Aero India 2015

Karan M
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Re: Aero India 2015

Postby Karan M » 20 Feb 2015 22:47

Dileep wrote:Just got back to the room. The KB in all its wisdom, made us say at the guest house near electronic city!!! My colleague heading the defense BU treated ourselves to an excellent Italian dinner at Chianti, for all the hard work we pulled off together.

The datapattern seeker is for.... BRAHMOS!!! it is getting to trials soon. They also are doing X band AESA work independently.

Had a photo op today with the great guy who flies LCH. He dropped in to our stall to say hi to one of our ex brass colleagues.

Avalon Tech chennai makes metal parts for Rolls Royce jet engine (don't know the model) and all kinds of advanced stuff. Have some photus to share. Some are directly outsourced by US majors.

Saw single crystal blades at HAL. Have photus.

Got a lot of infoboards. Too tired to download/watermark/post. Will have to do it later.


Data patterns is in competition with Alpha for that seeker as I recall.
The same seeker or similar ones will be used for Nirbhay as well.

Is the x-Band AESA for a seeker, airborne FCR or ground based surveillance radar?

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Re: Aero India 2015

Postby Sanjay » 21 Feb 2015 00:00

A request if I may: can we list links to any photo albums people care to share with us ? Maybe a BR AI 2015 album page ?

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Re: Aero India 2015

Postby Shreeman » 21 Feb 2015 00:19

Sanjay wrote:A request if I may: can we list links to any photo albums people care to share with us ? Maybe a BR AI 2015 album page ?


You mean, like, hypothetically, in a manner of speaking, this one -- http://www.bharat-rakshak.com/media/AeroIndia2015/

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Re: Aero India 2015

Postby Dileep » 21 Feb 2015 06:13

Here are the images of the glide weapon

Image

Image

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Re: Aero India 2015

Postby member_23370 » 21 Feb 2015 06:31

Nice. Are the wings fixed or do they deploy after release. The range is impressive 130-150 km and total weight of less than 600 kg means Tejas can carry a couple. Wonder why CEP was not mentioned. Too early perhaps.

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Re: Aero India 2015

Postby member_24684 » 21 Feb 2015 07:29

Dileep wrote:Here are the images of the glide weapon

Image


good to see

But they did a test of 1000 kg glide bomb ranging 100 kilometers. but this shows less than 500 kg total weight and Warhead only 315 kg

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Re: Aero India 2015

Postby Cybaru » 21 Feb 2015 07:50

SajeevJino, did they say 1000 pounds or 1000 kilos? They probably have different versions. This will so do for now! precisely delivered 535 pound warhead is pretty awesome. This is amazing.

This must also have a really low rcs. Kevlar/fibre and stealth shaping.

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Re: Aero India 2015

Postby negi » 21 Feb 2015 08:32

Wow that looks like a chotu predator , the wings form the pic look as if they do not fold but may be swivel about the center and deploy like Nirbhay's ?

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Re: Aero India 2015

Postby Sid » 21 Feb 2015 09:16

There are actually 2 types of glide bombs in picture.

Second pic shows other one on the right with a different wing layout then first one.

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Re: Aero India 2015

Postby Gyan » 21 Feb 2015 09:39

There may be multiple types of Glide bombs 1000kg, 600kg, 250kg etc. One will only know for sure when something blows enemy's Musharaff.

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Re: Aero India 2015

Postby Dennis » 21 Feb 2015 10:36

A quick note on the glide weapons: They are displayed in the IAF BRD display area. They are not part of the DRDO display.
From what I was able to gather from the folks there, these are not weapons that they manufacture or plan to, but concepts they want to make (whatever that means). The shapes, wing profiles, etc. were all generic. These have not been tested in any form, ever.

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Re: Aero India 2015

Postby Indranil » 21 Feb 2015 10:43

^^^ That seems right. They don't look like any kits.

