Bharat Rakshak

Consortium of Indian Defence Websites
It is currently 31 Jul 2014 18:18

All times are UTC + 5:30 hours




Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 3654 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1 ... 57, 58, 59, 60, 61, 62, 63 ... 92  Next
Author Message
PostPosted: 24 Feb 2012 06:18 
Offline
BRFite

Joined: 18 Jun 2000 11:31
Posts: 1709
India chopper deal figures in Italy graft investigation
Quote:
A probe by Italian prosecutors into allegations of corruption against state-backed defence major Finmeccanica has cast a shadow over a multi-million dollar deal that the company signed with India for 12 VVIP helicopters.
:
:


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: 24 Feb 2012 09:16 
Offline
BRFite

Joined: 14 Jan 2012 18:00
Posts: 754
VinodTK wrote:
India chopper deal figures in Italy graft investigation
Quote:
A probe by Italian prosecutors into allegations of corruption against state-backed defence major Finmeccanica has cast a shadow over a multi-million dollar deal that the company signed with India for 12 VVIP helicopters.
:
:



I won't mind if this deal gets shafted :D, about time the veeeyepees get to know what a pain in the ass delays can be, just like our brave soldiers.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: 24 Feb 2012 09:38 
Offline
BRFite

Joined: 30 Apr 2009 02:02
Posts: 1635
Location: Standing at the edge of the cliff
^^ Second that...


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: 24 Feb 2012 18:35 
Offline
BRFite

Joined: 18 Jul 2001 11:31
Posts: 1004
My understanding was that IAF provides aircraft for VIP duties. In the absence of dedicated VIP craft, it would depute other aircraft which might have other operational roles. I don't expect neta-log to travel less because of lack of aircraft. So it might be better to have more VIP aircraft (promptly available) so IAF's operations aren't affected. It is a completely different matter if the VIP butts prefer the soft leather cushioned seats or the rugged ones.

Just my guess.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: 24 Feb 2012 19:18 
Offline
BRFite

Joined: 20 Sep 2000 11:31
Posts: 1160
Arun Menon wrote:
VinodTK wrote:
India chopper deal figures in Italy graft investigation
A probe by Italian prosecutors into allegations of corruption against state-backed defence major Finmeccanica has cast a shadow over a multi-million dollar deal that the company signed with India for 12 VVIP helicopters.
:
:



I won't mind if this deal gets shafted :D, about time the veeeyepees get to know what a pain in the ass delays can be, just like our brave soldiers.


:D :D :D :D :D

Why can't they buy a few more Mi 17 in VIP configuration ? When it comes to arms / ammunition, Rodina is always present but for transporting the delicate arses of VIP, we need a western aircraft with capitalistic comforts. I undertsand that US has cancelled its Marine On order for the EH 101 (US version) and is going for upgrading the existing aircraft. IF TFTA vcan do it why not SDRE ?
K


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: 24 Feb 2012 19:53 
Offline
BRF Oldie

Joined: 19 May 2010 10:00
Posts: 2329
I think for high altitude CAS we need a fixed wing aircraft capable of slow flying rather than helos. We should adapt LCA, IJT for the role and in future develop a CAS variant of AJT=CAT


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: 24 Feb 2012 20:05 
Offline
BRFite

Joined: 30 Apr 2009 02:02
Posts: 1635
Location: Standing at the edge of the cliff
Vicji,
While I personally agree that we need to develop a CAS capable AJT, I believe that nothing comes close to an attack helicopter when it comes to CAS. The chopper has the benefit of operating from the second echelon lines while jets(except for the harrier) are restricted to airfields that are well behind the front lines. This also effects the bird's time on station as they can hang around for quite some time before heading back to refuel and/or re-arm. Then there is also a matter of accuracy with which fire is bought to bear against the engaged target which is significantly high for an attack helicopter.
JMO.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: 24 Feb 2012 20:09 
Offline
Forum Moderator

Joined: 13 Aug 2004 19:42
Posts: 32615
Location: Col of the regiment, ORR JTF unit
good point Kersi D, even the Obamas are into austerity these days (relatively speaking).

we have good reliable HW (Mi17V) and a guy who always want to create a splash and pimp out the ride to the wildest extent.

I hereby submit that DC Design be given the sole contract to upgrade the VVIP Mi17V to capitalistic stds.

http://www.infibeam.com/static/dcdesign ... r-car.html

he will likely source the interior stuff from the same places that eurocopter does but not at 1000% markup which eurocopter will surely take

in any case both our future commanders in chief are fit to hyperfit - Yuvraj and Vadra sir :oops: -- they could easily ride the basic Mi17 with no ill effect


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: 24 Feb 2012 22:31 
Offline
BRF Oldie

Joined: 23 Jul 2000 11:31
Posts: 10942
Well to be fair the EH-101 is a more modern chopper , has 3 engine which means more reliability , can carry heavier payload and yes comes with all the comfort and safety that the latest and best Western chopper can offer.

