J&K News and Discussion-2011

jagga · Post by **jagga** » 04 Mar 2011 17:46

menon s wrote:FOR THOSE WHO SAY UPA DOES NOT CARE FOE PUNDITS?
The Prime Minister will also be addressing the annual convocation of Sher-e-Kashmir Agricultural University besides handing over near 800 of the 2400 flats meant for Kashmiri migrant pandits , they said.The Budget has announced Rs 8000 crore special package for Kashmir besides a separate Rs 150 crore for Jammu region and Rs 100 crore for Ladakh based on the recommendations of the two task forces set up to go into allocations in terms of infrastructure needs and make suitable recommendations to overcome the deficiencies..
http://news.in.msn.com/national/article ... id=4975953

They are refugees NOT migrants. Migrant is a person who has fled/left his or her native country/state/place for economic reasons rather than fear of political or ethnic persecution.

somnath · Post by **somnath** » 04 Mar 2011 21:26

RamaY wrote:Can there be anything eternal (sanatan) in your world view? If so what it is?

"as data changes, I change my views...What do you do sir?" - John Maynard Keynes

Sanku · Post by **Sanku** » 04 Mar 2011 21:37

RamaY wrote:Can there be anything eternal (sanatan) in your world view? If so what it is?

Love for e-con-o-mics I guess. Money at any cost.

chaanakya · Post by **chaanakya** » 04 Mar 2011 21:39

Sanku wrote:
RamaY wrote:Can there be anything eternal (sanatan) in your world view? If so what it is?
Love for e-con-o-mics I guess. Money at any cost.

svinayak · Post by **svinayak** » 04 Mar 2011 21:41

Destroying India may be one more eternal thought

CRamS · Post by **CRamS** » 04 Mar 2011 21:54

Aditya_V wrote:'India willing to discuss Kashmir with Pakistan'

As predicted Pakis have won, no action against 26/11 prepatrators but we are discussing Kashmir is Disputed. Great!!!

Absolutely, no question about that. Its a shameful climb down from India's original position.

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 04 Mar 2011 22:00

Interesting marshalling of state resources:

Kashmir Chief directs all DCs to deal effectively with dogs

I guess it doesn't apply to separatists!

Srinagar, March 4 (Scoop News) –Divisional Commissioner, Kashmir, Dr. Asgar Hassan Samoon today directed Deputy Commissioners of the valley to take effective steps for checking the menace of stray dogs and polythene in the valley. He was interacting with the Deputy Commissioners of the valley through video conferencing here today.

Dr. Samoon directed Deputy Commissioners to direct the concerned officials to deal with rabid/mad dogs by issuing shoot at sight orders. All SPs, SHOs as well as Security forces have also been authorised to take cognisance and initiate action in case of rabid/mad dogs. This measure has been initiated by Div Com to ensure the safety of the public, in view of the recent incidents in which two young persons died due to dog bites in Uri and Pampore.

Dr. Samoon has requested public to help Administration in identifying the rabid dogs. The video conference was also attended by Director Health Services Kashmir, Director Animal Husbandry Kashmir, Regional Wildlife Warden, Representatives from SMC, Society for Prevention of Cruelty against Animals (SPCA), members of Faculty of Veterinary Sciences, SKUAST-K. The Chief Medical Officers, Chief Animal Husbandry Officers and Administrators of Town Area Committees also attended the conference alongwith their DCs.

Dr. Samoon, who has personally been monitoring the measures taken to control menace of stray dogs instructed SMC and Town Area Committees to take immediate measures for sterilisation by Animal Birth Control Programme of all male stray dogs. Divisional Commissioner, however, clarified that the shoot-at-sight orders shall be valid only for mad and rabid dogs and in no case should any non-rabid dog be shot.

Divisional Commissioner directed the Director Health Services to ensure availability of Anti Rabies Vaccines in all the districts of the valley and provide the same free of cost to the affected persons.

Director Health Services assured the Divisional Commissioner that sufficient quantity of Vaccines is available.

He directed the Deputy Commissioners to constitute SPCA in all the districts and sign MOU with Animal Welfare Board of India to facilitate receipt of assistance to deal with the menace.

He directed them to utilise the services of NYK Volunteers by arranging rallies to create awareness about the menace of polythene and stray dogs.