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Re: Aero India 2015

Postby Dennis » 21 Feb 2015 19:14

A few info boards in this album.

Credit to @flightgeist (twitter)

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Re: Aero India 2015

Postby member_24684 » 21 Feb 2015 20:01

^^^

SATCOM for Fighters. looks like most modern tech to me,

Image

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Re: Aero India 2015

Postby SaiK » 21 Feb 2015 22:15

rahuldevnath's tarmak sponsor pic is really awesome.. check the sonic boom
http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-Ff81mHBPdIE/V ... 1600/8.jpg

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Re: Aero India 2015

Postby JTull » 21 Feb 2015 23:28

SaiK wrote:rahuldevnath's tarmak sponsor pic is really awesome.. check the sonic boom
http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-Ff81mHBPdIE/V ... 1600/8.jpg


That's not a vapor cone caused near transonic speeds, but wingtip vortex.

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Re: Aero India 2015

Postby Indranil » 22 Feb 2015 00:31

^^^ LERX induced vortex.

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Re: Aero India 2015

Postby krish.pf » 22 Feb 2015 06:03

Bhaskar_T wrote:Krish - You can buy directly at the venue but 21st and 22nd Feb being Saturday and Sunday so there will be crowd, hence I suggest you to register online. Simply register for ADVA Rs600/- registration, carry the confirmation payment page which also shows you your unique registration & get the pass/ticket at the venue gate in 5-10 minutes. This confirmation not only comes after paying through credit card (take a photo from your mobile) but also comes to your email and mobile (sms). You do not need to take print out, showing the sms/email is sufficient. Do carry the identity card provided during registration. There are many desk-counters at the venue and I am told in weekdays, any counter had max of 8-10 people in queue. The desk was efficient and fast in issuing the tickets/passes - No worries. You can carry as many water bottles as you like (no snacks). Am sure you will carry umbrella, hat and sunglasses. Car parking no issue.

Am going there tomorrow, will reach by 8:30AM. My aim is to start with a heavy breakfast and enjoy the morning show, leave the venue by 12. Above is based on my friend experience who visited yesterday. He arrived at the venue by 9AM when the show was expected to start but the flying display according to him started at 9:30AM. This is all I can share. Last time when I visited, 2 years ago, food stalls were a mess by afternoon (I also recall ice-cream vendors were a hit & water bottles were being sold at exponential prices though they should have been selling stuff at authorized rates). People were stepping on each other fighting to be in queue etc for buying meals in different stalls. It was manageable but there was scope of improvement. So, if you are with kids, you may want to get the food earlier before long queues pile up. Hoping, arrangements are even better this year.

Fellow members can add/correct suggestions/tips from their experience in the last 3 days.

Krish.pf - Hi all,

I need some info on the online booking for general visitors. While booking online, it says -
Quote:
6. Your payment will take a minimum of one working day to reach the DEO account. You should take this into consider while making your payment.

How long does it take for the payment to get processed? What will happen if one books today? Is the coming Saturday and Sunday working days for DEO?
Is there an option to get tickets only for the ADVA 600Rs ticket, directly at the venue, tomorrow or on sunday? Much thanks to anyone with info, Regards

Much thanks for the info bhaskar. Much appreciate it. :)

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Re: Aero India 2015

Postby rahuldevnath » 22 Feb 2015 20:06

SaiK wrote:rahuldevnath's tarmak sponsor pic is really awesome.. check the sonic boom
http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-Ff81mHBPdIE/V ... 1600/8.jpg


Thanks Saik that's not the sonic boom. Here is another version on BR ==>
http://www.bharat-rakshak.com/media/1028337-3/Su-30MKI_001.jpg



