Serial Blasts in Mumbai

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KLNMurthy
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Re: Serial Blasts in Mumbai

Post by KLNMurthy »

Aditya_V wrote:KLN Murthy stop Equating POTA with Rape, thats a P-Sec argument which does not stand water. It allowed certain Police intercepts and certain types of evidence which made the fight against Terror easier but was Politicised and has become a causualty.
Strange thing to say. Where did I say POTA==Rape? Can you produce the quote? IIRC I said something like, POTA, torture etc. meaning ad hoc legal frameworks and harsh methods, clearly two separate things. I didn't even use the word "rape."

Actually, let me help you out: here's what I said in referring to POTA:
Having POTA, torture, mass roundups etc., don't help in themselves and may in fact hurt more than help;
So, how about an apology for making shit up about me?

I hope you are not setting up some kind of weird competition to show me up or something. That would be, shall we say, the wrong way to have anything like a productive discussion.
A_Gupta
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Re: Serial Blasts in Mumbai

Post by A_Gupta »

Chennai - police density (2010) [1]
Urban - 258 per 100,000 population
Suburban - 119 per 100,000

Delhi - police density (2011) [2]
362 per 100,000 population

Mumbai - police density (2011)
46352 personnel [3]
Population:[4] Census 2011
District:
Mumbai: 3,145,966
Mumbai (suburban): 9,332,481
The above two yield 371 police per 100,000 population.
I do not know of the jurisdiction of the Mumbai police[3] extends beyond Mumbai+Mumbai(suburban)


[1] http://www.tnpolice.gov.in/pdfs/CIT2010 ... DITURE.pdf
[2] http://english.alarabiya.net/articles/2 ... 57683.html
[3] http://www.mumbaipolice.org/right_of_in ... RTI%20.pdf
[4] http://www.censusindia.gov.in/2011-prov ... stmt-1.xls

Image
Last edited by A_Gupta on 15 Jul 2011 20:39, edited 1 time in total.
sumishi
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Re: Serial Blasts in Mumbai

Post by sumishi »

Did I hear it right just now in TimesNow? According to Chauhan (defending the Home Minister) there is no intelligence failure because there was no such intelligence (clues, emails etc) related to the attacks to analyze.
So if you do not have clues/intelligence to analyze, it is not an intelligence failure!
If the entire intelligence department is sleeping on the khatiya and missing out on clues, which, understandably cannot be analysed, it is not an intelligence failure :-?
where is arnab goswami these days?
shiv
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Re: Serial Blasts in Mumbai

Post by shiv »

From June 2011

Anti-Narcotics officer arrested in Mumbai Rave Party
http://kish.in/anti-narcotics-officer-a ... ave-party/
Anti-Narcotics officer arrested in Mumbai Rave Party
On the International Day against Drug Abuse, June 26, Mumbai police arrested a rave party in Mumbai-Pune highway in Raigad, detained 300 including a cop, an Anti-Narcotic cell officer Anil Jadhav. The detained crowd has youngsters including 60 girls and most of them are Mumbai students between the age group of 20-30 years.

http://www.outlookindia.com/article.aspx?263647
In the Mumbai/All over India/We are the bhais/We are the bhais” went the refrain from the DJ’s console at the plush Chembur Gymkhana late on Christmas eve. Gyrating to this popular number from a Hindi film was a motley group comprising hardened criminals who had served time, aides of fugitive don Chhota Rajan and small-time politicians, who even fired a few shots in the air. Keeping step with this group, with equal abandon, as evident in the still photographs and video grabs, were five officers of the Mumbai police.

From 2010
Mumbai: police officials partying with Chhota Rajan's aide
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k0-ms-7FPFM



http://winnersdelhinews.com/2011/06/mur ... s-exposed/
Assistant Commissioner of Police (ACP) Anil Mahabole, who is currently being probed for his alleged role in the murder of senior Mid Day journalist J Dey.

