LCA News and Discussions

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 18 Jul 2012 21:56

another level of complication could be testing impact of lightning on stores like drop tanks, munitions, LDP etc because if something gets fried the OEM could always claim its our fault!

manum · Post by **manum** » 18 Jul 2012 21:58

but I think the best solution for Pods and drop tanks is to keep them in metal....keep them independent of plane body so that they are independent modules who deal with lightening in their own way...i.e. the connector between plane and pods is an insulator....and pods are metal...

putnanja · Post by **putnanja** » 18 Jul 2012 22:24

BBC Reporton the Airbus lightening test facility for Airbus A350 which has made of composites.

rajanb · Post by **rajanb** » 18 Jul 2012 22:38

In some case they have a metal strips under the first layer of composites which are connected to the part of the A/C which is made of metal and they would have lightning disbursers on wing tips, under the nose, and on the rudder. So there would be a path for the electric charge to flow back into the air.

The way the LCAs have been flying, I would be very shocked

if they haven't been proofed for lightning and

if there was not at least one incident of an lca being hit by lightning.

And the mounting of any weapons/tanks would have also been proofed and checked with the mounting.

SaiK · Post by **SaiK** » 19 Jul 2012 03:59

LCA did report many years back on lightning tests on the body.. but I am not sure it was done with the stores, especially with the firangi ones. Not a bad idea to test, so that we can remove that nuisance value should that happen in the future, and firangies blaming LCA etc.

krishnan · Post by **krishnan** » 19 Jul 2012 06:08

http://lca-tejas.org/testing.html

Eric Leiderman · Post by **Eric Leiderman** » 19 Jul 2012 08:41

While there seems to be a discussion on lightening , we are only concentrating on the high voltage electrical potential. Any spark (lightening is one giant spark) radiates electro magnetic radiation in all the bands (huge amounts.) so any recieving antenna wich is capable of recieving emf waves is suspect. There are ways to mitigate this and possibly this is being tested too.

pentaiah · Post by **pentaiah** » 19 Jul 2012 08:54

Any circuit with zenner diodes to filter out high voltage would be in the radiating antenna circuit I guess along with reverse polarity diodes second line of defense ...

Going back into the cave ...

SaiK · Post by **SaiK** » 19 Jul 2012 08:54

yes.. but leaving the incident part [re-read the important message in that link], this link may give you a bit extra info:

Yesterday, we were about to test the fuel tanks of Tejas as part of the certification process, ahead of the IOC. Since, Tejas is an all-weather fighter, we had to see the effects (2 types) of lighting on the platform. If the lightning hits the aircraft, it can affect external parts, including the radome. This is called direct effect. It can also damage the fly-by-wire systems, electro-magnetic surroundings (instruments) – which fall under indirect effect.

tarmak007.blogspot.com/2010/12/low-intensity-explosion-at-cabs.html

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 19 Jul 2012 10:19

this being our 1st a.c we have no data bank to fall back on for things like this. I suspect those who have multiple a/c below the belt can easily predict the outcomes of such std tests

rajanb · Post by **rajanb** » 19 Jul 2012 12:33

I am sure that someone else must have noticed it and if discussed and posted before, my apologies.

Considering that landing on an Aircraft Carrier is akin to a controlled crash I just checked images of NP1 and LSP7. NP1 has a single wheel on the front though it seems bigger than the two front wheels on the LSP-7. I would have thought NP1, to have a stronger nose wheel, to take the force it would be subjected to, would have two tires too?

Any inkling why tis so?

Lalmohan · Post by **Lalmohan** » 19 Jul 2012 13:01

oleo leg strength is key and not tyres

rajanb · Post by **rajanb** » 19 Jul 2012 15:08

^^^^ You mean a tyre can't go bust? In which case leg strength does not matter? With two, the a/c still stands a chance. And the original LCA twin seater trainer also has two.

I once was taking off from BLR on a commercial flight. As the 737 a/c approached rotate speed, I heard a bang. When seat belt lights switched off I commandeered the purser and told him "mate, I heard this bang and am sure that you lost a tyre."

He made soothing idiotic sounds.

When we landed at BOM, there was another bang. The aircraft was moving from side to side. And the THUDS across the concrete separators were unusually loud. As I strolled down the steps I looked at the tyres. Now both were flat. A horrifying sight. Maybe the risk is not too great?

