Indian Response to Terrorism

[RayC]

R Vaidyanathan's article is a very interesting take.

It is like the Chinese game of 'Go', which is a strategic board game for two players. It is known as wéiqí in Chinese.

[Philip]

The best that can be hoped for is for Pakistan to be declared a terrorist state/rogue state by the US and international community if they do not hand over terror suspects wanted by India who are squatting in style in the salubrious "Pakland" under the protection of the Paki military/ISI.This will stop all military and economic aid to Pak,which is what India wants.The constant appeasement of Pak by the US/west with huge largesse,as it threw away billions in Iraq to fund militant groups-Musharrat got $10 billion ostensibly to fight the Taliban.Where has this moolah gone?

In these circumstances of non-cooperation with India,by not handing over terror suspects who have also killed many westerners,India must take the strongest action against pak diplomatically first,then by covert ops if the situ remains the same.Pak has to be isolated and ostracised and any nation that consorts with it by selling it arms and weapon systems, should receive the "cold shoulder" of India,both from the GOI nd the public through boycotting their products..

[disha]

...In these circumstances of non-cooperation with India,by not handing over terror suspects who have also killed many westerners,India must take the strongest action against pak diplomatically first,then by covert ops if the situ remains the same.Pak has to be isolated and ostracised and any nation that consorts with it by selling it arms and weapon systems, should receive the "cold shoulder" of India,both from the GOI nd the public through boycotting their products..

I am writing after so many days - the shock and pain has still to wear off. The only thing I can say of Indian Response to Terrorism

NONE

And yes that is a four letter word. Shame on us for allowing such a situation to come to pass.

[SaiK]

* .............
* Pakistan not to hand over Mumbai terror suspects to India
* US to Pak: Ensure there are no more terror attacks
* ...............

while we can find humpteen reasons about our gov, what about US gov? they are pussyfooting now.

-> acceptance of non-state actors
-> ensure no more attacks -> meaning, they are happy now!
-> no reaction to nato/un trucks being burnt.

Must call for making pakistan a state sponsor of terrorism. Let the powers and force be with civil society.

[RajeshA]

X-Posting from "India-Russia News and Analysis" Thread:

The Russian caution is what is needed in this complex situation.First,India must provide the international community,especially its mdia, overwhelming evidence of the Pak /Pak nationals masterplan of terror.That the international media is behind India for once is being seen,perhaps as many westerners and Jews were victims too.Taking the issue to the UN to label Pak a rogue state supporting terror,thus worthy of sanctions,economic and military would cut at the heart of the Paki military.Ilabelling individuals like Lt.Gen.Hamid Gul and others as war criminals/terrorist masterminds,whatever is also needed.But apart from this diplomatic campaign,where Russia will help as it has done in the past,we should keep all our options open and not be misled by the US,whose loyalty to Pakistan in the past and present is a factor that must be taken into account.The rep[ort that the US has "allowed India one strike in Kashmir",is an insult if true.We are not a colony of the US and reserve the righ5t to strike as many times if neccessary.

India must win the propaganda war first,equally important as the real war.The Russians saw this happen in Georgia,where the western media went for Russia initialy,but have now relented upon the initial attack from Georgia.Right now,Germany is negotiating with Pak for German U-214 subs to be built,Brazil is selling 100 ASMs and Sweden is selling AWACS
aircraft.We must lobby these countries not to sell their defence hardware to Pak,which is always used against India.If they still do,then we must trat them like dirt,expose them in the media and ask corporate India to boycott their chief products like Mercs,BMWs and Audis.Pressurise paramount not to buy any more Embraer aircraft.No Volvos from Sweden.You get the picture.Then we take action if neccessary at a time and place of our choosing.

Philip,
I too have been calling for a UN Resolution (post 1 and post 2).

There is sympathy in the international community at the moment for India. If India can establish credible evidence for an international audience, it will be difficult for the many countries to side openly with Pakistan and block such a resolution. Every body in the international community is aware that Pakistan is becoming a failed state with a big terror infrastructure intact there and would be willing to create some UN process tailor-cut for Pakistan to address the situation there. This is effectively curtailing Pakis' sovereignty.

