Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan (TSP): Dec. 28, 2010

Baikul · Post by **Baikul** » 05 Jan 2011 22:19

I think we should all support the notion of Taseer's bravery and martyrdom in the face of religious fanaticism. Hopefully, it will encourage more RAPEs to step up, take over from this valiant individual and face down the teeming hordes.

CRamS · Post by **CRamS** » 05 Jan 2011 22:21

Arjun wrote:...And REAL guts to marry an Indian, Tavleen Singh, while already married back home in Pakistan - and then later ditching her when she announced her pregnancy.

I knew he was married to her, but I didn't know this part. Is it really true? As much as I commend Tavleen SinghJi for some her views, particularly on TSP, it seems she also suffered from the same weakness as many Indian elites do even today: enamoured by and falling for TFTA traits without using their brains.

Tasser guy is a prime example of what India, I mean those of us who know the real face of TSP RAPE, are up against. Now this tag that he was "liberal", he was a "brave man (see NYT editorial) taking on extremists" bla bla is thrown about, but the truth is that a TSP RAPE "liberal" is one who likes the $, the whisky, white/elite Indian women, but hates Hindus with all the guts he can muster and is imbued with the TFTA superiority complex over us SDREs, and wouldn't blink an eyelid to use the very pigLeTs who consumed him against us SDREs. This complex truth will never enter the mainstream debate in the aftermath of him departing for the 72, but the simple falsehood that was a "liberal" will be the epitaph on his grave.

Gagan · Post by **Gagan** » 05 Jan 2011 22:24

Err,
How plausible is the theory that the killing of Salman Taseer was a hit?
I mean the Jihadi loving government of punjab and he didn't exactly see eye to eye. The punjab government is the same one with Rana Sanaulla at the interior ministry, who were giving huge monetary grants to the Jamat-ud-dawa just a few months back.
Obviously they are cosy with the Jihadis.

Or the ISI? With ST gone, Zardari loses one major supporting figure - one who actually owns a big media house.

Maybe this was just the oppertunity they were waiting for. He was already an eyesore because of his and his family's lifestyle. His involvement in the blasphemy law was the oppertunity. Things get blamed on a lone fanatic who was acting according to his extreme religious beliefs.

There seems to have been an element of planning that had took place. The assassin actually asked his collegues to take him alive prior to the shooting! Unless proven otherwise, my gut instinct tells me that the assassin has knowledge of the legal loopholes that will be used to extricate him here.

And now the ISI and IB are involved with the investigation. They might not physically hose down this site now, but they will be doing other hosing down for sure with the evidence collected, preservation of the evidence etc.

RamaY · Post by **RamaY** » 05 Jan 2011 22:26

^ THAT is the problem with the silent-India.

Even our own A_Guptaji saw a brave and liberal individual in this Tasser low-life.

Nothing wrong with having such an opinion as an individual. But making national policies based on such wet dreams? That is the sorry state of affairs with MMS-ilk at the helm.

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 05 Jan 2011 22:27

Joseph wrote:
Singha wrote:who was this great thinker (the ambassador), any refs?
The best link that I have found so far.
Hobbling along

Perico, Duke of Amalfi, a former Spanish ambassador to Pakistan, always had it, this country will drift from crisis to calamity, from calamity to catastrophe, and from catastrophe to disaster. This was also in the 1960s — and so it has been. He wrote little, spoke even less, but had a sound perception of the lands in which he served

A_Gupta · Post by **A_Gupta** » 05 Jan 2011 22:30

Gagan wrote:My take on Salmaan Taseer's intent when he took up the mission to go against the blasphemy law is his arrogance.
He thought that belonging to the rich and elite, with his fingers in each pie in Punjab, the support of Zardari (and thereby the west) ensured immunity from the masses. Living in that protective bubble had made him deulsional, cut off from the reality of the real pakistan in the slums and the galis. Well, the protective bubble has just burst, he and the other whiskey swilling elite just got a rude wake up call.

September 2009:
http://www.dailytimes.com.pk/?page=2009 ... 2009_pg3_1

Friday, September 18, 2009
In the aftermath of the death-in-custody of the blasphemy-accused Fanish Masih in Sialkot, the Governor of Punjab, Mr Salmaan Taseer, has courageously called for the repeal of the infamous law targeting the minorities in general and the Christian community in particular. He was echoing the demand being made by protesters in Lahore reacting to the cruel thrashing Christian protesters were given by the police in Sialkot.

