Serial Blasts in Mumbai

ranjbe · Post by **ranjbe** » 16 Jul 2011 03:19

A blog carried by the Economist magazine, which shows how Mumbaikars used social networks such as Facebook and Twitter to dissemenate information when the cell lines were jammed. Many other fascinating tidbits of information of how Indians all over the world provided support.
http://www.economist.com/blogs/babbage/ ... t?fsrc=nwl

jagga · Post by **jagga** » 16 Jul 2011 03:19

Can’t rule out hand of Hindu outfits: DOGvijaya

Senior Congress leader Digvijaya Singh on Friday said involvement of Hindu outfits could not be ruled out in Wednesday’s blasts in Mumbai.

svinayak · Post by **svinayak** » 16 Jul 2011 03:22

There is also outfit from mars

nachiket · Post by **nachiket** » 16 Jul 2011 03:23

^^I am only surprised he waited this long to ~~say~~bark it.

RajeshA · Post by **RajeshA** » 16 Jul 2011 03:25

Can't rule out hand of Digvijaya Singh: RajeshA

Prem · Post by **Prem** » 16 Jul 2011 03:50

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB1000142 ... 43520.html
The Holes in India's Antiterror Armor

First, there aren't enough boots on the ground. India has only about 140 police officers per 100,000 people, whereas the international average is about 270. There is no substitute for the policeman on the beat. He is the gatherer of intelligence, the enforcer of the law, the investigator of the crime and the standard-bearer of the authority of the state, all rolled into one. Second, the low quality of police dilutes the state's capacity for law and order. Local police forces suffer from corruption, inadequate training and an unprofessional work ethic. This is aggravated by the fact that India's intelligence model is 60 years old: The data gathering processes at the district and state level are archaic while agencies at the national level operate in silos. All aspects of intelligence are thus unsuited to prevent modern threats.These structural weaknesses persist to this day, despite a decade of terrorist attacks, because India's politicians refuse to push administrative and police reforms. In some cases, there are alleged links between politicians and organized crime that create an obstacle. But otherwise politicians in the country don't care about national security the same way they do about welfare programs. Despite a directive by India's Supreme Court four years ago, state governments have ignored recommendations made by advisory panels on police reforms. These ideas include fixed tenure for senior police officials, separating law and order from investigation, and removing direct political control over the functioning of police.More broadly, internal security needs political dedication and direction. India's Home Ministry now performs a number of functions that have no direct relation to internal security. It has divisions dealing with freedom fighters, relations between New Delhi and the states, state-level legislation, human rights and disaster management. It is doing too much and hence doing it badly.
Internal security deserves the highest attention under a dedicated cabinet minister. This single step will indicate New Delhi's seriousness and perhaps kick-start the process of police reforms across the country. Anything short of these bold changes will not meet the need of hour

( This is same our resident Piskologian Doc from Kerala was/is talking about)

Dipanker · Post by **Dipanker** » 16 Jul 2011 03:59

CRamS wrote:Guys,

Tubelight moment struck me: -). I think this was a revenge attack by TSP in response to India welcoming US holding back aid to TSP. Basically telling India, US aid or no, we can kick your ass anytime of our choosing and show you to be a bunch of "emerging superpower" spineless cowards. Bring on your cold or hot start.

Nope, not possible in such a short time.

Oops...Anujan said the the same thing before me.

mahaperu · Post by **mahaperu** » 16 Jul 2011 04:14

1. This was a intelligence failure fair and square.
2. Police need better training, better pay (performance based)
3. Corruption at common person level is key, citizens have to believe in the police/govt is working for them. I doubt many people will go to a police if they see anything suspicious, or that police will take action unless that person happens to be a politician, cricketer or a movie star
4. Apparently equipment procurement has been a problem caught in red tape. This is not just in the case of police equipment. This is country wide, from airplanes, which take 10 years to make a decision to procure. A single media news about corruption stop everything. The choice should not be either process is corrupt or the process is slow (in best case, really process is at standstill). I am sure there are means available around the world and in India for going through a quick, transparent and corruption free procurement
5. We should not just throw money at every "high-tech" equipment that we could lay our eyes on. Instead focus on the biggest bang for the buck. Throwing more money and/or resources without making any structural changes to the entire police department (or in general to the entire government) would be worthless. While spending money on security and counter terrorism, we should also realize that there are 45000 malnutrition related deaths in Maharashtra alone each year, which is ~ 123 persons dead every day due to malnutrition.

shiv · Post by **shiv** » 16 Jul 2011 05:45

RajeshA wrote:Can't rule out hand of Digvijaya Singh: RajeshA

+1

Nothing and nobody can be ruled out. Digvijay Singh would be as high on my list of people complicit in this terror act as the nebulous Indian Mujahideen. The question is if anyone has the guts to ask why Digvijay Singh talks the way he does. Or would anyone who asks about this be theratened and victimized?

Airavat · Post by **Airavat** » 16 Jul 2011 05:54

NIA conducting raids on IM bases

JwalaMukhi · Post by **JwalaMukhi** » 16 Jul 2011 06:00

mahaperu wrote:1. This was a intelligence failure fair and square.

More than intelligence failure, it is lack of application of intelligence to drive a clear cut policy that's hurting.
The source of this problem of terrorism is pakistaniyat. Having pakistan next door and expecting terrorism to not occur inside one's home is lack of intelligence. Having a gutter next to one's living area and expecting stench free living by applying perfume is not going to cut it.

The very idea and existence of pakistan, is the problem. That needs to be tackled in many ways. Although, there are known difficulties to addressing this issue, the least one can do is to not encourage things that enhances longevity of pakistan (and hence pakistaniyat).
Doing things that prolongs the pakistaniyat, is making one's task much more difficult.

All other things, such as beefing up security, increasing police personnel, training every citizen to become a rambo is all side show. One can also spend lots of money asking a grandma from Bangalore, kerala to go stand in a line to get photographed, finger printed and postively IDed as a praja of India. But those things are just lot of cost increase, because a few pakis (or wannabe pakis) decide to escalate the cost.