Mr Mahabole’s alleged links with the Dawood Gang were first reported in 2007 stating that he extorted money from builders on behalf of the gang. In fact the Mumbai Police Crime Branch found that he was close to Dawood’s sister Haseena Parkar. A case was filed against Mr Mahabole, which he is still contesting in court.

Mumbai Police’s list of tainted men is quite long. For instance, those from the now infamous encounter squad, once glamourised on celluloid in Bollywood films like ‘Ab Tak Chhappan’.
Lalmohan
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Re: Serial Blasts in Mumbai

Post by Lalmohan »

we need to get something in perspective, no country's intelligence apparatus is 100% effective. not even unkil's. All of them work day in day out trying to catch the bad guys. if they did not know, they did not know. what they didn't know and found out later, they will learn to look for next time. what they knew and did not act upon - is an intelligence failure. what mantriji is saying is that we didn't know this time therefore we didn't act. as someone else said - the good guys have to win every single time, the bad guys just have to win once.
shiv
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Re: Serial Blasts in Mumbai

Post by shiv »

http://articles.timesofindia.indiatimes ... ity-police
CHENNAI: Ballooning population and frozen count of police in city. That is what census 2011 figures tell us.

Chennai city, the second most densly populated city in the country, has a sanctioned strength of 14,000 police personnel. And the number pales when compared with Delhi's 83,000, Mumbai's 45,000 and Kolkata's 23,000. This leaves the city with short-winded police, saddled with double and triple shifts.

Delhi, which is the most densely populated city, has 37,346 people living in a square kilometre and Chennai has 26,903. A little bit of elementary maths throws up another fact that the police versus population ratio is thinning down for city: Chennai city has 1 policeman for every 413 people (1:413), Chennai suburban has 1: 1,222. Mumbai and Mumbai suburban has 1: 267, Delhi has 1: 200 and Kolkata has 1: 222.
It doesn't look like Mumbai is much worse than other metros in this regard.
CRamS
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Re: Serial Blasts in Mumbai

Post by CRamS »

chetak wrote:What are you guys talking about??

India is getting a great press internationally!!! :evil:

India praised for not pointing finger at Pakistan
One thing you have to admit and that is, ethch&dee does not seem to be important at all to India. First the merceiless terror assualt with Indian intelligence/security officials having no clue or told to shut up lest MMS has to respond to TSP, then Indian media going overboard to not point any finger at TSP, one NDTV pervert even saying its not "fair" to TSP because of Samjotha (thoo, that b!tch who said that makes me puke), then Raj Thackeray and his goons blaming helpless poor fellow Indians from Bihar and UP, and then as average Indians endure the pain and humiliation, here comes the final insult: western condescension on India's so called restraint, and DDM celebrating that. Can there be a more apt definition of corrupt cowards (that includes me) than this spectacle? TSP and their buddies in US sure are laughing in glee. And why not? Their gameplan is in play.
ramana
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Re: Serial Blasts in Mumbai

Post by ramana »

Shiv, The policeman with orange gloves is holding a fragment of the bomb casing. Shows its a high explosive due to the small fragment. Low explosives produce big fragments.
sum
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Re: Serial Blasts in Mumbai

Post by sum »

From 2010
Mumbai: police officials partying with Chhota Rajan's aide
Shiv-avare,
Isnt Chotta Rajan anyways supposed to be a "Sarkari" gangster? Just asking since i recall that we had big debates on this video on BR when first posted and about how this might be D psy-ops to put CR on backfoot?

Anyways, there seems to be a definite change in the post blasts stories this time and no more of the "Mumbai resilient" BS on any channel. All channels ( even NDTV) only playing the theme that the people are "resilient" only because of need to fill stomach and it definitely isnt by choice.

