” – for the survival of people and of humanism.
The price is often horrible. But the alternative is one enormous gaping void. It is simply nothing – the end, full stop!
In Stalingrad, millions died so we could live. Nothing was left of the city, except some melted steel, scattered bricks and an ocean of corpses. Nazism was stopped. Western expansionism began its retreat, that time towards Berlin.
Now Syria, quietly but stoically and heroically, stands against Western, Qatari, Saudi, Israeli and Turkish plans to finish the Middle East.
And the Syrian people have won. For how long, I don’t know. But it has proven that an Arab country can still defeat the mightiest murderous hordes.
Andre Vltchek is philosopher, novelist, filmmaker and investigative journalist, he’s a creator of Vltchek’s World an a dedicated Twitter user, especially for the online magazine “New Eastern Outlook”.
Tony Cartalucci - Surreal: West Mourns Death of Al Qaeda Collaborator in Syrian Airstrike
Jaysh al-Islam is a stalwart ally of US State Department-listed terrorist organization al-Nusra, though one would never suspect as much reading weepy Western eulogies over the terrorist organization leader's death
January 3, 2016 (Tony Cartalucci - NEO) - The commander of terrorist organization and Al Qaeda affiliate Jaysh al-Islam (the Army of Islam), "Sheikh" Zahran Alloush, was killed in a Syrian airstrike this week in the suburbs of Damascus.
In a surreal, coordinated propaganda campaign, the Western media sidestepped Alloush's praise of and coordination with US State Department-listed foreign terrorist organization Jabhat al-Nusra, previously known as Al Qaeda in Iraq - and indeed, the very terrorist organization that the so-called "Islamic State" (ISIS/ISIL/Daesh) itself sprung up from.
The West itself has for years now, reported on Jaysh al-Islam's collaboration with Al Qaeda. A March 2013 Institute for the Study of War report authored by now disgraced "expert" Elizabeth O'Bagy - a paid lobbyist who in fact attempted to lie about the presence of "moderate Syrian opposition," titled, "The Free Syrian Army" (.pdf) would note regarding the terrorist organization that:
Liwa al-Islam [now known as Jaysh al-Islam] is a driving force behind actions in Damascus, and is part of the current multilateral effort, codenamed “Operation Epic in the Capital of the Omayyads,” to gain ground and prepare for later sustained efforts against regime forces in the city. Liwa al-Islam is known to cooperate with Jabhat Nusra and conduct joint operations.
---------------
Syria Rebel Leader’s Assassination a Major Blow to US Agenda
by Eric Draitser
News of the death of prominent anti-Assad commander (or ‘terrorist,’ ‘rebel,’ ‘opposition commander,’ etc.) Zahran Alloush has the potential to radically alter the nature of the war in Syria.
Considering Alloush and other senior members of the leadership of the Salafist militant group Jaish al-Islam were killed in a major airstrike carried out by the Syrian air force, there is undoubtedly going to be a transformation on the ground as initiative on the battlefield, particularly in Southern Syria, shifts still further to the Syrian Arab Army and its allies.
With Alloush out of the picture and, based on reports coming from sources inside the opposition, significant disarray at the uppermost echelons of leadership of the barely cohesive “Islamic Army,” it seems clear that the Syrian government is likely to move in to reestablish control of Douma, Ghouta, and other rebel-held suburbs of Damascus.
Re: The Levant crisis.(Israel,SYRIA,Lebanon,etc) - II
Posted: 05 Jan 2016 09:41
by deejay
SA ji, regarding Shia- Sunni thing - There was a total bandh in Kargil two days ago. Kargil is predominantly - Shia.
Re: The Levant crisis.(Israel,SYRIA,Lebanon,etc) - II
Posted: 05 Jan 2016 10:04
by Satya_anveshi
yes, deejay ji, even paki occupied balawaristan (gilgit-baltistan agency) is also shia majority though pukes settled many sunni pathans there diluting the majority mix.
the more shia-sunni fissures surface, good for us. It is one of the divisions that bothers them and we should thoroughly exploit it.
Puki mortal fear of joining soddy barbarian terrorists coalition may be that they will lose kashmir for good.
