Lilo< Your twitter feed on End Violence on Woman is doing a good job.
Now we need a web page/blog that gathers the information.
Delhi Rape Victim Dies-Express your outrage.
Re: Delhi Rape Victim Dies-Express your outrage.
Hindu writes:
Rape victim cremated in a rush and away from the public eye
Shubhomoy Sikdar
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Policemen stand guard outside the crematorium as the last rites for the 23-year-old rape victim are performed, in New Delhi on Sunday.
The cremation of the young physiotherapy gang-rape victim was a low-key affair, with the government taking control and ensuring little public participation. Security in the area was beefed up as the woman’s mortal remains were consigned to the flames at Dwarka crematorium within hours of the arrival of the body from Singapore early this morning.
Though the body reached the crematorium around 5-45 a.m. and was put on the pyre by 6 a.m., the victim’s father lit it at around 7-30 a.m. as the family members protested against the police rushing them to get the cremation done before sunrise.
{Is this legitimate police function?}
The area was fortified with a large number of policemen and members of the Rapid Action Force in anti-riot gear guarding the area and keeping a close vigil. Deployment of security personnel had started on Saturday night.
The 23-year-old victim had breathed her last at a Singapore hospital on Saturday, after a 13-day battle for life following the brutal assault on her by six persons in a moving bus on December 16.
In a recognition of public outrage over the rape and death of the victim, Prime Minister Manmohan Singh and UPA Chairperson Sonia Gandhi were present at the Palam Technical Area of the Indira Gandhi International Airport when the body arrived by a special Air India aircraft around 3-30 a.m.
The two leaders interacted with the victim's parents who had accompanied the body.
A large number of policemen escorted the body to the victim’s residence and later to the crematorium. Several barricades were put by the police near the victim’s residence to prevent ordinary citizens from joining the mourning. The policemen asked the victim’s neighbours to stay away from her house where rituals were being performed. The restrictions continued after the body was taken to the crematorium.
The anger that has gripped the country following the incident resonated in the locality with neighbours joining the chorus demanding “strictest possible punishment” to the accused.
“When she left home the last time, little did her father know that she would return here as a corpse. It is not about a girl from our locality who has fallen prey to this barbaric act, it’s about the safety of women in general,” an emotional neighbour said.
The neighbour said his younger brother had tutored her while she was in school. “Because she was focussed, her father decided to sell his land and mortgage their house to arrange for her educational expenses.’’
Those present at the crematorium included mostly family members and relatives of the deceased. The electronic media was not present as the Broadcast Editors Association had asked news channels to refrain from covering the funeral.
Union Minister R.P.N. Singh, Delhi Chief Minister Sheila Dikshit, Mahabal Mishra, MP, and Delhi BJP chief Vijender Gupta were among those present.
Re: Delhi Rape Victim Dies-Express your outrage.
Hindu Op-ed...
Hindu is still the National paper.For a People’s Police from a Delhi tailwind
Prakash Singh
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AT LOGGERHEADS: The protesters need to understand that unless the functioning of the police is overhauled, the prevention, detection and investigation of crimes against women will continue to be poor. The picture shows confrontation at Rajpath on December 23, 2012.
PTI AT LOGGERHEADS: The protesters need to understand that unless the functioning of the police is overhauled, the prevention, detection and investigation of crimes against women will continue to be poor. The picture shows confrontation at Rajpath on December 23, 2012.
TOPICS
crime, law and justice police
politics government
Given the reluctance of our politicians to initiate police reforms despite judicial direction, the pressure of public opinion is perhaps the best weapon
The recent gang rape incident in Delhi would appear to have stirred the conscience of the nation. There have been demonstrations in Delhi and in several other towns of the country. The Delhi Police could not have imagined that an isolated incident of rape would snowball to such an extent and lead to a demand for the ouster of the police commissioner. The political class was also caught by surprise. Actually, what is happening in Delhi represents the cumulative dissatisfaction of people against poor governance of the country reflected, in the present context, in crimes against women.
The Delhi demonstrations bear a faint resemblance to the incidents in Tiananmen Square of China in 1989, where too the students came out into the streets against the government. The Chinese government crushed the student movement ruthlessly. Mercifully, the Government of India has used only tear gas and lathis to disperse the students. Our democracy, with all its flaws, gives much greater latitude to voices of dissent.
Three core issues
The protests have thrown up three important issues: the governance of Delhi, the safety of women and the need for improved policing. The Chief Minister wants control over the Delhi police, which is presently under the Ministry of Home Affairs. What needs to be done to give better safety and protection to women is another area of concern. Besides, what are the measures that need to be taken to revamp and restructure the police so that their performance meets the expectations of the people?
On September 22, 2006, the Supreme Court of India had given certain directions in view of the “urgent need for preservation and strengthening of Rule of Law.” It prescribed the setting up of three institutions in the states: a State Security Commission with a view to insulating police from extraneous pressures; a Police Establishment Board to give autonomy to the police hierarchy in matters of transfers and postings of junior officers; and a Police Complaints Authority to look into complaints of serious misconduct against policemen. The court also prescribed a procedure to ensure transparency in the selection of the Director General of Police and gave him a minimum tenure of two years. Officers performing operational duties in the field were also given a tenure of two years. The court further ordered that investigation and the law and order functions of the police should be separated to improve the quality of investigations. The Thomas Committee, which was set up to monitor the implementation of the court’s directions expressed its “dismay over the total indifference to the issue of reforms in the functioning of police being exhibited by the States.”
The States are reluctant to implement the Supreme Court’s directions because it would mean the executive losing their grip over the police, which they consider vital for their political survival. The Delhi Police Bill has yet to be given final shape. Actually, the expectation was that the Government of India would pass what would be a model Police Bill for Delhi and that the same would, with minor adjustments, be adopted by the other States. However, that did not happen. The Delhi Administration, it appears, is not in favour of giving police the kind of autonomy visualised by the apex court. The executive has become so used to lording it over the police that it cannot think of a situation where the police would have autonomy in taking important law and order decisions. It is like a drug addict being asked to give up narcotics.
We need police reforms not for the glory of the police but to ensure that the police uphold the rule of law and the Constitution of the country. At present, they are more bothered/concerned about the wishes and expectations of the political bosses, right or wrong, lawful or unlawful, rather than acting in the larger interests of society. The reductio ad absurdum of the situation is there for anyone to see. The police are not trusted and they do not inspire confidence.
It also needs to be emphasised that police reforms are absolutely essential if India is to emerge as a great power. Economic progress cannot be sustained if we are not able create a safe and secure environment. The democratic structure may also crumble if the police continue to feel inhibited in taking action against criminals, some of whom are entering the portals of democracy.
Apart from the reforms mandated by the Supreme Court, a whole range of other measures are also called for to improve the functioning of the police. There must be substantial augmentation in their strength, apart from filling up the existing nearly 4.20 lakh vacancies; infrastructure at police stations must improve in terms of vehicles, communications, equipment and forensic support; housing facilities should be better, and working hours need to be prescribed.
It is indeed one of the ironies of modern India that while we are preparing for a mission to the moon, and there has been: a revolution in information technology; vast improvements in rail and road networks across the country; a quantum leap in nuclear science, and India becoming one of the fastest growing economies, we are still — more than 65 years after independence — saddled with a colonial police with a feudal mindset. There are more than 20,000 police stations and posts across the length and breadth of the country, and their working impinges on the life of the common man from Srinagar to Kanyakumari and from Ahmedabad to Aizwal. It is a sad commentary on our Republic that we have not been able to transform the police into an instrument of service to the people.
Internal security
Looking at the larger picture, we need a motivated and effective police force to deal with the greatest internal security challenges confronting the country. These challenges are: the threat of international terrorism, the Maoist insurgency, and the continuing problems in the north-east and in Jammu & Kashmir. If we are to tackle these problems effectively, there is no getting away from having a professional police force, well trained and equipped, and committed to upholding the unity and integrity of the country. The police are the first responders in the event of any terrorist attack or Maoist violence, and they are also the backbone of our intelligence and investigation agencies.
Corruption has become a huge problem in the country. The responses to Anna Hazare’s agitation showed how disgusted and fed up people are. The anti-corruption and vigilance organisations at the State level and the Central Bureau of Investigation at the Central level are manned largely by police officers. Hence the further need to cleanse and reform the police.
