West Asia News and Discussions

Austin · Post by **Austin** » 16 Jul 2013 12:53

Its not true that Israel is neutral here they clearly Support the anti-Assad faction , It was mentioned by no other then Israel President.

Israel keeps bombing key facilities deep inside Syria on the pretext of it could be transferred to Hezbollah , It provides no evidence of it to UN even after bombing mission , they act like judge & jury on this and expect each time they bomb the world should take its word for what it is.

The aim is to weaken Syrian government and has little to do with Hizb , Israel knows Syria wont attack her in retaliation as that would be a full scale war something Assad cannot win .....so the bombing is a tacit support to Anti-Assad Force. There is no neutrality here.

habal · Post by **habal** » 16 Jul 2013 13:01

Truth be told. In ultimate analysis Israel is an agent of instability in Asia. Why not make Israel in Europe since Ashkenazis feel closer to Europeans anyways. Sephardims are a small minority anyway and are considered below the white jews.

Israel's utlity for west lies mainly in creating of this gladio force of jehadis with legitimate grievances against Israel but are ultimately to be used against Russia, China, Iran & India. With Syria, Iraq, Libya being ex-east bloc countries. If this gladio forces ultimately succeeds in destabilizing these countries beyond repair, there is a big chance that Israel will be poofed in a JDAM strike by their western mentors.

Austin · Post by **Austin** » 16 Jul 2013 16:09

Israel exists simply because of Jewish lobby in US who think its right to support Israel no matter what they do so even if they screw up US veto protects them besides Arms and Money.

Every thing around ME revolves around first protecting Israel and then rest follows. For long as such policy exist and No US President can survive without first pledging support for Israel then there is little hope for peace in ME.

As Absolute security for one nation can mean insecurity for others.

Johann · Post by **Johann** » 16 Jul 2013 16:13

Austin wrote:Israel keeps bombing key facilities deep inside Syria on the pretext of it could be transferred to Hezbollah , It provides no evidence of it to UN even after bombing mission , they act like judge & jury on this and expect each time they bomb the world should take its word for what it is.

The aim is to weaken Syrian government and has little to do with Hizb , Israel knows Syria wont attack her in retaliation as that would be a full scale war something Assad cannot win .....so the bombing is a tacit support to Anti-Assad Force. There is no neutrality here.

Austin,

How do you think the Assad regime is paying Hezbollah for the enormous risks its taking fighting on its side in places like Homs and Aleppo? How do you think Hezbollah got a hold of large calibre rockets and ATGMs in previous conflicts?

Israel has never failed to defeat the Syrian military.

It has on the other hand had severe trouble with Hezbollah over, and over and over again.

That is why Syria supports Hezbollah, and why that support is Israel's biggest bone of contention with the Assad regime.

Right now the nightmare Israeli scenario is what happens to Syrian chemical stocks if the regime collapses. Given that the Taliban is now hanging around that should be of concern to a very wide swathe of the world.

habal · Post by **habal** » 16 Jul 2013 16:51

there are lobbies for every occasion in US. Every cause has a lobby. But only those lobbies are successful when their agenda dovetails with that of the deep state. Until that ceases to be the case, it's all hunky dory. If this cleavage of interests ceases to exist then we have a hosni, a Ben Ali and so on. Ofcourse ofcourse, relations here are much deeper, 'much like taller than mountains and deeper than ravines & deepest oceans' than the original, yet still .. Israel was created by European jewry, it was only much later sustained by American jewry and their baptist sidekicks. So it's basically a Euro-American project. American idiosyncrasies are often overruled by this mono synthetic elite when it outlives it's original purpose or fails to reinvent, not much unlike Hosni & Ben Ali.

abhischekcc · Post by **abhischekcc** » 16 Jul 2013 17:41

brihaspati wrote:The islamic intervention is coming to India one way or the other, whether India intervenes in islamic neighbourhoods or not. If nothing is done, it will be passed off as organic, internal, and voluntary choice towards a more "egalitarian" theology and state. If something is done, or if "saffron" seems to come to power - that will be used to justify islamic intervention.

It is onlee a matter of time. Hoping that India can save itself by either buying out the ME, or doing its careful tiptoe foxtrot to appease the mullah, and by not seeming to intervene in the very zones from which Paki or BD interventionist support comes into India - that is the Gulf Sunni power centres - affects in now way the ultimate agenda of the mullahcracy.

In that case, the expected collapse of the global economy will be good for India, as it will lead to:
1. Collapse of energy prices, and consequently of petrodollar based economies (the fountains of terror).
2. Collapse of the social balance that KSA maintain by purchasing loyalties of various tribes.
3. The resulting collapse there will lead to a power vacuum, and draw jehadis from across the world to 'liberate' the holy land from infidel domination.

