Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan - Dec 25, 2012

RajeshA · Post by **RajeshA** » 11 Jan 2013 21:01

RamaY ji,

it depends what the CBMs are. Keeping Pakis confused is good.

VoA for > 80 is okay, if they have some insurance, just in case they become dear to Allah suddenly.

Anujan · Post by **Anujan** » 11 Jan 2013 21:22

Lets consider the NATO incident.

Pakis blocked NATO trucks. They were rewarded with IMF not offering a loan and US cutting off all coalition support fund. Watching Hafeez Shaikh shuttle to the US, begging bowl in hand, literally waiting outside the offices of IMF chief begging for a meeting was quite amusing. That was followed by brave articles about how US needs Pakistan more than Pakistan needs US. That was followed by brave pronouncements of how Pakistan will become China's no 1 ally if US keeps ignoring it. That was followed by everyone making peace offers, bringing out a bottle of vaseline and bending over for GUBO. Their meek precondition of preferential trade agreement with west as requirement for GUBO was ignored by the west as foreplay noises.

The lessons are as follows:

1. Pakis have a tradition of premature ejaculation. They badly misjudged their hand in anticipation of a stronger position in the future (just like how they blocked the NATO trucks). This is quite revealing usually as to what their game plan is. Even Mumbai attacks, I feel, is Pakis misjudging their hand (US probably said they would accomodate "Paki sensitivities" and they took it as a green light for terror incidents. Except as west knows from IC814 hijacking, what is rehearsed in India, is played out in the west. US/UK got their chaddis in a twist). The LoC incident is a gameplan for the future.

2. The only way of dealing with the Pakis is with a carrot and a stick. A carrot by itself is not enough (unless it is big enough and India is prepared to shove it up their musharraf).

India has lost out a decade not outgrowing economically or out-arming Pakistan or building up our assets in Afghanistan and in Pakistan. I hope it is not too late for us to start doing it. Else 2014 and beyond looks bleak for us. It is not purely an accident that the scum Shahzad Chaudry is threatening that Pakis will use their terrorists against India instead of fighting them, and it is in India's interest to make peace. Their gameplan will be fully revealed the day Jihadi Sethi writes an article "If 10 fellows can cause so much mayhem in Mumbai, imagine what 100 Pakis can do!"

All said, I am still hopeful. Pre 9/11 days in Pakistan give us some pointers.

1. Paki aim of taking all their yahoos and aiming them at India had mixed results. Even before 9/11 there were several articles (I remember one from India today) with titles like "Chicken have come home to roost". They suffered 10x of what we suffered.

2. Their political house is built on a deck of cards. Army overthrowing civilians. Jernails stuffing higher echelon with chamchas. Army starting more industry to shut up army wallahs and adventurists like Gul going on a crusade against the west is inevitable. Pakistan will continue to be Pakistan.

3. Their behavior towards India will reach a point, where WKKs themselves get embarrassed. The thing about TV anchors is that they might be bhenc*ds but they blow where the wind is blowing. Saying deeply unpopular things is bad for business and ratings. Finally we will learn to ignore the Pakis, fence our borders, shoot those who cross over and let them stew in their own juice.

RamaY · Post by **RamaY** » 11 Jan 2013 21:29

RajeshA wrote:RamaY ji,

it depends what the CBMs are. Keeping Pakis confused is good.

VoA for > 80 is okay, if they have some insurance, just in case they become dear to Allah suddenly.