Highlighting the importance of ban on usage of polythene, the Divisional Commissioner said that Jammu and Kashmir is the first state in the country to pass an Act against use of non-biodegradable wastes.

We should implement the Act in letter and spirit, he asserted.

It was informed that Faculty of Veterinary Sciences has deputed six interns to SMC for conducting sterilisation of stray dogs. Dog catcher has also been developed by them.

SPCA members suggested development of dog sanctuaries, for which Deputy Commissioner, Srinagar was asked to identify land measuring around 10 kannals in Srinagar in the first instance which can later be replicated in other districts.

sum · Post by **sum** » 04 Mar 2011 22:06

Aditya_V wrote:'India willing to discuss Kashmir with Pakistan'

Very eagerly waiting for the latest BRF Chankian spin on the new MMS utterances..

rgsrini · Post by **rgsrini** » 04 Mar 2011 23:33

^^^

Very eagerly waiting for the latest BRF Chankian spin on the new MMS utterances..

We cannot discuss about the same things in every Chai Biscoot sessions saar. We need to make it interesting by mixing different topics.

Nihat · Post by **Nihat** » 04 Mar 2011 23:54

sum wrote:
Aditya_V wrote:'India willing to discuss Kashmir with Pakistan'
Very eagerly waiting for the latest BRF Chankian spin on the new MMS utterances..

I don't think anybody can come up with anything, this is a sell out of the worst kind. We'd rather have Miliband make these statements, atleast he's a foreigner.

I have never really understood the desire of Indian leaders to make peace with TSP despite being kicked in the nuts. AGAIN and AGAIN. Is it something in our DNA, do we not have the guts to tell a puny and theocratic state to keep away, heck the leaders can't even ignore an advesary let alone confront it.

Venkarl · Post by **Venkarl** » 04 Mar 2011 23:55

brihaspati wrote: But flats? Does it imply multistoried apartments? That means many Pundit families individually owning cubic metres of air, and jointly owning only one piece of land. Is it possible to calculate what land and property they left when they fled for safety, and what theyw ill now be getting? Its a good strategy if its multistoried. This means they can all be now squeezed into a small space for Jihadis to come an have their pick of the women and kill the men or extract whatever other legitimate democratic demands the valley Muslims may feel from time to time. It reminds me of the beehive, which humans allow to grow in corners of their properties - so that the bees gather honey and then they can be smoked away.

..thats a torturous life...

....but yeah...these flats are perfect target for jihadis from now onwards.....just blow up a building 1 by 1 on a yearly basis and you get 50 lives minimum for each blast....now who will go and settle there as our ManishH has asked before? and the question is will we still look for data all over to change our views and be blind to these killings?

Venkarl · Post by **Venkarl** » 04 Mar 2011 23:58

Nihat wrote: I don't think anybody can come up with anything, this is a sell out of the worst kind. We'd rather have Miliband make these statements, atleast he's a foreigner.

I have never really understood the desire of Indian leaders to make peace with TSP despite being kicked in the nuts. AGAIN and AGAIN. Is it something in our DNA, do we not have the guts to tell a puny and theocratic state to keep away, heck the leaders can't even ignore an advesary let alone confront it.

Not so fast...give them some time...I am waiting for their gems and marvels..and then I will laugh at India.

brihaspati · Post by **brihaspati** » 05 Mar 2011 01:28

Here is another big big reason why you should not study history, not "live in the past". Because you would then know that all Sakunian [we denigrate associating Chanakya's name with such things] promises about "never really conceding", "chai biskoot session onlee", "nothing really given", to mumblings of "real politik", or arrogant "get real, have a life, smell the coffee" whenever its about conceding to Islamist/Jihadi/Paki demands - we have a great and illustrious history of the Congress doing its necessary rope trick or volte face.

For example,
Gandhiji is supposed to have told Maulana Azad, "If the Congress wishes to accept partition, it will be over my dead body. So long as I am alive, I will never agree to the partition of India. Nor will I, if I can help it, allow Congress to accept it". (India wins freedom - by M AK Azad, p.186)

But the Sapru-Rajagopalachari formula of 10th July, 1944, had his "blessings", and this accepted the right to decide the issue of separation from Hindusthan.

