Indian Interests

[ramana]

ReDiff's IANS writes news stories reflecting its origins as an US based NRI news service. The headlines and reporting reflects a US slant on all their stories. IOW its an Indian owned news service reporting about India through US perspective to Indian public.

[Rony]

Dont Know if this has been posted before.

DNA STUDY:NO ARYAN RACE MARKER! topic starts @1.35 min

Confirmation that there's no such thing as Aryan genes

http://www.yourdiscovery.com/web/olly-s ... ryan-genes

Danish genetic specialist overturns Aryan race theory

http://www.yourdiscovery.com/web/olly-s ... urity-myth

[Pranav]

Amartya Sen talking some sense:

India, China growth race 'silly', says Nobel winner

(AFP) – 15 hours ago

NEW DELHI — India's leading economist, Nobel Prize winner Amartya Sen, dismissed on Monday the "silly" obsession of comparing the economic growth rates of China and India.

In a lengthy critique of the practice, Sen argued that New Delhi was far behind in the growth race, but more importantly it lagged in other criteria that showed real living standards were far inferior in India.

"Despite the interest in this subject (of comparing India's eight-percent growth to China's 10 percent)... this is surely a silly focus," Sen wrote in The Hindu.

Growth as estimated by gross national product (GNP) was an arbitrary measurement, he said, and "the lives that people are able to lead -- what ultimately interests people most -- are only indirectly and partially influenced by the rates of overall economic growth".

In an unflattering portrait of his country, Sen drew on data from World Development Reports of the World Bank and Human Development Reports of the United Nations to show China far ahead on most criteria.

Life expectancy at birth in China was 73.5 years compared with 64.4 years in India; Infant mortality rate is 50 per thousand in India and just 17 in China, and the under-five mortality rate is 66 for Indians and 19 for the Chinese.

China's adult literacy rate is 94 percent, compared with India's 65 percent, and mean years of schooling in India is 4.4 years, compared with 7.5 years in China, he said.

"Almost half of our children are undernourished compared with a very tiny proportion in China," Sen added.

"Comparing ourselves with China in these really important matters would be a very good perspective, and they can both inspire us and give us illumination about what to do -- and what not to do," he said.

India's finance minister and prime minister routinely refer to their target of double-digit economic growth, which they say is required to make a dent in India's enormous poverty numbers.

India and China, which both have billion-plus populations, are often grouped together by analysts and pundits as Asia's emerging powerhouses despite their different levels of development and diplomatic influence.

Sen said that growth in GNP, a statistical measure of economic output by citizens of a country, was enriching many Indians, but the focus on the new affluent middle classes obscured the larger picture.

"Those gains are, of course, good, and there is nothing wrong in celebrating their better lives through economic growth... but the exaggerated concentration on their lives, which the media tend often to display, gives an incomplete picture of what is happening to Indians in general," he said.

Sen won the Nobel prize for economics in 1998.

http://www.google.com/hostednews/afp/ar ... c1a65e.c41

Another point is that instead of talking about Indian democracy, we need to internalize the idea that India falls in the category of "pseudo-democracies", that is, countries that go through the motions of elections, but in which the electoral process is devoid of transparency and verifiability.

[ramana]

No. Just because we had the nehru Gandhi family hijack the process we cant say its pseudo-democracy. It could be a passing phase. Lets not break our legs scoring self goals.

I strongly resent that description.

[Pranav]

A potentially beneficial step:

Nilekani to head task force on direct subsidies

Special Correspondent

NEW DELHI: In a move aimed at a focussed targeting of subsidies for the country's poor, the government on Monday announced the setting up of an inter-ministerial task force under Unique Identification Authority of India (UIDAI) chairman Nandan Nilekani.

It will work out a suitable mechanism to provide direct subsidies on kerosene, cooking gas (LPG) and fertilizers for the intended beneficiaries.

In a statement here, the Finance Ministry said the task force was set up “in order to evolve a suitable mechanism for direct subsidies to individuals/families who are entitled to kerosene, LPG and fertilizer and to evolve a model of direct transfer of subsidies on these items by re-engineering existing systems, processes and procedures in the implementation process…”

The task force, the statement said, would also undertake designing of appropriate IT systems and their alignment with the issuance of UID numbers, and bringing about changes in the administration and supply chain management.

The statement said the task force was constituted in the light of the “overwhelming evidence” that the current policy of providing subsidy on kerosene was resulting in “waste, leakage, adulteration and inefficiency… Therefore, it is imperative that the system of delivering the subsidised kerosene be reformed urgently.”

