Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan (TSP): Mar. 29, 2011

Lalmohan · Post by **Lalmohan** » 04 May 2011 21:48

i fear that TSPA in its tactical brilliance will launch another major terror attack on india now and precipitate a war like situation - hoping to take the heat off from unkil's unbending gaze... its a hallmark pak-jarnail-e-moron moment

archan · Post by **archan** » 04 May 2011 21:50

sum wrote: can expect renewed pappi-jhappi with vigour in coming days.

thanks for the mental image.

arun · Post by **arun** » 04 May 2011 21:53

X Posted from the ISI News and discussion thread.

General Mohammad Zahir Azimi, the Afghan Defence Ministry spokesman on the ISI:

“Not only Pakistan with its strong intelligence service but even a weak government with a weak intelligence service would have known who was living in that house in such a location”

“If an agency is not aware of the most wanted terrorist of the world living right next to them, how can they protect their strategic weapons?”

Read it all:

Pakistani spies must have known of bin Laden's hideout: Afghanistan

Gagan · Post by **Gagan** » 04 May 2011 22:26

B Raman's article got me thinking.

Someone in Pakistan is going to be sacrificed for the OBL episode.

Who better than Ahmed Shuja Pasha - the ISI chief?

Pasha is into what 10 more months of extension? If the US really puts pressure on Pakistan, AS Pasha will go. Kiyani will save himself.

Just like Hamid Gul's career was cut short, Just like Mahmud Ahmed was asked to leave at the US's insistence.

vijayk · Post by **vijayk** » 04 May 2011 22:39

http://www.politico.com/news/stories/0511/54258.html
Osama bin Laden had cash, was ready to flee

Osama bin Laden had cash totaling 500 Euros and two telephone numbers sewn into his clothing when he was killed — sure signs that he was prepared to flee his compound at a moment’s notice — top U.S. intelligence officials told members of Congress at a classified briefing in the Capitol Tuesday.

Let me guess whose numbers are these?

KiyaNahi... and Pasha

CIA Director Leon Panetta told lawmakers about the items found in bin Laden’s clothing in response to a question about why he wasn’t guarded by more security personnel at his relatively luxurious home in a military town north of Islamabad. The answer, according to one source: Bin Laden believed “his network was strong enough he’d get a heads-up” before any U.S. strike against him.

The evidence of cash — which amounts to about $740 in U.S. dollars — and phone numbers was divulged to support the administration’s belief that bin Laden was prepared to escape the compound if alerted to an impending attack, the source said.

Read more: http://www.politico.com/news/stories/05 ... z1LPGqbSe4

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 04 May 2011 22:48

It could also be local chef's number.

Sam · Post by **Sam** » 04 May 2011 22:50

Granted 500 Euros in Pakistan is a large amount but how far and for how many days could he have gone till the next refill of another 500E?

RamaY · Post by **RamaY** » 04 May 2011 22:57

shiv wrote:From rediff
http://www.rediff.com/news/report/osama ... 110504.htm

India's sentiments don't resonate with Pakistan's cries of violation of 'sovereignty' by America. The source said if at all such a thing such as a US chopper flies into India, "We will react very violently. But, then, we are not sheltering terrorists."

India's believe is that the Americans did it because when the US intelligence told their government about the presence of terrorists in Pakistan, Pakistan took no action. The source said, "It's not a text book case of violation of sovereignty."

The source added, "There is a war going on in the region, so war-like conditions apply in this case."

So what is stopping India from doing the same? After all India gave evidence of Paki involvement in 11/26 and Pakistan hasn't done anything for 2 years. And there is a war going in the region, so war-like conditions must apply right?

