Indian Foreign Policy

[Philip]

A channel alleges that there is a secret Snake-oil-Singh,Sharif deal which is in the works.It appears that the uniformed ungodly tribes of Pak have their own agenda.Nevertheless,just list out the never-ending roll of Paki terrorist and military atrocities carried out against India and even one simple act of diplomatic 'slap on the wrists' against Pak ever under this gutless,spineless bunch of eunuchs of the UPA-2? This Pak's festive gift to India.

[ramana]

ShyamD, All those US guys signing off on TSP planes taking off is bunkum to keep Indians happy. Chuck Yeager was one eager beaver guy doing similar stuff. And the guy was actively interoggating POW IAF pilots in his own memoirs. They are all in it together.

Its nice to think GOI is doing something when its contrary tot he fact.

If they wer doing something they would be more protective of their own personnel in Kabuul. They wouldnt have allowed the young IFS guy and the military attache die in the attack. Nor the doctors.
Only those who are not doing naything will be so carelss about hteir own security for they cannot imagein any retaliation for what the do elsewhere.

And Philip, Even that channel is bunkum. With what face and MMS do a deal with Badmash?

Currently UPA has no majority in the Lok Sabha and survives by blackmailing Mulyam Singh Yadav and others of his ilk.
IOW it has no legitimacy.

[prahaar]

They were struggling to get aid prior to the arab unrest. More recently they were about a few months away from bankruptcy. Can you imagine if we went to war - their friends would have lined up to bail them out. Their F16's now need sign off by a US guy sitting on their base for every flight. Everything their AF does these days is under tight US controls. One of the victories of our diplomacy.

Situations are different. Can't really compare the two. What has the US done since they and ISAF are losing troops every other day to ISI perfidy?

I agree. But you cannot compare ISAF casualties with Indian ones, our troops are getting killed in our own country, if that does not change calibration of response, I do not know what would. I see that on one hand you like to not compare situations but are readily giving US examples of inaction. US is not our benchmark. If US soldiers were killed on US soil, the world would know about it.

GoI and its entities.

I am sure GOI will have great words to pacify the fallen soldiers' families. Why is it so tough for people to admit that GOI arms are more confused than ever and do not have any plan? There is no harm in saying, we are clueless about this problem. They (GOI) seem to have given so many guarantees about pakistan to so many entities (external as well as internal) that there is actually nothing they can do (it seems). If my understanding is baseless, I am ready to be corrected, without shame.

[Philip]

It is so evident that the appeasement of Pak is solely because of the fact that Pak is a Muslim country and that the Cong/UPA depends heavily upon the minority vote at home.Raising communal tension in the run-up to general elections and planning secret deals with our mortal enemy,regardless of the mountain of Paki perfidy,the latest being just another atrocity that has been a regular feature for the last decade.What is now happening is that the morale of the armed forces ,who are laying down their lives for the nation,is being battered by the callous indifference of the ruling clique and their accompanying claque.To shamelessly whitewash the Paki military as AKA has done,despite its himalayan track record of perfidy,is perhaps the worst act of treachery committed against the armed forces by any of our defence ministers since Independence.One perhaps can forgive his incompetence and dithering,wanting to save his image by passing the buck,but this is unforgiveable.

[ramana]

Contrast the govt policy towards TSP, Maldives with the policy towards Sri Lanka, Bhutan or Nepal. Salman Khurshi* and even the MEA spokesman being picked with communal mind is a low point of MEA history.

[habal]

Only issue with Congress is that they have officially turned into an anti-Hindu institution. As I have said before, Congress is remnants of the Mughal darbar that was left remaining after Bahadur Shah Zafar was kicked out of Dehli. It changed it's orientation slightly after Sonia's arrival, and turned towards Christianity, but as a constant still remained anti-hindu. Christianity provided an opening to US-based baptist, pentecostal & mormon proslytization in India, Sonia opened the gates meanwhile she remained beholden to the RC church of Rome. Again non-Indian inputs at all levels of leadership. The only saving grace was that the bureaucracy, officialdom and serving classes still remained staunchly Indic, thus covering up some of the ill-effects of the policies adopted at top-leadership level.

Congress has pushed itself into a corner due to continuing to hang on to Nehru-Firoz legacy and it's princelets.

Even Manmohan Singh who probably even today draws pension from WB or IMF or both, continues to cater to his core constituency. the US State Dept and american foreign policy wonks. Chidambaram & Rahul feel freer to talk internal affairs with US ambassador. It is clearly an outsourced govt who are answerable only to US, WB, IMF etc. Their internal policy is muslim-oriented votebank policy. And thus the paralysis against Pakistan. Pakistan meanwhile has done better here, they kicked out Shaukat Aziz when they could.