Kerosene was provided at highly subsidised prices to BPL (below the poverty line) families under the Public Distribution System. However, apart from finding its way to the open market, the poor man's cooking fuel was adulterated with diesel.

Suitable mechanism

Likewise, the system of delivering subsidised LPG to the intended beneficiaries needed to be reformed. The same was the case with fertilizers. It was not possible to make a distinction among segments for which the subsidy should be given in the fertilizer sector. “There is a need to evolve a suitable mechanism for direct subsidies to individuals who are entitled to them,” it said.

The task force is to submit its interim report within four months of its constitution. The recommendations of the interim report will be implemented on a pilot basis by the Ministries concerned under the supervision of the task force in the six months following the date of submission of the interim report. “The final report would be submitted thereafter which would include the results of the implementation of the solution on the field,” the statement said.

Besides Mr. Nilekani, the task force will comprise secretaries of the Ministries of Finance, Chemicals & Fertilizers, Agriculture, Food & Public Distribution, Petroleum & Natural Gas and Rural Development, along with the Director-General of UIDAI.

http://www.hindu.com/2011/02/15/stories ... 411500.htm

[Pranav]

No. Just because we had the nehru Gandhi family hijack the process we cant say its pseudo-democracy. It could be a passing phase. Lets not break our legs scoring self goals.

I strongly resent that description.

Ramana ji, the first step towards taking corrective action is realizing the enormity of the problem. Too many people are oblivious. But on BRF many people do already realize what the issues are. Will tone it down a little.

[Maram]

No. Just because we had the nehru Gandhi family hijack the process we cant say its pseudo-democracy. It could be a passing phase. Lets not break our legs scoring self goals.

I strongly resent that description.

I agree with you. This may be a passing phase( Nehru-Gandhi dynastic supremacy). The more worrying trend is, this nepotistic dynastic politics is so well entrenched, ever regional satrap has got this system going. From my home town of Guntur, all emerging politicians of both the major political parties are childrens of MPs and MLAs....The Corporators in the city corporations are wives or brothers of leading politicians.. You get the drift... the saying "Yadha Raaja Tadha Praja" comes to mind...

The out right command and control structure died when Mrs Gandhi was assasinated along with accidental death of Sanjay Gandhi. Raajeev ji destroyed what little command and control structure that survived. What we have now is the command and control franchises loosely affialiated to Nehru-Gandhi family...Interesting times ahead....

[brihaspati]

Democracy performs most efficiently in a society that has been perfectly atomized. Western democracies appeared to succeed more because they partly succeeded in breaking up the family bonds. India has not done so - so family networks are bound to take up the dominant positions within Indian democracy.

Over time, such networks by necessity become exclusive, strictly endogamous and socially hierarchical. But which also means a lot of people whose hopes and dreams of power were raised by the high flying initial promises -would become disillusioned and blame democracy itself for crashing of the dreams.

If what is going on now continues - a time will come when the vast majority of peoplel feel left out, and thats the almost sure way to a popular uprising.

[rkirankr]

Some strange questions are there in the census this time. It seems these question really rankle the people. There are questions like
1. How many children do you have? Whether there was death of any children? Did you undergo abortion etc.
Also Questions like how much distance do you travel to reach the work place.

I do not know why they want such personal data. What is the use of these? Why do they need to profile all the population?

Is it not dangerous for such a data to be collated at one place? Any idea why all these.

Also this UPA should explain staggering wire tap figures

[Anurag]

http://turtlebay.foreignpolicy.com/post ... _at_the_un

LOL F'ing Embarrassing!

India's foreign minister inadvertently reads Portuguese statement at the U.N.
Posted By Colum Lynch Monday, February 14, 2011 - 10:36 AM Share

Indian Foreign Minister S.M. Krishna's visit last week to the United Nations was supposed to provide New Delhi with an opportunity to shine on the world stage, to show that India is a serious emerging power that deserves to sit with other world powers. It didn’t quite turn out that way.

Krishna, in his first appearance before the U.N. Security Council since his country began a two-year stint in January as a temporary member of the U.N. security body, read the wrong speech. For three minutes, Krishna read from the official statement of the foreign minister of Portugal, Luis Amado, noting with a gracious smile his "satisfaction regarding the happy coincidence of having two members of the Portuguese speaking countries" addressing the 15-nation council." (See the video: Krishna begans at 1:08:10)

The gaffe has fueled calls from India's opposition politicians to have Krishna step down, saying his mistake has brought "shame" to India at a time when it is trying to prove to the world that it is a serious player on the world stage.

The mistake occurred after Amado, who spoke before Krishna, decided to ditch his speech in favor of extemporaneous remarks on the theme of the council debate: the connection between social development and security. Copies of his official speech, however, were circulated to the council's members, including one copy that landed on top of Krishna's speech.