Cremate the body and sprinkle the ashes in paki-flowing Indus

member_22872 · Post by **member_22872** » 11 Jan 2013 21:41

But Anujan ji, why do we need a carrot? uncle may need a carrot, because he made his munna depend on his goodies and everytime his munna didn't act, he would dangle a carrot. What did we gain or even uncle gain by dangling carrots? nothing. TSP took them, and showed us and uncle middle finger. Did we get MFN status? no. We are playing matches again with the vermin, they earned money, went back and we ended up losing our soldiers...so what is the reason why we so badly want to dangle carrots? are we suffering from Stockholm syndrome? if we are 65 years of suffering is enough, better we wake up now.

lakshmikanth · Post by **lakshmikanth** » 11 Jan 2013 21:47

When I look at it, Bakis dont need a carrot: WE (India) are the carrot, and they are nibbling at it already. The carrot now needs to shove a big thorny bumboo up the Baki musharraf for a carrot and stick to be analogous.

svinayak · Post by **svinayak** » 11 Jan 2013 22:08

chaanakya wrote:And I know what IA is capable of and have been doing. My maternal grand father was in Army and he had faced all wars ( except Kargil, by that time he was well into long retirement). He always narrated his stories of war with Pakis and how they were within arms length of La Whore. But India Army follows a tradition of civilised army. It would do what it needs to do to restore the honor. No politician orders needed. The incident would be unadvertised and hush hush and Political class would be busy to contain the fall out and keep it under wraps.

What I am surprised is that this time Media has been told the incident in gory details. generally they are given sanitised press release. Something else is in play here so we should be cautious.

Kerry was appointed the Sec of State last week in US. Pakistan govt and PA may have taken the signal that now it can have its way and also the US will take its version of the story. Very carefully choreographed timing based on the US interest and US foreign policy changes coming up this month.
The Pak lobby will be in full strength in DC to build its network with the new cabinet.

chaanakya · Post by **chaanakya** » 11 Jan 2013 22:33

Pakistan is Current President of UN Security Council The reason why they were insistent upon UN probe. This month they are feeling full of Power.

member_22872 · Post by **member_22872** » 11 Jan 2013 22:37

I thought so too, but one month is not enough to begin a probe, influence it and then expect an outcome in their favour.

Lalmohan · Post by **Lalmohan** » 11 Jan 2013 22:39

its a test for kerry
didnt madamaklingon have a similar test when she came to office?

chaanakya · Post by **chaanakya** » 11 Jan 2013 22:57

One month is a long time for us to make this issue go on the sidelines. Something else will take the TV space. Congis will not talk or do much. Did you see any congis talking too much. They are off screen. Only Shitnde and Chiddu and Tainted saint talked. With Tamasha crowd , the outcome is right now in their favour as Army and Govt is not seen doing much .

Pakis being on Security council with India out of it and US needing Paki favours for pullout they can do a lot.

arun · Post by **arun** » 11 Jan 2013 23:05

arun wrote:
harbans wrote:Rediff Reporting Century off 4 Blasts
Government controlled press of the Islamic Republic of Pakistan’s “deeper than oceans” and “higher than the Himalaya’s” friend, P.R. China, is reporting 116 killed in the various demonstrations of the IEDology of Pakistan including the IED Mubarak variant on Thursday:

116 killed, 235 injured as four blasts rock Pakistan

Government controlled press of the Islamic Republic of Iran is reporting 125 killed in the various demonstrations of the IEDology of Pakistan including that the IED Mubarak variant of the IEDology of Pakistan, on Thursday:

Death toll from bomb blasts in Pakistan climbs to 125

rgsrini · Post by **rgsrini** » 11 Jan 2013 23:12

^^Even though it is a friendly pitch, as someone mentioned above, the batting display is phenomenal. It is a long time since I have witnessed such a bradmanesque innings. Hopefully, they will convert it into a double century.

JE Menon · Post by **JE Menon** » 11 Jan 2013 23:17

Double century is doubtful from that innings. Perhaps another century in the next one. It's better that way in this form of cricket.

Suraj · Post by **Suraj** » 11 Jan 2013 23:31

Anujan wrote:India has lost out a decade not outgrowing economically or out-arming Pakistan or building up our assets in Afghanistan and in Pakistan. I hope it is not too late for us to start doing it. Else 2014 and beyond looks bleak for us.