[Virupaksha]

I am long past the phase where I give benefit of doubt to MMS and Sonia. When every one was baiting them during 26/11, I said I am okay that an failure occured during their regime and I was more interested in seeing how they make sure the next doesnt happen. And they have failed spectacularly to even try. Their spokepersons(Yes, Diggyraja, I see him as their voice) who said saffron terror did it, was my last straw in giving benefit of doubt.

Diggy Raja has nothing to do with what we are actually doing in TSP - Diggy is talking just for local info consumption and vote banks. Fortunately, such idiots have nothing to do with foreign policy.

Terror attacks can happen anywhere in any country - even the most secure like Israel (a tiny country with tiny borders in comparison with the size of Indian borders). Securing a country is not as easy as people think despite all the money and technology available.

When a traitor is backed with such lahori logic, it tells more about the commentator than the traitor himself or ...?

I dont see any difference between this commentator's logic and the logic of a person who says that a rape victim was because she was showing ankles.

Shyamd, why is this lahori logic becoming Shyamd's logic?

[Philip]

"A Deadly Triangle",

By William Dalrymple,published by the Brookings Institution.
He sees the danger of an "escalating conflict" between India and Pak.

A very interesting read in full.

http://www.brookings.edu/research/essay ... an-india-c

[ramana]

X-post...

Jyoti Malhotra spills out her inner Pakistaniyat..in the TOIlet.

I am a Pakistani Agent

After a tirade on Samajwadi party and BJP, Joyti Malhotra, a true blu dilli billi whines about the real reason for her wanting to be a Pakistani while enjoying Delhi comforts:

The real tragedy from the unwarranted killing of the Indian soldiers on the LoC and this morning's hullabaloo in Parliament will be a possible cancellation of talks between Manmohan Singh and the recently elected Pakistan prime minister Nawaz Sharif, expected to take place on September 24 in New York, on the margins of the UN General Assembly. God knows this will be a retrograde measure because no one needs India's support today more than Nawaz Sharif. In fact, if he could condemn the cross-LoC intrusion from the floor of the Indian parliament, he would.

This ignores the fact that Badmash was the PM when TSP launched the Kargil offensive. And he did nothing to undercut his "out of control" forces! I call him Badmash fo rhtis perfidy. If the TSPA had won a major vioctory he would have owned up to the invasion. Since they got defeated he diswons them and claims rogue Mushy led the operations!

One thing Dilli Billis need to understand. The leadership of TSP is elected or dethroned by Pakistanis. No amount of Indian giving gifts,/rope/large heart will not influence the Paki mind. It is throughly diseased with frustration at not getting what the Birtsh and Americans promised them from India's cost.}

Certainly, India should take tough action against the Pakistani army and/or its government when things like this come to pass. However, I also believe that the people of India and Pakistan must be insulated from the foolhardiness of their governments. For far too long both peoples have suffered, both divided families as well as friends. I resent the fact that it is far easier for non-South Asians to get visas to travel to Pakistan -- and presumably, India -- than those of us from South Asia.


{Here she shows her arrogance at not being able to travel to TSP. She equates the GOI with TSP in her frustration at the prospect of cancellation of the potential sellout by a lame duck MMS in new York.

Now after the vast refugee culling that has happend in TSP whcih divided fmaily does she have in TSP? Maybe she should move to a non-South Asian land if she so desires to go to TSP with a visa. OTH with her attitude they might even welcome her without a visa}

If all the above makes me a Pakistani agent, then I guess, I am.

There is cognitive dissonance among the Delhi chatteratti with ties to TSP from pre-Partition days. They are having a Neville Chamberlain like "peace in our time" Munich moment. Ten years of UPA are coming to an end and hence this rush to settle even on unbeneficial terms.

They create fissures deep in India while they sellout India at the borders.

[shyamd]

ShyamD, All those US guys signing off on TSP planes taking off is bunkum to keep Indians happy. Chuck Yeager was one eager beaver guy doing similar stuff. And the guy was actively interoggating POW IAF pilots in his own memoirs. They are all in it together.

Ramana, Ok so lets assume its not true. But that still doesn't change the fact that India is more interested in developing the economy and as we grow in size TSP is ceasing to be relevant to us. This decision was made decades ago. Today TSPA themselves admit they are no match for us. They will keep trying to use terror and other such tactics to break our will, but its not going to work and they are just using it to milk the 3 and a half cows by getting us to react to it. Keep the jihadi's on side and give US a clear and easy exit.

If they wer doing something they would be more protective of their own personnel in Kabuul. They wouldnt have allowed the young IFS guy and the military attache die in the attack. Nor the doctors.
Only those who are not doing naything will be so carelss about hteir own security for they cannot imagein any retaliation for what the do elsewhere.