NDTV even interviewed a 10 yr type kid who sarcastically mentioned that they have anyways got used to it and it has to be so since Rahul baba anyways said the same about us (1 % attacks always happen). Wonder why Rahul baba is even holding office if we cant stop this repeating like US has done where no attack after 9/11 ( all this gyaan from a 10 year old!!!) :eek: :eek:


IIRC, 2 or 3 more hits on Mumbai and breaking points will be reached for their "patience" and "resilience"
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Re: Serial Blasts in Mumbai

Post by Ravi Karumanchiri »

shiv wrote:
ramana wrote:Shiv, The explosive property is called brisance. ANFO has high brisance power just as other high explosives.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brisance

Relative Effectiveness factor shows ANFO is 80% on TNT!

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Relative_e ... ess_factor

Thanks ramana - but what I had in my mind was a vague recollection of the velocity of explosive. The velocity of ANFO is about 63% of RDX. But yes ANFO looks pretty deadly as it is.
Actually, ANFO mixtures have considerably lower brisance than do military or demolition explosives. Military and demolition explosives have high brisance, required to cut metal, whereas ANFO mixtures and other explosives used in mining operations have lower brisance, but more 'heave' (meaning they can displace more material).

If you look at the photos of the blast scenes, a number of things become obvious that clearly indicate the use of ANFO or other similiar, lower-brisance explosive. In a number of pictures, there are cars with broken glass that is still in-place, in the window frame. If these cars had been in the vicinity of a high-brisance explosion, the glass would be completely blown-out. In another picture, there is a large metal door, typical of a shuttered storefront, and it is warped inward, from the blast. The curvature of this warped door would indicate that the bomb was placed at ground level, and that it was approximately 1.5 meters away. Had this charge been of a high-brisance explosive, there would have been perforations in this door, but not so much warping. Instead, the fact that it was warped, indicates a lower-speed shock wave, typical of ANFO or similar explosive. Yet another photo shows a lot of smoke hanging in the air -- this too is indicative of ANFO mixtures, but not so much of military grade explosives.

Another thing that I find curious is that none of the bombs seemed to have held shrapnel, typically nuts and bolts and ball-bearings, that would have significantly increased the casualty rate. This is a common practice among terrorists, especially those using military grade explosives (which have a 'plastique' nature, that makes studding the bombs with metal bits easier). ANFO, on the other hand, is a goopy paste that must be contained in a vessel, or else it would ooze out all over the place.

It is also quite curious that the bomb that was placed over top of the bus shelter, actually was the least effective (thankfully). It must have failed, or been very small. One would expect its elevation to have contributed to its deadly effectiveness, but this bomb claimed no lives. My guess is that the priming detonation charge 'spread' the ANFO too much for it to achieve full ignition, so what resulted was the conventional bomb equivalent of a 'fizzle'.

Some in this thread have remarked how insenstive ANFO is, and they are correct. It does require a priming charge, but I don't think they would have used anything more than a blasting cap, again, because of there still being so much glass still in the window frames of those cars.

My estimation is that this was done with ANFO, contained within a plastic vessel, and detonated with a small blasting cap, set off with a timer set on only a few minutes delay. Whoever did it, knew enough to be dangerous, but did not know everything there is to know about doing it.

The more I think about it; the fact that there was no prior intelligence input, that there has been no claim of responsibility, and that there has reportedly been a lack of congratulatory chatter since the blast; it makes me think this was done as a 'pledge'. What I mean by that, is that some up-and-coming, wannabe terrorist, did this dirty deed to demonstrate his bona fides; in an attempt to convince a terror paymaster that he is a good investment. This bomber is likely not within the real IM command structure, but he wants to be. This bomber is a second or third-degree hanger-on of the real IM cadres.

If the TSP were more directly involved, they wouldn't have had a fizzled bomb, and there would have been some kind of claim of responsibility or message. Instead, the silence indicates to me, that this is a lone bomber, without any political apparatus around him.

Any reflections on the above?
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Re: Serial Blasts in Mumbai

Post by shiv »

Ravi Karumanchiri wrote:
If the TSP were more directly involved, they wouldn't have had a fizzled bomb, and there would have been some kind of claim of responsibility or message. Instead, the silence indicates to me, that this is a lone bomber, without any political apparatus around him.

