Indo-UK: News & Discussion

jagga · Post by **jagga** » 17 Feb 2011 15:43

Well-known writers and other public figures in India have urged the British government to re-think funding cuts which will end BBC Hindi broadcasts.

The signatories include Arundhati Roy, broadcaster Sir Mark Tully, historian Ram Guha and the author Vikram Seth.

They say the BBC Hindi broadcasts, to end on 31 March, have 10 million listeners, particularly in rural areas.

The BBC announced the cuts last month, saying it had no choice as the government was reducing its funding.

Wednesday's appeal was entitled "Don't silence BBC Hindi radio".

"For nearly seven decades BBC Hindi radio has been a credible source of unbiased and accurate information, especially in times of crises," the signatories said.

I don't think many people listen to BBC radio in India. Can't understand all the heart-burn among "Well Known Writers".

Dileep · Post by **Dileep** » 17 Feb 2011 16:52

Hmm, I would say the number of BBC hindi listeners in the rural areas will be somewhat equal to the readers of Ms Roy's novel. Close to zero

rsingh · Post by **rsingh** » 17 Feb 2011 19:28

I will not be surprized if some of these loonies start collecting funds to save BBC hindi service. I used to listen to it but that was nothing special. Kailassh Badhwar used to sing how "timid British are"..................When I went to londonistan two male timid British homos were kissing each other violenltly in the TUBE.That was my first experiance

BTW has anybody listened to AIR's URDU service.................for me that was best. Baki's had respect for that station and sometime you hear news which were not available to aam media. Me think that was specially prepared for BAKIS..............but that was in 80ies,do not know how it goes these days.

Gus · Post by **Gus** » 17 Feb 2011 19:42

My dad used to say that IG's assassination was first announced by BBC when AIR and other media kept quite. Not sure if its true.

Sachin · Post by **Sachin** » 17 Feb 2011 19:47

Gus wrote:My dad used to say that IG's assassination was first announced by BBC when AIR and other media kept quite. Not sure if its true.

This is true. The AIR had not relayed the news, so that some time is there for the security forces to move in and do the bandobust. Some thing similar happened during the Babri Masjid demolition also. The Doordarshan (and AIR) kept on saying that the masjid is intact. BBC on the other hand had news bulletins every 45 minutes, and they showed the visuals and correct updates every time. This live coverage did have one advantage for me, my father decided to go for a cable TV connection (which was quite expensive then) so that he can see and hear of what is actually happening.

Gus · Post by **Gus** » 17 Feb 2011 21:07

Oh, the reason I heard was that, the delay was to make sure RG becomes PM and not the person next in line according to constitution.

rsingh · Post by **rsingh** » 18 Feb 2011 00:08

DD and AIR have responsibility to Indian people. During 1984 riots BBC did maximum to incite violence............." Delhi is burning. I am in CP and around me all of the buildings are on fire" said Mark Tully. I went there next day and it was far far better then what we were told by BBC.
Another story, during sikh riots people were killed in roadways bus in Haryana. AIR reported "members of one community were killed". BBC reported "Hindus were separated and killed". DD and AIR tried to control potential disturbances. BBC tried to get maximum mileage out of it.

akashganga · Post by **akashganga** » 18 Feb 2011 08:49

Will be glad to see BBC hindi go away. They started hindi service as propaganda to spread their ideologies. The world has changed.

jagga wrote:Call to save BBC Hindi broadcasts
Well-known writers and other public figures in India have urged the British government to re-think funding cuts which will end BBC Hindi broadcasts.

The signatories include Arundhati Roy, broadcaster Sir Mark Tully, historian Ram Guha and the author Vikram Seth.

They say the BBC Hindi broadcasts, to end on 31 March, have 10 million listeners, particularly in rural areas.

The BBC announced the cuts last month, saying it had no choice as the government was reducing its funding.

Wednesday's appeal was entitled "Don't silence BBC Hindi radio".

"For nearly seven decades BBC Hindi radio has been a credible source of unbiased and accurate information, especially in times of crises," the signatories said.
I don't think many people listen to BBC radio in India. Can't understand all the heart-burn among "Well Known Writers".

rohiths · Post by **rohiths** » 18 Feb 2011 11:28

Anyway they were front for Maoists and other subvertionists.
That is the only reason for all the rona-dhona

svenkat · Post by **svenkat** » 18 Feb 2011 11:59

Mark Tully fanned discord during 1984.The b@#$%^^d does equal qual with Porkistan.Yet the mofo is invited in TV shows and GOI gave him Padma Shree.Also he wrote a book with Satish Jacob(a St. Stephens product) on Punjab full of half truths.

