Solar energy in India

Murugan · Post by **Murugan** » 28 Apr 2011 10:57

Tata Power to add 185 MW of renewable energy
Tata Power is likely to add a total of 185 MW of renewable energy by March 2012.

The company is likely to add 150 MW of wind and 35 MW of solar energy to its renewable energy portfolio at a cost of about Rs 1,300 crore. The 150-MW of wind based power project is to come up in Tamil Nadu and Karnataka. On solar power front, Tata Power is implementing a 25-MW project at Mithapur, Gujarat, for which it has signed a PPA with the Gujarat Urja Vikas Nigam. The project is slated to be commissioned in Deceber 2011. It will also commission 10 MW of solar power on the rooftops of the Tata Motors plants and at Mulshi in Maharashtra in FY12.

Meanwhile, the company's grid-connected 3-MW solar plant at Mulshi has been commissioned and the power generated will be purchased by Tata Power Distribution for its Mumbai customers.

Lalmohan · Post by **Lalmohan** » 28 Apr 2011 12:10

should just pass a law requiring all new municipal buildings and apartment complexes to install solar panels on roofs

and give tax breaks to individuals building houses to install solar panels

and provide subsidised panels to panchayats etc., for community buildings, e.g. schools

mix of both PV and hot water systems

VickersB · Post by **VickersB** » 28 Apr 2011 12:43

^^ likewise in Chandigarh - apparently it's mandatory for houses above a certain size to install solar panels - enforcement is next to nil

Theo_Fidel · Post by **Theo_Fidel** » 28 Apr 2011 20:19

Chennai too has a mandatory requirement for solar water heaters for buildings above a certain size. But it is only for new buildings. They are still fairly expensive for homes though. The 200 Litre per day unit we installed cost Rs 25,000 installed 3 years ago. Photovoltaic cost ten times that for just a kilowatt of capacity installed. After some government tax incentives it was in the Rs 200,000 + range for panels, battery, inverter, etc for just 1 kw. Maybe cheaper now.

One thing I would highly recommend is that you also put in a low flow shower and kitchen tap. Otherwise 200 litres will run out just like that as we found out! These things were expensive and cost an addition Rs 5,000.

suryag · Post by **suryag** » 28 Apr 2011 21:42

Guys could you give me more info on the TATA BP solar kit, like model number or the power rating of the system, I dont know what they are making for 28K(22k + 6k rebate) so am curious

suryag · Post by **suryag** » 28 Apr 2011 22:16

Thanks Martenji, any chance you remember the power output of this kit, how many watt-hours ?

Yagnasri · Post by **Yagnasri** » 29 Apr 2011 04:36

To my knowledge it directly heats water and no electric heater is involved.

Amber G. · Post by **Amber G.** » 29 Apr 2011 22:35

^^^ Unit of power (does not matter if it is electric or heats water directly) is watt (and not watt-hours etc)

Mort Walker · Post by **Mort Walker** » 30 Apr 2011 01:17

^^^I think the better question is how many folks, not necessarily here, but everywhere understand the difference between energy and power?

The problem with solar thermal power is that heat drop off is significant once sunlight is at oblique angles, so you need mirrors and actuator motors to keep panels in position for proper heat exchange. With photo-voltaic (PV) panels, actual efficiency is a problem. Even if PV panels are 40%, overall energy efficiency is going to be low; and lets not talk about the dangerous materials in manufacturing PV panels.

suryag · Post by **suryag** » 30 Apr 2011 03:32

Amber G. wrote:^^^ Unit of power (does not matter if it is electric or heats water directly) is watt (and not watt-hours etc)

OT but I visualised it as a system that came with a battery/inverter and solar panels hence the question watthour capacity of the system.

Theo_Fidel · Post by **Theo_Fidel** » 30 Apr 2011 07:02

Apparently the coal cess has been operational for sometime. Even collected some money!

http://www.financialexpress.com/news/na ... y/778854/0

Delhi: The National Clean Energy Fund (NCEF), created under the aegis of non-renewable energy ministry, will provide financial support for development of indigenous technologies in solar power.

The government views the research will help in reducing the final cost of producing electricity through tapping solar energy.