Added this parting shot of Rafale ==>

Image



By the way the Hall Exhibition and Display Boards album is up here ==>

http://www.bharat-rakshak.com/media/AeroIndia2015/exhibition

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Re: Aero India 2015

Postby Philip » 22 Feb 2015 20:42

V.Interesting news.Exciting prospect.How would this affect the desi plan to build our own med. multi-role helos at HAL?
However,as of now,we do not have any naval med. sized helo design ready to replace our Sea Kings.Incidentally,the MI-17V brochure at AE is the best I've ever seen at any air show of any item.A work of art,collector's item.I hope those who visited got hold of them.The colour cut-away drgs.superb,info exhaustive covering every aspect of the helo from hydraulics,engines,controls,avionics-with glass cockpit options from Honywell,etc.,pics of its versatility which has made it the world's most popular med. role helo.We will operate more than 150 of the same and why we have not thought of manufacturing the same here is a mystery.The Almaz naval brochure had splendid pics of the Kirov class battle-cruiser.The mdoernisation of the same shows hugely increased weaponry.

Sikorsky to Make Naval Helicopters in India
The S-70B Seahawk helicopters may be built either with the Tata Group or through a new partnership

http://www.wsj.com/articles/sikorsky-to ... 1424415972

By Santanu Choudhury
Feb. 20, 2015

BANGALORE, India—Sikorsky Aircraft Corp. will make India its only assembly location outside of the U.S. for one of its military helicopters if it wins contracts to build more than 120 helicopters from the South Asian nation, the company’s global defense business head said.

The S-70B Seahawk helicopters may be built either with the Tata Group with whom Sikorsky already has an alliance, or through a new partnership with another company in India, Samir Mehta, president of Sikorsky’s defense systems and services department, told The Wall Street Journal.

“We are very, very confident that the venture that we have now [with Tata] coupled with new relationships that we will form in the future will not only fulfill the needs of the Indian government but allow us to again fulfill requirements from other countries,” Mr. Mehta said.

Sikorsky is hoping to sell at least 139 of its S-70B Seahawk helicopters to India. In one order, on which a final decision is expected soon, it has been short listed to supply 16 of the helicopters. In a separate bid it is trying to win the order for 123 of the helicopters.

He didn’t disclose the investment that would be required to build a factory. Sikorsky now makes the S-70B helicopter in Stratford, Connecticut.

Sikorsky, a unit of United Technologies Corp., was chosen by the Indian government in December to supply 16 helicopters for its navy. The contract being discussed includes an option to buy eight additional helicopters.

The Indian Navy variant of the S-70B will include advanced sonar and 360-degree-search radar, air-to-surface missiles and torpedoes for anti-submarine and anti-surface warfare. It will also have the capability to fold up its blades and tail for easy storage on warships.

Mr. Mehta said he expects India to award the contract for the first 16 helicopters “in a matter of months.”
A senior official in the Indian Navy who asked not to be named said “commercial discussions with Sikorsky are in the final stages and the final deal will likely be signed soon.

Sikorsky will make India its only assembly location outside of the U.S. for one of its military helicopters if it wins contracts to build more than 120 helicopters. An earlier version of this article incorrectly stated that an order of 16 helicopters would be enough to convince Sikorsky to start building helicopters in India.

Corrections & Amplifications


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Re: Aero India 2015

Postby SaiK » 22 Feb 2015 20:57

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/B-cjuSrCYAAbqXU.jpg

is it my eyes or it is the design?

i feel odd about CG/placement on those turbines

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Re: Aero India 2015

Postby saumitra_j » 22 Feb 2015 21:17

Folks,

Back to Pune from a very hectic AI 2015 trip- my first AI trip and unfortunately I did not get enough time. I will spend more time next AI. I got a chance to talk to three gents from DRDO so I am sharing my conversation.