What exactly were you expecting us to do? That neighborhood is one of the most secure areas in Kabul - if not the most secure - if i recall correctly, it was intel warnings the week before the Kabul attack that caused them to fortify the embassy even more and build bomb protections - which probably saved lives inside the embassy.

[shyamd]

When a traitor is backed with such lahori logic, it tells more about the commentator than the traitor himself or ...?

I dont see any difference between this commentator's logic and the logic of a person who says that a rape victim was because she was showing ankles.

Shyamd, why is this lahori logic becoming Shyamd's logic?

Eh? I don't understand your logic boss? Are you saying I am saying its okay for TSP to do what they are doing? In which case I am saying NO! I am saying, no nation can protect itself from terror as a tactic - not even the US (as we most recently found out in Boston - funnily enough months before Boston I pointed out the US has been lucky and low and behold Boston happened) and even in a state like Israel which has a fraction of the borders we have. Even yesterday BBC Panorama did a special on Boston bombings - US intel officials admit themselves that they have been lucky - they said 40 plots were stopped post 9/11 not because the US had the ability to stop them but because of faulty planning by the executors.

Seriously, if you think the US is secure - please watch this program on youtube - its called Border Wars - its a NatGeo series on drug wars and border management in the US. You can hear it in their own words from officers on the ground and see for yourself how much gets through and they can only manage to stop a fraction of whats going in and out.

I am also saying you are paying far too much attention to Diggy/Doggy who has nothing to do with foreign policy decisions.

Added later: Late Raman ji was frustrated but he doesn't understand what else is taking place in that part of the world and why we don't need to get our hands dirty.

[nachiket]

Ramana, Ok so lets assume its not true. But that still doesn't change the fact that India is more interested in developing the economy and as we grow in size TSP is ceasing to be relevant to us.

Err...you do realize that our economy is in the toilet right? So the grand plan doesn't really seem to be working out. Go and tell the families of the dead soldiers or the victims of paki terrorist attacks that "TSP is no longer relevant".

[shyamd]

^^ Our economy is in the toilet? Dude I am talking over the last decade we have had peace (and the periods before that too) - we have taken more people out of poverty (millions out of poverty) than any time in our history. And 5% growth is not ridiculously bad - that too at much higher base. Sure they could have done a better job of managing the economy but thats besides the point - can you imagine what these figures would have been like if we are actively fighting wars?

[ramana]

shyamd, You are taking the argument inot the silly zone.
Do you agree or do you need Chadamabaram to tell you:
- Currently the economy is in toilet with rupee in free fall and anxious measures to stem its fall.
- No Western interest in investing in India where the govt mismanages and allows all the profits to be erased by the falling rupee.
- Growth rate is in the 5% from the 8-9% previous years which means its in slowdown aka recession.
- High inflation for all consumer goods
So where is the dream economy for which the people were told to suffer and soldier die unarmed?

BSF forces are not allowed to carry high capacity firearms.
If it isn't for the LKA type opposition leaders this govt would have fallen yesterday!

Cartton in Deccan Chronicle a very pro-Congress paper from HYD.



It should have read we just got a super economist to run RBI to stop the falling rupee!

[brihaspati]

shyamd ji,
can you give us any other example of a nation that pursued pure economic development avoiding desperately to appear to want any retaliation and any war with a consistent and persistent neighbouring enemy - and thus avoided war and poverty both?

Do you consider any area where India does needs to get its hands "dirty" outside its current borders ? Trying to ignore the freudian slip in "dirty" anyway.

[Prem]

Lets assume both ShyamD's and counter argument is correct. Why not take action against Overgroud Indian born Internal Pakis working against the country. Every terroist attack is good oportunity to clean the very obvious visible filth. 5 Indian soldiers died, cremate 500 Hurirats and Psecs within 17 days. Benarsi Burning Pyers space ought not to be wasted and utilized fully for Shuddi.

[shyamd]

shyamd, You are taking the argument inot the silly zone.
Do you agree or do you need Chadamabaram to tell you:
- Currently the economy is in toilet with rupee in free fall and anxious measures to stem its fall.
- No Western interest in investing in India where the govt mismanages and allows all the profits to be erased by the falling rupee.
- Growth rate is in the 5% from the 8-9% previous years which means its in slowdown aka recession.
- High inflation for all consumer goods
So where is the dream economy for which the people were told to suffer and soldier die unarmed?

BSF forces are not allowed to carry high capacity firearms.
If it isn't for the LKA type opposition leaders this govt would have fallen yesterday!

Yes I agree (I have never disputed this fact) economy is in bad shape NOW due to UPA's fudge up in the last few years and it will get worse. My point was looking at the bigger picture. BUT answer me one simple question: has the economy not grown tremendously whilst we have has a period of peace? As you point out yourself - 8-9% growth. India always suffers from high inflation - we are importers of energy.