This would be useful in the next terror strikes on India, because India through this UN Process may have a mechanism and a legal right to intervene in Pakistan's lawlessness.

Tactically, we should be willing to go ahead with a weak resolution if it seems there is a better chance that it passes. I am however sure, that once the culpability of Pakistan has been accepted, it will be possible to throw in additional constraints on Pakistan, including an arms embargo.

However India should never make our actions contingent upon UN Resolutions. It may be accepted or it may not be accepted. India however has been attacked and has an intrinsic right to defend herself.

For those in Pakistan, who have been dreaming of a re-hyphenation with India, they should understand, that that would never happen, as Pakistan would be known as a terrorist state by the UN. If that is not a slap on the H&D of Pakistan, then I don't know what is.

[Madhusudhan]

This would be useful in the next terror strikes on India, because India through this UN Process may have a mechanism and a legal right to intervene in Pakistan's lawlessness.

All wars of self-defense have a legal basis in International law. There is no UN resolution needed for India to punish Pakistan now. There is nothing the International community can do about it.

[surinder]

Shock and awe the TSP's Economy


http://www.dnaindia.com/report.asp?newsid=1212468

Rvaidya

Dear R. Vaidya:

Interesting article. Good job on articulating a vision. I had a few points:

1) I do not agree with the idea that we should give visas to capable TSPians. US, UK, etc. have given such visas with no gain whatsover. This is a country that is driven by these things. We, by most reckoning, millions of Pakistanis in India anyways. At the time of partition, many who actively voted for and fought for Pakistan, stayed back to be Indian citizens. None of these have helped India. The RAPES would get Indian citizenship, and they become Indian in name only, sympathisizing with the idea of Pakistan, as well as being its silent supporters.

2) Regarding applying pressure on countries that supply arms to Pakistan. Can someone who has knowledge of economics, finaance, and has the numbers and see the numbers? Do we even have money power to go to Germany, or Brazil, or Sweden and tell them not to sell to Pakistan, else face economic consequences from India? I don't know the numbers, but I doubt if we can.


Thanks.

PS: An aside, India claims itself to be a scientific superpower etc. But we recently bought a whole bunch of plains from Brazil. I am shocked, with all the scientific talent in India, we needed to goto Brazil. Another aspect of your article must be to make India rely more on its own for defence needs.

[John Snow]

Nothing is more dumb than going to UN to seek permission, It will set a bad precedent. We have had enough of experience by going to UN about J&K.


Every nation has rights to defend it self against aggression and unproved terror attacks.

We are not going to war for some natural resources monopoly.

[surinder]

The best that can be hoped for is for Pakistan to be declared a terrorist state/rogue state by the US and international community ...

Funny thing is that India has long wished to see the US declare Pakistan a terrorist sponsor nations, without doing it itself!!!

[sum]

Pathetic situation that a country calling itself a "rising superpower" and having a 1.1 Billion strong army has to beg the US to prtoect itself and act against its attackers. what a farce!!!

[Philip]

Yes Rajesh,guys,particularly when Pak "resuses to hand over" suspects when it has done before sending some of them them to the US.Double standards can't be played out at the UN to fool the international community.barring China,who will support Pak's stand on terror,when "all (terrorist) roads lead to Pak?" However,this calls for some innovative and sustained diplomacy.EWe need a Krishna Menon or a Dixit right now.All we have is the "headless chicken!"

[brihaspati]

Will the Indian elite go for the jugular or just light more candles and scream at the formless/ nameless political class before TV cameras? It is going to be a long haul and may be in a decade or so, we can find a solution to our existential crisis of being attacked by barbarians from the West. We need to combine strategy and patience and completely throw to the dustbin the ‘Gujral Doctrine’ by that mumbling Prime Minister about treating younger brothers with equanimity.

The doctrine essentially suggests that if we are slapped on both the cheeks we should feel bad that we do not have a third cheek to show. He, according to security experts, seems to have dismantled our human intelligent assets inside Pakistan, which has resulted in the gory death of thousands of Indian citizens in the last few years. Such is our strategic thinking in this complex world since our political class is not adequately briefed and the elite don’t think through issues. Better to be simple in our talks and vicious in our actions rather than the other way.

Hopefully, this November attack will create a new vibrant India capable of taking care of its own interests.