My first pit stop was the LRDE stall, I have taken some pictures of the Uttam as well. The gent I spoke to worked on Bharani, and other land based radars. LRDE had also done some avionics work on the LCA and this gent had designed one of the LRUs flying on the early prototypes. Apparently, the new boss at LRDE asked the folks to concentrate on radars and not bother with avionics, so they are mostly focussing on radars now. The gent told me that now we have completely mastery over ground based radars and once the CABS AEW is accepted, we would have developed the skills for air based radars as well. He told me that since in an air base radar, both the radar and the targets are moving constantly, it makes the software extremely complex and we still need to master some of those technologies. I asked him about how DRDO manages quality control given that they are a design organization while OFB,BEL, HAL etc do the manufacturing. He told me that since last few years, DRDO is also developing the production processes and they force the PSU to that process and they are not allowed any deviation without certification from DRDO. He was also bitter about the fact that IAF has been a little difficult in accepting the LCA - the latest being that IAF is insisting that Air to Air refueling be part of FOC - something that has never been there on other IAF aircraft! I asked him about the Uttam but unfortunately he was not aware of the details. I will post a pic separately.

The second gent I met was a scientist from ADE who was working in the areas of UAV (Rustom 1 & 2). He told me that for Rustom 1, the design was already there (they took Burt Rutan's design) and hence they did not have to follow all the processes defined by CEMILAC. However for Rustom 2 which is a completely new design, they need work with CEMILAC at every step and hence there is a lot of documentation to do - hence the development is a bit slow. For Rustom 1, they still need to establish automated take off and landing and once that is done, it should be good for induction. I also met some young folks who had designed the data link for the Rustom 1 & 2. They work completely on the directions of ADE. One interesting tid-bit that they told me was that the data link for the Rustom also supports a voice channel - apparently an innovative idea to also use the UAV to relay voice.

The third gent I met was involved in the Kaveri program. He told me that they are currently testing the endurance of the engine - they have done 3000 hours already. They need to do 4000 hours before they are certified to fit it on a twin engined aircraft - they have plans to fit it on the Mig 29 (did not get a chance to ask him where the airframe would come from...). Once they do 5000 hours, they will be certified to fit it on the LCA MK1. He told me that the reheat thrust is 3% less than design - on some prototypes it is 2% less which is apparently allowable (specs allow +- 2% variation in thrust). He said he reckons it will take another 3 years for the Kaveri to do the 5000 hours. He said that Kaveri does not use any single crystal blades as yet and while they have been able to make these in the labs, they are at least 5 years away from mass manufacturing. He said a conservative design, lack of PM skills and risk aversion has been a huge problem with the Kaveri - they could have reached this stage 5 years back had they been less conservative.

All in all a great AI for me - will posts pics of info boards and other information later.

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Re: Aero India 2015

Postby shiv » 22 Feb 2015 21:32

SaiK wrote:https://pbs.twimg.com/media/B-cjuSrCYAAbqXU.jpg

is it my eyes or it is the design?

i feel odd about CG/placement on those turbines

SaiK it is precisely that placement of the engines that allows the flaps to deflect the exhaust down leaidng to high lift and very slow flight - the C-17 is awesome in that sense.

See this video from the point linked below
https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=p ... NeHE#t=134

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Re: Aero India 2015

Postby shiv » 23 Feb 2015 06:09

pandyan wrote:Shiv saar - buy a decent monopod for your video camera. they help a lot to stabilize the shot and very agile to follow fast moving subjects. best of all, monopods have rcs of a stick and are not cumbersome like a tripod. 2015 video link you had posted before was very shaky.

:D Thanks for the suggestion. But actually - 95% of the video is very good and hardly shaky simply because I always edit out the worst shaky bits and use software stabilization offered by YouTube to remove jitter over and above that The only really shaky bit is a 5 second segment that I forgot to edit out while stepping out for a coffee. (I had lost sight of the LCA that was over 2 km away in the haze and tried to sight it by eye.) By the time I noticed this omission the video was already online. The real issues with that video are loss of quality from 3 GB original to 300 MB upload and excessive pixellation due to overuse of digital zoom. Clearly, I have lost touch in that dept but I am no longer that keen since people nowadays have excellent videos like that defenseupdate one. Sadly that video only has samples and not the whole show.