At a minimum the price for such increase, either be it increase in security needs or taking supplementary measures has to be extracted from pakistan. There is statecraft and there is stagecraft.
Spending too much effort on stagecraft will only yield cosmetic results.
Cure the swamp at its fountainhead, automatically pakistaniyat and paki wannabes either be in Lahore or in bangalore, kerala will be cured. Else, one can buy more perfume bottles and prepare meals menu for piglet kasab.

ashashi · Post by **ashashi** » 16 Jul 2011 06:37

jagga wrote:Can’t rule out hand of Hindu outfits: DOGvijaya
Senior Congress leader Digvijaya Singh on Friday said involvement of Hindu outfits could not be ruled out in Wednesday’s blasts in Mumbai.

Is he related to lal peele topi wala?

RamaY · Post by **RamaY** » 16 Jul 2011 07:10

After reading NVS article above I have a cynical thought. Perhaps it is better thing that such strikes happen in the financial capital so the stupids in GoI+media+intelligentsia who say 'going after these terrorists and pakistan will hurt Indian economic growth' will shut up.

Anantha · Post by **Anantha** » 16 Jul 2011 07:12

shiv wrote: I am certain that the police, Mumbai corporation and D company have "split up" areas of Mumbai where they collect hafta from bars and other business estabishments.

Mumbai is paralysed every monsoon from floods. The trains are overcrowded. the defunct mills occupy prime land that no one uses (IIRC), Decrepit building where the idiotic rent laws have prevented the eviction of tenants or raising of rent collapse every year. Where narrower and narrower buildings on the smallest plots get taller and taller each year?

This is a resilient city? What sort of bullshit statement is that? Its an overcrowded badly run city run by criminals where honest and proud simple citizens try and eke out an existence. It's just that the rich are so rich that they bulldoze the influence needed to keep their parts of the city running. The rest of the Mumbaikars are focked up. No one wants to say it loud. And that focked up Mumbai is getting hit time an time and time again.

As a 3rd generation Mumbaite and having quit mumbai, I completely agree with your observations. The city is run by criminals that includes politicians. I know for a fact that the CM of Mumbai personally (along with a PA) oversees bribes on building constructions (increase in FSI space if you bribe). I have heard from a source close to high office that the CM's office has to deliver "x" crores on average to everyday to "Delhi" to remain in power. Imagine and add any number of other activities that go on with political patronage. No wonder the city is Phuc$$ up. No wonder a 2 bedroom flat in a suburb runs at 1 crore and it is 1.5-2 crores in the proper city. This city is no longer viable. No body wants to say it loud.... As other smaller cities provide better jobs and comfort Mumbai will lose its charm for aam Indian, and it is important. In a larger sense these bum blasts in Mumbai will be pin pricks as rest of India would have moved on. Unfortunately a few will die here and there due to blasts, but it wont make a damn difference to the mighty elephant. There in lies the strength of India.

nachiket · Post by **nachiket** » 16 Jul 2011 07:21

Anantha wrote: In a larger sense these bum blasts in Mumbai will be pin pricks as rest of India would have moved on. Unfortunately a few will die here and there due to blasts, but it wont make a damn difference to the mighty elephant. There in lies the strength of India.

Yeah, fat load of good that "strength" is going to do to the ones who got blown up, or their families.

Anantha · Post by **Anantha** » 16 Jul 2011 07:31

nachiket wrote:
Anantha wrote: In a larger sense these bum blasts in Mumbai will be pin pricks as rest of India would have moved on. Unfortunately a few will die here and there due to blasts, but it wont make a damn difference to the mighty elephant. There in lies the strength of India.
Yeah, fat load of good that "strength" is going to do to the ones who got blown up, or their families.

Yes it does not help these victims, do not get me wrong, but we have paid heavy price for being a dharmic civilization and we need to win the larger war. And to win that war Mumbai should lose its importance or should I say we need to have financial muscle equal to Mumbai in at least 25-50 Indian cities.

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 16 Jul 2011 07:58

TOI has front page details today.

post 26/11, seven interceptor craft with bulletproof cabins and long range radios were bought. one is rendered dead by mechanical failure (no $$ to fix it) and the rest get a ration of 100 litres of fuel/week per MH Govt diktat. as they consume 100 ltrs/hr, each patrols only 1 hr/week !!

just after these blasts, the cellphone network got overwhelmed and the CM himself could not talk to his subordinates "since we depend on cellphones onlee". there is no packet radio or VHF radio network between the admin, fire brigade, ATS, police , though I am sure the police have their radio network, but not the others. so for 30 mins the CM wherever he was wandering could not even talk to his reports.

so we seem to have spent some capex post 26/11 but that usual bugbear of Indic projects OPEX is lacking as usual. and our C3I, again traditionally poor remains poor.

abhishek_sharma · Post by **abhishek_sharma** » 16 Jul 2011 08:12

Mumbai blasts: Indian Mujahideen duo in focus, fears grow of bigger strike in Gujarat

Two leading Indian Mujahideen (IM) activists Mujeeb Sheikh and Abu Faisal, who were recently arrested in Madhya Pradesh, have become the focal point of the investigation into the 13/7 blasts. Wanted in connection with the terror attack on Ahmedabad in July 2008, they are considered dangerous and "active terrorists". The duo had plotted to kill judges of the Allahabad High Court, who gave the verdict awarding a major portion of the disputed Babri site to Hindus. Two of their accomplices killed a constable of the Anti-Terrorism Squad (ATS) of Madhya Pradesh Police at Ratlam in MP before they were arrested.

The duo is considered more crucial than others, who were arrested along with them, for two reasons. First, Mujeeb is from Ahmedabad, a fact that assumes significance in view of the intelligence community's conviction that people from the Narendra Modi-ruled state were targets of Wednesday's blasts. The IM had confessed to targeting Mumbai-based Gujaratis also on July 11, 2006, in the bombing of seven first-class compartments of local trains.

