Indo-UK News & Discussions- June 2017

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IndraD
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Re: Indo-UK News & Discussions- June 2017

Postby IndraD » 08 Apr 2019 01:55

Many from Westminster University London joined ISIS , captured terrorist in Syria reveals

Uni in London becomes recruiting ground for Islamic radicals https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-47772772

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Indo-UK News & Discussions- June 2017

Postby Peregrine » 10 Apr 2019 20:12

Jallianwala Bagh tragedy shameful scar on British Indian history: Theresa May – PTI

LONDON: Theresa May on Wednesday described the Jallianwala Bagh massacre in Amritsar as a "shameful scar" on British Indian history but stopped short of a formal apology sought by a crosssection of Parliament in previous debates.

In a statement, marking the 100th anniversary of the massacre, at the start of her weekly Prime Minister's Questions in the House of Commons, she reiterated the "regret" already expressed by the British Government.

The massacre took place in Jallianwala Bagh in Amritsar on Baisakhi in April 1919 when the British Indian Army troops, under the command of Colonel Reginald Dyer, fired machine guns at a crowd of people holding a pro-independence demonstration.

According to the British government records, 379 people, including men, women and children were killed and around 1200 injured in the firing.

"The tragedy of Jallianwala Bagh of 1919 is a shameful scar on British Indian history. As Her Majesty the Queen (Elizabeth II) said before visiting Jallianwala Bagh in 1997, it is a distressing example of our past history with India," she said in her statement.

"We deeply regret what happened and the suffering caused. I am pleased that today the UK-India relationship is one of collaboration, partnership, prosperity and security. Indian diaspora make an enormous contribution to British society and I am sure the whole House wishes to see the UK's relationship with India continue to flourish," she said.

In response, Opposition Labour Party Leader Jeremy Corbyn demanded that those who lost their lives in the massacre deserve a "full, clear and unequivocal apology for what took place".

May's statement comes a day after British MPs at Westminster Hall of the Parliament complex debated the issue of a formal apology for the April 13, 1919 massacre to mark its centenary this Saturday.

Foreign Office Minister Mark Field had told MPs that he had been "compelled" by the arguments to raise the issue of going further than the "deepest regret" expressed over the killings during the British Raj.

"I feel that we perhaps need to go further... I have now been persuaded - not just by this debate - to take a different approach," the minister said, adding that the government had to also consider the "financial implications" of any apology for events of the past.

"These issues are an important way of trying to draw a line under the past. Therefore, this is work in progress and I cannot make any promises," he said, holding out some hope of a formal apology over the incident.

The debate was tabled by Conservative Party MP Bob Blackman, who opened proceedings with a strong sentiment of "shame" as he called on the British government to apologise.

"General Dyer was vigorously defended by - I say this with shame - the Conservative party, as well as most of the military establishment. He evaded any penalties post inquiry, as his military superiors advised that they could find no fault with his actions, his orders, or his conduct otherwise," Blackman said, in reference to the British general who had ordered the shooting at a Baisakhi gathering in Amritsar 100 years ago.

"As we approach the 100th anniversary of the Jallianwala Bagh massacre in Amritsar on 13 April 1919, it is clear that there needs to be a formal apology from the United Kingdom government that accepts and acknowledges their part in the massacre," said Indian-origin Labour MP Preet Kaur Gill.

"This is the right time for the (British) Prime Minister to publicly apologise," added fellow Labour MP Virendra Sharma.

In wrapping up the outcomes of the debate, Blackman concluded that children in British schools should be taught about the tragedy because people should know what happened in Britain's name and that "saying sorry - apologising for this massacre - is the right thing to do".

The pressure on the Cabinet minister mounted further on Wednesday as he received a letter signed by 80 MPs stressing that he must consider their call for an "apology anew".

"Relations between the UK and India today are friendly and constructive. Yet that does not mean an apology would not be good," notes the letter, initiated by Labour MP Pat McFadden.

During a previous debate in the House of Lords earlier in the year, it was confirmed that UK foreign secretary Jeremy Hunt was "reflecting" on demands for a formal apology to mark the centenary of the Jallianwala Bagh massacre this week.

Following Theresa May's latest statement on the issue in the Commons, it remains to be seen if the UK government will follow up with any further statements in the lead up to the 100th anniversary on Saturday.

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Re: Indo-UK News & Discussions- June 2017

Postby Skanda » 10 Apr 2019 23:03

Peregrine wrote:Jallianwala Bagh tragedy shameful scar on British Indian history: Theresa May – PTI
...
but stopped short of a formal apology sought by a crosssection of Parliament in previous debates.
...


