Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan (TSP): 31 Oct 2011

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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan (TSP): 31 Oct 201

Postby partha » 06 Dec 2011 13:15

US military officials say Pakistan leaving border liaison centres
Afghanistan soil is being used for terrorism against Pakistan. Hence we will pull the troops from the border.

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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan (TSP): 31 Oct 201

Postby SSridhar » 06 Dec 2011 13:32

partha wrote:US military officials say Pakistan leaving border liaison centres
Afghanistan soil is being used for terrorism against Pakistan. Hence we will pull the troops from the border.

That should give the ISAF a freer hand to attack Taliban and its protectors on this side of the Durand Line, shouldn't it ? Now, Pakistanis don't even have a reason to complain. I think, in their fake anger, the PA does not understand what it is doing. Tactical brilliance, perhaps.

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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan (TSP): 31 Oct 201

Postby dada » 06 Dec 2011 13:33

http://www.dailytimes.com.pk/default.asp?page=2011\12\05\story_5-12-2011_pg7_26

excerpt
"“India is our enemy and if we have to sacrifice our sons against India, we would be proud. But what’s the use of sacrificing our sons for this meaningless war, which is not our war?” asked Hussain’s uncle, Muhammad Nazeer"

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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan (TSP): 31 Oct 201

Postby SSridhar » 06 Dec 2011 13:35

Anujan wrote:Salman Bashir (the current foreign secretary who never forgets to meet Kayani before and after every India visit) is set to become Paki high comissioner to India

How come a FS becomes a High Commissioner ?

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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan (TSP): 31 Oct 201

Postby kmkraoind » 06 Dec 2011 13:37

FLASH NEWS: 2 suicide attacks in Afghanistan, at least 20 feared killed.

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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan (TSP): 31 Oct 201

Postby sum » 06 Dec 2011 13:38

SSridhar wrote:
Anujan wrote:Salman Bashir (the current foreign secretary who never forgets to meet Kayani before and after every India visit) is set to become Paki high comissioner to India

How come a FS becomes a High Commissioner ?

Didnt same happen with Nirupama Rao to US?

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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan (TSP): 31 Oct 201

Postby SSridhar » 06 Dec 2011 13:42

sum wrote:Didnt same happen with Nirupama Rao to US?

Is Salman Bashir then retiring ? Didn't know that.

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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan (TSP): 31 Oct 201

Postby partha » 06 Dec 2011 13:43

SSridhar wrote:
partha wrote:US military officials say Pakistan leaving border liaison centres
Afghanistan soil is being used for terrorism against Pakistan. Hence we will pull the troops from the border.

That should give the ISAF a freer hand to attack Taliban and its protectors on this side of the Durand Line, shouldn't it ? Now, Pakistanis don't even have a reason to complain. I think, in their fake anger, the PA does not understand what it is doing. Tactical brilliance, perhaps.

Exactly. That's what I thought. Now, Pakistanis can't complain that their soldiers were killed by NATO.

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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan (TSP): 31 Oct 201

Postby Aditya_V » 06 Dec 2011 13:49

kmkraoind wrote:FLASH NEWS: 2 suicide attacks in Afghanistan, at least 20 feared killed.


In keep with Paki Tradition, the Paki suicide bombers have attacked a Shia Shrine.

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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan (TSP): 31 Oct 201

Postby Altair » 06 Dec 2011 13:53

shiv wrote:
Altair wrote:I have a feeling that Pakistan has set in motion plans for a series of terrorist attacks on both Indian and Western targets all over the world. My feeling is based on the chatter level of Pakistani mouth pieces. They occasionally give out a sudden splash of "confidence" when they speak like a Gamma ray burst.
Please watch Hamid Gul, Kiyani videos and statements for the past week. If there is something in the pipeline, these two monsters would know about it.


IMO unlikely that these mofos have the degree of control that is needed to carry out such a concerted global attack and also gain from it in some way.

shiv
It does not matter if they have control or not. They may not even know of these "plans",BUT they can find out in advance of any such big bang events in the pipeline.I am sure these pigs know but will not give away. Signs like
(a)Key people in ISI/PA suddenly unavailable or disappear
(b)Large funds ($,Euros,Gold)/Drugs/Diamonds transactions in the past month involving Paki hedge funds
(c)Unplanned/Strange re-assignment or re-deployment of key personnel within Pak and abroad in diplomatic missions
can be tracked if there is a will.
However, since it is unlikely that either Hamid Gul or Kiyani would do any such thing it is upto RAW/CIA/MI6 to look for signs. If there is an attack, I am sure one of the three above would throw a hint. It is prudent to track right now.

