Gaur wrote:Karan M,
I feel that you are overestimating the advantage that TERPROM will give to Rafale. I mean, passiveness aside, the radar altimeter is good enough for low altitude flying. Even in baseline Su-27, flying at low altitude was never a problem. In Su-27, when switched to Basic or NAV mode, the radar altimeter reading is effortlessly visible in the middle right of HUD. So, that was no problem even in baseline Su-27.
But MKI has perhaps the best SAR out there. Add to that the excellent payload capacity, range and Brahmos integration, MKI is as good as Rafale in strike role.
Gaur - why should passiveness be kept aside. TERPROM is entirely passive! It does not rely on your radalt if the pilot/Weapons system so chooses. Radalt, even TACAN/any RF can be detected by today's passive detection systems - also referred to by some as "Passive Radars". This coupled with the Rafales minimized signature makes it the best bet to attack high end IADS with missiles like the Scalp. At medium-high alt, a Su-30 MKI is anyday the equal or even the superior of the Rafale given the number of weapons options integrated already, but at low altitudes the Rafale does have an edge. B
In A2A, Rafale is of no match. Leaving the maneuverability aside, the datalink and the gigantic BARS radar convert MKI practically into a mini AEWAC (and that's no exaggeration). Also, the Rafale's IRST is immature to say the least. Compare that with the OLS-30. There is not even a contest.
Again, you are comparing apples to oranges. The Rafale too has a datalink - the Link 16 (but the IAF will integrate its ODL) and its RCS is actually lower than that of the MKI which negates the effect of its lower powered radar somewhat. Even if the Bars detects the Rafale first (which is what should happen), its only now that there is an advantage in actually attacking the enemy, thanks to the RVV-AE outranging the MICA. Once the Meteor comes about, that advantage goes to the Eurocanards which can effectively outrange the MKI, thats a key decider. With the Su-30 MKI getting its AESA the sight advantage will remain, but until the Russians come up with a Meteor equivalent, ie a true LRAAM able to handle fighters as versus the telephone pole R-172 (useful against large aircraft or unwarned fighters, unlikely in an era of AWACS) or the mythical RVV-AE Ramjet (which never got developed or funded).
Now coming to the OLS-30, its a very capable system but that does not mean the others are pushovers. Its a ranging IRST with integrated LRF but without imaging capabilities. The Pirate reportedly has an Imaging sensor capability plus kinematic ranging, whereas the Rafale goes one step further and offers both TV and IRST channels. Its anything but immature - if anything, the reverse. The French AF dropped the Imaging IR sensor because the older one is obsolete or too mature & they want the latest one when its available. The French lead in terms of Imaging IR sensors, they are one of the leading countries in the world when it comes to thermal imaging - both Sagem & Thales source their key sensors from the same French Govt supported R&D firm.
The RCS reducing measures in Rafale and EF are nearly meaningless against powerful radars like BARS and APG-79. Surely, Dassault is not going to tell us that Rafale will be invisible to BARS even within a 100km radius! And you know that BVR shots are not taken even near that range. So, I am leaving a lot of extra room here.
Hardly meaningless. Every bit of RCS reduction helps because that allows for your jammers to work that much less. And for BVR shots, look up Meteor. With an integrated Ramjet, its NEZ is that much more. Plus with IIR Mica the Rafale has a totally passive missile to attack the enemy with at BVR ranges. Receives feed from AWACS, cues Spectra, fires missile, updates Mica-IIR towards the enemy who has no chance to escape unless he has a MAWS or AWACS telling him what to do. In a violent pitched battle, the other guy may well be taken by surprise. An analysis of aircombat showed majority of kills were scored when the opponent was taken by surprise. And before you mention, long burn Alamo-IR does not have a Mid Course datalink for BVR shots (>40 km)
The only thing in favour of Rafale is Spectra. If that indeed performs as per its hype, then R118 may not be good enough.
Lets not mix up things. Spectra is an integrated EW system. It includes passive missile warning, RF detection, RF jamming & chaff & flares are cued by the system. R118 is a RWR with sensor fusion capabilities that ties together the Israeli jammer & chaff & flares. But even that is not the "baseline" as to what India can do, since the MiG-29 Upg already incorporates the NG EW suite with integrated ECM & the LCA is getting a brand new EW suite with multi-threat handling system. So with the Su-30 MKI upgrade, we'll see what comes on it. However, what you must understand is that the smaller the base aircraft signature, the less work the ECM needs to do to protect it.
To make myself clear, I am not against Rafale. In fact, Rafale has always been my choice for MMRCA from the start. It is just that, like indranil, I was always mystified by the whole MRCA saga itself. Buying more Su-30s always seemed more a logical choice to me.
The IAF just wanted more Mirage 2000's initially but CAG said it should be a mulitvendor selection so it became this MMRCA. However, I am glad it happened. The Mirage 2000 would be challenged in a decades time against some of the newer Chinese aircraft and systems. We need fighters that can last 40 years
I really don't like the small radar on the Rafale, apart from that, I am fine with everything else. The Emiratis reportedly noted that they wanted higher radar power on their Rafales (to match the APG-80 on Super Vipers) and more powerful engines. I wish we too push for the same if we buy the Rafale. The APG-80 per Aviation Week is credited with a 70-80 nm range against a 1 Sq Mtr target, so thats quite capable.