An excellent article, but fundamentally flawed. What he wants is a societal transition from one viewpoint and doctrine to another - and he relies on exactly the class that allowed the situation to come to this pass. He is relying on the creamy layer in a "numbers game" democracy - where the most natural tendency of a highly fragmented society will be to form easy-going elite who are basically opportunists. These do not have stake in an identity with a nation - it doesn't exist for them. Why do you think Indian society repeatedly threw up elite who advocated collaboration with invaders or not uniting together with apparent enemies within the "nation" to defeat the invader - think of the Brahmin minister of Prithviraj III who stopped a young Prithviraj from coordinating with the Chalukyas and trap and exterminate Ghori. Same goes for Jayachand - compare this with the disparate and competitive European armies of Austria, Prussia, Russia and England uniting against Bonaparte. What made the houses of Amber/Jodhpur join the Mughals and to the extent that some Rajput clans gave their daughters in marriage to the Mughals (well same less publicised cases happened under the Sultans like the case of mother of Firuz) while others like in Mewar (mostly with a few exceptions) stuck to their guns? Siddharaj Jayasimha of Gujarat patronized, protected and allowed Muslims to flourish in Gujarat all the while the North was being ravaged, and thus prepare grounds for the success of Ulugh Khan in a land that successfully resisted the Ghori hordes? It was mainly (1) personal gain from trade/concessions/wealth (2) using the threat of foreign horde to preserve power in domestic politics (3) the stupid folly of hoping to use the foreign hordes in finishing off domestic enemies (4) the attitude that everything is a commodity - "a banyiafication of all values", loyalty, nationhood, ideology, one's people, ones family, even sons, daughters, wives - everything can be "sold" in exchange for life, limb or consumption. This is the fundamental cancer and needs a long hard, but uncompromising ideological struggle, and the best point is not to look at the "elder elite" - look at youth across all sections to try an recreate these values and identities for them while it still has some hope of being successful.

I worked academically with someone from Israel, who described his early life at the Kibbutzs, and about how the Sabras took vows of not going for trinkets/dolling up until the nation survived - this is the stuff, that makes nations.

[Philip]

Pakistan's Mumbai Arrest: Will It Satisfy India?
By Madhur Singh / New Delhi
Monday, Dec. 08, 2008

After a week of breathing fire on Pakistan for failing to crack down on the militant group Lashkar-e-Toiba (LeT), which India blames for orchestrating the lethal Mumbai attacks of last month, New Delhi reacted with caution to reports of a Pakistani raid that led to the arrest of an alleged Mumbai mastermind. Indian security analysts are concerned that the move may be a feint by Pakistan's all-powerful military to buy time. "If the reports are true, the raids show some movement forward," says defense expert C. Uday Bhaskar. "But given how the civilian and military establishments are aligned in Pakistan, it is always a case of two steps forward, one step backward."

Why India Is Still Skeptical of Pakistan's Anti-Terror Efforts

The US Challenge After Mumbai: Cooling India-Pakistan Tensions

The raid in Muzaffarabad, the capital of the Pakistani half of the disputed territory of Kashmir, targeted the main local office of the Jama'at-ud-Da'awa (JuD), a charitable organization that terrorism experts say became the legal front of the banned LeT. Soldiers entered the office after a 3 p.m. deadline for its occupants to surrender had passed. Some 30 people fled. Local residents report that they heard fighting and machine-gun fire but no heavy weapons. The army has refused to comment. Latif Akbar, a leader of the ruling Pakistan Peoples Party in Muzaffarabad, told TIME that he's "very worried about the law-and-order situation. There will be retaliatory attacks [by militants] for sure." (See pictures of Mumbai as it sifts through the rubble.)

Among those reportedly taken into custody was Zaki-ur-Rehman Lakhvi, who India believes was in charge of training LeT operatives for suicide attacks. Indian authorities refused to comment on the reports, saying they were awaiting official confirmation from the Pakistani government that they had acted on a diplomatic protest served on the Pakistan High Commissioner to New Delhi on Dec. 2, seeking "strong action" against those responsible for the Mumbai attacks. (See pictures of Mumbai's days of terror.)