Re: The Levant crisis.(Israel,SYRIA,Lebanon,etc) - II
Posted: 05 Jan 2016 10:46
by sum
Satya_anveshi wrote:posting here only because Shia-Sunni underpinnings in Levant crisis:
This is second such Shiite march in India (I posted one from Mumbai earlier related to Arbaeen ).
Kargil and many parts of N.Kashmir had a complete shutdown on this event
Re: The Levant crisis.(Israel,SYRIA,Lebanon,etc) - II
Posted: 05 Jan 2016 10:49
by deejay
There have been Shia protests in Karachi in front of Saudi Consulate. The Sheikh Nimr beheading is refusing to die down. Fissures are opening up.
Re: The Levant crisis.(Israel,SYRIA,Lebanon,etc) - II
Posted: 05 Jan 2016 11:25
by habal
Nimr killing may be attempt by Saudi-Turkey (execution came after Turkish Turdogan visit to KSA) to inflame Iran and shift focus from Syria to Iran. Remember one thing, even against Libya the western sanctions were lifted just before Bliar & Obama decided to do regime change there. Maybe this is like a last gambit by KSA-Turkey to see if they get any dividends and their mentors can get any excuse for supporting these puppets.
Re: The Levant crisis.(Israel,SYRIA,Lebanon,etc) - II
Posted: 05 Jan 2016 12:40
by deejay
Indian in ISIS of British Origin:
BBC Breaking NewsVerified account
@BBCBreaking
Briton Siddhartha Dhar thought to be main suspect in IS propaganda video, BBC understands http://bbc.in/1mwknou
We can snark at each other forever about phony moral symmetry but the fact (which you ought to have been aware of since you have hung around here forever) is that, as Indians we have a stronger civilizational affinity with Iranians than with Saudis, and we generally believe that Iranians haven't totally let go of their core civilizational values and are hence more redeemable than the Saudis for whom the current state represents the acme of what they have achieved or are likely to achieve in creating a humane civilization.
This is a wide generalization. Iran is as virus stricken as Saudi Arabia or Afghanistan. It would be a sad day if "perceived civilizational affinity" were to cloud our judgement and influence foreign policy.
IMHO, we should be as ugly, slimy, forked-tongued hypocrites as the Americans when it comes to seeking out and pursuing our national interests.Lectures on human rights, democracy, freedom etc are included.
Re: The Levant crisis.(Israel,SYRIA,Lebanon,etc) - II
Posted: 05 Jan 2016 14:35
by habal
One of the largest donors to the Clinton Foundation is Saudi Arabia's brutally repressive absolute monarchy.
Re: The Levant crisis.(Israel,SYRIA,Lebanon,etc) - II
Posted: 05 Jan 2016 14:36
by Lalmohan
the current iranian regime is no better than the saudis. however, it is more likely that a 'normal' iranian regime will emerge over the coming years and take its place amongst the civilised nations. the same hope cannot be held for the gulf arabs
Re: The Levant crisis.(Israel,SYRIA,Lebanon,etc) - II
Posted: 05 Jan 2016 14:40
by habal
Atleast they are not heading UN Human Rights Council.
Re: The Levant crisis.(Israel,SYRIA,Lebanon,etc) - II
Posted: 05 Jan 2016 14:42
by Vikas
When Push comes to shove against Kaffir, both Iran and KSA will join hands to slaughter the Kuffar and lay claim on women and children. I have no hope from both the strains.
My only concern is that this war between Shia-Sunni should not spill into India especially in this age of communication and SM.
Re: The Levant crisis.(Israel,SYRIA,Lebanon,etc) - II
Posted: 05 Jan 2016 14:57
by Aditya_V
On the contrary, it could be useful as the psuedo secular divide for 10 years can give the breathing space India needs..
Re: The Levant crisis.(Israel,SYRIA,Lebanon,etc) - II
Posted: 05 Jan 2016 14:59
by durvasa
While Russia or India can support Iran for tactical reasons and US supports Sauds, it serves Indian, and for that matter most non-Islamic world, objectives to keep this Islamic cancer divided.