Because it was obvious to me the pilots had used all their strength and skill to keep the a/c on course. It was the starboard rear tyres.

member_19648 · Post by **member_19648** » 19 Jul 2012 18:19

The current issue of Geopolitics has a nice article on the Tejas program, on the challenges it faced, and how the program has shaped up. Was a good read, for anyone interested, it can be read here: Page 44

http://www.geopolitics.in/july2012.aspx

member_19648 · Post by **member_19648** » 19 Jul 2012 18:28

Also discovered this on the net, a pic of Tejas with a refueling probe, probably a dummy one as written in the article.

http://www.aame.in/2012/07/light-combat ... itted.html

Raman · Post by **Raman** » 19 Jul 2012 22:42

Tejas FOC slides to 2015

Ardeshir · Post by **Ardeshir** » 19 Jul 2012 22:49

Raman wrote:Tejas FOC slides to 2015

This is the same DDM article from TOIlet posted earlier.

SaiK · Post by **SaiK** » 20 Jul 2012 00:14

Unless we all know the real status [which never ever be available], DDM will play spoil sport... and these guys will make money with their write anything about it articles.

BTW, being successful is important for the only fighter jet project in the nation... so late entry is just fine.. and people should ignore the DDM.

rajanb · Post by **rajanb** » 20 Jul 2012 09:22

Prasant wrote:
Raman wrote:Tejas FOC slides to 2015
This is the same DDM article from TOIlet posted earlier.

I had seen this article in the TOI, a few days back, and decided not to post it, because it did not deserve my assistance towards increased circulation.

A few years back, I was having a drink with my Unc who was then a senior level officer. The topic veered around to arms dealers. And I remember his recountign to me tales of lobbying, pressure and also encouraging DDMitis. It encompassed not only products which were being developed indigenously, but he spoke of how foreign competitors used DDMs to further their chances.

Sometimes, I think, that it goes to the extent that a losing competitor, doesn't mind if the deal gets scuttled, because it may negatively impact their chances elsewhere or open increased sales to us.

suryag · Post by **suryag** » 20 Jul 2012 09:47

so the trials didnt go well ? brings tears to me

Just a week ago we were all so happy with the number of sorties undertaken and thought we had turned the corner and now this hope we get to ioc-2 by year end and handover the crafts to the IAF

rajanb · Post by **rajanb** » 20 Jul 2012 10:00

suryag wrote:so the trials didnt go well ? brings tears to me

Just a week ago we were all so happy with the number of sorties undertaken and thought we had turned the corner and now this hope we get to ioc-2 by year end and handover the crafts to the IAF

SuryaG

where did you hear that?

If you notice that 3 LSPs were used for the trials. All three paricipated in the first round. In the sea trials and from the test flight reports only two of the original three were flying. That could mean one of the following regarding the one that is not flying: ( I do not remember which LCA's, olde man that I am)

a) They needed only two for the sea trials.
b) It has been grounded?
c) they need to tweak the LCAs for something and they are doing the tweaking on this first.

Please correct me if I am wrong. FOC is for when the IAF has also figured out how the LCA fits into their overall doctrine. It is a combination of training, support services, LCA's and the tactics and strategies in place. And they would need at least half a suadron strength.

Gurneesh · Post by **Gurneesh** » 20 Jul 2012 18:25

^^^ IMHO one would be a backup plane (to be used only if the main two cannot fly for some reason).

suryag · Post by **suryag** » 20 Jul 2012 20:32

No Rajanb sir I didnt get it from anything, i read this news article and found it quoted the 2k sortie mark and also said

So far, Tejas has achieved only initial operational clearance-I (IOC-I) to certify it's airworthiness. "The IOC-II for the fighter, which also includes integration of some weapons like laser-guided bombs, was pushed back to December 2012. But now, it will only be possible by July, 2013, or so after over 200 more sorties. FOC will come only two years after that," said a source

Was wondering if the above was true what could have caused the slip from Dec->Jul and the recent trials came to mind. So was depressed thinking about the possibility of vistiing pokhran/goa/leh again next year as pat of certification. Tejas should have been named Nakul(younger brother of Arjun

)

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 20 Jul 2012 20:41

the point which is scary is nobody has said for sure if the radar has been integrated and how much testing is done for that. remember its a new radar, not a proven commodity like EL2032 in entirety. it is a vast testplan on its own.

without a radar + wvr + bvr missiles proven, FOC is impossible...even IOC2 is doubtful.