Looking at the reluctance of the political class, how do we push forward the agenda of police reforms? The pressure of public opinion is perhaps the surest weapon. The protesters need to understand that unless the functioning of the police is overhauled, the prevention, detection and investigation of crimes against women would continue to be poor. National Crime Records Bureau statistics show that there has been a steady increase in crimes against women: 1,64,765 cases in 2006, 1,85,312 in 2007, 1,95,856 in 2008, 2,03,804 in 2009 and 2,13,585 in 2010. Out of these, in 2010 alone, there were 22,172 incidents of rape, the largest number being recorded in Madhya Pradesh. Public opinion must mobilise on the issue of police reforms. The media must also lend support to the campaign. Non-governmental organisations should also pitch in. The judiciary should wield the whip against defiant States. The Central Government should mount pressure on the States to accelerate the process of reforms in the police.
The future of India, it may be said without any exaggeration, is linked to the fate of police reforms in the country. Seen from all angles — the security of the common man, safety of women, survival of democracy, maintaining the trajectory of economic progress, and dealing with corruption or combating the major threats confronting the country – we have to have a reformed, restructured and revitalised police force, a People’s Police in place of the present Ruler’s Police.
(Prakash Singh, a recipient of the Padma Shri, has been campaigning for police reforms.)
Re: Delhi Rape Victim Dies-Express your outrage.
http://jezebel.com/5972046/extremely-gr ... rape-cases
Extremely Gross ‘Two-Finger Test’ in India Still Apparently Counts as Admissible Evidence in Rape Cases
Extremely Gross ‘Two-Finger Test’ in India Still Apparently Counts as Admissible Evidence in Rape Cases
India's grand rape-prevention scheme of outing and public shaming rapists before turning them over to angry vigilantes admittedly has some kinks that still need to be ironed out. For starters, it sounds like a plan concocted by a tyrannical sheriff in an Old West boomtown who's been too long in his cups. It also elides some of the more pernicious victim-blaming that still plagues rape investigations in rural India, where the so-called "two-finger test" is still a totally legit (as in, it serves as admissible evidence in a court of law) way to investigate rape.
On Sunday, Human Rights Watch released a report that highlights the many ways in which police and government officials in India have failed to take rape seriously. The "two-finger test," whereby, explains the Wall Street Journal, a doctor "inserts two fingers into a women's vagina to determine its laxity and whether the hymen is broken, signaling previous sexual activity," appears in Indian jurisprudence textbooks and is admissible as evidence in court in cases of rape.
That the test is still acceptable courtroom evidence, says the Human Rights Watch, is an extremely unfortunate fact because it helps further the belief that rape survivors are "loose women." It also only serves to further emphasize how drastically the culture of rape prevention and prosecution in India needs to change. In the wake of a brutal (and now deadly) gang rape in New Delhi, some of India's public officials have been intensely criticized for their seemingly lax attitudes towards rape, which some politicians seem to actually regard as consensual sex. The case of the 23-year-old woman who died Saturday from injuries sustained on Dec. 16 when she was raped and beaten with iron rods on a bus in New Delhi has sparked country-wide outrage at India's treatment of rape and rape victims.
Though Indian authorities, after emerging from a two-week-long torpor of seeming indecision, have responded with righteous ferocity by promising to charge six men with murder (which carries the death penalty), human rights critics say that India's rape woes (of the 24,206 rape cases in India in 2011, only about a quarter resulted in the convictions of alleged rapists) cannot be so easily glossed over. Said Meenakshi Ganguly, South Asia director at Human Rights Watch,For politicians, supporting the death penalty is an easy but ineffectual way out. It is much harder, but more effective, to revamp the response of police, doctors, forensic specialists, prosecutors, and judges to sexual violence. Survivors deserve an effective, coordinated response to sexual assault.Until lawmakers and law enforcement officials do the hard but necessary work of overhauling the way sexual assault is both investigated and perceived in India, an endemic culture of victim-blaming will frustrate the pursuit of real justice — for victims and rapists alike — in rape cases.
Re: Delhi Rape Victim Dies-Express your outrage.
Politicians can never be controller of police force... it has to be as autonomous as possible with a structure of checks and balances from the political force.
Last edited by SaiK on 31 Dec 2012 02:33, edited 1 time in total.
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brihaspati
- BRF Oldie
- Posts: 12410
- Joined: 19 Nov 2008 03:25
Re: Delhi Rape Victim Dies-Express your outrage.
Who the h*** are these kings, queens, and princes and princesses to claim the presence at the cremation, when the nation is excluded? Is India a feudal monarchy that single individual ruling crowns and tiaras promise that "jsutice" will be done? Who gave them the right to make such promises? What prevented them from making such promises and carrying them out before- if they had such absolute power to do so?
What criminal mindset and complete arrogant shamelessness makes all the "leaders" mentioned attend the cremation after putting up full state coercive machinery to isolate the nation from the family in the name of privacy and sececy? This gets the goat. Curse on you. All the intense agonzing hatred that I have for all your party's protection of cher-char/dupatta-pulling/lifting/abductions/rape/molestations that I have witnessed from the age of 10, because you want such muscle to counter muscles of other parties and to coerce the commons - let that lead you to the end you all deserve.
All the political parties in India, the longer they have existed - the more, they are primarily responsible for nurturing violence agains women. Sometimes in the name of culture, sometimes in the name of excuses of lack of development and education and thousands of years of imagined deprivation, sometimes on the excuse "you also need such guys - you know, no party can run only on goodie boys", "you have to allow those little concessions - they will use abusive sexually loaded words, they will grope and maybe do a littlle fingering or ch**", "because these are the guys who help us control these har**** junta, who don't remember their benfactors/bosses". And these guys then gather more of the same and are rewarded for the numbers.
May you all suffer the most horrible ends that all of you deserve.
What criminal mindset and complete arrogant shamelessness makes all the "leaders" mentioned attend the cremation after putting up full state coercive machinery to isolate the nation from the family in the name of privacy and sececy? This gets the goat. Curse on you. All the intense agonzing hatred that I have for all your party's protection of cher-char/dupatta-pulling/lifting/abductions/rape/molestations that I have witnessed from the age of 10, because you want such muscle to counter muscles of other parties and to coerce the commons - let that lead you to the end you all deserve.
All the political parties in India, the longer they have existed - the more, they are primarily responsible for nurturing violence agains women. Sometimes in the name of culture, sometimes in the name of excuses of lack of development and education and thousands of years of imagined deprivation, sometimes on the excuse "you also need such guys - you know, no party can run only on goodie boys", "you have to allow those little concessions - they will use abusive sexually loaded words, they will grope and maybe do a littlle fingering or ch**", "because these are the guys who help us control these har**** junta, who don't remember their benfactors/bosses". And these guys then gather more of the same and are rewarded for the numbers.
May you all suffer the most horrible ends that all of you deserve.
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RamaY
- BRF Oldie
- Posts: 17249
- Joined: 10 Aug 2006 21:11
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Re: Delhi Rape Victim Dies-Express your outrage.
Bji
Time for MahaPratyangira.
Time for MahaPratyangira.
Re: Delhi Rape Victim Dies-Express your outrage.
Ramana ji,ramana wrote:Lilo< Your twitter feed on End Violence on Woman is doing a good job.
Now we need a web page/blog that gathers the information.
Agree that the twitter feed is becoming more or less stable - though iam still required to delete some false positives but that can be eventually reduced using better identifiers and filtering in the RSS feed side.
The content from RSS feed is automatically posted as Facebook and Google+ updates.
Facebook profile: http://www.facebook.com/EndViolenceonWomen
Twitter Profile: http://twitter.com/Violenceonwomen
Apart from above iam trying to automatically append more info into the tweets like
a)news source (succeded in this)
b)location - i.e identification of State,District,Town/City etc. , stuggling with this but working on a few ideas that are in hand.
in the meantime a full text feed generator (which contains the whole text of the currently tweeted links) can be theoretically set up and linked to a blog - i will work on this tomorrow and lets see how it turns out.
And guys , those good with regex etc please have a look at the expressions used in filtering and give help and suggestions on ways of isolating more useful info from the sources. One look and you can see the brute force amateurish approach to regex
. stable feed - http://pipes.yahoo.com/maramara/violenceonwomeninindia
testing feed - http://pipes.yahoo.com/maramara/violenc ... iatesting1
Re: Delhi Rape Victim Dies-Express your outrage.
RSS feeds get only the english stuff. We need to find away to get the news from varnacular press. may be few of us need to put as a reply to twitter Id that Lilo created.
Re: Delhi Rape Victim Dies-Express your outrage.
Muppala ji ,
check these feeds from oneindia http://rss.oneindia.in/
They have from Telugu,Tamil,Kannada,hindi,gujarati,bangla etc. But currently we dont have a collection of "vernacular words" to parse these sources. But its doable.
check these feeds from oneindia http://rss.oneindia.in/
They have from Telugu,Tamil,Kannada,hindi,gujarati,bangla etc. But currently we dont have a collection of "vernacular words" to parse these sources. But its doable.