Rajdeep · Post by **Rajdeep** » 05 Jan 2011 22:31

Top detective blasts 'culture of silence' that allows Asian sex gangs to groom white girls... because police and social services fear of being branded racist
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article ... itain.html

Police and social services were today accused of fuelling a culture of silence which has allowed hundreds of young white girls to be exploited by Asian men for sex.
New figures suggest that an alarmingly high proportion of prosecutions for on-street grooming of girls aged between 11 and 16 have involved men of Pakistani heritage.

Gagan · Post by **Gagan** » 05 Jan 2011 22:33

Exactly as predicted things seem to be happening.
If BRFites are not nauseated enough, watch this video.
The Herrow gets a herrow's welcome in court, the bar association rises to its expected stance to defend him against 'illegal confinement', and the public are gushing "well done Qadri" all the while.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jn1gWvE17MI
AoA

saket · Post by **saket** » 05 Jan 2011 22:33

Did Taseer ever formally marry Tavleen Singh or he just fathered her son out of wedlock .. ?

Gagan · Post by **Gagan** » 05 Jan 2011 22:35

No Taseer didn't marry Tavleen.
They just spent one week together.
They would have probably met a few times thereafter.

Taseer was married all the time to his wife in pakistan.

A_Gupta · Post by **A_Gupta** » 05 Jan 2011 22:36

RamaY wrote:^ THAT is the problem with the silent-India.

Even our own A_Guptaji saw a brave and liberal individual in this Tasser low-life.

Nothing wrong with having such an opinion as an individual. But making national policies based on such wet dreams? That is the sorry state of affairs with MMS-ilk at the helm.

Don't misunderstand. Where did I say he was a brave and liberal individual? The point is that in the last point of his life, he got one thing right, and he did courageously stick to it. Doing the one correct and courageous thing does not turn Taseer into a brave and liberal individual. But the correct and courageous action is to be applauded. Or if not applauded, at least respected.

partha · Post by **partha** » 05 Jan 2011 22:43

Gagan wrote:Exactly as predicted things seem to be happening.
If BRFites are not nauseated enough, watch this video.
The Herrow gets a herrow's welcome in court, the bar association rises to its expected stance to defend him against 'illegal confinement', and the public are gushing "well done Qadri" all the while.
<video>
AoA

Lawyers saying they will defend the murderer free of cost is not at all surprising. They are just following in the foot steps of Quaid-e-Azam.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ghazi_Ilm- ... #Character

Gagan · Post by **Gagan** » 05 Jan 2011 22:44

Eyewitness account:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9pRwS8KMESI

saket · Post by **saket** » 05 Jan 2011 22:47

RamaY wrote:^ THAT is the problem with the silent-India.

Even our own A_Guptaji saw a brave and liberal individual in this Tasser low-life.

Nothing wrong with having such an opinion as an individual. But making national policies based on such wet dreams? That is the sorry state of affairs with MMS-ilk at the helm.

The pitfalls of relativization .. even a cactus in a desert is more prominent than a lotus in a garden of roses.
Pakis frequently compare BJP with the religious parties in pakistan saying that the latter have never been as strong as the BJP in India thereby proving Indian Hindus are more extremist .. all the time forgetting that BJP (or even Shiv Sena) are far more liberal than PML(N) or PPP.

krisna · Post by **krisna** » 05 Jan 2011 22:53

MY THOUGHTS ON SALMAN TASEER’S ASSASSINATION

The assassination of Salman Taseer,draws attention once again to the penetration of the Pakistani security forces by Islamic extremist elements.

Earlier, evidence of such penetration came in the involvement of low-level army and Air Force officers in the two unsuccessful attempts to kill Gen.Pervez Musharraf in Rawalpindi in December 2003, and in the assassination of 19 officers of the US-trained Special Services Group (SSG) by a Pashtun Army officer belonging to the SSG, whose younger sister was reportedly among the 300 girls killed during the SSG raid on the Lal Masjid in Islamabad between July 10 and 13, 2007.