Second, the group engineered huge attacks on Ahmedabad and Surat allegedly to avenge the post-Godhra killings of Muslims in Gujarat. Mujeeb and two other Gujarati jehadis, Aurangzeb Afridi and Keyamuddin Kapadia, were part of the group that collaborated with IM operatives from Azamgarh in the attack on Ahmedabad.

His intense motivation for retaliation is the reason why investigators suspect Mujeeb will know a few things about the identity of the bombers --- estimated to be about five-six — who focused on Gujaratis again in Mumbai.

Investigating agencies fear that the suspected revival of the IM module spells a big threat for Gujarat cities, and have already asked the state government to ramp up its defences against bigger terror attacks.

Investigators believe that being the latest among the key IM operatives to have been nabbed, Mujeeb and Faisal should be aware of the plans of the terror outfit and those who are suspected to be behind the latest attack on Mumbai.

Juhu-resident Faisal is no ordinary jehadi, either. It was he who had asked Mujeeb and another IM operative Aslam to work out the logistics for the planned attack on Allahabad HC judges who gave the Babri verdict. He is a close associate of fugitive terrorist from Mumbai, Abdus Subhan alias Tauqir. Agencies have identified Subhan as the person who acted as the link between the SIMI operatives from Azamgarh and IM leaders Riyaz and Iqbal Bhatkal. Sources say that SIMI operatives were looking for smaller targets when Subhan motivated them to aim for bigger strikes, leading to a spate of terror attacks on cities.

Although on the run, Subhan, a Meera Road resident, has been taking shelter with IM operatives across the country, leading the agencies to suspect that Faisal could shed light on the network from where IM draws its bombers.

Ranchi-resident Daanish Riyaaz, an alleged IM operative, who was arrested last month from Vadodara railway station, has been accused of providing hideouts for Subhan not just in his hometown, but also in Khandwa and Seoni in MP. This shows the extensive links that Subhan and Faisal have with IM operatives.

SwamyG · Post by **SwamyG** » 16 Jul 2011 08:16

shiv wrote:
RajeshA wrote:Can't rule out hand of Digvijaya Singh: RajeshA
+1

Nothing and nobody can be ruled out. Digvijay Singh would be as high on my list of people complicit in this terror act as the nebulous Indian Mujahideen. The question is if anyone has the guts to ask why Digvijay Singh talks the way he does. Or would anyone who asks about this be theratened and victimized?

Equally important is why is the media giving him so much attention. He is an AICC general secretary. Currently he is not even elected MLA, MP, CM or anything. He carries weight because of his rhetoric helps India score self-goal every time he is allowed to play. It is like the TV camera shows him, and he immediately scores a self-goal. If the camera stopped focusing on him, he would probably stopped scoring the self-goals. Sadly, attack dogs like him will get all the press. I am sure there are so many good politicians in the INC fold, they are not going to open their mouth.

abhishek_sharma · Post by **abhishek_sharma** » 16 Jul 2011 08:23

'There was no intelligence input about this attack'

So, wasn’t it an intelligence failure?

There was no intelligence input about this attack. But I will not call it an intelligence failure because it seems this attack was carried out by probably a small group that was not detected. The intelligence agencies detect an activity through informants or by detecting communication devices like phones or mail. In this case, this particular group did not use any of these means of communication, so agencies could not detect it.

Give him Nobel Prize.

abhishek_sharma · Post by **abhishek_sharma** » 16 Jul 2011 08:27

IM may have got explosives from Maoists in state

Investigating agencies believe the Indian Mujahideen (IM), suspected to be behind Wednesday's triple explosions in Mumbai, may have procured the ammonium nitrate used in the bombs from Maoists in Maharashtra. "IM has been short of funds and resources and may not have been able to procure RDX as routes are blocked due to vigilance. It may have been helped by Maoists in the state, who have free supply of ammonium nitrate because they operate in areas where mining takes place," an officer told HT on condition of anonymity as he is not authorised to speak to the media.
Gadchiroli and other surrounding areas in the eastern part of Maharashtra are centres of Maoist activity.

Ammonium nitrate is a fertiliser. A mixture of ammonium nitrate and fuel oil, called ANFO, is commonly used in mining and quarrying operations.

The officer said there has earlier been evidence of Maoists being funded by Islamist terrorists, but if the Naxals did indeed supply the ammonium nitrate, this could be the first time the two elements have come together for an operation.

The officer ruled out the use of RDX as the explosions did not leave any craters at the three spots. "In fact, most of the injuries are either burns or those sustained due to objects that would have been destroyed in the blast. No presence of pellets has been found, which suggests the bombs were small and of low intensity," the officer pointed out.

The making of a bomb is easy if ammonium nitrate, sulphur, fuel oil and a tungsten fuse wire are brought together.

sanjeevpunj · Post by **sanjeevpunj** » 16 Jul 2011 08:29

LAHORE – Following serial blasts in Mumbai which left at least 21 innocent people dead and injured more than 130 on Wednesday, diplomatic experts feared that the coordinated terror attacks may lead to a new campaign against Pakistan and its security forces, particularly the Inter-Services Intelligence.
They also hinted that “it may be an American effort for a possible Pak-India stand-off because relations between Islamabad and Washington are on the lowest ebb and America will not lose the ‘opportunity’ to tarnish the image of the nuclear-armed Pakistan.”

During background interview they noted that the recent blasts took place at a time when ISI Chief Lt General Ahmad Shuja Pasha was in Washington on a mission to rebuild the damaged relationship with the United States and bridge the trust deficit.
“It could be part of tactics to tarnish the already shaky image of Pakistan abroad and to assure the US that Pakistan is an epicenter of terrorism. The same technique to tarnish Pakistan’s image was used by India in 2001 on the eve of US President Bill Clinton’s visit to India when 35 Sikhs were killed in Chattisinghpora village in Jammu and Kashmir and Indian establishment had alleged it was a conspiracy by the Pakistani intelligence agencies. It was afterwards disclosed that Indian police conducted the massacre of Sikhs,” they added.