In all fairness, it is often tough to tell the difference between the standard speeches delivered before the U.N. Security Council. The Portuguese statement sounded off familiar themes that could have been read by virtually any delegation. For instance, it noted that it "is impossible to implement effective poverty reduction strategies" in a place wracked by political chaos and violence. It underscored the importance of meeting the Millennium Development Goals -- a series of internationally accepted health and poverty benchmarks aimed at eliminating poverty -- in order to spur economic development in the Third World.

It was not until Krishna highlighted the importance of coordination between the United Nations and the European Union that the Indian delegation grew suspicious. India's U.N. ambassador, Hardeep Singh Puri, approached Krishna, slid the Portuguese text off his pile of paper, and instructed him to read the Indian statement buried beneath it. "OK," a puzzled Krishna said before asking: "I have to start all over again?" Without so much as a pause, or a recognition of the gaffe, Krishna started again, beginning with a reference to Mahatma Gandhi's famous line "poverty is the worst form of violence." You'd think -- that if he had taken the time to glance at his speech before reading it -- he would have noticed the omission.

As for Krishna, he suggested the slip-up could have happened to anyone. "There was nothing wrong in it," he told the Press Trust of India. "There were so many papers spread in front of me, so by mistake the wrong speech was taken out."

[ramana]

Its par for the course in the MEA. The former MEA secy had a drafting error in the SeS joint statement. Now the minister has a simple error of the tongue (lapsis lingua!)

[ajit_tr]

http://turtlebay.foreignpolicy.com/post ... _at_the_un

LOL F'ing Embarrassing!

Chinese durnken rant equally hilarious.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WguKoQNWJMc

[ajit_tr]

double post.................

[negi]

Talk about chootiyapanti

Pak Jamiat chief stirs up Deoband battle
PC and MMS all the time yap about communal forces and how deeply are they concerned about destructive elements trying to disturb peace in India, would these worthies answer how difficult is it to deny VISAs to such elements from the other side ?

[Rony]

Meera Nanda’s Ignorance Revisited

More than Meera Nanda, it is Sjoman and Singleton that need to have their flimsy arguments and ludicrous logic refuted and summarily exposed. Nanda's article draws heavily from Singleton's book. Make no mistake, if this Sjoman and Singleton aren't deconstructed and exposed now, this might very well be another AIT in the making. And years from now textbooks will claim that *yoga* was a European invention. Both Sjoman and Singleton have preconceived notions, and then bake their arguments around it. An all too familiar rubric
of our eminent historengineers and their Eurocentric associates. In fact our professional migrationist from Eurocentric Inc., Steve Farmer has already quoted Singleton to pompously claim that *yogAsana* is a colonial construct "appropriated" by 'Hindu nationalists'.

[Prem]

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB1000142 ... lenews_wsj

India: Twenty Years Later

Economic opening, starting in 1991, may have created wealth in India. But it hasn't created a political constituency for reform.This disconnect between rising aspirations and the inability to meet those hopes quickly enough gives rise to a fault line in Indian politics. Politicians happily exploit it: Rather than summoning the will to push through reforms that would address the roots of the problem, it's easier to pitch illiberal spending and subsidies as an easy "fix."
This explains measures that already have moved India backward from its reform progress, including entitlements proposed by Mr. Singh himself despite his reform leadership in the early 1990s. The most obvious example is the rural employment guarantee scheme his government started in 2005, essentially paying the rural poor to work whether or not any actual work existed for them to do. In 2010, the government passed the Right to Education Act, which empowers public teachers without caring for student enrollment and retention. And for the past two years, it's been contemplating a right to food act that would dramatically expand the current food subsidy regime, which already costs 500 billion rupees ($11 billion) a year. Expansions of all these programs depend on a thin tax base that could stretch state finances to the breaking point.
Will the new entitlement state affect India's post-liberalization story? The first decade after 1991 saw growing personal consumption as more Indians put the raw struggle for survival behind them. The second decade saw families invest in the future by raising their spending of services such as education and health. The third decade is now upon us. If India can't overcome the current political inertia surrounding reform, this decade won't see the positive strides the last two saw. Of course, there is the possibility that the widening arc of prosperity will encourage voters to look beyond entitlements—to seek leaders who deliver more secure futures through expanded opportunities and better infrastructure. This has already started happening at the state level. Last November voters in Bihar, one of India's most backward states, re-elected Nitish Kumar, a leader who had reformed governance and who had managed to woo investors. In Gujarat, Narendra Modi's solid economic credentials have translated into political gains