I was keen to put some video online because I have videos on YouTube from Aero India every time from 1996 onwards. Visiting Aero India laden with photography equipment is actually a pain unless photography is the main aim and I probably never will go with anything more than a small handheld.

But one day I might compile interesting bits of 10 editions of Aero India and make one video of the aircraft that have come and gone. Over the decades the video equipment quality has changed and I have not always managed to keep up with the latest. But I think I still hold the record for being the only guy with online videos of 1996 Aero India so far. Not sure if that is still true - but it used to be. Maybe 1998 as well.

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Re: Aero India 2015

Postby shiv » 23 Feb 2015 06:31

Image

I have a point to make about this "Red Bulls" mid air collision that thankfully ended without anyone being injured. I believe that this is an example of what IAF pilots face day in and day out - i.e. "hot and high" conditions. Bangalore is one of the milder examples of hot and high - with Feb temps of 30 plus deg C and 1000 meters high. Planes need greater separation for aerobatics because the thinner air is less conducive to rapid, responsive manoeuvring, Another issue that pilots and photographers face in India is haze. Visibility in India barely crosses 3 km at the best of times - while in Europe and north America you can often see right up to the edge of the earth.

In the past no one would pay attention when Indians said this. Things are better now.

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Re: Aero India 2015

Postby Shreeman » 23 Feb 2015 06:52

^^^ The argument can be further extended to include other abnormal environment aspects for day to day operations. And may be valid.

But the specific Red Bull incident was merely an accident that is inherent in these Air Shows. AeroIndia has just been lucky (minus Baldev Singh canopy etc).

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Re: Aero India 2015

Postby shiv » 23 Feb 2015 07:00

Shreeman wrote:^^^ The argument can be further extended to include other abnormal environment aspects for day to day operations. And may be valid.

But the specific Red Bull incident was merely an accident that is inherent in these Air Shows. AeroIndia has just been lucky (minus Baldev Singh canopy etc).

I read an interview in the paper in which the Red Bulls pilots were quoted as saying that their shows in Europe allow them to be much closer and much lower but the hot and high conditions + Aero India regulations required them to modify their routine. The other team with the girls on the wings (Breitling??) also had some issues with Aero India regulations because the demand was that they stay at 1000 feet and not 500 as they normally do and the newspaper quoted them as saying that at 1000 feet above Bangalore it was too cold for the girls to stay exposed for long. (Newspaper interview report)

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Re: Aero India 2015

Postby Philip » 23 Feb 2015 11:19

Talking about flaps,etc. Shiv,did you see the planned BE-2500 super-heavy Neptun amphib monster ? It is an incredible design,6 engines.4 on the canards which deflect thrust to the main wings giving it a WIG effect (wing in ground).The twin tails carry two more engines.The payload is an incredible 700t for a 7,000km trip! I was lucky to get a leaflet about it. The Ekranoplan WIG monsters,its predecessor flew during Soviet times armed with LR missiles atop the fuselage. Here are some links for the same.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Np8vNRk-Svc
Evolution of the Ekranoplan - Be-2500 Neptun 2022

http://www.testpilot.ru/russia/beriev/b ... 2500_e.htm
Be-2500
super heavy amphibian ground effect plane

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Re: Aero India 2015

Postby KiranM » 23 Feb 2015 13:25

saumitra_j wrote:Folks,
The third gent I met was involved in the Kaveri program. He told me that they are currently testing the endurance of the engine - they have done 3000 hours already. They need to do 4000 hours before they are certified to fit it on a twin engined aircraft - they have plans to fit it on the Mig 29 (did not get a chance to ask him where the airframe would come from...). Once they do 5000 hours, they will be certified to fit it on the LCA MK1.