4. Economic malaise in India always leads to political conflict, which has lead to removal of incompetent leadership.

5. China is not unaffected by the economic malaise.

5. Pak-BD depend on external money to prop up their aggression against India, hence lack of sponsorship from them will make them less of a threat to India.

abhischekcc · Post by **abhischekcc** » 16 Jul 2013 18:01

habal wrote:Truth be told. In ultimate analysis Israel is an agent of instability in Asia. Why not make Israel in Europe since Ashkenazis feel closer to Europeans anyways. Sephardims are a small minority anyway and are considered below the white jews.

Israel's utlity for west lies mainly in creating of this gladio force of jehadis with legitimate grievances against Israel but are ultimately to be used against Russia, China, Iran & India. With Syria, Iraq, Libya being ex-east bloc countries. If this gladio forces ultimately succeeds in destabilizing these countries beyond repair, there is a big chance that Israel will be poofed in a JDAM strike by their western mentors.

Israel was created when two powerful forces collaborated to create it - the dying Anglo-British imperial interests (ABII) and International Jewish interests (IJI). The former also created Pakistan.

ABII wanted to bookend the middle east and its oil wells. (India's independence is critically linked with the fact that ABII discovered a new source of easy money). Hence it needed two client states that would be critically dependant on it, and would also serve as a pacemaker to keep ME burning and consequently oil prices high.

Pakistan has served many other purposes besides this, but that is another article.

IJI wanted a homeland where Jews would not be persecuted, but they have always been junior partners in this game.

I could recount many episodes where Jewish interests were repeatedly sidelined by ABII-USA, but when their own interests were threatened they took action in a very short time.

Also, ABII-USA (protestants) would have created a jihadi force regardless of whether Israel existed or not.

rsingh · Post by **rsingh** » 16 Jul 2013 18:50

abhischekcc wrote:
habal wrote:Truth be told. In ultimate analysis Israel is an agent of instability in Asia. Why not make Israel in Europe since Ashkenazis feel closer to Europeans anyways. Sephardims are a small minority anyway and are considered below the white jews.

Israel's utlity for west lies mainly in creating of this gladio force of jehadis with legitimate grievances against Israel but are ultimately to be used against Russia, China, Iran & India. With Syria, Iraq, Libya being ex-east bloc countries. If this gladio forces ultimately succeeds in destabilizing these countries beyond repair, there is a big chance that Israel will be poofed in a JDAM strike by their western mentors.
Israel was created when two powerful forces collaborated to create it - the dying Anglo-British imperial interests (ABII) and International Jewish interests (IJI). The former also created Pakistan.

ABII wanted to bookend the middle east and its oil wells. (India's independence is critically linked with the fact that ABII discovered a new source of easy money). Hence it needed two client states that would be critically dependant on it, and would also serve as a pacemaker to keep ME burning and consequently oil prices high.

Pakistan has served many other purposes besides this, but that is another article.

IJI wanted a homeland where Jews would not be persecuted, but they have always been junior partners in this game.

I could recount many episodes where Jewish interests were repeatedly sidelined by ABII-USA, but when their own interests were threatened they took action in a very short time.

Also, ABII-USA (protestants) would have created a jihadi force regardless of whether Israel existed or not.

Sorry Saar, it looks like you just got infected with Lahori logic germ. Is it Dar -e-SHQ making you see konspiracee theori everywhere

. Anyway nice to read your posts. How is life?

habal · Post by **habal** » 16 Jul 2013 19:33

abhischekcc wrote: IJI wanted a homeland where Jews would not be persecuted, but they have always been junior partners in this game.

yes. People miss this wood for some american trees.

abhischekcc wrote:I could recount many episodes where Jewish interests were repeatedly sidelined by ABII-USA, but when their own interests were threatened they took action in a very short time.

Also, ABII-USA (protestants) would have created a jihadi force regardless of whether Israel existed or not.

they rely on fact that mango-man has existential compulsions, short memories & weak status quo.

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 16 Jul 2013 19:42

habal wrote:Truth be told. In ultimate analysis Israel is an agent of instability in Asia. Why not make Israel in Europe since Ashkenazis feel closer to Europeans anyways. Sephardims are a small minority anyway and are considered below the white jews.

Israel's utlity for west lies mainly in creating of this gladio force of jehadis with legitimate grievances against Israel but are ultimately to be used against Russia, China, Iran & India. With Syria, Iraq, Libya being ex-east bloc countries. If this gladio forces ultimately succeeds in destabilizing these countries beyond repair, there is a big chance that Israel will be poofed in a JDAM strike by their western mentors.

let us go by facts.....
A nation-state for Jews in israel is a consequence of the Westphalina remaking of Western Europe. So they have as much right to a state as any other nationality.

And make no mistake:

Israel in Middle East also serves Indian national interests. It keeps the Arab jihadis home in Middle East or else they will be in India like during the Sultanate days.
And most likely welcomed by the psec ruling elite just as they were welcomed in Sind by then mercantile elite.

And Askenazis are more like Persian Jews who are European by way of migration.
Lets go by facts.....

