Light Combat Helicopter: News & Discussion: 10 August 2020

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deejay
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Re: Light Combat Helicopter: News & Discussion: 10 August 2020

Postby deejay » 26 Mar 2021 09:18

ramana wrote:
srai wrote:^^^
HELINA/Dhruvastra is ready on ALH Rudra. There are already for dozens of ALH Rudras in service with the IA/IAF. Let the IA/IAF/MoD/GoI place the order and sign the contract for equipping Rudras first. Haven’t heard movement on that front yet.

One would think the IA/IAF/MoD/GoI would place orders for thousands given that it will arm hundreds of Rudras and in the near future LCHs and LUH. Instead, we may only see a token order. It will be a long drawn out affair.



Just say will integrate the Hellfires from stock as initial capability and see how fast they will agree to the Helina/Dhruvastra orders.


Say it and still nothing will happen. The process is the key. Not wishes.

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Re: Light Combat Helicopter: News & Discussion: 10 August 2020

Postby Kartik » 26 Mar 2021 11:47

LCH in IAF colors

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Re: Light Combat Helicopter: News & Discussion: 10 August 2020

Postby Vivek K » 26 Mar 2021 19:27

Still no orders!

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Re: Light Combat Helicopter: News & Discussion: 10 August 2020

Postby MeshaVishwas » 05 Apr 2021 23:34

A superb run down of the capability of the LCH.

DEAD ops with programmable IIR HeliNa against Giraffes and other such systems?

After all, cooling systems for such items may be a juicy target :twisted:


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Re: Light Combat Helicopter: News & Discussion: 10 August 2020

Postby sooraj » 23 Apr 2021 08:54

Sciinaction
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Amazing edited photos of LCH

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Re: Light Combat Helicopter: News & Discussion: 10 August 2020

Postby Philip » 24 Apr 2021 08:42

LCH prod. in significant numbers must be given the green light asap. Both for our needs and slso to ignite export interest. We have a winner with the LCH.Secondly,after 300 Dhruvs built for the services,its time a renewed export thrust was given as Dhruv has several variants. The Ecuador experience is way in the past. About the issue with folding rotor difficulties for the IN,when the engines are French,why have we not thought of acquiring suitable rotor folding tech. from any major helo OEM? If this issue is resolved to IN satisfaction,dozens of Dhruvs will be ordered for warships saving a lot of moolah avoiding imports.

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Re: Light Combat Helicopter: News & Discussion: 10 August 2020

Postby srai » 24 Apr 2021 15:41

^^^
Couple of options under development

HAL OFFERS NEW SOLUTION FOR NAVAL ALH BLADE FOLDING
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Re: Light Combat Helicopter: News & Discussion: 10 August 2020

Postby Rakesh » 26 Apr 2021 08:32

https://twitter.com/GODOFPARADOXES/stat ... 65827?s=20 ---> LCH launching Mistral ATAM which is a fully digital IR guided fire & forget missile with large off-boresight capability & can be operated at speeds of up to 200 knots and at altitudes exceeding 15,000 feet. Max & Min intercept range 6.5 km & 500 m respectively.

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Re: Light Combat Helicopter: News & Discussion: 10 August 2020

Postby Philip » 27 Apr 2021 11:33

The ALH new blade folding/unfolding daily duty can be easily simulated on land including a pitching platform. Naval technicians could try out the procedure on land ,giving inputs and mods if required, even before tests are done at sea saving time.

What is the LCH's ATGM? That is frankly more important than an AAM,though laudable. Secondly,the cockpit side windows could have small triangular armoured sections at the canopy bottom corner to improve crew protection from small arms fire without impairing visibility.

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Re: Light Combat Helicopter: News & Discussion: 10 August 2020

Postby srai » 27 Apr 2021 12:16

Philip wrote:...

What is the LCH's ATGM? ...


HELINA/Dhruvastra

ALH Mk.4 Rudras with HELINA/Dhruvastra have successfully completed final round of user trials. Now it’s a matter of orders being placed and production commencement.

Pretty much all the weapons on LCH have been first integrated on ALH Rudras. ATGM will be no different. One can be pretty sure a lot of the integration work on LCH has already been done behind the scenes. HAL has been proactive in the recent years with its products doing things in anticipation without waiting for users.

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Re: Light Combat Helicopter: News & Discussion: 10 August 2020

Postby Rahul M » 27 Apr 2021 13:49

This got me thinking, if there are any plans for a retractable landing gear on the lch and what advantages it gives, if any.
Deejay sir ? Hari Nair sir ? Raghu?

sooraj wrote:Sciinaction
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Amazing edited photos of LCH

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Re: Light Combat Helicopter: News & Discussion: 10 August 2020

Postby Zynda » 27 Apr 2021 14:47

Retracting LG lowers drag (depends up on LG and its frontal/side projected areas as well as speed) but again the associated retraction mechanism will add weight penalty, cost & real estate. Another advantage would be reduction in RCS with LG retraction...ultimately a trade-off study (ies) need to be preformed and decision has to be taken. I am quite sure HAL would have performed such studies...in future if the customer requires retracted LG, HAL will need to accommodate the same.