Re: Delhi Rape Victim Dies-Express your outrage.
Good job with the twitter page. Reading the tweets shows how much violence there is, just within the past day. One tweet was interesting: Berhampore police on a drive to sensitize people to rape laws. Looks like some police stations are being pro-active about reducing eve-teasing/harassment in their jurisdiction (there must be more policemen like this all over India). Collecting all the rape/murder/eve-teasing news in one place gives the overall picture at a glance.Lilo wrote:
They have from Telugu,Tamil,Kannada,hindi,gujarati,bangla etc. But currently we dont have a collection of "vernacular words" to parse these sources. But its doable.
Re: Delhi Rape Victim Dies-Express your outrage.
A substantial number of us went through similar economic situation before we are successful or not so successful or failures. It is pretty sad and depressive reading this article.
‘Don’t take my daughter away’, cried the grief-stricken mother
‘Don’t take my daughter away’, cried the grief-stricken mother
“Meri bachchi ko mere paas rehne do, usey mujhse door mat karo (don’t take my daughter away from me, let her remain with me)” was the cry of the distraught mother as the body of her young daughter was being taken to the crematorium.
The mother of the 23-year-old gang-raped woman fainted several times in grief after the body was brought to their family home in Mahavir Enclave in southwest Delhi early Sunday morning. The mother was taken to Deen Dayal Upadhyay Hospital, where her condition is stated to be stable.
“As soon as the body was taken away for cremation, the mother collapsed,” Vimla, a neighbour, told IANS.
The body of the young woman, who became the focus of countrywide protests and prayers, was flown in from Singapore at 3.30 a.m. and taken to the family home at 4.25 a.m. It was kept there for about two hours before being taken to the crematorium in Dwarka Sector 19.
The mother was sobbing inconsolably over the body and fainted several times, said neighbours.
“When the body was being put in an ambulance to be taken to the crematorium at around 6.15 a.m., the mother pleaded, ‘Don’t touch my daughter’s body’, and fainted,” said a next-door neighbour. Family members and friends sprinkled water on her face to bring her back to consciousness.
“I don’t want to let my daughter go alone, please let her remain with me,” the grief-stricken mother pleaded again and again, before she fell unconscious.
She was taken to Deen Dayal Upadhyay Hospital after her daughter was cremated around 7.30 a.m.
According to one of the neighbours, after the Dec 16 brutal gang-rape and torture of her daughter, the mother had hardly eaten any food, and her health had deteriorated. She has already been keeping unwell for the past few months, another neighbour told IANS.
Since Saturday evening, a large number of people, mostly neighbours, were assembling outside the family’s home to condole the torture victim’s death.
The house, an unplastered brick structure, comprises two small ordinary rooms, also unplastered. The house belongs to a relative, who stays in one of the rooms while the entire family of the young woman – parents and two brothers – stay in the other room. The family room has bare minimum furnishing. They have been staying there for the past two and a half years.
Many residents of Mahavir Enclave visited the house in a steady stream since morning to offer condolences and their support to the traumatised family. But, not finding the family members at home, as they were in hospital with the mother, the neighbours got restive and began shouting slogans demanding justice for the dead woman and punishment to the rapists.
“We want Justice”, “Hang the rapists!”, “Hate liquor that turns people into beasts”, were among the slogans that the people were shouting.
When the IANS correspondent was searching for the house and asked some residents the whereabouts, the neighbors said emphatically in unison: “She is our daughter.”
“Every house in this street belongs to her,” said Vimla.
According to Vimla, the family of the dead woman was “very poor”.
The parents had sold a plot of land nearby as well as land in their village in Ballia district of eastern Uttar Pradesh to fund their daughter’s education.
“Now her elder brother, who is preparing for his engineering entrance exams, has no hope to continue his studies. The family had depended on her future career to see them out of their poverty,” Vimla told IANS.
Ranvir Sirohi, another resident of Mahavir Enclave, told IANS that the victim’s father is a loader at the Delhi airport and has been “saving every penny to make his daughter a doctor”.
In order to see the dream fulfilled, the family did not care to shift to better accommodation, he said.
Now the dream lies shattered
Re: Delhi Rape Victim Dies-Express your outrage.
Delhi gangrape victim could have been saved, decision to fly her to Singapore came late: Family - India Today
This is the house of BraveHeart, then how come Arundhathi Roy, Kancha Ilaiah and BBC journos, say the movement is unjustified, because she is from an affluent middle class family. I really wonder, weather they are really humans or some demonic spirits with bodies.
Regarding her house, its a small 2-room house, where landlord relative occupies one room and all the rest of family of 5 members stay in another room.
This is the house of BraveHeart, then how come Arundhathi Roy, Kancha Ilaiah and BBC journos, say the movement is unjustified, because she is from an affluent middle class family. I really wonder, weather they are really humans or some demonic spirits with bodies.
Regarding her house, its a small 2-room house, where landlord relative occupies one room and all the rest of family of 5 members stay in another room.
Re: Delhi Rape Victim Dies-Express your outrage.
All of them are monsters pretending to be do gooders.
Truly Shani is ruling an ripping the masks of respectability for these rogues.
Truly Shani is ruling an ripping the masks of respectability for these rogues.
Re: Delhi Rape Victim Dies-Express your outrage.
x-posting 2 posts from under the Burkha
rahulm
Post subject: Re: Demonstrations and Police Brutality in Delhi
PostPosted: 29 Dec 2012 11:30 am
Online
BRFite
Joined: 19 Jun 2000 06:01 am
Posts: 349
I feel absolutely gutted.
Hari Sheldon's one liner & VKS Singh's comments have summarised the situation very well.
In separate threads over a period of time TheoFidel or was it Bji? ( will have to check) has also highlighted the state of many women in this country.
The issues come down to a largely male dominated society, embedded disrespect and even absolute contempt for women, corruption in the police and ineffective (delayed is denied) law and order i.e social, political and legal layers.
Women are trained by households to become faithful sheep/cattle to serve father, brother, husbands and sons and any combination thereof over their lifetime. They spend their entire life seeking permission from one or many of the males in her family circle. This is proudly proclaimed to be our "Sanskriti" by the men and women are brainwashed enough to parrot this line. They are expected to and willingly accept the sole responsibility (Stockholm syndrome perhaps) of upholding this "sanskriti" at their very own self sacrificial altar of self respect and emancipation while the male goes scot free - e.g peeing (i.e exposing) himself in public places to wearing anything they want including stripped chaddis with all jewels in full public view while the women (50%) of our population clench their thighs and grit their teeth (due to lack of public conveniences) and wear full length clothes in the heat to protect their modesty and uphold this "Sanskriti"
When women are the victims of domestic violence/sexual abuse mostly they are encouraged firstly by family and then by others close to her to keep quiet - because her individuality, respect and justice are second somehow to the "name" of the family, clan, village in society. These are the "high" moral standards we have set for ourselves.
In the instances where the girl/family choose to go to the police they are humiliated & advised to settle and the girl made to feel like a whore/slut. This from a police force who is supposed to protect and serve and they do - just not the people who they are supposed to but their political masters.
When the girl is able to brave all of this and file an FIR, corruption will likely work against her with the police.
The structurally flawed legal system will add more indignity by dragging the case and most likely vanquish what remains of the girls self respect and pride by subversion of justice through corruption.
Women have been made and are fulfilling the role of being the objects for the male. It's the "Purush rajneeti" which is deeply ingrained in our society.
Any girl who steps outside this boundary is considered fair game. This is no different to the UPA's behaviour - they impose 144 to subjugate the public who steps out of line - the male dominated society will subject the women who challenge the status quo by stripping away firstly through "eve-teasing',then by violence and finally through rape to utter humiliation and to set an example for & a warning to others to not step out of line.
A French volunteer worker girl on a student assignment was humiliated in front of the whole office staff including I & bought to tears by a high priest of a very well established and highly regarded religious NGO where I was serving. Her crime - wearing a sleeveless T-Shirt. What lessons in spirituality, humanity etc can one expect from this Sri Sri? Is not this Sri Sri supposed to be above all and equanimous?
The poor girl later sobbing said to me that she has extensively travelled the world and worked in various NGO's but for the first time in her life she was judged in public and then made to feel like a whore.
You see she had stepped out of line and Sri Sri was upholding the high morals standards for the sake of the entire society and she had to be punished. Back in your box and never you dare to come out - that was the message.
He went a step further and never spoke or interacted with this poor girl for the rest of her 6 month internship. Take that - you deserve it - the man of God said.
And the public prostrates at the feet of this worthy. Comical or tragic?
All of this is largely tacitly accepted and even condoned by the silent majority of society as just justice and the way things are are. This has become so deeply ingrained that it resides in the individual sub-conscious and therefore & thence becomes a part of the social fabric. Over a period of time it becomes our identity i.e "sanskriti".