President Zardari and Prime Minister Gilani rightly reflected sentiments of Pakistani people by conveying sense of grief and sorrow over the tragedy to the Indian leadership.
Although this time New Delhi did not readily blamed Pakistan due to their past experience as in most cases Indian claims regarding involvement of Pakistan proved hundred per cent wrong. To mention here are Samjhota Express Blasts, Malegaon Blasts and Ajmer blasts. In these incidents initially India raised accusing fingers towards Pakistan. It was, however, afterwards disclosed that the extremist Hindus were behind these blasts.
Source:http://nation.com.pk/pakistan-news-news ... ndia-talks

Any truth in the above? To me, it looks like a well disguised statement, hinting at driving a wedge between India and USA, to balance their own current predicament.

abhishek_sharma · Post by **abhishek_sharma** » 16 Jul 2011 08:33

Hunt on for elusive IM activist, explosive supplier

“Besides Riyaz Bhatkal, his brother Iqbal, Yasin Bhatkal and Mohsin Chaudhary, there is another important operative of the IM whom we could not locate in previous crackdowns. This man has repeatedly supplied explosives to the outfit from a quarry near Bhatkal town and Udupi in Karnataka,” said a senior Mumbai Police officer who took part in a major crackdown against the IM in 2008 and who is also a part of the ongoing blast probe.

“The IM members already arrested have not divulged this operative’s name, as they claim Riyaz was the one who was directly in touch with him,” said the officer.

Officers also disclosed that two IM operatives arrested in 2008, Ahmed Abubakr Bawa and Mohammed Naushad Mohammed Irshad Sayyed, had ferried explosives from Bhatkal and Udupi but never had direct contact with Riyaz’s source.

Sources also said that cellphone activity around the three blasts sites for leads. They were looking for anomalies such as cellphones showing activity at these locations prior to the blasts, which have fallen silent since.

Meanwhile, the police have identified the owner of the scooter at Zaveri Bazaar on which the bomb was placed under an umbrella. According to the police, the scooter belonged to a shopkeeper in the area who is being questioned. Preliminary investigations suggest that the bomb might have been planted on the unattended scooter after it was parked.

After a severed head found at the Zaveri Bazaar blast site fuelled speculation about a suicide bomber’s involvement, the victim was identified as a labourer, Kishan Shivcharan Mandal, by his family.

The Director General of National Investigation Agency S C Sinha on Friday returned to Delhi with a cache of CCTV footage. In all, 11 CDs have been handed over to the NIA. An e-mail which originated from outside the country is also being looked into.

The agency is seeking help from states, and an NIA team carried out raids at Ranchi at the house of two IM operatives. The officials said they had also sought help from UP police and Bangalore cops.

Raids were also carried out at the house of IM operative Danish Riyaz, arrested recently by the Ahmedabad police. The NIA team is looking for an associate of Riyaz, identified by some accounts as Manzar Imanuddin. The NIA team questioned the family members of the two for several hours and seized hard discs and certain documents.

Sources said that the probe is focused in UP and Bangalore as IM cadres have been traced to these areas in the past.

chetak · Post by **chetak** » 16 Jul 2011 08:39

abhishek_sharma wrote:'There was no intelligence input about this attack'

So, wasn’t it an intelligence failure?

There was no intelligence input about this attack. But I will not call it an intelligence failure because it seems this attack was carried out by probably a small group that was not detected. The intelligence agencies detect an activity through informants or by detecting communication devices like phones or mail. In this case, this particular group did not use any of these means of communication, so agencies could not detect it.
Give him Nobel Prize.

These are government wallahs onlee.

The input has to be hand delivered by the LET or whoever, on a working day only between 0900-1700 but excluding tea times and lunch hours.

It has to be in the approved format or it will not be acccepted.

It has to be delivered in multiple copies so that it's easy for their distribution.

No receipt will be given immediately but the same can be picked up after three days from a indifferent pan spewing peon, if you can find him.

If the concerned person is on leave, then the input will not be accepted by anyone else.

This is what our elected representatives and their minions the babus are expecting the terrorists to do.

abhishek_sharma · Post by **abhishek_sharma** » 16 Jul 2011 08:42

From B. Raman: July 14

The Prime Minister Dr.Manmohan Singh's reported decision to visit Mumbai in the wake of the new series of orchestrated and timed explosions on July 13 reflects his embarrassment and concern over the blasts.

2.The embarrassment arises from the continuing deficiencies in our counter-terrorism capability even after the much vaunted improvements introduced after the 26/11 strikes. The deficiencies relate to the preventive and surveillance capabilities of our intelligence agencies and the police. The concern should be over the likely negative political impact of the success of the terrorists in circumventing the security measures.

3. The Government's credibility in relation to counter-terrorism is likely to suffer further erosion----particularly in Mumbai, whose population has been the target of five instances of high casualty terrorist attacks ---in 1993,2003,2006,2008 and 2011. The argument about the difficulties faced by the intelligence and security agencies in preventing terrorist attacks will not carry conviction to the people. While they may accept one or two surprise attacks, they would find it difficult to accept repeated attacks not only in Mumbai but also in other cities.

4. Other cities---New York. Madrid and London---have had isolated mass casualty attacks, but the police was able to ensure that there were no more attacks. It would be natural for the public to ask why this has not been possible for our security agencies.

5 Despite arrests made after past attacks, terrorist organisations still have at their disposal a seemingly unending stream of recruits who are willing to be trained and used to carry out attacks. A worrisome aspect is that our security agencies and the police have been unable to quantify the total number of trained terrorists still available to the organizations and neutralize them. They have also been unable to identify and block the sources of recruitment.