Lets say if we went to war, the deficit will be worse (due to importing weapons) and we would be in an even worse position.

[ramana]

then you will hurt the vote banks!
See power get elected to loot is more important so long as common man dies.

[ramana]

Guns or butter is false argument.

When your butter is dalda.

There i ssomething called proportionate retaliation. Who is asking for all out war?

In game theory there is somethig called "Evolutiion of Cooperation". It shows that random tit-for tat brings about cooperation very quickly. This no hitting back ever encourages constant hurt.
And meantime the very reasons given for not hitting back turn out to be illusory then what is going on?
What is hurtful is the claim to be a democracy but never ever share the decisions with the peole and mumble at every important occassion.
Its more like a subedari of the Moguls.

[shyamd]

Quick victory post 26/11 before elections would have got the votes too... We don't view war for short term aims - never have. Always long term perspective. Plenty of opportunities for corruption too with import of arms.

The tit for tat will take place - it just won't be when the media is watching to escalate matters (stated position by the army btw). Gen JJS authorised use of snipers in that sector - to hit them hard which we have been doing.

[Philip]

The Rupee is in a fatal downward spin,and the circus contortions of the troika of humpty dumptys,Dr.Snake-oil Singh,his Sancho Panza,Montek and Wal-mart wizard PC,combinedly cannot arrest its fall.

The UPA's "great white hope" to recover from the "spin" is a p*ss with Pak and lots of cross-border trade,replacing cross-border terror. An impossible dream,but heavily promoted by the regime's white massa,Uncle Sam,who is retreating from Afghanistan,tail between legs,and desperately needs Pakistan to prevent Al Q and the Taliban ungodlies from yet again turning that country into the HQ of anti-US/Western terror.So servile Singh and his merry men at Uncle Sam's behest are girding their loincloths,ready to dance to the tune of the Paki military bands who continue with their deadly pastime of beheading and picking off Indian soldiers at their pleasure.These "unfortunate" incidents ,like the other matter of the "Chinese take-away" of Indian territory,should not upset us says our latter-day Solomon,Salman-the-Cursed,and should be treated like "acne".Pimples,pinpricks -these trifling irritations must not deter us from our avowed goal of becoming the west's chief lackey and world's most servile and impotent state,where tiny tots like Lanka and the Maldives can shake their rattles in our face and watch us cower in retreat!

In a poem I wrote last year about our "Titanic" state of affairs,the last line still holds good:

"Don't worry about the loss of lives,what matters is that the dynasty survives!"

PS:The Whoopie....oops! The Rupee ,is now almost 62 to the almighty $ and the stock market has tanked by 450 pts.Dr.Singh and his expert team of financial surgeons who are in their terminal stages of disease ,seem unable to save the patient who may shortly ask for a second opinion!

[RoyG]

Quick victory post 26/11 before elections would have got the votes too... We don't view war for short term aims - never have. Always long term perspective. Plenty of opportunities for corruption too with import of arms.

The tit for tat will take place - it just won't be when the media is watching to escalate matters (stated position by the army btw). Gen JJS authorised use of snipers in that sector - to hit them hard which we have been doing.

So we've been killing them with snipers? How many kills? Surprised the pakis haven't made any claims. Lemme guess...your source told you?

[Virupaksha]

When a traitor is backed with such lahori logic, it tells more about the commentator than the traitor himself or ...?

I dont see any difference between this commentator's logic and the logic of a person who says that a rape victim was because she was showing ankles.

Shyamd, why is this lahori logic becoming Shyamd's logic?

Eh? I don't understand your logic boss? Are you saying I am saying its okay for TSP to do what they are doing? In which case I am saying NO! I am saying, no nation can protect itself from terror as a tactic - not even the US (as we most recently found out in Boston - funnily enough months before Boston I pointed out the US has been lucky and low and behold Boston happened) and even in a state like Israel which has a fraction of the borders we have. Even yesterday BBC Panorama did a special on Boston bombings - US intel officials admit themselves that they have been lucky - they said 40 plots were stopped post 9/11 not because the US had the ability to stop them but because of faulty planning by the executors.

Seriously, if you think the US is secure - please watch this program on youtube - its called Border Wars - its a NatGeo series on drug wars and border management in the US. You can hear it in their own words from officers on the ground and see for yourself how much gets through and they can only manage to stop a fraction of whats going in and out.

I am also saying you are paying far too much attention to Diggy/Doggy who has nothing to do with foreign policy decisions.

Added later: Late Raman ji was frustrated but he doesn't understand what else is taking place in that part of the world and why we don't need to get our hands dirty.

For the added later part: If you are so understanding, why dont you enlighten us, because all I am seeing is India joining hands with the Soudi islamist cabal?

Who cares about the US? Infact you need to reread what I wrote, I am okay with mistakes happening, as long as an honest try is made to rectify atleast post facto.