While a joint Al Qaeda-Jaish-e-Mohammad (JEM)—Harkat-ul-Jihad-al-Islami (HUJI) team motivated by Abu Faraj al-Libbi was suspected in the attempts to kill Musharraf, the Tehrik-e-Taliban Pakistan (TTP) was suspected in the assassination of the SSG officers by one of their colleagues.

.In 1995, a plot by the HUJI led by Qari Saifullah Akhtar to assassinate Benazir Bhutto, the then Prime Minister, and Gen.Abdul Waheed Kakkar, the then Chief of the Army Staff, with the complicity of some commissioned officers of the Army was discovered and neutralized in time.

Thus, the involvement of personnel of the security forces in plots against political and military leaders is nothing new in Pakistan, but there are some significant differences between the earlier incidents and the assassination of Salman Taseer.

In the earlier three incidents, the security forces personnel involved came from the Armed Forces and were from the Deobandi-Wahabi-Salafi sects. In the assassination of Taseer, the culprit is from the Elite Force of the Punjab Police specially raised and trained to fight against terrorism and to protect VIPs. Media reports from Pakistan claim that he is from the Barelvi sect, which has till now been considered more tolerant than the Deobandi-Wahabi-Salafi sects.

One extremist organization in Pakistan which has recruits from all sects, including the Barelvis, is the Hizbut-Tehrir(HT) which is believed to have many followers in the Armed Forces as well as the Police.

All fundamentalist elements in Pakistan----whether Deobandi or Wahabi or Salafi or Barelvi---- consider it as their religious obligation to kill those opposing the blasphemy law and the law declaring the Ahmediyas as non-Muslims. Many individual Muslims also believe so even if they do not belong to any of these organizations.

(All of TSPians)

Sherry Rehman had said in a message circulated through the Internet as follows: “The mullahs have announced a million man march and given me a public deadline of 6th Jan to take back the amendment bill, or else. They said they will stop at "nothing then to protect namoos I risalat". (honour of the Prophet).I do not have state security but am quite clear that I will not take the bill "back" as demanded by some extremists, most recently when they openly declared myself and Taseer waajibul qatl. ( meaning “deserve to be killed” ) .” One feels concerned for her security.

Sherry, Ab tera number kab aayega

The channel reported that he(quadri) was removed from the Punjab Police Special Branch three years ago for having extremist views. Qadri had joined the Punjab Police five years ago and was inducted into the Elite Force some time ago. After obtaining clearance from the authorities, he was put on the security squad of VVIPs and of the governor.”

( despite having extremist views was cleared for protecting the blasphemer!!)

In addition, 25 police officers and a muharar (record-keeper) of Elite Force who had prepared the list of personnel, including Qadri, for duty during the governor’s visit were also taken into custody and shifted to Islamabad for investigation. Investigators also confiscated the cellphones of the security personnel deployed for the governor’s security. A police party went to the house of Qadri in Muslim Town late in the night and found some religious books in his room.”

It is unMuslim to be a liberal. That is the message that Qadri and those behind him in the conspiracy (if there was a larger conspiracy) have sought to convey through the assassination of Taseer. It is unlikely to have any major impact on the political situation in Pakistan, but it will have an impact on the will of the Pakistani political leadership and civil society to confront the extremists. The fight against extremism in Pakistan will remain a losing battle unless and until all political forces and the civil society come together on this issue and the Army whole-heartedly backs them. One sees no sign of that.

Sherry might stand in the line for canadian viza or offer her apologies shortly.
this is normal for TSP to lurch from one crisis to another etc.( Read SS post)

RAPES will not cross the red line now newly defined. they will stay within their boundaries, but continue to support the mad mullahs with money.
The mad mullahs require money provided by the RAPES to keep the pious abduls religiously fanatic for global warfare. It is jeehaaaraddd all the way till the centripetal forces causes a collapse of the society. may take some time- may be years.
come on folks no doomsday scenario. have popcorn and beer. watch the show.

krisna · Post by **krisna** » 05 Jan 2011 23:06

^^^^ per B Raman, mentioned about Hizb ut-Tahrir.
Hizb ut-Tahrir

is an international pan-Islamic political organization whose goal is for all Muslim countries to unify as an Islamic state or caliphate ruled by Islamic law and with a caliph head of state elected by Muslims.