Cant believe this, I was about to submit my post and I see this news flash.
At least 30 dead in Kabul shrine blast

Agence France-Presse, Updated: December 06, 2011 13:29 IST
Kabul: At least 30 people were killed in an explosion at a Kabul shrine where Shia Muslims were marking the Day of Ashura on Tuesday, an AFP photographer saw.
The blast came in the city centre where Shias had gathered to carry out religious rituals to mark the day, a public holiday in Afghanistan.

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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan (TSP): 31 Oct 201

Postby SSridhar » 06 Dec 2011 14:06

The Oz defence minister spikes h,d & r of TSP
Australian Defence Minister supports uranium sales to India
Strongly favouring Labor Party’s decision to export uranium to India despite it being a non-signatory to the Nuclear Non-Proliferation Treaty, the Australian Defence Minister, Mr Stephen Smith, has said that he did not support the similar treatment towards Pakistan.

Mr Smith, who is set to leave for India today, said he did not support uranium exports to Pakistan. He said that he was a strong supporter of uranium export to India, calling it an exceptional case.

“India brought itself under the governance of the international nuclear regulators, the International Atomic Energy Agency and the Nuclear Suppliers Group,” Mr Smith said.

“That has not occurred with Pakistan. There has never been a suggestion of (nuclear) proliferation from India,” he said adding, “Regrettably, over preceding years, there have been serious concerns about proliferation from Pakistan.”

The Minister expressed hope that Pakistan would understand the decision {this is too much for an already beleagured Pakistan, :D } and that it would not affect military ties between the two nations.

“Pakistan would understand the decision and that it would not affect military ties between the two nations, especially in their cooperation in the war in Afghanistan,” he said adding, “I don’t see this decision as having an adverse outcome, so far as the Australia-Pakistan relationship is concerned.”

“Nor do I see it in any way as being relevant to suitability in South Asia. We have a very good military-to-military and defence-to-defence relationship with Pakistan.”

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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan (TSP): 31 Oct 201

Postby Suppiah » 06 Dec 2011 14:08

No wonder Pakibarians are not attending Bonn - they are busy lighting bonfires in Afghanistan...MMS watch out!

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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan (TSP): 31 Oct 201

Postby shiv » 06 Dec 2011 14:49

Altair wrote:It does not matter if they have control or not. They may not even know of these "plans",BUT they can find out in advance of any such big bang events in the pipeline.I am sure these pigs know but will not give away. Signs like
<snip>
Cant believe this, I was about to submit my post and I see this news flash.
At least 30 dead in Kabul shrine blast


Altair no disagreement with what you say, but the difference between what (I think) you are saying and what I am saying is as follows:

The Pakistan army, jihadi groups and Taliban are part of the same tapestry. Internal information of what is being planned by each will be known to others, but they will not make it public because it will lead back to them anyway. That is - if the army says that they know that the LeT is going to do something, the links stand getting exposed. What is worse than exposure is the fact that they will be asked to help prevent future attacks - which they cannot do anyway. So the groups remain as thick as thieves.

The problem to my mind is in talking as if "Pakistan army", "jiahdis" and "Taliban" are different entities. They are not. They are a loosely connected bunch of thugs who do not exert total control over each other. Someone or the other is always planning attacks, given the history of these groups. The Kabul attack of course is connected with Muharram. It is Muharram today.

The Taliban, Jihadis and Pakistan army gain by being considered as different entities. Like a BRFite with 2-3 avatars who support each other in discussions, but only 1 gets the rap for mistakes made. The US is at the forefront of that attitude because it actively assists the Pakistani army which only pretends to be different from the Taliban. However because the branches of the group act independently - the Pakistan army cannot stop Taliban attacks and Taliban cannot stop Paki army from capturing or killing a Talib to earn money from the US. As a result of this dysfunctionality any attack that occurs does not gain them any leverage or power. Prior knowledge that an attack is going to occur is of no use to them because they can neither stop the attack without revealing their complicity, nor can they later use the attack as a warning to anyone without inviting blame on themselves.

The attacks may occur as you say, but it will gain them nothing. It will be a self goal. That was the reason for the reply I made to your original post.
shiv wrote:
Altair wrote:I have a feeling that Pakistan has set in motion plans for a series of terrorist attacks on both Indian and Western targets all over the world. My feeling is based on the chatter level of Pakistani mouth pieces. They occasionally give out a sudden splash of "confidence" when they speak like a Gamma ray burst.
Please watch Hamid Gul, Kiyani videos and statements for the past week. If there is something in the pipeline, these two monsters would know about it.