[ramana]

Meera Nanda’s Ignorance Revisited

More than Meera Nanda, it is Sjoman and Singleton that need to have their flimsy arguments and ludicrous logic refuted and summarily exposed. Nanda's article draws heavily from Singleton's book. Make no mistake, if this Sjoman and Singleton aren't deconstructed and exposed now, this might very well be another AIT in the making. And years from now textbooks will claim that *yoga* was a European invention. Both Sjoman and Singleton have preconceived notions, and then bake their arguments around it. An all too familiar rubric
of our eminent historengineers and their Eurocentric associates. In fact our professional migrationist from Eurocentric Inc., Steve Farmer has already quoted Singleton to pompously claim that *yogAsana* is a colonial construct "appropriated" by 'Hindu nationalists'.

Rony, The West is a hollow intellectual shell. A velagapandu after the elephant swallows it.
In order to perpetuate itself it needs to adopt and claim as its own whatever helps them survive and achieve dominance. They despise the current Greeks yet claim to be the heirs of the Ancient Greeks. They hate the Jews but steal Christianity. They even depict Jesus as Caucasian. They stole Enlightenment from India. And after post-Modernism, they need to steal Yoga the new age 'religion'.

So that is what is going on here.

Its the Ape in the movie "2001 Space Odyessy" facing the monolith/cul-de-sac of the mind.

[Maram]

I recently read a book called "Black Swan" by Nicholas Nasseem Taleb. It generally(I am making gross generalisation, which does the book injustice!) talks about how the world thought there are no black swans untill they were found. Read the following links for more thorough reviews :-
1)http://www.guardian.co.uk/books/2007/may/12/society
2)http://www.independent.co.uk/arts-enter ... 51969.html

Taleb uses the black swan as that "unforeseen/ unpredictable cataclysmic event" that changes everything and how previous prediction models are unsuccessful in seeing these events. He applies this theory in the stock markets/financial markets/derivatives etc...

Applying the analogy in geo strategic affairs, there are several events in geo strategic affairs that were unpredictable . Examples are:-
1) First World War :-
http://www.firstworldwar.com/origins/index.htm
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Archduke_F ... of_Austria
Imagine if his car took the wrong turn and the assasination prevented.

2)Events in North Africa and the Middle East may just be another of those "Black swan" moments :-
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2010%E2%80 ... revolution
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mohamed_Bouazizi
A street vendor Mohammed Bouazizi in Tunisia faced up to daily hard life, trying to feed many in his family and faced debts was insulted,his goods confiscicated.... He was pushed to the wall. He had nothing to lose from the point. He rebelled. He doused kerosene/paint some highly inflamable substance and burnt himself alive. In the process he facilitated the domino effect...

What are remarkable similarities in many countries in the middle east?
1) High Birth rate due to no/minimal contraception
2) women can't work in many countries(although they can in some). This makes 50% of their society non productive economically. Yes, I know... In India too, there are several women who choose to be home makers. But thats presumably by choice. Many do some sort of work once their children grow up. But many women who want to work to benefit the family financially CANNOT and that is the issue.

This leads to several social problems like polygamy and domestic violence...
3) There is a general pattern of corruption and nepotism which leads to poor state of the economy in many countries. This in turn leads to unemployment, complicated further by Malthisian Theory(http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Malthusian_theory) problems.

4) Finally, the most critical component of these problems is the LACK OF RECOURSE to sort these issues. India too, we hae any of these problems. However we can boot them out.In these countries they can't. That is why they have recoursed to sustained group protests.

Ofcourse, the other interesting link is Amir Khan is propping these deeply unpopular regimes through out. If it is not Amir Khan, then it is THE KINGDOM OF SAUDI ARABIA.

BRAdmins, can a new thread on kingdom of saudi arabia related matters be started to :-

1) how many despots are given asylum in KSA. Idi Amin to Nawaz Sharf saheb to Ben Ali( the tunsian dictator) and explore the reasons
2) Role of Saudi funded madrassas their role in spreading islamic fanaticism and subsequent socio-economic problems in these countries.
3) just news items links from KSA
4) the nexus between the Mutaween/religious clergy and the Saudi Monarchy?

Final thought :- It is satisfying to know the people in the middle are also concerned about roti-kapda and makan related issues.Once these issues are addressed, then extremism will slowly lose ground. Interesting there are no extremem groups linked to the protests barring Muslim Brotherhood in Egypt.

[ramana]

THread on KSA is already there on 4th or 5th page.