The organization was founded in 1953 in Jerusalem by Taqiuddin al-Nabhani, an Islamic scholar and appeals court judge (Qadi) from the Palestinian village of Ijzim. Since then Hizb ut-Tahrir has spread to more than 40 countries, and by one estimate has about one million members. Hizb ut-Tahrir is very active in the west, particularly in the United Kingdom, and is also active in several Arab and Central Asian countries, despite being banned by most of the local governments.

It believes this political transformation would provide honest leadership, protecting and caring for its citizens, and fighting against the "colonial foreign policies" of the United States and other Western nations that have led to "U.S. interventions, energy inspired wars, puppet (Muslim) governments and western values forced by the barrel of a gun." Hizb ut-Tahrir is also strongly anti-Zionist and calls for Israel, which it calls an "illegal entity," to be dismantled.

Democracy is a Kufr system because it is laid down by man and it is not from the Shari'ah Laws.

Bangladesh banned Hizb ut-Tahrir on 22 October 2009, for "destabilizing" the country, a day after a bomb attack targeting a ruling party lawmaker, and a relative of the prime minister, Sheikh Hasina

In Pakistan, Hizb ut-Tahrir was proscribed by Pakistani President General Musharraf in 2004, although it had the ban on it lifted[106] after a legal challenge against its proscription in the Lahore High Court

According to "a senior Obama Administration official" interviewed by journalist Seymour Hersch in 2009, "HT has "penetrated the Pakistani military and now have cells in the Army." Hersch reports that the Pakistan Army denies this.

A report in Foreign Affairs Journal claims that Hizb ut-Tahrir "dominates" the British Islamist "scene" with some 8,500 members in the United Kingdom, compared to only 1,000 for a rival, Muslim Association of Britain.

Following the 7 July 2005 London bombings the British government announced its intention to ban the organization but abandoned the ban. According to The Independent Blair "shelved the ban after warnings from police, intelligence chiefs, and civil liberties groups that it is a non-violent group, and driving it underground could backfire."and according to the Observer because the Home Office believed a legal ban would not stick.

Gagan · Post by **Gagan** » 05 Jan 2011 23:09

Zardari will do a downhill ski and prevent the introduction of any such bill in parliament by Sherry now.

The situation is err, delicate for the feudals right now. The abduls are mobilized and on the streets, the fervor for Jihad is high. It is bad enough that their Herrow is being carted around in handcuffs, no elite will dare touch anything related to the blasphemy law with a barge pole right now.

To do something about the anti blasphemy law will not only will that mean instant departure from this world, they won't even get a maulana to recite their last rights.

Poor Asia Bibi, when is her sentence scheduled to be carried out? Any dates there? Does it have to be confirmed by the supreme court of pakistan? No judge is going to risk his life either here on her case. Zardari won't pardon her either.

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 05 Jan 2011 23:10

RamaY wrote:
SSridhar wrote:
"AbhishekD"
It has an undertone of anti-feudalism.

/quote

AbhishekD, an Islam that prescribes slavery cannot be anti-feudal. Especially in Pakistan, it is not.

May Allah bless you SSji!

As long as Islam has Islamism, the fate of Pakistan will not change. The only change one will see in Pakistan would be that the Kabila guards will wear their dark-green uniforms "openly" from now on.

Unfortunately there is no hope for Islam without Islamism. That is the reason for the finality of the prophet. There is no way to transform Islam by any other person, be it another prophet or .... It has to demise in its original form

The TSPA problem is Indian Army already has a olive green uniform so they can't change their colors from Khaki without the hardliners screaming sellout. Besides khaki hides their incontinence when facing the Indian Army.

Prem · Post by **Prem** » 05 Jan 2011 23:23

SSridhar wrote:
Philip wrote:Pak is at the crossroads of history.

They are progressing from Inbreed to Crossbreeds to Croassroads !! Just like all the rivers run to ocean in Kufffar world , All the roads lead to onlee one place in Poakworld. More than Murtad Tauseer, Poaks know themselves and appreciate the Islamist qualities of brave Ghazi Qadri Who stands for peace, mercy and moderation of Poakloka.