IMO unlikely that these mofos have the degree of control that is needed to carry out such a concerted global attack and also gain from it in some way.

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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan (TSP): 31 Oct 201

Postby harbans » 06 Dec 2011 15:11

There would be thousands of families in Gutterstan that have one son in the PA another in the LeT and another working somewhere in Peshawar and supporting the TTP. The happy Paki family once a year during Id would get together and exchange notes and purity scales once a while. The other 5 siblings in the Madrassa would be looking upto which idol bhaijan footsteps to follow..I've known a few myself.

PS: Rajan Ji had assumed India wasn't invited to the Bonn conference..on the basis of past experiences. It's not a closed knit conference with 85 nations.

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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan (TSP): 31 Oct 201

Postby sum » 06 Dec 2011 15:56

Arms and the rogue

THE WEEK investigates a conspiracy hatched by the ISI to arm insurgents in India


It was past midnight on April 1, 2004, in the coastal city of Chittagong in southeastern Bangladesh. Two trawlers carrying munitions, enough to arm a brigade and procured from the company China North Industries Corporation (NORINCO), reached the harbour. Top officials of Bangladesh's foreign intelligence and internal security intelligence guided the trawlers from St Martin's Island in the Bay of Bengal to the Chittagong jetty, and Nurul Amin, a senior official at the industries ministry, was expected to arrive from Dhaka to supervise the unloading and distribution of the consignment.
Everything went on smoothly, until two policemen, Mohammad Alauddin and Helal Uddin, saw the consignment and blew the whistle, perhaps unaware of the orders from higher authorities.

It was New Delhi, not Dhaka, which was shocked by the haul, as it was revealed that the arms were meant for insurgent groups in India. Bangladesh has become, says an Indian military report on the haul, “a key focal point in the transit route of illegal arms in the subcontinent.”


The Criminal Investigation Department (CID) of Bangladesh investigated the case till July this year, and the police have filed charges against some of the country's top politicians and intelligence officers, including two former ministers and intelligence chiefs.
THE WEEK has unearthed official records on the case in India and Bangladesh, and has got exclusive access to the 3,500-page Chittagong case diary. It has also got the confessional statement of the main accused in the case, notorious Bangladeshi arms dealer Hafiz Rehman, and many important court documents. The documents reveal startling details of how Pakistan procured weapons from China to fuel insurgency in India. And the case is the strongest evidence of Pakistan's Inter-Services Intelligence and China coming together to use Bangladeshi soil against India.
The four-member team of Bangladesh army's ordnance branch, which investigated the arms haul, has also confirmed that all 10 truckloads of arms and ammunition were manufactured in China by NORINCO, a state-owned arms manufacturer. The seized consignment, which included 1,290 submachine guns, 400 semi-automatic guns, 400 Thompson submachine guns, 150 rocket launchers, 2,000 grenade-launching tubes, 840 rockets, 24,996 hand-grenades and 11,40,520 bullets, was the largest arms haul in Bangladesh's history.

The case diary says the Directorate General of Forces Intelligence, or DGFI, which is Bangladesh's military intelligence agency, was penetrated by the ISI to the extent that its then director, Maj.-Gen. (retd) Rezzakul Haider Chowdhury, was an ISI mole. Chowdhury was later promoted as the chief of Bangladesh's National Security Intelligence. The NSI, too, was penetrated by the ISI and its then chief, Brig.-Gen. (retd) Abdur Rahim, who reports to the prime minister like the DGFI chief, was discreetly working for the ISI.