Karan M · Post by **Karan M** » 20 Jul 2012 23:00

Ok, you haven't been following the radar issue. But enough information is available. Why not do some digging on your own rather than getting worried and then worrying others in turn. Statements about there being no radar on LCA and hence no integration possible are wrong. Basically by IOC2 they have to demonstrate CCM capability and BVR by FOC.

Anyways..radars have been flying on the LCA for over 2 years, 4 months now. The MMR was actually ready fairly quickly since India had the hardware ready and Israel adopted signal processor and software from the ELTA2032 to the Indian hardware and prototypes were made ready, ground tested (same as we are doing with the AEW&C radar) and then fitted to the plane.

And tests are being done on the integrated avionics system as well.

http://tejas.gov.in/history/timeline.html

2010
23 April - LCA Tejas LSP-3 made maiden flight. LSP-3 is close to the final configuration including the new air-data computers, Hybrid Multi Mode Radar, new communication and navigation equipment and radar warning receiver. With this the LCA programme has completed 1350 test flights logging about 800 flying hours.

2 June - LCA Tejas LSP-4 made successful maiden Flight. In addition to the LSP-3 standard of preparation, the aircraft also flew with the Countermeasure Dispensing System
19 November - LCA Tejas LSP-5 made successful maiden Flight.

Another reference to LSP-3's radar, April 2010
http://www.defenceaviation.com/2010/04/ ... radar.html

Note that the LCA MMR is basically the hardware from the original MMR (LRDE antenna, TWT, receiver-exciter/data processor, combined with Israeli signal processor & Israeli software).

Another reference to LSP-4 and radar. July 2010

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5w-_ZuRnwik

Uploaded by youmazdatube on Jul 25, 2010

The flight, piloted by Group Capt. Suneet Krishna of the National Flight Test Center (NFTC), lasted 40 min. The pilot went supersonic and later recovered the full flight envelope, exhibiting confidence in the system.
"Tejas-LSP-4 is the final configuration of [the] IAF version," an ADA source said. "Now all the hardware items have come onboard and there won't be anymore additional systems, barring some software changes. All objectives have been met and all systems worked as per the design. IAF pilots from [the] operational front [will] soon fly LCA."
In addition to the MMR, the LSP-4 had an onboard radar warning receiver, [an] electronic countermeasure system (ECM), and new avionics software.

LSP-5 and radar - May 2011
http://worldofdefense.blogspot.in/2011/ ... -from.html

The Tejas recently began its first phase of night attack trials. The fifth limited-series-production aircraft (LSP‑5), in the final Mk.1 configuration that includes a night-vision-capable cockpit, was used in six night flights in which test pilots conducted mock targeting and attack drills to test simulated avionics and integration of weapons and sensors. The aircraft’s modified ELTA Systems multimode radar and Rafael Litening pod were both tested during the flights.

Following the first six tests last month, India’s Defense Research and Development Organization (DRDO) said, “The preliminary results indicate that the integrated system performed very well, meeting the requirements of night operations. The flights also tested the helmet-mounted display system [Elta DASH] and instrument landing system.”

Radar is already integrated on LSP-7 and is working fine. March 2012

http://samantk.com/News/Defence/lca-tej ... ssful.html

Update: DRDO Statement: Tejas Limited Series Production - 7 (LSP-7) aircraft took-off for its maiden flight from HAL airport at 4:27 pm on 9th March 2012. This test flight is significant for the program, as LSP -7 build-standard is close to the initial operational clearance (IOC) standard. Accordingly LSP -7 aircraft, along with LSP - 8 will be offered to the Indian Air Force for user evaluation trials (UET). The flight was also significant considering the fact that for the first time “Production Test Schedule” was used for the first flight of an LSP aircraft in this program. This is also the first time that maiden flight of the aircraft was not accompanied by the customary ‘chase’ aircraft, which is an indicator to the level of confidence in the machine. The flight lasted 28 minutes with Gp Capt KK Venugopal at the controls in the cockpit and Wg Cdr Kabadwal of the National Flight Test Centre (NFTC) as Test Director in the telemetry. During the test flight, performance of the aircraft systems including Multi-mode Radar (MMR), Helmet Mounted Display System (HMDS), Auto-pilot and Instrument Landing System (ILS) was satisfactory, providing a moment of pride for all the stake holders which include ADA, HAL, IAF, CEMILAC, DG AQA, ADE and NAL among others.