Johann · Post by **Johann** » 16 Jul 2013 19:46

Domestic American support for the Israel project has been a major factor in international politics for almost a century now, and its only grown. Back in the day the support was mostly Jewish, but since the 1970s it has increasingly come from the much larger group of evangelical Christians.

The Balfour declaration in 1917 was entirely about winning the support of prominent Jews in Russia and America in order to win their support in the stalemate against the Central Powers and tip the balance. Russia was thinking about getting out, and America was thinking about getting in. This is a quote from James Gelvin's 2005 book on the Israeli-Palestinian conflict

Two of [US President] Wilson's closest advisors, Louis Brandeis and Felix Frankfurter, were avid Zionists. How better to shore up an uncertain ally than by endorsing Zionist aims? The British adopted similar thinking when it came to the Russians, who were in the midst of their revolution. Several of the most prominent revolutionaries, including Leon Trotsky, were of Jewish descent. Why not see if they could be persuaded to keep Russia in the war by appealing to their latent Jewishness and giving them another reason to continue the fight?" ... These include not only those already mentioned but also Britain's desire to attract Jewish financial resources.

Of course like the Zionists themselves the British didn't really expect the Arabs to be quite so upset about the plan to build a new Jewish state in the Levant. Hitler's persecution of German Jews in the 1930s sent Jewish migration from Europe to the Mandate soaring, and the Palestinian Arabs rose up at a time when Arab nationalism was growing across the region. How much support the UK has given Israel is very much a triangulation of its relationship with the US on the one hand, and its relationship with the Arab world on the other, and the Arab world's relationship with enemies like Nazi Germany and the Soviet Union.

Rony · Post by **Rony** » 16 Jul 2013 22:00

I have no idea why Indians dont retaliate. Outsiders will interpret (which they are already doing ) this pacifist mentality with cowardliness.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KzUMwS8qJeg

vishvak · Post by **vishvak** » 16 Jul 2013 22:25

Rony wrote:I have no idea why Indians dont retaliate. Outsiders will interpret (which they are already doing ) this pacifist mentality with cowardliness.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KzUMwS8qJeg

What's that in his hand - ring structure that is put on head cloth? So is that used like the whacker that Europeans use as status symbol and whack little kids?

KLNMurthy · Post by **KLNMurthy** » 17 Jul 2013 01:14

Johann wrote:
Pranav wrote:
It is curious to see both the Saudis as well as Assad cheer Morsi's departure, at a time when Saudis are backing cannibals in Syria.

Clearly the dust has not settled as yet.
Its not that complicated.

Al-Sa'ud has a problem with a republican movement with transnational links like the Muslim Brotherhood coming to power in a major Arab country like Egypt.

Saudi Arabia has a different problem with Syria's alliance with Iran which is both its most serious geopolitical rival, and a threat to the Al-Saud royal family's domestic legitimacy.

Al-Sa'ud *would* have a problem with the Muslim Brotherhood triumphing in Syria, but not Salafi groups, or a purely local Islamist flavoured government.

May not be complicated for those who already know the answer, but sure cleared up things for me. I too, was confused as to saudi's support of the sisi regime.

Another q for the gurus: is there any doubt that US WANA policy is driven by saudi, qatar and the other gulfies?

KLNMurthy · Post by **KLNMurthy** » 17 Jul 2013 01:38

Austin wrote:Israel exists simply because of Jewish lobby in US who think its right to support Israel no matter what they do so even if they screw up US veto protects them besides Arms and Money.

Every thing around ME revolves around first protecting Israel and then rest follows. For long as such policy exist and No US President can survive without first pledging support for Israel then there is little hope for peace in ME.

As Absolute security for one nation can mean insecurity for others.

Is it really that hard for Indians to understand the Jews' attachment to the home of their civilization?

Absolute security for Israel is needed because of the innate hatefulness and Pakiness of the araps, and because of the real and demonstrated danger of extinction faced by the Jews every day. This part may actually be hard for Indians who would almost certainly survive a nuclear attack.

[I think I should clarify a bit. I have understanding and sympathy for araps being upset about the Jewish state. I am not so sympathetic to their incapacity to keep a perspective: arap culture and civilization itself supplanted many native peoples in those countries, and Jews are hardly looking to supplant anything. Also, I suspect arap rage to be fundamentally paki in nature: they are less angry that palestinians lost their homes than at the fact that it is the Jews--arap equivalent of bahman-bania-- that brazenly took away those homes. Just look at how Jordan used the real bakis to crush the palestinians.]

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 17 Jul 2013 01:42

Its driven purely by their own interests hiding behind others as needed.

KLNMurthy · Post by **KLNMurthy** » 17 Jul 2013 01:53

ramana wrote:Its driven purely by their own interests hiding behind others as needed.

Ramana, it is not clear what US interests are served by supporting jihadi cannibals in Syria or why both parties are putting pressure on ombaba to give support. Only explanation I can think of is deep influence of saudi and the araps in the trans-party US power structure.