I presume that India is doing exactly what US has been doing for past 10 years. It is collecting more and more intelligence to locate the whereabouts of Pakroaches. Pakis should expect an Abbatobad like operation from their south-eastern borders.

jaibhim · Post by **jaibhim** » 04 May 2011 23:03

Indeed the ghairat brigade as seen on the Beeb by Marvi Memmon PML(Q) [apologies for not getting the exact name], is in full swing as indicated by the insult America has inflicted on a sovereign country where parliament is the supreme body to discuss and adumbrate the pros and cons of assassination.
Did the participants here see the above weblink page--
http://www.facebook.com/WLSASG , it reflects unfulfilled freudian dreams of organic solidarity where geelani saheb is calling OBL as a martyr?
Mr.Rajesh, you are very right in your observation which might lead one to think there will be greater civil resistance in cashmere, because terror might no longer be a viable strategy to begin with, it can be a support to the civil protest but not the main means. If you scour youtube for anti-india propaganda you can see maulana masood azhar [very funny way of spreading poison but one has to break bread with the devil to hear what is said] berates away, of a prescient warning of the way he wants the intifada to go in cashmere, liberate our muslim bretheren and civil unrest seems to be the new preferred means until madaoudi's dream is realised, the khilafat and umrah !
Thanks to BR I know how and what to look for in terms of strategic analysis and examine their politics such as the mojahir movement. Chindu is not amused and calls for unfettered peace talks which the americans will not doubt hate, but is important for all stake holders? Who are these stake holders if I may ask?

Pranav · Post by **Pranav** » 04 May 2011 23:06

RamaY wrote: So what is stopping India from doing the same? After all India gave evidence of Paki involvement in 11/26 and Pakistan hasn't done anything for 2 years. And there is a war going in the region, so war-like conditions must apply right?

I presume that India is doing exactly what US has been doing for past 10 years. It is collecting more and more intelligence to locate the whereabouts of Pakroaches. Pakis should expect an Abbatobad like operation from their south-eastern borders.

Why do you need to go across the border when Dawood's associate Pawar is right here, sitting in Delhi, and winning EVM elections.

shyamd · Post by **shyamd** » 04 May 2011 23:22

Pakistan: Local Taliban commander ends truce with army after Bin Laden killing

last update: May 04, 18:45

Wana, 4 May (AKI) - By Syed Saleem Shahzad - A group loyal to a Taliban commander in South Waziristan launched an attack on an army camp in the northwestern Pakistani tribal area's main town of Wana late on Tuesday.

The attack by fighters loyal to Nazir Ahmed marked the first termination by a Taliban leader of a ceasefire agreement with Pakistan's army since Bin Laden's killing by US special forces on Monday.

"There is no information of any casualties, but the militants have made their point that they have terminated all ceasefire agreement with the army and they consider their presence in the tribal area as a hostile presence," a local tribal elder told Adnkronos International (AKI) by telephone.

"The whole night, militants rained down missiles and rockets over the main military camp in Wana while the Pakistani army returned fire," said the elder.

He was speaking to AKI on condition of anonymity because of a possible backlash by militants or the Pakistani administration in South Waziristan.

NATO forces have long view 36-year-old Ahmed's group as the biggest threat in the provinces of Paktika, Helmand and Zabul, in neighbouring Afghanistan, where he runs the largest jihadist network.

Ahmed, the Taliban's chief in Wana commands thousands of supporters but remained impartial in the 2009 military operation against Pakistani Taliban militants in South Waziristan.

Ahmed was considered as anti-Al-Qaeda and carried out the massacre of 250 members of the anti-Pakistan Army Islamic movement of Uzbekistan (IMU) in 2007 in South Waziristan and expelled hundreds of their members.

However, during a recent visit to South Waziristan, Nazir told AKI he has never been opposed to Al-Qaeda and his differences with the IMU were of a local nature.

He said he has also recently re-established communication with IMU leaders.

See SSS article on mullah nazir's special interview.

Altair · Post by **Altair** » 04 May 2011 23:40

Ladies and Gentlemen
Well, Now that Naked Pak 44 1/4 The Final Insult has won the Best Comedy Movie with Geelani completing the honors in Paris, we can all move to the next category.
The Next category is the Best Action Movie GUBO HARD 4 where a bunch of unorganized but highly motivated guys riding on mules and jeeps take on an Army known to hold a nuclear arsenal and sophisticated weapons at its disposal donated by a superpower. The special effects looked almost real and the anti-climax has won rave reviews from critics worldwide. Applause!!!!!!