BVR capability is intended for FOC, with dual missile launch.

The issue with dates is fairly straightforward to anyone who can get some occasional public info from LCA flight team members even once in a while, say at seminars, public functions etc. The program is being run very cautiously.

ADA and CEMILAC will not compromise on any test points and are proceeding in a very risk averse manner. We may dislike this but fact is there is a lot riding on this program and many are only too eager we mess up. Its not too far from the days that a Kalmadi tried to kill the program.

Have patience. It will come. The LCA TP's by the way, are doing a good job spreading the positiveness about the aircraft to others. Its slowly and steadily winning adherents.

Karan M · Post by **Karan M** » 20 Jul 2012 23:20

There are unlikely to be any significant challenges to the integration of the BVR missile to the radar itself, because the missile chosen for the interim LCA fit, is the Rafael Derby. Made by IAI, the same company which helped us with the MMR "fix". So software codes are available.

Note that thanks to the MiG-27 and Jaguar upgrade programs, DARE/ARDC have a fair handle on weaponization with PGMs as well.
http://www.aviationweek.com/Article.asp ... 472407.xml

India’s Tejas Light Combat Aircraft (LCA) has completed weapons trials in preparation for its operational clearance before the end of this year.

The single-seat, single-engine supersonic fighter also underwent flight trials in the western desert state of Rajasthan, a defense ministry official says.

“The bombing runs, which were part of a campaign for the second phase of initial operational clearance (IOC-2) and final operational clearance (FOC), were carried out over [the] last two days at the Pokhran field firing ranges, where India conducted its nuclear tests,” the official says.

The tests were conducted by three LCA aircraft — LSPs 2, 3 and 5 — that deployed a series of weapons, including laser-guided 1000-lb. bombs and unguided bombs, he says. The tests were an extension of the weapons deployment trials that took place in Pokhran last September.

Although LSPs 2 and 5 were fielded again this year, LSP 4, which was used last year, was replaced with LSP 3 for this year’s tests, the defense official explains.

The aircraft pounded on an area with a variety of armaments such as precision-guided bombs and conventional bombs weighing up to 500 kg during the tests. The bombs hit the targets on the ground with great accuracy, the official says.

Tejas is planned to be finally cleared for operational service by 2013. Maritime trials are likely to begin soon and the LCA also is gearing up to fire a beyond-visual-range missile, which will be either the Rafael Derby or the Vympel R-77.

Also, to avoid the usual media led motivated attacks on the LCA, its clear ADA-HAL-NFTC have stuck to a philosophy of releasing minimum data about challenges they face, solving the problems and only then talking about them.
http://www.defencenow.com/news/461/teja ... month.html

Last year, the ‘Tejas’ LCA project suffered a major setback due to fuel leakage in one of the aircraft during taxi-trials. Following this mishap, the entire Tejas fleet was grounded for safety purposes and several months were lost due to absence of tests on the LCA. Several structural changes in the fuel and hydraulic system were made on the aircraft to avoid future mishaps. In fact, the project management team from IAF and the Deputy Chief of Air Staff has been intently monitoring the development of the LCA project after the mishap.

Note how the above report spins the details about the "major setback" . If the media was even a tenth as onboard this program as a national endeavour, they would have mentioned it as a challenge and how the LCA team overcame it. But its a "major setback", "mishap", and a needlessly sensational claim about the PMT and DCAS is mentioned as if "now" they are monitoring the project. As versus the fact that the PMT/DCAS monitor the LCA anyhow & this is but one of the many activities they face.

Point is that with the Indian media being what it is, and absolutely irresponsible, the LCA team has to be risk averse and cannot keep providing day to day updates of these sort of routine things which come up from time to time in ANY development program. The media will just go to town attacking the program. Only a handful of journalists even have the sincerity to understand the program and how intense the product development process is, with flight critical systems requiring very high safety.

