The Jan Lokpal Bill, Anna Hazare, and Baba Ramdev II

Tamang · Post by **Tamang** » 28 Aug 2011 00:16

Rajdeep was calling Anna has rabble rouser till yesterday and now he is all praise for him.

Prem · Post by **Prem** » 28 Aug 2011 00:21

Arindam Chaudhuri at Ramlila ground with Anna Hazare

Rahul M · Post by **Rahul M** » 28 Aug 2011 00:25

bhaskar ji, this is a non sequitur. no one expects ralegan siddi to be the model for India.

that article fails to understand the basic premise of what AH did there, it was not a top down model which would enforce 70's era socialism, the major point is the gram sabha administered itself and brought a change. other villages are free to do that or create their own model.

it's not socialism OR market driven economy but Socialism AND Market driven economy. no one is rolling back the free market structure of the Indian economy.

which type of village do you think would be in a better position to benefit from the opportunities offered by a market economy like the large food processing unit nearby or the swanky new highway passing by the village ? ralegan siddhi or it's twin village which doesn't have drinking water, where illiteracy is all pervading and people are impoverished and unhealthy ?

Muppalla · Post by **Muppalla** » 28 Aug 2011 01:10

Prem wrote:Few thoughts /questions on Anna's success. The masters of color revolutions must be studying his case now to implement their agenda within India ( And China) . Time to be more vigilant about them and their Bharre ke Tatto RNIs. Cleaning corrupt practices will lay down the foundation for long term clean governece , political /reform and freedom as well economic growth but do we now get the black money back from Swiss accounts and how fast ?In this uncertain time, The one and half T will go long way in consolidating India' position in global community of nations. May be it calls for new thread to figure out the expected or actual gains from the movement as well chartering new course of India from here .

+100

In the era of Twitter and FB crowds, there is room for anything. India has to be prepared for multiple types of colors.

Theo_Fidel · Post by **Theo_Fidel** » 28 Aug 2011 01:19

Rahul M wrote:that article fails to understand the basic premise of what AH did there, it was not a top down model which would enforce 70's era socialism, the major point is the gram sabha administered itself and brought a change. other villages are free to do that or create their own model.

Exactly.

Without change in how society was organized even Siddhi would have been a failure.

It says something that 40,000 preventable maternal deaths does not move people as much as Rs200 corruption w/ traffic constable. Someone said our society is sick. Very much so.

Lets come clean here and take a census. In the past 12 months how many here have paid a bribe in India. Personally 3 times for a total of about Rs 400. I have interacted with government machinery about 40 times. And paid bribe twice. TN of course is relatively clean. I did tip several peons Rs 50 after some work was done. I don't consider that a bribe.

And one little statistical number. In 2004-2005 the State & GOI combined spent Rs 869 per student per year for class 10 and under. Yes that is correct, I did not leave out any zero's. Such is the nature of our spectacular investment in our people. And it is the products of such education that are expected to be clean as the driven snow.

http://imageshack.us/f/405/indiaeduexpdropout.jpg/

IndraD · Post by **IndraD** » 28 Aug 2011 01:22

http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/indi ... 762579.cms
Team Anna was on verge of giving up

It was a battle of nerves that ended with the government blinking first. When leader of the House Pranab Mukherjee announced that it had adopted Anna Hazare's demands, little did the government know that Team Anna was precariously poised on the edge of defeat. Hazare's sliding health and the threat of the burgeoning crowd going out of control would have led Team Anna to throw in the towel if the government had hung in for another day.

Sources said that after the core committee meeting on Saturday morning, it was decided that the group would ask Hazare to give up his fast. But like seasoned poker players, Team Anna managed to mask their anxieties and continued to play hardball, threatening to carry on the fast indefinitely if their demands were not met. It was quite an act to pull off because the group felt Hazare could not do without food for another 12 hours.

http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/indi ... 762444.cms
How the resolution was finally reached

http://www.hindustantimes.com/Anna-camp ... 38744.aspx

Anna camp spent the day on tenterhooks

http://www.hindustantimes.com/Lalu-Shar ... 38725.aspx
Scathin criticism of Team Anna by Lalu & Sharad

http://www.indianexpress.com/news/anna- ... ad/838059/
Anna follows parliamentary debate on I Pad

Bhaskar · Post by **Bhaskar** » 28 Aug 2011 01:33

Rahul M wrote:bhaskar ji, this is a non sequitur. no one expects ralegan siddi to be the model for India.