6.The attacks of July13,2011, ----like those of 1993,2003 and 2006 and unlike those of 2008--- were multi-targeted and well orchestrated with a single modus operandi. They required good motivation and some training and not sophisticated expertise. The 2008 attacks were commando-style and multi-targeted with multiple modus-operandi---use of explosives and hand-held weapons and hostage-taking. They required considerable training and sophistication. Hand-held weapons were used in addition to explosives in 1993 too.

7.No claim of responsibility has so far been made. There has been no electronic interception of suspect messages----electronic chatter as professionals call it----which might give a clue as to who might have been responsible. The security agencies are, therefore, groping in the dark in identifying the organisation responsible.

8.Coastal security and immigration controls have been tightened up after the 26/11 terrorist strikes. The possibility of outsiders sneaking in to carry out the attacks is somewhat low. The greater possibility is that the attacks were carried out by some people normally resident in India---- maybe, Indian nationals or foreigners. The investigating agencies should keep an open mind and avoid jumping to conclusions.

9.The reports about a wired body and a separated head being found in one of the spots need to be carefully investigated. If these reports are correct, this would be a disturbing indicator of an act of suicide terrorism with possible foreign influence.

10.If these reports are ultimately ruled out as not correct, the only other possibility is of timed strikes, which might have been carried out either with mechanical (clocks or the alarm mechanism of a mobile telephone) or with chemical timers. The 1993 strikes were carried out by Dawood Ibrahim's men with chemical timers of US-origin obtained by them from the Inter-Services Intelligence (ISI).

11. The reported use of ammonium nitrate speaks of a lethargy in imposing checks on the sale of nitrogenous fertilisers despite this being repeatedly used as the explosive material by different terrorist groups in copy-cat acts in different countries of the world. Western countries have imposed checks on the sale of nitrogenous fertilisers. In Canada, sleeper cells were caught when they sought to buy nitrogenous fertilisers. It is not clear whether we have imposed similar checks.

12. Whether it is the Indian Mujahideen (IM) or any other organisation which is ultimately found to have been responsible,it wanted to disprove the official claims of having broken its back. This may not remain a one-city phenomenon. We must be prepared to prevent the danger of similar attacks in other cities.

13. We should not allow the latest blasts to disrupt the on-going dialogue process with Pakistan unless there is concrete evidence to show that either the ISI or Pakistan-trained elements were involved. {Jai Ho!}(14-7-11)

abhishek_sharma · Post by **abhishek_sharma** » 16 Jul 2011 08:50

From B. Raman: 15th July

Q.Can the three blasts in Mumbai on July 13,2011, be attributed to an intelligence failure?

A.Yes. I have always held that every successful terrorist strike is due to either an intelligence or a security failure or both.

Q.But the Home Minister Shri P.Chidambaram has said that despite there being no flow of intelligence, there was no intelligence failure. What did he mean by it?

A.Many, including some foreign analysts, have been mystified by his remarks. Most of the queries that I received from abroad sought my explanation of his remarks. I replied that what he probably meant was that while there was no intelligence indicating the possibility of the blasts, he would not attribute the paucity of intelligence to any failure on the part of the agencies. They tried their best to collect intelligence, but this particular intelligence did not come their way. That is what he appears to have meant.

Q. Would you accept his explanation?

A. There was definitely a failure of intelligence. Whether this was due to any institutional failure on the part of the intelligence agencies or not could be established only by an enquiry into how the terrorists managed to carry out the successful strikes. Unfortunately, after each terrorist strike, our Government has avoided holding a detailed enquiry as to how the terrorists succeeded. The enquiry ordered by the Maharashtra State Govt after the 26/11 terrorist strikes only went into the deficiencies of the police. The deficiencies of the central agencies were not enquired into by the Government of India. The result: We have not learnt the right lessons. That is why most of our discourse on dealing with terrorism is on general terms and not in specific terms as a result of lessons drawn from each strike. In other countries, each strike involving large casualties or damage is followed by a detailed enquiry to draw the right lessons.

Q.Presuming there was an intelligence failure, where and how did it occur?

A. As of now there are four possibilities. Either the terrorist strike was carried out by a reactivated old cell of an existing indigenous organisation which had been lying dormant because of the stepped up security measures after 26/11 or it was carried out by a new cell of a new indigenous organisation or by one or more angry indigenous individuals with no organisational affiliation. If it was the first possibility, the surveillance of the old cells was apparently unsatisfactory. If it was the second or third, apparently their coming into being had escaped the attention of the agencies and the police. If these three possibilities involving indigenous elements are ruled out, there is a fourth possibility of the commission of the attack by external elements which had managed to sneak into India despite the stepped up immigration controls introduced after the 26/11 strikes.

Q.What could this be due to?

A. Poor penetration of terrorist organisations---old or new. Timely human intelligence comes through successful penetration. Good penetration comes through good contacts in the community from which the terrorist organisation or individual terrorists have arisen. There is always a reluctance on the part of the community to co-operate with the police against its members suspected of involvement in terrorism. The available means of overcoming this resistance have to be examined.

Q. How about technical intelligence (TECHINT)?

A. There does not appear to have been any TECHINT in the form of electronic chatter through telephones or the Internet. This could be due to gaps in the TECHINT capability of the agencies or the successful adoption of evasive techniques by the terrorists or their not adopting any of the technical means for communication among themselves. What exactly was the reason for the non-flow of TECHINT could be established only if and when one or more of the perpetrators are arrested and interrogated.

Q.Any other point that needs to be considered?

A. There was possibly a certain complacency on the part of the intelligence agencies since there had been no major terrorist strike for some months. The terrorists probably noticed the slackening of vigilance and struck.