“In the next five years, India would need 28,000 mw of renewable power, and wind energy would be a dominant source for it. But going forward, solar energy would play a vital role in achieving that target,” Pramod Deo, chairman, Central Electricity Regulatory Commission, said in an event organised by Forum for Advancement of Solar Thermal (FAST).

Last week, the government cleared the creation of a national clean energy fund that will finance green energy projects and research ventures aimed at reducing India’s carbon footprint. The 2010-11 Budget had made provision for such a fund created through a clean energy cess of R50 per tonne of coal, lignite and peat since last year.

The government has collected around R3,124 crore from the coal cess in 2010-11, and the corpus under the fund is expected to be over R6,500 crore in 2011-12. It is expected that a significant portion of these funds would be used for supporting payment security mechanisms and R&D activities under Jawaharlal Nehru National Solar Mission.

“Last year, we added 3,150 mw of renewable energy to out grid, including 2,000 mw from wind power and just 40 mw of solar power. But this year we are expecting to add 250 mw from solar power,” Deepak Gupta, secretary, ministry of new and renewable energy, said.

Mort Walker · Post by **Mort Walker** » 30 Apr 2011 12:01

There are metal alloys in PVs such as cadmium, beryllium (in small quantities), tellurium and so on that are difficult to handle and dispose of. Not a big deal now, but if PVs were to be used more commonly, then it would have to be given serious consideration. After that you need chemical batteries to store the energy at night, which has its own environmental problems.

suryag · Post by **suryag** » 04 May 2011 08:58

Cross posting from the renewable energy thread

Paging Chaanakya ji

Sir jee
in the following doc from MNRE
list of sanctioned off-grid SPV projects
Different projects have different subsidy amounts sanctioned by the Govt.
For example first row
Andhra Pradesh Power Plants Educational Institutions 16.07.2010 16.03.2011 161.00 404

The CFA received as subsidy should have been
404 X 1000 X 81 = 3,27,24,000(if it was a battery back up system, highly unlikely for such capacities) or
404 X 1000 X 57 = 2,30,28,000 for a system without battery back-up)

Can you please clear the confusion on this ?

Theo_Fidel · Post by **Theo_Fidel** » 04 May 2011 20:06

Just cause it is interesting...

Here is the Ivanpah project Google funded, a ~ 400 MW Phase 1 construction underway. Hope to see such pictures in India soon.

Theo_Fidel · Post by **Theo_Fidel** » 04 May 2011 20:24

^^^^
BTW this is a power tower project. Different from the Trough technology.

Here's a list of approved JNNSM projects in India using thermal technology. 470 MW total. As you can see this is less than that from the single project Phase 1 alone above. IMO uneconomic.

Lanco Infratech -------------- 100 MW - Jaisalmer, Nachna, RJ - Parabolic mirror
KVK Energy -------------------- 100 MW - Jaisalmer, Nachna, RJ - Parabolic mirror
Megha Engineering----------- 50 MW - Anantapur, Pamidi, AP - Parabolic Mirror
Rajasthan Sun Energy------- 100 MW - Bikaner, Kolayat, RJ -
Aurum Renewable Energy --- 20 MW - Jamnagar, Dwarka, GJ -
Godavari Power-------------- 50 MW - Jaisalmer, Parewar, RJ -
Corporate Ispat--------------- 50 MW - Jaisalmer, Pokhran, RJ -

Theo_Fidel · Post by **Theo_Fidel** » 04 May 2011 20:30

Here is the cost breakdown of a 100 MW CSP project. This is an estimate. You can see why size matters. 500 MW size is minimum requirement.

chaanakya · Post by **chaanakya** » 05 May 2011 00:24

suryag wrote:Cross posting from the renewable energy thread

Paging Chaanakya ji

Sir jee
in the following doc from MNRE
list of sanctioned off-grid SPV projects
Different projects have different subsidy amounts sanctioned by the Govt.
For example first row
Andhra Pradesh Power Plants Educational Institutions 16.07.2010 16.03.2011 161.00 404

The CFA received as subsidy should have been
404 X 1000 X 81 = 3,27,24,000(if it was a battery back up system, highly unlikely for such capacities) or
404 X 1000 X 57 = 2,30,28,000 for a system without battery back-up)

Can you please clear the confusion on this ?