Shanmukh · Post by **Shanmukh** » 17 Jul 2013 03:01

Johann wrote: Of course like the Zionists themselves the British didn't really expect the Arabs to be quite so upset about the plan to build a new Jewish state in the Levant. Hitler's persecution of German Jews in the 1930s sent Jewish migration from Europe to the Mandate soaring, and the Palestinian Arabs rose up at a time when Arab nationalism was growing across the region. How much support the UK has given Israel is very much a triangulation of its relationship with the US on the one hand, and its relationship with the Arab world on the other, and the Arab world's relationship with enemies like Nazi Germany and the Soviet Union.

It is a bit more than just Hitler's persecution. Hitler was the last step, the culmination of a long history of persecution of the Jews. Right from 1800, the Jews were fleeing everywhere they could - to America, to South Africa, and finally, Israel. To quote Raul Hilberg from his `Destruction of the European Jews', the church originally said `You have no right to live among us as Jews'; the secular antisemites, including most of the European empires, (the French, German and Russian empires), that came afterwards said `You have no right to live among us'. While killings were rare, persecution of Jews was an everyday matter of fact for them. Hitler was the final straw, he said `You have no right to live.'

And the Arab antisemitism is as old as Muhammad himself. Why no one thought of that is unknown. Orientalism aside, what is happening is exactly what could be expected to happen. The Arabs are not going to stop their terrorism against Israel, no matter what.

chanakyaa · Post by **chanakyaa** » 17 Jul 2013 06:17

Rony wrote:I have no idea why Indians dont retaliate. Outsiders will interpret (which they are already doing ) this pacifist mentality with cowardliness.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KzUMwS8qJeg

My dear Rony, or whatever your name is. It is very easy to pick videos off internet from lowest denominators of the society and conveniently generalize. Your conclusion that the person in video is an Indian, suggests that you know the person well (friend or relative), else your assumption deserves further scrutiny. It is fairly easy to pick candidates from lowest denominator of population, regardless of race, ethnicity or religion and generalize for the whole. I could make the same argument about wealthiest nations on earth using people who are on welfare, mainstream getting screwed by bankers blah...blah...blah; and then question why don't they retaliate. At some point in time Jewsish population could not protect themselves from Hitler; but today wars can't be fought without their money (i.e. consent). World asked the same question, why don't jews retaliate? You have no idea that the arap in the video is indirectly getting screwed by other powerful nations, not physically but strategically. If you understood the gravity, you would have asked a question, why doesn't that arap retaliate? But, I know you wont. Please, please try to grow up. Listen to what your mother said, eat your veggies and don't forget the calcium.

Rony · Post by **Rony** » 17 Jul 2013 09:05

It is very easy to pick videos off internet from lowest denominators of the society and conveniently generalize.

Point Taken

Your conclusion that the person in video is an Indian, suggests that you know the person well (friend or relative), else your assumption deserves further scrutiny.

Shock video appears to show Emirati attacking Indian

You have no idea that the arap in the video is indirectly getting screwed by other powerful nations, not physically but strategically.

Irrelevant excuse ! It does not matter if the Arab is getting screwed "strategically" by other nations ! If someone hits me, i have to retaliate not take the beatings and then satisfy myself that he is "strategically" (not physically) getting screwed by someone else. Besides, knowing the sanctuary which UAE is for the anti-India terrorists and hawala terrorist transactions, one could argue that UAE is also "strategically" screwing India. What did the congress run Indian govt do in return ? signing one sided jet-etihad like deals ?

Austin · Post by **Austin** » 17 Jul 2013 11:52

My experience has been Arab specifically in UAE they tend to look down upon person from SE Asian countries but when it comes to Goras specifically American or UK they are treated in a different category.

Lalmohan · Post by **Lalmohan** » 17 Jul 2013 11:54

arabs have a big time fascination for goras verging on the homo-erotic, and equal disdain for SDRE's - more so the gulf types
you only have to experience their apartheid system for a few days to see the light

Austin · Post by **Austin** » 17 Jul 2013 12:10

Lalmohan wrote: you only have to experience their apartheid system for a few days to see the light

I did see it with my own eyes hence the comment ..... just because they have oil money they have some sort of superiority complex viz a viz Asians and when it comes to Goras they are duty bound to obey them.

Lalmohan · Post by **Lalmohan** » 17 Jul 2013 12:13

yes austin - i was agreeing with you and reinforcing your comment

habal · Post by **habal** » 17 Jul 2013 12:24

Keeping aside that Arap's emm .. righteous indignation, it wouldn't surprise me if the Indian driver really had driven non-courteously around surrounding traffic, without observing lane-discipline, especially more so if he belongs to the Socialist Republic of K. It so happens that drivers from socialist republic are a close second to another socialist paradise up north across India's borders who are clearly the worst drivers in the world. Also note he doesn't raise hands against the arap, either he himself belongs to the universal brotherhood of peace and considers it blasphemy to raise hands on forefather or else if that's not the case he is in mortal dread of going back to socialist republic without a job.