We specialise in majoring in minor things. The ship carrying 50% of our population is burning and we want to re-arrange the chairs on the deck.
At a national collective conscience we are more concerned with (false) morality (playboy bunnies should wear decent clothing) than with justice, governance, dowry and female infanticide. We will gladly hob nob with & respect corrupt people - even participate in this corruption but get on our high horse and ostracise a girl for wearing a mini skirt.
Collective hypocrisy. Tragic or a comedy? Talk about misplaced priorities.
India cannot be shinning just because its trial balance and general ledger look good.
I R2I'd and back packed through India for 2.5 years until October 2012 after which sadly I could not take it anymore and returned overseas. I refused to pay bribes for what is my right (I have documented some of my run ins in the Indian police thread) and been advised to (even by some BRF'ites) to comply, threatened by police, humiliated in public because I would not and did pay Rs. 50 for an FIR, Rs. 500 for a Police Clearance Certificate or Rs. 5,000 to register a property. These are real numbers.
People who participate (both givers and takers) are all the Jai Chands of our society who rip the social and legal fabric of this country to shreds because they are unable in their individual & collective myopia to look beyond their own narrow and parochial interests and then expect the system to work for them when they are in trouble. Running with the hares and hunting with the hounds leads to personal disaster somewhere down the line.
How many BRF'ities who talk against corruption on this forum have never paid a bribe - I wonder?
I supped with the high and mighty in public and private life. I also toured the remote villages of UP and Bihar for 10 months and met the men and women, rich, poor & destitute.
In all my interactions with government services, many private services and throughout my tour over 2.5 years through 4 corners of our country, at every opportunity - from being humiliated in public offices, assaulted by a goon in a train (in full view of the RPF) because I would not him pay him Rs. 20 for a seat in the general compartment, to being denied entry in hotels in Varanasi and Goa because I was "Indian", to being ignored in TAJ - Hyderabad (because I was wearing a dhoti the list goes on and on) I tried to console myself by telling myself that India is shinning.
In the end, after all of my experiences I was unable to re-concile this broad brush slogan at the coal face of my personal experiences when I stepped outside the high society, English speaking (with terrible false accents) crowd eating fake foreign food at real foreign prices.
The economic, social and physical state of women in the villages of UP, Bihar and even Maharashtra brought me down to earth very quickly. I saw this up close (I was involved in primary health care and education in remote villages approximately 12 months) and I was quite shocked. This deserves another thread.
What shocked me even more was the ingrained attitudes of men towards women even in our uber RAIE class and the uber RAIE women who behave like sheep. I did scratch the surface here and its not very nice in there including to my dismay among the CGO's and senior members of our armed forces.
People mostly receive a ritualistic (not even religious) education in our country. Everyone including goons, murderers & rapists without exception know to remove shoes when going into temples, where feet should not be pointed, which gods should be circumambulated clockwise and which only 3/4 clockwise. This is guaranteed across the population.
I was shocked at the lewd comments and harassment girls from a very young age suffer in Varanasi from boys (from "good" families) in colleges, buses, offices and roads. These are not exceptions. This is the norm.
Some of these boys will make it to the police, some will become judges and some lawyers and some even law makers. It would be naive to expect anything good will come out and because of them.\
Women of this country will have to own, lead and work for their own emancipation. It would be unwise for the women of this country (for their own good I should add) to leave such important and indeed their very life and death matters in the hands of the male of this country.
The Delhi gang rape girl went out to see a movie and was returning home in a bus. For this simple joy of life she was subjected to total humiliation, violence and had to die. No matter what our history, "sanskriti" and economic balance sheet if a young girl has to be brutally gang raped & then die for undertaking such a simple joy of life something is terribly wrong.
Somebody suggested earlier to hang the rapists. OK. Please also hang the police who let that bus on the road for a small hafta.At the very least slap a criminal case against him ( I believe corruption is a criminal offence in our country) For a selfish personal pecuniary gain of the police, a girl had to suffer the indignity of a brutal gang rape and pay with her life. I say hang this police wala first and then the rest.
For that we need good governance and that is another topic. But as somebody said earlier and I paraphrase - "Even God will not help ch***iyas" who elect such governance.
RIP whatever your name is. I cry for you.
Last edited by rahulm on 29 Dec 2012 12:18 pm, edited 2 times in total.
Re: Delhi Rape Victim Dies-Express your outrage.
Lilo, As next step think of somehow mapping them per state for a start and then district level.
Want to have some IT bigwigs look at this.
Want to have some IT bigwigs look at this.
Re: Delhi Rape Victim Dies-Express your outrage.
rahulm
Post subject: Re: Demonstrations and Police Brutality in Delhi
PostPosted: 30 Dec 2012 11:45 pm
Online
BRFite
Joined: 19 Jun 2000 06:01 am
Posts: 350
There are plenty of existing laws. I wonder how heaping more laws, however well intended on top of a tottering legal system whose foundations are pretty much on its last legs weakened by nepotism, sycophancy & subverted by self serving corrupt gentry with the tacit approval and some times active participation of the population is going to yield any benefit.
So lets have a fast track court - a parallel system for to try rape cases - Is this really going to fix the nepotism, sycophancy and subversion? The delivery of injustice will be quicker but maybe that's merciful too.
The problem in this unfortunate lady's case is its high profile - Rape is brutal. This was extra horrific in its brutality.
Girls are getting raped with alarming frequency but that has never really been a problem so far. Has it? The girl gets kidnapped for a period of time, gets raped and walks back into society. This is been a threshold low enough for all in society to look the other way. Response has been to take enough preventative measures in the form of avoiding putting oneself and ones family in situations of danger.
This one exceeded the threshold. That is the problem.
Where is the Bollwood actor who drove and killed a few people sleeping on the pavement in his nice big car? Where is he now, how many movies has he made since and how many have been hits? BTW, does any know or care about about the bereaved family. Where & how are they now?
Or the illustrious torch bearers of our great Police and IAS linked in a previous post by some one who were convicted of rapes? Where are they now?
The police have a "hafta diary" and they can openly talk about it without fear of reprisal from the public and their bosses?
This is good enough for ISO 9000 certification. Maybe, they should seek it! Their compliance with clause 7.5.3 is amazing - I have rrarely seen this this level of robustness in the Corporate world. I have written so many NC's against this clause. If only I had known I would have made 1 phone call to the Delhi Police.
Like Harvard (was it?) sent a delegation to study the 6 Sigma levels attained by the famed dabbahawala's of Mumbai, ISO and corporates should seek professional advice from the Delhi Police on systems for traceability. Why let perfectly good knowledge go waste?
Having more women in the police is not going to help - I don't think. Omerta takes care of that. Once in tent you piss outside if you know whats good for you. Instead of male police inflicting brutality it will become female police inflicting the lath and telling girls to go home, don't venture out late at night, aurto ki maryada samjo", apni izzat sambhalo, jaldi shaadi kar lo etc etc Does it make it better and more importantly does it make it right because it comes from a woman police officer?
Instead of men now the women police will be co-opted into the gender politics to maintain the existing harmony and status quo. Not unlike the principle of the Brit's co-opting Indian's into civil service to main the Empire's supremacy. That was economic politics.
India is special where 2 systems systems run in parallel (legal & social norms) and whenever the 2 clash usually the social systems win out or there is an attempt by people and therefore society to undermine the legal system. Examples of this are "In our family girls don't ask for property rights" a blatant violation of the rights of the girl.
There is no shame associated with perpetrators of rape. Privately many of his family incuding females will condone the perp. with dialogues like - "Mard hai - abh kya kre", - "Ladki ki jaat to sambhal ke rehna chahiye" etc etc.
I had one mother tell me in rural UP - "Sand (bulls) to sand he rahenge, hume hamiri gayo (cows - i.e girls) ko sambhal ke rakhna chahiye.
My parents brought me up to respect girls without question. Were my parents special? Does this not happen any more?
This girl echoed my thoughts:
"His 18-year-old daughter Naina, who grew up in Australia, said law changes had to be accompanied by cultural change. ''There's all these [Hindu] goddesses but if we seriously can't respect what we've got in front of us … what's the point?'
Read more: http://www.smh.com.au/world/silence-in- ... z2Ga0PV040
"
Well said that one.
So we have stronger laws but again and quoting from the newspaper above "And there is pressure for India's justice system, sometimes so slow-moving as to be almost irrelevant, to be fast-tracked for sex cases"
legal reform is necessary and must be carried out but there is something terribly wrong with society.
By accident once I overheard an Indian say out quite loudly at North Sydney station "Bh*nch* kya maal hai, iski to band bajani hai" to a girl in a mini skirt. I was simply stunned. He did not know I was behind him.