that article fails to understand the basic premise of what AH did there, it was not a top down model which would enforce 70's era socialism, the major point is the gram sabha administered itself and brought a change. other villages are free to do that or create their own model.

it's not socialism OR market driven economy but Socialism AND Market driven economy. no one is rolling back the free market structure of the Indian economy.

which type of village do you think would be in a better position to benefit from the opportunities offered by a market economy like the large food processing unit nearby or the swanky new highway passing by the village ? ralegan siddhi or it's twin village which doesn't have drinking water, where illiteracy is all pervading and people are impoverished and unhealthy ?

Well said. As I said already, I never agreed with the article but what you have said is intriguing. The combination of Socialism and a Market driven economy might be an economic and political model which can be far more effective then the current economic model of India.

SwamyG · Post by **SwamyG** » 28 Aug 2011 02:04

VinayB wrote:Cho Ramaswamy tried to point out the role of media in a times now debate. Arnab was shouting him down. Pathetic to see him do that to Cho, who has a life time of sensible analysis and anti-establishment politics behind him.

That is how he is. Some one has to tell Arnab it is no longer early 20th century when one had to shout into the telephone for the voice to be heard at the other end. But I did see him talk softly to Narayanmurthy. He expressed how Arnab was privileged to talk to him. Arnab's constant yelling reminds me of Chris Matthews in MSNBC. Both of the must be spitting at the cameras, and I hope the cameramen are wearing raincoats.

IndraD · Post by **IndraD** » 28 Aug 2011 02:06

IndraD wrote:http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/indi ... 762579.cms
Team Anna was on verge of giving up
It was a battle of nerves that ended with the government blinking first. When leader of the House Pranab Mukherjee announced that it had adopted Anna Hazare's demands, little did the government know that Team Anna was precariously poised on the edge of defeat. Hazare's sliding health and the threat of the burgeoning crowd going out of control would have led Team Anna to throw in the towel if the government had hung in for another day.

Sources said that after the core committee meeting on Saturday morning, it was decided that the group would ask Hazare to give up his fast. But like seasoned poker players, Team Anna managed to mask their anxieties and continued to play hardball, threatening to carry on the fast indefinitely if their demands were not met. It was quite an act to pull off because the group felt Hazare could not do without food for another 12 hours.

This news is factually wrong. After parliament having agreed to his demands Anna announced he would break his fast tomorrow which is more than 12 hours + .

brihaspati · Post by **brihaspati** » 28 Aug 2011 02:08

Socialism and market driven economy can onlee function under dictatorships, and that too for a limited amount of time. No problem if anyone wants to go for that for India. But will have to accept some form of dictatorship in the process. Are we ready for that? AH had to become dictatorial [paternalistic/authoritarian/communitarian whatever] to manage both.

Provision of public goods and allowing incentives via market forces, never sit easy together.

Manish_Sharma · Post by **Manish_Sharma** » 28 Aug 2011 02:44

American take on corruption:

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0365737/quotes

Danny Dalton: Some trust fund prosecutor, got off-message at Yale thinks he's gonna run this up the flagpole? Make a name for himself? Maybe get elected some two-bit congressman from nowhere, with the result that Russia or China can suddenly start having, at our expense, all the advantages we enjoy here? No, I tell you. No, sir! Corruption charges! Corruption? Corruption is government intrusion into market efficiencies in the form of regulations. That's Milton Friedman. He got a goddamn Nobel Prize. We have laws against it precisely so we can get away with it. Corruption is our protection. Corruption keeps us safe and warm. Corruption is why you and I are prancing around in here instead of fighting over scraps of meat out in the streets. Corruption is why we win.

brihaspati · Post by **brihaspati** » 28 Aug 2011 02:51

There are long term serious implications of the Parliament bowing down to Ramlila maidan pressure. It is true that the MP's and their parties are responsible for this situation in the first place. But what it has now created is a peculiar situation from which Indian parliamentary democracy of this phase will never really recover. I had suggested for some time that the Indian rashtra was weakening. It was showing an increasing awareness of its own weakening powers through various reactions of its wings - judiciary was one instance.