Indian security analysts, meanwhile, were not only reticent but also skeptical of both the Pakistani authorities' ability and their willingness to crack the whip on the many terrorist groups operating on Pakistani soil. Mistrust of the Inter-Services Intelligence (ISI) runs deep among Indian intelligence and security circles — far more than in the U.S. — particularly since the late 1980s, when the ISI was accused of aiding a fierce insurgency in India's border state of Punjab. Many believe that the ISI-Pakistani-army nexus holds the country in a vise, severely curtailing any civilian government's power to take any meaningful action against the many terrorist movements operating in Pakistan, whether on the border with Afghanistan or in Kashmir.

Vikram Sood, former head of India's external intelligence agency, the Research and Analysis Wing (R&AW), is even more skeptical and thinks the raid may only be a means to buy time. "It would be quite surprising for the Pakistani army to do this," he says. "The LeT has been their favorite." He points out that no raid has taken place at the JuD headquarters in the city of Muridke near Lahore. The LeT allegedly morphed into the JuD after 2001, when the LeT was banned by Pakistan after it was accused of masterminding a botched yet deadly attack on the Indian Parliament. The JuD denies it is the same organization. However, it continues to be headed by Hafiz Saeed, the LeT founder who figures on India's most-wanted list. (See more pictures of the Mumbai massacre.)

A day before the raid, TIME spoke with Muhammad Yahya Muhahid, the JuD's secretary of information, who defended Hafiz Saeed, saying he is merely a religious scholar and cleric, denying his role in any of the terrorist acts. "Our organization has again and again made it public that it has no relations with the Lashkar-e-Toiba," Muhahid said. "Hafiz Saeed does not head the Lashkar-e-Toiba. The Jama't-ud-Da'awa does not consider any activity, carried out by any person, group or state, in any place, anywhere in the world, in which unarmed civilians and public places are targeted, to be right. We have already condemned the Mumbai attacks." Muhahid said that "India wants to implicate him just to protect its own Hindu extremists."

Responding to speculation that India might stage military strikes against institutions and camps it believes may be LeT-militant strongholds in Pakistan, Muhahid said, "If our educational facilities are attacked, we will put pressure on our government to respond to India in the same coin."

In India, there is pressure for continued pressure on Pakistan. Even so, says former Indian intelligence chief Sood, things will get a lot worse before they get any better. "Just today there's been an attack on 160 NATO vehicles in northwestern Pakistan," he says. "I expect more bombings, even in Pakistan. There's going to be no let-up. There may be more suicide bombings." He says the task of ridding Pakistan of terrorists cannot be left to the Pakistani authorities. "It should be taken up by an international force," he says.

Many analysts are doubtful about the significance of the Muzaffarabad raid because they believe Pakistan's past attempts to crack down on terrorists have been merely cosmetic. "They have banned organizations, taken their leaders in custody, then put them under house arrest, only to release them and let them get back to their activities," says B. Raman, former head of the counterterrorism wing of the R&AW. "They need to show us that this time it will not be a farce. They should either deport those accused of the Mumbai attacks or allow an Indian police team to visit Pakistan and interrogate them." Raman believes greater pressure from the U.S. and from Israel, which lost nine citizens in the Mumbai carnage, may make a crucial difference this time. "As of now, there is tremendous anger among the Americans and the Israelis," he says. "But we need to see how things will be two, three months later." —With reporting by Ershad Mahmud / Rawalkot

[brihaspati]

Just an idea - given that the Delhites do seem to think security a non-issue, and trade-commerce-corruption the best bet, wouldn't it actually help them to remove the one source of attracting terror-attacks? Has anyone considered moving the capital away from Delhi to a more central or southern location - further away from the reach of Pakibani or Chini missiles? Before you start jumping with the Tughlaq gaffe, maybe consider that the capital of Mauryan empire that ruled even Afghanistan was in Patna, and the British managed all their expansion from Calcutta - it was all downhill basically for them when they moved to Delhi! Is there something in the soil around Delhi that saps the will to resist and rather makes one more prone to fall in love with foreign hordes-look at what happened to the Sultanate and the Mughals and the British and Nehru I, Nehru III, Nehru IV, ......!

[NRao]

The R Vaidyanathan suggestions will NOT work.