Any reflections on the above?
To me what it indicates is not that TSP is not involved - but the intel and security system has made it difficult to get RDX. There is so much cursing of Intel here but not a word of praise for attacks that have been prevented simply by good surveillance - but I digress. Of course one cannot rule out the "small, new group" theory

NH4NO3 needs to to be regulated. Or spiked to reveal its origin.
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Re: Serial Blasts in Mumbai

Post by negi »

Well use of commercially available explosives can be very well a deliberate ploy of the ISI after the 09/11 attacks; for the 'hypocrites' have begun to smell the coffee. RDX is not sold commercially (outside of military only used for controlled demolitions in urban areas) and hence it will be a dead give away as far as TSP's involvement in any attack is concerned finally from a tactical pov procuring the maal from area near the target makes more sense as against smuggling it from across the broder. As a matter of fact terrorists in Kashmir still use RDX whenever they can bring it in but there ISI does not have to worry as there is "freedom struggle" going on in Kashmir.
Last edited by ramana on 16 Jul 2011 01:23, edited 2 times in total.
Reason: Added quotes.ramana
shyamd
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Re: Serial Blasts in Mumbai

Post by shyamd »

Must read the series of articles on 13/7. Covers the IB view on the case and various other issues.
13/7- whose email was it?
Posted on July 15, 2011 by Vicky Nanjappa

An email that was sent out after the serial blasts has come under scrutiny. The Union Home Secretary in New Delhi said today that apart from the 16 CDs containing footage of the images picked up the CCTVs there is also a mail that is being verified and this mail had been sent out after the blasts.

According to investigators who are now looking into this email, the same was sent in the name of a Telangana activist claiming responsibility for the blasts. Investigators had rubbished this and said that there is absolutely no connection between the blasts and the activities in that state and this mail is nothing but a diversionary tactic on part of the persons who actually carried out the blasts.

This email was sent a couple of hours after the blasts stating that this incident was carried out since the government was not handing over a separate state. However the origin of the mail is what makes it interesting. The mail has been tracked down to the Gulf and emerged from there that night, sources also said.

The mailing culture after a blast was started by the Indian Mujahideen and it was during those serial blasts that rocked Bangalore Ahmedabad and Delhi did mails start to come out regularly. When the IM was formed and the Uttar Pradesh court blasts were carried out they had sent out a mail for the first time.

In all these mails they have cited an emotive issue such as the Babri demolition or the Gujarat riots. In the other mails they have cited that innocent youth have been arrested and also they have spoken about the Kashmir problem. These are all very emotive issues and the IM always looked to justify its actions by acting as the saviours of its community members.

However there is a different pattern in this mail. The fact that it came from the Gulf which is quite a strong hold of the IM leads investigators to believe that it could be them behind this mail. However this time around the IM has been very careful not to identify itself and stayed away from sending any mails claiming responsibility for the attack. Hence it appears that they have used yet another very emotive issue to justify the blasts. However this time around it is not so much about justifying the attack, but the intention was to put investigators on a different track altogether.

Investigators also do not rule out the possibility of this just being another prank mail to put the Telangana agitation in bad light. If one looks at the name (withheld) on the mail sent from a Yahoo account it is clear that it bears the name of a person from Coastal Andhra Pradesh who have been opposing the formation of a separate state. All angles are open, but we are not reading too much into it although we do find the need to track the exact source of the email, investigators also pointed out.

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Posted in 13/7, Indian Mujahideen, Terrorism | Tagged Babri demolition, CCTV, email, Gujarat riots, Gulf, Indian Mujahideen, Kashmir, Telangana | 1 Comment
Self motivated modules in Kerala make it a hub
Posted on July 15, 2011 by Vicky Nanjappa

More clues point towards the Indian Mujahideen to be behind this attack. Looking at the intensity and the articulate planning of these blasts it becomes clear that the IM in fact has managed to re-group. Intelligence bureau reports state that while the Indian Mujahideen took place in Uttar Pradesh a few years back the re-grouping has taken place down South.