I want to make two points:

1) Indian Mullahs are worried that aam IM want to have a normal Indian life: education, job wife and two kids. This will remove the Mullah uniqueness (gives political power) and hence the effort to derail Vastanvi. In my travels my taxi driver an IM whom we took to Kanya Kumari said that in his circle there is a lot of debate on how the mullahs are right about the Koran but wrong about the social life. He was paying for his siblings to go to school so they can have better chances. Off course I gave him money to buy books for siblings.

2) There is a curiosus aspect of English DDM. When it comes to 2Gs(First Family) the DDM is out to defend them even thru pretzel logic. When it comes to any increase in national strengthfor India, like military arms etc, the DDM is out and out to sabotage the efforts.

So there is split personality here that they dont see India as Indira! They only see Indira as India.

Need to think about this second point a little more.

[hnair]

1) Indian Mullahs are worried that aam IM want to have a normal Indian life: education, job wife and two kids. This will remove the Mullah uniqueness (gives political power) and hence the effort to derail Vastanvi. In my travels my taxi driver an IM whom we took to Kanya Kumari said that in his circle there is a lot of debate on how the mullahs are right about the Koran but wrong about the social life. He was paying for his siblings to go to school so they can have better chances. Off course I gave him money to buy books for siblings.

ramana-saar, my post in west asia thread.

It will be great if the churning will cause Indian migrants to get some political say in a constitutional way. India will soon have the most affluent muslim population amongst the Ummah and the middle-east nations would want to acknowledge that at some point, what with the west moving away from hydrocarbons in a determined way.

Indian Mullahs can still have relevance in future and they might have to provide guidance to more of Ummah if they can reduce the influence of the in-style Islamist thinking amongst some of them. And it is in everyone's collective interests to not victimize folks like Shree Vastanvi beyond a point.

[Maram]

THread on KSA is already there on 4th or 5th page.

I want to make two points:

1) Indian Mullahs are worried that aam IM want to have a normal Indian life: education, job wife and two kids. This will remove the Mullah uniqueness (gives political power) and hence the effort to derail Vastanvi. In my travels my taxi driver an IM whom we took to Kanya Kumari said that in his circle there is a lot of debate on how the mullahs are right about the Koran but wrong about the social life. He was paying for his siblings to go to school so they can have better chances. Off course I gave him money to buy books for siblings.

2) There is a curiosus aspect of English DDM. When it comes to 2Gs(First Family) the DDM is out to defend them even thru pretzel logic. When it comes to any increase in national strengthfor India, like military arms etc, the DDM is out and out to sabotage the efforts.

So there is split personality here that they dont see India as Indira! They only see Indira as India.

Need to think about this second point a little more.

Educating Indian Muslim youth will give them Roti Kapda Makaan(RKM THINKING)thinking thus alienating them from the mullah sphere of influence. I applaud you for your small positive action(of giving money to buy books) which will go a LOOOOOOOOOONG way in reducing mullah sphere of influence.

Re :- DDM of the angrezi variety, Naxal Ram of the Hindu and Shekhar Dupatta of the Indian sorry faaren Express and more recently Burkha Dutt and Prannoy i don't use shaving cream Roy of the NDTV fame all feel they are the custodians of the Gandhian flame. I heard that that some one in top echelons of the communist party was related to Prannot's wife. Need to check this in detail.

The other problem is BJP Spokespersons like Rudy,Gadkari,venkayya naidu and several BJP leaders like Modi are not media savvy. Pramod Mahajan's untimely death robbed them of a media savvy politician who managed the press between 1996-2003 period . They have been unable to replace Mahajan!

BJP also are piss poor at managing regional satraps like AIDMK/DMK/TMC/BJD/Shiv Sena... So they can't cobble an alliance like kaangress can. they know how sideline satraps more effectively.Look how they have managed Jagan/Chiru bd Chandra Sekhar Rao in AP.Because they a re relatively new party.... there is no acquired knowledge of managing egos/massaging egos/ curbing destructive tendencies in politicians etc... The Kaangress do.

Kaangress have singhvi/diggi raaja/ Jayanti Natarajan etc.. who are erudite and english savvy.

The Indian media elite is left leaning of a faabian socialism(emanated from london school of economics) and Kaangress leaders like MMS/Chidambaram are england trained/educated forging those fabian socialism links.

BJP needs to groom English media savvy politicians.

All this makes BJP less likely to gain political power and therefore Business leaders cultivate Kaangress leadership

Just my thoughts...

[sum]

I heard that that some one in top echelons of the communist party was related to Prannot's wife. Need to check this in detail.

That would be Brinda Karat...

[Maram]

Thanks SUM, that's the one.