Thankfully the BBC era has come to an end.Wishing a happy burial for BBC Hindi service.

Ram Guha seems to be a favourite among anti-national elements.

Dileep · Post by **Dileep** » 18 Feb 2011 16:49

Gus wrote:Oh, the reason I heard was that, the delay was to make sure RG becomes PM and not the person next in line according to constitution.

There is nothing like a line of succession in the Indian system like americans do. That is because the parliament holds the power, which is delegated to the PM. If one PM dies, they just choose another PM.

In USA, the people elect the president, so you can't elect another on short notice.

jagga · Post by **jagga** » 18 Feb 2011 18:17

Answer to below question is "Politicians". Even if there is 15% GDP growth for next 50 years, poverty wont go away.

Will UK’s £1billion aid get to the poor of India... or corrupt politicians?

Haresh · Post by **Haresh** » 18 Feb 2011 19:16

SHAME HE'S BLACK !!
and
HALF A WOG!!!

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article ... -slur.html

Rahul M · Post by **Rahul M** » 18 Feb 2011 20:20

jagga wrote:Answer to below question is "Politicians". Even if there is 15% GDP growth for next 50 years, poverty wont go away.
Will UK’s £1billion aid get to the poor of India... or corrupt politicians?

the answer to that question is "elite 'social-workers' back in UK".
kindly do not fall for the propaganda, UK aid is NOT spent through politicians but through UK based NGO's and their local branches.

http://www.business-standard.com/india/ ... ia/401580/

Indian activists say access to DFID funds is contingent on hiring consultants, mostly British. “When they (DFID) give money they send their own consultants. The way they handle it, it would be better if they didn’t give anything,” said Harsh Jaitley who heads VANI, a network of 2000 NGOs.

Echoing Jaitley’s views Anil Chaudhury, activist and founder of NGO Peace and Action Centre (PEACE), said agreements signed by DFID (and other agencies) have inbuilt clauses that ensure that a chunk of the money was paid to consultancies — a large proportion of these bodies are run by expatriates to ensure that the money flows back into the British economy.

As much as 60 per cent of the grant could often go towards paying the consultants hired by DFID to audit and monitor the programmes.

jagga · Post by **jagga** » 18 Feb 2011 23:19

^
Will UK’s £1billion aid get to the poor of India... or corrupt politicians

MUCH of Britain's promised £1billion aid to India will be administered through a political system mired in corruption, a Sun investigation has discovered.

hnair · Post by **hnair** » 18 Feb 2011 23:29

Nowadays, corrupt politicians need to pay off voters and hence money is reaching the poor better than at any other time post-1947. May not be a western approved system. But nevertheless, is a system that seemed to work for poorer Indians and even maoists too will have to come overboard at some point, to tap on to that model, if they want to compete with mainstream politicos for the attention of the poor.

so it is better through these corrupt politicians than highly paid consultants who sniff at the Indian traffic/cows and go back to their South of France villas to wash off the experience.

Rahul M · Post by **Rahul M** » 18 Feb 2011 23:32

jagga wrote:^
Will UK’s £1billion aid get to the poor of India... or corrupt politicians
MUCH of Britain's promised £1billion aid to India will be administered through a political system mired in corruption, a Sun investigation has discovered.

an "investigation" by the sun ?

tell me you are joking.

and no, DFID money is NOT spent through the govt, irrespective of what 'sun' tells you.

jagga · Post by **jagga** » 18 Feb 2011 23:45

^
Whats so funny

Discussion can be done without using YOU too many times

hnair wrote:so it is better through these corrupt politicians than highly paid consultants who sniff at the Indian traffic/cows and go back to their South of France villas to wash off the experience.

Because of this attitude corruption don't go away from India. There must be zero tolerance towards corruption. The best thing is to BAN the aid through DFID.

Rahul M · Post by **Rahul M** » 18 Feb 2011 23:52

the govt is hesitant to ban the DFID aid PRECISELY because it is targeted at pvt NGO's and they(GOI) can't be arbitarily interfering with funding for NGO's.

hnair · Post by **hnair** » 18 Feb 2011 23:55

jagga wrote:Because of this attitude corruption don't go away from India. There must be zero tolerance towards corruption. The best thing is to BAN the aid through DFID.