For a good Poak ,onlee place is in Parloak.

shravan · Post by **shravan** » 05 Jan 2011 23:24

Sindh to re-scrutinize police personnel

KARACHI: Sindh Home Department Wednesday issued directives to re-scrutinize police personnel who will be put to various tests regarding psychological and religious aptitudes held by them.

Lalmohan · Post by **Lalmohan** » 05 Jan 2011 23:26

actually paquiland has passed the cross roads of history and is heading into the cul-de-sac rapidly
soon the car will be driving at Vmax into the crash barriers...

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 05 Jan 2011 23:27

TSP from cross roads -> cul de sac.

Great summary of the situation.

Tell Lal professor to tweet this.

rohitvats · Post by **rohitvats** » 05 Jan 2011 23:31

Is it possible that the dynamics of the islamism with-in TSPA are being suppressed and that TSPA is reached a more delicate stage than we fathom? Something like the state in USSR before collapse?

That report about SSG personnel involved in explosion at Tarbela facility is real eye-opener. Though, the narration seems to be a bit incorrect. Thr explosion happened in NCO Mess/Dining hall (langar) and person involved afaik was a NCO/Other ranks. Such factors affeting the SF of a nation do not portend well for the Army.

Lalmohan · Post by **Lalmohan** » 05 Jan 2011 23:35

the army is compromised
the elite units are compromised
the police are compromised
the green revolution is into its advanced stages
its probably not the colour of revolution that unkil had chosen
Al Q 1 Unkil 0

RamaY · Post by **RamaY** » 05 Jan 2011 23:37

A_Gupta wrote: Don't misunderstand. Where did I say he was a brave and liberal individual? The point is that in the last point of his life, he got one thing right, and he did courageously stick to it. Doing the one correct and courageous thing does not turn Taseer into a brave and liberal individual. But the correct and courageous action is to be applauded. Or if not applauded, at least respected.

A_Gupta wrote: His stance took some courage, and his courage did not wilt in the face of fatwas against him declaring him a blasphemer and apostate, and he did not flinch with the knowledge that he was going against a plurality of Pakistani public opinion.

In the tradition of the Indian jawan respecting a courageous enemy, I believe he and his family who have been bereaved, should be accorded some respect.

I might have mis-read this. While I respect your opinion, is there any person who did not do a single good deed in his entire life? What should be the benchmark?

I will give you one point though. He died for his cause and his karma. I don't see any courage in it, except a (stupid) choice. Same as his choice to consume alcohol or pork or whatever... I also wouldn't offer him any respect as he is not killed by an Indian Jawan in a war. He was back stabbed by his own system and faith. His karma caught up with him.

Virupaksha · Post by **Virupaksha** » 05 Jan 2011 23:42

I have few question to the gurus

What does "collapse of society" mean for Pakistan? How different is it from today? Is it something like how "khyber-pakhtunwa" is ruled today will be the future of Pakistan itself or is it something different?

Because from my reading of tea leaves of Pakistan, the only change is from "fake piety" to "true piety" - so something like Iran/Soudi style rule. Was 1978 a "collapse" of Iran? Isnt the Soudi elite cohabitated by others already, what will the difference be for Pakistan with respect to its 3 1/2 friends. Some rich elite replaced by religious elite.

I agree that the only benefit, from it becoming every one's problem. I see not much change.

What does this so-called "collapse" mean for Pakistan and there by for India? In short why this hallaboo about coming collapse, when actual realities are not changing?

A_Gupta · Post by **A_Gupta** » 05 Jan 2011 23:43

RamaY wrote:
A_Gupta wrote: Don't misunderstand. Where did I say he was a brave and liberal individual? The point is that in the last point of his life, he got one thing right, and he did courageously stick to it. Doing the one correct and courageous thing does not turn Taseer into a brave and liberal individual. But the correct and courageous action is to be applauded. Or if not applauded, at least respected.

A_Gupta wrote: His stance took some courage, and his courage did not wilt in the face of fatwas against him declaring him a blasphemer and apostate, and he did not flinch with the knowledge that he was going against a plurality of Pakistani public opinion.

In the tradition of the Indian jawan respecting a courageous enemy, I believe he and his family who have been bereaved, should be accorded some respect.
I might have mis-read this. While I respect your opinion, is there any person who did not do a single good deed in his entire life? What should be the benchmark?