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Re: Light Combat Helicopter: News & Discussion: 10 August 2020

Postby arvin » 27 Apr 2021 15:24

Rakesh wrote:https://twitter.com/GODOFPARADOXES/status/1386483701605965827?s=20 ---> LCH launching Mistral ATAM which is a fully digital IR guided fire & forget missile with large off-boresight capability & can be operated at speeds of up to 200 knots and at altitudes exceeding 15,000 feet. Max & Min intercept range 6.5 km & 500 m respectively.
]


There was a image recently of R73 used as SAM mounted on truck. If we have excess stock due to ASRAAM migration maybe try it on LCH too in air to air mode. Would have greater range than Mistral. Will be able to give air cover from a longer standoff distance. Weight at 100 kg would be an issue. Will have to be mounted on inner pylon.

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Re: Light Combat Helicopter: News & Discussion: 10 August 2020

Postby S_Madhukar » 27 Apr 2021 15:26

Will the landing gear be a problem in forests with dense canopies or urban areas with loose wires ...

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Re: Light Combat Helicopter: News & Discussion: 10 August 2020

Postby sajaym » 27 Apr 2021 19:34

S_Madhukar wrote:Will the landing gear be a problem in forests with dense canopies or urban areas with loose wires ...


Madhukar, if at any time the LCH has gone so low as to touch the dense canopies or loose wires then the pilots already have a BIG problem.

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Re: Light Combat Helicopter: News & Discussion: 10 August 2020

Postby Rakesh » 28 Apr 2021 18:51

https://twitter.com/Amitraaz/status/138 ... 81986?s=20 ---> LSP 1 of the IAF's Light Combat Helicopters (LCH).

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Re: Light Combat Helicopter: News & Discussion: 10 August 2020

Postby Raman » 28 Apr 2021 23:35

The LCH landing gear is an integral part of the crash protection system. Changing to a retractable system will have other major structural implications.

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Re: Light Combat Helicopter: News & Discussion: 10 August 2020

Postby kit » 29 Apr 2021 00:57

Raman wrote:The LCH landing gear is an integral part of the crash protection system. Changing to a retractable system will have other major structural implications.


i was wondering no landing gear shown in above pics ?!., are they retractable in AF versions

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Re: Light Combat Helicopter: News & Discussion: 10 August 2020

Postby Rakesh » 29 Apr 2021 01:07

just artist imagination. no retractable version exists AFAIK.

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Re: Light Combat Helicopter: News & Discussion: 10 August 2020

Postby deejay » 30 Apr 2021 18:52

Rahul M wrote:This got me thinking, if there are any plans for a retractable landing gear on the lch and what advantages it gives, if any.
Deejay sir ? Hari Nair sir ? Raghu?

...


I have no information on retractable landing gear plans but with that tail gear design I don't think it will ever be on agenda.

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Re: Light Combat Helicopter: News & Discussion: 10 August 2020

Postby ramana » 24 May 2021 08:38

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Last edited by nachiket on 24 May 2021 08:41, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Light Combat Helicopter: News & Discussion: 10 August 2020

Postby ramana » 24 May 2021 08:46

Thanks.
Was posting from phone.

Nice weapon suite.
Was wondering if dual launcher for SAAW can be used for the 250 kg bomb locations.

Hope Hari Nair can tell us.

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Re: Light Combat Helicopter: News & Discussion: 10 August 2020

Postby Philip » 24 May 2021 10:15

I was just wonndering looking at the stub wings for the 4 hardpoints,two on each, that if lengthened just a little they could mount wingtip AAMs as well, leaving the underwing pods for air-to-G weaponry. The extra length/ area of the stub wings could also improve lift. Look at the huge wings on our MI-25s which carry an enormous amount of weaponry.

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Re: Light Combat Helicopter: News & Discussion: 10 August 2020

Postby Pratyush » 24 May 2021 10:43

Does the LCH provide enough forward momentum for the utilisation of SAAW.?

Though, your question does fill my brain with the thoughts of a SAAW or smaller sized weapon using the technology developed for it. But adapted as a Helo launched attack drone. Fitted with Nag warhead.


Imagine each of the machines armed with 2 of these drones and 8 ATGM. Operating in enemies rear areas hunting troop and vehicle concentrations.

Or acting as the eyes and ears of the Apache. Or the future Indian heavy attack helicopter in the late 2020s or early 2030.

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Re: Light Combat Helicopter: News & Discussion: 10 August 2020

Postby ks_sachin » 24 May 2021 11:26

Philip wrote:I was just wonndering looking at the stub wings for the 4 hardpoints,two on each, that if lengthened just a little they could mount wingtip AAMs as well, leaving the underwing pods for air-to-G weaponry. The extra length/ area of the stub wings could also improve lift. Look at the huge wings on our MI-25s which carry an enormous amount of weaponry.