Answered in solar thread.

chaanakya · Post by **chaanakya** » 05 May 2011 00:27

Theo_Fidel wrote:^^^^
BTW this is a power tower project. Different from the Trough technology.

Here's a list of approved JNNSM projects in India using thermal technology. 470 MW total. As you can see this is less than that from the single project Phase 1 alone above. IMO uneconomic.

Lanco Infratech -------------- 100 MW - Jaisalmer, Nachna, RJ - Parabolic mirror
KVK Energy -------------------- 100 MW - Jaisalmer, Nachna, RJ - Parabolic mirror
Megha Engineering----------- 50 MW - Anantapur, Pamidi, AP - Parabolic Mirror
Rajasthan Sun Energy------- 100 MW - Bikaner, Kolayat, RJ -
Aurum Renewable Energy --- 20 MW - Jamnagar, Dwarka, GJ -
Godavari Power-------------- 50 MW - Jaisalmer, Parewar, RJ -
Corporate Ispat--------------- 50 MW - Jaisalmer, Pokhran, RJ -

All thermal projects in India are cleared on the basis of assessing feasibility. As no plants were available to gather data. This is a good beginning from zero.

chaanakya · Post by **chaanakya** » 05 May 2011 00:50

Theo_Fidel wrote:Here is the cost breakdown of a 100 MW CSP project. This is an estimate. You can see why size matters. 500 MW size is minimum requirement.

Good chart. Solar field probably means land cost?

I think there is one plant in Spain with 700Mw. Can you list out any GW capacity plant, area lit needs and fluid it uses for heat transference?
TIA

Theo_Fidel · Post by **Theo_Fidel** » 05 May 2011 01:05

Land cost is under land development. Solar field would be all physical equipment necessary as part of the Solar field minus piping, controls, substations, etc.. BTW power block is the generator package minus the storage if any.

Agree that his is a good start but hope GOI has plan for when these plants run into ROI/ROE issues.

AFAIK there are no GW Solar Thermal plants in operation, though there should be several in 2-3 years.

I'm still trying to ascertain the details on the technology involved and the options included. The only one I can confirm per Google is Megha using Parabolic w/ no storage. I don't know anyone in India Solar only in Nuclear & Coal.

If anyone knows please help by filling in details for the projects above.

Kersi D · Post by **Kersi D** » 05 May 2011 20:57

Theo_Fidel wrote:Land cost is under land development. Solar field would be all physical equipment necessary as part of the Solar field minus piping, controls, substations, etc.. BTW power block is the generator package minus the storage if any.

Agree that his is a good start but hope GOI has plan for when these plants run into ROI/ROE issues.

AFAIK there are no GW Solar Thermal plants in operation, though there should be several in 2-3 years.

I'm still trying to ascertain the details on the technology involved and the options included. The only one I can confirm per Google is Megha using Parabolic w/ no storage. I don't know anyone in India Solar only in Nuclear & Coal.

If anyone knows please help by filling in details for the projects above.

I am working on equipment for several solar thermal power plants. i would like to correspond with like-minded persons. Please contact me on k e r s i k d o t i w a l l a @ r e d i f f m a i l d o t c o m.

Waiting for yr replies
Kersi

Theo_Fidel · Post by **Theo_Fidel** » 09 May 2011 06:41

Kersi,

It is good to have you here. Please post some your knowledge/experiences so we know what the ground situ is like.

Meanwhile...

http://economictimes.indiatimes.com/new ... 201503.cms

NEW DELHI: Technological breakthroughs and economies of scale will make solar power competitive in six years and help India add 67,000 megawatts of solar generation capacity by 2022 - more than thrice the country's target, according to a report by consultancy firm, KPMG.

"The present trends indicate that the prospects are very bright for solar power to be equal to conventional electricity any time after 2017, said a senior official from the Ministry of New and Renewable Energy.

The report, which will be released next week, says solar energy can contribute 7% of the total power needs of the country by 2022, helping cut coal imports by 30% or 71 million tonnes a year. This would result in saving of $5.5 billion in imports per year from 2022 onwards, it said.