I got conflicting info at the GTRE stall. When I asked a middle aged looking gent there about plans to fit and test Kaveri in a Mig-29 he was categorical that there are no such plans since CEMILAC will not allow to test an unproven engine in a manned platform. That did not make sense to me. I tried asking again in a different way but his response didn't change. He talked about testing the engine in IL-76 test bed. I had questions about how will they test Kaveri next if not in a proven twin engined airframe and why his claim of CEMILAC's objection was not making sense but decided not to press on.

At the ADA stall talked to another gent about AMCA. I asked him why the earlier designs in MCA avatar did not have a tail and the latest version does. He responded saying that as the design matured their simulations required the addition of rudders and elevators. I asked him if it was anything to do with earlier version's TVC control needing to handle the functions of the tail and he said current version also has TVC but did not elaborate. I had this thought that ADA perhaps did not want to take huge risk with a tailless aircraft and associated complex TVC controls, perhaps why they added the tail in final version. But he did not give any indicators. I did not press forward with my questions and my thinking (not wanting to be doubted for an agint :wink: for prying a lot).

I attended on the last day and spend the noon post lunch visiting the stalls. Most of the stalls were busy dismantling their exhibits and packing. Also looks like many knowledgeable people stop hosting at the stalls around this time (compared to when I attended a weekday last time). Though I understand that last day last session feeling sets in to pack up and go back early, kind of dismays after spending a lot for entry. It will be better if the organizers charge a little less for the last day.

Did not see the Rudra or LCH doing manoeuvres. They just lifted off and flew across the sky.

A disappointment was being unable to check out the HAL Space Division pavilion to get the feel of the Mars landscape they recreated. They had barricaded around the perimeter of the entire HAL stall section. Quite a few models beyond the sight from the perimeter. I understand crowd control is a pain. But if they want to engage inquiring minds and inflame the passion for aviation, they need to be more open to the public on General visit days.

What was heart warming was the nascent fan base for Tejas among the general public. Many PYTs and guys cheered a lot whenever Tejas took to skies. Perhaps more than any other fighters (though the most cheers and oohs & aahs were reserved for the aerobatics teams).

Added later: It was also heart warming to see the stalls of Samtel avionics, Data Patterns and Alpha Technologies. Was telling my brother how they are chipping in and doing their utmost by way of sub systems for various programs.
In the Israeli, French and Russian sections I saw Indian female hosts instead of the regular phoren models from respective countries. There was a Make in India feeling in that way alright. :mrgreen: But they were not less prettier.

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Re: Aero India 2015

Postby shiv » 23 Feb 2015 13:38

Philip wrote:Talking about flaps,etc. Shiv,did you see the planned BE-2500 super-heavy Neptun amphib monster ? It is an incredible design,6 engines.4 on the canards which deflect thrust to the main wings giving it a WIG effect (wing in ground).The twin tails carry two more engines.The payload is an incredible 700t for a 7,000km trip! I was lucky to get a leaflet about it. The Ekranoplan WIG monsters,its predecessor flew during Soviet times armed with LR missiles atop the fuselage. Here are some links for the same.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Np8vNRk-Svc
Evolution of the Ekranoplan - Be-2500 Neptun 2022

http://www.testpilot.ru/russia/beriev/b ... 2500_e.htm
Be-2500
super heavy amphibian ground effect plane


Philip it requires a national sense of "can do" and self confidence and a degree of chutzpah to try out such stuff. Something will succeed and the failures give data on what should not be tried.

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Re: Aero India 2015

Postby Shreeman » 23 Feb 2015 13:42

shiv wrote:
Shreeman wrote:^^^ The argument can be further extended to include other abnormal environment aspects for day to day operations. And may be valid.

But the specific Red Bull incident was merely an accident that is inherent in these Air Shows. AeroIndia has just been lucky (minus Baldev Singh canopy etc).