D Company, for instance, has Indian support. Which is why it is STILL functioning in Mumbai.

Similarly, there are others within India (and perhaps even in other countries) that will get hurt by such sanctions.

That article is TOO logical for it to be implemented.

[vsudhir]

RajeshA and philip, someone high up is listening keenly to your arguments!

India to give ultimatum to UN Security Council on Pakistan

Not satisfied by Pakistan clamping down on the terror group Lashkar-e-Taiba (LeT) – blamed for the Mumbai blasts, including shutting down of their training camps in the Pakistan-occupied Kashmir (PoK) and alleged detention of senior LeT leaders – India is bracing to haul Pakistan over coal at the UN Security Council.

It is an ultimatum of sorts by India, and it is expected to underscore that in case the international community fails to take urgent action, “India will take action that it deems fit to safeguard its citizens”.

This is the strongest ever indictment of Pakistan by India, and moving away from the semantics New Delhi is expected to tell the world body that if enough pressure is not put on Pakistan to hand over those behind Mumbai attacks, besides the handover of fugitives like Dawood Ibrahim, then it will take appropriate action.

[John Snow]

Going to UN is big time trouble. It will bring back all the dirty linen into public with lot of garbage dumped at India's door.

Bad Bad Bad move IMHO.

Probably one more excuse for GOI under MMS not to act. Its Holiday season, I dont know what the UNSC will do till new year...

[NRao]

NPR, this morning, reported that the pressure that MMS faced for a "military option", has faded because his party won 5 states.

Indian political entities cannot survive a "retaliation" from Pakistan. Which is bound to come IF any action by India "hurts" the Pakistani military establishment. Islamists have a take down mentality that India in general and the Indian politicians in particular cannot take (bardash?).

And, corruption completes the circle.

From an Indian political PoV, the Mumbai attacks were of really no consequence - just part of the territory. IF India could live with Kashmir since 1990, what is Mumbai? Even IF nukes were not a part of the equation I have to wonder how many think that India would act decisively against Pakistan even in today's environment.

Even the US is acting in her own interest. The US can pressure Pakistan knowing that the real pressure would be against India. LeT has been fighting the US in A'stan for years now, but THE "pressure" was never applied on LeT until now.

I really cannot see India doing anything worth the salt we have till India cleans her own house first.

[SaiK]

can't blame pakis, indian babooze, etc.. you have 1/2 billion more such kinds in different types and classifications within..

[NRao]

Mumbai Attacks Fuel Demand for Security Products

[NRao]

Indian Voters Spurn BJP

[NRao]

U.S. Seeks Financial Blacklist for Some Pakistanis (via UN)

[shiv]

Going to UN is big time trouble. It will bring back all the dirty linen into public with lot of garbage dumped at India's door.

Bad Bad Bad move IMHO.

Probably one more excuse for GOI under MMS not to act. Its Holiday season, I dont know what the UNSC will do till new year...

Snow garu - when one country attacks another I will give ALL POSSIBLE responses and you have to choose the best one:

1) Send fax
2) Release white paper
3) Go to UN
4) Have cabinet meeting
5) Send armed forces on leave
6) Hope that US/NATO will do some job for us
7) Appeal for calm
8) Lose sleep
9) Give bhashan
10) Make phone call

There is nothing else that is possible when a country is attacked, and India has chosen more than one option. You should be proud. Not critical.

[Rye]

Going to the UN will only complicate matters for India....you would think the GoI would have learnt that over 60 years of getting shafted by the UN mofos. But then, these are the same people have not let 100s of terrorist attacks affect their sleep or diet. Never mind, let me get back to watching some paint dry on the wall nearby...definitely more useful that watching the Indian response to terrorism.

[ramana]

From an Indian political PoV, the Mumbai attacks were of really no consequence - just part of the territory. IF India could live with Kashmir since 1990, what is Mumbai? Even IF nukes were not a part of the equation I have to wonder how many think that India would act decisively against Pakistan even in today's environment.

Sadly I had come to same conclusion on Sunday night when I had my talk with a neighbor.

