Indian Naval News & Discussion - 12 Oct 2013

All threads that are locked or marked for deletion will be moved to this forum. The topics will be cleared from this archive on the 1st and 16th of each month.
Prasad
BRF Oldie
Posts: 7385
Joined: 16 Nov 2007 00:53
Location: Chennai

Re: Indian Naval Discussion

Postby Prasad » 20 Apr 2015 23:15

O/T The number of people taking a picture of Vishakapatnam is amazing!

Philip
BRF Oldie
Posts: 20147
Joined: 01 Jan 1970 05:30
Location: India

Re: Indian Naval Discussion

Postby Philip » 21 Apr 2015 09:39

Note the little bulge at the bows ,indicating the location of the bow sonar.I think that this is a first for the P-15 class or am I mistaken-do the 15As have bow mounted sonars or hull mounted sonars?nations

The gunfire support is essential for any amphib ops in out island territories,if there is an attempt to invade them by an enemy,or retake them if captured.Plus,in the defence of the smaller island IOR nations, like the Mauritius or the Maldives ,where there was a previous coup attempt in the late '80s.One cannot rule out an ISI sponsored attempt to take over the Maldives supported by China.The IN has to be prepared for any eventuality.

From Bus Std./BR,worth posting in full.
[quotehttp://www.bharat-rakshak.com/NEWS/newsrf.php?newsid=21889]

INS Visakhapatnam shows growing Indian ability to build warships economically

Ajai Shukla | New Delhi April 21, 2015

The Navy’s new destroyer, INS Visakhapatnam, with enhanced capability to operate in areas tainted by a nuclear, biological and chemical strike, at its launch at the Mazagon dock in Mumbai on Monday

On Monday, eight months after Prime Minister Narendra Modi commissioned the first Project 15A guided missile destroyer, INS Kolkata, the first of its successor class vessels - INS Visakhapatnam - was launched into the water at Mazagon Dock Ltd, Mumbai (MDL).

INS Visakhapatnam, the first of four stealthy destroyers coming up under Project 15B, began taking shape on January 23, 2013, when MDL started fashioning 2,800 tonnes of Indian-made warship steel into the warship's hull. With this partly-build structure now floating in water, INS Visakhapatnam will be built up by 2017 into a 7,334-tonne behemoth. After trials, it will be commissioned in 2018 as India's most heavily armed warship.

It will be joined in the fleet at two year intervals by three successors: INS Paradip, INS Marmagoa and a fourth vessel, yet unnamed.

The most remarkable feature of these destroyers is not its 32 world-beating Indo-Israeli anti-ship-missile defences called the Long Range Surface to Air Missile (LR-SAM), or Barak 8; nor its arsenal of 16 Brahmos supersonic cruise missiles that can sink ships or strike land targets 295 kilometres away; nor its heavyweight torpedoes that can destroy enemy submarines 100 kilometres away.

The most remarkable feature of these warships is that, tonne-for-tonne, they are not only one of the world's most heavily armed but also one of the cheapest.

Underlining the benefits of designing and building combat platforms in the country, the four Project 15B warships will cost the navy Rs 29,348 crore, an average of Rs 7,337 crore per destroyer. Tipping the scales at an estimated 7,334 tonnes, INS Visakhapatnam will cost the navy just about Rs 1 crore per tonne, or $159,750 in 2014 prices.

Three Project 15A destroyers were built even cheaper -at $92,210 per tonne - but the fall of the rupee and inflation in labour and materials cost have raised the price of their successors.

Only China's Guangzhou class destroyers were built cheaper, at $146,870 per tonne in 2014 prices. However, as combat platforms, Guangzhou-class destroyers are not in the same class as INS Visakhapatnam. Their anti-missile defence consists of 48 Russian-origin SA-N-12 Grizzly surface-to-air missiles, which have ranges of under 40 kilometres, depending upon the target. The LR-SAMs on the Visakhapatnam-class, in contrast, shoot down incoming anti-ship missiles - the most significant threat to surface warships - at ranges out to 70 kilometres, and have a far better hit probability.

Similarly, the Brahmos anti-ship/anti-surface missile, which is both supersonic and has a range of 295 kilometres, is regarded as superior to the Guangzhou-class' YJ-83 anti-ship missiles, which have ranges of about 200 kilometres.

The Daring-class destroyers, which is the spearhead of the Royal Navy's surface fleet, and which the United Kingdom boasts is the finest air defence destroyer in the world, costs an estimated 193,650 per tonne to build.