No doubt PMO had decided to buy EH-101 over any thing out there as any elite in any country given a choice would choose the best ..... for US not choosing EH-101 its more a question of lobby and choosing what is made in the country.

As far as Mi-17 goes the Russian president uses Mi-8 variant ( export designation Mi-17 ) for VIP roles and perhaps will continue to use it till Mi-38 takes over.

Here are some pics of Presidential Mi-17

Mi-8
Interiors

Kazan also offer some Business Class/VIP Mi-17
http://imagery.vnfawing.com/archive/Hel ... 593937.jpg


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: 25 Feb 2012 05:55 
Offline
BRF Oldie

Joined: 02 Dec 2008 10:49
Posts: 4821
Austin wrote:
As far as Mi-17 goes the Russian president uses Mi-8 variant ( export designation Mi-17 ) for VIP roles and perhaps will continue to use it till Mi-38 takes over.

Here are some pics of Presidential Mi-17

Mi-8

I didn't get you. The Mi-8 and Mi-17 are two different helicopters. the "17" is not an export designation. Or is it different for this version?

The helo in the pic is an Mi-17 not Mi-8. Easiest way to spot is the tail rotor. The 17 has the tail rotor on the port side instead of starboard.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: 25 Feb 2012 09:36 
Offline
BRF Oldie

Joined: 23 Jul 2000 11:31
Posts: 10942
Mi-17 is just an export designation of the internal Mi-8MT/MTV and other advanced variant.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: 25 Feb 2012 10:37 
Offline
BRF Oldie

Joined: 01 Jan 1970 05:30
Posts: 10546
Location: India
I endorse Kersi and others on this issue.Firstly,the number of these VVIP helos is profligate.12.Even the US which wanted the same for "Marine Corps 1",found the aircraft too expensive and as of now it stands cancelled/shelved.If one remembers right,Mrs.Gandhi used Alouette-3s for her helo trips.OK,a twin-engined aircraft is safer agreed,and it is fact that the MI-8/17 medium helo is the most widely used helo in the world,even used by NATO forces (leased) in Af-Pak.Two air shows ago,there was at one of the Russian pavilions,a brochure giving the interior layouts/pics of MI-17s in VVIP configuration.I think I may have somewhere in my archives a CD of the same,will post pics if ever found.The interiors were most luxurious,absolute 5*+ std., and a revelation as to how far the Russians had improved the quality of aircraft interior design (Sukhoi Superjet too for instance ),perhaps the design was outsourced to a European supplier. Given the huge number if MI-17s in service and on order for the IAF,it would've been most cost-effective to have ordered VVIP versions which would be easier to operate too.We will now have the dubious distinction of operating such a large number of VVIP helos superior to what even the US pres. uses!


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: 25 Feb 2012 10:56 
Offline
Forum Moderator

Joined: 13 Aug 2004 19:42
Posts: 32615
Location: Col of the regiment, ORR JTF unit
I agree Philip, the servicing of Mi17VVIP would be much easier for HAL.

Khan's marine1 is a special overstrength sqdn - I believe its a mix of CH53, UH60 and SeaKing(whatever the green paint land version is called) and consists around 45 airframes, most of which are based near DC but some may be elsewhere for short haul trips in other parts of the vast country. they are looked after quite well.
when POTUS goes overseas, some of these helis are also put onboard C5 or C17 and airlifted onsite if he is going out of town like say delhi to jaipur.

for a minor league visit like that to India (delhi and hyd), there were 70 x heavy airlift flights just to bring in his kit and kaboodle :)


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: 25 Feb 2012 20:57 
Offline
BRFite

Joined: 18 Jun 2000 11:31
Posts: 1709
New choppers for Bagdogra base
Quote:
KOLKATA: In keeping with the government's policy to upgrade military infrastructure in the eastern and northeastern parts of the country, the newly acquired multi-purpose Mi-5 V5 helicopters have been stationed at the IAF's base at Bagdogra in north Bengal. These helicopters were inducted into the IAF last week in Delhi.

The first batch of helicopters was received and inducted into the Eastern Air Command at Bagdogra by Air Vice Marshal KS Gill, Senior Officer Administration, EAC.

These helicopters are an upgraded version of the Mi-17 choppers already in use by the Indian Air Force. They have highly automated avionics, multi-functional displays, sophisticated navigation systems and a range of weapons that can be used during combat mode. Their powerful engines will enable the armed forces to react quickly in high altitudes.