What is the reason why they cant apologize? Are they afraid of having to pay repatriations or worried that it will open pandora's box for every other excess committed by the erstwhile empire?

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Indo-UK News & Discussions- June 2017

Postby Peregrine » 11 Apr 2019 01:00

Peregrine wrote:Jallianwala Bagh tragedy shameful scar on British Indian history: Theresa May – PTI
...
but stopped short of a formal apology sought by a crosssection of Parliament in previous debates.
...
Skanda wrote:What is the reason why they cant apologize? Are they afraid of having to pay repatriations or worried that it will open pandora's box for every other excess committed by the erstwhile empire?
Skanda Ji :

IMO in due time they will!

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Re: Indo-UK News & Discussions- June 2017

Postby mmasand » 11 Apr 2019 01:17

This has something to do with the recent case of a veteran paratrooper being tried in court for murder of two Irish men (Bloody Sunday) in '72. The Tories came under severe criticism for allowing CPS to charge a soldier serving in the interests of HM's govt.

It takes a lot of political appetite to tender an apology for excesses of a different regime. The Tories are not capable of it just yet. Maybe in a decade or so, just not now.

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Re: Indo-UK News & Discussions- June 2017

Postby nachiket » 11 Apr 2019 01:50

The usage of the word "tragedy" itself is a subtle attempt at deflecting blame. A car or air crash is a tragedy. Jallianwala Bagh was a massacre, an act of state-sponsored mass murder, a ruthless slaughter of unarmed, innocent civilians.

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Re: Indo-UK News & Discussions- June 2017

Postby srin » 11 Apr 2019 21:35

Now that Julian Assange has been arrested, it'd be interesting to see how long would it take for him to get extradited to US/Sweden/wherever. Will that come close to how long Mallya's process has taken ? And will US show video evidence regarding the state of its prisons and promise that it isn't political ?

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Re: Indo-UK News & Discussions- June 2017

Postby Suraj » 11 Apr 2019 22:09

Julian Assange was living under asylum conditions granted to him the government of Ecuador at their embassy in London. Vijay Mallya on the other hand, as far as I know, has ILR (indefinite leave to remain) in UK, their form of permanent residency. This makes a difference in how they treat extradition requests because in the former case he's a wanted fugitive in UK itself, while Mallya is not.

As to Jaliianwala Bagh, it follows a generally predictable formula of western establishments. First you plunder, commit crimes, or whatever. Get rich and powerful from it. Then several generations later, you offer a 'large hearted' non-apology. Any sort of fake apology from the UK in this context is BS emanating from a head of government barely clinging on to her job amidst the wreckage of Brexit.

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Re: Indo-UK News & Discussions- June 2017

Postby A Nandy » 12 Apr 2019 00:15

IMO in due time they will once they are properly broken!

Suraj
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Re: Indo-UK News & Discussions- June 2017

Postby Suraj » 12 Apr 2019 00:21

The UK court system sounds like a joke here:
UK rejects Vijay Mallya's plea against extradition to India
Mallya’s application seeking permission to appeal was refused by Justice William Davis on Friday," the Press Trust of India reported, citing a UK judiciary spokesperson. Mallya now has time till 12 April to move a second application before the court to admit his appeal, a person familiar with the development told Mint on condition of anonymity.

If the appeal is rejected again, Mallya would have the option to approach a higher court in the UK, the person said.

Mallya had filed the application in the UK high court after home secretary Sajid Javid approved his extradition to India in February.

If you fail in the permission to appeal, it means you can apply a second time, and if you still fail, you can apply to a higher court ?

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Re: Indo-UK News & Discussions- June 2017

Postby mmasand » 12 Apr 2019 00:29

I think they skipped out on the appeal to tribunal as the first step before moving the court, followed by which he can move the high court (equivalent of the SC). Realistically, it will be at least a year before he will actually step foot in India. Remember we inherited our bureaucracy from the UK, so don't be surprised at delays.

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Re: Indo-UK News & Discussions- June 2017

Postby Vips » 17 Apr 2019 00:17

UK and India strengthen defence ties with new agreement.

The UK is set to strengthen defence ties with India through a renewed Memorandum of Understanding, Defence Minister Stuart Andrew has announced.

At bilateral defence and security equipment talks in London this week, the two nations agreed to re-double efforts to identify mutual defence and security capability needs and collaborate on solutions.

Air Marshal Richard Knighton signed the Defence Equipment Memorandum on behalf of the UK Ministry of Defence, while Shri Barun Mitra, Additional Secretary Defence Production at the Ministry of Defence, signed on behalf of the Indian Government.