Another - a India friend of mine who works in a major International Bank in the city was taking a lunch break and sitting on a bench in Hyde Park when a passing Sardar said to her "Chammakchallo - chalti kya? This lady was simply stunned.
Another time, out of courtesy, I took a bunch of our IT finest and brightest on a 457 class visa, on assignment to a Bank in Sydney, to Bondi beach and I was shocked by the way they went berserk with their stares and camera's ogling at the fine skimpily dressed aussie girls. It was so obvious that I was afraid we might either get lynched or have the police upon us so I hastily pulled them aside and gave them a 60 second lesson on sensitivity and manners -" look but don't stare" is the mantra here. They did not want to listen to me.
The fine gents know how to stare shamelessly and will gladly out stare anyone. They are also great DOO's
I added another D to make it DDOO (Drooling DOO's) Ha.
Looks like our worthies want to start an export business in moral degradation and objectification of women,
A young student medical intern in Mangalore writes to me several times a day lamenting the fact that he is bored, wants to travel but can;t because in her words "You know how it is in India - safe nahi hai" So they must travel in groups.
In my time in Delhi I personally used to carry a can of capsicum spray and bought for and taught many girls in Varanasi and Delhi to use this device.
The mental and social prison most of our women live in!Things the Indian nari across all ages and all classes will tell you if only one stops staring, drooling at her from every orifice, listen and most importantly if you are able to infuse in her the confidence that she will absolutely not be judged by you no matter what she reveals to you.
No Sir's there is something terribly wrong.
It is a terrible thing to be illiterate, poor, dalit and a woman in our society - legally everything is fine - available on paper - try getting it in practice. Tough luck and you will most certainly be verbally abused, probably be beaten, maybe disowned but almost certainly be subject to spousal rape.
Our legal systems and social mores are so terribly out of alignment that either we wait it out for society to transform itself - a process that will take an indeterminate amount of time and will claim more victims until we emerge the other side of the dark tunnel. If we we want individual behavioural and therefore societal transformation quickly then we need absolutely zero tolerance to verbal and physical sexual abuse - something like the Singapore model of governance.
Universally, I have seen girls in Gujarat, Goa and Sikkhim to feel much safer. Infact, in Vadodara, Ahmedabad grils get a much better deal. They roam around at late night's for pav bhaji with extra butter and top it up with ice cream at Dairy Den and Havmor without any problems and feel safe and secure. The legal system is as good as or as bad as anywhere else in India. What is different? Peoples and therefore society's attitudes maketh the difference here.
Indian's had to fight for independence - the Brit's did not give it to us, dalits had to have a leader from within to secure their fundamental rights for them - the "others" did not give it to them.
While being an integral part of society, sadly, it appears women are distinct enough that they will have to have a leader emerge and to fight for and secure rights the patriarchal society is not going to give it to them.
I suspect, unfortunately this too will die down like the Hazare and other big campaigns. I hope I am wrong.
Post subject: Re: Demonstrations and Police Brutality in Delhi
PostPosted: 30 Dec 2012 11:45 pm
Online
BRFite
Joined: 19 Jun 2000 06:01 am
Posts: 350
There are plenty of existing laws. I wonder how heaping more laws, however well intended on top of a tottering legal system whose foundations are pretty much on its last legs weakened by nepotism, sycophancy & subverted by self serving corrupt gentry with the tacit approval and some times active participation of the population is going to yield any benefit.
So lets have a fast track court - a parallel system for to try rape cases - Is this really going to fix the nepotism, sycophancy and subversion? The delivery of injustice will be quicker but maybe that's merciful too.
The problem in this unfortunate lady's case is its high profile - Rape is brutal. This was extra horrific in its brutality.
Girls are getting raped with alarming frequency but that has never really been a problem so far. Has it? The girl gets kidnapped for a period of time, gets raped and walks back into society. This is been a threshold low enough for all in society to look the other way. Response has been to take enough preventative measures in the form of avoiding putting oneself and ones family in situations of danger.
This one exceeded the threshold. That is the problem.
Where is the Bollwood actor who drove and killed a few people sleeping on the pavement in his nice big car? Where is he now, how many movies has he made since and how many have been hits? BTW, does any know or care about about the bereaved family. Where & how are they now?
Or the illustrious torch bearers of our great Police and IAS linked in a previous post by some one who were convicted of rapes? Where are they now?
The police have a "hafta diary" and they can openly talk about it without fear of reprisal from the public and their bosses?
This is good enough for ISO 9000 certification. Maybe, they should seek it! Their compliance with clause 7.5.3 is amazing - I have rrarely seen this this level of robustness in the Corporate world. I have written so many NC's against this clause. If only I had known I would have made 1 phone call to the Delhi Police.Like Harvard (was it?) sent a delegation to study the 6 Sigma levels attained by the famed dabbahawala's of Mumbai, ISO and corporates should seek professional advice from the Delhi Police on systems for traceability. Why let perfectly good knowledge go waste?
Having more women in the police is not going to help - I don't think. Omerta takes care of that. Once in tent you piss outside if you know whats good for you. Instead of male police inflicting brutality it will become female police inflicting the lath and telling girls to go home, don't venture out late at night, aurto ki maryada samjo", apni izzat sambhalo, jaldi shaadi kar lo etc etc Does it make it better and more importantly does it make it right because it comes from a woman police officer?
Instead of men now the women police will be co-opted into the gender politics to maintain the existing harmony and status quo. Not unlike the principle of the Brit's co-opting Indian's into civil service to main the Empire's supremacy. That was economic politics.
India is special where 2 systems systems run in parallel (legal & social norms) and whenever the 2 clash usually the social systems win out or there is an attempt by people and therefore society to undermine the legal system. Examples of this are "In our family girls don't ask for property rights" a blatant violation of the rights of the girl.
There is no shame associated with perpetrators of rape. Privately many of his family incuding females will condone the perp. with dialogues like - "Mard hai - abh kya kre", - "Ladki ki jaat to sambhal ke rehna chahiye" etc etc.
I had one mother tell me in rural UP - "Sand (bulls) to sand he rahenge, hume hamiri gayo (cows - i.e girls) ko sambhal ke rakhna chahiye.
My parents brought me up to respect girls without question. Were my parents special? Does this not happen any more?
This girl echoed my thoughts:
"His 18-year-old daughter Naina, who grew up in Australia, said law changes had to be accompanied by cultural change. ''There's all these [Hindu] goddesses but if we seriously can't respect what we've got in front of us … what's the point?'
Read more: http://www.smh.com.au/world/silence-in- ... z2Ga0PV040
"
Well said that one.
So we have stronger laws but again and quoting from the newspaper above "And there is pressure for India's justice system, sometimes so slow-moving as to be almost irrelevant, to be fast-tracked for sex cases"
legal reform is necessary and must be carried out but there is something terribly wrong with society.
By accident once I overheard an Indian say out quite loudly at North Sydney station "Bh*nch* kya maal hai, iski to band bajani hai" to a girl in a mini skirt. I was simply stunned. He did not know I was behind him.
Another - a India friend of mine who works in a major International Bank in the city was taking a lunch break and sitting on a bench in Hyde Park when a passing Sardar said to her "Chammakchallo - chalti kya? This lady was simply stunned.
Another time, out of courtesy, I took a bunch of our IT finest and brightest on a 457 class visa, on assignment to a Bank in Sydney, to Bondi beach and I was shocked by the way they went berserk with their stares and camera's ogling at the fine skimpily dressed aussie girls. It was so obvious that I was afraid we might either get lynched or have the police upon us so I hastily pulled them aside and gave them a 60 second lesson on sensitivity and manners -" look but don't stare" is the mantra here. They did not want to listen to me.
The fine gents know how to stare shamelessly and will gladly out stare anyone. They are also great DOO's
I added another D to make it DDOO (Drooling DOO's) Ha.Looks like our worthies want to start an export business in moral degradation and objectification of women,
A young student medical intern in Mangalore writes to me several times a day lamenting the fact that he is bored, wants to travel but can;t because in her words "You know how it is in India - safe nahi hai" So they must travel in groups.
In my time in Delhi I personally used to carry a can of capsicum spray and bought for and taught many girls in Varanasi and Delhi to use this device.
The mental and social prison most of our women live in!Things the Indian nari across all ages and all classes will tell you if only one stops staring, drooling at her from every orifice, listen and most importantly if you are able to infuse in her the confidence that she will absolutely not be judged by you no matter what she reveals to you.
No Sir's there is something terribly wrong.