On 24th September, 1944, Gandhiji wrote to Jinnah that he would not accept the "two nation theory" but was willing to consider the basis for partition as where Muslims are "in absolute majority, desire to live in separation from the rest of India". Further, " Differeing from you on the general basis, I can yet recommend to the Congress and the country the acceptance of the claim for separation containe din the Muslim League Resolution of Lahore 1940 on my basis and on the following terms" (Desika char. p 667)

JLN persuaded MKG to address the AICC on 14th June, 1947. Gandhiji said :

You will not doubt that no one could be as much hurt by the division of the country as I am. And I don't think that anyone can be as unhappy today as I am. But what has happened has happened..The working comittee has on your behalf accepted partition. Now we have to consider what our duty is..If the Congress Working Committee has done this, it has done so deliberately and for certain weighty reasons. And this decision has been taken jointly by the Congress, the Muslim League and the British Government...If you reject it the world will call you irresponsible...It is important that you should understand the times. The demand of the times is that we should bridle our tongues and do only what will be for India's good" (Collected works, vol 88, pp153-155).

This last paragraph should be studied by all to see what are the veiled threats, emotional manipulations, and suggesting excuses or logic that the dissenters within Congress could use to feel at peace - about what was a very nice u-turn about "concessions".

It is the same set of logic and arguments and methods - fait accompli, "look how unreasonable they are", "you should take responsibility", "if you don't support what we have already decided and agreed upon - you will be blamed", "trust your gurus" - be "real" and submit to the "demands of the time", "close ranks behind us leaders", and all this "for India's good" (forget definition of what that India means).

This should be the core understanding of the attitude that may also appear over J&K.

shiv · Post by **shiv** » 05 Mar 2011 06:31

The "I flew once' mohterma writes:

Pakistan building colony for Chinese in PoK

Experts in New Delhi said by increasing presence in the Gilgit-Baltistan area, China was adding to the strategic threats in Leh-Kargil. They said this would necessitate greater attention to development of infrastructure in the sector and a review of New Delhi’s interactions with the nationalist elements in Xinjiang and Gilgit-Baltistan.

eh what?

RamaY · Post by **RamaY** » 05 Mar 2011 06:47

brihaspati wrote: JLN persuaded MKG to address the AICC on 14th June, 1947. Gandhiji said :

...

That is exactly today's head of the nation is trying to repeat.

What has happened has happened. The ruling coalition has on your behalf accepted autonomy. Now we have to consider what our duty is. If the UPA had done this, it has done so deliberately with the approval of corresponding political constituencies and for certain weighty reasons. India cannot stop its economic progress for narrow interests of keeping certain states in the union against their will. And this decision has been taken jointly by the UPA, the cashmiri separatists and the Pakistan govt. If you reject it the world will call you irresponsible and India will be denied its place at the high table. It is important that you should understand the times and do not listen to the religious organizations like RSS and Bajarang Dal. The demand of the times is that we should bridle our tongues and do only what will be for Indias good, that is economic progress and India's rightful place at world high table.

JwalaMukhi · Post by **JwalaMukhi** » 05 Mar 2011 06:49

"India willing to discuss POKashmir with pakis" is the chankian spin. PM Shri.MMS was misquoted. In their eagerness to report, the POK part was just notated in short form as K.
Could be mixup of papers. Sorry, will have to check with SMkrishna, at least can be sure for now the papers were not portugal's papers.

CRamS · Post by **CRamS** » 05 Mar 2011 08:33

sum wrote:Very eagerly waiting for the latest BRF Chankian spin on the new MMS utterances..

Yesterday, I was on the same flight with S.M.Krishna from Delhi to Bangalore. After getting down at Bangalore airport, I went up close and shook hands with SMK, and I wanted to challenge him on this sell out. I went up to him, even as the security detail around him were watching me closely. I chickened out, preferfing to just shake his hands and wish him well, because like on many other occasiona before, I don't believe except for me, this Kashmir sell out was on the minds of anybody else on that flight, and hence I didn't want to make a fool of myself and my family by being arrested for dis-orderly behavior or something to that effect. And my fears were sort of well founded because as I was mentioning to another guy in the bus taking us to the terminal what I wanted to ask SMK, people were giving me wired looks, some luaghing, as though I am some kind of crazy moron passionate about some obscure irrelevant issue that they don't even know nor care about.

abhishek_sharma · Post by **abhishek_sharma** » 05 Mar 2011 08:38

Gaddafi likens his crackdown to India’s action in Kashmir

http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/indi ... 631784.cms

svinayak · Post by **svinayak** » 05 Mar 2011 22:52

CRamS wrote:

Yesterday, I was on the same flight with S.M.Krishna from Delhi to Bangalore. After getting down at Bangalore airport, I went up close and shook hands with SMK, and I wanted to challenge him on this sell out.