Defence Minister Stuart Andrew said:
As major world economies, Britain and India both have a proud global maritime history, with impressive futures ahead. The signing of this Memorandum of Understanding underpins the collaboration between our two nations, building on our defence ties, and ensuring our nations are able to combat emerging threats for generations to come.

The agreement, which marks a step change in India and United Kingdom’s defence relationship, comes after a visit by India’s chief of naval staff, Admiral Sunil Lanba, to HMS Queen Elizabeth in Portsmouth last month. It also follows HMS Dragon’s visit to Goa in December last year, where the ship took part in the longstanding naval exercise, The Konkan Series.

By collaborating and exploiting procurement opportunities together, both nations will be able to benefit from technological and manufacturing capabilities and support long-term cooperation between their defence and security industries.

In addition to the bilateral talks this week, UK and Indian industry met to discuss how they would forge deeper and broader partnerships to contribute to these efforts.

Minister of State for Trade and Export Promotion Baroness Fairhead said:
I am delighted that the Ministries of Defence of India and the United Kingdom have signed this Memorandum of Understanding. This agreement will help us develop closer, mutually beneficial relationships between our respective defence and security industries.

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Re: Indo-UK News & Discussions- June 2017

Postby panduranghari » 17 Apr 2019 18:15

nachiket wrote:The usage of the word "tragedy" itself is a subtle attempt at deflecting blame. A car or air crash is a tragedy. Jallianwala Bagh was a massacre, an act of state-sponsored mass murder, a ruthless slaughter of unarmed, innocent civilians.


https://www.channel4.com/programmes/the ... the-empire

Use proxy server to watch this. The descendants of Dyer do not think he did anything wrong.

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Re: Indo-UK News & Discussions- June 2017

Postby mmasand » 17 Apr 2019 19:58

Should watch Sathnam Sangera's rage as he has very diplomatically captured it in his docu.

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Re: Indo-UK News & Discussions- June 2017

Postby Suraj » 18 Apr 2019 00:27

Mallya fails to get UK court to stall Indian banks' bid to recover dues
Vijay Mallya on Wednesday failed to convince a UK High Court to dismiss an order related to money in one of his London bank accounts, dealing a blow to the embattled liquor tycoon's efforts to prevent a consortium of Indian banks getting access to nearly 260,000 pounds.

In one of the many legal cases being faced by the 63-year-old liquor tycoon in the UK, Master David Cook ruled that an interim debt order in favour of SBI and other banks seeking access to funds in the ICICI UK bank account "should remain in force" but that the application to make it final should be adjourned until after the hearing of Mallya's pending bankruptcy petition.

The funds in the account will meanwhile remain frozen as part of the worldwide freezing order in favour of the Indian banks last year.

Mallya's lawyers had argued for the dismissal of the interim order on a number of grounds, including a claim that it was a "deliberate ploy" to prevent Mallya "reasonable" living expenses.
"I reject the proposition that the application for a TPDO (third party debt order) was a deliberate ploy to thwart Dr Mallya's ability to meet his ordinary living expenses and reasonable legal expenses which are permitted under the terms of the WWFO (worldwide freezing order)," Master Cook notes in his judgment.

"The relevant context here is that Dr Mallya is in a post judgment scenario where the Claimants (Indian banks) are attempting to enforce their judgment and discover the true extent of his assets. I note that Dr Mallya has made no voluntary payment to date… while continuing to incur substantial legal costs in opposing the Claimants' efforts to enforce their judgment," he said.

The case revolves around 258,559.79 pounds held in a bank account with the ICICI UK, which is named as a third party in the High Court case. It is among one of many orders pursued by TLT LLP, the law firm acting for the Indian banks, as part of efforts to recoup some of the 1.142 billion pounds owed to them arising from proceedings in the Bangalore Debt Recovery Tribunal (DRT) against Kingfisher Airlines and others.

The DRT case was registered in the UK under the Foreign Judgments (Reciprocal Enforcement) Act 1933 and went in favour of the Indian banks in an appeal in May 2018.

The banks have since also filed a bankruptcy petition against Mallya in the UK courts, which is being challenged by the former Kingfisher Airlines boss and is expected to come up for hearing around December this year.

Meanwhile, in yet another legal intervention, Mallya is seeking a stay of all enforcement proceedings which have been commenced since the presentation of the bankruptcy petition by the Indian banks in September last year, a hearing of which is expected next month.

The outcome of that hearing will determine the future course of the funds being sought by the SBI, Bank of Baroda, Corporation bank, Federal Bank Ltd, IDBI Bank, Indian Overseas Bank, Jammu & Kashmir Bank, Punjab & Sind Bank, Punjab National Bank, State Bank of Mysore, UCO Bank, United Bank of India and JM Financial Asset Reconstruction Co. Pvt Ltd.