The UPA seems to think it can go to the UN as an aggreived party a la Draupadi to force them to take action or else India will act. However these charlatans ahve blunted and defanged Indian military capability. So the appeal to UN will be ignored and worse made to look like an out of turn compliant. In the end John Snow's laments will come true.
India is still going to the UN as a supplicant rather than one who demands action because they blunted the capability in many ways.

I otherwords a toothless tiger will get no respect.

[svinayak]

From an Indian political PoV, the Mumbai attacks were of really no consequence - just part of the territory. IF India could live with Kashmir since 1990, what is Mumbai? Even IF nukes were not a part of the equation I have to wonder how many think that India would act decisively against Pakistan even in today's environment.

Sadly I had come to same conclusion on Sunday night when I had my talk with a neighbor.

The UPA seems to think it can go to the UN as an aggreived party a la Draupadi to force them to take action or else India will act. However these charlatans ahve blunted and defanged Indian military capability. So the appeal to UN will be ignored and worse made to look like an out of turn compliant. In the end John Snow's laments will come true.
India is still going to the UN as a supplicant rather than one who demands action because they blunted the capability in many ways.

I otherwords a toothless tiger will get no respect.

This is a leadership vacuum

[Raju]

there is no need for such doom & gloom. Congress will not win more than 10 seats in LS elections.

[Nesoj]

Now that the intelligentsia have conducted their mandatory 'candlelit vigils' in our cities, the 'aam janata' are protesting what is more important to them

I was astonished to read about 'street corner protests' in TN

Street corner protests are being organised by the parties like the MDMK across Tamil Nadu. This is the anger directed at Sri Lanka`s army chief General Sarath Fonseca.

Were there any such 'street corner' protests against the terror attacks ??? It just proves that 'Security' is least among the priorities of India's 'aam janata'. Brethren in Sri Lanka are apparently more important that 'those Bombaywallas in Mumbai'

Raju said
there is no need for such doom & gloom. Congress will not win more than 10 seats in LS elections.

better be prepared to eat your words - Wouldn't be surprised if they increase their seats over last time
And even if they get only 10 seats .... who would get the spillover ?? BJP of Kandahar / Parliament attack fame ???

[NRao]

This is a leadership vacuum

I think it is much, much deeper.

I think that Indian politicians have become very comfortable with the situation. How does this Mumbai attack impact them for sure or even the Indian people? Mumbai has been traumatised to some extent, it will revive.

The rest of the country will go back to Bollywood and cricket. They ALL have got used to getting water from a water truck, total lack of hygiene, no secure worthwhile jobs, making ends meet everyday, having to travel most of their lives, etc. Once in a while a piece of news lights up the nation - +ve and -ve. But there is never a determined, prolonged, even effort to clean up anything.

Inertia.

Pakis have the same, but it is religion driven.

This is a vision vacuum. need a Kalam.

[surinder]

Anyone listen int to the Diane Rheem show on NPR this morning? A BBC lady was filling in and the topic was Mumbai.

It is interesting to see what the american (or Western) view of that situation. Infact, all we really see and hear is that view. The show wasn't all bad, but one caller a Muaslim said that he is moderate & secular and this kind of attacks hurt izlaam. I thought the caller was sincere and good person who was genuinely hurt by the attack. But the panelists, went on an attack on "Hindoo fundamentalists". So if a muaslim man indulges in such acts, the Hindoo fandoos get blamed still. Anyways, one panelists (did nto catch name) had written an article for NYT yesterday or so where he stated that Mumbai attacks have changed the geopolitical alignment---now South Asia must be considered as part of the Middle East, since they are all the same. That was humiliating. I should search for the NYT article of this gentleman.

[SaiK]

why aren't we matured enough to take this party centric voting to policy centric democratic voting. parties may come, parties may go based on incumbancy, governance, doing the job, keeping up with policies, measures and matrix., but our policies must go and keep maturing.

[NRao]

why aren't we matured enough to take this party centric voting to policy centric democratic voting. parties may come, parties may go based on incumbancy, governance, doing the job, keeping up with policies, measures and matrix., but our policies must go and keep maturing.

For democracy to function it NEEDS litrate (not educated) people. Among other things. India is going backward in this matter - democracy.

[SaiK]

litrate (not educated) people.

I thought literacy was inclusive in education.