Could you please elaborate on this ? It's my impression that in relative terms the disparity between the economies are FAR more pronounced now than 10 years ago - not only are just per capita incomes higher, but India adds approximately an entire Pakistani economy to its own each year now, due to the relative sizes of the economies. Actual effective budgetary allocations may not correspond, but that's a different topic; they allocate more as a % of GDP to defence than us (plus external baksheesh component), and that has historically been the case.

Prem · Post by **Prem** » 11 Jan 2013 23:37

Me think Half-Tit Syed declaring Kashmir violene turning ugly provides us a good cover to clean the valley from few very proud traitors along with Pokanimals. Next step is to make law which provide the option of retired faujis to settle in Valley with active material support from GOI. For Every KP, Five retire fauji families to reside there.

Gagan · Post by **Gagan** » 12 Jan 2013 00:24

The most appropriate response I can think of is to not stop at halaling some of the paki soldiers and non state actors, but to do something that will take the gas out of these guys for a few years.

Someone had mentioned capturing territory for each transgression, I like that.
One of their Jihadi leaders needs to meet their 72.
GOI bringing up the prospect of war will suddenly infuse a lot of sense in the Pakistani mind.

Pakistan probably has filled the Haji Pir sector with soldiers.

Large concentration of pakistani soldiers in a given geographic area + Indian Artillery barrage = Multiple 72s

Gagan · Post by **Gagan** » 12 Jan 2013 00:56

Pakistani establishment thinking seems to be that they have chairmanship in the UN this month. They wanted some incident in J&K to raise the issue, at least start a debate.
Guess what, they are getting a series of Jhappads on the LOC, we'll have to wait and see how much diplomatic muscle they can muster - they'll probably have to sell some family jewels to get massa AND Cheena biladhel to verbally tilt towards them.

Gagan · Post by **Gagan** » 12 Jan 2013 00:58

Expect the usual suspects in the desi and videshi media to start crying about nooklear flashpoint, etc etc

RamaY · Post by **RamaY** » 12 Jan 2013 00:59

Gagan wrote:The most appropriate response I can think of is to not stop at halaling some of the paki soldiers and non state actors, but to do something that will take the gas out of these guys for a few years.

Someone had mentioned capturing territory for each transgression, I like that.
One of their Jihadi leaders needs to meet their 72.
GOI bringing up the prospect of war will suddenly infuse a lot of sense in the Pakistani mind.

Pakistan probably has filled the Haji Pir sector with soldiers.

Large concentration of pakistani soldiers in a given geographic area + Indian Artillery barrage = Multiple 72s

If wishes were horses...

- If India can punish the Afjals in its jails that will be sufficient
- GoI making the right statements instead of giving "we should talk even if 100000 indians are killed" type stupid statements will be sufficient
- If India can captures its own territory in PoK that would be nirvana

Cosmo_R · Post by **Cosmo_R** » 12 Jan 2013 03:34

Anujan wrote:Lets consider the NATO incident.....

The lessons are as follows:

2. The only way of dealing with the Pakis is with a carrot and a stick. A carrot by itself is not enough (unless it is big enough and India is prepared to shove it up their musharraf).....

1. The WKK will never be embarrassed—they only wax not wane

2. The gulli/danda approach might be a better bet for the butts ('assonance' Google please): 'TTP' attacks on defence colonies making the krispie kantonment kernels (and their spawn) go snap, crackle and pop.

Plausible deniability (© Copyright PakArmy 1947-2013) = mullah determined market price of young Mo.