I can understand why anybody can be frustrated, because nobody has given a logical explanation of why 26/11 can be forgotten within 6 months in Sharm-al-Shiekh. All I hear is "trust me, I know better." Basically, MMS and Sonia are saying while they dont trust Indians, the Indians will have to repose unwavering and unflinching trust in them.

Regarding Diggy, why shouldnt I pay attention to him? Isnt he one of the trusted leutanents/gurus of Sonia and Rahul? For god's sake, he is going to decide how they will divide my state. I havent seen one slap on wrist from Sonia and Rahul on him, which they seem to give for everyone else for smaller minor statements, which just shows that Diggy is their voice. And I WILL listen to what the maharani says. When Rahul baba says green terror is not a big risk, I listen to it as well.

Shyamd, any arguments or information which dont end in "trust me, I know better"?

When the maldives coup took place and we said, it was an islamist coup. Your statement was the general was an Indian blessed one and that "trust me, I know better". Then when the islamists started ruling the roast and kicked out GMR, then suddenly everything for "peace and prosperity" went out of the window, now chinese and islamists were driving the coup, which we said at the first instant.

[Virupaksha]

How about taking away Pakistan's MFN status? How about killing dawood?

To achieve what exactly? You kill dawood - someone else replaces him. Takeaway MFN and what leverage do you have? You fall straight into the TSPA's plans which is to have as little leverage with India as possible.

Leverage is meant to be used. What exactly are we using this leverage for?

I believe this is what is happening. A monkey's hand is in cookie jar and it cant take its hand out with its fist full of cookies. The monkey thinks keeping its hand in cookie jar and holding onto cookies is "leverage"

[shyamd]

For the added later part: If you are so understanding, why dont you enlighten us, because all I am seeing is India joining hands with the Soudi islamist cabal?

LOL! I have many times before, unfortunately I don't have the time to go into it again.

Who cares about the US? Infact you need to reread what I wrote, I am okay with mistakes happening, as long as an honest try is made to rectify atleast post facto.

Who said there hasn't been one? Have you not noticed any of the post 26/11 exercises - upgrading CG, coastal police networks etc.

I can understand why anybody can be frustrated, because nobody has given a logical explanation of why 26/11 can be forgotten within 6 months in Sharm-al-Shiekh. All I hear is "trust me, I know better." Basically, MMS and Sonia are saying while they dont trust Indians, the Indians will have to repose unwavering and unflinching trust in them.

Regarding Diggy, why shouldnt I pay attention to him? Isnt he one of the trusted leutanents/gurus of Sonia and Rahul? For god's sake, he is going to decide how they will divide my state. I havent seen one slap on wrist from Sonia and Rahul on him, which they seem to give for everyone else for smaller minor statements, which just shows that Diggy is their voice. And I WILL listen to what the maharani says. When Rahul baba says green terror is not a big risk, I listen to it as well.

The likely explanation of the 'I know better..' is because they have access to info that we don't. They are using Diggy to appeal to vote bank. That is all. If you insist on buying that its their voice then thats your decision.

Shyamd, any arguments or information which dont end in "trust me, I know better"?

Which bit specifically?

When the maldives coup took place and we said, it was an islamist coup. Your statement was the general was an Indian blessed one and that "trust me, I know better". Then when the islamists started ruling the roast and kicked out GMR, then suddenly everything for "peace and prosperity" went out of the window, now chinese and islamists were driving the coup, which we said at the first instant.

You know Nasheed said in public it was backed by India after the event or at least had Indian neutrality. But he didn't play it up because he needs Indian support. India wasn't just sitting around - we moved our Naval exercises (one of the largest - TROPEX) off the coast of Maldives to prevent any thing going haywire. Well, just because it was Indian backed doesn't mean the party can do a double cross or change their mind once they are in power.

[shyamd]

Leverage is meant to be used. What exactly are we using this leverage for?

I believe this is what is happening. A monkey's hand is in cookie jar and it cant take its hand out with its fist full of cookies. The monkey thinks keeping its hand in cookie jar and holding onto cookies is "leverage"

For starters you need to build trade first and grow it before you have any leverage. Taking away MFN won't make any difference - maybe soothe a few egos but thats all. Letting it grow to a sizeable figure and then taking it away will make much more of a diff. TSPA know that and don't want us to gain that leverage.

[Virupaksha]

For the added later part: If you are so understanding, why dont you enlighten us, because all I am seeing is India joining hands with the Soudi islamist cabal?

LOL! I have many times before, unfortunately I don't have the time to go into it again.

I have been following your posts in quite a long time, all of them when critically questioned, end with "trust me, I know better"

Who cares about the US? Infact you need to reread what I wrote, I am okay with mistakes happening, as long as an honest try is made to rectify atleast post facto.