[Rahul M]

there is no need for such doom & gloom. Congress will not win more than 10 seats in LS elections.

anyway, with the election results out, now do people understand what I have been trying to convey since day one ?

the political parties, especially the current one in power does not take strong actions against terrorism/pakistan because they find NO electoral benefits from it.

neither are they 'punished' if they fail to do so. delhi is a prime example.
even the bjp might question the linking of electoral dividends with the security plank.

fact is, outside of BRF, few people =< low/middle class income group care about terrorism.
and the politicians won't budge unless that changes.
moreover, development and security are considered entirely different issues by most, including the 'hard on terror' parties.

borrowing a phrase from hollywood, the Indian politician says "show me the vote in it !"
till he sees the vote in it, be ready to live with terrorism, after all such things happen in a 'big country like India'.

JMT and all that.

[Lalmohan]

the electoral results are actually much more damning about the public's faith in the BJP - they promised much but did nothing, e.g. economy and defense... so stick to the devil you know

[SaiK]

to put something important here.. just for comparison. there could be retribution to response on terrorism, here.

[Raju]

there is no need for such doom & gloom. Congress will not win more than 10 seats in LS elections.

remember my nukkad predictions and how they have a habit of coming true.

[surinder]

I found it: The article in NYT was by Robert Kaplan.

http://www.nytimes.com/2008/12/08/opini ... ef=opinion

[svinayak]

Fascinating Article which shows how they have been doing social studies and understanding India.

http://www.nytimes.com/2008/12/08/opini ... ef=opinion

Op-Ed Contributor
Trouble in the Other Middle East
By ROBERT D. KAPLAN
Published: December 8, 2008

Washington

THE divisions we split the world into during the cold war have at long last crumbled thanks to the Mumbai terrorist attacks. No longer will we view South Asia as a region distinct from the Middle East. Now there is only one long continuum stretching from the Mediterranean to the jungles of Burma, with every crisis from the Israeli-Palestinian dispute in the west to the Hindu-Muslim dispute in the east interlocked with the one next door.

Yet this elongated Greater Near East does not signify something new but something old.

For significant parts of medieval and early modern history, Delhi was under the same sovereignty as Kabul, yet under a different one from Bangalore. From the 16th to the 18th centuries, the Mughal dynasty, created by Muslims from Central Asia, governed a sprawling empire encompassing northern and central India, almost all of Pakistan and much of Afghanistan — even as Hindu Maratha warriors in India’s south held out against Mughal armies. India’s whole history — what has created its rich syncretic civilization of Turko-Persian gems like the Taj Mahal and the elaborate Hindu temples of Orissa — is a story of waves of Muslim invaders in turn killing, interacting with and ultimately being influenced by indigenous Hindus. There is even a name for the kind of enchanting architecture that punctuates India and blends Islamic and Hindu styles: Indo-Saracenic, a reference to the Saracens, the term by which Arabs were known to Europeans of the Middle Ages.

Hindu-Muslim relations have historically been tense. Remember that the 1947 partition of the subcontinent uprooted at least 15 million people and led to the violent deaths of around half a million. Given this record, the relatively peaceful relations between the majority Hindus and India’s 150 million Muslims has been testimony to India’s successful experiment in democracy. Democracy has so far kept the lid on an ethnic and religious divide that, while its roots run centuries back, has in recent years essentially become a reinvented modern hostility.

The culprit has been globalization. The secular Indian nationalism of Jawaharlal Nehru’s Congress Party, built around a rejection of Western colonialism, is more and more a thing of the past. As the dynamic Indian economy merges with that of the wider world, Hindus and Muslims have begun separate searches for roots to anchor them inside a bland global civilization. Mass communications have produced a uniform and severe Hinduism from a host of local variants, even as the country’s economically disenfranchised Muslims are increasingly part of an Islamic world community.

The Muslim reaction to this Hindu nationalism has been less anger and violence than simple psychological withdrawal: into beards, skull caps and burkas in some cases; self-segregating into Muslim ghettos in others. The terrorist attacks in Mumbai had a number of aims, one of which was to set a fuse to this tense intercommunal standoff. The jihadists not only want to destroy Pakistan, they want to destroy India as well. India in their eyes is everything they hate: Hindu, vibrantly free and democratic, implicitly and increasingly pro-American, and militarily cozy with Israel. For Washington, this is no simple matter of defending Pakistan against chaos by moving troops from Iraq to Afghanistan. It is a whole region we are dealing with. Thus for the jihadists, the concept of a 9/11-scale attack on India was brilliant.