The projected increase in solar capacity can reduce India's carbon emissions by 2.5%, which is a tenth of the 20-25% reduction India has volunteered at the international summit on climate change in Copenhagen, KPMG says.

It is estimated that solar power prices would decline at the rate of 7% per annum over the next decade. Efficiency improvement due to technological advancement and emergence of low cost manufacturing are likely factors that would aid the continuing trend.

Sates like Rajasthan, Gujarat and Tamil Nadu are expected to take the lead in this direction reaching the grid-parity earlier. Apart from conducive policies in place, other reasons being higher insolation (measure of solar radiation energy received on a given surface area in a given time) and having little reserves of coal

Though India may add up to 17 gigawatts (GW) of solar power by 2017, the cumulative installation between 2017 and 22 can jump three fold to 50 GW, the consultancy says. Last year, the Ministry of New and Renewable Energy had opened up competitive bidding for phase-1 of the Jawaharlal Nehru Solar Mission .

Bids were received for prices being quoted between Rs 10-13 kw/hr for both Concentrated Solar power and solar photovoltaic projects .

Against solar power, the conventional power at grid level is available at Rs 4 kw/hr whereas the average cost passed on to the consumer in 2010-11 is estimated to be as high as Rs 5.42 kw/hr factoring in the transmission and distribution losses.

To achieve the grid parity for solar power over the next 5 years, the government must take measures to sustain the momentum in growth. A fund to support states in meeting the renewable purchase obligations can take the sector to the next level.

Theo_Fidel · Post by **Theo_Fidel** » 09 May 2011 20:18

http://www.marketwire.com/press-release ... 417199.htm

SkyFuel has signed a memorandum of understanding (MOU) with Megha Engineering and Infrastructures Limited (MEIL) regarding the use of its parabolic trough collector in concentrating solar power (CSP) projects. MEIL's bid to build, own and operate a 50MW solar thermal power plant, through its wholly owned subsidiary MEIL Green Power Limited, in Andhra Pradesh, India was selected under Phase One of the Jawaharlal Nehru National Solar Mission (JNNSM). The JNNSM has put India in the lead of emerging CSP markets, calling for 20 million square meters of solar concentrators by 2022.

SkyTrough's design allows a high proportion of components to be provided by local fabricators, which allows Indian companies to expand manufacturing into the solar market. SkyFuel is working with partners in India to secure commitments for aluminum and steel fabrication.

suryag · Post by **suryag** » 09 May 2011 20:23

At times i feel this whole JNNSM is like the defence offsets proposition. Most of the guys putting up plants are putting it up with technology sourced from outside, with little acclimatisation/Indianisation added to it. I hope this progresses to the next step where this technology is developed further in India and the reliance on foreign companies is reduced

Kersi D · Post by **Kersi D** » 09 May 2011 22:06

Theo_Fidel

Thanks for your invitation.

Basically I am working in a company that (can) supply a lot of HTF and steam related equipment for the CSP concentrated solar power plants.

There are 7 companies who are going to set up 470 MW of solar power under JN Solar Power Mission. They are
1) Reliance (ADAG) have not yet selected/revealed the technology or its supplier. Both parabolic mirror and Fresnell Linear mirror technology are in the run.

2) Megha Engg has tied up with SkyFuels (also mentioned above)

3) Lanco & KVK are not yet revealing the technology or its supplier. At one time they had "almost finalised" with Acciona but the deal fell through. However they are still talking with Acciona.

4) Abhijet Power and Godavari Power have signed with Lanco Engg, USA

5) Nothing much is known about Aurum Enterprises as they are not yet revealing the technology or its supplier. There are some rumours that they may opt out and "sell thier PPA" to some other bidder

Gujarat govt also has a similar scheme. Cargo Power and Wellspun ae believed to be setting up CSP of 50 MW each

Rajasthan govt also has similar plans but they have not yet finalised any scheme till date.

Regards
Kersi

PS. Theo_Fidel in what way are you directly connected with solar power ?

Theo_Fidel · Post by **Theo_Fidel** » 10 May 2011 03:52

Kersi,

That is a very detailed list of projects. Appreciate it. I consult with a couple of engineering companies that are working on some design options for CSP structures. Esp. WRT light weight low impact foundations and modular in-situ customizable components. Both projects I'm aware of are power tower projects. So my interaction w/ solar is unfortunately very peripheral.