Who said there hasn't been one? Have you not noticed any of the post 26/11 exercises - upgrading CG, coastal police networks etc.

I said honest, not hollow.

Where has been an attempt to go at the local networks? 26/11 had significant local helps, were those networks smashed, oh wait!! Diggiraja and vote banks are more important than a repeat of 26/11.

I can understand why anybody can be frustrated, because nobody has given a logical explanation of why 26/11 can be forgotten within 6 months in Sharm-al-Shiekh. All I hear is "trust me, I know better." Basically, MMS and Sonia are saying while they dont trust Indians, the Indians will have to repose unwavering and unflinching trust in them.

Regarding Diggy, why shouldnt I pay attention to him? Isnt he one of the trusted leutanents/gurus of Sonia and Rahul? For god's sake, he is going to decide how they will divide my state. I havent seen one slap on wrist from Sonia and Rahul on him, which they seem to give for everyone else for smaller minor statements, which just shows that Diggy is their voice. And I WILL listen to what the maharani says. When Rahul baba says green terror is not a big risk, I listen to it as well.

The likely explanation of the 'I know better..' is because they have access to info that we don't.

Right, exactly as it happened when Nehru was screaming, "trust me, I know better" with china in 1962, in maldives.

With the islamist blind eye, it is the commons who have had to suffer for "trust me, I know better".

They are using Diggy to appeal to vote bank. That is all. If you insist on buying that its their voice then thats your decision.

Shyamd, any arguments or information which dont end in "trust me, I know better"?

Which bit specifically?

Any argument when questioned critically.

When the maldives coup took place and we said, it was an islamist coup. Your statement was the general was an Indian blessed one and that "trust me, I know better". Then when the islamists started ruling the roast and kicked out GMR, then suddenly everything for "peace and prosperity" went out of the window, now chinese and islamists were driving the coup, which we said at the first instant.

You know Nasheed said in public it was backed by India after the event or at least had Indian neutrality. But he didn't play it up because he needs Indian support. India wasn't just sitting around - we moved our Naval exercises (one of the largest - TROPEX) off the coast of Maldives to prevent any thing going haywire. Well, just because it was Indian backed doesn't mean the party can do a double cross or change their mind once they are in power.

Another case of "trust me, I know better" when questioned and then when the inevitable follows, oops, you commons suffer, we will enjoy in our palaces - ala 1962, the partition.

[shyamd]

I have been following your posts in quite a long time, all of them when critically questioned, end with "trust me, I know better"

Lol. Clearly you haven't well enough - other wise you would know what I am referring to.

Where has been an attempt to go at the local networks? 26/11 had significant local helps, were those networks smashed, oh wait!! Diggiraja and vote banks are more important than a repeat of 26/11.

Fair point. But they are now obviously being watched.

Right, exactly as it happened when Nehru was screaming, "trust me, I know better" with china in 1962, in maldives.

With the islamist blind eye, it is the commons who have had to suffer for "trust me, I know better".

Well is it not a fact that they know better than aam aadmi? His mistake was that he didn't do his CYA (Cover your own arse) and do both simultaneously - trust but verify. We aren't making the same mistake again.

Another case of "trust me, I know better" when questioned and then when the inevitable follows, oops, you commons suffer, we will enjoy in our palaces - ala 1962, the partition.

[/quote]
So pointing out facts is now "trust me i know better". Umm.. ok. Lets end discussion here - you can have the last word.

[brihaspati]

Fair point. But they are now obviously being watched.

who is being watched - Diggiraja or vote banks or both?

Right, exactly as it happened when Nehru was screaming, "trust me, I know better" with china in 1962, in maldives.

With the islamist blind eye, it is the commons who have had to suffer for "trust me, I know better".

Well is it not a fact that they know better than aam aadmi? His mistake was that he didn't do his CYA (Cover your own arse) and do both simultaneously - trust but verify. We aren't making the same mistake again.

Depends on definition of "knowing". But "he" did not trust and he did verify. He also covered his gluteals by getting things done through and in the name of others - who were then made to take the blame. What he didn't do was being truthful to the public about how he had misinformed them. "You" are not making the same "mistake" again - that is this time around you are being truthful about how you are misinforming the public?

[ramana]

Salman Khurshi* displays cognitive dissonance at the failure and potential collpase of GOI's Munich Policy of appeasement of TSP.

In any other normal time the UPA govt would face No Confidence Motion and early elections would be called. Its time for them to go.

Sense of shock at LoC violations:MEA

NEW DELHI: India on Tuesday said it was still in a sense of shock over ceasefire violations by Pakistan in Jammu & Kashmir and called for a return to peace and tranquility on the border.

"There is a sense of disappointment. We first need to get back to normal. There are other priorities," external affairs minister Salman Khurshid told reporters on the sidelines of a function here.