The key takeaway from the above is that the Indian development capability is now mature enough that within the space of months, the LCA design team was able to make many critical changes to the fuel & hydraulics system within the aircraft, and have it qualified for incorporation into the latest LSP-7. They did this with minimum fuss, despite the constant carping in the media about delays, and what not.

Lets take another area, items like digital flight controls have been mastered. Folks may wonder why the hardware re: DFCC is routinely displayed at airshows. The significance is not lost on those who denied us tech. You see, the original DFCC had US input. The new one is completely indigenized.

ADE also served notice in this: http://drdo.gov.in/drdo/pub/techfocus/2008/apr08.pdf that they were capable of making FCC hardware for a variety of platforms.

Similar messages can be discerned across a variety of areas.

LCA certification is now just a question of when, not how and if.

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 20 Jul 2012 23:25

thanks for restoring my BP back to normal.

Karan M · Post by **Karan M** » 20 Jul 2012 23:55

Here is a reference to the revised processor on the LCA MMR.

Office of the Regional Director AQA, ALISDA Bangalore
http://dgaeroqa.gov.in/field_establishm ... ments.html

ALISDA, DGAQA is providing Quality Assurance coverage during development of state-of-the-art Avionics Systems by DRDO Organizations including ADA situated in and around Bangalore. The Main Systems are :-

SV-2000 Maritime Patrol Airborne Radar (MPAR) for Dornier A/c and Naval ALH
Signal & Data Processor MK-III for MMR-LCA
Smart Stand by Display Unit (SSDU) for LCA
Cockpit Interface Unit (CIU) for LCA
Environmental Control and Fuel Management Electronic Unit for LCA
Data Transfer Unit (DTU) for MIG-27 (Upgrade)

So, the MMR development continues, even in the most challenging areas. And continue to advance local tech, even though they now have a working MMR.

An all new AESA system is also being developed for MK2, and that is continuing as well. Original plan was to develop the backend (receiver, exciter, signal-data processor combination in India + software) while getting the Tx/Rx modules from a partner OEM from abroad. X Band Tx/Rx modules are very hard to design for manufacturability, especially those which can be flight qualified, are reliable, compact, have low thermal dissipation even while producing required power. And are cost effective to make in number

The recent interview with Saraswat notes that they have developed a 1/8th prototype AESA array at LRDE and are testing it. How do we know this is Indian? DRDO's local partner, Astra Microwave mentions their work on X Band FCR (and that they have supplied prototypes to LRDE design) in a recent report. That would actually indigenize the entire radar, with complete control of the new AESA MMR in Indian hands.

A lot is being done, but unlike in most other countries - we neither have informed journalists putting out regular updates, or staged leaks with blurry camera pics shot by "fans".

Indranil · Post by **Indranil** » 20 Jul 2012 23:57

Nice post Karan. I was about to reply on similar lines. But you have done a much better job.

Karan M · Post by **Karan M** » 21 Jul 2012 00:06

Singha wrote:thanks for restoring my BP back to normal.

SaiK · Post by **SaiK** » 21 Jul 2012 00:46

thanks karan for the good posts. perhaps future versions of LCA, or upgrades think about under the belly (like advanced super hornets - video , actually intl model offered to India) IRST, and conformals [and other designs in the video]

I think LCA should follow the hornets tail by tale.

pragnya · Post by **pragnya** » 21 Jul 2012 10:47

Karan M

excellent posts as usual. appreciate the ability you have to dig out facts and surmising from your interaction with TPs and the rest.

just wanted to know if the ADA is waiting for all the flight parameters (for IOC 2) to be tested out and systems tweaked for the optimum before these are incorporated into LSP 6 which will do AOA handling, STR tests etc?? and then we go into BVR firing etc..for FOC??

also if you can delve on wake penetraion, lightning (component lightning tests IIRC is over) test of the aircraft with all systems on and the pilot present.

TIA.

NRao · Post by **NRao** » 21 Jul 2012 11:39

Singha wrote:thanks for restoring my BP back to normal.

Now I know why I had to sell all my pharma company shares!!!!

SaiK · Post by **SaiK** » 21 Jul 2012 18:43

It is a good thought to jumpstart to AESA t/r modules especially the latest generation AlGaN walahs. This should help them in getting the right size compact, and least power consuming, and having high gain.