Ever before Islam, Persians and us did not have that great relations. Sura-As(h)ura eternal battle stories encapsulate some of those struggles Indics had with Persians. US, it seems, has a much better handle on the long term scenario as Sauds can hardly be considered a long term threat. This single-family estate will dissipate once oil loses its importance or even otherwise. Iran is a much older civilisation with hardy, proud, masochistic and reasonably intelligent people. They represent a much bigger threat to India in the long term than KSA or Pakistan. Mughals and other invaders were more Iranian-Turkic than Arabic.
Re: The Levant crisis.(Israel,SYRIA,Lebanon,etc) - II
Posted: 05 Jan 2016 15:03
by Chinmayanand
Looks like a full blown war awaits Iran and KSA. Hope Russia delivers the much needed mil hardware to Iran fast and discounted. Let one go down first. Yemen shows that Shias have more fight in them compared to Sunnis. Well, the Sunnis do have the liberty to prove me wrong.
Re: The Levant crisis.(Israel,SYRIA,Lebanon,etc) - II
Posted: 05 Jan 2016 15:10
by habal
VikasRaina wrote:When Push comes to shove against Kaffir, both Iran and KSA will join hands to slaughter the Kuffar and lay claim on women and children. I have no hope from both the strains.
My only concern is that this war between Shia-Sunni should not spill into India especially in this age of communication and SM.
VikarRaina, what you write is true of partition era India. When Shia Jinnah collaborated with Sunni Iqbal and Sunni Syed Ahmed Khan to give the philosophical basis for partition. But a lot of water has passed under the bridge since.
Today ISIS and Sunni Arabs are no different.
But Shia dominated countries like Syria, Lebanon, Iraq etc atleast do not have same antipathy towards minorities as Saudi Arabia, Qatar, Pakistan, Sudan and similar uncivilized countries.
Druze, Christians, Yazidis, Sunnis, Kurds have atleast made a living under Shia rule.
but minorities like Yazidis, Kurds, Assyrians, Druze have only been raped, murdered, beheaded, abused, enslaved under Sunni rule.
Re: The Levant crisis.(Israel,SYRIA,Lebanon,etc) - II
Posted: 05 Jan 2016 15:20
by Aditya_V
We should be neutral, given that we have more 100 million of 1 sect and 50 million of the other, plus 6 million Indian workers in GCC. We can't even dream of foreign deployments until we have our MIC and grow into a much bigger economy.
Re: The Levant crisis.(Israel,SYRIA,Lebanon,etc) - II
Posted: 05 Jan 2016 15:46
by deejay
Foreign deployment? Abhi toh we are not ready to even react militarily to Pathankot, Mazar e Shrif, Jallalabad ...
Let us first deploy in India.
Re: The Levant crisis.(Israel,SYRIA,Lebanon,etc) - II
Posted: 05 Jan 2016 15:51
by Chinmayanand
Aditya_V wrote:We should be neutral, given that we have more 100 million of 1 sect and 50 million of the other, plus 6 million Indian workers in GCC. We can't even dream of foreign deployments until we have our MIC and grow into a much bigger economy.
This is interesting. How big should it be? Let's put a number to it. Russian economy is way smaller than Chinese economy but it can put a fight abroad but China can't .
Apart from a big economy say $10 trillion and a MIC which we may not get in the next 3 decades and ofcourse the will & confidence and an understanding of potential consequences .
Re: The Levant crisis.(Israel,SYRIA,Lebanon,etc) - II
Posted: 05 Jan 2016 15:56
by habal
Iran fights in Syria, supports Houthis in Yemen, supports hezbollah in Lebanon and fights Israel in proxy war all over middle east. Fight Saudi Arabia across Middle East. And takes on USA at times. It has not even quarter of economic size of China. But it has civilizational confidence.
Russia has both MIC and civilizational confidence that it can fight wars abroad and win.
China doesn't have that unless they are threatened and pushed against the wall, they do not have the confidence to deploy externally. India is in same boat.
So clearly it isn't economy or MIC that is responsible here.
Re: The Levant crisis.(Israel,SYRIA,Lebanon,etc) - II
Posted: 05 Jan 2016 16:06
by habal
this is how it looks like. An intact VBIED.
@Mahin in Homs countryside
Re: The Levant crisis.(Israel,SYRIA,Lebanon,etc) - II