Just as the chaos in Iraq through early 2007 threatened the post-Ottoman state system from Lebanon to Iran, creeping anarchy in Pakistan undermines not only Afghanistan but also the whole Indian subcontinent. The existence of terrorist outfits like Lashkar-e-Taiba that have links with the Pakistani security apparatus but are outside the control of Pakistan’s own civilian authorities is the very definition of chaos.

A collapsing Pakistan, and with it the loss of any real border separating India from Afghanistan, is India’s worst nightmare. It brings us back toward the borders of the Mughal world, but not in a peaceful way. Indeed, the route that intelligence agencies feel was taken by the fishing boat hijacked by the terrorists — from Porbandar in India’s Gujarat State, then north to Karachi in Pakistan, and then south to Mumbai — follows centuries-old Indian Ocean trade routes.

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The jihadist attack on India’s financial center not only damages Indian-Pakistani relations, but makes Pakistan’s new civilian government — which has genuinely tried to improve ties with India — look utterly pathetic. Thus, the attack weakens both countries. Any understanding over Kashmir, the disputed Muslim-majority territory claimed by Pakistan, is now further than ever from materializing, with mass violence there a distinct possibility.

This, in turn, reduces the chance of an Indian-Pakistani rapprochement on Afghanistan, whose government Pakistan seeks to undermine and India sends millions of dollars in aid to help prop up. The Pakistani security services want a radical Islamized Afghanistan as a strategic rear base against India, while India wants a moderate, secular Afghanistan as a weapon against Pakistan.

Pakistan is not only chaotic but dangerously lonely. Islam has not proved effective in bringing together its regionally based ethnic groups, and thus a resort to a fierce ideology as a unifying device among fundamentalist Muslims has been the country’s signal tragedy. Meanwhile, Pakistan’s military suspects that Washington will desert their nation the moment the leadership of Al Qaeda is, by any chance, killed or captured.

Making matters worse, every time the United States launches an air attack into Pakistan from Afghanistan, it further destabilizes the Pakistani state. That is why the Mumbai attacks bring true joy to the most dangerous elements of the Pakistani security establishment: the tragedy has caused the world to focus on India’s weaknesses — its lax security, its vulnerability to age-old maritime infiltration and, most of all, the constant threat of caste and tribal violence — that have been obscured by its economic success. See, many Pakistanis are saying, your beloved India is not so stable either.

This is nonsense, of course. India, with all its troubles, is far more stable than Pakistan. In the meantime, every day that goes by without riots in India is a defeat for the Mumbai terrorists. Indeed, India’s own Muslims have demonstrated against the attacks.

But India, not just Pakistan, desperately needs help. Just as solving or at least neutralizing the Israeli-Palestinian dispute is a requirement for reducing radicalism and Iranian influence throughout the Levant, the same is true of the Indian-Pakistani dispute at the other end of the Greater Middle East. Our notion of the “peace process” is antiquated and needs expanding. We need a second special negotiator for the Middle East, a skilled diplomat shuttling regularly among New Delhi, Islamabad and Kabul. (There has been some speculation, in fact, that Barack Obama is considering Richard Holbrooke, the former United Nations ambassador, for just such a job.)

The Middle East is back to where it was centuries ago, not because of ancient hatreds but because of globalization. Instead of bold lines on a map we have a child’s messy finger painting, as the circumvention of borders and the ease of communications allow the brisk movement of ideas and people and terrorists from one place to another. Our best strategy is, as difficult and trite as it sounds, to be at all places at once, Not with troops, necessarily, but with every bit of energy and constant attention that our entire national security apparatus — and those of our allies — can bring to bear.

Robert D. Kaplan is a national correspondent for The Atlantic and a senior fellow at the Center for a New American Security.

[ramana]

The Mumbai Terrorist attacks have nothing to do with all those factors that Robert Kaplan a Cold Warrior invokes. Its pure Evil from TSP which parctices killigion.