I read an interview in the paper in which the Red Bulls pilots were quoted as saying that their shows in Europe allow them to be much closer and much lower but the hot and high conditions + Aero India regulations required them to modify their routine. The other team with the girls on the wings (Breitling??) also had some issues with Aero India regulations because the demand was that they stay at 1000 feet and not 500 as they normally do and the newspaper quoted them as saying that at 1000 feet above Bangalore it was too cold for the girls to stay exposed for long. (Newspaper interview report)


I understand the temperature argument re. exposed people. Aero India is risk averse. Thats true for both.

Re. Hot and High, I remain skeptical. For an aircraft, Bangalore, is not really different than hilly terrain of LA.

A change in routine is likely a bigger factor than hot&high. These aircraft have more than enough margin in performance for 3-4000 feet.

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Re: Aero India 2015

Postby shiv » 23 Feb 2015 14:06

Shreeman wrote:Re. Hot and High, I remain skeptical. For an aircraft, Bangalore, is not really different than hilly terrain of LA.

A change in routine is likely a bigger factor than hot&high. These aircraft have more than enough margin in performance for 3-4000 feet.


Shreeman I can only quote from what people have said.

AM Philip Rajkumar has an article about DARIN I upgrade in Vayu and as a test pilot he says that making a Jaguar take off in Bangalore carrying 4 x 1000 lb bombs and 2 drop tanks in Bangalore summer at 37 deg C and Bangalore altitude (about 1000 metres above MSL) was a hair raising experience. Maybe that will happen in LA as well but it seems to be a real issue that people talk and write about

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Re: Aero India 2015

Postby SagarAg » 23 Feb 2015 17:46

shiv wrote:I have a point to make about this "Red Bulls" mid air collision that thankfully ended without anyone being injured. I believe that this is an example of what IAF pilots face day in and day out - i.e. "hot and high" conditions. Bangalore is one of the milder examples of hot and high - with Feb temps of 30 plus deg C and 1000 meters high. Planes need greater separation for aerobatics because the thinner air is less conducive to rapid, responsive manoeuvring, Another issue that pilots and photographers face in India is haze. Visibility in India barely crosses 3 km at the best of times - while in Europe and north America you can often see right up to the edge of the earth.

In the past no one would pay attention when Indians said this. Things are better now.

Heard in news that this was the last flight at Air Show for these Red Bulls birds. They have purchased new birds and will use them starting next Red Bull show.

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Re: Aero India 2015

Postby Dileep » 23 Feb 2015 20:14

Back home after a long, tiring, but successful show.

This morning, we showed up at Gate 1, wearing the tag. The CISF pandu points to the valid date range (1st to 22nd Feb) and says it is expired. We had to go to the main security booth, and there the guy says it is extended to 25th. (Meanwhile several people are being waved thru). Apparently, only "Contractor" and "service provider" badges have expiry date of 25th.

We had taken three labourers to help packing. They were initially denied admission, saying that they should have obtained (at Rs 2500 a piece) exhibitor badges!!

I don't know what kind of ass backwardness is this!!

Anyway, our ex navy commander colleague went in and talked to the in-charge, and the labourers got the normal vijitar baass onlee.

We found that the TD2 demo plane standing alone in the courtyard. We all went close, looked around and took photos.

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Re: Aero India 2015

Postby shiv » 23 Feb 2015 20:44

Dileep wrote:We had taken three labourers to help packing. They were initially denied admission, saying that they should have obtained (at Rs 2500 a piece) exhibitor badges!!

I don't know what kind of ass backwardness is this!!


No wonder some poor BRFite reported that on the last day everyone was busy packing and no one was interested in explaining.

Unfortunately government run things are like marrying a whore. The hardware looks and feels like a wife but the behaviour is that of a whore. These grabbing cheapos need to get these finer points sorted out.