[Maram]

Ramana Garu,

Indian Muslims are beginning to think more like Indians first rather than consider themselves part of the Ummah... Azim Premji has started an educational trust. I am posting several links :-

1)http://teck.in/no-reservation-only-merit-based.html
His Critique of the concept of reservations makes for interesting reading. He advocates Meritocracy.
2)http://www.azimpremjifoundation.org/home.html
He is donating a substantia part of his wealth for this.

Avul Pakir Jainlubdin Abdul Kalaam ji's ideas about a resurgent India need to no description to members of this forum.

As educations provides employment and this provides money, more and more Indian Muslims will become stake holders in our economy and this will change their attitudes. Of course, there is a lot of work to be done. Most of the terrorists are from middle class backgrounds... so educashion itself may not be enough. Indian Muslims need their role models. Hopefully Kalam Ji and Premji Sir will give their role models...

[brihaspati]

"Mullahs are right about the Quran, but wrong about social issues"

That in a nutshell combines all of the dangers and continued threat of Islamism. That statement seems innocent and "modern" as an aspiration, but looking deeper it is not so. A Muslim who identifies that the Mullahs are right about the Quran, cannot but contradict his other statement that Mullahs are wrong about social issues. You cannot acknowledge the Mullah's being right about the Quran then because all that is wrong with the social issues stem actually from the authority of the Quran and the Mullah's claim of being "right" about the Quran.

Unless the text is unseated as the binding contract on all Muslims forever into the future, but at best a snapshot of history and claimed solution for a particular time period in history for a particular region and people, there is no solution to the problem and no liberation for IM's.

As long as the text (and its associated texts which are not always highlighted but invariably used to buttress outrageous claims) is still acknowledged as unchallengeable, the Mullah's authority and grip over the IM remains intact. The textual authority is the source and defence of all retrogression, social, political and economic. More dangerously for us, that textual authority sanctions every possible deception on us - non-Muslims - and every cover and justification for planned genocide on non-Muslims as and when sufficient numerical and military strength is gained.

The Maratha and Sikh project has remained incomplete, which is that the institutional basis of the power of the Islamic clergy has to be completely destroyed. [Both compromised partly out of internal factional fights where the precursors of modern DIE's used Islamics for their own power struggles]. All its institutional networks, its law boards, its charity networks, its theological apparatus that is tasked with spreading the textual authority and regenerating the memes - stand firmly in the way of IM's becoming integrated with the non-Muslim Indian in a safe and reliable way. More dangerously the textual authority preserves the genocidal aspects of Islamic proselytization within the ideas that are compulsorily memorized as part of theological education.

So compromisers from among us who are trying to protect/justify/reconstruct with selective highlighting - the Islamist texts and their authority, or the associated Islamic institutions - should be targeted as much as the Islamic clergy. They are one and the same cause, and treated so.

[brihaspati]

There is a fundamental error in thinking that mere education of IM youth will give them aspirations which will dilute the authority of the Islamist memes if not the authority of the Mullah. It is the nature and target of the education that is crucial.

If it is consciously a copy of the British project of denigrating, discrediting - and in general making Hindus feel bad about almost every aspect of their Hindu identity, by reconstruction and reinterpretation of Hindu texts and history, then it may just possibly succeed. Which means that any such educational project must have an underlying programme of discrediting the textual authority of Islam. Without such a conscious programme, modern education that avoids discrediting foundations of Islamism - will simply strengthen Jihadi violence. So instead of the crude sword and chopping hands or legs off or skinning alive, the modern education will teach how to use the internet, the available technology, or better methods of carrying out genocide using military knowhow.

None of the so-called Islamic countries which went for "modern education" have been able to prevent increasing radicalization. The Islamic education also creates aspirations for power in the naive but effective way in which it was conceived under the founders of Islam. So modern education will only fuel that aspiration for total dominance using education only as providing modern tools for aggression.

[Rony]

Mira Bhupathi the Evangelist, Mahesh Bhupathi's mom

http://cmpaul.wordpress.com/2008/11/10/ ... onfession/

[Pranav]

Baba Ramdev 'called bloody Indian' - http://www.deccanchronicle.com/national ... indian-258

Could there be Evanjehadi influences at work ... the MP in question Ering is not a Buddhist, by the way. See http://www.praisethealmighty.com/june_1 ... an_mps.php

[Hariprasad]

Baba Ramdev 'called bloody Indian' - http://www.deccanchronicle.com/national ... indian-258

Could there be Evanjehadi influences at work ... the MP in question Ering is not a Buddhist, by the way. See http://www.praisethealmighty.com/june_1 ... an_mps.php

However, the MP denied saying anything against Ramdev and claimed that he had only objected after the yoga guru levelled allegations of corruption against the Nehru-Gandhi family and the central government.