It has been said on several ocassions it is very essential that security agencies keep their noses down South since the states down the country will see the re-emergence of home grown terror. Kerala is a state that has always been spoken about which would play the role of a feeder state to such activities. However increasingly when one looks at this state the only major operation carried out by the cadres from this state was during the Bangalore blasts.

As it has been pointed out Kerala will always remain a feeder state in terms of funds. In addition to this it would also serve as a hide out for terrorists since in this state one can find a lot of sympathisers for such persons. Moreover the political atmosphere has always been condusive for such operatives. The IM has found this state to be a perfect hunting ground and over the past couple of years they have used Kerala to kick start their operations.

According to the police and those officials who have been studying Kerala as a destination for terrorists, the fact remains that there is not one dedicated terror group in this state. One would get to find that there is a mix of the IM, the SIMI and elements of HuJI and the Lashkar-e-Tayiba. The major part of these modules has always been to oversee a recruitment process and also channelize funds for terror activities.

For terror groups however there has not been much of an effort put into a state like Kerala. The funds have been flowing in easily and there are many sympathisers for their cause. The IB says that there are modules in this state which are always on standby and these modules would have cadres who are being prepared for bigger operations.

The immediate worry from Kerala is not the creation of the modules by bigger outfits. There are several self motivated modules which offer to carry out terror attacks on their own. Bigger groups such as the IM and the Lashkar are aware of this and hence they have never found the need to activate their modules for terror strikes emerging out Kerala. At the moment they are happy carrying out recruitments and collecting funds which could fund operations in other states. The IM in particular has used this state to the fullest and has been gradually setting up its modules here. Moreover their operatives in the Gulf also use Kerala as transit point not only to cross over but also to send over funds.

Intelligence Bureau officials say that for an operation like 13/7, it would have cost the terror group anything between Rs 50,000 and Rs 1 lakh. Raising such small amounts is never difficult and there are many sympathisers who will part with such sums.

Security agencies say that Kerala continues to be a hot bed for such activity. The hawala money from the Gulf, the political environment and also the communally sensitive nature of this state make it ideal for terror operations. It has been said in the past too that bigger groups have never activated their modules big time from this state. There are a lot of over enthusiastic youth who will gather a group of people and carry out strikes in the names of bigger organisations.

The interrogation of T Nasir makes this evident. During his probe it had been found that there are several small modules in Kerala which are ready to carry out such operations. His module too was a very small one and he himself had managed to collect funds from a sympathiser in the Gulf for this operation. He says that the amount spent by him for the Bangalore blasts was just Rs 45000. His interrogation also goes on to state that he had sought the support of Abdul Nasar Madani for this blast and also states that he was upset that Madani had used this as a political gain which had upset him. He however also adds that Abdul Nasar Madani had backed out of this at the last moment.

These statements are indicative of the fact that a state like Kerala comprises several small modules. These modules cannot however be dismissed since fringe elements from other terror groups constantly look for support and financial help from these modules. In addition to this the police have also found that operatives from various other states take refuge in Kerala. This has led to the combining of the forces which makes Kerala a deadly battle ground for terror operations.

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Posted in 13/7, Indian Mujahideen, Lashkar-e-Tayiba, SIMI, Terrorism | Tagged Abdul Nasar, Bangalore Blasts, Gulf, Hawala money, HuJI, IM, Indian Mujahideen, Kerala, Lashkar-e-Tayiba, SIMI, T Nasir, Vicky Nanjappa | Leave a comment
Three modules carried out 13/7
Posted on July 15, 2011 by Vicky Nanjappa

Was it a joint operation by the modules of Hyderabad, Bangalore and Jharkhand? This is what the investigations point towards at the moment. Around 14 boys of the Indian Mijahideen were picked up to carry out this operation.