Q. Could there have been a security failure that was behind the successful terrorist strike?

A. One security dimension comes into the picture in respect of the procurement of the materials required for the improvisation of an explosive device. Three kinds of materials are required for an IED--- the explosive itself, the detonator and the timer or a remote control device. The final results of the forensic examination are not yet available. The present indicators are that the terrorists had used ammonium nitrate possibly with a booster and made more lethal than normal by mixing it with projectiles and furnace oil, and a timer, possibly the alarm mechanism of a mobile telephone. The ammonium nitrate which is the ingredient of nitrogenous fertilisers is easily available for procurement in India. After the use of the ammonium nitrate in large quantities in the attempt to blow up the New York World trade Centre in February,1993, by Ramzi Yousef and its subsequent use in other terrorist strikes many Western countries are reported to have issued instructions to all wholesale and retail dealers in fertilisers that they should alert the police if any suspicious-looking person, who is not a genuine farmer, seeks to procure nitrogenous fertilisers. A terrorist cell was disrupted in Canada when one of its members tried to procure a large quantity of fertilisers and the dealer, who became suspicious, alerted the police. In India, it is difficult to impose such curbs since terrorists can easily procure the ammonium nitrate from friends in the farmer community instead of from a dealer. The alarm mechanism of a mobile telephone can also be easily procured without attracting suspicion. Procurement of detonators can cause suspicion, but here too one can easily procure from friends in the community of industrial users of detonators such as granite quarry owners. Al Umma of Tamil Nadu reportedly stole detonators from quarry owners. It, therefore, becomes difficult to detect the preparations for an act of terrorism at the stage of procurement of the IED components unless the terrorists use military-grade explosives procured either locally or from other countries.

Another security dimension arises in respect of the planting of the IEDs after they have been assembled clandestinely. The planting could be prevented in places where there is an access control. In public places, where there is no access control, it becomes very difficult to prevent the planting of an IED unless it is detected accidentally as it was in respect of the jihadi bomber who sought to plant an IED in the Times Square of New York last year. His IED, at the time of planting, reportedly started emitting smoke. An alert member of the public noticed it and he was caught and the IED neutralised. It was more luck than physical security which prevented this attempted strike.

The third dimension is about the utility of Closed Circuit TV (CCTV) cameras. The CCTV can help prevent the planting of an IED in an infrastructure building where there is a central control room constantly monitoring the happenings with the help of CCTV images. CCTV cameras have a very limited preventive role in public places such as crowded streets. They are helpful in investigation after the blasts had taken place, but not in detecting the planting of the IEDs. The CCTV cameras in the London tube stations helped in identifying the perpetrators after they had carried out the terrorist strikes in July,2005. They could not help in prevention.

It has been reported that CCTV footages are available in respect of the Opera House scene in Mumbai where one of the IEDs was planted. Their examination could help the investigators if heavy rain during the planting had not affected the quality of the images.

The only way of detecting an IED in a public place with no access control is through the alertness of the public. They have to be constantly briefed by the police as to what to look for.

Q.It has been reported that there were heavy rains before, during and after the blasts. Any comments on that?

A. It is remarkable that despite the rains all the three IEDs detonated at the fixed time without any malfunctioning. This would indicate that the perpetrators had taken the required precautions to ensure that the rains would not affect the detonation of the IEDs at the fixed time. This speaks well of the quality of expertise of the perpetrators. They were not novices.

It has been reported that the police were facing difficulty in determining where exactly the IEDs were planted. This could have been due to the rains. After a blast, two kinds of examinations are done---the visual and the forensic. During the visual examination, one looks for indicators like craters caused by the detonation, the kind of debris at the scene including the remnants of the detonator and the timer etc. The rains would have definitely created difficulties in the visual and forensic examination. It is ironic, but normal that while the rains seem to have created difficulties for the investigators, they do not seem to have created difficulties for the perpetrators.

“The Hindu” (July 16) has reported that the police have since established that one of the IEDs was kept in a scooter.

Q. There has been talk of a wired body being found near the scene in the Zaveri Bazaar area. Could this indicate that one of the blasts might have been caused by a suicide bomber?

A. If a suicide bomber was involved his body would not have been found intact. If the IED was fixed to the upper part of the body his head would have been severed by the force of the blast and thrown far away. If the IED was fixed in the lower part of the body, the legs would have been severed. If the dead body was intact, the possibility of a suicide explosion becomes less. But, how to explain the wires around the body? The answer to this could be found only by the investigators.

Suicide terrorism is a common feature in Pakistan since 2007. In India, we have had instances of suicidal terrorism (fedayeen attacks) against heavily protected targets, but not suicide terrorism except by the LTTE when it killed Rajiv Gandhi in 1991. If it is established that one of the blasts was caused by a suicide terrorist, this would indicate the definitive involvement of jihadi terrorists.

“The Hindu” (July 16) has reported that the Mumbai Police have identified the dead body and ruled out a suicide bomber. There was no wire on his body, but only an electronic chip inside one of his injuries. This might have got embedded due to the force of the blast. However, there has been no official statement from the Police so far.

Q. Who might have been responsible for the explosions?

A. So far, there are no clear indicators. There has been no claim of responsibility. If Indigenous elements were involved there was a possibility that claims of responsibility would have been made. The Indian Mujahideen (IM) had in the past claimed responsibility for the terrorist attacks carried out by it. Pakistani organisations such as the Lashkar-e-Toiba (LET) claim responsibility when they carry out a strike in Jammu & Kashmir. When they carry out a strike outside J&K, they either do not claim responsibility or do so in the name of a fictitious organisation of India. After 26/11, the LET claimed responsibility in the name of a fictitious organisation called the Deccan Mujahideen. If individual jihadis, without organisational affiliation, who are called Jundullas (Soldiers of Allah) are involved, no claim of responsibility is made. There is no evidence so far on the basis of which a reasonable surmise could be made as to who might have been responsible.

Q. Shri Prithviraj Chavan, the Chief Minister of Maharashtra, has said that mobile phone services literally collapsed for 15 minutes after the blasts making it difficult for him to communicate with the police.