It is a terrible thing to be illiterate, poor, dalit and a woman in our society - legally everything is fine - available on paper - try getting it in practice. Tough luck and you will most certainly be verbally abused, probably be beaten, maybe disowned but almost certainly be subject to spousal rape.
Our legal systems and social mores are so terribly out of alignment that either we wait it out for society to transform itself - a process that will take an indeterminate amount of time and will claim more victims until we emerge the other side of the dark tunnel. If we we want individual behavioural and therefore societal transformation quickly then we need absolutely zero tolerance to verbal and physical sexual abuse - something like the Singapore model of governance.
Universally, I have seen girls in Gujarat, Goa and Sikkhim to feel much safer. Infact, in Vadodara, Ahmedabad grils get a much better deal. They roam around at late night's for pav bhaji with extra butter and top it up with ice cream at Dairy Den and Havmor without any problems and feel safe and secure. The legal system is as good as or as bad as anywhere else in India. What is different? Peoples and therefore society's attitudes maketh the difference here.
Indian's had to fight for independence - the Brit's did not give it to us, dalits had to have a leader from within to secure their fundamental rights for them - the "others" did not give it to them.
While being an integral part of society, sadly, it appears women are distinct enough that they will have to have a leader emerge and to fight for and secure rights the patriarchal society is not going to give it to them.
I suspect, unfortunately this too will die down like the Hazare and other big campaigns. I hope I am wrong.
Re: Delhi Rape Victim Dies-Express your outrage.
My impression is Mango man actually does not care about corruption - only about getting the job done and is prepared to bribe for this purpose. As I have alluded to before, what was the bus doing plying illegally in the first place?
Ethically and morally he see's nothing wrong in this and is currently incapable or if capable unwilling to appreciate the impact of his subversive behaviour on the society's psyche.
People who care about all this are not mango abdul.
It takes a rape of horrific brutality to wake us up. What about all the daily harassment women have to face from having their various body parts described in lewd language to what will be done to them, to being groped?
Country is becoming economically stronger but ethically worse. New money has instilled a swagger in people young and old which has brought about an air or arrogance and invincibility - I can get away with it - connections and money. I think its going to get worse not better.
In this sense we are still feudal - its not who you are its who you know. I got sick of hearing about all the connections my friends have. Name dropping is a prerequisite in any conversation.
So we are clan -ish. We take care of our own and own only - family, friends and then our circle in that order.
Therefore, women have to organise themselves and form a power group to have their interests taken care of. The subservience of women is like a narcotic to the male - compliance by the woman brings several benefits to the male - fat chance the males are going to give it up easily. Why would they? Rarely in history has power been ever divested peacefully.
Deep down, the patriarchal society ensconced in their freedom is telling women that since they can't be given the bread of respect they can therefore eat the cake of subservience, servility & service.
Value systems are topsy turvy.
This too will be forgotten I am afraid.
Ethically and morally he see's nothing wrong in this and is currently incapable or if capable unwilling to appreciate the impact of his subversive behaviour on the society's psyche.
People who care about all this are not mango abdul.
It takes a rape of horrific brutality to wake us up. What about all the daily harassment women have to face from having their various body parts described in lewd language to what will be done to them, to being groped?
Country is becoming economically stronger but ethically worse. New money has instilled a swagger in people young and old which has brought about an air or arrogance and invincibility - I can get away with it - connections and money. I think its going to get worse not better.
In this sense we are still feudal - its not who you are its who you know. I got sick of hearing about all the connections my friends have. Name dropping is a prerequisite in any conversation.
So we are clan -ish. We take care of our own and own only - family, friends and then our circle in that order.
Therefore, women have to organise themselves and form a power group to have their interests taken care of. The subservience of women is like a narcotic to the male - compliance by the woman brings several benefits to the male - fat chance the males are going to give it up easily. Why would they? Rarely in history has power been ever divested peacefully.
Deep down, the patriarchal society ensconced in their freedom is telling women that since they can't be given the bread of respect they can therefore eat the cake of subservience, servility & service.
Value systems are topsy turvy.
This too will be forgotten I am afraid.
Re: Delhi Rape Victim Dies-Express your outrage.
Just felt this ~one hour back, mango man cares about one thing and one thing alone: survival.rahulm wrote:My impression is Mango man actually does not care about corruption - only about getting the job done and is prepared to bribe for this purpose.
Ethically and morally he see's nothing wrong in this and is currently incapable or if capable unwilling to appreciate the impact of his subversive behaviour on the society's psyche.
Value systems are topsy turvy.
People who care about all this are not mango abdul.
For survival they don't want to change things, instead mangoman prefers avoiding snake in life's snakes and ladder.
Re: Delhi Rape Victim Dies-Express your outrage.
Was told that murder charges will be difficult to prove. Best bet is attempted murder.
Reason is tough to prove there was intention to kill.
Then there is the question of hospital cleanliness which could have brought on the infection
Add to that the UPA govt decision to shift the victim in an unstable condition on advise of nameless spooks.
All these could have contributed to her death.
Even third rate lawyer will beat these charges.
So INC did succeed.
Reason is tough to prove there was intention to kill.
Then there is the question of hospital cleanliness which could have brought on the infection
Add to that the UPA govt decision to shift the victim in an unstable condition on advise of nameless spooks.
All these could have contributed to her death.
Even third rate lawyer will beat these charges.
So INC did succeed.
Re: Delhi Rape Victim Dies-Express your outrage.
X-posted...
Sushupti wrote:Safdarjung doctors say flying "brain-dead" rape victim to S'pore not medical decision. Order came from govt
Doctors question move to shift Delhi gang-rape victim to Singapore
http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/indi ... 814404.cms
Re: Delhi Rape Victim Dies-Express your outrage.
I think its in the power of the DP commissioner to suspend the cops who took hafta from that bus owner to allow the bus to ply.
Has he done that?
Oh that sends wrong message to the beat cops to stop recording hafta.
Has he done that?
Oh that sends wrong message to the beat cops to stop recording hafta.
Re: Delhi Rape Victim Dies-Express your outrage.
https://twitter.com/shalini_mishtie/sta ... 9300330496
The minor accussed, who seems to have caused the most damage to the poor girl, and was the most brutal of the assailants, was known as Raju, from Baduan, UP.
As it turns out his real name is Md. Afroz.
...
The minor accussed, who seems to have caused the most damage to the poor girl, and was the most brutal of the assailants, was known as Raju, from Baduan, UP.
As it turns out his real name is Md. Afroz.
...
Re: Delhi Rape Victim Dies-Express your outrage.
Army cancels all New year parties
Great job General Bikram Singh!!!
Army cancels new year parties in memory of the victim
Great job General Bikram Singh!!!
Army cancels new year parties in memory of the victim
Re: Delhi Rape Victim Dies-Express your outrage.
Lets not forget, being all of them Non Indians , its is none of their concern. It is the duty of Indians to take care of their own and punish these Dusht .kmkraoind wrote:[
This is the house of BraveHeart, then how come Arundhathi Roy, Kancha Ilaiah and BBC journos, say the movement is unjustified, because she is from an affluent middle class family. I really wonder, weather they are really humans or some demonic spirits with bodies.
Regarding her house, its a small 2-room house, where landlord relative occupies one room and all the rest of family of 5 members stay in another room.
Re: Delhi Rape Victim Dies-Express your outrage.
But the foundation of that swagger is wrong, I have been saying this often. More money was sought to strengthen a flawed structure. So along with the structure the flaw also got strengthened.rahulm wrote:Country is becoming economically stronger but ethically worse. New money has instilled a swagger in people young and old which has brought about an air or arrogance and invincibility - I can get away with it - connections and money. I think its going to get worse not better.
Re: Delhi Rape Victim Dies-Express your outrage.
VikramS wrote:https://twitter.com/shalini_mishtie/sta ... 9300330496
The minor accussed, who seems to have caused the most damage to the poor girl, and was the most brutal of the assailants, was known as Raju, from Baduan, UP.
As it turns out his real name is Md. Afroz.
...
Was this one of the reasons for such a clampdown by INC protecting its votebanks?
Recall I had suggested an Islamic marauder link to the rape in GDF and pointed to the US envoy's death in Benghazi?
Re: Delhi Rape Victim Dies-Express your outrage.
The name expose could very likely be the reason for UPMA's actions.
But he was not the only one was he? The others perps who were adults could have made sure better sense prevailed.
Then the poor girl would have likely survived and this would have been another rape statistic.
The use of a L spanner is gruesome. This is torture & rape leading to death. The torture lasted for an hour.
I want that hafta cop to explain. He should be tried as an accessory to the crime.
I may have got this wrong but when I visited the site in Konkan where the explosives in the Mumbai blasts were off loaded, I was told by the locals that the beat cop took Rs. 500 to look the other way.
