Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan (TSP): Mar. 29, 2011

putnanja · Post by **putnanja** » 03 May 2011 04:00

amdavadi wrote:pakis had lot riding on saving OBL. They were protecting him for last 1oyrs and they werent planing to give him up.

Definitely not for free!

Nandu · Post by **Nandu** » 03 May 2011 04:02

Thanks, ramana.

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 03 May 2011 04:03

putnanja wrote:
amdavadi wrote:pakis had lot riding on saving OBL. They were protecting him for last 1oyrs and they werent planing to give him up.
Definitely not for free!

$18B since 9/11!

UBanerjee · Post by **UBanerjee** » 03 May 2011 04:19

The gravy train is going to wittle down methinks. This is the perfect excuse.

krithivas · Post by **krithivas** » 03 May 2011 04:26

Time for resurrection of "Throwing the Towel" Thread
Imran Khan: Pakistan has lost its dignity and self-esteem
http://www.independent.co.uk/opinion/co ... 78033.html

putnanja · Post by **putnanja** » 03 May 2011 04:26

ramana wrote:
putnanja wrote:
Definitely not for free!

$18B since 9/11!

How much more could they have milked out of US if osama wasn't captured?

Muppalla · Post by **Muppalla** » 03 May 2011 04:37

http://www.acus.org/users/farhana-qazi

Does the experts know more about her? She comes mostly on the public radio/TV such as NPR.

Dipanker · Post by **Dipanker** » 03 May 2011 04:46

amdavadi wrote:pakis had lot riding on saving OBL. They were protecting him for last 1oyrs and they werent planing to give him up.

Yes Osama was the golden goose laying golden eggs for Pakistan for last 10 years.

Airavat · Post by **Airavat** » 03 May 2011 05:36

The Sun: Pakistan must have known he was on their soil

America launched the attack on the assumption that its closest ally in the Afghan war was complicit in hiding Bin Laden.

As he accepted our cash, President Zardari, a sticky-fingered crook, must have known bin Laden was holed up in a high-walled, barb-wired citadel not far from his Presidential palace.

Pakistan has already shown contempt for nuclear safety by selling its secrets to any rogue regime that is willing to buy The Bomb. Only last week, an al-Qaeda commander claimed a nuclear "dirty bomb" is hidden in Europe, ready to be detonated in the event of bin Laden's death.

One influential American source with contacts inside the White House says even a peace-loving President like Barack Obama could not stand by if a close ally were nuked. He added: "There is nothing to lose in Pakistan. No oil. No minerals. Nothing to deter us from putting boots on the ground."

Anantha · Post by **Anantha** » 03 May 2011 05:41

X posted from OBL thread

I have this following project, if some IT guy can do this
Some of you might have seen Hitler Parodies in you tube.
For eg: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gK5nxUAVvCE
We need to create one for "Hitler finds out about OBL being dead" and circulate it far and wide that will include TSP perfidy.
Here is one forum where there are instructions on how to edit the video and put subtitles:
http://s1.zetaboards.com/downfallparodi ... 2508370/1/
The subject matter will be like this
Hitler is the head of PAks and Al-Queda
1 When one General points the map, he can say "us" Pakistanis can set off Loose nukes in and around the German spots shown in the Video
2. Hitler will reply that OBL and his team will take care of placing the weapons in the right spots
3. The two Generals sheapishly will say OBL is dead with the sweaty face
4. Hitler will say- Kiyani, Pasha, Athar Abbas and Al-Zawahiri will stay in the room and everyone else will leave (several others then leave the room)
5. Hitler then screams at the four- I told you guys not to keep OBL in Abbotabad and you guys did not obey my orders, and he also abuses Mushy bhai here . There is lot of scope to bring lot of dirt on Pak in this scene, need to be creative
6. When the girl cries the other lady will console and say you will get your 72/ Canada Visa visa soon.
There is lot of room for creativity.
Please help guys

anupmisra · Post by **anupmisra** » 03 May 2011 06:01

krithivas wrote:Time for resurrection of "Throwing the Towel" Thread

I used to love that thread.

Anantha · Post by **Anantha** » 03 May 2011 06:05

anupmisra wrote:
krithivas wrote:Time for resurrection of "Throwing the Towel" Thread
I used to love that thread.