A. Nothing surprising. This happened in London immediately after the blasts of July 2005. Thousands and thousands of anxious persons were trying to contact their relatives. The mobile services got jammed preventing the Police Commissioner from contacting his men in the field. The police thought of advising mobile companies to suspend their services, but did not do so due to a fear that this might add to the panic. Corrective measures were reportedly taken subsequently. I was under the impression that corrective measures had been taken in India too, because one had not heard of such collapse of the mobile services after the explosions of 2008 by the IM in Delhi, Jaipur, Ahmedabad and Bengaluru or during the 26/11 terrorist strikes in Mumbai. Why this happened this time? This needs to be examined. ( 16-7-11)

shiv · Post by **shiv** » 16 Jul 2011 09:16

Anantha wrote:No wonder a 2 bedroom flat in a suburb runs at 1 crore and it is 1.5-2 crores in the proper city. This city is no longer viable. No body wants to say it loud...

Mumbai actually survives on the greed of some that translates into low income livelihood for many.

If you are a shop owner in a narrow street with a hovel of a shop and the street throngs with people what are the pros and cons for you the shop owner?

Pros:

The business is excellent. The huge crowds ensure that someone is always ready to enter your shop even though the entire street is lined with shops that sell the exact same stuff that you sell.
The rent you pay for this hovel of a shop in a dilapidated building is Rs 100 a month - fixed in 1974.
Electricity bills for the shop are miniscule because the area is so small
No water bills. There is no water supply and no bathrooms/toilets
Small establishment, migrant labor - low labor costs if yoru family are not manning the shop entirely

Cons:

You have to sit here from morning till evening. There are no toilets - you go in a bylane by the corner. You acceppt that and say 'All of India is like this"
Garbage is thrown on the street to be picked up by the municipal corporation once a day in the morning. Hey - you are paying your taxes.
Food has to be brought in from somewhere. Heck Mumbai has the world's best manual food delivery system. Tea is brought in by a boy working in a nearby hole of a hotel

What the above factors amount to is wealth, filth, crowding and cheap labor who sleep on the streets.

The city of Mumbai, its residents and the government tacitly accept filth, crowding and people sleeping on the street as a necessary price to pay for wealth. Mumbai is not unique - this is true of every Indian city to a greater or lesser extent, but it has reached its peak in Mumbai.

Because of crowding and garbage, drains cannot be repaired or they get clogged with filth leading to flooding. because anyone can move in and live on the street (No cold weather in Mumbai, even clothes are not needed) anonymously and get a job as a delivery boy or something criminals can liev and roam at large. Touts pimps, kidnappers and extortionists run their businesses among travellers and itinerants. For a small hafta the local businesses are left alone by these criminals.

If you were a businessman what would you dream of as an ideal business?
1. Heavy footfall leading to brisk sales
2. Low overheads - rents and labor

Mumbai offers this in abundance along with filth overcrowding and crime. Everyone wealthy man in Mumbai is in there for the money. He puts up with the filth and crowding for the money. The crowding is necessary for cheap labor and a large customer base. Urinating on the street is a minor price to pay. Who would give up a 100 square foot shop in exchange for a public toilet?

Ultimately Mumbaikars will have to protest the conditions they accept. That make make Mumbai temporarily poorer, but in the long term Mumbai will rise again rather than sink.

sanjeevpunj · Post by **sanjeevpunj** » 16 Jul 2011 09:20

Everyone must read this.

KOCHI: Justice V R Krishna Iyer has said that currently the greatest enemy of India is not so much Pakistan but terrorism.(don't jump at this line,please read further)
In a statement issued here Krishna Iyer said: "A sense of insecurity prevails in not knowing where the terrorist enemy is operating from. The greatest enemy of India is not Pakistan but terrorism. Terrorism is not possible without corruption. Any secret operation by Pakistanis within India has to be secret and secrecy is possible only by bribery and other devices all of which involved corrupt money. The Indian intelligence apparently is not able to ferret it out. The secret processes by which corruption operates, if every Indian discloses what his neighbour is doing, terrorism cannot flourish as it does today."
Though the Pakistan Government has condemned the Mumbai blasts, important Muslim organisations in India have not condemned the dastardly act. "I am not challenging the patriotism of the Muslim organisations in India but do suspect the degree of their loyalty. If every Muslim in India feels India to be his motherland and wants to defend it, the Indian police intelligence will easily get information about the secret manoueuvres of hostile Muslim elements." Stating that there was something wrong in people not communicating with the police when the terrorist manipulations were being organised with such success, Krishna Iyer said: "What we require therefore is not so much policemen or weapons but burning patriotism. Every Muslim must watch the secret doings of other Muslim organisations especially foreigners. A new wave of patriotism must begin in every school, college and research organisation. Every Indian must watch what his neighbour is doing with a patriotic vision and mission to save the nation. Even children's organisations should be permeated with the spirit of Bharatmatha. Then alone India has hope. New intelligence methodologies are necessary." ENS

shiv · Post by **shiv** » 16 Jul 2011 09:24

I am happy to note that important Hindu organizations have been quick in condemning the act.

sanjeevpunj · Post by **sanjeevpunj** » 16 Jul 2011 09:27

Yes, Shiv ji, Hindus organisations are deeply concerned about defending entire country, whereas some of the Muslim or Christian organisations may satisfy themselves with voicing concern of their 15% or 10% minority populations, which is natural,as they represent minorities. However they also should come up and condemn these acts.

Rahul M · Post by **Rahul M** » 16 Jul 2011 09:32

Lalmohan wrote:lets assume that the BRF hypothesis of ISI's traces will be hard to find on this one is true. What shape will the ongoing investigation take?

this

Mumbai blasts: Can’t rule out hand of Hindu outfits, says Digvijay
http://www.indianexpress.com/news/mumba ... ay/818173/

abhishek_sharma · Post by **abhishek_sharma** » 16 Jul 2011 09:33

Statement from Vishwa Hindu Parishad

Statement from Jamiat Ulama i Hind (A)

Hari Seldon · Post by **Hari Seldon** » 16 Jul 2011 09:38

sanjeevpunj wrote:Yes, Shiv ji, Hindus organisations are deeply concerned about defending entire country, whereas the Muslim or Christian organisations satisfy themselves with voicing concern of their 15% or 10% minority populations.

sanjeev dude,

Kindly preface or qualify such blanket statements with 'some', or 'a section of' or 'a vocal section of' etc. For 2 good reasons - one is objective - sans proof that *all* mus or xtian orgs are as you say they are, your statement is likely to be factually incorrect (after what are the odds one 100% of these orgs are treacherous, eh?).