What are the tradeoffs in helo's performance?

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Re: Light Combat Helicopter: News & Discussion: 10 August 2020

Postby Pratyush » 24 May 2021 13:01

The main issue with wing tip extension will be the additional weight added to the machine. If the machine was designed to operate primarily in forward flight regime them it would not have major implications.

A machine designed to operate in the nap of the earth flight regime would be so well optimised that it would not really work. Especially, if you consider that the early prototypes of the machines were 65 kg overweight. And a lot of effort was spent in reducing this weight.

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Re: Light Combat Helicopter: News & Discussion: 10 August 2020

Postby ks_sachin » 24 May 2021 13:17

Pratyush wrote:The main issue with wing tip extension will be the additional weight added to the machine. If the machine was designed to operate primarily in forward flight regime them it would not have major implications.

A machine designed to operate in the nap of the earth flight regime would be so well optimised that it would not really work. Especially, if you consider that the early prototypes of the machines were 65 kg overweight. And a lot of effort was spent in reducing this weight.


One of the req of LCH was performing at extreme high altitude. You add weight and guess what you compromise.

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Re: Light Combat Helicopter: News & Discussion: 10 August 2020

Postby titash » 24 May 2021 22:35

ks_sachin wrote:
Pratyush wrote:The main issue with wing tip extension will be the additional weight added to the machine. If the machine was designed to operate primarily in forward flight regime them it would not have major implications.

A machine designed to operate in the nap of the earth flight regime would be so well optimised that it would not really work. Especially, if you consider that the early prototypes of the machines were 65 kg overweight. And a lot of effort was spent in reducing this weight.


One of the req of LCH was performing at extreme high altitude. You add weight and guess what you compromise.


As long as the LCH is qualified for Siaches ops with light armament we have a solid deterrent in place for Kargil & Ladakh style adventurism.

On the other hand, there is no reason to not qualify heavier weaponry for the plains, so you can perform swing role with the same asset. Sacrifice high altitude performance with larger bomb and rocket pods and ATGM payloads so as to stop an armored thrust in Punjab or Thar…no high altitude requirements there. Or perhaps the Rudra already fulfilled that role?

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Re: Light Combat Helicopter: News & Discussion: 10 August 2020

Postby NRao » 25 May 2021 07:29

https://twitter.com/hvtiaf/status/1396979615927652356

(Twitter account of Harsh Vardhan Thakur)

LSP #LCH

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Re: Light Combat Helicopter: News & Discussion: 10 August 2020

Postby srai » 12 Jun 2021 18:28

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Re: Light Combat Helicopter: News & Discussion: 10 August 2020

Postby Maria » 13 Jun 2021 13:51

Is it my amateur mind or does anyone else find that amount of armour too little, what about the fuselage?

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Re: Light Combat Helicopter: News & Discussion: 10 August 2020

Postby ks_sachin » 13 Jun 2021 17:45

Maria wrote:Is it my amateur mind or does anyone else find that amount of armour too little, what about the fuselage?

Perhaps the IAF knows what it wants?

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Re: Light Combat Helicopter: News & Discussion: 10 August 2020

Postby srin » 13 Jun 2021 22:06

^^ And perhaps it'll need a name and role change ? "Slightly heavier" combat helicopter. Not usable now at extreme high altitudes.

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Re: Light Combat Helicopter: News & Discussion: 10 August 2020

Postby Maria » 13 Jun 2021 23:15

ks_sachin wrote:
Maria wrote:Is it my amateur mind or does anyone else find that amount of armour too little, what about the fuselage?

Perhaps the IAF knows what it wants?


I am sure they do, is there no way of applying armour elsewhere on the hepter without a weight penalty? It is apparent that the canopy has been given armoured cover to protect the pilots. However, I don't think in war, bullets would be labeled with the words 'Pilot' or 'Canopy' alone. If the aircraft is expected to outrun AAA or small arms fire, then why the armour in the 1st place? Just thinking Sir, if my thinking is out of line I am happy to be corrected.

I agree with Srin that the LCH is meant to a light and fast marauder of enemy armour and adding more armour would change its class and it would probably need a stronger powerplant. However, I would defer that discussion as this would be OT when the powers to be announce a MCH or AMCH :twisted:

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Re: Light Combat Helicopter: News & Discussion: 10 August 2020

Postby Indranil » 15 Jun 2021 22:27

The other places can take hits and still survive. For example, if you get hit in the fuel tank it is okay.

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Re: Light Combat Helicopter: News & Discussion: 10 August 2020

Postby sankum » 15 Jun 2021 23:50

Self sealing fuel tanks increases survivability..


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Re: Light Combat Helicopter: News & Discussion: 10 August 2020

Postby kit » 24 Jul 2021 23:46

ashishvikas wrote:Exhaust looks upward facing.

https://twitter.com/gaur_av_iation/stat ... 66240?s=20


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