Since the Parliament did not adopt this "resolution" without mounting "popular pressure" outside the Parliament, it shows itself up as reluctant. What AH has done is the classic two-option onlee method, I have always put forward as the test for any regime or position. He has forced the government/party/regime to choose sides. In this case the regime itself stands more exposed than opposition - which have been agitating on this issue for some time. But the failure of the Opposition to force the issue - overall makes it publicly established that the Parliament itself is ineffective to force such issues even if there are "good" people in there.

By accepting the "resolution" after pussyfooting, the regime finally establishes that the rashtra in its current form is actually no longer effective as an institution. In the future, more and more such issues will be forced. The regime will get increasingly defensive and go for personal retribution.

AH's movement had to draw on "Hindu" religious motifs underneath, just like MKG had felt the need to in order to mobilize large numbers. Even through the "secular" spin, those who felt threatened by the mobilization - pushed the label of "Hindu" Right-authoritarian-etc on him just as the Brits spinned on MKG's movement in 1921. In so many ways its a repeat. But remember that movement was ultimately splintered and withdrawn becuase of the withdrawal of the "other" religion. Moreover the Brits could channelize the religious "opposition" into a separate politics altogether. The Congress and pseudo-kraantivaadis like Laloo or Mulayam or Mayavati - now represent the rashtra in 2011, just as the Brits represented rashtra in 1921 - 90 years ago. They will go for the splitting of mobilization based on communal and other subidentities - just as the Brits did.

In the end, MKG's movement went into political wilderness for the next 7 years. Rashtra managed to divide Indian society, and activate certain religious subidentities, who wanted separate rashtras based on those subidentities. It does not have to be just "Islamic" pureland again - it could be a Dalitstan, in addition to a Haritstan.

I would anticipate such moves in due course.

Prem · Post by **Prem** » 28 Aug 2011 03:12

Bsir ji,
Maya, Laloo or Haritpardes Hopewadi Itayadis cant accomplish much unless they collude with outsiders. This time, game is and will be different. Anna has also woken up grass root nationalistic people and lets not forget the anger in public about the Jokers in politics. Nation holds few more trump cards which are close to their sentiments and any mpove to hurt them can unleash the dreadful dogs of dark deeds doing the dance of death and destruction having detrimental effect on the destiny of these brokers.

Kanishka · Post by **Kanishka** » 28 Aug 2011 03:35

Personally I am much more worried about Anna Hazare ji's life now that parliament has passed this resolution.
As pointed out by some by itself this resolution means nothing really. It is just the first of the many steps.

What happens if something happens to Anna ji before the bill becomes law?

Will this bill ever become law?

Manish_Sharma · Post by **Manish_Sharma** » 28 Aug 2011 04:25

^^ We have to worry more about Swami Ramdev as he created the whole foundation by travelling around country and awakening people.

anupmisra · Post by **anupmisra** » 28 Aug 2011 04:32

Prem wrote:Arindam Chaudhuri at Ramlila ground with Anna Hazare

Inquilab Zindabad? Is he a commie?

vijayk · Post by **vijayk** » 28 Aug 2011 06:15

http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/ente ... 757216.cms

I don't support Anna: Jacqueline Fernandez

The lady from srilanka does not support Anna. She is upset that mahesh butthole is targeted by anna's supporters.

ashashi · Post by **ashashi** » 28 Aug 2011 06:19

shivajisisodia wrote:
gakakkad wrote:
Ashashi wrote -

You have too high an opinion of Americans. I guess you exposure to Amecians is limited.
You are right, Kakkar.

Anyone who thinks that a Jay Leno comedy skit is representative of anything, least of all, all Americans, proves the fact that literacy and education are two different things, with one having very little to do with the other.

Your analysis is right on the mark.

So, you believe those people were acting stupid?

vijayk · Post by **vijayk** » 28 Aug 2011 06:29

http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/indi ... 763716.cms
Anna next mission: India tour for clean leaders

NEW DELHI: Even before his ongoing fast could come to an end, Anna Hazare on Saturday announced he would soon launch another campaign to ensure that no tainted leader gets elected to the next Lok Sabha. Speaking after more than 38 hours, Anna declared he would tour the country and appeal to citizens to be wary of such leaders in the 2014 general elections.

In his second address of the day within two hours, Anna said people's high expectations from MPs were routinely belied.

Taking the dais around 9 am - a good two hours before his usual time of appearance over the last three days - a resolute and confident Anna declared he will continue his campaign for a strong anti-corruption law till his last breath. Asking people to remain vigilant after the ongoing campaign winds up, the 74-year-old said blind trust on MPs had brought the country to the current pass. "We trusted these people to abide by the Constitution. Now that we have woken up, let us not fall asleep again or let complacency seep in."