Few would dispute the technological pre-eminence of the US Navy's DDG-51 destroyers, of which USS Rafael Peralta is the newest. Boasting the Aegis Combat System for air defence, Harpoon anti-ship missiles and Tomahawk strategic land strike cruise missiles; these Arleigh Burke-class destroyers are the gold standard in multi-role capability. However, this capability comes at a prohibitive estimated $205,000 per tonne, despite the economy of scale that comes from building about 100 of these warships.

Even more expensive is Japan's Akizuki-class destroyer, which Mitsubishi is building for $232,370 per tonne; and Australia's Hobart-class destroyer, designed by Spanish shipbuilder Navantia and built in Australia, which will cost the Royal Australian Navy an estimated $333,300 per tonne, more than double the cost of INS Visakhapatnam.

The capabilities that the navy has announced for Project 15B indicates the design of these warships - rooted in the three destroyers of Project 15; and evolved into the three of Project 15A - has continually improved. Although these vessels use the same power plant - four Ukrainian M-36E Zorya gas turbines - INS Visakhapatnam, which is significantly heavier at 7,334 tonnes than the 5,800-tonne Delhi-class destroyers of Project 15, can work up the same speed (30 knots, or 56 kmph).

The Visakhapatnam's crew of 325 officers and sailors, include an air complement that operates the ship's two helicopters. The destroyer carries 1,000 tonnes of fuel, which allows it to patrol the oceans for 8,000 nautical miles (15,000 km; 9,200 miles) at 18 knots (33 km/h; 21 mph). For entering an area that has undergone a nuclear, chemical or biological (NBC) strike, the Visakhapatnam has a "total atmosphere control system", which cleans the air through a filter system.[/quote]

PS:This is the most accurate report,others saying that only 8BMos SSM carried.

Singha
BRF Oldie
Posts: 66601
Joined: 13 Aug 2004 19:42
Location: the grasshopper lies heavy

Re: Indian Naval Discussion

Postby Singha » 21 Apr 2015 09:57

> designed by Spanish shipbuilder Navantia and built in Australia, which will cost the Royal Australian Navy an estimated $333,300 per tonne, more than double the cost of INS Visakhapatnam.

australia has a long trend of building overpriced vessels in australia instead of directly importing. they are spending $1b more due to australia build for just 3 ships...
http://www.news.com.au/national/navy-wa ... 6847274212

p.s. cheen seems to have shafted them with sub standard pipes too, pics above :mrgreen:

Kersi D
BRFite
Posts: 1383
Joined: 20 Sep 2000 11:31

Re: Indian Naval Discussion

Postby Kersi D » 21 Apr 2015 10:16

HELP HELP HELP

Hey everybody

How do you insert a pic on BRF ?

How do you insert a video on BRF ?


Kersi

deejay
Forum Moderator
Posts: 3888
Joined: 11 Aug 2016 06:14

Re: Indian Naval Discussion

Postby deejay » 21 Apr 2015 10:39

Prasad wrote:O/T The number of people taking a picture of Vishakapatnam is amazing!


It is the new form of Salutations.

Singha
BRF Oldie
Posts: 66601
Joined: 13 Aug 2004 19:42
Location: the grasshopper lies heavy

Re: Indian Naval Discussion

Postby Singha » 21 Apr 2015 10:47

kersi use the full editor, paste the link first, then mark the link with mouse end to end and then click on image button

K_Rohit
BRFite
Posts: 186
Joined: 16 Feb 2009 19:11

Re: Indian Naval Discussion

Postby K_Rohit » 21 Apr 2015 10:52

Why is P15B that much heavier than P15A? Same propulsion, same armament, what adds weight?

Singha
BRF Oldie
Posts: 66601
Joined: 13 Aug 2004 19:42
Location: the grasshopper lies heavy

Re: Indian Naval Discussion

Postby Singha » 21 Apr 2015 11:10

diff is only 200t per reports. perhaps additional fuel, bow sonar, a heavier PA radar on the aft mast, more armour in some areas .

srin
BRFite
Posts: 1815
Joined: 11 Aug 2016 06:13

Re: Indian Naval Discussion

Postby srin » 21 Apr 2015 11:33

Guys - how many cruise missiles does the Vizag class carry ? I used the Kolkata specs from Wiki and assumed it was 16, but all the news reports mention it is just 8 :shock: And coupled with just 32 Barak-8s.

That's a long way down from Delhi class with 16 anti-surface missiles + 32 Barak-1 + 48 Shtil (reading numbers of the wiki - so may be off) at only 6200 tons.