The case diary says Chowdhury and Rahim travelled to London and to a Middle East country to meet the ISI's top brass to plan covert anti-India operations (using passports Z0171247 and O0397451). And they often directed sources by using their own cell phones (01812271769 and 01711565850). The investigators have confirmed their contacts with other military and government officials and other ISI moles through emails, phone intercepts, witness accounts and other evidence.
Both Chowdhury and Rahim, currently in prison, were cultivated by two ISI officers posted at the Pakistan High Commission in Dhaka, Brig. Mogisuddin and Col Shahed Mahmud. Mogisuddin facilitated their meetings with ISI officials and arms dealers in Bangladesh, Dubai and London. “Our investigation has found that the weapons came from China and were procured by Pakistan with the help of Bangladesh's top intelligence officials,” said Moniruzaman Chaudhory, chief investigating officer. “All [weapons] were destined for India.” He said his team had figured out six of seven issues that a Chittagong court had directed it to solve during the investigation. “The only unsolved issue is the identification of the vessel that transported the arms consignment,” he said.
The conspiracy began in 2000, when Bangladesh was in political unrest owing to the enmity between the ruling the Awami League and the opposition Bangladesh Nationalist Party (BNP). Many leaders of the Jamaat-e-Islami Bangladesh, who were accused of collaborating with Pakistan during the liberation war and committing war crimes, had returned to the country. The BNP came to power in 2001, forming a coalition with the Jamaat-e-Islami and Islami Oikye Jote.
During this time, President Pervez Musharraf of Pakistan, under intense pressure from the US after the 9/11 attacks, declared that no Pakistan-based group would be allowed to commit terrorism in the name of religion. He banned five jihadi groups that his army had long nurtured. Though the camps were closed, terrorists were shifted to hideaways. The ISI shifted at least 100 terrorist commanders, including Arab fighters of al Qaeda, from Pakistan to Bangladesh in special Pakistan International Airlines flights from Karachi to Dhaka. In Dhaka, the houses they stayed in were owned and protected by the DGFI and NSI. Some terrorist commanders were even kept at the NSI director-general's house in the tony Gulshan area in Dhaka.
Saleem Samad, a Dhaka-based journalist who tried to interview a terrorist who was shifted to the city, was arrested by the intelligence agencies and was threatened with death. “My ordeal began the day I went to interview an Arab fighter in Dhaka,” said Samad. Once he got bail he escaped from Bangladesh and took refuge in Canada. (See the box)
Around this time, many Indian terrorist groups were expanding their activities to Bangladesh. This correspondent visited Sector 3 in Uttara, VIP Road in Karnail and Dhanmondi in Dhaka, where commanders of the United Liberation Front of Asom, a militant separatist group in India's northeast, lived for years. It was in Dhaka that Ulfa's military chief Paresh Baruah alias Kamruj Zaman came under the radar of the ISI. He was flown to Pakistan many a time, and at least once to Afghanistan, where he met warlord Gulbuddin Hekmatyar.
In Dhaka, Baruah's handler was Mogisuddin. He introduced him to pro-Pakistan Bangladeshi politicians and intelligence officials. One of them was Gulam Faruk Obhi, a Jatiya Party parliament member. It was Obhi who introduced Baruah to arms smuggler Hafizur Rahman. “We met at a fast food joint at Rapa Plaza in Dhaka. Paresh told me that he might need my help in importing some goods,” said Rehman in his confession statement. THE WEEK has a copy of the statement. He said Ulfa leaders and their families were protected by the DGFI and NSI.
According to the CID's case diary, the ISI took the help of a Middle East-based Pakistani channel to fund and smuggle weapons. Brig. Rahim and Mogisuddin held several meetings with the channel's people in Dhaka and abroad. Rahim later admitted that he was hooked to the religious programmes on the channel. “Sahabuddin [then director of the NSI] observed this. He told me that I should start a local franchise with the channel,” said Rahim.
One of the meetings, according to the case diary, was held in a Middle East country in 2003 and another in Dhaka in 2004. The owner of the channel came to Dhaka and was received at the airport by NSI officials. The expenses of his stay were met from Bangladesh's national intelligence fund. Prime Minister Khaleda Zia's son Tarique Rahman was also present at the meeting. Currently living in London, Tarique is widely expected to succeed his mother as BNP chief.
Rahim once met the ISI chief in London. The ISI had not received the payment of 2.5 crore takas of the mobile phone bugging devices that the Bangladesh intelligence agencies had bought from Pakistan. “The ISI chief said the devices were a gift from Pakistan,” said Rahim. He, however, did not say anything in his confession on how and when the weapons were procured from China. The investigators suspect that Bangladeshi intelligence officials were not aware of Pakistan's business contacts with NORINCO.
Headquartered in Beijing, NORINCO is the third largest defence company in China and makes precision strike systems, amphibious assault weapons, anti-aircraft and anti-missile systems, night vision products and small arms. It has a long-standing relationship with the Pakistan army. In 1996, the FBI arrested a group of Chinese arms dealers, including three NORINCO representatives, who were trying to smuggle small arms and shoulder-held missile launchers to California. And in August 2003, the US imposed sanctions on NORINCO after it was caught providing Iran speciality steel used in its missile programmes.