The National Investigating Agency which is working on these leads has already conducted a raid in Ranchi at the residences of some SIMI members. They have been in Karnataka since yesterday where a probe into the activites of both the IM and the SIMI are taking place. However very strong reliance has been placed on the intelligence input that has been coming in from Hyderabad where it was said that the boys were from these places.

After examining the footage that the police have got from the CCTVs, it was concluded that the boys who were at the spot were not locals. Further information on this case also goes on to reveal that this operation was planned in the month of January itself and the intelligence from Hyderabad had passed on inputs regarding the same in the month of February itself. However it became extremely difficult to track these people down since all through the operation they never used cell phones or even exchange emails. It appears that they met in person and discussed it among themselves.

This was a deliberate ploy on their part since intelligence can be picked up very easily if they tend to communicate through phones or emails. The police had said on the day of the blast that there was no specific input regarding these boys since there was no communication records of the operation.

An intelligence bureau official from Hyderabad says that there has been regular movement of some youth in the past one year and the various interrogation reports of IM operatives such as Salman and the rest did give an indication that the IM was trying to strike. Salman was specific when he told the police that they wanted to carry out a series of blasts and wanted to re-commence operations from Uttar Pradesh which they eventually did at Varanasi.

The NIA would probe these IM operatives again for further clues apart from launching a man hunt for the youth who carried out the serial blasts on Wednesday.

While the modules in Bangalore and Hyderabad were considered to be very strong, the one at Jharkhand is a relatively new one. The Bangalore module was always under the scanner following the blasts in the city. Hyderabad which was a hub for the HuJI had slowly started showing traces of IM movement in the past two years. Following the twin blasts in the city and the subsequent death of Shahid Bilal the activities among the members of the HuJI had gone down considerably.

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Posted in 13/7, Indian Mujahideen, SIMI, Terrorism | Tagged Bangalore, Hyderabad, IM, Jharkhand, NIA, SIMI | Leave a comment
Locals didn’t carry out blasts
Posted on July 15, 2011 by Vicky Nanjappa

The investigations into the serial blasts case is gradually taking shape with vital clues coming out. In New Delhi the Union Home Secretary said that the scooter had been identified on which the bomb had been placed. In addition to this the investigators also have found that the men they have seen in the CCTV footage were not locals and they were foot soldiers who were sent from different states to plant the bombs.

The police had termed this as a crucial piece of evidence and had even sent the same to the forensics for examination. A scooter which was damaged was found at the Zaveri Bazaar and it was discovered that the bomb was placed on it. Investigators are trying to find out more clues regarding this scooter and are trying to ascertain whether it belonged to one of the bombers or was the bomb placed on it randomly. If it had been placed randomly then it becomes evident that the bombers were at the spot minutes before the blasts occurred.

They will also study the similarity between this and the Malegaon case in which the case was cracked by identifying the bike on which the bomb was placed. In that case they had managed to track down the number on the chasis which finally led to the culprit.

The cops are examining the footage from at least 30 cameras of the various locations to find more clues regarding the bombers. Earlier it was found that there were three men speaking on a cell phone and they were at the venue for over an hour. It was also found that they were conversing among themselves and also speaking on the phone. Initial reports have now indicated that these boys were not locals and this clearly points to the fact that a module from outside has executed these blasts.

Apart from the ATS the intelligence bureau and also the National Investigating Agency is tracking this case. The NIA has been focusing on the rest of the states which house the modules which could have triggered this attack. SIMI is emerging as a very strong suspect in this case and some of the modules in Ranchi have come under the scanner. Raids are being conducted in various places across the country since there is strong intelligence inputs which point a finger at a joint operation by the SIMI and IM.

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Posted in 13/7, Indian Mujahideen, SIMI, Terrorism | Tagged ATS, CCTV footage, IM, modules, NIA, Ranchi, serial blasts, SIMI, Vicky Nanjappa | Leave a comment
How terrorist are at advantage with obsolete Explosives Act
Posted on July 15, 2011 by Vicky Nanjappa

We have bomb blasts galore and an Explosives Act dating back to 1884. We have a controller of explosives sitting at Nagpur who has more expertise with crackers manfucatured at Sivakasi and terrorists who continue to innovate with each passing day.