"There has to be peace and tranquility on the border. Ceasefire should not be violated. We are still in a sense of shock."

He was replying to questions on Pakistan not being ready to confer most favoured nation (MFN) status to India.

The Pakistan government on Monday said it has no immediate plan to grant the MFN status to India.

Pakistani troops fired at Indian positions in Mendhar sector along the line of control (LoC) in Jammu & Kashmir's Poonch district on late Monday night.

On August 11, Pakistanis fired at Indian positions in Digwar village of Poonch district and on August 6, specialist troops of the Pakistan army killed five Indian soldiers in Chakan-Da-Bagh sector of the LoC in Poonch district.

The debate is about Pak refusal to accord MFN while India accorded unilaterally MFN status. And instead of stick to topic he is talking of his sense of shock at the Pak murders of our soldiers!!!

His cabinet colleague AKAnthony acted like spokesman for TSP Army by giving plausible deniablity for the terrorist murders(the attack was with silencer equipped weapons). And the political class was blaming the soldiers for getting murdered.

The failure of the Bullet proof jackets(BPJ) (most of the five soldiers were shot in the chest or upper body) shows the degree of malaise in the OFB, the Army , the MoD and the clean minister who allows substandard equipment at the frontlines.

[SSridhar]

The debate is about Pak refusal to accord MFN while India accorded unilaterally MFN status. And instead of stick to topic he is talking of his sense of shock at the Pak murders of our soldiers!!!

Ramana, that is because the edifice that Sonia and MMS built, namely that more sops would eventually turn the prodigal long-last brother around, has failed miserably once again. Obviously, GoI was very hopeful of MFN coming their way. It shows that very little has been learnt of Pakistani perfidy. He cannot therefore answer the question. He talks of 'shock' at shelling by the TSPA. The choice of that word, 'shock', reveals a defeatist mind. There must have been a more than disproportionate IA retaliation immediately rather than talking of 'shock' after 10 days. Unfortunately, the IA hands are tied by an enormous bureaucratic hand-cuff since Nehruvian days.

[Philip]

And now the Pakis taking a cue perhaps from us on BR,want to "downgrade" the Indian mission. Talk about punishing the victim of rape and rewarding the rapist! The GOI should tell them to go ahead with their asinine threat.it will certainly improve matters.No more "biryani diplomacy" and BS from T'stan. If our mandarins are in shock,then wonderful.They need to be awaken from their sleepwalking-sleeptalking with Pak. and bite the diplomatic bullet.Having added salt to the wound with that "downgrade" statement,we must seriously examine taking them up on the offer.

[ramana]

Philip, Don't expect MMS to do that for it wipes out any dreams of his 'mission' that he setout to and hints darkly all the time. His tenure has shown the econmoci growth story turn back to Nehruvian glows adjexted for inflation, totally corrupt and looters protected, CBI turned into a INC poiltical party instrument, Delhi the rape capital of India and so on.

[Prem]

The joke in Dilli is India's foreign policy is in the good hands of foreigners to promote their Interests in India. The fear of deep wounds inflicted on Indian body by Maino Mohan Maskhares will take at least 20 years to heal. Deliberate attempts to weaken both treasury and defence have been done to promote Rome and Riyad interests with on your face four lettered word attitude.

[ramana]

Looks like after Salman Khursi* took over the MEA doesn't check the date or time of TSP statements and welcomes them! they are on quick response stations. Auto-welcome any thing from TSP.

Tragicomedy of errors India flip flops on Badmash's old statmetn

NEW DELHI: In the midst of gunfire on the LoC and heated rhetoric, both India and Pakistan used an old statement by Pakistani Prime Minister Nawaz Sharif to seek to lower temperatures with each other.

The external affairs ministry welcomed a statement by Sharif promoting talks with India. However, it changes its tune when it turned out that the statement was actually issued in May 2013. The ministry now said that no talks were possible in the current atmosphere of "unprovoked" incidents on the LoC.

Foreign minister Salman Khurshid later amplified the Indian position. "There is a lot of disappointment and anger and I think the air needs to get cleared before we can start giving responses to many things that are half done. We first need to get back to normal and there are steps that need to be taken by the Pakistan side before we can start addressing these issues," he said.

Sources in the government that their initial positive response to Sharif's purported statement marked an appreciation of the "publicly articulated commitment and not any particular statement". Sources also said that the initial reaction came in response to a question which didn't refer to any particular statement.

Pakistani officials also clarified that even though the purported statement by Sharif was made some time ago, "it reflects the sentiment of the Pakistan government".

According to Pakistani media reports, Sharif said on a TV channel on Monday that the two countries should look at a new beginning for resolving all outstanding disputes in a friendly manner. Later, it turned out that the statement, which was attributed to the Pakistani PM, was made in an interview in May.