Indian security agencies had information on NORINCO's involvement in supplying arms to insurgents. Jayadeva Ranade, former additional secretary, Research and Analysis Wing, said India had informed China about it but the Chinese repeatedly denied it. “The problem was, neither India's military intelligence nor R&AW had any intelligence or evidence to prove it,” he said.
According to the CID's case diary, the weapons might have been procured in 2003 and a ship, most probably, had come from the Chinese port of Beihai in Qingdao. Confession statements by Hafiz Rehman and another arms dealer, Deam Mohamad, in a Chittagong court revealed that the ship passed through Hong Kong and Myanmar, and when it reached St Martin's Island near the Myanmar border, the consignment was reloaded into two trawlers. “When I asked him [Baruah] about the required permission from the Bangladesh navy, coast guard and customs, he said the NSI and DGFI chiefs had made all arrangements, and the jetty permission had also been obtained,” said Rehman in his confession.
During the final stages of the plan, a tall, stocky man was brought in from Manila to Dhaka via Bangkok. He was Anthony Shimray, the chief arms procurer of the National Socialist Council of Nagalim, or NSCN(IM), the biggest insurgent outfit in the northeast. Shimray was arrested by India's National Investigation Agency on October 2, 2010. He said he had procured arms from Chinese defence companies several times with the help of his middleman in Bangkok, Willy Narue.
From Dhaka Shimray went to Chittagong and checked in at the Golden Inn hotel on March 28, 2004. In the hotel ledger he gave his address as 97/5 Sher-e-Bangla road, Mohammadpur, Dhaka. Shimray and Rehman hired two trawlers—Amanat and FB Khazardan—and, along with some other people, took them to St Martin's Island. There they shifted the weapons and ammunition from the ship to the trawlers.
The trawlers passed through Teknaf, in Cox's Bazar district in Chittagong, on the Myanmar-Bangladesh border. Escorted by Bangladesh's coast guard, the consignment reached the Chittagong Urea Fertiliser Ltd Jetty across the Karnaphuli river, where the trawlers pulled in. The jetty was under the industries ministry, which was headed by Jamaat-e-Islami leader Motiur Rahman Nizami. He is in prison for his role in the smuggling.
As soon as the weapons were seized, the ISI and its operatives in Bangladesh began their attempts to derail the investigation. Chittagong was notorious for arms smuggling and the BNP government tried to pass it off as a routine incident. Lutfozzaman Babar, then home minister, was allegedly involved in this. Babar was arrested last year and is currently in Dhaka Central Jail. His lawyer Mofizul Hoq Bhuiyan, however, told THE WEEK that he was being victimised. “It is a politically motivated case. He was a bright young politician. His only fault was that he was in the BNP,” he said.
It was a blind case in the beginning. But an unexpected confession changed its course. “We traced Habibullah Rahman, the man who gave trucks for unloading the arms at Chittagong jetty. During the interrogation he told us that one officer from Bangladesh intelligence wing, field officer Mohamed Akbar Hossain, had taken trucks from him,” said Chaudhory. Once Hossain was arrested and interrogated he revealed the name of his boss, NSI director Wing Commander (retd) Shahabuddin Ahmed, and when Shahabuddin was interrogated he disclosed the name of his boss, Brig.-Gen. Rahim. It was Rahim who revealed the involvement of DGFI chief Maj.-Gen. Chowdhury.
When the investigation in the case started, a plot was allegedly hatched by some members of the BNP to assassinate Sheikh Hasina, the opposition leader. Three months after the arms were seized in Chittagong, grenades were hurled from the roofs of neighbouring buildings towards a truck on which she was addressing a crowd in Dhaka. Eighteen people were killed, though Hasina escaped. Now the investigators have found that the assassination was planned by her own security officers.
Things changed when Hasina's Awami League defeated the BNP-led four-party alliance in the parliament elections in 2008. A few days after she became prime minister, Hasina initiated a multi-agency review of ISI contacts in the DGFI and NSI. She also arrested Ulfa leaders and handed them over to India, including its chairman Arabinda Rajkhowa. “When we took power we realised that there were a lot of wrong things happening in our country,” said Bangladesh Home Minister Shahara Khatun. “We made a clear decision that we are not going to tolerate any act of terrorism in our country.”
The trial of Chittagong arms case at the metropolitan court in Chittagong boils down to the names that would pop up. As the testimony has begun at the court, Bangladesh is brimming with speculation. Outside the court-room, the walls of the town, which witnessed many atrocities during the liberation war, are painted with graffiti extolling the 1971 heroes. “The guys who were supposed to protect our country from any internal and external security threat were moles of a foreign agency. It was a doomsday scenario for us,” said Maj.-Gen. (retd) Syed Muhammad Ibrahim, who fought against Pakistan in 1971.