Painpoints are the answer.

partha · Post by **partha** » 12 Jan 2013 05:14

From archives:

Brad Goodman wrote:
Sunil Gavaskar denies reports of his involvement with PPL

Raja Bose wrote:
What else to expect from the Pakis. When they have had no good news for the last 50 years, all they can do is manufacture them.
1st, it was LinkedIn opening an office in Pakistan - DENIED.
After that, it was Putin visiting Pakistan - DENIED.
Now, it is Sunil Gavaskar helping set up the PPL - DENIED.

partha wrote:
Japan offering $4B funding for Basha dam - DENIED.
Bill Gates inviting Pakistani student - DENIED (http://www.thenewstribe.com/2012/05/28/ ... G50Yfl27cY)
Bangladesh Cricket Board agreeing to tour Pakistan - DENIED (http://cricket.yahoo.com/news/bcb-chief ... 08451.html)
Salman Khan and Katrina attending Pakistani awards function - DENIED (http://tribune.com.pk/story/405801/katr ... situation/)

SG involvement in PPL should be the best
Looking at the state of Pakistan, I won't be surprised if Jinnah comes back from the grave and denies having created Pakistan.

Future denials.

http://tribune.com.pk/story/492677/paki ... -official/

Pakistan Super League: Indian players want to take part, says PCB official

KARACHI: At a time when India and Bangladesh have refused to play in Pakistan, their players have contacted the Pakistan Cricket Board (PCB) in order to take part in the Pakistan Super League which is scheduled to get underway in March.

“The Bangladesh board doesn’t want to send its national team to Pakistan but some top Bangladesh players have contacted us to become a part of the PSL,” a senior PCB official told The Express Tribune. “Four Indian players are also interested in playing and have already submitted their applications to their board and their IPL franchises to allow them to take part.”

The official stressed that only top players will be brought as they want to ensure the standard of the league.

“West Indian great Gordon Greenidge, John Emburey, Lawson and Alvin Kallicharran all want to work as head coaches as they don’t have any security concerns with travelling to Pakistan,” added the official before confirming that local coaches will be considered for top positions and support staff of the teams as well.

Pakistani-American billionaire, thought to be Shahid Khan who also owns an NFL team Jacksonville Jaguars, has shown interest as well.

There will be multiple denials in the coming days. Watch this space.

Anindya · Post by **Anindya** » 12 Jan 2013 06:25

From Chanaakya's post yesterday....

1. This is the time drop MFN status for Pakis. Extend only when Pakis also give it. Reciprocity.
2.Stop VOA and easy Visa regime. Suspend it indefinitely .
3. Cancel Visa for all Pakistanis in India and ask them to leave India within 15 days. Remaining pakis after fifteen day should be rounded up and detained.
4.Stop train , buses and truck movements.
5. Oppose Pakis in international forum for any loans and aid.

I think, this is a critical line of thinking. Our leaders and WKK will seldom allow us to take military action action against Pakistanis, even when conditions are actually quite dire. So, what can be done, short of military action or wrapping some of these terrorists in pig skin, when they're caught or killed.

- Invest in Textile industry: The Pakistani textile industry is not very competitive to begin with, but I believe it can be practically shut down if countries like India and even Bangladesh invest a little more and give some significant tax reliefs to these industries. Help kill textiles and cotton farming in Pakistan

- No trade and business CBMs - no Pakistani investments in India, no MFN, no cross LOC trade, no access to Indian markets for Pakistani businesses. Indian businesses should be able to grow without access to Pakistani markets, but Pakistan does not have the intellectual and cultural horsepower to succeed in a globalized world.

- No Pakistani should be legally or illegally allowed into India - no visas, no work permits, no medical visas, no student visas or a grandfather clause. People to People contacts with Pakistanis does no country any good.

- Raise the investment levels in defense to 3% - Pakistan has this insane urge to keep up with Indian defense spending. Manage defense spending and raise it - ask for offsets and make not so subtle noises about risks of doing deals with countries that do business with Pakistan.

- Spend money on lobbying - from the issue of the need for reversing the unbalanced IWT to the habitual grooming of young girls in western nations by Pakistanis - everything must be raised and repeated in western media again and again. Get professors of Indian origin to reject Pakistani applicants to colleges/univs in Europe and US.