The finest one in the "Throwing the Towel" thread was when one guy claimed additional points for posting, how a towel company in TSP closed down due to bad economy and that it was the best throwing of the towel.

anupmisra · Post by **anupmisra** » 03 May 2011 06:08

putnanja wrote:How much more could they have milked out of US if osama wasn't captured?

How much more? Have you ever been accosted by a disfigured beggar on a street corner and you gave him/her five rupees to go away? What happens next? More beggars show up and pester you shoving their limbs and babies into your face. They know a sucker when they see one. Until the light turns green and, embarassed, you lurch forward till the next traffic light. Getting rid Osama may have been that green light for us.

amdavadi · Post by **amdavadi** » 03 May 2011 06:11

Lead about OBL stuck in isloo or near abbotabad came from Uzbek CI guy who told CIA back in dec of 09.

shiv · Post by **shiv** » 03 May 2011 06:43

Ramin wrote: as critical as everyone is on Pak, I dont think they'd have any incentive to protect OBL. He was more a liability for the whole region

Sir this has to be one of the most profoundly ignorant, nay, stupid statements I have seen on BR. Care to expand on this crap and redeem yourself? You come on here and make a statemnt like this and you have one heck of a lot of explaining to do. You have just vomited all over the forum.

arun · Post by **arun** » 03 May 2011 06:49

X Posted from the Pakistani Role in Global Terrorism thread.

The duplicitous behaviour of the Islamic Republic of Pakistan regards Global Islamic Terrorism brings out some scepticism.

Extract from transcript of the Press Briefing of Assistant to the President for Homeland Security and Counterterrorism John Brennan, 2nd May 2011.

The US is not buying the argument that the Islamic Republic of Pakistan was cluless about Osama Bin Laden’s presence in Abbotabad:

Q And if I could just ask, have you been able to determine how bin Laden was able to hide in this relatively prominent location, and do you believe the Pakistanis when they say that they had no idea that he was there?

MR. BRENNAN: People have been referring to this as hiding in plain sight. Clearly this was something that was considered as a possibility. Pakistan is a large country. We are looking right now at how he was able to hold out there for so long, and whether or not there was any type of support system within Pakistan that allowed him to stay there.

We know that the people at the compound there were working on his behalf, and that’s how we ultimately found our way to that compound. But we are right now less than 24 hours after this operation, so we are talking with the Pakistanis on a regular basis now, and we're going to pursue all leads to find out exactly what type of support system and benefactors that bin Laden might have had.

Q But you don’t necessarily take them at their word that they didn’t know?

MR. BRENNAN: We are pursuing all leads in this issue.

Q Just to follow on that, is it really credible that Pakistani authorities had no idea that this compound was being built and that it existed -- such an elaborate compound?

MR. BRENNAN: I think it’s inconceivable that bin Laden did not have a support system in the country that allowed him to remain there for an extended period of time. I am not going to speculate about what type of support he might have had on an official basis inside of Pakistan. We are closely talking to the Pakistanis right now, and again, we are leaving open opportunities to continue to pursue whatever leads might be out there.

Confirmation that the Islamic Republic of Pakistan was kept in the dark regards the mission that concluded with the execution of Islamic Terrorist Osama Bin laden in the Islamic Republic of Pakistan. Indeed the Islamic republic of Pakistan was only informed AFTER the strike force completed the mission and had exited Pakistani airspace. It thus appears that contrary claims by Pakistan is nothing more than a ploy to preserve their national honour and dignity.

Further it is disclosed that the Islamic Republic of Pakistan were “scrambling some of their assets” which luckily did not make contact with the US strike force:

Q And I understand that there was a moment of real tension, one with the helicopter, but then also when the Navy SEALs were leaving and the Pakistani government started scrambling their jets, and there was a concern that they were coming to where the U.S. troops were, where the Navy SEALs were. Was there an actual concern that the Pakistanis -- since they were not apparently informed about this military operation, was there an actual concern that they might actually take military action against the Navy SEALs?

MR. BRENNAN: We didn’t contact the Pakistanis until after all of our people, all of our aircraft were out of Pakistani airspace. At the time, the Pakistanis were reacting to an incident that they knew was taking place in Abbottabad. Therefore, they were scrambling some of their assets.

Clearly, we were concerned that if the Pakistanis decided to scramble jets or whatever else, they didn’t know who were on those jets. They had no idea about who might have been on there, whether it be U.S. or somebody else. So we were watching and making sure that our people and our aircraft were able to get out of Pakistani airspace. And thankfully, there was no engagement with Pakistani forces. This operation was designed to minimize the prospects, the chances of engagement with Pakistani forces. It was done very well, and thankfully no Pakistani forces were engaged and there was no other individuals who were killed aside from those on the compound.