Mallya, meanwhile, remains on bail after his extradition was signed off by UK home secretary Sajid Javid in February and is seeking leave to appeal against that order in the High Court as well.

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Re: Indo-UK News & Discussions- June 2017

Postby chetak » 18 Apr 2019 00:39

Suraj wrote:Julian Assange was living under asylum conditions granted to him the government of Ecuador at their embassy in London. Vijay Mallya on the other hand, as far as I know, has ILR (indefinite leave to remain) in UK, their form of permanent residency. This makes a difference in how they treat extradition requests because in the former case he's a wanted fugitive in UK itself, while Mallya is not.

As to Jaliianwala Bagh, it follows a generally predictable formula of western establishments. First you plunder, commit crimes, or whatever. Get rich and powerful from it. Then several generations later, you offer a 'large hearted' non-apology. Any sort of fake apology from the UK in this context is BS emanating from a head of government barely clinging on to her job amidst the wreckage of Brexit.


they are terrified of the financial implications of a full apology and acceptance of responsibility for their actions in case any one of the descendants of the affected parties files a case and asks to be compensated.

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Re: Indo-UK News & Discussions- June 2017

Postby A Nandy » 18 Apr 2019 01:01

Also it opens the door for a flood of cases for reparations for all colonial crimes in India. That will be real Karma.

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Re: Indo-UK News & Discussions- June 2017

Postby Lisa » 18 Apr 2019 14:18

chetak wrote:
they are terrified of the financial implications of a full apology and acceptance of responsibility for their actions in case any one of the descendants of the affected parties files a case and asks to be compensated.


Chetakji,

Its not the money. The apology will have to start with "Her Majesty............", ie apology will have to be in the name of the Queen, she will be apologising. That is what is unacceptable. After all it was armed force working in her name that did the deed.

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Re: Indo-UK News & Discussions- June 2017

Postby Lalmohan » 18 Apr 2019 15:56

mmasand wrote:Should watch Sathnam Sangera's rage as he has very diplomatically captured it in his docu.


nicely done, he manages to keep the whole thing very dignified

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Re: Indo-UK News & Discussions- June 2017

Postby UlanBatori » 21 Apr 2019 01:10

Unlike Modi's rioting India, UK is a peaceful heaven of community relations. BREXIT preview:
The rioting apparently erupted as homes belonging to Irish republicans, those who believe all of Ireland should be separate from British rule, were raided ahead of the Easter weekend.
"Protecting the public is and will always be our priority," Northern Ireland police said. "The searches were being carried out because we believed that violent dissident republicans were storing firearms and explosives for a number of planned attacks and these may have been used over the Easter weekend in the city."
There were about 100 people in the area, including "young people and members of the media," when the unknown shooter fired into a crowd of people, police said.
Prior to the shooting, the protesters had gathered near Creggan at about 9 p.m. Police said the rioters threw over 50 petrol bombs at police officers and hijacked two vehicles, which were then set on fire.
A car burns after petrol bombs were thrown at police in Creggan, Londonderry, in Northern Ireland, Thursday, April 18, 2019.

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Re: Indo-UK News & Discussions- June 2017

Postby saip » 21 Apr 2019 07:38

Lisa wrote:
chetak wrote:
they are terrified of the financial implications of a full apology and acceptance of responsibility for their actions in case any one of the descendants of the affected parties files a case and asks to be compensated.


Chetakji,

Its not the money. The apology will have to start with "Her Majesty............", ie apology will have to be in the name of the Queen, she will be apologising. That is what is unacceptable. After all it was armed force working in her name that did the deed.

It will never happen. Saying only that Jallianwala Bagh is scar on Indo - British relaions what is May saying? A total non-apology when in reality the whole colonialism is a blot. The guy who said 'Give me liberty or give me death' also owned 77 slaves. May too considers in her heart of hearts colonialism is her God given right and the rest is lip service. We need MODI for antother TEN years to teach these white cretins.

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Re: Indo-UK News & Discussions- June 2017

Postby chetak » 21 Apr 2019 13:51

saip wrote:
Lisa wrote:
Chetakji,

Its not the money. The apology will have to start with "Her Majesty............", ie apology will have to be in the name of the Queen, she will be apologising. That is what is unacceptable. After all it was armed force working in her name that did the deed.

It will never happen. Saying only that Jallianwala Bagh is scar on Indo - British relaions what is May saying? A total non-apology when in reality the whole colonialism is a blot. The guy who said 'Give me liberty or give me death' also owned 77 slaves. May too considers in her heart of hearts colonialism is her God given right and the rest is lip service. We need MODI for antother TEN years to teach these white cretins.


colonization is a scar on Indo britshit relations.


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