Do things that are at least possible to do, given the extremely inability of our leadership to take any meaningful military action against Pakistani debauchery.

abhishek_sharma · Post by **abhishek_sharma** » 12 Jan 2013 08:06

They are a using a new word on twitter: Pakisthoo.

Sushupti · Post by **Sushupti** » 12 Jan 2013 08:18

Yaa Allah Pakistan isn't secular anymore?.

Pakistan to be part of Vibrant Gujarat for the first time

http://www.deccanherald.com/content/303 ... first.html

kasthuri · Post by **kasthuri** » 12 Jan 2013 08:37

UndyTV reports Firing by Pakistani troops continued intermittently through the night, say sources

Agnimitra · Post by **Agnimitra** » 12 Jan 2013 08:38

Sushupti wrote:Pakistan to be part of Vibrant Gujarat for the first time

http://www.deccanherald.com/content/303 ... first.html

Interesting bit:

Modi on his part, had been sending signals of warming up to the nation. During his Sadbhavana mission is 2011, Modi had urged the UPA government to ease visa rules for Pakistani tourists wanting to visit Ajmer Sharif shrine.

abhishek_sharma · Post by **abhishek_sharma** » 12 Jan 2013 10:38

Shiv Aroor ‏@ShivAroor
In Aug 2011, an identical raid to Jan 8 one, was mounted by Pak Army. Full details of that hushed-up incident at 11AM on #HeadlinesToday.

Prem · Post by **Prem** » 12 Jan 2013 10:39

Governor PKP against two-nation doctrine
Reported in Nawa-e-Waqt governor of Khyber-Pakhtunkhwa Masud Kausar told journalists that the basis on which Pakistan was created was no longer viable. He said religion had divided the nation and now the only possible binding factor was defence of the state. He said the two-nation doctrine should be replaced since being a Muslim in Pakistan was dangerous because of sectarian divisions.

http://www.thefridaytimes.com/beta3/tft ... 11&page=14

abhisheka · Post by **abhisheka** » 12 Jan 2013 13:25

Orbat has the best commentary on the latest Pakistani stunt.

Mr. Luhar notes it is interesting the Indian Army on the ground took action on its own. This was not a rouge action, it was authorized at division level, likely even higher. ... The Indian Army has long been fed up of the Government’s complete indifference to the lives of the soldiers. This is not the old army of yore where from the Army Chief to the lowest rifleman Delhi’s orders were followed with blind obedience, even when they were totally wrong, as in 1962. The men and officers of today are literate, plugged in, and highly aware. Nor does India want it otherwise, because the kind of recruit the Army needs nowdays has to be fully educated.

Anujan · Post by **Anujan** » 12 Jan 2013 13:54

^^^
Pakis have always made the mistake of confusing India with Indian army. Hence the bravado with LBS, Indira and ABV. The former does dhoti shivering, the latter's retribution is swift and brutal.

Let us also not confuse the two.

Anujan · Post by **Anujan** » 12 Jan 2013 15:44

http://www.nytimes.com/2013/01/12/world ... -home&_r=1&

Obama Accelerates Transition of Security to Afghans

James M. Dubik, a retired Army lieutenant general who led the effort to train the Iraqi Army and is a senior fellow at the Institute for the Study of War, a nongovernmental research group, said that accelerating the effort to put Afghan forces in the lead, and the cuts in Americans troops that are expected to follow, posed risks.

“There will be insufficient combat power to finish the counteroffensive against the Haqqani network in the east,” he said, referring to the militant group that operates in Afghanistan and Pakistan.

SSridhar · Post by **SSridhar** » 12 Jan 2013 16:00

Anujan wrote:Obama Accelerates Transition of Security to Afghans
. . . a nongovernmental research group, said that accelerating the effort to put Afghan forces in the lead, and the cuts in Americans troops that are expected to follow, posed risks.