Mahendra · Post by **Mahendra** » 04 May 2011 23:42

The 500 Euro found in OBL's clothes have been traced back to a payment made to Bakistan under the Kerry-Lugar bill in April 2011.
The two telephone numbers found are said to be registered in Rawalpindi. There is absolutely no way they would release information about the telephone numbers unless the people who use those numbers have been identified.

shyamd · Post by **shyamd** » 05 May 2011 01:04

Pak's noose has been tied. The Chairman for intelligence will be investigating whether pak is complicit in hiding OBL. This came as a result of a closed door meeting with Panetta.

Meanwhile.

It used to be TTP and a few allies taking on Pak army. Now it is TTP plus Taleban, AQ allies. You reap what you sow. Let the IED mubaraks begin.

Prem · Post by **Prem** » 05 May 2011 01:13

Mullah "O" Maar and rest of the AQAMs cannot trust Poaks with their life anymore . This fear itself will have very own bloofy momentum within withering Poakland. OBL's death is another nail in Poak coffin. IMHO, all eyes should be on if, when and how much more moola they receive from Massa detrimental for Poak economic health.

hnair · Post by **hnair** » 05 May 2011 01:16

500 euros? he planned to bribe his way out of Crore Commander's kamplexes with 500 euros? No wonder he dead!

Prem · Post by **Prem** » 05 May 2011 01:28

Osama bin Laden's Pakistan
Pakistan needs to reform its military and intelligence services in order to rid itself of terrorist activity.
Brahma Chellaney
http://english.aljazeera.net/indepth/op ... 13531.html

This only underscores the major protection that bin Laden must have received from elements of the Pakistani security establishment to help him elude the US dragnet for nearly a decade. The breakthrough in hunting him down came only after the US, even at the risk of rupturing its longstanding ties with the Pakistani army and ISI, deployed a number of CIA operatives, Special Operations forces, and "contractors" deep inside Pakistan without the knowledge of the Pakistani military.In recent years, with its senior operations men captured or killed and bin Laden holed up in Pakistan, the badly splintered al-Qaeda had already lost the ability to mount a major international attack or openly challenge US interests. With bin Laden's death, Al Qaeda is likely to wither away as an organisation.Yet its dangerous ideology is expected to live on and motivate state-sponsored non-state actors. It will be mainly such elements that will have the capacity to launch major transnational terrorist attacks, like the 2008 Mumbai strikes. Even in Afghanistan, the US military's main foe is not al-Qaeda but a resurgent Taliban, which enjoys safe haven in Pakistan.That is why the spotlight is likely to turn on the terrorist nexus within Pakistan and the role of, and relationship between, state and non-state actors there. Significantly, as the CIA closed in on bin Laden, the chairman of the US Joint Chiefs of Staff, Admiral Mike Mullens, for the first time publicly linked the Pakistani military with some of the militants attacking US forces in Afghanistan. Pakistan's homegrown militia continue to operate openly, and the Pakistani army and intelligence remain loathe to sever their cozy ties with "extremist" and "terrorist" elements.
Make no mistake: the scourge of Pakistani terrorism emanates more from the country's Scotch whisky-sipping generals than from the bead-rubbing mullahs. It is the self-styled secular generals who have reared the forces of jihad and fathered the Taliban, Lashkar-e-Taiba, Jalaluddin Haqqani militia, and other groups. Yet, by passing the blame for their ongoing terrorist-proxy policy to their mullah puppets, the generals have made the US believe that the key is to contain the religious fringe, not the puppeteers.In fact, Pakistan's descent into a jihadist dungeon occurred not under civilian rule, but under two military dictators – one who nurtured and let loose jihadist forces, and another who took his country to the very edge of the precipice.Without reform of the Pakistani army and ISI, there can be no end to transnational terrorism - and no genuine nation-building in Pakistan. How can Pakistan be a "normal" state if its army and intelligence agency remain outside civilian oversight and decisive power remains with military generals?With bin Laden dead, the only way that al-Qaeda can reconstitute itself is if the Pakistani military succeeds in reinstalling a proxy regime in Afghanistan. Until the Pakistani military's vice-like grip on power is broken and the ISI cut down to size, Pakistan is likely to remain Ground Zero for the terrorist threat that the world confronts.