Two is a subjective reason - pushing all IMs or xtians into a box isn't great tactics or grand strategery or even basic common sense.

(And there's a third reason - folks will report your posts, mods will have to take notice and action and eventually your vibrant voice and POV would be lost to the forum only).

Hey, unwanted advice, I know. But just my 2 paise only. Jai ho and all that.

sanjeevpunj · Post by **sanjeevpunj** » 16 Jul 2011 09:45

Hari Seldon wrote:
sanjeevpunj wrote:Yes, Shiv ji, Hindus organisations are deeply concerned about defending entire country, whereas the Muslim or Christian organisations satisfy themselves with voicing concern of their 15% or 10% minority populations.
sanjeev dude,

Kindly preface or qualify such blanket statements with 'some', or 'a section of' or 'a vocal section of' etc. For 2 good reasons - one is objective - sans proof that *all* mus or xtian orgs are as you say they are, your statement is likely to be factually incorrect (after what are the odds one 100% of these orgs are treacherous, eh?).

Two is a subjective reason - pushing all IMs or xtians into a box isn't great tactics or grand strategery or even basic common sense.

(And there's a third reason - folks will report your posts, mods will have to take notice and action and eventually your vibrant voice and POV would be lost to the forum only).

Hey, unwanted advice, I know. But just my 2 paise only. Jai ho and all that.

No it is not unwanted advice, I shall make appropriate suggested changes in my statement. Thanks man, I appreciate the response.

negi · Post by **negi** » 16 Jul 2011 09:45

The word mofo must have been coined for guys like D45kBJ singh; karma caught up with VP singh by the grace of great mahakaal it shall catch up with BJ singh too.

shiv · Post by **shiv** » 16 Jul 2011 10:57

sanjeevpunj wrote:Yes, Shiv ji, Hindus organisations are deeply concerned about defending entire country, whereas some of the Muslim or Christian organisations may satisfy themselves with voicing concern of their 15% or 10% minority populations, which is natural,as they represent minorities. However they also should come up and condemn these acts.

Statements like "Muslim organizations did not condemn the act" is asking for, in fact demanding an equal equal. It is bad politics to make such a stupid statement constructed in that way even if it is 100% true. Any fool would then be able to scour the media and ask "Which Hindu organizations condemned the act?"

I cringe with horror at the fundamental rhetorical errors made by some people who let loose high volume support for Hindus. I think Madrassa and and Islamic education give a far better education in rhetoric and politics. Pointing that out is difficult because one immediately gets accused of being psec or islam pasand. Some arguments just make it dead easy for Islam pasand people to have a good ROTFL.

Chandragupta · Post by **Chandragupta** » 16 Jul 2011 11:37

Nobody wants to say this out aloud but until & unless Islam is completely cleansed out of the subcontinent, Indics would continue to die. Let's not naively assume that even a majority of 250 million Indian muslims have burning patriotism inside their hearts. Not saying rest 900 million Hindus are ideal citizens but they do will never have an ideological compulsion to attack their own country & people.

vera_k · Post by **vera_k** » 16 Jul 2011 12:03

Sturdy buses to ensure a safer ride

This is one instance where rising accident costs forced a government agency to opt for safer options. I feel similar dynamics will work in terror cases if compensation amounts paid out to terror victims are increased. Once the amount paid out crosses a certain threshold, there will be strong motivation to move on upgrading the security infrastructure.

At a minimum all the sea bridges into the city must have border control posts to hinder the ability of whoever it is to just walk in and create mayhem.

nikhilarora · Post by **nikhilarora** » 16 Jul 2011 12:10

Just yesterday, 3 LET terrorists were gunned down in Kashmir, one of them the regional commander of LET and an important asset for it in India. Raises important questions, like LET is still very much active in India and are just waiting for the opportune moment to strike. Now Mumbai attacks show important security flaws, the boats that were bought for coastal surveillance remain out of order. I am sure, if an investigation is done, 90% of such security establishments are handicapped. You see choppers, gun boats, security in train stations, airports, big commercial hubs, there is absolutely zero checking in major places. How easy it is to drive an explosive laden car into any place these days. I don't know why this general apathy! The govt doesn't bother, it always has more important things to do, people are busy earning bread for themselves, there isn't any organization to monitor these, periodic reports get shoved under the chair. Anyways, will cut it short. This Digvijay Singh is a pure pain in the wrong side. I donno why the press gives him undue attention, he is just a moron ready to lick its master's feet. He now sees Hindu terrorism because 1 or 2 of such attacks were carried out by hindu groups whereas 99% of attacks you see involve some muslim or the other. Not to denigrate the Muslim people as a whole, they are quite respected and they are good people in general. But some people are bringing much shame to the community! Ans why the hell will hindu terrorists bomb some market in mumbai, what purpose does it serve. Sometimes I feel are people so stupid or they are really very intelligent and I am the one stupid here!!!

sumishi · Post by **sumishi** » 16 Jul 2011 12:25

sanjeevpunj wrote:Everyone must read this.
KOCHI: Justice V R Krishna Iyer has said ....
.... Every Indian must watch what his neighbour is doing with a patriotic vision and mission to save the nation. Even children's organisations should be permeated with the spirit of Bharatmatha. Then alone India has hope. New intelligence methodologies are necessary.

Like Secretary Napolitano's "If You See Something, Say Something" Campaign rolled out in Walmart Stores?

“Homeland security starts with hometown security, and each of us plays a critical role in keeping our country and communities safe,” she said. "This partnership will help millions of shoppers across the nation identify and report indicators of terrorism, crime and other threats to law enforcement authorities.”

From: Homeland Security taps new partner in terror fight: Wal-Mart