What am I missing ?

Kersi D
BRFite
Posts: 1383
Joined: 20 Sep 2000 11:31

Re: Indian Naval Discussion

Postby Kersi D » 21 Apr 2015 12:19

Our friend Mr Joseph Chacko of Frontier India, has come with a new book on IN submarines. This book should be interested as it is probably the first and only book on IN submarines

http://frontierindia.org/product/foxtro ... arine-arm/

Kersi

Kersi D
BRFite
Posts: 1383
Joined: 20 Sep 2000 11:31

Re: Indian Naval Discussion

Postby Kersi D » 21 Apr 2015 12:32

Singha wrote:kersi use the full editor, paste the link first, then mark the link with mouse end to end and then click on image button


Sorry Mr Singha. But I am lost !!!

Please tell me how exactly to go from this INDIAN NAVAL DISCUSSIONS page.

Kersi

hnair
Forum Moderator
Posts: 3730
Joined: 03 May 2006 01:31
Location: Trivandrum

Re: Indian Naval Discussion

Postby hnair » 21 Apr 2015 12:33

Kersi-saar, just post the URLS of your photos and videos. Djinns will do the rest 8)

Prasad, I thought for a second, they were waving the ship off. Then saw the 10s of devices in the air. Considering the price point of its smartphone handsets, cheen needs its Uoooaawei to add a network aggregator and it will have its own Gorgon Stare over at these docks :lol:

Tribute to ATV launch, no such laxity

Kersi D
BRFite
Posts: 1383
Joined: 20 Sep 2000 11:31

Re: Indian Naval Discussion

Postby Kersi D » 21 Apr 2015 12:34

I have not uploaded them anywhere. One video and 2 pics are on my HDD

JE Menon
Forum Moderator
Posts: 7030
Joined: 01 Jan 1970 05:30

Re: Indian Naval Discussion

Postby JE Menon » 21 Apr 2015 12:37

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AlK27dw-jAc

For those who know Tamil, a long programme on INS Vizag ... a bit of nice video in the beginning. And discussion by a couple of armed forces folk. Very patriotic feeling infused through the discussion.

And one from DNA, Zeenews, in Hindi

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z6lXNnOzDao

Kersi D
BRFite
Posts: 1383
Joined: 20 Sep 2000 11:31

Re: Indian Naval Discussion

Postby Kersi D » 21 Apr 2015 12:41

If possible I will e-mail it to one the admins who may do the needful. My ID k e r s i k d o t i w a l l a A@T r e d i f f m a i l .dot. com

Singha
BRF Oldie
Posts: 66601
Joined: 13 Aug 2004 19:42
Location: the grasshopper lies heavy

Re: Indian Naval Discussion

Postby Singha » 21 Apr 2015 12:55

Kersi D wrote:I have not uploaded them anywhere. One video and 2 pics are on my HDD


you can upload the images to http://imgur.com/ and video to youtube and post the links here. signing up for those accounts is free. if you already have gmail a/c the youtube credentials are already there.

Kersi D
BRFite
Posts: 1383
Joined: 20 Sep 2000 11:31

Re: Indian Naval Discussion

Postby Kersi D » 21 Apr 2015 13:25

Singha wrote:
Kersi D wrote:I have not uploaded them anywhere. One video and 2 pics are on my HDD


you can upload the images to http://imgur.com/ and video to youtube and post the links here. signing up for those accounts is free. if you already have gmail a/c the youtube credentials are already there.


That's the only solution available to me

jaladipc
BRFite
Posts: 456
Joined: 15 Jan 2009 20:51
Location: i CAN ADA

Re: Indian Naval Discussion

Postby jaladipc » 21 Apr 2015 17:55

Hello everyone, its been a very long long time and thought to pay a visit based on some chai pe charcha with the paanwallah

A follow on to the Visakha class will be announced with full spectrum of defensive capabilities with ABM being prime focus. Paanwallah says 3 hulls on initial order with +2 under consideration if the private shipyard can deliver on time and meet ezzzpectations. it was said the esize of the steel required will put in a different class

Austin
BRF Oldie
Posts: 23385
Joined: 23 Jul 2000 11:31

Re: Indian Naval Discussion

Postby Austin » 21 Apr 2015 18:07

India launches first-of-class Project 15B destroyer

http://www.janes.com/article/50802/indi ... -destroyer
Mazagon Dockyard Limited launched Vishakhapatnam , the first of four 7,300-tonne Project 15B guided missile destroyers being built for the Indian Navy (IN), in Mumbai on 20 April.