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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan (TSP): 31 Oct 201

Postby SSridhar » 06 Dec 2011 17:13

Hats off to Sheikh Hasina's government for exposing the ISI-Chinese nexus.

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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan (TSP): 31 Oct 201

Postby gakakkad » 06 Dec 2011 17:18

BRFITE well ahead of the curve as usual . Altair et al predicted terror strikes . And a sozens of afghans were massacred.

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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan (TSP): 31 Oct 201

Postby rajanb » 06 Dec 2011 17:24

harbans wrote:There would be thousands of families in Gutterstan that have one son in the PA another in the LeT and another working somewhere in Peshawar and supporting the TTP. The happy Paki family once a year during Id would get together and exchange notes and purity scales once a while. The other 5 siblings in the Madrassa would be looking upto which idol bhaijan footsteps to follow..I've known a few myself.

PS: Rajan Ji had assumed India wasn't invited to the Bonn conference..on the basis of past experiences. It's not a closed knit conference with 85 nations.


I know. I was ill-informed. And I was so surprised to read about SMK's speech. It seems we are attacking. So much so, that if you surf the Paki sites, the mango apduls are screaming afainst the MFN status in the streets. If they do not want F = Favoured, then they have a choice of another representation of F in the acronym.

Meanwhile the civvies in Porkplace claim that the personnel from the two ISAF/PA/Afghan co-ordination posts have been called back for 'consultations". :mrgreen:

On the same topic, why are the Yanquis taking till 23rd December to complete the investigation into the 24Xqadrification? I would think reviewing a few hours of activity and also any intel prior to that could be at most, completed in a week?

Is something up?

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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan (TSP): 31 Oct 201

Postby harbans » 06 Dec 2011 18:03

^ It was me who was ill informed Rajan Ji..got used to so many times India not being invited to Afghanistan conferences that assumed this was another closed knit India out thing. Apologies for the phrasing..intended to be:

PS: Rajan Ji, I had assumed India

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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan (TSP): 31 Oct 201

Postby SSridhar » 06 Dec 2011 18:13

Rajanb & harbans, it was the November Istanbul conference that was the turnaround after India was not invited for the same conference in the previous year. The Turkish Prime Minister ensured privately that India would be invited. Times do change.

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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan (TSP): 31 Oct 201

Postby jrjrao » 06 Dec 2011 18:19

NY Times edit (of yesterday):

Pakistan Fans the Flames
The United States needs Pakistan’s cooperation — as grudging and duplicitous as it is. Islamabad controls supply routes for American troops in Afghanistan, and it is essential to negotiations with the Taliban.

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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan (TSP): 31 Oct 201

Postby harbans » 06 Dec 2011 18:21

Yes indeed it was the Turkey meet, not too sure if India was in London the year before too. Hindu too says this..

As intense discussions begin in Bonn this weekend in preparation for the December 5 international conference on Afghanistan, India will for the first time get attention it has never gained during similar international meetings around the globe over the past 10 years.


http://www.thehindu.com/news/national/a ... 681982.ece

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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan (TSP): 31 Oct 201

Postby SSridhar » 06 Dec 2011 18:34

harbans, India was there in London but was isolated when it advocated 'no talks' with the Taliban.

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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan (TSP): 31 Oct 201

Postby harbans » 06 Dec 2011 18:44

Thanks Sridhar Ji..more on this coming from Wilileaks:

A cache of a quarter-million US cables released by WikiLeaks has exposed secret back-room manoeuvring by the US and has dramatically revealed how India was kept out of a key meeting on Afghanistan that was held in Turkey.

Among the State Department cables released by WikiLeaks, 3,038 are from the US embassy in India. Other cables pertain to communications from US missions in Islamabad, Colombo and Kathmandu.

India was one of the countries reached out by top US diplomats before the much anticipated release of what the New York Times described as "an unprecedented look at back-room bargaining by embassies around the world, brutally candid views of foreign leaders".

"We have reached out to India to warn them about a possible release of documents," State Department Spokesman P.J. Crowley said ahead of their publication Sunday, triggering condemnation from the White House and congressional leaders.

The US had warned WikiLeaks editor-in-chief Julian Assange that publishing the papers would be illegal and endanger peoples' lives.

A secret cable from the US embassy in Ankara showed that India was kept out of the Jan 25 meeting held in Turkey on Afghanistan to appease Pakistan, though Islamabad was of the view that excluding India from such regional structures would be a mistake.