amdavadi · Post by **amdavadi** » 05 May 2011 01:32

OBL was carring 500Euros so if paki abdul got greedy claming 25mil reward. He could bribe him with 500euros

Prem · Post by **Prem** » 05 May 2011 01:46

Pakistan as Terror Sanctuary
http://online.wsj.com/article/SB1000142 ... 55154.html

To begin, the army must prove that it has given up its quest to treat Afghanistan like a puppet rather than a neighbor. The surest way to do this is to turn against its jihadist proxies in the Haqqani network, responsible for the deaths of hundreds of American soldiers in eastern Afghanistan. Unrealistic budgets flow from an expansionist world view: Curtailing the army's ambitions this way will free up much-needed resources for Islamabad.As a good-faith gesture to make up for the bin Laden debacle, arresting his longtime deputy and al Qaeda's likely new leader, Ayman al-Zawahiri, and the Taliban's Mullah Omar would also be more than welcome. Both are thought to live somewhere in Pakistan under official or semi-official protection. Finally, the army needs to stop resisting a key administrative measure it beat back three years ago—bringing the ISI under civilian rather than military control. Pakistan's civilian rulers may be incompetents, but they lack the ISI's signature traits of over-ambitiousness and willful disregard for civilian lives.
Should Pakistan's generals proceed with these small reforms, the U.S. can keep up aid flows and establish closer military-to-military ties, with an emphasis on training for younger officers. The idea here would be to return the army to its British Indian roots—as a professional force that stayed out of politics and governance.

( You can catch a fish in pee but cant change Poak behaviour mr. Dhume)

Charlie · Post by **Charlie** » 05 May 2011 01:49

WSJ: And now the reality in New Delhi

The official also said “we are not war mongers” and noted the countries’ shared heritage in the Indian Subcontinent. “Pakistan is a foreign country but it was a part of us at one time,” the official said.

these weak-kneed ******** are pure SDRE's unfortunately

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 05 May 2011 01:58

Prem,
Mr. Dhume always spouts a massa line. He might be a policy wonk for them.

Prem · Post by **Prem** » 05 May 2011 02:43

IMF postpones Pakistan talks, delays disbursement deal
http://www.thepakistaninewspaper.com/ne ... p?id=19595

WASHINGTON: The International Monetary Fund has postponed talks in Pakistan next week due to security concerns, an IMF spokesman said on Wednesday, delaying a deal to disburse more than $3 billion in funds to the country.The killing of Osama bin Laden by US special forces on Sunday at a Pakistani compound near Islamabad has raised worries about the potential for retaliatory attacks.“An IMF mission to meet Pakistani authorities in Islamabad … has been postponed in light of security developments in Pakistan,” an IMF spokesman told Reuters. “No new dates have been set at this stage.”The IMF mission was meant to discuss budget targets for the fiscal year 2011/12 and to review economic and policy developments under Pakistan’s $11 billion IMF loan program, the spokesman said.The World Bank said it had also postponed travel to Pakistan although loan disbursements for development and social projects were not affected, including funding for rebuilding of areas devastated by massive flooding last year.It is not unusual that missions by international institutions are postponed when geopolitical events give rise to concerns staff could face harm.IMF disbursements to Pakistan of two remaining tranches of about $3 billion under the program is critical to help the nation through a financial crunch due to a widening fiscal deficit brought about by the flooding.
Pakistan agreed to an IMF loan program in November 2008 to avert a financial crisis. So far, about $8 billion of the loan has been disbursed, while an additional $451 million in funding has since been authorized to cope with damage caused by the summer floods.Questions have been raised about whether the United States might pull back on its bilateral aid to Pakistan, which would make the IMF funding even more critical.US lawmakers have questioned how it was possible for bin Laden to live near a Pakistani military training academy without the knowledge of the government and have called for a review of US aid.On a recent visit to Washington, Pakistan’s Finance Minister Hafiz Shaikh said on April 18 it was a “myth” that his country was a major recipient of aid from Washington.Shaikh said the United States had not delivered what it promised under a law passed in 2009 that is meant to provide $7.5 billion in civilian aid to Pakistan over five years. The law authorized aid of $1.5 billion a year

putnanja · Post by **putnanja** » 05 May 2011 02:51

Was this posted before?