Also it seems, there is another driver in the drivers seat, and this guy just stepped out to get beaten. http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=90b_1373924691

habal · Post by **habal** » 17 Jul 2013 15:44

a very unusual newspiece

CIA tips off Hezbollah about bombing plot
By Mitchell Prothero July 17, 2013, 3 a.m.
the CIA has warned Lebanese officials that groups linked to al-Qaeda are planning a campaign of bombings in Beirut's Hezbollah-dominated southern suburbs, Lebanese officials said on Monday.

The unusual warning - US officials are barred from directly contacting Hezbollah, which the US has designated a terrorist group - was passed from the CIA's Beirut station chief to Lebanese intelligence last week with the understanding it would be passed to Hezbollah, Lebanese officials said.

Hezbollah officials acknowledged the warning and took steps to tighten security in the southern suburbs that are known as the Dahiya.

The move came days after a bomb wounded dozens of people in the area. One Lebanese official said the CIA warning included evidence that was ''very convincing and scary'' because it was so specific. The evidence included phone intercepts on cells operating along Lebanon's border with Syria, as well as inside Beirut.

''They had transcripts of calls made from known al-Qaeda people in Lebanon to people in the [Persian] Gulf that included detailed information about the attacks, including the amounts of explosives that had been smuggled into Lebanon,'' one Lebanese intelligence official said. ''We have already begun to make arrests.''

The CIA warning included information that at least three cells had smuggled military-grade explosives by the tonne into Lebanon for a pair of huge truck bomb attacks targeting Beirut's southern suburbs, where Hezbollah has many offices and maintains a heavy security presence.

A third cell of suicide bombers was planning to target a list of Hezbollah and Lebanese officials, as well as diplomats from nations, including Russia, that have been strong supporters of Syrian President Bashar al-Assad. The US embassy declined to comment or to allow the CIA station chief for Lebanon to be interviewed.

Two other Lebanese officials confirmed a continuing operation to target and stop al-Qaeda operatives in Lebanon from conducting bombing attacks in support of the Syrian rebels.

Both officials pointed to a raid at the weekend by the Lebanese armed forces in the city of Aarsal, a key haven for Syrian rebels and a hotbed of anti-Hezbollah sentiment in Lebanon.

On Saturday, the Lebanese army captured a ''number of men from a number of different Arab nations, including the Gulf'' in possession of military-grade explosives, including some set to be used in suicide operations, Lebanon's National News Agency reported.

An unusually large number of Lebanese army units could be seen conducting patrols and manning checkpoints on the outskirts of the Dahiya. Inside the neighbourhood, Hezbollah forces were conducting security patrols and detaining suspicious people.

Residents said they were taken aback by reports the CIA had warned Hezbollah of a planned attack. ''We all think that the [Syrian rebels] are al-Qaeda and backed by the CIA and Israel,'' said Abu Ibrahim, a labourer from Haret Hreik, a suburb in the Dahiya. ''So why would they help us? Maybe they're realising how crazy their friends in Syria are.''

http://www.wellingtontimes.com.au/story ... plot/?cs=5

and this very same CIA (with it's legions of 'language experts' who run at 200k$/annum) didn't have actionable intelligence on the 26/11 and other terror attacks in India .. hain ji ? how believable is that.

they are in the mood to teach the al-queeda types a lesson for exceeding their mandate and don't want them to advance any more on their own steam. How many twists & turns does this war have ?

'Shadow war' targets Christians in Syria

Kidnapping Christians reportedly has become a growth industry. In late February, the website Ora pro Siria, operated by Italian missionaries in Syria, launched an emergency fundraising appeal called "Ransom a Christian." The website said the going price for a kidnapped priest was in the neighborhood of $200,000.

It's not just clergy who find themselves in harm's way. In June, the Franciscan Custody of the Holy Land reported that a cluster of Christian villages along Syria's Orontes River had been almost totally destroyed in the fighting, forcing thousands into hiding.

"Of the 4,000 inhabitants of the village of Ghassanieh, as just one example, the local pastor reports that no more than 10 people remain," said Fr. Pierbattista Pizzaballa, director of the custody, adding that bombs had also seriously damaged a Franciscan monastery in Knayeh near the border with Lebanon.

As NCR went to press, a Greek-Catholic monastery in Qara was under assault by rebel forces. Officials of the Norbertine order told Vatican Radio they had lost contact with a 74-year-old Belgian missionary, Daniel Maes, living at the monastery.

In a July 1 opinion piece on National Review Online, religious freedom activist Nina Shea charged that a "shadow war" is being waged against Syria's Christians. Shea pointed to the death of Murad and the fact that Islamist groups have begun setting up Shariah courts in areas of Syria under their control, charging Christians with a variety of alleged offenses under Muslim law.