I am ok with you thinking about my attitudes. Someone has to, I been very bad

But why ban money coming from UK? It is good free money and if some of them feel guilty about past deeds of plunder or some of them are idiots enough to forget that to rant around like this.... not our problem.

jagga · Post by **jagga** » 18 Feb 2011 23:58

Rahul M, Do you think below could be the reason as well? From your above link

Almost 66 per cent of the grant given to India by DFID goes to the government: to fund the health ministry’s Reproductive Child Health and HIV and AIDS programmes (42 per cent) and the Sarva Shiksha Abhiyan (24 per cent). The remaining amount is shared by the Rural Livelihood Programmes in four states and the Poorest Areas Civil Society (PACS) programme

Why I am saying this is because and If I remember well, when cameron was here on his last visit to India, GOI was thinking to stop taking AID money. But not to embarrass cameron and company the idea was dropped.

Added Later: Just found this from google
India to tell London to stop aid next April

India's external affairs ministry has instructed the finance ministry to inform London that India will not accept further aid from the Department for international Development from next April. DFID is a UK government agency that manages Britain's aid to poor countries to help alleviate poverty

Last week, India's Foreign Secretary Nirupama Rao told her counterpart in the finance ministry that "internal discussions" within UK's DFID were "to limit the aid further and channelise it to specific projects of their choice in certain states instead of routing it through the central government

Rahul M · Post by **Rahul M** » 19 Feb 2011 00:31

boss, they go to govt schemes which are implemented on the ground by NGO's, same difference. personally I would rather they kept their not-AID to themselves and gave us back what they looted from us.

brihaspati · Post by **brihaspati** » 19 Feb 2011 03:36

I have gained this impression from experts on economics and finance here on the forum that international activity or steps by any nation/gov has no ideological/value component. It is all strictly business only, profits ony. So British "aid" must be profitable in monetary terms for the British. There cannot be any "humanitarian" component to it. So anything that the British "aid" does on the ground in India must be tied to greater returns financially and economically for UK. So in that sense there cannot be any reason to continue the UK "aid".

As for Rahul M ji's wish - no chance! UK most carefully avoided any statement of even acknowledgment/apologies for trauma/exploitation due to the slave-trade [and the triangular Atlantic slave trade which according to significant number of non-British and non-Marxist historians fuelled the basis of the industrial revolution in UK]. The underlying premise apparently was that any acknowledgment/apologies may open the case for a compensation claim.

All the capital extracted from colonies and slaves have to be firmly held on to. Because Brits did all that in their national interest, and strictly according to the only golden rule of international relations - that of pure monetary profits, they are entirely justified in what they did and continue to do now - that is deny any repsonsibility for what they did, and refuse to compensate.

Maram · Post by **Maram** » 19 Feb 2011 04:07

All the newspapers in the past weeks in the UK have carried articles India related talking about India being a space power and Nuclear Power. Why does India need Aid?Blah blah blah...We are soon going to be a bigger economy than the UK blah blah blah.. Radio 5 live carried a discussion session during evening Drive In Time by Asmaaa & Peter. same bull shit as above.....

May be the time has come for India to say NO to UK aid.....

Hari Seldon · Post by **Hari Seldon** » 19 Feb 2011 05:26

Wouldn't it be wonderful if India rented out ad-space in UKstani tabloids urging UK-stan to keep their 'aid(s)' home where it is nowadays increasingly being needed anyway, eh? Would certainly find resonance in popular sentiment there only.

Ya ya I know, far-fetched, not-our-ishtyle and all that. But a man can at least dream & be happy, can't he?

ArmenT · Post by **ArmenT** » 19 Feb 2011 10:44

UK getting serious against homegrown Pakis?
Luton army parade protesters lose High Court appeal

Five Muslim men who disrupted a march by soldiers who had just returned from Afghanistan have lost an appeal against convictions for public order offences.
...
....
Lord Justice Gross said the right to freedom of expression was important but that "the focus on minority rights should not result in overlooking the rights of the majority".

sum · Post by **sum** » 19 Feb 2011 10:55

Uh,oh...shouldn't India send a strong message to Uk-stan to honor the minority rights there and send a team of observers to monitor the court proceedings to ensure no subversion of justice ( like the UK-stanis sent their team for Dr.Sen's hearings)?

shyam · Post by **shyam** » 19 Feb 2011 12:08

It is foolish to say no to the aid offered by UK, it is a non-refundable forex. All that we have to make sure is that that money gets spent in India and also gets seeped through the cracks of corruption so that the cynical goals of the funds are not achieved. Some BR members should consider joining NGOs sponsored by these grants.