"The new helicopters have special night vision capabilities that enable them to carry out low-altitude operations even when it is pitch dark. The weather radar on board gives it all-weather capability. For several years now, the Special Forces have been practicing night operations in difficult terrain the the North East. These helicopters will be ideal for such operations, even if they are carried out in high altitude terrain," an official said.

Bagdogra is one of the most crucial air bases in the eastern part of the country due to its strategic location. It is located close to the narrow 'chicken neck' region that connects the North East to the rest of the country. The role of the air base will be crucial in the case of an attempt to cut off the North East from the remaining part of the country.

Apart from defensive purposes, the air base has an important role to play during disasters - natural or otherwise. After the earthquake in Sikkim, all air operations were conducted from Bagdogra. Mi-17 choppers had to be brought in from Assam then as Bagdogra only had the smaller Chetaks and Cheetahs.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: 26 Feb 2012 14:31 
Offline
BRFite

Joined: 14 Dec 2010 17:34
Posts: 294
Location: Classified
Note the Mi 5 v5 in the second line.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: 27 Feb 2012 00:20 
Offline
BRF Oldie

Joined: 24 Apr 2001 11:31
Posts: 2059
VinodTK wrote:
12 VVIP helicopters

What the heck is a "VVIP"? Are service chiefs also VVIPs or are they merely lower-tier VIPs along with the DC, DTO, RDO, Tehsildar etc?


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: 27 Feb 2012 01:07 
Offline
Webmaster BR

Joined: 15 Jan 2004 12:31
Posts: 1246
Location: Planet Earth
VVIP = Very, Very Important Person. Usually accorded for heads of state and may also be service chiefs.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: 27 Feb 2012 14:25 
Offline
BRF Oldie

Joined: 01 Jan 1970 05:30
Posts: 10546
Location: India
Yes Singha,after visits by B.Hussein O.,our worthies have lobserved closely and have gotten fresh ideas on how to pamper their precious backsides.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: 27 Feb 2012 21:22 
Offline
BRFite

Joined: 21 Feb 2012 15:54
Posts: 282
My only concern with the VVIP Helicopter scam is that St. Anthony may just get an excuse to shaft important defence procurements. I personally give a big $hit whether this deal goes thru or not, but not at the cost of important ones


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: 29 Feb 2012 12:21 
Offline
BRF Oldie

Joined: 07 Oct 2005 12:58
Posts: 6577
Location: Desh ke baarei mei sochna shuru karo. Soch badlo, desh badlega!
http://tarmak007.blogspot.in/2012/02/al ... e-hal.html


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: 29 Feb 2012 12:45 
Offline
BRF Oldie

Joined: 01 Jan 2010 21:41
Posts: 7322
krishnan wrote:
http://tarmak007.blogspot.in/2012/02/alh-rudra-ready-to-spit-fire-hal.html

Would be nice to see the snippet and title of the report. Posting a plain URL is not in good taste.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: 04 Mar 2012 20:16 
Offline
BRFite

Joined: 18 Jun 2000 11:31
Posts: 1709
Sikorsky offers military choppers to India
Quote:
:
:
Sikorsky's Executive Vice President for India and South Asia, Air Vice Marshal Arvind Jeet Singh Walia (retd), told India Strategic defence magazine (www.indiastrategic.in) that at present the offer was to make a naval variant of the famous Black Hawk, designated MH-70B Sea Hawk, if the Indian Navy opts to buy this aircraft.

The Indian Navy should have a requirement for more than 100 helicopters of this type, and if the Sea Hawk is chosen, there would be appreciable Transfer of Technology and manufacturing capability to India, subject of course to an agreement between the Indian and US Governments.

If selected, the MH-70B could be co-produced in India under what is called the Buy-and-Make category of the defence ministry's Defence Procurement Procedure (DPP), he said.