In that context, some Syrian Christians have issued warnings about Western policies of arming Syria's opposition.

"I would like everyone to know that the West, in supporting the revolutionaries, is supporting religious extremists and helping to kill Christians," Fr. Halim Noujaim, the Franciscans' regional minister for Syria and Lebanon, said after the execution of Murad.

The Obama administration recently announced the U.S. will provide small arms and ammunition to the rebels. Critics such as Noujaim charge that Assad's fall could pave the way for either Iraq-style chaos or the Egyptian-style rise of an Islamist regime, in either case setting up Syria's Christian minority for special hardship.

The Catholic Near East Welfare Association has issued an emergency appeal to support Syria's Christians.

as if on cue ..

the state dept ululates
http://www.state.gov/j/drl/rls/rm/2013/211910.htm

anupmisra · Post by **anupmisra** » 17 Jul 2013 16:09

Rony wrote:It does not matter if the Arab is getting screwed "strategically" by other nations ! If someone hits me, i have to retaliate not take the beatings and then satisfy myself that he is "strategically" (not physically) getting screwed by someone else. Besides, knowing the sanctuary which UAE is for the anti-India terrorists and hawala terrorist transactions, one could argue that UAE is also "strategically" screwing India. What did the congress run Indian govt do in return ? signing one sided jet-etihad like deals ?

Look Rony, nothing personal. That poor Indian driver is probably the only bread winner for his family back in India. By retaliating he would be either condemned to a lifetime in jail or much worse, and his family would never know what happened. The Lexus owner would see to that, whether he is being strategically screwed by us or not. Nothing to do with trade deals. Secondly, we do not know what transpired before this video was shot. Did the Indian driver (who surely works for an arab company delivering stationery items) ram the Lexus or start an argument? And, just for relevance but not for point scoring, does this not happen on Indian streets all the time in full view of hundreds? Who steps in to protect the weaker or less affluent party? The guy at the bottom end of the social totem pole always gets shat up on from the assh**e above. Just my two cents.

Mukesh.Kumar · Post by **Mukesh.Kumar** » 17 Jul 2013 16:23

chanakyaa wrote:Shock video appears to show Emirati attacking Indian

Guys look at the date on the video. Its likely Ramadan (the time for self-control and reflection), and practically the time that people go mad. In this hot summer without food and water, people go crazy. Road rage incidents spike during this time.

But generally there is a problem. If I had to rank the GCC countries from downright obnoxiousness to Indians to uneasy tolerance it would go like:
1) Qatari's--> Rich on new found gas wealth, they even look down on oiropeans
2) Kuwaiti's--> Confused lot (Incidentally the only corner of GCC dominated by people from AP and not Kerala)
3) Saudi's--> Ask any expat and he will tell you how difficult life is over there. Have heard this anecdote repeated time and again that a Saudi seeing an Indian expat in a posh car will come up and spit on the car, scratch it,etc. Again, it's a society in transition. I would say give it a few more years, their population growth has outstripped oil revenues for some time. Once these buggers are forced to work, the welfare state fails to deliver on ever increasing demands, they will come down a few notches. Though that comes at a loss of overseas employment for us as more and more Saudi's have to take non-managerial/ low white collar/ blue collar jobs, it will tone them down.
4) Emirati's--> Well the truth is that there are very few of them. And the oil wealth of Abu Dhabi and commercial success of Dubai have propped up the Emirates. But all in all the other states are weaker- Ras al Khaimah, Ajman, Fujairah & Sharjah are much poorer country cousins. Generally speaking and looking at the video, I would say that the person was from Dubai or maybe Sharjah. Of all the GCC states, UAE maybe be the Emirate which can be considered as median for treatment of Indians.
5) Bahrain--> In the past Bahrani's were obnoxious too, but recent turmoil, and the fact that the Shia population is poorer has meant that tolerance/ acceptance has increased, or xenophobia is masked.
6) Oman--> Best of the GCC states. But here also there are undercurrents.

If you look at this behaviour, I would say that it started off from a sense of entitlement that I can pay people to do whatever I want. A history of slavery which kind of creates a mindset. But with time and as Indians have progressed, there is a feeling of hollowness that drives a inferiority complex. Maybe deep inside these guys know that if Indians are allowed unchecked freedom, then they will swamp them with numbers, competence. Hence teh desire, the attitude to keep Indians subservient.

While this video maybe shocking to you, Indians are median. These guys are crazy. Look through this news item to see an example of how bad it can get even for people from other nationalities/ ethnic appearances. You should see the way they treat Filipino's , Pakistani's, Bangladeshi's. Mind you I am not condoning this behavior, just putting forward my take on what may lie behind.