“There will be insufficient combat power to finish the counteroffensive against the Haqqani network in the east,” he said, referring to the militant group that operates in Afghanistan and Pakistan.

Finish the Haqqani network, eh ? What a joke ? By giving prime place to TSPA in Afghan Peace talks, the Obama administration has made known its intentions clearly. It is running away and as quickly as possible. Already Obama is talking of non-military options being pursued by TSPA. A seal of approval is therefore given to TSPA's peace deal with TTP.

Anujan · Post by **Anujan** » 12 Jan 2013 17:00

http://tribune.com.pk/story/492651/nego ... h-the-ttp/

Pakistan Army also thinks of itself as the Army of God. Since the 1980s, the army’s mission has been to protect the “ideological borders of Pakistan” together with the physical borders. The 1994 army’s Green Book states that “the existence and survival of Pakistan depend upon complete implementation of Islamic ideology in true sense. If the ideology is not preserved then the very existence of Pakistan becomes doubtful”. This thinking was reflected in the banners at army recruiting centres displaying, “iman, taqwa, jihad fi sabil Allah” (faith, piety and jihad in God’s way).....The public largely sees the Taliban as sincere, although somewhat overzealous. Therefore, soldiers killed fighting them are quietly buried, while those killed in Pakistan-India wars are remembered as shaheeds through the streets and roads bearing their names.

SSridhar · Post by **SSridhar** » 12 Jan 2013 17:18

Anujan wrote:http://tribune.com.pk/story/492651/nego ... h-the-ttp/
. . . Therefore, soldiers killed fighting them {the Taliban} are quietly buried, while those killed in Pakistan-India wars are remembered as shaheeds through the streets and roads bearing their names.

There are even fatwas stating that these dead soldiers fighting the Taliban are not martyrs of a jihad and hence not to be accorded all that respect.

abhishek_sharma · Post by **abhishek_sharma** » 12 Jan 2013 17:22

Shiv Aroor ‏@ShivAroor
"The tradition of beheading is not Pakistan's alone. What do you think our Gorkhas use their khukris for?" ~ Maj Gen (Retd) Ashok Mehta

Shiv Aroor ‏@ShivAroor
Never stops amazing you how hospitable people are in the most dangerous areas. Incredible kindness and warmth by locals near the LoC.

Shiv Aroor ‏@ShivAroor
I ask a local at village near the LoC if it bothers him that nothing changes much on the LoC. He smiles ruefully. "Not anymore," he says.

SSridhar · Post by **SSridhar** » 12 Jan 2013 17:23

One thing that India has to be aware of is that the US may choose to transfer equipment left over in Afghanistan by c/ 2014 to TSPA rather than incurring the efforts and expenses to take them back to the US. We may never know if that took place under the wraps. The US may even do so overtly by justifying that these would be needed to ward off any future misadventure by AQAM which the TSPA would take care of.

abhishek_sharma · Post by **abhishek_sharma** » 12 Jan 2013 18:42

Shiv Aroor ‏@ShivAroor
Army issues clarification: On Jan 8 in Mendhar, both 13 RAJRIF jawans were mutilated. One of them [Lance Naik Hemraj] was beheaded.

Shiv Aroor ‏@ShivAroor
Army says its clarification pertains to what the Pak FS has said, quoted in reports by @the_hindu and @ReutersIndia.

rajanb · Post by **rajanb** » 12 Jan 2013 18:47

When is he going to say we have done the same, and in twentyplicate?

abhishek_sharma · Post by **abhishek_sharma** » 12 Jan 2013 18:54

nitin gokhale ‏@nitingokhale
Now L/Nk Hemraj's family and villagers sit on hunger strike demanding return of his severed head.

anupmisra · Post by **anupmisra** » 12 Jan 2013 19:14

abhishek_sharma wrote:They are a using a new word on twitter: Pakisthoo.

One does not "Thoo" a paki, one flushes it.