At least you are trying. Hence this opportunity to meet him. In future you may get the official time to discuss with him. So dont give up

menon s · Post by **menon s** » 06 Mar 2011 08:23

Look, who’s pelting stones in Srinagar!
On the ground of Nedos Hotel, dozens of police and CRPF men are mimicking a real protest. A large group of securitymen hold stones and pieces of bricks in their hands and wait a dozen yards away from their colleagues in bullet-proof jackets, ready with plastic shields and lathis in their hands. An officer stands in a corner and whistles. The uniformed men who act as protesters start shouting pro-separatist slogans. Soon the pitch of the slogans goes several decibels up and suddenly stone-throwing begins. The shields are hit by bricks and stones. Then the men who act as police and CRPF personnel go for a baton charge and even capture the “stone-throwers”. There is an announcement on a loudspeaker and a policeman is asking the protesters to disperse.
http://www.indianexpress.com/news/look- ... ar/758487/

menon s · Post by **menon s** » 06 Mar 2011 08:32

muzaffar hussain baig on art 370
http://www.kashmirobserver.net/index.ph ... union-baig

“Be it the Mughals, Afghans, Sikhs or Dogras, Kashmiri Muslims were treated no better than serfs and slaves, the policy of apartheid practiced in some other parts of the world looked more humane than the treatment meted out to the Muslims of Kashmir who incidentally were themselves part of a glorious and outstanding 5000 year old civilization”, Baig said.

menon s · Post by **menon s** » 06 Mar 2011 08:44

Prem Shankar Jha writes on the preparations ahead of " the summer of discontent"

All this is being done surreptitiously. Officially, the government claims to have fulfilled the Centre’s promise, made on 25 September, to release all stone-pelters. As a result, there are only 195 of them left in jails, booked under the Public Safety Act. In reality, however, the total number of stone-pelters imprisoned has more than doubled, from 1,800 at the end of September to 4,294 on 20 February. The arrest of 614 of these carried out this year has been hidden from the interlocutors.

Stone-pelters are not the only ones being targeted. All the local cable television channels have been shut down. An estimated four million prepaid SIM cards are being withdrawn. SMS remains banned and newspapers that are deemed to be pro-separatist or anti- Abdullah have had their advertising cut off. Among the newspapers that have suffered are Greater Kashmir, Rising Kashmir, Kashmir Monitor and the Urdu newspaper Ikhlaq. The last is owned by Shia leader Maulvi Iftikhar Ansari, who is a People’s Democratic Party member. Kashmir Monitor and Ikhlaq have lost both state government advertisements and those from the Centre’s Directorate of Audio Visual Publicity.

The state government has also arrested a number of prominent persons whom they consider to be professional fomenters of dissent. These include Kashmir High Court Bar Association president Mian Qayoom and secretary general GM Shaheen. In the past, both have abused their positions to consciously spread disinformation. But the association has, nonetheless, been an important safety valve for the Kashmiri people to vent their grievances. Locking them up has almost certainly done far more harm than good

The government’s purpose is clear: with Geelani’s principal lieutenants, Masarat Alam, Asiya Andrabi and her husband Mohammed Kasim Faktoo already in jail, they only have to remove him to render the stone-pelters leaderless. But history should have taught it that if such action is not accompanied with measures to address the root causes of alienation, removing one set of leaders only creates space for the emergence of more hardline leaders.

TODAY, IT has another chance to turn Kashmiris’ attention back towards democratic self-expression. This is in the panchayat elections scheduled for next month. But this time it is the Omar government that is bent upon sabotaging democracy. Not only has it refused to incorporate the 73rd amendment of the Indian Constitution (which mandates five-yearly election, a guaranteed devolution of funds and an elective leadership of panchayat bodies) into the Kashmir Constitution, but it has persuaded the Centre that the elections should be held on a non-party basis and the state government should retain the right to nominate the heads of the elected panchayats and zilla parishads.