Still sometimes wish that GoI would grow a pair and confront these guys. A little push back would go a long way in changing the perception of Indians.

brihaspati · Post by **brihaspati** » 17 Jul 2013 17:20

Well, both the Arabs and the Indians were screwed by the Europeans, especially the Brits. Indians even got "freedom" by peacefully no-fisticuff-fighting. Arabs got it by compromise and religious alliance, no fighting though.

But see - how much more the Indian mind remains colonized: so many voices here trying desperately to find every possible reason to look for blame in the Indian supposed-victim for what he got, before trying to rationally and coolly, shall I say with clinical and professional detachment - the 201 reasons as to why the Arab behaved so. No such rational reason and justification finding for the Indian - assumed to be more likely to have broken rules, driving laws, etiquette ityadi.

All the emotional vituperation on the Indian - but oh, no, respectful, kind, considerate - reason finding for the Arab onlee.

Wah kya baat hai! The Arab is right in his behaviour - he is treating a slave as a slave.

rajithn · Post by **rajithn** » 17 Jul 2013 17:20

chanakyaa wrote: My dear Rony, or whatever your name is. It is very easy to pick videos off internet from lowest denominators of the society and conveniently generalize. Your conclusion that the person in video is an Indian, suggests that you know the person well (friend or relative), else your assumption deserves further scrutiny. It is fairly easy to pick candidates from lowest denominator of population, regardless of race, ethnicity or religion and generalize for the whole. I could make the same argument about wealthiest nations on earth using people who are on welfare, mainstream getting screwed by bankers blah...blah...blah; and then question why don't they retaliate. At some point in time Jewsish population could not protect themselves from Hitler; but today wars can't be fought without their money (i.e. consent). World asked the same question, why don't jews retaliate? You have no idea that the arap in the video is indirectly getting screwed by other powerful nations, not physically but strategically. If you understood the gravity, you would have asked a question, why doesn't that arap retaliate? But, I know you wont. Please, please try to grow up. Listen to what your mother said, eat your veggies and don't forget the calcium.

An excuse couldn't be lamer!

brihaspati · Post by **brihaspati** » 17 Jul 2013 17:27

Nations which get respect, and get away with the vilest of acts without any retribution whatsoever - like the Brits or the USA or China or Pakis or Saudis - usually have their first reaction on their respective nationals being in the right and justified - whatever be the actual incident. Then when allegation against their national becomes indisputable, they start "rationalizing" and justifying what their national had done. Even there they would try and support them and reduce their penalties and retributions - whether by hook crook or legal.

This is what Indians should learn. Your first emotional response should be - my brother and sister cannot do wrong. Of he she has done something then he/she was provoked. There are 201 cool, rational, plausible clinical reasons as to why he/she did it. And we will still try to help him or her out with as little damage as possible.

That is when you get nationals giving lives and loyalties for you as a nation.

Rony · Post by **Rony** » 17 Jul 2013 17:56

brihaspati wrote:But see - how much more the Indian mind remains colonized: so many voices here trying desperately to find every possible reason to look for blame in the Indian supposed-victim for what he got, before trying to rationally and coolly, shall I say with clinical and professional detachment - the 201 reasons as to why the Arab behaved so. No such rational reason and justification finding for the Indian - assumed to be more likely to have broken rules, driving laws, etiquette ityadi.

All the emotional vituperation on the Indian - but oh, no, respectful, kind, considerate - reason finding for the Arab onlee.

Wah kya baat hai! The Arab is right in his behaviour - he is treating a slave as a slave.

Exactly ! There is something wrong with us if everything is visible in front of us but we still give chankian reasons and justifications for inaction !

brihaspati wrote:This is what Indians should learn. Your first emotional response should be - my brother and sister cannot do wrong. Of he she has done something then he/she was provoked. There are 201 cool, rational, plausible clinical reasons as to why he/she did it. And we will still try to help him or her out with as little damage as possible.

Indians actually do this but only on personnel and family level. Look at how the "secular" politicians, elite, business people and even the working class or the ROP types singlemindedly protect the crooks in their family or community. But when it comes to nation or national interests, we try to find many chankian justifications for inaction.

rsingh · Post by **rsingh** » 17 Jul 2013 19:05

Indian are treated even worse then that in India. Nobody mind that. Secondly why Indians are there? Because they need work and Araps are like that. They have a fear based society. Rich Arap won't mind if an even richer Arap ****** his wife. I wonder why Indian Europeans (do not know about others) would go to buy property (actually long term lease)in Dubai where they are not treated as equals.
All my friends bought things there but I can't even think of that. Living under the rule of Barbaerians who have no idea of human rights, no respect for other religions .......not me. Self respect in more important then earning. And I do my bit..................never used Arabian Airlines, never bought any product where something is written in Arabic ( stranded procedure in old Europe).

brihaspati · Post by **brihaspati** » 17 Jul 2013 19:52

Rony ji,
I should have been more explicit - I meant by "brother or sister" as any average Indian out there at the receiving end of stuff, however deserving they might be of that reception. Not just family relations. People have tried to put me in trouble over such interventions. But there are times when you need to feel the lion roar inside you. Whatever be the consequences.

habal · Post by **habal** » 17 Jul 2013 20:22

Can't count the number of times in India that my vehicle has been banged from the sides by a jerk cutting in .. so not very possible to take an extremely idealistic view here. Previous such instance was as recent as last week. Those in the grind, usually don't tend towards idealism. Oily Araps are usually considered as sub-humans who got into wealth in Indic circles, so there is not much debate towards their behaviour. But one thing I noted was the way, the Indian stood cowering with no attempt to resist or even stand the ground without retaliating. That is a feature usually seen in feudalistic societies where there is a strong lord-serf relationship of unequals. This behaviour is learnt from observing and living in such feudalistic societies.