It appears that there is no Indian company supplying technology. Kinda unfortunate that none of them are trying to go the power tower route which would require HTF and have the Storage option.

Kersi D · Post by **Kersi D** » 10 May 2011 11:37

Theo_Fidel wrote:Kersi,

That is a very detailed list of projects. Appreciate it. I consult with a couple of engineering companies that are working on some design options for CSP structures. Esp. WRT light weight low impact foundations and modular in-situ customizable components. Both projects I'm aware of are power tower projects. So my interaction w/ solar is unfortunately very peripheral.

It appears that there is no Indian company supplying technology. Kinda unfortunate that none of them are trying to go the power tower route which would require HTF and have the Storage option.

Sorry but I am not able to understand the "power tower" concept.

The commonest system is the parabolic mirrors which use HTF, heat transfer fluids. This system is offered by almost all "technology suppliers".

Tower technology is offered by Abengoa Solar - Spain. They do not give this technology to any other user, only for their own plants. Efficiencies are higher than parabolic mirrors.

Fresnell mirror technology too does not use any HTF. This is a new technology. Only one largish plant is under construction, in Australia. This technology may come to India, very soon !!!!

Another system of parabolic mirrors using molten salts is possible. Till today it is barely at pilot plant stage. Again this system offers better efficiencies

No Indian company has the "know how" for the actuall mirror /solar field. Of course there are a lot of Indian companies who can offer design engineering services for the "power block". Again the steam turbine is imported, there are barely 2 - 3 companies in the world who offer stem turbines for solar application

Regards
K

Kersi D · Post by **Kersi D** » 10 May 2011 11:44

chaanakya wrote:
Theo_Fidel wrote:Here is the cost breakdown of a 100 MW CSP project. This is an estimate. You can see why size matters. 500 MW size is minimum requirement.

Good chart. Solar field probably means land cost?

I think there is one plant in Spain with 700Mw. Can you list out any GW capacity plant, area lit needs and fluid it uses for heat transference?
TIA

All HTF based plants use fluids better known by their brand names i.e. Therminol VP-1 (by Solutia Chemicals) and Dowtherm A (by Dow Chemicals). They are a eutectic mixture of diphenyl (25 - 28%) and diphenyl oxide (72 - 75%).

There are some pilot plant studies using molten salts. Molten salts are a mixture of sodium and potassium nitrites and nitrates. Thee are some brands too but I cannot recollect them offhand.

Kersi

Theo_Fidel · Post by **Theo_Fidel** » 12 May 2011 05:44

Kersi,

I have always had this question, maybe you can take a stab at it.

As I understand it the branded fluids you mentioned are for linear parabolic/fresnel type CSP projects. They have a lower operating temperature range.

Molten salt is higher tempreture, all the way up to super critical steam temperatures. This is important as SCS systems have higher efficiencies in the 44% range.

Is this correct.

The reason I ask is that the Ivanpah project I'm working on uses steam directly in the receiver on top of the Power Tower, per the drawings I've seen. This choice was not by the engineers but by the promoter. The engineers are not too thrilled, as all kinds of additional equipment has to be provided due to the extremely high pressures involved. The equipment has to be rated for 30 years+ of continuous service and daily cycling. We have had to put in numerous thrust blocks, some rated for 100 tonnes horizontal to restrain the thermal forces, kinda hard when we are trying to minimize ground penetrations. It has added cost that could have been avoided by molten salt, which while much heavier, I'm given to understand can be operated at atmospheric pressure. It remains to be seen how all this extremely high pressure equipment will perform in the desert.

I was curious as to how this selection of HTF is made.

Kersi D · Post by **Kersi D** » 12 May 2011 11:10

Theo_Fidel wrote:Kersi,

I have always had this question, maybe you can take a stab at it.

As I understand it the branded fluids you mentioned are for linear parabolic/fresnel type CSP projects. They have a lower operating temperature range.

Molten salt is higher tempreture, all the way up to super critical steam temperatures. This is important as SCS systems have higher efficiencies in the 44% range.