How long will Pakistan play the world? - Shyam Saran

...
The latest developments underscore the fact that US and Pakistani interests in Afghanistan and in the broader war against terrorism have never been aligned. Pakistan was forced to become a reluctant ally in the war against the Taliban and al-Qaeda after 9/11, in order to avoid a national catastrophe, delivered by an angry and vengeful America. Whether under Musharraf or under Zardari/Kayani, Pakistan has never wavered in its objective to see the backs of US troops in Afghanistan and to re-establish a Pakistan-dominated dispensation in that country. The myth that Pakistan may be supportive of the Taliban but opposed to al-Qaeda has now been busted. Both have been instruments in Pakistan’s Afghan strategy.
...
...
The key to how the situation will evolve post-Osama lies in the hands of the United States. There may be a temptation in Washington to use this latest example of Pakistani perfidy to extract its unwilling but unavoidable collaboration in the US exit strategy for Afghanistan. Pakistan may have to cut its links with the Taliban elements in its north-west tribal territory and carry out operations against its allies in that region. It may be forced to give up other assets which have targeted the Americans in Afghanistan. This may enable an uneasy peace to descend in the country and with Osama dead, the original mission in Afghanistan may be declared to have been accomplished. However, once the US withdraws its forces, mayhem is likely to return to Afghanistan, which will be a huge challenge for its neighbours, including India. If, on the other hand, the US uses this opportunity to truly address the dilemma both our countries confront in Pakistan, the situation may evolve differently. The heart of this strategy would be not to make short-term tactical gains in managing US withdrawal from Afghanistan, but to use the leverage it has gained to insist on a change of course in Pakistan, away from using terrorism as an instrument of state policy.

If progress is made in this regard, a different environment may emerge in which a manageable, if not friendly, India-Pakistan relationship may become a reality. And only then will there be a realistic prospect of winning the global war against terrorism.

Charlie · Post by **Charlie** » 05 May 2011 03:03

A Fox News Grab

RamaY · Post by **RamaY** » 05 May 2011 03:15

Charlie wrote:WSJ: And now the reality in New Delhi

The official also said “we are not war mongers” and noted the countries’ shared heritage in the Indian Subcontinent. “Pakistan is a foreign country but it was a part of us at one time,” the official said.
these weak-kneed ******** are pure SDRE's unfortunately

Charlie,

The essence of that article is not what you quoted. It is

India’s geographic proximity to Pakistan, the official said, makes its security calculations different than the U.S. “We exist back-to-back with Pakistan. There is no denying that reality,” the official said. “It’s easy to be hawkish on Pakistan, to say, ‘we’ll bring Pakistan to its knees,’ but then what?”

Please visit Managing Pakistan's Failure

shaardula · Post by **shaardula** » 05 May 2011 06:24

would it be correct to say -- whatever does massa does will not solve our tsp problem, but what massa does could potentially make the tsp problem solvable.

RajeshG · Post by **RajeshG** » 05 May 2011 06:24

I want to pursue the issue of Kayani chickening out a bit further. This is mainly because the biggest change between now and pre-OBL days I think is the loss of credibility that TSPA has amongst the jihadis and TFTA mards. I personally feel that even the slightest of direct action with boots on ground could have resulted in BHO pulling out - claims about fighting it out notwithstanding. And if BHO had pulled out none of this would have come out in public. So the key thing to me is -> Kayani chicken out. Does that show that TSPA fears full-fledge escalation ? At one point in those couple of hours the question must have been raised about escalation. Are they not confident about escalation ? The general picture portrayed by TSPA has been that they are ready for full-fledged escalation and would start dropping bombs on slightest provocation wrt coldstart or whatever. But doesnt this show outright fear ? To belabor the same point - they must have known that everybody knows that they have OBL and if they can make this mission fail, yanks are not going to publicly say anything and are not really going to escalate - but there seems to have been some doubt and fear that the yanks might actually escalate. I am sure the jihadis will be thinking about this and will not respect the TSPA at all. How does this doubt about TSPA mardangi in jihadi minds affect things ?