People including the one's who pay Rs. 50 to the cop for traffic violations and different sums for all sorts of different activities, simply do not understand how such seemingly simple acts have far reaching repercussions in destroying systems and ultimately some one some where down the line pays for it.
So go on, pay the Rs. 50 bribe all day every day.
But he was not the only one was he? The others perps who were adults could have made sure better sense prevailed.
Then the poor girl would have likely survived and this would have been another rape statistic.
The use of a L spanner is gruesome. This is torture & rape leading to death. The torture lasted for an hour.
I want that hafta cop to explain. He should be tried as an accessory to the crime.
I may have got this wrong but when I visited the site in Konkan where the explosives in the Mumbai blasts were off loaded, I was told by the locals that the beat cop took Rs. 500 to look the other way.
People including the one's who pay Rs. 50 to the cop for traffic violations and different sums for all sorts of different activities, simply do not understand how such seemingly simple acts have far reaching repercussions in destroying systems and ultimately some one some where down the line pays for it.
So go on, pay the Rs. 50 bribe all day every day.
Re: Delhi Rape Victim Dies-Express your outrage.
I just wrote to the three chiefs of the armed forces of India:
The government of India has become the most tyrannical and unwitting regime in the recent times. The nation that produces the most number of the brightest engineers, PhDs, and physicians in the world every year, has somehow failed to understand the obvious consequences of repeatedly electing the rulers who have not accomplished anything except for openly, actively and precisely engaging in waging a war against their own nation.
Today, I sincerely urge our armed forces to rescue the nation from these mobsters and their Made in Italy boss. I urge General Deepak Kapoor, Air Chief Marshal Norman Anil Kumar Browne and Admiral Madhvendra Singh to ignore the bureaucratic formalities (which were constituted specifically in the interest of protecting these criminals from the Indian armed forces) and take a bold step in seizing the control and bring every ruling culprit to justice via a quick military court. India looks at the last hope – you gentlemen. Your quick action will ensure that the Law and Order prevails again in India and bar the innocent people of my country.
Jai Hind!
Sameer M.
The government of India has become the most tyrannical and unwitting regime in the recent times. The nation that produces the most number of the brightest engineers, PhDs, and physicians in the world every year, has somehow failed to understand the obvious consequences of repeatedly electing the rulers who have not accomplished anything except for openly, actively and precisely engaging in waging a war against their own nation.
Today, I sincerely urge our armed forces to rescue the nation from these mobsters and their Made in Italy boss. I urge General Deepak Kapoor, Air Chief Marshal Norman Anil Kumar Browne and Admiral Madhvendra Singh to ignore the bureaucratic formalities (which were constituted specifically in the interest of protecting these criminals from the Indian armed forces) and take a bold step in seizing the control and bring every ruling culprit to justice via a quick military court. India looks at the last hope – you gentlemen. Your quick action will ensure that the Law and Order prevails again in India and bar the innocent people of my country.
Jai Hind!
Sameer M.
Re: Delhi Rape Victim Dies-Express your outrage.
Gen Kapoor and Admiral Singh retired a while back.
Re: Delhi Rape Victim Dies-Express your outrage.
I have not personally read the report but I believe the boy and poor girl in were in a near naked state, in the cold Delhi night when they were thrown out of the bus. They were surrounded by around 50 onlookers for a while before somebody took them to the hospital. Sickening.
Public onlookers at such sights are common as we know. Every one has no time for anything and is madly rushing around - until there is free entertainment to be had in the form of accidents on our roads. Depraved behaviour.
It is the very same cross section of people who will give endless speeches on "Sanskriti" and frankly I have no time for them or their speeches.
During my back packing adventures through Desh (and they were indeed adventures) I did some service with an NGO in Varanasi of a revered religious order. This NGO has a full service hospital attached to it with an army of doctors.
One day, I fainted in this organisation's premises. When I came to (about 5 minutes later as I later learned) I was lying on the bitumen, surrounded by a "mob" of Shri Shri's in the pristine dresses of their particular order. They were having a "sabha" discussing whether I was dead or alive and what they should do with me.
It was a staff member who rushed to my aid, picked me up and took me to the hospital. All the Rev. Shri Shri's could do was stare at me for a full 5 minutes which could have proved crucial for my survival. And the institution has a full fledged hospital on site less than 50 metres away from where I fainted.
All these holy worthies will however, turn up faithfully for the morning and evening Aarti's and pontificate on religion, greatness of God, & "Sanskriti". A bit rich I say.
They have not an ounce of humanity and they want to be heard when they talk about religion? Won't wash with me.
What amazed me during my travels was people have all the time and inclination in the world to talk about "Sanskriti" care not for governance & women's emancipation (gender politics).
Oh no sir, instead allow me to take you to Nagpur where a perfectly hospitable gent and great in all other respects threatened me with my life when I said to his daughter - a engineering student, that she is an adult and she does not have to listen to anybody - the constitution of India allows her the freedom and she does not require anybody's permission.
This upset the father. Her mother agreed with me but kept silent while the girl was asked to to go her room and not come back. You see - the father was putting the girl through engineering so that he can find a good her a good husband and then be rid of her. My little talk would poison her mind and u[set the social harmony created through the establishment of stable gender politics.
For us children are our property and a girl child must be docile, listen and serve a string of male's in her life. This I was told repeatedly is her way to salvation (a prescriptive formula no doubt decided by a bunch of males who had nothing but the highest good of the females in their minds), her purpose in life and this is what our "Sanskriti" is.
I am but a baccha, like the erudites who have pontificated to me, I do not have the intellect to understand "Sanskriti" but I do think I have the ability to recognise humane behaviour when I see it.
As for the Shri Shri's, well after i was in some position to walk after 15 days, I went for a walk around the premises and the Shri Shri' were there, faithfully present at the evening Aarti. They had a queue of people waiting to prostrate full length before them to get blessed. Suckers!
I can assure you I was not in that queue.
I did silently wish the Shri Shri's something which I believed would be in the highest interest of the public prostrating full length before them - but as they say never reveal your wishes because then they don't come true. So I can't
Public onlookers at such sights are common as we know. Every one has no time for anything and is madly rushing around - until there is free entertainment to be had in the form of accidents on our roads. Depraved behaviour.
It is the very same cross section of people who will give endless speeches on "Sanskriti" and frankly I have no time for them or their speeches.
During my back packing adventures through Desh (and they were indeed adventures) I did some service with an NGO in Varanasi of a revered religious order. This NGO has a full service hospital attached to it with an army of doctors.
One day, I fainted in this organisation's premises. When I came to (about 5 minutes later as I later learned) I was lying on the bitumen, surrounded by a "mob" of Shri Shri's in the pristine dresses of their particular order. They were having a "sabha" discussing whether I was dead or alive and what they should do with me.
It was a staff member who rushed to my aid, picked me up and took me to the hospital. All the Rev. Shri Shri's could do was stare at me for a full 5 minutes which could have proved crucial for my survival. And the institution has a full fledged hospital on site less than 50 metres away from where I fainted.
All these holy worthies will however, turn up faithfully for the morning and evening Aarti's and pontificate on religion, greatness of God, & "Sanskriti". A bit rich I say.
They have not an ounce of humanity and they want to be heard when they talk about religion? Won't wash with me.
What amazed me during my travels was people have all the time and inclination in the world to talk about "Sanskriti" care not for governance & women's emancipation (gender politics).
Oh no sir, instead allow me to take you to Nagpur where a perfectly hospitable gent and great in all other respects threatened me with my life when I said to his daughter - a engineering student, that she is an adult and she does not have to listen to anybody - the constitution of India allows her the freedom and she does not require anybody's permission.
This upset the father. Her mother agreed with me but kept silent while the girl was asked to to go her room and not come back. You see - the father was putting the girl through engineering so that he can find a good her a good husband and then be rid of her. My little talk would poison her mind and u[set the social harmony created through the establishment of stable gender politics.
For us children are our property and a girl child must be docile, listen and serve a string of male's in her life. This I was told repeatedly is her way to salvation (a prescriptive formula no doubt decided by a bunch of males who had nothing but the highest good of the females in their minds), her purpose in life and this is what our "Sanskriti" is.
I am but a baccha, like the erudites who have pontificated to me, I do not have the intellect to understand "Sanskriti" but I do think I have the ability to recognise humane behaviour when I see it.
As for the Shri Shri's, well after i was in some position to walk after 15 days, I went for a walk around the premises and the Shri Shri' were there, faithfully present at the evening Aarti. They had a queue of people waiting to prostrate full length before them to get blessed. Suckers!
I can assure you I was not in that queue.
I did silently wish the Shri Shri's something which I believed would be in the highest interest of the public prostrating full length before them - but as they say never reveal your wishes because then they don't come true. So I can't
Last edited by rahulm on 31 Dec 2012 13:58, edited 3 times in total.