At present, the navy has an RfP (Request for Proposals or tender) for 16 helicopters with an option for eight more twin-engine, 12.5 tonne category helicopters. But there are indications for nearly a 100 more, Walia said, adding: "The technical and financial evaluation process is on and a decision is due any time."
:
:


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: 05 Mar 2012 14:49 
Offline
BRFite -Trainee

Joined: 08 Nov 2010 19:22
Posts: 10
Came across this news item in today's Tribune. Felt quite pleased with the contents. According to the report, if the Defence Ministry grants Tata-Sikorsky JV company the license it is seeking, as much as 80% of S-92/H-92 will be produced in India. That seems better than the local content on Dhruv! At present, they're only producing the cabins whose rate of production is being increased to 36 per year. Here's the report:

http://www.tribuneindia.com/2012/20120305/nation.htm#9

Considering the quality issues associated with Dhruv cabins, may be HAL can outsource their production to these guys.
Does any one know how the H-92 compares with Mi-17s? It may be a good idea to fulfil future military requirements for medium helos from this venture.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: 06 Mar 2012 06:44 
Offline
BRF Oldie

Joined: 28 Jun 2007 06:36
Posts: 2917
80% of components when by value will be 5% of value, because the engine component, the blade technology component, the transmission component etc will be imported lock, stock and barrel, where as the screwdriver component, each screw component, the door plastic component will be "indigenous" - in other words the screw driver technology. I thought we are past that.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: 06 Mar 2012 13:44 
Offline
BRF Oldie

Joined: 04 Feb 2004 12:31
Posts: 2486
What disappoints me is that while Sikorsky will utilise TASL's facilities to build the S-92, the MoD will not force HAL to offload some of the huge work load they have currently. TASL could easily be given work related to LUH and whatever heli the IAF chooses for its light utility role, either the Fennec or the Ka-226. TASL could also be roped in for production of the LCH, with HAL being the prime integrator. HAL seems to want to keep all the major work to itself, outsourcing only small quantities of work to small private companies..and all the while we keep seeing it sliding every single deadline to the right.

Perhaps the earlier GoI divests its shares in HAL, the better.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: 06 Mar 2012 14:08 
Offline
BRFite

Joined: 14 Apr 2010 11:27
Posts: 131
Kartik wrote:
HAL seems to want to keep all the major work to itself

on a lighter vein, perhaps we should read Sir Humphrey's notes on the DAA in "Yes Minister" :-)


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: 14 Mar 2012 21:55 
Offline
BRFite

Joined: 07 Dec 2008 02:32
Posts: 984
link

Quote:
PROBE IN PROCUREMENT OF 12 VVIP HELICOPTERS

There was a media report stating that the scope of a probe by Italian prosecutors into allegations against unethical dealings by M/s Finmeccanica, Italy has widened to include the Indian contract signed with M/s Agusta Westland for purchase of 12 helicopters. Ministry of Defence asked for a report in the matter from the Indian Embassy in Rome. The report received indicates that Italian magistrate/prosecutors are conducting preliminary investigation about allegations of financial mal-practices occurring within M/s Finmeccanica, Italy and its subsidiaries in general and there is no specific probe being conducted about India related transactions.


Quote:
AVAILABILITY OF HELICOPTERS FOR HIGH ALTITUDE AREAS

The air logistics including casualty evacuation in emergent situations of Indian Army is being met by Indian Air Force (IAF) helicopters. The Army's rotary wing assets also assist the IAF.

A Request for Proposal (RFP) / for hiring of civil helicopters for movement of maintenance supplies in high altitude areas was issued in October 2011, which included details of dispatch and receiving helipads.

The security situation is reviewed by the Government from time to time, keeping in view the threat perception. This is a continuous process.


Quote:
HELICOPTERS EMPLOYED IN FOREIGN COUNTRIES

The Indian Air Force helicopters are assisting in providing logistics support in aid of Ministry of Home Affairs anti-naxal operations.

Details of helicopters pressed in service in the foreign countries cannot be divulged in the interest of friendly relations with foreign countries and strategic concerns.

PURCHASE OF LUHS

There is a proposal of procurement of 187 Light Utility Helicopters (LUHs) under design and development project undertaken by Hindustan Aeronautics Limited (HAL). The project was sanctioned by Government of India in February 2009. The project is proceeding as per approved time lines.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: 14 Mar 2012 22:34 
Offline
Forum Moderator

Joined: 02 Apr 2010 01:21
Posts: 2796
Pic courtesy Sourabh Joshi (at Indian aviation expo 2012):
Image

There is a cap on the rotor of the ALH NAVY. I have not seen this before. Does anybody know the reason? Folding of blades?


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: 15 Mar 2012 08:18 
Offline
BRF Oldie

Joined: 08 May 2007 17:04
Posts: 8411
Location: (IT-vity && DRDO) nagar
^^ Noticed a Naval ALH flying around yesterday with something slung underneath it. New version of SV-2000 being tested?


Last edited by sum on 15 Mar 2012 10:30, edited 1 time in total.

Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: 15 Mar 2012 09:04 
Offline
BRFite

Joined: 30 Apr 2009 02:02
Posts: 1635
Location: Standing at the edge of the cliff
^^^Where did you see the Naval version?? I saw a couple of Army ALH's doing circuits over Malleshvaram and Ulsoor Lake...