IN officials said it would be commissioned in July 2018 and delivery of the three follow-on platforms at two year intervals will be completed by 2024 at an overall cost of INR293.40 billion (USD4.89 billion).

Vishakhapatnam is a follow on design from the Project 15A destroyers, the first of which - INS Kolkata - was commissioned in August 2014. The remaining two - Kochi and Chennai - are expected to join service by early 2016.

Vishakhapatnam 's key differences from the Project 15A class include the relocation of its sonar to the bow from the hull; the design of its mast, which houses its main radar, has also been revised to further reduce its radar cross section.


Other changes include reshaping of the hull to accentuate its stealth features and the addition of a rail-less helicopter traversing system.

The IN claims that over 65% of the 164 m-long Vishakhapatnam is indigenously sourced, including its DMR249 A steel and 11 of its weapon and associated sensor systems. Its imported components include four Ukrainian-built Zorya-Mashproekt DT-59 gas turbines, Russian propellers and shafting, assorted weaponry, sensors and radar.

The destroyer is fitted with the locally developed Ship Data Network, which manages its power, integrated platform and combat management systems.


IN officials said Vishakhapatnam would be fitted with the IAI-Elta-designed EL/M-2248 Multi-Function Surveillance Threat Alert Radar (MF-STAR) to provide guidance to 32 Barak-8/NG air-defence missiles, which have a 70 km range. IN officials claim that MF-STAR is capable of simultaneously tracking multiple seaborne targets up to a distance of 25 km and fighter aircraft upto 250 km away.


The Barak-8/NG, under joint development by Rafael-IAI and India's Defence Research and Development Organisation (DRDO) since 2006, will be test-fired in October from Kolkata and fitted onto other warships, including Vishakhapatnam , officials said. The Barak-8 was successfully tested in Israel in November 2014.

The destroyer will also be fitted with IAI-Elta EL/M-2238 S-band (2 to 4 GHz) 3-D volume air surveillance radar (STAR) radar and a Thales LW-08 D-band air search radar.

Vishakhapatnam 's principal weapon will be eight BrahMos anti-ship cruise missiles co-developed by the DRDO and Russia. A test-firing of Brahmos was conducted from Kolkata on 9 January.


The ship's anti-submarine warfare capability includes twin-tube launchers and RBU-6000 SMERCH-2 rocket launchers built by private defence contractor Larsen & Toubro (L&T).

Other armaments include a licence-built 76 mm Oto Melara Super Rapid Gun, four Russian AK-630 close-in weapon systems and a 127 mm main gun, which is still under negotiation.

In January India's Ministry of Defence approved the INR15 billion procurement of 13 127 mm guns. Oto Melara emerged as the sole bidder with its 127 mm/64-calibre gun along with its precision-guided Vulcano round when BAE Systems declined to offer its 127 mm/62-cal Mk 45 Naval Gun System in response to the November 2013 tender. However, IN sources said BAE Systems is re-considering its options and a re-evaluation of the acquisition is anticipated.

Meanwhile, senior IN officials said INS Vikramaditya (ex-Admiral Gorshkov), the IN's 44,750-tonne Kiev-class aircraft carrier, will be equipped with a Barak-1 point defence system during its first minor refit around June.

They said the carrier, which joined service in late 2013, would receive the Barak-1 system currently fitted to the frigate INS Godavari , which is being decommissioned. The installation will be carried out at INS Kadamba, the IN's new base at Karwar on India's southwest coast.

Austin
BRF Oldie
Posts: 23385
Joined: 23 Jul 2000 11:31

Re: Indian Naval Discussion

Postby Austin » 21 Apr 2015 18:32

So P-15A has 16 Barak-8 and they doubled it to 32 for P-15B , Brahmos still remains 8 wonder why such low number.

CIWS is just Ak-630M no Barak-1 or will be retrofitted later who knows Maitri or naval variant of Astra VLS

John
BRF Oldie
Posts: 2137
Joined: 03 Feb 2001 12:31

Re: Indian Naval Discussion

Postby John » 21 Apr 2015 19:07

Austin, P 15a has 32 Barak 8 and Janes simply lifts information from news media reporting of 8 i would wait till confirmation since detailed piece already said 16.

prabhug
BRFite
Posts: 174
Joined: 05 Dec 2008 14:31

Re: Indian Naval Discussion

Postby prabhug » 21 Apr 2015 19:15

My question again . Why is laser guided SAM not used in CIWS missiles for the navy ? Is there anything already i have missed

member_28911
BRFite
Posts: 537
Joined: 11 Aug 2016 06:14

Re: Indian Naval Discussion

Postby member_28911 » 21 Apr 2015 19:47

Austin wrote:So P-15A has 16 Barak-8 and they doubled it to 32 for P-15B , Brahmos still remains 8 wonder why such low number.