Re: Delhi Rape Victim Dies-Express your outrage.
Anyone notice this story:
http://www.thehindu.com/news/cities/Del ... 258545.ece
which is about the girl who was molested by a conductor in Delhi, published in TOIlet paper.. isn't covered anymore there?
The victim is a muslim.. she was raped earlier by her brother apparently.. any guesses as to why toilet paper is conviniently ignoring the story?
sad
http://www.thehindu.com/news/cities/Del ... 258545.ece
which is about the girl who was molested by a conductor in Delhi, published in TOIlet paper.. isn't covered anymore there?
The victim is a muslim.. she was raped earlier by her brother apparently.. any guesses as to why toilet paper is conviniently ignoring the story?
sad
Minor molested in Delhi bus was earlier raped by brother
Fresh facts have emerged in the case of a minor girl molested in a bus in New Delhi with police arresting her teenaged brother for allegedly raping her six months ago and molesting her thereafter.
The tragic story of the girl unfolded on Sunday, after the 16-year-old girl recorded her statement with police.
Her brother Nazakkat Ali (19) was arrested following her complaint.
The girl was molested on Saturday night allegedly by a conductor when she left her house following harassment by her family. The conductor Ranjit Singh was arrested in connection with the case, which comes close on the heels of the brutal gang-rape of a girl in a moving bus in south Delhi.
Police went to her house in west Delhi’s Khyala on Sunday, to record her statement during which she told investigators about her ordeal.
A senior police official said her father had married thrice and they were living with his third wife. She claimed that there were problems in the family.
“She also told us that her brother had raped her six months ago and was molesting her thereafter. We have arrested the boy,” the official said.
On Saturday night, the girl had left her house at around 9:30 p.m. and when the bus reached Mandi House at around 11 p.m., police personnel noticed the girl inside the bus alone crying.
A case of kidnapping was found registered about her at Khyala Police Station after her family approached police.
Keywords: Delhi, molestation, women abuse, Delhi bus molestation case, violence against women, Nazakkat Ali, rape cases, Mandi House
Re: Delhi Rape Victim Dies-Express your outrage.
Gangrape: Body lay waiting at Singapore airport as govt, family differed on where to fly
New Delhi, Dec 31: The mortal remains of Delhi's 23-year-old gangrape victim could have arrived 3 hours earlier, but the Centre wanted the body to be flown either to Kolkata or Varanasi, instead of Delhi, and the victim's family refused.
The victim's body reached Singapore airport at 5 pm, and lay there waiting for more than three hours, as the Centre and the victim's family differed on where to take the mortal remains.
The special Air India plane lay waiting at Singapore airport, though all clearances had been given to allow AI-380A flight to depart on priority.
Had the plane left on time, it would have arrived in Delhi in the night, but the government wanted to avoid chaos in Delhi.
The victim's family insisted on going to Delhi for the last rites, Mumbai Mirror reported, and finally the plan departed at around 10 pm Singapore time. The Centre heaved a sigh of relief, as the plane would arrive in Delhi at the unearthly hour of 4 am, when there was no chance of protests.
In foggy weather, the plane landed, the Prime Minister and Congress president Sonia Gandhi were present at the airport, and the body was rushed to the victim's residence, where after religious rites were carried out, it was cremated in Dwarka, even before the veil of fog had lifted over Delhi, a time when most of the Delhiites were deep in slumber.
Re: Delhi Rape Victim Dies-Express your outrage.
Our great Law & Order minister is actually in Sydney right now.
There is an effort by Pallavi Sinha armed with a comprehensive petition to meet him.
Sirs, the great Indian Dharma advocates plenty of respect for women but that has been since long lost in the past. I saw no evidence or it. It appears buried in depths of time somewhere and relegated to being enjoyed in TV episodes every Sunday.
We either to need to revive the past in such a way that is makes sense in the present and is relevant or come with with a new narrative which gets us the desired outcomes.
The part of India that I enjoyed was mostly to do with our glorious history. I enjoyed little of the present. Much of it is messy, broken and some quite smelly (Mahim for example
) and the chip on the shoulders of the nouveau riche bigger than Mt. Everest.
And what has happened to the Fiance? Not much is being heard about him - what is his condition?
If I were him, I would disappear very quickly. He might be sufficiently well educated, sufficiently motivated and most importantly the only eye witness impervious to Police pressure to be a severe thorn in side of the establishment.
I would worry about him being "accidented" with the headlines reading - "Gang Rape Fiance sees futility of existence - commits suicide'. A convenient suicide note would be discovered.
The culprits in Police custody would then toe the establishment's line.
There is an effort by Pallavi Sinha armed with a comprehensive petition to meet him.
Sirs, the great Indian Dharma advocates plenty of respect for women but that has been since long lost in the past. I saw no evidence or it. It appears buried in depths of time somewhere and relegated to being enjoyed in TV episodes every Sunday.
We either to need to revive the past in such a way that is makes sense in the present and is relevant or come with with a new narrative which gets us the desired outcomes.
The part of India that I enjoyed was mostly to do with our glorious history. I enjoyed little of the present. Much of it is messy, broken and some quite smelly (Mahim for example
) and the chip on the shoulders of the nouveau riche bigger than Mt. Everest.And what has happened to the Fiance? Not much is being heard about him - what is his condition?
If I were him, I would disappear very quickly. He might be sufficiently well educated, sufficiently motivated and most importantly the only eye witness impervious to Police pressure to be a severe thorn in side of the establishment.
I would worry about him being "accidented" with the headlines reading - "Gang Rape Fiance sees futility of existence - commits suicide'. A convenient suicide note would be discovered.
The culprits in Police custody would then toe the establishment's line.
Re: Delhi Rape Victim Dies-Express your outrage.
rahulm, good posts.
Re: Delhi Rape Victim Dies-Express your outrage.
rahulm, good points about the fiance.
I want to add to what you said about him. Mods please delete if this crosses a boundary. First of all, I want to day that he too was a (less unfortunate) victim. I'm saying this because (and this is the crux of what I wanted to state) I'm hearing rumblings from media chaiwallahs that the girl was the only braveheart in that bus.
Mind you, I'm not convinced that I myself would have been appropriately macho if I had been in his situation. But there it is.
I want to add to what you said about him. Mods please delete if this crosses a boundary. First of all, I want to day that he too was a (less unfortunate) victim. I'm saying this because (and this is the crux of what I wanted to state) I'm hearing rumblings from media chaiwallahs that the girl was the only braveheart in that bus.
Mind you, I'm not convinced that I myself would have been appropriately macho if I had been in his situation. But there it is.
Re: Delhi Rape Victim Dies-Express your outrage.
https://twitter.com/RajeevSrinivasa/sta ... 7921976320
A single death can become a catalyst RT @zegirish The Roman Monarchy was overthrown by a rape http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lucretia
A single death can become a catalyst RT @zegirish The Roman Monarchy was overthrown by a rape http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lucretia
Re: Delhi Rape Victim Dies-Express your outrage.
At worst this will be forgotten like many others before (likely outcome). At best it will maybe become a marker on the way to women's emancipation in India. Nothing more, no revolution happening from this.
I am sure. Why? Because, even if the Indian women (and I am convinced it will have to come by, from and within the women) have the desire to carry this through, the Indian women who participated in and are necessary to keep the momentum going will be re-called by their "masters" the various males in their circle, firstly by persuasion, then by threats and finally by arm twisting & coercion (e.g. turn of the money supply).
So this is not going any where. More accurate to say the Epic Indian rape was subdued by the Great UPMA while the helpless sheeple walked back to their caves.
I am sure. Why? Because, even if the Indian women (and I am convinced it will have to come by, from and within the women) have the desire to carry this through, the Indian women who participated in and are necessary to keep the momentum going will be re-called by their "masters" the various males in their circle, firstly by persuasion, then by threats and finally by arm twisting & coercion (e.g. turn of the money supply).
So this is not going any where. More accurate to say the Epic Indian rape was subdued by the Great UPMA while the helpless sheeple walked back to their caves.
Last edited by rahulm on 31 Dec 2012 16:00, edited 1 time in total.
Re: Delhi Rape Victim Dies-Express your outrage.
I notice an interesting mindset here that in some convoluted way, some people have even found ways to heap insults on Dharmic orgs and put them up as "responsible" parties to this barbarity.
In any case, one can only consider it a brilliant piece of word jugglery to have been able to pull something like this from the hat! Is "Hindu Terrorism" far behind?
In any case, one can only consider it a brilliant piece of word jugglery to have been able to pull something like this from the hat! Is "Hindu Terrorism" far behind?