A little before noon, while leader of Opposition, Sushma Swaraj, was speaking during the Lokpal Bill debate in Lok Sabha, Anna again took the microphone and launched another attack on MPs. This time, his body language, too, was confident, as parliamentary approval for his demands increasingly seemed a certainty. He even got up to greet actor Aamir Khan and director Raju Hirani, something he had never done in the past. He looked fresher, and with his trademark cap making a comeback, seemed dressed for the occasion.

"We had some expectations from our MPs. They did not live up to them. In the coming elections, we are not going to elect them. Next time, do not elect them as they are not performing according to the rules laid out in the Constitution," he said.

"I will tour the country and appeal to people to not elect the people who opposed the Jan Lokpal Bill," Anna said.

shivajisisodia · Post by **shivajisisodia** » 28 Aug 2011 06:33

ashashi wrote:
So, you believe those people were acting stupid?

No, they go out and look for stupid people. If they run into someone that is not stupid, they just edit it out. Showing a normal person with average intelligence wouldnt get any laughs, would it ? They are in the comedy business.

Its just like, if you watch the show, "Girls gone wild", you would think that all American women get naked at the drop of a coin and are drunk and loose. Do you really think thats true ? This show only shows those women who expose themselves, thats the business they are in.

On the other hand, if you watch the Sunday morning talk shows only, you would be wrong in extrapolating from that that all Americans are intellectuals and policy wonks, all PHDs. Thats no more true than thinking that all Americans are stupid.

Anantha · Post by **Anantha** » 28 Aug 2011 06:58

It is foolish of us to expect that these crooked parliamentarians will enact a proper Jan Lokpal bill. Atleast 1/3 of these MP's will go to jail if Lokpal comes into effect.
It is like the US 5th Amendment. You do not have to incriminate yourself and therefore have a constitutional right to remain silent in a court of law.
Same way the parliamentarians have a constitutional right, not to enact the Jan Lokpal bill.
It is going to be an uphill battle to get a meaningful Lokpal bill passed, if not impossible.

vijayk · Post by **vijayk** » 28 Aug 2011 07:04

^^ I do agree. But if Anna starts India tour and gets response from youth, they will be forced.
Brace yourself for unleashing of communal and castiest forces even riots to get bring the CON DIEnasty.

So who politically benefited and who lost ground in this whole campaign.

abhishek_sharma · Post by **abhishek_sharma** » 28 Aug 2011 07:10

National flag dishonoured by Anna supporters

These guys don't worry when the flag is burnt in some parts of the country.

Rahul M · Post by **Rahul M** » 28 Aug 2011 07:14

muraliravi wrote:..........

please check PM inbox.

JwalaMukhi · Post by **JwalaMukhi** » 28 Aug 2011 07:17

Well there are more number of babus than netas. Probably, for every neta there may be 1000 babus/sarkari naukars. Well, netas do not manage the day to day operations. Netas, probably do not dictate that babus shaft the common man when common man approaches to get his routine work done. Netas are frying bigger fish, in getting contracts through nepotism and other such maladies.

Why are people getting really railed about netas so much? Granted that netas can do bigger damage.
Netas do generally get elected by the people. Babus/sarkari naukars on the other hand are a step removed from the commoners. But no neta will instruct to not provide a service that commoner is seeking to avail. Most of the corruption that commoners and middle class see are in this type of transactional avenues.

Babus/sarkari naukars man these transactional avenues and are executive branch and are larger in number. There seems to be lot of love for the babus/sarkari naukars in the haste to pile on netas.

Babus/sarkari naukars do not feel they are a separate class and do not feel the need to treat commoners as equal to them, unless netas push the button - then babus will do salaam and deliver service on demand.

Since babus/sarkari naukars exceed netas by a huge number shouldn't the focus be on the babus too. BTW, most babus/sarkari naukars aren't unpad and aren't gawars.

habal · Post by **habal** » 28 Aug 2011 07:19

sugriva wrote:^^^^
Somewhere this denigrating of politicians as thieves/rascals/ba$****$ etc has to stop for a healthy continuation of democratic politics. If Kejriwala and Kiran Bedi were to enter parliament tomorrow would they also be labelled as rascals? Let us give our institutions some respect if not the people within.

maybe the Ford Foundation sponsored agenda of the day is to discredit Indian politicians. A lot of people including ex-bureaucrats and people with knowledge of the workings of the govt are very uncomfortable about the way these two have gone about discrediting politicians as a class at every single opportunity. They are preparing ground for something.