"We welcome the publicly articulated commitment by the Pakistan prime minister and we remain committed to resolving all issues with Pakistan. Upholding the sanctity of LoC is vital for us,'' MEA spokesperson Syed Akbaruddin said.

Akbaruddin continued, "Unprovoked incidents on the LoC naturally have consequences for bilateral relations. We expect Pakistan to abide by its publicly stated commitment not to allow its territory or territories under its control to be used for terrorism and violence against India. We also look forward to determined action being undertaken to dismantle the terrorist networks and infrastructure as well as tangible movement on bringing to justice quickly those involved in the Mumbai terrorist attacks of November 2008."

About the response to Pakistan's proposal for secretary-level talks on the water issue later this month, the spokesperson said for any such dialogue to take place, it was important to create an environment free of violence and terrorism. "For a peaceful dialogue to proceed, we need an environment free of violence and terror. Certainly, what has happened last week does not fit into that. We have factored all subsequent developments also and we will take a call on this in due time,'' he said.

While the Singh-Sharif meeting in New York in September-end is still on, the government is likely to delay the formal announcement for the meeting. "There's still some time left before the proposed meeting,'' the spokesman said.

When asked about JuD chief Hafiz Saeed leading Eid prayers last week, the spokesperson said India believed Saeed was the 26/11 mastermind who needed to be brought to justice. "Fugitives from justice must be brought to justice,'' he said.

India has also temporarily given up hopes of an MFN decision from Pakistan. Khurshid, when questioned, said, "Its an issue on which they have taken a decision in the past but its a new government, they have to take a call. I think this is not something that is a one-way benefit to India. It has a lot to do with their own businesses so they must convince their own businessmen that its good for them. But right now there are more important things to attend to than MFN."

The US too publicly urged the two countries to resolve issues. US ambassador Nancy Powell said, "We hope both the nations continue to find a solution to current issues and to work towards a greater cooperation and contribute to the stability and prosperity."

Will the Minister seek out who was responsible and hold them accountable?
No way!!!! The guy might even get a favored posting.

[habal]

You need to thank Pakistan for exposing these guys.

[SSridhar]

The Salman Kurshid comedy is growing bigger by the day and threatens to overtake that of his predecessor, SM Krishna. The latest one posted above makes Salman Kurshid on par with SMK.

GoI Appears to be desperate for a lifeline thrown in by Pakistan to clutch on to. What explains this desperation, apart from the Nobel Peace Prize ambition ?

[Vipul]

India adding numbers and value to its diplomatic corps.

New Delhi, Aug 14 : With India's growing global importance creating newer challenges and opportunities for Indian diplomacy, Prime Minister Manmohan Singh's government is seeking to strengthen its diplomatic corps by inducting around 900 officers over the next few years while building expertise in areas like environment, disarmament and security that are increasingly part of the global discourse.

Around 520 new positions are to be added by 2018 to the mainstream Indian Foreign Service (IFS) cadre as part of the IFS expansion plan. Besides, the Ministry of External Affairs also plans to add 380 new positions at the subordinate level during the 10 year period - 2008-18.

For all its size, India has far fewer diplomats than say China, the UK or the US.

The Indian government has drawn up a mandatory mid-career training programme as part of which each IFS officer will have to undergo training three times during the career, after every six-eight years, official sources said.

The new training policy, announced last year, is part of the ministry's effort to "link the training process with what we are supposed to do and to the growing demands of the profession", officials added.

With the field of diplomacy increasing wide, now officers will be required to attain expertise - or have "domain knowledge" - in fields like global warming, disarmament and security issues among others, officials said.

Besides getting newer technology to use the manpower more effectively, the ministry is also inducting experts in fields where they would be having little knowledge, for example railways, the source added. An expert on railways would be useful in countries where India is collaborating or setting up a railway project. Such experts would be inducted on short-term deputation, he said.

While learning a foreign language is a must, emphasis is placed on languages that are spoken in a large number of countries, like French, Spanish and Arabic. With the growing importance of China and India-China relations, a number of IFS officers have taken to learning Chinese, he said.

Though the ministry is taking to the latest and most advanced technology, the "diplomatic bag or pouch" will always remain as a means of confidential diplomatic communication for fear of cyber leakage, they said. The importance of the "diplomatic bag" or a written message holds importance in the wake of the leaks of secret communication - courtesy WikiLeaks and the latest by National Security Advisor Edward Snowden.

[ramana]

So they realise they are understaffed, lack expertise in some foreign policy areas, other areas like transportation, communication channels, and above all language skills.

What about Pashtu and Dari which is important in the near abroad? And need to beef up counter-espionage skills.
Too many personnel falling for 'honey' traps.

[Philip]

Ramana,both "honey and money"!