At a meeting with US Under Secretary of State for Political Affairs William Burns, then Turkey's deputy under secretary for Bilateral Political Affairs, responsible for the Middle East, South Asia and Africa, Rauf Engin Soysal, said Turkey had not invited India to the Afghanistan Neighbours Summit "in deference to Pakistani sensitivities".

"He (Soysal) said Turkey had not invited India to the neighbours summit in deference to Pakistani sensitivities; however, he claimed, Pakistan understands attempting to exclude India from the nascent South Asian regional structures would be a mistake," Guardian quoted the message dated Feb 25, 2010 as saying.


http://www.deccanherald.com/content/116 ... india.html

The US would have listened to Kiyani/ Pasha that India should not be there. Z wouldn't care much if India was there. The impression Z would have given is that Paki's are not averse to India being there, while Kiyani would have said the opposite. US lobbied to appease Kiyani/ Pasha.

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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan (TSP): 31 Oct 201

Postby vijayk » 06 Dec 2011 18:45

SSridhar wrote:Hats off to Sheikh Hasina's government for exposing the ISI-Chinese nexus.


Unfortunately, if it was Khaleda Zia, the ISI/China would have had their way. Our Nikkammas are falling all over the Pakis to issue more visas, calling them Men of Peace etc.

We need to penetrate these Bandladeshi, Nepali networks using the insurgents of North east and eliminate the Bangladesih/Nepali and Chinese agents who co-operate with ISI.

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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan (TSP): 31 Oct 201

Postby svinayak » 06 Dec 2011 20:02

Scholars & Journalists Debate the Future of Pakistan

WASHINGTON, DC
Monday, December 5, 2011

The Brookings Institution hosted two panel discussions on the future of the world's second most populous Muslim nation.

The think-tank has just released a new book called "The Future of Pakistan" (Brookings Institution Press, 2011), which evaluates several scenarios for how the country will develop and evolve in the near future.

A team of 17 experts from Pakistan, the United States, Europe and India contributed chapters to the book. Several of the authors joined other Pakistan experts on two panels to examine the issues, relevant actors and their motivations, different outcomes they might produce, and what it all means for Pakistanis, Indians, the United States, and the entire world.

Updated: Monday at 7:28pm (ET)

http://www.c-span.org/Events/Scholars-a ... 737426007/

Please watch the video
Pakistan is trashed left and right.
Watch the last question asked.



People who are missing in this debate are Chinese. They are a major force in Pak but they are conspicuous by their absence. STRANGE
Last edited by svinayak on 06 Dec 2011 20:22, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan (TSP): 31 Oct 201

Postby Singha » 06 Dec 2011 20:14

as per WSJ it costs the US $400 to airlift a gallon of fuel currently into its isolated posts and firebases in afghanistan.

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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan (TSP): 31 Oct 201

Postby rajanb » 06 Dec 2011 21:56

Singha wrote:as per WSJ it costs the US $400 to airlift a gallon of fuel currently into its isolated posts and firebases in afghanistan.


Porkistan's economic strangulation of Unkil. :eek:

If I was a US Marine I would be going :evil:

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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan (TSP): 31 Oct 201

Postby Altair » 06 Dec 2011 22:07

gakakkad wrote:BRFITE well ahead of the curve as usual . Altair et al predicted terror strikes . And a sozens of afghans were massacred.

Actually I was preparing for a big bang attack like busted Operation:Bojinka by RamzeY and KSM. I think December 23-January 2 is going to be a testing time. If I was a Paki general I would strike at that time when all the world is shopping and partying.
Target can be anywhere from Mumbai to Kabul to New York.
Pakis are crazy enough to do it even if they are going to loose another 50% of their country.

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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan (TSP): 31 Oct 201

Postby ramana » 06 Dec 2011 22:27

The Brookings Report is interesting cast of authors!

Table of COntents :Future of Pakistna

All the Indians are synrectic types and can't see the TSP for what it is:an armed kabila biding its time to get back into India and wont let the people settle down till it happens. The kabila has supproters in US who orchestrate its recalcitrance.

Pakistan is not an acronym. Its a demonym.

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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan (TSP): 31 Oct 201

Postby member_19648 » 06 Dec 2011 22:39

Altair wrote:Actually I was preparing for a big bang attack like busted Operation:Bojinka by RamzeY and KSM. I think December 23-January 2 is going to be a testing time. If I was a Paki general I would strike at that time when all the world is shopping and partying.
Target can be anywhere from Mumbai to Kabul to New York.
Pakis are crazy enough to do it even if they are going to loose another 50% of their country.