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Re: Aero India 2015

Postby deejay » 23 Feb 2015 20:52

SagarAg wrote:
shiv wrote:I have a point to make about this "Red Bulls" mid air collision that thankfully ended without anyone being injured. I believe that this is an example of what IAF pilots face day in and day out - i.e. "hot and high" conditions. Bangalore is one of the milder examples of hot and high - with Feb temps of 30 plus deg C and 1000 meters high. Planes need greater separation for aerobatics because the thinner air is less conducive to rapid, responsive manoeuvring, Another issue that pilots and photographers face in India is haze. Visibility in India barely crosses 3 km at the best of times - while in Europe and north America you can often see right up to the edge of the earth.

In the past no one would pay attention when Indians said this. Things are better now.

Heard in news that this was the last flight at Air Show for these Red Bulls birds. They have purchased new birds and will use them starting next Red Bull show.


I was speaking to folks at Yellahanka on 19th after we saw the Red Bull mid air from vertically below it. They were doing an outside loop (which is tough with all the -ive g's) and as they came out from the lower part of the loop the pilots had the sun straight in their eyes. The 'sun-in-the-eyes happened for the first time in the whole loop. Also in an outside loop the visibility ahead of the aircraft is literally blocked, so they were practically shaded from the bright sun through and through till they faced the sun. Some one shouted -$h!t there is the sun in the eyes moments before the mid-air happened. My theory is this sunlight would've played a part but I am speculating. It was also hazy but not if one looked straight up. Haze was mostly slant.

Having said that, hats off to how the two pilots reacted after the tips touched. Some serious experience and cool head on display there.

Another thing, the IAF SAR helicopter was all ready with crew strapped in waiting for the call to start up before the first of the Red Bull landed. Amazing reactions from the SAR crew (both air and ground).

It was in my discussions, I got the distinct impression that unofficially there was One-upmanship going on (at best this is unofficial so take it with due consideration). One group in competition were the foreign aerobatic teams and the other one was a head to head between the Rafale and Su 30 MKI.

It seems the inaugural day belonged to the Red Bulls and the other teams had tried to come back in the morning display of the 19th. The Red Bull thing happened in the afternoon display. This was their turn in setting the standards.

Sagar G, yes it was their last air show prior to converting on new aircraft and this conversion will take about one year.

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Re: Aero India 2015

Postby maz » 23 Feb 2015 21:45

Dileep, do you intend posting the info board pix in a BR AI 2015 album or some other site? Looking forward to seeing them.

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Re: Aero India 2015

Postby Indranil » 24 Feb 2015 03:18

deejay wrote:I was speaking to folks at Yellahanka on 19th after we saw the Red Bull mid air from vertically below it. They were doing an outside loop (which is tough with all the -ive g's) and as they came out from the lower part of the loop the pilots had the sun straight in their eyes. The 'sun-in-the-eyes happened for the first time in the whole loop. Also in an outside loop the visibility ahead of the aircraft is literally blocked, so they were practically shaded from the bright sun through and through till they faced the sun. Some one shouted -$h!t there is the sun in the eyes moments before the mid-air happened. My theory is this sunlight would've played a part but I am speculating. It was also hazy but not if one looked straight up. Haze was mostly slant.

Having said that, hats off to how the two pilots reacted after the tips touched. Some serious experience and cool head on display there.

I feel the plane to the right (of the two involved) actually had a wingdrop in clockwise direction. That would justify ASTE's apprehensions for rarefied atmosphere at Bangalore (as hakim was saying). They are phenomenal pilots in phenomenal machines. She flew with one aileron and asymmetric lift! The other flew with broken props, that plane must be vibrating like hell. I think they were incredibly lucky as well. It was the probably the limit of damage that the machines could take. For example, if the wing was any more damaged, it would have scraped the tarmac on landing and toppled the plane.


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Re: Aero India 2015

Postby Dennis » 24 Feb 2015 06:54

Here's a photograph of the Red Bulls' plane showing the damaged wing as it was taxying back to the dispersal after the emergency landing.

Link

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Re: Aero India 2015

Postby Nick_S » 24 Feb 2015 07:30

Any news on IJT at all?


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