CIWS is just Ak-630M no Barak-1 or will be retrofitted later who knows Maitri or naval variant of Astra VLS


P-15A (Calcutta class) has 32 Barak-8 VLS and 16 Brahmos VLS.

Kersi D
BRFite
Posts: 1383
Joined: 20 Sep 2000 11:31

Re: Indian Naval Discussion

Postby Kersi D » 21 Apr 2015 20:57

The armament of P 15B is similar to P 15A. It has 32 Barak 8 VLS launchers and 16 Brahmos VLS launchers.

Kersi D
BRFite
Posts: 1383
Joined: 20 Sep 2000 11:31

Re: Indian Naval Discussion

Postby Kersi D » 21 Apr 2015 20:58

Last edited by Rahul M on 21 Apr 2015 22:12, edited 3 times in total.
Reason: put only video id in utube tags. the part AFTER v=

Kersi D
BRFite
Posts: 1383
Joined: 20 Sep 2000 11:31

Re: Indian Naval Discussion

Postby Kersi D » 21 Apr 2015 20:59

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_ccxCvzIndk&feature=youtu.be

The launch of the first P 15B destroyer of IN. She will be named INS Visakhapatnam

K

arun
BRF Oldie
Posts: 10248
Joined: 28 Nov 2002 12:31

Re: Indian Naval Discussion

Postby arun » 21 Apr 2015 21:26

X Posted from the STFUP thread.

Pakistan Navy attempts to help Pakistani boat carrying 232 Kilograms of narcotics apprehended by a joint Indian Navy and Coast Guard team to escape arrest.

Attempt to engineer an escape of the Pakistani boat by the Pakistan Navy foiled due to “heavy presence of Indian Navy and Coast Guard warships”.

Given the attempt of the Pakistan navy to engineer an escape of the Pakistani drug smugglers, our Government must do a thorough check to rule out that this was not a Pakistan State sponsored narcotic smuggling ring with intent to raise funding from narcotics to foment Mohammadden Terrorism in our country:

Pakistan boat seizure: Crew contacted Pakistan Navy for help

John
BRF Oldie
Posts: 2137
Joined: 03 Feb 2001 12:31

Re: Indian Naval Discussion

Postby John » 21 Apr 2015 21:41

prabhug wrote:My question again . Why is laser guided SAM not used in CIWS missiles for the navy ? Is there anything already i have missed

Palma a cheaper variant of Kashtan uses laser guided Sosna missiles, laser guidance is cheaper than command guidance problem. But laser guidance has its drawbacks it is not all weather capable and i am not sure how effective they are at hitting sea skimmers in high sea states. But regardless they have same weakness as command guidance in that only limited number can be guided. Both have been replaced by active guided missiles with drop in prices for seeker/onboard computer. Only matter of time before missiles have network centric capabilities and can share data between each other increasing tracking capability.

VinodTK
BRF Oldie
Posts: 2249
Joined: 18 Jun 2000 11:31

Re: Indian Naval Discussion

Postby VinodTK » 22 Apr 2015 02:37

India to Purchase Harpoon Missiles Worth $145 Million
The Indian MoDs Defence Acquisition Council has cleared the purchase of another 22 Harpoon anti-ship missile at a cost Rs 913 crores ($145 million).

This was in the pipeline as a foreign military sales deal with the department of defence of the USA. The missiles are manufactured by Boeing Defence, Space and Aerospace.

The missiles will be integrated with the Sihsumar class submarines – the Indian version of the HDW submarines.

Harpoon missiles have three versions: for the army, navy and the air force. The naval version is named UGM 84.

Indian navy had earlier procured 26 such missiles for itself to be fitted on P81 surveillance aircrafts for $200 million. Another 26 were brought by the Indian Air Force.

Singha
BRF Oldie
Posts: 66601
Joined: 13 Aug 2004 19:42
Location: the grasshopper lies heavy

Re: Indian Naval Discussion

Postby Singha » 22 Apr 2015 06:24

At 7 million these must be the most expensive subsonic asm in the world. Being bulk item its high time we started our own product. China has some ten domestic models already


Return to “Trash Can Archive”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 30 guests