One can see many a time in North India, when such altercation in traffic or roadside takes place that two parties take similar positions and the victim of such treatment begins to cower without even a semblance of retaliation or standing ground. Especially if the other party is a police man and the victim is a nepali or bihari labour or general challenged-type who is struggling to make ends meet. The submission is complete. Atleast this used to be the case earlier, can't say what recent sociological changes may have occured.

Gagan · Post by **Gagan** » 18 Jul 2013 04:50

habal wrote:David Cameron accused of betraying Syrian rebels

Syria's top rebel commander has accused David Cameron of betrayal after the Prime Minister abandoned plans to arm the Syrian opposition..
The Russian Today channel has further put a spin on top of this apparent disinfo by claiming that Turkish airbase has been used for this alleged attack. Thus for first time an Islamic nation has allowed use of it's territory by Israel to attack a fellow muslim country. This is supposed to keep Erdogan dancing on unstable ground wrt to domestic opinion. CNN has reported that Erdogan is losing support from even his core rural support base.

The Israeli attack on the Syrian-North Korean reactor in Deir ez-Zor during Operation Orchard, was also likely done via the Turkish route. That site is far away from israel, and very close to the Turkish-Syrian border, and there is open desert in the middle - no military base or even a decent town in that desert. OTOH any other approach from Israel to that site is littered with SAM batteries.

habal · Post by **habal** » 18 Jul 2013 09:21

for all the time they keep talking of the muslim chummah .. the relentless backstabbing amongst these on various pretexts is mind-numbing. that particular attack or non-attack has been turned into psy-ops by the Russians against the Turks. If such an attack had actually taken place, I don't doubt Syria would have missed any opportunities to take pot-shots at Erdogan's complicity.

some comment in NYtimes

JHawkwood, Italy
Since I have spent time in in the Arab Region I never believed Assad would fall. I believe the blood of 90,000 Syrian is on the hands of the US, Europe and certain Arab countries. If they had taken a peaceful political approach Syria might have inched more towards reform and not war as it was already moving in that direction. The West was naive in their understanding of the situation. The propaganda machine painted him as a dictator when he fact he was the head of a coalition government (Yes, they were government parties but it was a coalition) with strong support. Now look at what you have. 20,000 Hezbollah fighters sitting on Israel's border. Islamic extremists in the North and East.
When will the US start getting this right? Stop viewing Iran as an enemy and negotiate a relationship. In an odd way, this is a worse blunder than Iraq.

suddenly nytimes has very reasonable articles and is now painting assad as a benign dictator, compared to alternatives.

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 19 Jul 2013 01:29

So Arab Spring is turning into Arab Summer and soon will become Arab Winter of discontent

Night watch 17 July 2013

Comment: The ripple effects of the Egyptian Army's ouster of President Mursi are strong in all states that experienced the so-called Arab Spring. That is because military forces were responsible for the overthrows of Ben Ali, Mubarak, Qadhafi and Saleh. All were coups or partial coups that exploited the public demonstrations.

In Tunisia, the presidential guard, not the street protestors, overthrew Ben Ali. That puts in perspective President Marzouki's meeting with the chief of the ground forces plus his stress on its national defense mission and its role in assisting the police. Marzouki did not mention any responsibility for protecting the political order. That is the mission that the Erdogan government is seeking to eliminate for the Turkish armed forces.

One should gork why do these military overthrow the civilian heads of got using the protestors cover? Where else did we see this before?

svinayak · Post by **svinayak** » 19 Jul 2013 01:34

THey are working on a mini spring action in Nai DIlli during the election in OCt. The same international force - internationalists, activists coordinated from Uncle is using the discontent educated Muslim youth age group 20-30 years to create protest.

This age group is a experimental group based on 20 years of global change on Islamic countries. Look for Indian groups to join the so called spring movement

Kati · Post by **Kati** » 19 Jul 2013 02:30

So old Aunt Betsy (UK) has formally abandoning the plan to arm the syrian rebels...
...steam has run out for the rebels...

http://www.reuters.com/article/2013/07/ ... 6K20130718

Now it's time for old Uncle Sam to follow the aunt....

I was waiting for Shyamd-ji's "something significant" to happen....still waiting......