SwamyG · Post by **SwamyG** » 28 Aug 2011 07:27

Theo_Fidel wrote:It says something that 40,000 preventable maternal deaths does not move people as much as Rs200 corruption w/ traffic constable. Someone said our society is sick. Very much so.

Ah....the beauty of numbers, and the twist that can be given to these. More people face issues with corruption first hand, than maternal deaths. Humans across civilizations react to incidents or issues only when it impacts them or is close to them - sometimes emotionally and sometimes geographically. Essentially it is the connection. Indians have so many problems to take care, that it is not reasonable to expect them to react to some numbers. Everybody in India is exposed to corruption in several spheres. The straw on the camel's back has been the series of recent scams. Be it INC/DMK or BJP. The implication that Indians do not care for death is only partially correct. While statistics do not move them, each time some natural calamity or bomb blasts occur - it is these very same Indians who rush to help. At an institutional level lot needs to improve when it comes to our reaction in the case of emergencies, but our people have done admirably well. If there are examples of callousness or lack of seriousness then it is because of the numbness that has crept into the hearts of people. Not that it is an excuse, just a reason. While a single death is a big news out in the West, it is not a big news unless it is a celebrity.

Anything can be said and proven true about India.

Pranav · Post by **Pranav** » 28 Aug 2011 07:28

JwalaMukhi wrote:Probably, for every neta there may be 1000 babus/sarkari naukars. Well, netas do not manage the day to day operations.

It's true that the Netas don't manage day-to-day operations. They just auction lucrative posts to the Babus who then have to meet corruption targets.

Anantha · Post by **Anantha** » 28 Aug 2011 07:42

Mudslinging has started

http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/indi ... 762579.cms

How Team Anna pulled a fast one
Himanshi Dhawan

vera_k · Post by **vera_k** » 28 Aug 2011 07:45

habal wrote:maybe the Ford Foundation sponsored agenda of the day is to discredit Indian politicians. A lot of people including ex-bureaucrats and people with knowledge of the workings of the govt are very uncomfortable about the way these two have gone about discrediting politicians as a class at every single opportunity. They are preparing ground for something.

You mean the UPA government is sponsored by the Ford Foundation? Equating all politicians and discrediting them was the line put out by TV channels close to the UPA after the 26/11 attacks on Mumbai. The line peddled was that all politicians are equally ineffective on terror. This same strategy was then extended to blunt opposition attacks on corruption issues. At that time I had said this is not going to end well as the voters are being told they have no option but to upend the existing system.

uddu · Post by **uddu** » 28 Aug 2011 07:50

Anna Hazare's next mission: India tour for clean leaders
http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/indi ... 763716.cms
NEW DELHI: Even before his ongoing fast could come to an end, Anna Hazare on Saturday announced he would soon launch another campaign to ensure that no tainted leader gets elected to the next Lok Sabha. Speaking after more than 38 hours, Anna declared he would tour the country and appeal to citizens to be wary of such leaders in the 2014 general elections.

In his second address of the day within two hours, Anna said people's high expectations from MPs were routinely belied.

Taking the dais around 9 am - a good two hours before his usual time of appearance over the last three days - a resolute and confident Anna declared he will continue his campaign for a strong anti-corruption law till his last breath. Asking people to remain vigilant after the ongoing campaign winds up, the 74-year-old said blind trust on MPs had brought the country to the current pass. "We trusted these people to abide by the Constitution. Now that we have woken up, let us not fall asleep again or let complacency seep in."

habal · Post by **habal** » 28 Aug 2011 07:52

Ford Foundation funds Sisodia/Kejriwal. But the manufactured reluctance on part of the govt to solve the Anna issue may have some inside players as well. This is my suspiscion. Indian politicians have been shown up to the world as self-seekers who cannot even feign regard for a fasting man (and other citizens fasting with him) by shortening their debates and compulsions, folks like Sharad Yadav and Laloo can't even pretend to lose honourably. This inputs will be used for the next round.