[Pranav]

x-post from internal security thread:

Rajiv Malhotra's speech from launch ceremony of the book "Breaking India".

Rajiv MAlhotra-1
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fqsYWgiV3yc

Rajiv Malhotra-2
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yc19N26IrVY

[Pranav]

How credible is the organization "Hindu American Foundation"?

Critique of Hindu American Foundation's Report on 'Caste'

By Rajiv Malhotra

Author of: "BREAKING INDIA: Western Interventions in Dravidian and Dalit Faultlines" (January, 2011)

Chairman of Board of Governors, Center for Indic Studies, University of Massachusetts (Dartmouth)

Professor Emeritus, Dev Sanskriti University, Haridwar.

Special Overseas Advisor to the Hindu Dharma Acharya Sabha

Board Member, World Association for Vedic Studies

Founder and President of Infinity Foundation


Summary

The critique below is in response to a report on "caste" recently issued by the Hindu American Foundation (HAF), “Hinduism: Not Cast in Caste” (available at http://www.hafsite.org/sites/default/fi ... _Dec10.pdf.) The purpose of my critique is two-fold: (1) to highlight substantive defects in the content of the report and (2) to demonstrate the severe damage that has already been inflicted or will likely result as a consequence of the distribution of the report. The report threatens to undo significant progress achieved by the Hindu community in correcting derogatory misrepresentations of Hinduism in the US educational system, provides valuable ammunition to anti-Hindu groups that will seriously undermine Hindu interests worldwide, and has serious geopolitical ramifications that threaten the interference of Western bodies into internal Indian/Hindu matters. Meanwhile, it does not achieve anything constructive to improve conditions on the ground in India in any sense.

http://hindtoday.com/Blogs/ViewBlogsV2. ... ceCode=IND

[Arjun]

x-post from internal security thread:

Rajiv Malhotra's speech from launch ceremony of the book "Breaking India".

Rajiv MAlhotra-1
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fqsYWgiV3yc

Rajiv Malhotra-2
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yc19N26IrVY

Rajiv Malhotra is fabulous as usual.

I would think his central point is valid for BR as well - there is no systematic academic analysis of the sources and control of discourse on religion as pertaining to India. This compares poorly with China's track record on this front.

As a portal devoted to Indian strategic studies - BR would benefit from allowing a thread that tracks the sources of discourse on Indian religions (both Dharmic as well as Indian Muslim / Indian Christian issues), which organizations are controlling the discourse, their motives and work towards an Indo-centric critique of the discourse. There is no point in pretending that religion is irrelevant to analyzing the Indian strategic and international relations context. This needs to be a non-burqa one, and to avoid flame wars - the tone needs to be kept academic.

[Maram]

There is a fundamental error in thinking that mere education of IM youth will give them aspirations which will dilute the authority of the Islamist memes if not the authority of the Mullah. It is the nature and target of the education that is crucial.
If it is consciously a copy of the British project of denigrating, discrediting - and in general making Hindus feel bad about almost every aspect of their Hindu identity, by reconstruction and reinterpretation of Hindu texts and history, then it may just possibly succeed. Which means that any such educational project must have an underlying programme of discrediting the textual authority of Islam. Without such a conscious programme, modern education that avoids discrediting foundations of Islamism - will simply strengthen Jihadi violence. So instead of the crude sword and chopping hands or legs off or skinning alive, the modern education will teach how to use the internet, the available technology, or better methods of carrying out genocide using military knowhow.

None of the so-called Islamic countries which went for "modern education" have been able to prevent increasing radicalization. The Islamic education also creates aspirations for power in the naive but effective way in which it was conceived under the founders of Islam. So modern education will only fuel that aspiration for total dominance using education only as providing modern tools for aggression.

Brihaspati ji,

I have spent the last couple of days thinking about this post in general and the sentences I have highlighted in particular. Education, irrespective of nature and target is of little value. The most important thing to consider is the outcome of any education. does it lead to money making? can that peson who is educated earn enough to buy roti-kapada-makaan?

The kind of education that is the need of the hour is the one that gives money to buy a house, educate their children,loooks after their health and pays their pention. The targets should be big cities like Hyderabad, Bangalore and such.. That effect will percolate down quickly.

[ramana]

Maram garu, Also leadership of Muslims in such areas needs to be allowed to develop financial interests in those cities or else they have nothing to lose and indulge in supporting terrorists.

[kmkraoind]

A small question to strategic gurus. RIL had sold 30% stake in some gas/oilfields to BP, does that means BP is also co-owner of these gas/oilfields. In case of hostilities between India China, any attack on these gas/oilfields by the Chinese is attack on an American company or just its just Indian headache.