HTFs are used only in parabolic trough collectors. In the Lineaer Fresnell mirror and Tower technology, steam is generated directly without any intermediate agent like HTF.

Molten salts can give higher steam temperatures but I do not think any system operates in super critical regime

Kersi

GuruPrabhu · Post by **GuruPrabhu** » 18 May 2011 08:54

Kersi D wrote:
Sorry but I am not able to understand the "power tower" concept.

Look up Solar Two in Daggett, California. It was a 10 MW molten salt based system. It had marginal success in late 1990s.

Tower technology is offered by Abengoa Solar - Spain. They do not give this technology to any other user, only for their own plants. Efficiencies are higher than parabolic mirrors.

Is this the same as Andalucia, Spain which will host Solar Tres, the follow-up to Solar Two?

GuruPrabhu · Post by **GuruPrabhu** » 18 May 2011 09:00

Kersi D wrote:Molten salts can give higher steam temperatures but I do not think any system operates in super critical regime

The primary reason for having molten salt is so that the plant can generate power at night. This was intended to address the "solar can only work during the day" criticism.

Theo_Fidel · Post by **Theo_Fidel** » 21 May 2011 10:59

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2011-05-1 ... -says.html

Solar May Equal Cost of Producing Coal Power by 2017 in India, KPMG Says

India, which produces 71 percent of its electricity from coal, seeks to add 120,000 megawatts of power by 2017 to reduce blackouts threatening development in the world’s second-fastest growing major economy. Indian companies have announced about $7 billion of overseas energy acquisitions since January 2010 as they seek coal, uranium and other fuels, according to data compiled by Bloomberg.
Twice as Costly

Today, solar power costs more than twice as much as the 5.42 rupees per kilowatt-hour that it costs to deliver electricity to consumers, said KPMG which is advising Maharashtra State Power Generation Co. on a 125-megawatt solar power project.

The cost of fossil-fuel electricity may rise as much as 5.5 percent annually as India has to buy more expensive imported coal and replace aging plants, Kamath said. The country’s coal deficit may triple over the next five to seven years, a unit of Moody’s Investors Service said in a February report.

Solar power prices are projected to decline by 7 percent a year in the next decade on more efficient technologies and lower manufacturing costs, the report said.

If solar power becomes competitive with other sources, India could add 39,070 megawatts of grid-connected solar projects from 2017 and 2022, including residential rooftop panels and 18,455 megawatts of solar-powered telecommunication towers and agricultural water pumps, according to the report.

The government has set a target of installing 22,000 megawatts of solar power capacity by 2022.

Theo_Fidel · Post by **Theo_Fidel** » 25 May 2011 11:18

All this talk about solar has finally convinced me to put PV panels on my house in Massaland.

So I've been spending some time researching it and I have to say the prices are really really attractive. The salesman say reluctantly that they expect prices to halve, yes halve, by 2015. Apparently about 50,000 MW of annual PV capacity alone is in the works.

Here in the Midwest coast of America there are not so many grants or incentives for solar but still an entire 3 KW grid connected system that will generate roughly 70% of my electricity could be mine for just under $11,000 after tax incentives & rebates. Not only that it is property tax exempt.

If I wanted to go all the way with a electric car as well, a 6 KW system is just under $19,000. The car, such as the volt is about $30,000 so I could be just about free of fossil/nuclear/oil economy for under $50,000.

Of course I understand that everything else I use consumes fossil fuels but don't rain on my parade yet....

Has anyone installed panels on their house yet. Any experience.

chaanakya · Post by **chaanakya** » 25 May 2011 23:51

Theo_Fidel wrote:All this talk about solar has finally convinced me to put PV panels on my house in Massaland.

So I've been spending some time researching it and I have to say the prices are really really attractive. The salesman say reluctantly that they expect prices to halve, yes halve, by 2015. Apparently about 50,000 MW of annual PV capacity alone is in the works.

Here in the Midwest coast of America there are not so many grants or incentives for solar but still an entire 3 KW grid connected system that will generate roughly 70% of my electricity could be mine for just under $11,000 after tax incentives & rebates. Not only that it is property tax exempt.