Kashmiris know only too well that the purpose of a non-party election is to conceal the support that various parties enjoy among the people. They also know that by retaining the right to nominate the heads of panchayat bodies, the National Conference (NC) will retain control of the loot of developmental funds that has been the hallmark of that benighted state.

In short, like the rigged elections of the 1950s, ’60s and ’70s, the panchayat elections will also be a farce. The NC will retain its zamindari and New Delhi is so frightened by the prospect of Kashmir going out of its control that it will let the NC do whatever it wants so long as it keeps Kashmir in line.

So at the end of the day, the satge is set to goof up things, this summer! Thank you, MMS...

menon s · Post by **menon s** » 06 Mar 2011 09:01

Hurriyat Conference (G) chairman, Syed Ali Shah Geelani will share the podium with right wing HIndu organisation Rashtriya Swayamsevak Sangh (RSS) chief, Mohan Bhagwat during the 10th India Today Enclave, where both the leaders have been invited to speak in a breakfast debate, “ Kashmir- what next”, on March 19.

http://www.kashmirdispatch.com/headline ... ashmir.htm

menon s · Post by **menon s** » 06 Mar 2011 09:14

During the search the police allegedly recovered 70,000 US Dollar from Shamima alias Shazia alias Bitti and 30000 Us Dollars with Rs. 19000 Indian Currency from Mustaq Ahmed Dar. On enquiry both the passengers had reportedly disclosed that they had received this money from Altaf Qadri executive Member of APHC presently in Pakistan and was at Kathmandu at the instance of JKLF Supremo Mohd Yaseen Malik.

Accused Mustaq Ahmed Dar along with Shamima gone to Kathmandu in the month of March 2002 and allegedly collected one lac us dollars which were to be distributed among the militants’ ranks and organization including HM and LeT.

http://www.earlytimes.in/newsdet.aspx?q=68834

sum · Post by **sum** » 06 Mar 2011 09:31

He said the Article had virtually assumed a permanent status as it could be scrapped only through a resolution by the constituent Assembly of Jammu & Kashmir which had ceased to exist since.

Is what Baig mentioned ( which i have quoted) true?

chaanakya · Post by **chaanakya** » 06 Mar 2011 11:42

sum wrote:
He said the Article had virtually assumed a permanent status as it could be scrapped only through a resolution by the constituent Assembly of Jammu & Kashmir which had ceased to exist since.
Is what Baig mentioned ( which i have quoted) true?

There are views which hold that 370 assumed permanence as Constituent Assembly of J&K ceased to exist. The point is hotly debated and contested. My take is as below.
Let us read the fine print of Art 370

Article 370 of the Constitution of India
1. Notwithstanding anything in this Constitution:
a. the provisions of article 238 shall not apply in relation to the State of Jammu and Kashmir,
b. the power of Parliament to make laws for the said State shall be limited to;
i. those matters in the Union List and the Concurrent List which, in consultation with the Government of the State, are declared by the President to correspond to matters specified in the Instrument of Accession governing the accession of the State to the Dominion of India as the matters with respect to which the Dominion Legislature may make laws for that State; and
ii. such other matters in the said Lists, as, with the concurrence of the Government of the State, the President may by order specify.
Explanation—For the purpose of this article, the Government of the State means the person for the time being recognised by the President as the Maharaja of Jammu and Kashmir acting on the advice of the Council of Ministers for the time being in office under the Maharaja’s Proclamation dated the fifth day of March, 1948;
c.the provisions of article 1 and of this article shall apply in relation to this State;
d.such of the other provisions of this Constitution shall apply in relation to that State subject to such exceptions and modifications as the President may by order specify
i. Provided that no such order which relates to the matters specified in the Instrument of Accession of the State referred to in paragraph
(i) of sub-clause (b) shall be issued except in consultation with the Government of the State:
ii. Provided further that no such order which relates to matters other than those referred to in the last preceding proviso shall be issued except with the concurrence of the Government.

