Indian Judicial System

[tandav]

Law is a matter of interpretation. Some lawyer told me that the same case with the same data apparently results in different ruling based on interpretation by the judge. This was a shocking revelation to me recently after getting entangled in some nasty legal matters. I intend to educate others in the practical ways of the Judicial system. Everything from how Judges behave, types of lawyers, try to explain why some lawyers charge Rs 70K per appearance and whether they are worth it. I highly encourage others to explain their own run ins with the legal system and outcomes thereoff so we all may learn best practices. The entire field is ripe for disruption with AI and other methods.

Any Business or Agency in India is subject to the laws of India. The actual workings of the Judicial System is pretty confusing to the lay person. In this opaque structure lies many problems and has increased the cost of justice to unimaginable levels with cheats easily gaming the situation and honest people getting stuck because of lack of knowledge. This thread will attempt to simplify or educate the public on how to handle or approach the legal system in India. Discuss better processes and approaches. What to do and what not to do.

[tandav]

Starting with Contracts. Apparently for a very long time people who had defaulted on contracts had managed to get away by claiming that the contract signed is not enforceable due to lack of it being stamped or sufficiently stamped. All contracts has stamp duty and insufficiently stamped contracts were held inadmissible / unenforceable. The confusion around this basically meant any contract (employment, Purchase order, Work Order) signed is legally unenforceable. Essentially meant that those who wanted to cheat would try to escape by citing the above issue.

Recently the supreme court had a 7 member bench that basically held that the above defect can be post facto cured by the litigant by paying the relevant stamp duty.

https://www.livelaw.in/top-stories/non- ... urt-168265

There
https://www.livelaw.in/high-court/karna ... tescroll=1

[tandav]

In most contract laws such as issue of Purchase orders or Work Orders disputes are to be referred to Arbitration. However while the process appears fair on surface, note that the appointment of Arbitrator is an art and a savvy party can rig the system to deliver biased judgements.

It is critical that your lawyers be super competent and honest (this is more difficult than one may naively assume). A compromised lawyer can easily destroy your case (by not arguing your case with proper facts) in arbitration and once the judgement is passed on basis of cross questioning the sole Arbitrator may pass a judgement that can and will fly contrary to the face of any reasonable interpretation of law

[SriKumar]

Good thread, tandav. It is unimaginable pain for someone unfortunate enough to get tangled in the justice process which can take anywhere from 5 years to 30 years- people are born and die over such timescales. The new bills, as I understand, are to replace the current system of laws- a very major step, if true. Are pdf files of the text available anywhere? This thread, though is meant to educate people on practical specifics of current-day engagement on legal matters- and is a creditworthy endeavor.

[chetak]

Blow hot , blow cold......

Surprising how retirement often stiffens the spine of babooze and their extended tribe

[bala]

Esteemed tech people of this forum, consider this:
Proposal for Judgement System of INDIA (IJJIS):
We feed into the new INDIAN Judicial Judgement Information System (IJJIS, open to naming contest in Sanskrit) LLM (large language model) all the existing laws, precedent ruling, case model rules, etc and using GEN AI (generative AI) publish the entire set of Judgements for all existing cases, past and present. Can run this on super param computers.

Then compare the existing judgements that are produced with those presented up to now by Judges (reams of writing of esteemed judges of INDIA), then we should have a fair idea of how accurately the Judges applied the law. After a few trials and tweaks and with a decent scorecard for algorithms, we can make this as tool for the Judge (saves them hours of paperwork) to dispense with a case. Time saved, Judge looks like a miraculous hero after a cursory reading (person can become a speed reader) of gen AI material, provide their chaapa and lo and behold India gets the best judgement system due to computer and AI. Can also have automatic language translated scripts in regional language, hindi, sanskrit and optionally other international languages (for those challenged in Angrezi).

Using the system, we can keep metrics and pay special attention to where cases become ambiguous because of how laws were written. Send the feedback of such ambiguous laws back to the politicos with a suggestion of how it should be worded properly. The politicos vote for the amendments on a monthly/quarterly/yearly basis. In one shot India leapfrogs to first place in the world for speed of judgement. All doable in a short time!