If I wanted to go all the way with a electric car as well, a 6 KW system is just under $19,000. The car, such as the volt is about $30,000 so I could be just about free of fossil/nuclear/oil economy for under $50,000.

Of course I understand that everything else I use consumes fossil fuels but don't rain on my parade yet....

Has anyone installed panels on their house yet. Any experience.

Few suggestions

1. Get good panel, PCU and Battery for four Hr Backup. 2 KWp should cost about Rs.4L
2. Spend on changing light fixtures use T5 CFL or LED with smart switching/lighting/sensors. Keep load to 70% of your Panel.

Few panel changes would be there during usual warranted period of 15-20 years. Ask for replacement warranty for period promised for, nothing to repair there. CC is also replaced. And a happy tension free home. Just witnessed one such operating for 11 years.

Don't connect AC or any Load with Reactive Power requirement unless you put massive battery banks with good inverter.
Some (french at least) are working on Hydrogen storage and others on compressed air, heat storage etc.Don't know how far successful. Reluctant to part with without Pilot being cleared first for them.

SPV power going to cost about same as Thermal by 2030.

Theo_Fidel · Post by **Theo_Fidel** » 26 May 2011 07:57

chaanakya wrote:SPV power going to cost about same as Thermal by 2030.

I was amazed at the pricing. In 2001 I priced out the same 3 KW system and it was ~ $49,000 without battery and after tax incentives. Obviously I gave it a pass. Also the area required was 750 sqft on my roof, which meant I would have to use a big chunk of my North facing roof - very inefficient. It is now less than 320 Sqft. The price is now an incredible 1/4 of what it wast 10 years ago.

Fortunately my state has grid tie-in so I can offset grid power without a battery system. Makes it much cheaper and low maintenance.

My house in Desh is old school with Mangalore tiles on wood rafters. I kinda like the old school house with internal courtyard and spent a ton replacing wood and tiles recently. I don't think I can put PV on my roof. In any case it is completely surrounded by 100 ft coconut and mango trees. No sun. My dad is considering one for his house in Chennai. Much sun.

I was talking to a engineer with a power company and he says that their projection is that PV will drop by 1/2 at least by 2020. There is so much more cost cutting that can be done WRT to manufacturing efficiency. Apparently the power companies are very hesitant to built new power plants because of this. They are just expanding existing ones a little. They think in 10-20 years PV will be down to $1.5 - $2 installed, on your roof. At which point the residential market will start to shrivel for them.

chaanakya · Post by **chaanakya** » 26 May 2011 12:12

Theo_Fidel wrote:
I was amazed at the pricing. In 2001 I priced out the same 3 KW system and it was ~ $49,000 without battery and after tax incentives. Obviously I gave it a pass. Also the area required was 750 sqft on my roof, which meant I would have to use a big chunk of my North facing roof - very inefficient. It is now less than 320 Sqft. The price is now an incredible 1/4 of what it wast 10 years ago.

Fortunately my state has grid tie-in so I can offset grid power without a battery system. Makes it much cheaper and low maintenance.

My house in Desh is old school with Mangalore tiles on wood rafters. I kinda like the old school house with internal courtyard and spent a ton replacing wood and tiles recently. I don't think I can put PV on my roof. In any case it is completely surrounded by 100 ft coconut and mango trees. No sun. My dad is considering one for his house in Chennai. Much sun.

I was talking to a engineer with a power company and he says that their projection is that PV will drop by 1/2 at least by 2020. There is so much more cost cutting that can be done WRT to manufacturing efficiency. Apparently the power companies are very hesitant to built new power plants because of this. They are just expanding existing ones a little. They think in 10-20 years PV will be down to $1.5 - $2 installed, on your roof. At which point the residential market will start to shrivel for them.

Price will drop , first, based on the volume. Then obviously, manufacturing practices.
Currently, SPV is almost monopolized with few players on international market. China is big one, but not considered under Govt schemes. India wants its own manufacturing units to take hold. Not sure if that can be or should be done. Panel or cell making is ok, but Ingots are still a big question mark, in my opinion. Indian companies are also trying to scale up to match the anticipated and actual demands.

Power companies are trying new model of payments where manufacturers promise assured power output and paid out of revenue generated. If this takes off , might prove good for the Industry.