This was a good deed for the sake of his society; he did take the risk of the charges of blasphemy and apostasy. Since the PPP was not backing him, except for Sherry Rehman, he could have easily "repented" and shut up, after the various mullah organizations went after him. He did not.

I will give you one point though. He died for his cause and his karma. I don't see any courage in it, except a (stupid) choice. Same as his choice to consume alcohol or pork or whatever... I also wouldn't offer him any respect as he is not killed by an Indian Jawan in a war. He was back stabbed by his own system and faith. His karma caught up with him.

Not seeing courage in it is your choice. I challenge anyone of you here to take a stand which could get you extremely unpopular in the mullah circle, when you are actually within their reach.

Lalmohan · Post by **Lalmohan** » 05 Jan 2011 23:45

i expect to see attempts on sherry and ayesha siddiqi soon
that will clarify that its the army who are behind the drive towards piousness
the jarnails will lead the green forces of khilafat out to conquer the world and impose sharia...
it has begun...

CRamS · Post by **CRamS** » 05 Jan 2011 23:46

A_Gupta wrote: Don't misunderstand. Where did I say he was a brave and liberal individual? The point is that in the last point of his life, he got one thing right, and he did courageously stick to it. Doing the one correct and courageous thing does not turn Taseer into a brave and liberal individual. But the correct and courageous action is to be applauded. Or if not applauded, at least respected.

I am sure many "esteemed" individuals like Pervez Musharaff, Hafeez Saeed, Hitler, Pol Pot etc in their entires lives got a few things right. For example, even after the Mumbai slaugter Hafeez Saeed may have shown his human traits by enjoying the smell of the roses outside the GHQ in Rawilpindi. So one must recount this when he is packed off to his 72? Likewise, Musharaff, according to NYT and the west is a "liberal" because he likes scotch whisky and wears Armani suits, got rid of "extremists" from Lal Masjid etc, and so we SDREs must also celebrate such "liberal" traits. Give me break!!!!

RamaY · Post by **RamaY** » 05 Jan 2011 23:47

krisna wrote:MY THOUGHTS ON SALMAN TASEER’S ASSASSINATION
It is unMuslim to be a liberal. That is the message that Qadri and those behind him in the conspiracy (if there was a larger conspiracy) have sought to convey through the assassination of Taseer. It is unlikely to have any major impact on the political situation in Pakistan, but it will have an impact on the will of the Pakistani political leadership and civil society to confront the extremists. The fight against extremism in Pakistan will remain a losing battle unless and until all political forces and the civil society come together on this issue and the Army whole-heartedly backs them. One sees no sign of that.

Exactly my point. There is only one path to which the civil society, political parties, and the all-powerful Army can come together. A Talibanized Pakistan.

RamaY wrote: As long as Islam has Islamism, the fate of Pakistan will not change. The only change one will see in Pakistan would be that the Kabila guards will wear their dark-green uniforms "openly" from now on.

Unfortunately there is no hope for Islam without Islamism. That is the reason for the finality of the prophet. There is no way to transform Islam by any other person, be it another prophet or .... It has to demise in its original form

Brad Goodman · Post by **Brad Goodman** » 05 Jan 2011 23:47

The End of Jinnah's Pakistan

Every time you think things can't possibly get worse in Pakistan, along comes something to prove you wrong. On Tuesday, in possibly the country's most consequential political shock since the 2007 murder of former Prime Minister Benazir Bhutto, Salmaan Taseer, the 65-year-old governor of Punjab province, was gunned down in an upscale Islamabad market by one of his police bodyguards. The reason: the governor's plain-spoken defense of Asia Bibi, an illiterate Christian woman sentenced to death under Pakistan's harsh blasphemy laws. According to press reports, Taseer's killer pumped nine bullets into him for daring to call the blasphemy provision a "black law."

Taseer broadly belonged to Jinnah's Pakistan. He was educated as a chartered accountant in England, founded a successful telecom company, and published the country's leading liberal newspaper in English. (Though, as the son of a famous Urdu poet, Taseer was perhaps more culturally authentic than his nation's founder.) By contrast, Taseer's killer, a 26-year-old named Mumtaz Qadri, symbolizes Maududi's vision. In photographs, he's bearded and moustache-less, in the manner prescribed by fundamentalist Islam. That Mr. Qadri could defy South Asia's usually rigid codes of hierarchy by murdering someone far above his station jibes with the contempt radical Islamists often feel for traditional elites. According to press reports, Mr. Qadri showed no remorse for the murder.