vera_k · Post by **vera_k** » 28 Aug 2011 07:53

If Sisodia/Kejriwal set out to discredit Indian politicians, then they had able allies directing the UPA's media strategy. The way the government eventually capitulated says that Parliament as an institution of representative democracy is in the ICU, fast heading toward expiry. Whether enough reforms can be put in to preserve it remains to be seen.

habal · Post by **habal** » 28 Aug 2011 07:59

Yes you have to infiltrate both sides for maximum returns from strategy planning.

the govt knows far more than the commons as to which forces are behind Kejriwal, Sisodia & co, but they are not in a position to take them on directly and have to feign ignorance. They should have played a game more efficiently and been seen to concede or deter more effectively. They were ineffective in this because there were people on the, inside creating hurdles for smooth resolution and this coupled with lack of effective leadership w/plenty of mid-rung leaders who were just used to taking orders. This has exposed this entire setup.

shivajisisodia · Post by **shivajisisodia** » 28 Aug 2011 08:01

Do you really think the Indian politician needs any help from anyone to discredit himself ?

There is no doubt that if India and its leaders start doing really well in the truest sense of the word, many people and nations would try to do them in, out of envy, insecurity, greed or to avert a potential threat to themselves.

The tragedy is that the Indian leadership never bring their nation even minimally to a point where others feel envy or afraid of them. Rest assured, at this point in time, others only feel contempt for India and its politician, not envy or fear or anything else. And all the outsiders know that the best way to destroy an Indian politician is to simply wait a few days and he will self destruct.

sumishi · Post by **sumishi** » 28 Aug 2011 08:09

sumishi wrote:
shivajisisodia wrote:I am far more concerned about us living in an authoritarian society going forward where in the name of "parliament being supreme", no public movement will be allowed and all the news channels will be "tamed", so there will be no exposure of scams and scamsters, nor will there be any propogation of any people's movment ideas.
... beware, the taming of the media. That is what is coming next. That is one way to ensure there are no more scams.
+10

Also, be ready for piling up of more constraints on Internet freedom through the IT Law.

uddu · Post by **uddu** » 28 Aug 2011 08:11

abhishek_sharma wrote:National flag dishonoured by Anna supporters
These guys don't worry when the flag is burnt in some parts of the country.

Can anybody beat this?

Now don't think that you can punish him for that. The eminent lawyer can say either it's not done by him, or he did not see it becoz he is blind.

And I had seen national flag upside down. May be an image of the President of India herself alongside the national flag?
More ministers can be seen being so ignorant about the national flag. Even the stupid pastor who uses the flag for religious purposes atleast know that saffron is valour and green is greenery.

sumishi · Post by **sumishi** » 28 Aug 2011 08:16

^^Man, that should go viral! Will take the breath out of the "dishonouring flag" brigade!

Rahul M · Post by **Rahul M** » 28 Aug 2011 08:17

brihaspati wrote:Socialism and market driven economy can onlee function under dictatorships, and that too for a limited amount of time. No problem if anyone wants to go for that for India. But will have to accept some form of dictatorship in the process. Are we ready for that? AH had to become dictatorial [paternalistic/authoritarian/communitarian whatever] to manage both.

Provision of public goods and allowing incentives via market forces, never sit easy together.

you lost me there. I was not talking of more socialism at the national level, beyond what is already there in niches, public ownership of railways for example. a technical discourse of what constitutes market socialism and what does not is irrelevant to us, our system has many socialist characteristics and shares many objectives with socialist systems. India is, as per the constitution, a socialist country. but it is in a category by itself not matching that of china or vietnam.
people expect the govt to work for public welfare especially in health, education etc. call it socialism if you want or don't. these aspects are also present in western democracies.

what is needed is development of rural India, anything that works should be used and encouraged, whether it is AH's socialism or something else. as long as the basic structure of the gram sabha is kept intact it is entirely upto the respective villagers to decide how to govern themselves. lastly, AH's model seems quite similar to the kibbutz model you were advocating sometime back.

Rahul M · Post by **Rahul M** » 28 Aug 2011 08:30

Bhaskar wrote: Well said. As I said already, I never agreed with the article but what you have said is intriguing. The combination of Socialism and a Market driven economy might be an economic and political model which can be far more effective then the current economic model of India.

I consider our current model a combination of those two systems, albeit a flawed one. at the rural level, due to lack of funds, socialism might well be the way out, although it is for the gram sabha to decide. in the long run however we have no other way but to move people from agriculture to industry.