Other mentions of the Islamic Republic of Pakistan in the Press briefing:

Q Can you tell us more about the role that the U.S. -- more of the role of how the U.S. is interacting with Pakistan and are we actively investigating what they knew and didn’t know about Osama bin Laden being there or not?

MR. BRENNAN: Well, a couple things. One, the President mentioned yesterday that he spoke to President Zardari, and a number of senior U.S. officials are in regular contact now with their Pakistani counterparts. We are continuing to engage with them -- we’re engaging with them today -- as we learn more about the compound and whatever type of support system bin Laden had.

I would point out that we’ve had differences of view with the Pakistani government on counterterrorism cooperation, on areas of cooperation, and what we think they should and shouldn’t be doing. At the same time, I’ll say that Pakistan has been responsible for capturing and killing more terrorists inside of Pakistan than any country, and it’s by a wide margin. And there have been many, many brave Pakistani soldiers, security officials, as well as citizens, who have given their lives because of the terrorism scourge in that country. So although there are some differences of view with Pakistan, we believe that that partnership is critically important to breaking the back of al Qaeda and eventually prevailing over al Qaeda as well as associated terrorist groups.

Q Can I ask one follow? You mentioned that questions are going to be raised about Pakistan, understandably, and the role of Pakistan. For you and your counterterrorism job, given now the history of the Raymond Davis episode and the fact that this was done without consultation, are you concerned that in just in your line of work it will be very difficult to reestablish a good working relationship with the ISI or the intelligence authorities there?

MR. BRENNAN: There’s dialogue going on with our counterterrorism counterparts in the aftermath of this. They’re expressing understanding about the reasons why we did this. They are appreciative that it was done without having Pakistani casualties outside of that compound. The U.S.-Pakistani relationship, which is a strategic relationship, goes on a number of different areas and levels; counterterrorism is one of them. It can be a complicated matter. As I say, we don’t always agree on some of the things that we want to do. But through that continued dialogue and communication, I think we get where we need to be.

This is one more incident that we’re going to have to deal with, and we look forward to continue to work with our Pakistani colleagues, because they are as much, if not more, on the front lines of the battle against terrorism.

More on the question of the honesty or lack of it, of the Islamic Republic of Pakistan in confronting Islamic Terrorism :

Q Since the death of bin Laden, what is the thought of this administration -- do you believe that the Pakistani government was transparent and being honest and forthcoming, given the information that they have now on Osama bin Laden -- what they knew, or going in to finding out more about this situation?

MR. BRENNAN: There are a lot of people within the Pakistani government, and I’m not going to speculate about who or if any of them had prior knowledge about bin Laden being in Abbottabad. But certainly his location there outside of the capital raises questions. We are talking to the Pakistanis about this. But they, at least in our discussions with them, seem as surprised as we were initially that bin Laden was holding out in that area.

Read it all:

Press Briefing

SSridhar · Post by **SSridhar** » 03 May 2011 07:50

Nandu wrote:Foreign Policy mag has compiled a decade worth of lie by Pakis about OBL.

Osama bin Who? A decade of denials and downplaying from Pakistani leaders.

The Pakistani argument is very predictable because it is premised on the following two points.

Those who say terrorists are staying in Pakistan must also provide their precise coordinates. There is no point in merely accusing Pakistan without giving the complete address
It is not impossible for someone to evade intelligence agencies. Such things have happened in their own country. 9/11 & 26/11 are examples.

The first argument implies that Pakistan has absolutely no responsibility of its own to investigate and do the needful in apprehending the terrorists. It wants foreign countries to tell it what is happening on its own soil. So much for its sovereignty ! Any detail given is rejected as imprecise, as we have seen in the seven dossiers that we gave them, and any very precise detail given is either passed on to the culprits to escape (cruise missile attacks on OBL in 1998 and on other occasions) or simply dismissed with a wave of their hand ( as in the case of Dawood Ibrahim or as the ex-Afghan Intelligence Chief Amarullah Saleh could vouchsafe on a number of times on Afghan terrorists).