GoI Tender:
1. 01004/LP/CRD/36-11 Development of GaN T/R Module
based active phased array test bed
– Qty 1 No.
500/- 02 AUG 2011

The vendor should have design, development and manufacturing capabilities in INDIA itself. Vendors have to demonstrate a working GaN based transmit-receive (T/R) module satisfying all the electrical specifications within two weeks of their reply against LRDE tender enquiry which is must for the final consideration of their proposal
'lrde010711sp2_development.pdf');

another tender ref:

9. 3 INCH GaN TEMPLATE ON SAPPHIRE 20 Nos. SSPL/12ATT012/CMS-II -Do-

for sspl, dilli

vina · Post by **vina** » 22 Jul 2012 00:55

There are unlikely to be any significant challenges to the integration of the BVR missile to the radar itself, because the missile chosen for the interim LCA fit, is the Rafael Derby

Oh well. All will be well, when the ChiPaks get their "Asstras" whooped. They need to get that one rolled out and proven and standardized as the BVR missile of choice on the IAF fleet (Su30, Mig 29, LCA, Rafale and PakFa).

member_23657 · Post by **member_23657** » 22 Jul 2012 11:22

I was talking to a person who is closely working on LSP-8. He says that the LCA struggles to fly over 0.8Mach for prolonged period. It vibrates and rattles when it tries to do so...

What is the ASQR for LCA..

Performance from Wiki and other related sources say the
Maximum speed to be Mach 1.8 (1,920 km/h, 1,195 mph) at high altitude

http://www.airforce-technology.com/projects/tejas/ says

The Tejas single-seat, single-engine, lightweight, high-agility supersonic fighter aircraft has been undergoing flight trials in preparation for operational clearance, and by March 2012 had flown more than 1,816 test flights up to speeds of Mach 1.4.

Is 1.8Mach speed only achievable with F414 intergation??

sum · Post by **sum** » 22 Jul 2012 11:32

I was talking to a person who is closely working on LSP-8. He says that the LCA struggles to fly over 0.8Mach for prolonged period. It vibrates and rattles when it tries to do so...

Hmmm....never heard of this one before.

Need to activate some chai-wallahs to check on this fact.

vic · Post by **vic** » 22 Jul 2012 12:06

Except fifth gen super cruise aircraft, no aircraft flies for "prolonged" periods over Mach 0.8

Karan M · Post by **Karan M** » 22 Jul 2012 12:37

avinashpeter wrote:I was talking to a person who is closely working on LSP-8. He says that the LCA struggles to fly over 0.8Mach for prolonged period. It vibrates and rattles when it tries to do so...

Avinash, no non supercruising fighter today, least of all a light aircraft like the LCA can sustain a speed over Mach 0.8 for a significant period of time. It will run out of fuel in minutes. The usual speed of operation will be from 0.5M to 0.8M, with fighters going supersonic for a brief time only when launching missiles (to add speed, range) and when chasing hostile aircraft.

Second, such uncorroborated stuff is usually wrong. So far in multiple trials, this has not even cropped up in the IAF feedback re:ASRs which have been around acceleration and STR (with the F2J3). The Ge404IN20 aircraft have been around for a while and have gone supersonic in their first flight itself.

http://www.asian-defence.net/2010/06/te ... first.html

The LCA is a delta, and its unlikely to face any significant challenges in going supersonic at high/medium alt. So far, the LCA has managed to cross the sound barrier repeatedly, in different trials.

At low altitudes, the Ge404F2J3 had less thrust and the LCA's top speed was limited at sea level. Even so, it went supersonic with the IN20. They are making further changes to lessen drag, and the Ge404IN20 comes with 90 kn thrust

In Geopolitics mag, a LCA TP notes that the IAF pilots used to spar over which handled better the Mirage 2000 or the Jaguar, but a LCA TP is certain that the LCA handles better than both (he obviously has had experience on both types).

Net, this is not really some big issue, because the IAF would have flagged it otherwise.

The MK2 of course comes with the 98 Kn or thereabouts Ge404INS6, that extra 8 kn of thrust should significantly better the transonic acceleration profile plus performance in subsonic.

Victor · Post by **Victor** » 22 Jul 2012 13:16

What he is probably talking about is the buffeting that can take place at about Mach 0.8 or 600 mph with buildup of supersonic airflow. This is common but there should be no question of not being able to punch through past the sound barrier. Cruise speed should be about 500 mph.