The murder highlights anew the way in which Pakistan's English-speaking classes resemble a small island of urbanity surrounded by a rising tide of fundamentalist zeal. They have only themselves to blame for their predicament. From independence onward, successive governments—military and civilian alike—have ridden the tiger of fundamentalism out of political expediency, misplaced piety or geopolitical ambition. A statistic from Zahid Hussain's "Frontline Pakistan" is telling: When Pakistan gained independence in 1947 it housed 137 madrassas. That number has since swelled to about 13,000, between 10% and 15% of which are linked to sectarian militancy (Sunni versus Shia) or terrorism.

In the 1980s, army officers were instructed to read "The Quranic Concept of War," a book by a zealous officer, Brigadier General S.K. Malik, which argues that "terror struck in the hearts of the enemies is not only a means, it is the end in itself." Many of these officers subsequently rotated through the notorious Inter-Services Intelligence whose links to violent fundamentalist groups fighting NATO troops in Afghanistan and India in Kashmir are widely regarded as too deep to sever entirely.

question to guru's has any one read this book?

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 05 Jan 2011 23:52

Its a pdf available on Internet.

BTW ancient bible warfare also shows the same concept.

svinayak · Post by **svinayak** » 05 Jan 2011 23:52

A_Gupta wrote: I challenge anyone of you here to take a stand which could get you extremely unpopular in the mullah circle, when you are actually within their reach.

Who cares. They have to solve their problem which they created in the first place with full knowledge
Create the problem. Attempt to fix it and get fame!

Baikul · Post by **Baikul** » 05 Jan 2011 23:56

Brad Goodman wrote:.....................

In the 1980s, army officers were instructed to read "The Quranic Concept of War," a book by a zealous officer, Brigadier General S.K. Malik....................has any one read this book?

Doesn't answer your question but:

http://wolfpangloss.files.wordpress.com ... of-war.pdf

Sanku · Post by **Sanku** » 05 Jan 2011 23:59

ravi_ku wrote: What does this so-called "collapse" mean for Pakistan and there by for India? In short why this hallaboo about coming collapse, when actual realities are not changing?

No illusion of state to get money from 2 1/2 of its 3 1/2 friends, since there is no one who can deliver.

And since the only oil the Porki's have is what they get by squeezing Mussharff (the person not the anatomical reference) they will rapidly become "Somalia++".

Imagine a Somalia sitting astride the world's oil routes.

RamaY · Post by **RamaY** » 05 Jan 2011 23:59

A_Gupta wrote: Not seeing courage in it is your choice. I challenge anyone of you here to take a stand which could get you extremely unpopular in the mullah circle, when you are actually within their reach.

We all INDIANS have been standing in challenge within the reach of mullah-pakistanis since 1947. That is the story of TNT.

Gaganji already explained our (stupid) hero's mistake. The hero thought that he is immune from his own faith/ideology just because he is a RAPE. That is not courage, it is stupidity.

Secondly, what him standing for anti-blasphemy is not the right choice. If at all he should have left the faith/land that allowed all this blasphemy nonsense, the moment his first brain cell started working.

I will leave it here...

Brad Goodman · Post by **Brad Goodman** » 06 Jan 2011 00:00

Found this article for the book written by Aatish Taseer in case some one is interested

Present In Our Memory Games by Khushwant Singh

Stranger to History is a personalised study of Muslim identity in different countries: Britain, Turkey, Syria, Iran, Saudi Arabia, Pakistan, India. The only thing they have in common is the passion to restore Islam to what its founder Prophet Mohammed had in mind by destroying its enemies today as they perceive them, notably the US, Israel and Britain {India??}. Their methods of achieving this end are determined by their own internal problems. In between analysing responses given to him, Taseer interposes his own problems with his father betraying his mother’s trust. The reader should know something about their family background.
Salman Taseer’s father was a minor literary celebrity in pre-Partition days. He married a Scandinavian (or maybe English). As often happens in cases of mixed marriages, Salman turned out to be a very handsome young man who had no problems seducing good-looking women. He was also a great admirer of Zulfikar Ali Bhutto and hitched his wagon to the rising star in Pakistani politics. He wrote a highly laudatory biography of his hero and came to Delhi with his publisher to promote his book in March 1980. They stayed at the Oberoi Hotel where Tavleen met him.