shaardula · Post by **shaardula** » 05 May 2011 06:33

but why wouldn't the yanks say anything? yanks would have been hassled in the heart of tsp in pursuing what is worldwide known to be a legitimate target.

i think us military is majorly pissed with the causalities it is taking in af-pak. while they might not succeed in making afg a modern democracy, they are not willing to get their nose bloodied because of the shenanigans of a two bit country that depends on them for sustenance.

shiv · Post by **shiv** » 05 May 2011 06:38

RajeshA wrote:
What Pakistanis have lost is any plausible deniability that had. Mumbai 26/11 brought much of their plausible deniability crumbling as far as terrorism against India was concerned. OBL knock-out has destroyed all of that plausible deniability they had with regard to terrorism directed at the West.

If there is any terrorist attack against the West in the near future, then all the anger that the West is suppressing in order to continue some modicum of the transactional relationship between them and Pakistan would evaporate. Then the anger would pour out bursting. Any terrorist attack would cause anger, and the lightning has to fall somewhere - and now per default that would fall on Pakistan.

Those of us who are bemoaning that despite the fact that the Pakistani Army and ISI were sheltering Osama bin Laden, the West does not seem ready to hit at Pakistan, they are right to feel a little dejected, but they should perhaps wait how the situation changes when there is a new attack!

Pakistan's ISI is the new scapegoat for all terror in the world by default! "Plausible Deniability" is a thing of the past!

I agree with the above statement, and it is based precisely on these thoughts that I am speculating.

If you were Paki army, what would you do now?

Would you order an attack, or would you ask your chelas to keep their heads down and not conduct any attacks till further notice.

RajeshG · Post by **RajeshG** » 05 May 2011 06:44

shaardula wrote:but why wouldn't the yanks say anything?

Everybody has known about OBL being harbored by TSPA but has not said or done anything worthwhile for the last 2 decades. If the operation had failed everything would have been back to normal. BHO wouldnt have come on TV saying we failed in this operation which was directed at getting some random high-valued-target that we arent sure of. So if yanks havent escalated till now why would they do it after some failed mission ? So Kayani's fear was unfounded. But he was afraid anyway. Shows a soft man IMO.

RamaY · Post by **RamaY** » 05 May 2011 06:47

Why is Pakistan so obsessed and scared of Afghanistan? AFAIK They never ruled over Afghanistan in any form, then why this need to hold Afghanistan?

TIA.

RajeshG · Post by **RajeshG** » 05 May 2011 06:54

[quote="shiv]If you were Paki army, what would you do now?

Would you order an attack, or would you ask your chelas to keep their heads down and not conduct any attacks till further notice.[/quote]

I have to attack. I have no choice. Nobody likes weak and fearful faujis. Neither yanks nor jihadis. Look at the spike in BHO's job approval ratings.

http://www.realclearpolitics.com/epolls ... -1044.html

The other options would be shooting hatf-x, more bum tests, SDRE hunting or more lal masjids. They have to do something though, cant just take this lying down.

shaardula · Post by **shaardula** » 05 May 2011 06:57

if the op had failed bho would not have told we failed, but he would still have to explain why he was fighting pakis in the middle of tsp.

VinodTK · Post by **VinodTK** » 05 May 2011 06:58

Why U.S. mistrusts Pakistan's powerful spy agency

There are other reasons to puzzle. Pakistan's foreign ministry says that Abbottabad, home to several military installations, has been under surveillance since 2003. If that's true, then why didn't the ISI uncover bin Laden, who U.S. officials say has been living with his family and entourage in a well-guarded compound for years?

The answer to that question goes to the heart of the troubled relationship between Pakistan and the United States. Washington has long believed that Islamabad, and especially the ISI, play a double game on terrorism, saying one thing but doing another.

Dipanker · Post by **Dipanker** » 05 May 2011 07:02

RamaY wrote:Why is Pakistan so obsessed and scared of Afghanistan? AFAIK They never ruled over Afghanistan in any form, then why this need to hold Afghanistan?

TIA.

In nutshell because of Durand Line! Theoretically FATA and NWFP should be part of Afghanistan after the lapse of 100 years long Afghan British treaty of 1893. A non pliant Afghan govt. may want them back. Remember even the Taliban did not recognize Durand Line?