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: 15 Mar 2012 09:17 
Offline
BRF Oldie

Joined: 08 May 2007 17:04
Posts: 8411
Location: (IT-vity && DRDO) nagar
^^ Saw there over the Sarjapur ORR....looked like the wheeled version and so surmised it was naval version ( since couldn't make out the colour of the chopper)


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: 15 Mar 2012 09:51 
Offline
BRF Oldie

Joined: 01 Jan 2010 21:41
Posts: 7322
AFAIK, all LCH have the same landing gear. Is there a Naval version?


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: 15 Mar 2012 10:27 
Offline
BRFite

Joined: 30 Apr 2009 02:02
Posts: 1635
Location: Standing at the edge of the cliff
Must have been a typo, Martenji. I guess he wanted to say ALH and it came out LCH.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: 15 Mar 2012 10:29 
Offline
BRF Oldie

Joined: 08 May 2007 17:04
Posts: 8411
Location: (IT-vity && DRDO) nagar
Sorry about that onlee..meant ALH.

The LCH has been running in my mind since i saw it last week with its metallic gray + tiger stripes combo. Still not been able to figure out if that was the TD-3 or the TD-2 repainted from its original digital camo?


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: 03 Apr 2012 04:02 
Offline
BRFite

Joined: 18 Jun 2000 11:31
Posts: 1709
Sikorsky-Tata joint venture applies for defence licence
Quote:
US-based chopper manufacturer Sikorsky Aircraft Corporation, part of United Technologies Corp, and Tata Advanced Systems Limited (TASL) have applied for a defence licence to manufacture components and assemble helicopters for use by the Indian Navy, according to Steve Estill, vice-president (strategic partnerships), Sikorsky.

“The licence will pave the way for us to set up an assembly line in this country. We will decide on our plans once we hear from the Ministry of Defence. We expect our application to be cleared from the ministry in the second quarter of this financial year,” he told mediapersons here on Monday.
:
:


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: 07 Apr 2012 18:46 
Offline
BRFite

Joined: 20 Aug 2010 17:37
Posts: 124
Location: Bangalore
A couple of recent pics of TD-2 just before a test flight
and
a pic in the cockpit of an ALH during a recent flight test at high altitude somewhere in the clear skies over Bangalore!
- Hari

Image
Image
Image


Last edited by Hari Nair on 07 Apr 2012 19:12, edited 1 time in total.

Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: 07 Apr 2012 18:52 
Offline
BRFite

Joined: 04 Aug 2011 11:34
Posts: 159
Location: Pune
Hari Nair wrote:
A couple of recent pics of TD-2 just before a test flight
and
a pic in the cockpit of an ALH during a recent flight test at high altitude somewhere over the clear skies over Bangalore!
- Hari

Image
Image
Image


great! looks like IFR probe is in place now. what is the pylon yellow like thing at the bottom of forward fuselage?
and i thought they have moved the landing gear assembly inside the body.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: 07 Apr 2012 19:11 
Offline
BRFite

Joined: 20 Aug 2010 17:37
Posts: 124
Location: Bangalore
That's not an "IFR Probe" (not sure if there's any such thing)- its an airspeed calibration probe. It sticks out clear beyond the "dirty" air under the main rotor and measures the airspeed.
The Yellow pylon mounted things are (temporarily located) aircraft airspeed probes.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: 07 Apr 2012 19:25 
Offline
BRFite

Joined: 26 Jan 2005 13:59
Posts: 636
Looks like the Wings of LCH have also changed


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: 07 Apr 2012 19:34 
Offline
BRFite

Joined: 04 Aug 2011 11:34
Posts: 159
Location: Pune
Hari Nair wrote:
That's not an "IFR Probe" (not sure if there's any such thing)- its an airspeed calibration probe. It sticks out clear beyond the "dirty" air under the main rotor and measures the airspeed.
The Yellow pylon mounted things are (temporarily located) aircraft airspeed probes.


oh! i was under impression that helicopters are also refueled in air like fighters. Actually when i was writing earlier post the question crept in my mind that how do they refuel helicopter considering difference in operating environment(altitude, speed etc) of a (tanker) plane and helicopter. also i never heard of any helicopter in tanker role.

a thought just came into my mind, maybe stupid. can we have IFR on a helicopter? one can modify a mi-26 size heli into tanker role and other helis can get fuel from it. it may not be useful in attack helos but definately will help in recon and AEW types of missions.


Top
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 3654 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1 ... 57, 58, 59, 60, 61, 62, 63 ... 92  Next

All times are UTC + 5:30 hours


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Google Feedfetcher and 24 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Group