[Jarita]

^^^ This sounds like East Indian COmpany part two with Reliance acting as conduits. Selling our non renewables to the same chors

[Jarita]

The write-up below was written in 2003


Modern Indian Sassoons-House of Reliance

We have seen in the beginning of this section EICs gave a sort of trade monopoly to house of Sassoon during 1830-1945. If we see today the trend now is such monopoly is being granted to Reliance corporation. The collaboration of MNCs with Reliance show the same trend of EICs continuing. Once the natural resources of any country were taken over then the political governments will be as power less as grass blades being inundated with floods.

MNC
Ownership house /EIC back ground
Indian Counterpart
Product
Potential In US $



De Beers
Rothschild
Reliance
Diamonds
Billions

EXXON
Rockefeller
Reliance
Oil Natural gas
Billions

Royal Dutch Shell
Rothschild
Reliance
Oil Natural gas
Billions

Lucent/Viacom*
Rockefeller
Reliance
Telecommunications
Billions

Metlife/New York life
Rockefeller
Reliance
Insurance
Billions

http://www.portraitofindia.com/liberal2.htm

[Prem]

http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/9caf40b4-3d86 ... z1EcdEMx1E
Where is Singh?
By Suhel Seth

The press conference held last week by Manmohan Singh, India’s prime minister, was an unmitigated disaster. Mr Singh’s enormous brand was felled at the hands of some very reasonable television folks. None of them was out for the kill. But then the prey succumbed even without any poisoned arrows being fired.Mr Singh as a brand, until that morning, stood for integrity and high morality. He was the same man who led his own government to the brink when threatened with blackmail by the Communists over the 2009 Indo-US Nuclear deal. But then that was perhaps another time and probably another kind of prime minister’s office.

At a time when the nation is looking for an inspirational leader, Mr Singh did not help his cause by saying: “I am not as big a culprit as I am being made out to be”. Over the second term of the coalition government, Mr Singh has come across as a man under siege. With his values and integrity, he doesn’t deserve this.
The bigger question is where are the controls and processes that almost every prime minister’s office has been armed with ever since India got its independence. The country needs inspirational leaders who can tell us what went wrong and why? To send former ministers to jail is seen as tokenism.Punishing the culprits behind the telecoms scandal is as critical as restoring trust in our institutions.For the prime minister to blame ‘coalition dharma’ as the cause for the rot affecting India makes Mr Singh come across as weak and ineffective leader. It was an error on his part not to accept that he made a mistake and move on.At the start of his first term in 2004, people would generally ask ‘Who is Singh?’ Then in 2007, we declared ‘Singh is King’. But in 2011 people are beginning to ask ‘Where is Singh?’.

It is a strange government we have. The foreign minister reads out Portugal’s speech at the United Nations. The premier breaks a long silence only to worsen his image.Mr Singh loves using the example of Caesar’s wife being above suspicion. We aren’t too worried about the wife. India is now looking for its leader. If we can find Caesar, the issues about the wife will be settled on their own.

[Jarita]

This is quite funny

Baba Ramdev reacts to Digvijay attack on him
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SjSYFNva ... r_embedded

[RamaY]

"Mullahs are right about the Quran, but wrong about social issues"

That in a nutshell combines all of the dangers and continued threat of Islamism. That statement seems innocent and "modern" as an aspiration, but looking deeper it is not so. A Muslim who identifies that the Mullahs are right about the Quran, cannot but contradict his other statement that Mullahs are wrong about social issues. You cannot acknowledge the Mullah's being right about the Quran then because all that is wrong with the social issues stem actually from the authority of the Quran and the Mullah's claim of being "right" about the Quran.

There is a fundamental error in thinking that mere education of IM youth will give them aspirations which will dilute the authority of the Islamist memes if not the authority of the Mullah. It is the nature and target of the education that is crucial.

None of the so-called Islamic countries which went for "modern education" have been able to prevent increasing radicalization. The Islamic education also creates aspirations for power in the naive but effective way in which it was conceived under the founders of Islam. So modern education will only fuel that aspiration for total dominance using education only as providing modern tools for aggression.

+1

The kind of education that is the need of the hour is the one that gives money to buy a house, educate their children,loooks after their health and pays their pention. The targets should be big cities like Hyderabad, Bangalore and such.. That effect will percolate down quickly.

Modern education is just that - a way to earn modern money so they can get a modern house and further modern education for their children.

Modern education does not offer any guarantees to change individual thought processes and religious/ideological linkages. Exactly why education in IM community will not change their attitudes towards other aspects of social life.