I believe they would want to go for small attacks rather than huge ones. When Afg was alive with yahoos, Pakis used to have it as a hedge against any retaliation falling on them. They used to give the orders and behave civilized while the world looked at the yahoos in Afg with suspicion. Now, that hedge is gone, any attack and the world knows who is responsible. So, the Pakis might want to go small scale, that would save their falling grace a bit, improve their condition among yahoos, they can claim being victims themselves, and the attacks would be small enough not to invite retaliation. They would want to go through this phase with minimum risk and max ROI, to come and fight another day.

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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan (TSP): 31 Oct 201

Postby Brad Goodman » 06 Dec 2011 22:45

spoken like a true paki
Play India after they compensate 2009 tour cancellation: Latif

KARACHI: Former Test captain Rashid Latif has urged the cricket board to play a bilateral series with India only after they compensate Pakistan for the cancelled tour of 2009.


"Why do we have to always take the initiative in wanting to resume bilateral ties with India. They didn't allow our players to take part in the IPL for the last three editions, what difference has it made to our cricket infact our team is doing well and our players are in demand all over the world," Latif said.
like in London jail :mrgreen:

"Pakistan cricket has survived and also done well despite international teams not coming to our country, India ignoring us and the spot-fixing scandal so we should take heart from all this while dealing with the Indians."

I have no idea what he is saying here

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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan (TSP): 31 Oct 201

Postby Brad Goodman » 06 Dec 2011 22:49

Pakistan rejects Lakshmi Mittal's investment proposal: Report

"The reason for rejecting the offer, according to the official, was sensitive relations between the two countries," The Express Tribune's website said.

It further said that "the investment offer was reportedly above $2 billion".

"In the offer, it was said that the coal obtained from Thar would be used by the company ArcelorMittal's steel plants situated in India and other countries," the website added

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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan (TSP): 31 Oct 201

Postby Altair » 06 Dec 2011 22:54

Ivanev wrote:So, the Pakis might want to go small scale, that would save their falling grace a bit, improve their condition among yahoos, they can claim being victims themselves, and the attacks would be small enough not to invite retaliation. They would want to go through this phase with minimum risk and max ROI, to come and fight another day.

Unfortunately that is not how Pakis think. Pakis think like a spoilt child. They will up the ante and do more antics until they find someone who can calm them with more weapons,support for Kashmir, Depth in Afghanistan etc. They will raise the stakes. I guarantee.

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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan (TSP): 31 Oct 201

Postby Nihat » 06 Dec 2011 22:55

Had we not dismembered TSP into two , then East India would be a very disturbed place. God Bless Indira Gandhi.

Hopefully our politicians and intelligence agencies are working to ensure that the current BD govt. continues to enjoy the goodwill of the BD population and remains in power for the next 20 yrs. at least so that we can consolidate our position and not allow ISI poison into BD anymore.

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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan (TSP): 31 Oct 201

Postby ramana » 06 Dec 2011 22:57

Altair if you can spend the time, try to see the parallels between Hitler and Mussolini's fascist ideas and the Jinnah's Muslim League. There is an element of gottdamerung in the Paki psyche. I think all kabilas (societies ruled by select gangs using force) in whatever garb end up with such delusions.

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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan (TSP): 31 Oct 201

Postby partha » 06 Dec 2011 23:15

http://tribune.com.pk/story/302997/rehman-malik-thanks-taliban-for-maintaining-muharram-peace/

ISLAMABAD: Interior Minister Rehman Malik on Tuesday thanked the Taliban for maintaining peace during Muharram on his appeal, Express News reported.

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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan (TSP): 31 Oct 201

Postby ramana » 06 Dec 2011 23:22

He told them to go do their Pakistaniyat in Afghanistan.
In other words he is praiisng the Mazar-e-Sharif attack and death toll.

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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan (TSP): 31 Oct 201

Postby Altair » 06 Dec 2011 23:40

ramana wrote:Altair if you can spend the time, try to see the parallels between Hitler and Mussolini's fascist ideas and the Jinnah's Muslim League. There is an element of gottdamerung in the Paki psyche. I think all kabilas (societies ruled by select gangs using force) in whatever garb end up with such delusions.

I will try ramana garu. We must also observe the Baath party. The atrocities committed by Baaathists are no small crimes.

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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan (TSP): 31 Oct 201

Postby Nihat » 07 Dec 2011 00:14

TSP has reached it's 72 yet again . TIme for a new start !!!


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