Prasad · Post by **Prasad** » 05 May 2011 07:03

As far as kiya nahi is concerned americans and the rest of the world can cry themselves hoarse until the end of the world. That mattes nothing to them. Things in favour of ass-phuck -
1. Americans can't withdraw out of Af-pak tomorow. They will have to do it in a staged manner over many months, if they're any serious. This means, they still need the porkis to declare victory and 'bring the boys' home. So they wont squeeze the porki balls any more than necessary. That means kiyanahi will stay.
2. For all the american crying, they will continue to provide porkis with arms saying it was non-state/rogue eye yes eye actors onlee. Kiyanahi is still our most valuable alleye onlee.
3. IMF/WB funding may be cut but not to the tune that it would cause major problems to them. Their economy is already down in the dustbin. Any funding from the imf will only prop them up.

In essence they will still have help from outside. What would really cook the porkig pig would be internal strife. Eye yes eye needs the public to keep thinking they're the guardians of the faith and stand up to the infidels. If the public is led to believe that they just greased up and bent over and cried come take me, public would go mad. They already know that 10%i and groper are just for the sake of it and kiyanahi holds the danda. Public support failing would increase the bad taliban ranks and support for them. How much that would destabilise the PA is a matter of question.

Outside of outright american boots on teh ground, porkis aren't going anywhere. People in the US will still point to the nukes and say - too big to fail. And we'll have to deal with it.

VinodTK · Post by **VinodTK** » 05 May 2011 07:18

Obama reserves right to act again in Pakistan

Despite Islamabad's complaints that the raid that killed bin Laden was unauthorized and unilateral, Obama's spokesman Jay Carney said the president was prepared to target fugitives again if they are found in Pakistan.

"He made very clear during the campaign that that was his view. He was criticized for it," Carney told reporters.

"He maintained that that was his view and, by the actions he has taken as president, feels that it was the right approach and continues to feel that way."

RamaY · Post by **RamaY** » 05 May 2011 07:28

Fact1: US President went live claiming a successful raid in the middle of TSP and killing of OBL
Fact2: A compound in Abbotabad, helicopter ruins

Q1: Is it OBL that they killed, if so did they kill him on this day?
* It must be OBL because an acting US President put his and the sole super-power's credibility on line.

Q2: Did OBL live in that building, that too for years?
* If not OBL, USA might not have risked the operation in the middle of TSP.
* It is upto Pakistan to prove that OBL has not been living in that compound since 2005.
* Needs explanation for the helicopter ruins.

Q3: Is TSPA/ISI aware of OBL's location?
YES
* Why didn't they raid that compound themselves? Musharraf's challenge; show me where he is and I will take care of him.
* TSPA/ISI double game. Unkil's rath

NO
* They missed such an important target in Abbotabad? Doubts on ISI capabilities
* Why did they raid that compound in 2003? What were they looking for? Was there a building in 2003?

Q4: Did TSPA/ISI play a role in this operation? What is best for TSPA/ISI?
* YES
- Public role in OBL killing. It would have reestablished their anti-terror credentials. Put a lid on 11/26.
- Backlash from Taliban. Is it new though?
* NO
- TSPA/ISI's failure to detect American intrusion. Loss of faith for mango-abduls.
- Fears of clown jewels
- Lose of confidence on TSPA/ISI capabilities in their allies

svinayak · Post by **svinayak** » 05 May 2011 07:31

VinodTK wrote:Obama reserves right to act again in Pakistan
"He maintained that that was his view and, by the actions he has taken as president, feels that it was the right approach and continues to feel that way."

Is there a connection of the Birth certificate showing Hussain in the name and later going for the fugitive hunt in Pakistan so that Pakistanis dont feel hurt.

shiv · Post by **shiv** » 05 May 2011 08:00

Prasad wrote: People in the US will still point to the nukes and say - too big to fail. And we'll have to deal with it.

True - "Too big to fail" is an argument that is swallowed without question in the USA. I am seeing it appear more often in the media now. That specious argument was absent when the Soviets were pushed toward failure.

The US won't help Pakistan fail. We have to do it ourselves.