Rooftop is yet to take off in India. Few installations are there . Certain technical issues remains and grid tie up is not yet standardised. CEA working on it for all India applications for local grid connectivity.

I think India needs a similar setup that you indicated for your place.

mangalore tiles , yes, SPV would be ugly if you replace MTs. But one can opt for BIPVs, still costly though. But if you put three panels of 150 watt each and small inverter you will get enough for lights and one or two fans in village. you will also get subsidy so that cost will be less.

Chennai, yes it could be done. If you don't want to waste roof space , opt for pedestal type of SPV holders, 7-8 ft high instead of truss types. You will get both, roof space sunlight as well as power. Also install solar water heater with water efficient showers and connections to Kitchen. You will be amazed to see the savings.

For residential market to boom , certain conditions need to be met before individual owners commit to additional expenditure.One is easy renting roof space and getting say 20-30% of power from solar and rest by the project developer.

Theo_Fidel · Post by **Theo_Fidel** » 09 Jun 2011 00:03

http://www.livemint.com/2011/06/0700134 ... r.html?h=B

Adani Power Ltd plans to set up two solar photovoltaic cell projects in Gujarat and Rajasthan that would produce 140 megawatts (MW) in three years.

Work has already begun on setting up a 40MW plant in Kutch, Gujarat, said Ravi Sharma, chief executive of Adani Power.

“The firm will commission its 40MW solar power project near Bitta village in Kutch district by December this year. We have already entered into a long-term power purchase agreement with the Gujarat government for this renewable power,” Sharma said. The plant’s capacity would be boosted to 100MW in two years.

“Solar power generation is currently in the initial stages in India. Currently, cost of setting up a photovoltaic solar power project stands at around Rs. 18 crore per MW in India, which is quite higher than the coal-fired power plant, which costs Rs. 3-5 crore per MW,” said an analyst who tracks the power sector for a domestic brokerage, requesting anonymity.

At this cost, Adani Power will have to spend Rs. 2,500 crore to produce 140MW, the analyst said.

But the prices companies charge for producing power using renewable resources are also high because of incentives provided by the Union and state governments, making it easier to recover expenses.

In January 2009, Gujarat announced a policy to promote solar energy, fixing a tariff of Rs. 15 per kWh for developers using solar photovoltaic technology, and Rs. 13 per unit for utilities running on a solar thermal platform—both for 12 years.

After that, Gujarat Urja Vikas Nigam Ltd will pay Rs. 5 per unit to the utilities for the next 13 years.

The Union government, in its solar policy, has also fixed higher tariffs of Rs. 17 and Rs. 15 for 25 years for solar photovoltaic and solar thermal power, respectively.

Theo_Fidel · Post by **Theo_Fidel** » 13 Jun 2011 02:40

http://deshgujarat.com/2011/06/10/24130/

Today, the first phase of the 10 MW Azure solar power plant was officially inaugurated by Honourable Chief Minister of Gujarat, Shri Narendra Modi, at Khadoda village, Sabarkantha district in the State. This marks a giant step towards realizing Gujarat’s vision of leading India’s adoption of solar power.

The Azure Power solar plant set up over 60 acres of community land is now generating more reliable power and income for the community.

Azure Power has a project under every Solar Policy in the country. In addition to Gujarat, Azure Power has inked agreements with State Governments of Punjab and Rajasthan. Ongoing talks with other State Governments will take this total generating capacity to a combined production of 100 MW solar power by 2014 with cumulative investment of INR 1500 Crs.

Theo_Fidel · Post by **Theo_Fidel** » 13 Jun 2011 02:50

This would mean they plan to develop about 5% of their Solar potential. We should look to put in a series of High tension Undersea Cables and we can get all the power we need from the desert.

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2011-06-0 ... -says.html

Saudi Arabia plans to generate solar electricity equaling the amount of its energy from crude exports, Oil Minister Ali Al-Naimi said.

Saudi Arabia, the world’s largest oil exporter, has the potential by 2020 to produce enough solar power to meet more than four times global demand for electricity, al-Naimi said yesterday in a speech in Krakow, Poland, posted on the Saudi Press Agency website.