2. If the concurrence of the Government of the State referred to in paragraph
(ii) of sub-clause (b) of clause
(1) or in second proviso to sub-clause
(d) of that clause be given before the Constituent Assembly for the purpose of framing the Constitution of the State is convened, it shall be placed before such Assembly for such decision as it may take thereon.
3. Notwithstanding anything in the foregoing provisions of the article, the President may, by public notification, declare that this article shall cease to be operative or shall be operative only with such exceptions and modifications and from such date as he may notify: Provided that the recommendation of the Constituent Assembly of the State referred to in clause (2) shall be necessary before the President issues such a notification.
4. In exercise of the powers conferred by this article the President, on the recommendation of the Constituent Assembly of the State of Jammu and Kashmir, declared that, as from the 17th day of November, 1952, the said art. 370 shall be operative with the modification that for the explanation in cl.(1) thereof the following Explanation is substituted namely:
Explanation—For the purpose of this Article, the Government of the State means the person for the time being recognised by the President on the recommendation of the Legislative Assembly of the State as the *Sadar-I-Riyasat of Jammu and Kashmir, acting on the advice of Council of Ministers of the State for the time being in office.

Point one is Clause 3 refers to clause 2 in matters of recommendation of Constituent Assembly before making Art 370 cease to be operative etc.

Now see what Clause 2 says.

It says that if the concurrence of the State Govt ( as required in previous clauses) is given before the constituent assembly ..... is convened ( then) it shall be placed before such Assembly for such decision as it may take there.

Now the question is what happens when concurrence is given after the constituent assembly has convened and framed the constitution and then ceased to exist. Clearly no such action is required. Clause 2 and 3 would be operated only till such time Constituent Assembly existed and convened. Concurrence of State Govt is enough as per clause (1) post Constituent Assembly ceasing to exist.

menon s · Post by **menon s** » 06 Mar 2011 11:55

Concurrence of State Govt is enough as per clause (1) post Constituent Assembly ceasing to exist.

which means it can never be changed. We can rant and wail, thats it. I think its time to move away from the argument of Squashing Art 370.

Virupaksha · Post by **Virupaksha** » 06 Mar 2011 12:01

menon s wrote:
Concurrence of State Govt is enough as per clause (1) post Constituent Assembly ceasing to exist.
which means it can never be changed. We can rant and wail, thats it. I think its time to move away from the argument of Squashing Art 370.

what about changing when president's rule is in place

ManishH · Post by **ManishH** » 06 Mar 2011 12:16

^^^ Art. 370 can be squashed given people demonstrate their will by mass action.

Unfortunately, our political parties are stuck in vagaries of electoral politics and see no immediate electoral gain from such movement. So all they do confine Art. 370 repeal to a bullet item in their manifesto.

It's high time genuine people, in whichever party, stand up and do what's good for the nation instead of focusing on their next electoral battle.

PS: There's an ad in ToI today requiring teachers in Army School, Kaluchak. Needs someone with B.Ed. In case anyone has the qualification, this is a great chance to teach the young and to settle.

menon s · Post by **menon s** » 06 Mar 2011 12:24

Concurrence of State Govt is enough as per clause (1) post Constituent Assembly ceasing to exist.
which means it can never be changed. We can rant and wail, thats it. I think its time to move away from the argument of Squashing Art 370.
what about changing when president's rule is in place

That would be cheap of us Indians and our democracy in front of the world community.

Virupaksha · Post by **Virupaksha** » 06 Mar 2011 12:40

menon s wrote:
Concurrence of State Govt is enough as per clause (1) post Constituent Assembly ceasing to exist.
which means it can never be changed. We can rant and wail, thats it. I think its time to move away from the argument of Squashing Art 370.
what about changing when president's rule is in place
That would be cheap of us Indians and our democracy in front of the world community.

log kyaa kahenge??

What was all this democracy, world community doing when the pandits were being kicked out? - can you please remind me.

PS: does it also require state's govt acceptance to change in first iteration art 370 to remove that line and in the next iteration, do it.... There are many many possibilities to play around, all it takes is looking at it from a new angle.

menon s · Post by **menon s** » 06 Mar 2011 13:52

Approach policy with states interest and not just passion, alone. please, i ve heard this pandit argument many times. First of all we all know that it is not possible, by the UPA or the BJP...may be give subsidies to Hindus in Jandk state to create six kids each, in twenty years we will alter the demographics and then something can be done.

chaanakya · Post by **chaanakya** » 06 Mar 2011 14:28

ravi_ku wrote:.. There are many many possibilities to play around, all it takes is looking at it from a new angle.