Tavleen is the granddaughter of Sardar Bahadur Bajamber Basakha Singh, one of the principal builders of New Delhi, including the North Block of the Secretariat. He lived next door to us on Jantar Mantar Road and was my father’s closest friend. We saw him almost everyday. He also stayed with me in London. When Tavleen met Salman, she was in the prime of her youth and extremely attractive. A fair game for our Lothario from Pakistan. Though married with children, he had no compunction in seducing Tavleen. They hit it off and spent the whole week together. Tavleen became pregnant. She wrote to him in Lahore and toyed with the idea of aborting her pregnancy. He dissuaded her from doing so. He rented a flat for her in London. He joined her for a while. But his ardour had abated. He had more affairs, including one with an Indian film star whose name is not revealed by Aatish. Tavleen sensed the romance was over and returned to Delhi much embittered by her experience. Some of it washed on her son. Salman was unfazed and remarked that he had left his foreskin in India but brought the body back to Pakistan.

As might be expected, Aatish had a disturbed childhood. At school in Kodaikanal he spelt out his view of his father to his counsellor. She asked: "How do you feel about your father today?" He replied: "Nothing. I mean the man is obviously a shit. He abandoned my mother with a baby to bring up on her own. Everyone has shitty people in their lives."

Meanwhile, Salman Taseer had his ups and downs. Under Bhutto he prospered. He turned to business and made a tidy killing. He acquired a large house, yet another wife, drank Scotch, ate ham, bacon, pork and lived it up. When Bhutto fell and was hanged, General Zia-ul-Haq put him in jail. The only book he was allowed to read was the Quran. He admitted he read it front to back and back to front but found nothing in it for him. When General Musharraf was forced to resign and Zardari took over, his fortunes were again in the ascendant. He is now governor of Pakistan’s Punjab. His son Aatish met him before that. He was welcomed by his stepmother and step siblings but his father remained aloof and cold. He never wanted to see him again.

Aatish Taseer’s account of his meeting the new generation of Muslims makes depressing reading. In England he met British-born young Pakistanis wearing skull caps and sporting beards to assert their Muslim identity; in Turkey, a group of people who regretted Kemal Ataturk’s attempts to modernise them. It was the same in Iraq and Syria and worst in Ahmadinejad’s Iran. He performed the lesser pilgrimage (Umra) in Mecca carefully hiding the tattooed image of Shiva on his arm and the steel kada his Sikh grandmother had given him. In Sindh he was disappointed to see its age-old Sufi Islam give way to Wahabi bigotry. However grim his portrayal of Muslim communities in countries he visited, his account is honest, perceptive and makes riveting reading. I will look forward to reading his personal exploits which got wide coverage in the world media, Inshallah, another day.

Picture of Aatish Taseer

A_Gupta · Post by **A_Gupta** » 06 Jan 2011 00:13

RamaY wrote: Gaganji already explained our (stupid) hero's mistake. The hero thought that he is immune from his own faith/ideology just because he is a RAPE. That is not courage, it is stupidity.

I disagree that Gagan proved any such thing.

A_Gupta · Post by **A_Gupta** » 06 Jan 2011 00:15

CRamS wrote: I am sure many "esteemed" individuals like Pervez Musharaff, Hafeez Saeed, Hitler, Pol Pot etc in their entires lives got a few things right. For example, even after the Mumbai slaugter Hafeez Saeed may have shown his human traits by enjoying the smell of the roses outside the GHQ in Rawilpindi.

So smelling the roses is the same as standing up for justice for someone who is in jail and sentenced to death?

Your scale of values never ceases to amaze me.

A_Gupta · Post by **A_Gupta** » 06 Jan 2011 00:16

Dawn is not down.
http://www.dawn.com/2011/01/05/lawyers- ... iller.html

LAHORE: Lawyers showered the suspected killer of a prominent Pakistani governor with rose petals when he arrived at court Wednesday and an influential Muslim scholars group praised the assassination of the outspoken opponent of laws that order death for those who insult Islam.