[bala]

The entire Indian Judicial system is a borrowed britshit system, whose usefulness in the Indian context is a question mark. BTW the Britishits borrowed many judicial basis from the Manusmriti and Chanakya Neeti. They threw away the existing Panchayat System of India and brought in grey haired useless dudes to boss over the Indian population. Since they were thick behind their heads, they introduced time wasting tactics and wrote laws which can interpreted howsoever they wished depending on their whims and fancy. The entire Britshit laws need to be thrown out lock, stock and barrel and India needs to come up with proper sane laws which can be applied in the Indian context. Using computer programs we can leapfrog the staid, boring, time wasting existing system which is a scheme to drag down the economy and make some dudes rich and support mostly comprised judges on govt payroll for life.

How funny British laws made their impact on Indian judiciary? | Aditya Satsangi

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pP4zhar46B8

[Sachin]

The new bills, as I understand, are to replace the current system of laws- a very major step, if true.

The new bills only touch one part of the legal system. That is the criminal law. Contract Acts (which is being discussed here) is more on the civil law side. But the new Acts replacing the British made Indian Penal Code, Criminal Procedure Code, and Evidence Act. These three Acts/Code are the pillars of Criminal Justice system in India.

Indian Penal Code/ Bharthiya Nyaya Sanhita
1. Offences against women & children and then bodily injuries have been given precedence and now comes in the first chapters in the new Act. Earlier it was disorganised.
2. Community Service has now been introduced as a punishment.
3. Offences like stripping etc is made gender neutral. Women can be prosecuted for stripping another woman.
4. Organized crime, terrorism etc is now punishable offences under BNS itself. Supdt. of Police has the power to decide whether BNS sections have to be invoked, or other acts like UAPA should be used.
5. Sedition related offences are not there in BNS. Instead of that offences against the country (Deshdroh) has been introduced.
6. Lynching is now an exclusive offence by itself.
7. Punishment enhanced for hit & run offences.
8. Having s-exual intercourse, concealing identity (including religion) is now made an offence. #LoveJihad.
8. Fine amounts have been increased.

Code of Criminal Procedure/Bharatiya Nagarik Suraksha Sanhita
1. Posts of Judicial Magistrate 3rd class, Metropolitan Magistrate and Assistant Sessions Judge is abolished.
2. The court now have powers to issue summons over electronic medium (like e-mail, WhatsApp etc.). The BNSS provisions now allow liberal usage of advanced telecommunication, internet & video conferencing facilities.
3. Dangerous criminals can now be handcuffed.
4. More offences have been categorised in which the offender can be declared a "proclaimed offender".
5. For an offence with punishment of more than 7 years, forensic experts should visit the crime scene.

Evidence Act/Bharatiya Sakshya Adhiniyam
1. Documents to include electronic documents also.
2. Evidence now includes digital evidence as well.
3. Coercion to make a confession makes the confession inadmissable evidence.
4. Join trial can be held even if one of the accused is on the run, and declared "proclaimed offender".


These are just some of the changes brought in by the new laws. These Acts are yet to be rolled out and it is being done in stages. There will be a learning curve, and lot of commonly used Sections are now changing (Sec 320, Sec 420, Sec 497A etc. etc.). Right from the Police Head Constable/Station Writer all the way to Sessions Judges (and above) have to be trained to use these new laws and provisions.

[Sachin]

The entire Indian Judicial system is a borrowed britshit system, whose usefulness in the Indian context is a question mark.

I was shocked to find that the Articles related to Higher Courts (High Courts & Supreme Courts) are literally copied & pasted from the Govt. of India Act 1937 made by the British . So much for the Indianess of Constituition itself. The new Criminal Laws may bring in some difference, especially as the new Cr.PC mandates timelines for every aspect of a criminal case (investigation, trial, appeals etc.). The current judicial setup is suited for a tiny country like UK.

IMHO, there has to be some kind of limits on appeals. Example; for offences which carry max 7 years of RI or fine the last appeal should be to the High Court. If punishment is for a period 3 years or less, appeal can be to the District & Sessions court level only.

[tandav]

In many contracts today there is a clause for arbitration citing the arbitration and councilliation Act 1996. Technically this brings us close to the jury system.

The idea is to approach a neutral 3rd party to resolve disputess rather than approach courts. On paper this appears to be a good system, however the issue of corruption in which one party bribes the arbitrator to give a biased judgement is always there. The main issue is that an arbitral award is legally enforceable.

There is "rightly" immunity for the arbitrator for passing judgements, however the cost of against such defending such biased decisions is painfully high.