The second argument appears as a valid one on the face of it. But, it obfuscates many things. For one, Pakistan has a long history of playing both sides to its advantage. Even in the 9/11 case, the Pakistani ISI chief Lt. Gen. Mahmood Ahmed egged on the AQAM to fight even while being sent on behalf of the US to negotiate surrender terms. From then onwards, until now, Pakistan has double-crossed everyone. It kept the Quetta Shura well protected and dispersed them to Karachi when their continued presence in Balochistan became dangerous. It has again ensured the safety and continued operation without any let or hindrance of the Haqqani shura in Waziristan. Therefore, the analogy with a common criminal evading intelligence agencies does not stand.

partha · Post by **partha** » 03 May 2011 08:00

"liability for the whole region"

Why am I smelling a Himalayan Yeti?

shiv · Post by **shiv** » 03 May 2011 08:14

partha wrote:
"liability for the whole region"
Why am I smelling a Himalayan Yeti?

Check this

Ramin wrote:congratulations to US and Pakistan for the capture

Altair · Post by **Altair** » 03 May 2011 08:15

http://www.abc.net.au/news/stories/2011 ... 205976.htm

Mr Brennan revealed the United States did not inform the Pakistanis of the operation until its helicopters had exited Pakistani air space out of fears Islamabad would scramble fighters to intercept the mission.

Link

And he even raised suspicions that US forces might have been prepared to take action against any Pakistani effort to intercept their helicopters, saying the US was "clearly" concerned the Pakistanis might decide to scramble jets.
"So we were watching and making sure that our people and our aircraft were able to get out of the Pakistani airspace, and thankfully there was no engagement with Pakistani forces," Brennan said.

Wow! I envy the trust US places on munna! What a strong bond and friendship!

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 03 May 2011 08:27

I feel sure a quartet of F-15Es were orbiting afghan airspace, locked and loaded with 8 amraams, 2 aim9x each and prepared to "go in" if PAF came up and gave chase

Rangudu · Post by **Rangudu** » 03 May 2011 08:29

I'm told that

(a) The Bin Laden compound in Abbotabad is owned by a "retired" TSPA officer

(b) The "trusted courier" brothers hosting Bin Laden may also be TSPA

sum · Post by **sum** » 03 May 2011 08:30

Shri Hamid Mir ( self proclaimed neutral journalist) was clarified a MAJOR point on TV yesterday which might acquit the TSPA from the dock: the OBL mansion was apparently not few yards from Kakul but 1-2 KMs away..

Now thats solid proof that TSPA was not involved!!!!

shiv · Post by **shiv** » 03 May 2011 08:31

Rangudu wrote:I'm told that

(a) The Bin Laden compound in Abbotabad is owned by a "retired" TSPA officer

B Raman was right

Altair · Post by **Altair** » 03 May 2011 08:31

If these statements does not clarify to people (DDM et al) who think it was a Joint Op, I wonder what would!

Pakistan has been thoroughly and comprehensively beaten. I am getting the impression lately that appointment of Gen Petraeus to CIA and Panetta to Pentagon underscores Obama's commitment to Af-Pak region. He is going to be a real pain-da-butt for Pakistan in the coming years.
White House will squease every dollar it has given to Pakistan in return for saving H&D that is if any is left.
China will assist Pakistan but it comes at a even bigger price. All in all a very grim future for Pakistan.

sum · Post by **sum** » 03 May 2011 08:32

Rangudu wrote:I'm told that

(a) The Bin Laden compound in Abbotabad is owned by a "retired" TSPA officer

(b) The "trusted courier" brothers hosting Bin Laden may also be TSPA

As Chidanand Rajghatta said on TV yesterday: "Whatever way the Paki panelists spin it, the Pakis have been caught with their pants down this time and it doesn't look pretty"

Altair · Post by **Altair** » 03 May 2011 08:37

Rangudu wrote:I'm told that

(a) The Bin Laden compound in Abbotabad is owned by a "retired" TSPA officer

(b) The "trusted courier" brothers hosting Bin Laden may also be TSPA

Anyone ready to bet that TSPA officer in discussion here is very close to Pervez Musharraf?

I bet a dinner with champagne in the best restaurant in Hyderabad.

partha · Post by **partha** » 03 May 2011 08:42

@Shivji, 100% Yeti.

r_subramanian · Post by **r_subramanian** » 03 May 2011 08:44

US closes embassy, consulates in Pakistan
The United States said Tuesday it was closing its embassy in Pakistan's capital and consulates in three other cities to the public until further notice, a day after Osama bin Laden was killed near Islamabad.
url: http://www.thenews.com.pk/ NewsDetail.aspx?ID=15052
(Please Remove the embedded space)

SSridhar · Post by **SSridhar** » 03 May 2011 08:48

Altair wrote:Wow! I envy the trust US places on munna! What a strong bond and friendship!