Maram · Post by **Maram** » 19 Feb 2011 14:38

Shyam,

We are nation of Billion plus people. with a forex reserve of 298.66 Billion Dollars Why do we need UK aid? If we were to remove corruption,we could channel goverment money more effectively and that is enough to satisfy all our needs. What we need is a concerted anti corruption drive, not UK Aid.. JMT...

jagga · Post by **jagga** » 19 Feb 2011 15:34

With constant public pressure the aid to India by UKstan might get stopped in very near future. Before something like this happen, India must BAN the aid and as Hari Seldon ji said put the advertisement on front pages of UK newspaper "We Don't Need British Aid". It will be a slap on the H&D of brits. The attitude of British aam janta is very bad regarding the aid to India. Gora press seems to be kind of jealous of emerging India. Where is all the Brit press when all the aid goes to terrorist state of Pakistan and not even a single pound get spent on needy? There is prejudice among Brit press and people against India.
GOI is spending Billions of dollars on social schemes every year. What is needed is to root out corruption. Best thing is give some baniya amount of 10 million dollars to poor Brits and spent 10 million dollars on Brit press advertising "Look We Are Giving You The Aid"

jiteshn · Post by **jiteshn** » 19 Feb 2011 16:08

The vertical red line divides the period before and after 1900(the after effects of 1857 rebellion). India and china GDP was among the top two. Imagine the amount of tax revenue the british generated through the economy of its indian colony. And it hoarded the revenue back to the UK for almost a century. UK was the third largest economy by the end of the 19th century; after india and china.

The british raj began from 1858. Check out how the UK GDP jumps from 36232 in 1820 to 100180 in 1870.

UK aid, my foot. Indian empire virtually bankrolled UK's entire economy for almost a century.

shyam · Post by **shyam** » 19 Feb 2011 23:26

The reason I say we should take UK aid, without letting them achieving the target goals, is because that money will be a loss to UK exchequer. Maybe GoI should demand complete visibility into how that money is spent.

Rahul M · Post by **Rahul M** » 21 Feb 2011 05:28

no shyam, as was pointed out in the article I linked to in last page, that money goes back to UK but we get a bad name for it.

Neshant · Post by **Neshant** » 21 Feb 2011 05:42

There is no aid, it is just propaganda.

Far more is extracted out of Africa via IMF games and keeping the place in debt trap through financial subterfuge than ever reaches the continent. Only a morsel of what is robbed is ever returned as aid - which is merely a small debt forgiveness which could never be paid anyway and subsidies to companies from the country bankrupting Africa.

The only good news on this front is that looting of Asia has largely come to an end.

I fear however the financing & banking con men and companies within a country are now a bigger threat than external powers trying to financially wreck states. So beware of the fast talking banking CEO trying to sell a bunch of bull and flip paper.

somnath · Post by **somnath** » 21 Feb 2011 07:12

It is ironic that DFID gets hit by both sides of the divide..The "right" in India asks it to f-off on grounds articulated above..And the "Left" has an equal amount of visceral hatred for it because it thinks DFID aid is used to perpetuate neo-liberal policies of the state that they are opposing!

But we should be simply saying "thank you for thus far, but no thanks anymore" to DFID now...That money is not required, even if 100% was being deployed in India and not to consultants..

Lalmohan · Post by **Lalmohan** » 21 Feb 2011 18:48

an interesting aside for those wondering about islamists in the UK turning white
many years ago, King John (brother of Richard Lionheart) approached the King of Morocco for aid - he offered to convert the english people to islam if the King sent over an army to help him fight the Dukes and establish control over the unruly Saxons and the truculent Norman overlords who didn't much like John, and prefered Richard - busy in the holy land fighting muslims.
the king of morocco turned down the offer, not seeing much profit in the enterprise

Lalmohan · Post by **Lalmohan** » 21 Feb 2011 19:41

^^^ a book called "The Tartar Khan's Englishman"

Lalmohan · Post by **Lalmohan** » 21 Feb 2011 19:49

whites turning to islam

Lalmohan · Post by **Lalmohan** » 21 Feb 2011 20:03

sorry, poor use of english
i meant to say that islamists become the mainstream (i.e. the white population turns into islamists)

Murugan · Post by **Murugan** » 21 Feb 2011 20:06

jiteshn bhai pl provide link to the info. nice comparative table you have posted.