Sure , there are many possibilities to play with. In my opinion state govt concurrence is enough to remove the concurrence clause and then....

But for that to happen , one needs to build atmosphere and consensus in masses in favor of India and to bring to front the goodwill India enjoys there and to support majority elements well disposed towards India. Detain, Isolate and Eliminate separatists as an effective tool of preventing insurgency.

sum · Post by **sum** » 06 Mar 2011 21:40

may be give subsidies to Hindus in Jandk state to create six kids each, in twenty years we will alter the demographics and then something can be done.

So the above option would not be "cheap of us Indians and our democracy in front of the world community" ( your words in earlier post) ? Not to add the biggest killer of all : "communal and anti-minority"

menon s · Post by **menon s** » 07 Mar 2011 08:21

Police on arrest spree in Kashmir, 70 detained under draconian PSA
Srinagar, March 06 :After slapping draconian law, Public Safety Act (PSA) on more than 70 innocent Kashmiris, Indian police has started raiding houses in Shopian, Kulgam, Pulwama and Islamabad districts of held Kashmir to arrest 600 youth for taking part in last year’s uprising.

The police threaten the parents of the youth to get their wards to police stations. The police action has forced many a youth to flee from their homes and take shelter at the houses of relatives or friends.

In Shopian district, 15 people have been illegally arrested under the PSA while the policemen are conducting raids on the houses of 200 others. In district Pulwama, 24 persons have been unlawfully detained under the draconian law and number of youth wanted exceeds 250.

In Kulgam, police is raiding the residences of 60 people while 200 innocent Kashmiris have been detained. In Rajouri district, more than two-dozen civilians have been illegally arrested under the black law and around 300 are wanted by the police. -KMS

http://www.kashmirglobal.com/?p=2674

nachiket · Post by **nachiket** » 07 Mar 2011 08:29

Where is the link? And how do the geniuses reporting this know that all the arrested people are innocent?

sum · Post by **sum** » 07 Mar 2011 09:12

X-posting from TSP thread:

Charlie wrote:Pakistan fantasy of Kashmiris

We all know how weird Obsessive Compulsive Disorder (OCD) among humans could be. Obsessive Compulsive Affinity – not necessarily a disorder - is a term which doesn’t exist. But imagine if it were coined now, wouldn’t the masters of semantics describe Kashmiris’ obsessive affinity to the ‘rogue’, raw, yet superb, Pakistani cricket team like that?
I know this statement is going to raise eyebrows. But, tell me, what different side is the Kashmiri heart this Cricket World Cup?
As if rising from the ashes, as Lala (Afridi back home is so lovingly called that) and his ‘boys’ go on a winning spree, you observe a new triumphism overtaking Kashmiris again.
The past few years have been painful years of loss and dejection to Lala’s Kashmiri fans. The worst to them was perhaps the team’s almost-usual losses at Team India’s hands, which has unarguably matured to be the world’s No. 1 cricketing team, past Australia. Kashmiris, by and large, had shunned watching cricket clashes of these ‘titans’ since Misbah-ul-Haq gave away what Kashmiris to this day see as a catch which deserved plain hanging in the 2009 T-20 World Cup final with India.
It is debatable if Kashmiris’ affinity for that country – or the public display of that - is the same as before. Nevertheless something happened in the last twenty years which makes things look different. But even today wearing green uniforms in the village or town cricket tournaments are no passé in the valley. The daily news of death and destruction emanating from Pakistan do have people in Kashmir to receive with that I-told-you-so-always kind of thinking. But the kind of people who see that situation ‘an aberration’ in history are just everywhere. They seem unmindful of everything.
In our childhood we would commonly see even school going children – not brainwashed about any particular type of politics anywhere - making Pakistani flags and unfurling them on its independence day. At my own school we had boys trying to march like Pakistani soldiers, brandishing hockey type wooden sticks – masquerading as guns.
We have even heard of times when listening to Pakistan Radio on radio sets was banned by law in Kashmir. Those days the government would pay spies – probably known as khoftan faqirs – who would report which family tunes in to Pakistan radio. Today things are hardly different. All Pakistani satellite TV channels stand banned in Kashmir. People cannot make phone calls from here to that country. Although Internet does provide some glimpse of Pakistani life to some people, yet Pakistan remains as distant to a common man as before.
A lot for the worse has happened for Pakistan as a country and its cricket team in the last two decades or so. Today we have people like George Fulton who in his stunning article George ka khuda hafiz last week went to the extent of calling Pakistan being a state on a precipice. A wafer-thin sliver is all that stands between you and becoming a failed state, he wrote while narrating the circumstances of his ‘divorce’ to the country.
But Kashmir’s cricket fans seem oblivious to everything. You talk match fixing, they will close their ears. You talk temperamental sportsmanship, they will sound indifferent. There is a sudden rush of energy today that Lala’s team may at last break the team’s world cup jinx – not letting Team India beat them again – and even clinch the cup.
But with love comes the pain. This world cup has had its share of the usual nail chewing moments for the Kashmiri fans. Any crazy act by Afridi’s ‘boys’ invites instant ridicule and anger. Already two big sins have gone to the team’s credit – their unpardonable fielding in the match with Sri Lanka and dismal batting with minnows Canada.
And it is not only about the fans among the common people. We have heard stories of Kashmiri politicians having their loyalties to the south of the state and secretly skipping office to watch a Pakistani cricket match. We have heard of senior police officers taking leave from work to see Pakistanis play. We have heard of failing pretensions of loyalty in plenty when it came to an Indo-Pak match. Of uncontrolled jubilations and heart breaks.
When it comes to Team India’s fan following in Kashmir, it isn’t that bad. Its fan following has increased significantly in proportion over the years. But a public viewership of the thrilling India-England match a few days back in Srinagar could have been baffling. The prayers that went up for England to win were massive. These are the moments when our friends in India find such Kashmiri behavior illogical, bizarre, intolerable and even blasphemous.
But why are Kashmiri hearts on the side which most of our Indian friends see the wrong side?
A friend sometime back offered an explanation which is both debatable and contestable. He called this attitude a ‘revenge syndrome’ - for a sense of loss in politics, in the battlefield, in the street, in the hearts.
An unknown number of Kashmiris have died unsung for nursing this syndrome. An unknown number of cardiac arrests have gone unreported. People have died in shock for that loss. People have died of bullets, fired from bunkers whose custodians would not take Kashmiri chants of jubilation at a Pakistani win easy.
Today the world damns Lala’s boys as the most mercurial, immature and even suspect. And yet most Kashmiris’ affinity to them remains as ever before. That is what perhaps the first love is all about - damn crazy, blind and venomous.
And let me tell you even as people like Omar Abdullah are not so well known to wear their hearts on their sleeves, he tweeted on the evening of 26th February - Finished work just in time to watch the last few overs of the Pak- SL match.
It is as crazy as that.[/size]

The columnist can be emailed at [email protected]

What is one supposed to make of this article, esp the bolded parts?

Are we supposed to "win hearts and minds" of such lost causes who admire and are ready to lick boots for a country which kills more of their co-religionists every week than any other nation?

sum · Post by **sum** » 07 Mar 2011 09:15

Geelani backs out of conclave citing NSA's presence

In a letter to noted journalist M J Akbar, Editorial Director of India Today, Geelani expressed his inability to attend the March 19 session where he was to speak on future of Kashmir alongwith senior BJP leader Murli Manohar Joshi.

"I came to know that the session will be presided by National Security Advisor. That makes me unable to participate in view of our consistent policy of non-engagement with Government of India until it accepts our five-point demand," Geelani said in the letter.

The hardline leader was scheduled to take part in the breakfast session of the conclave on March 19 in Delhi where he and Joshi were the speakers with Menon in the chair.

In August last year, Geelani had announced his five-point formula which included asking Centre to acknowledge Kashmir as an international dispute, start the process of "demilitarisation", release political prisoners and take action against security personnel allegedly involved in the killings during the summer unrest.

Good riddance, must say...

svinayak · Post by **svinayak** » 07 Mar 2011 09:23

sum wrote:X-posting from TSP thread:
Are we supposed to "win hearts and minds" of such lost causes who admire and are ready to lick boots for a country which kills more of their co-religionists every week than any other nation?

This is the same population which attacked the Pak forces in 1948 and defended themselves

sum · Post by **sum** » 07 Mar 2011 09:52

^^ and once that was done, got back to cheering their ex-attackers ( like the JeI, Razzakars etc in BD)?