But. do not mistake that for withdrawal of support to TSP anytime soon. As the saying goes, 'Death lurking everyday but guaranteed to live long'.

partha · Post by **partha** » 03 May 2011 08:48

Shri Raman in his blog says Abottabad is dominated by Hazaras who are against Al Qaeda. There are also plenty of Shias. So then the Q is why would OBL choose a such a city to "hide" knowing that it is populated with Hazaras? This is possible only if some bigger power was protecting him and that power could only be the Pakistani state.

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 03 May 2011 08:51

Rangudu wrote:I'm told that

(a) The Bin Laden compound in Abbotabad is owned by a "retired" TSPA officer

(b) The "trusted courier" brothers hosting Bin Laden may also be TSPA

Bet the retiree is also ISI!

The couriers have to be TSPA. Its all an Army operation.

Sai.U · Post by **Sai.U** » 03 May 2011 08:54

Compound in Pakistan was once a safe house: Gulfnews

Airavat · Post by **Airavat** » 03 May 2011 08:57

IED targets police station in Charsadda

At least four people were killed in an improvised explosive device (IED) blast at the Umerzai Police station, officials said on Monday. The wall of the police station was severely damaged. The mosque situated next to the police station was also damaged in the blast. Security in the area was beefed up earlier in the morning when news about Osama bin Laden’s death spread. This area had earlier come under attack last month when the convoy of JUI-F chief Maulana Fazlur Rehman was attacked.

Klaus · Post by **Klaus** » 03 May 2011 08:58

sum wrote:Shri Hamid Mir ( self proclaimed neutral journalist) was clarified a MAJOR point on TV yesterday which might acquit the TSPA from the dock: the OBL mansion was apparently not few yards from Kakul but 1-2 KMs away..

Now thats solid proof that TSPA was not involved!!!!

So distance of OBL's compound from Kakul is inversely proportional to TSPA involvement now, is it? Lahori logic reaching renewed heights, courtesy of Hamid Mir!

partha · Post by **partha** » 03 May 2011 09:02

"Bin Laden moved into Abottabad only recently": Wajid Ul Hasan.

I am sure he hired the best real estate broker in the city to find this million dollar mansion.

Anujan · Post by **Anujan** » 03 May 2011 09:08

I said it before and I repeat it, I will bet my left testimonial that it wasnt joint ops. Pakis are clutching at straws. The huge giveaways are the clueless statements that the Pakis keep making. At the very least they would have prepared a statement. Look at this latest gem from Hussain Haqqani (Pak Ambassador to the US) on Wolf Blitzer (on being asked why such a big house didnt arouse suspicion)

"In Pakistan, there are many houses which are larger than others"

partha · Post by **partha** » 03 May 2011 09:11

Anujan wrote:I said it before and I repeat it, I will bet my left testimonial that it wasnt joint ops. Pakis are clutching at straws. The huge giveaways are the clueless statements that the Pakis keep making. At the very least they would have prepared a statement. Look at this latest gem from Hussain Haqqani (Pak Ambassador to the US) on Wolf Blitzer (on being asked why such a big house didnt arouse suspicion)

"In Pakistan, there are many houses which are larger than others"

OMG! Do you have a link to this comedy show? I seem to have missed it.

Altair · Post by **Altair** » 03 May 2011 09:13

SSridhar wrote:
Altair wrote:Wow! I envy the trust US places on munna! What a strong bond and friendship!
But. do not mistake that for withdrawal of support to TSP anytime soon. As the saying goes, 'Death lurking everyday but guaranteed to live long'.

I realize that. But I am sure the free money will stop. It will become increasingly difficult for
1. US to give money and funding to Pakistan .
2. Pakistan to justify the demands of his boss.
3. Control the explosive mixture of Talibans,Haqqanis and the full house.

All this can still be done but the cost to do so will be high, hence less money for the Generals and hence even less for the terrorists.
The 50-50 over match has suddenly become a 20-20 match in Pakistan. There will be more fireworks and high risk shots.

Anujan · Post by **Anujan** » 03 May 2011 09:14

I cant find the clip, but the transcript is here: http://cnnpressroom.blogs.cnn.com/2011/ ... f-blitzer/