Every government has claimed that it is serious about its war on terror. While there have been hubs set up to combat 26/11 type situations, intelligence agencies say that the biggest headache for India would always be bomb blasts since these operations for terrorists are easier to execute rather than a fidayeen styled attack which requires years and years of planning.

When this is the case the question would be what are we doing to combat these terrorists who seem to pick up material and prepare bombs with such ease. Yesterday we had spoken about the ease with which terrorists procure ammonium nitrate and turn it into a bomb. We had also discussed that the regulations regarding ammonium nitrate are not strong enough in our country. Preparing a bomb using ammonium nitrate is easy for various reasons. One it is easily available and the mixture that is fuel oil is not too hard to get. Ammonium Nitrate has been restricted in many countries but in India that is not the case since it is still the cheapest mining explosive device.

Now coming to the laws. Unlike the United States India does not have city specific laws. Repeated intelligence has suggested that our cities will be the target and hence in such a scenario city specific laws relating to explosives would be ideal. In the US, a mayor is entitled to have his own explosive or bomb laws. Each one who transports any material pertaining to explosives has a record on him. His details including finger prints are taken into record unlike India. In the US there are even laws for pyro techniques which include the decibels of a simple cracker explosion.

The rules regarding explosives in India date back to 1884. Some changes have been made to this by the Indian government but that again dates back to 1983 when terrorism was not an issue in India. These laws and rules basically look to regulate the manufacture, possession, use, sale and export of explosives. There is also another law known as the Explosives Substances Act of 1908 which largely takes care of factors pertaining to prevention of crimes by unlawful and malicious use of explosives.

Experts point out that although these laws deal with the procurement of the explosives, there are many areas which remain blank regarding the use of newer explosives.

Another interesting aspect is that there are no experts who deal in this field since tracking the procurement of explosives still largely lies with the police and the intelligence bureau. The job needs to be a specific one and constant attention should be given in this area. Currently we have a controller of explosives in Nagpur and his deputies in other parts of the country. However the main job that has been thrust on these people is with regard to fire crackers and this is just not good enough to handle something called terrorism and the bombs used by terrorists.

Bombers obtain their explosives by stealing the material. There is no mechanism in place to ensure that he fails to procure it. Experts feel that laws are not the big issue here since they have sections in them which can convict such persons once the crime is proven.

This brings us to the question as to why the National Explosives Control Bureau has not been set up as yet. Representations in this regard have been given right from the days of the NDA government. In fact Prof Chandrashekar, forensics sciences expert who had given this representation says that it is high time that the government acts on this proposal taking into consideration the present day situation.

The explosives control bureau would have to be set up in order to prevent terrorism. Apart from having a team of experts, it should have an intelligence wing. All sticks of dymanite used for any purpose should be numbered and statistics available with this bureau. The intelligence wing should track each gram of explosive in this country whether it is used for genuine or malicious purposes. A network ought to be created where in the bureau picks up information as to who sells what to whom. In addition to this the bureau would also have to track any explosive which is coming into the country or going out of it.

Experts are of the view that now a days it is the police who do most of this job. Right from investigations they are also busy tracking down the origin of the material used in bomb blasts. This leads to a lot of time being wasted which proves fatal to the investigations and before we even know it the terrorsits would have carried out another strike on our soil.

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Posted in 13/7, Terrorism | Tagged 26/11, Ammonium Nitrate, Explosives Act dating, National Explosives Control Bureau, Prof Chandrashekar, Sivakasi, Vicky Nanjappa | 1 Comment
Human bomb theory appears illogical
Posted on July 15, 2011 by Vicky Nanjappa

The police have not yet divulged the details of a man who had wires all over him which prompted the Union Home Secretary to say that they are also exploring the possibility of a human bomb.

While this is an angle that needs to be explored for sure, the question however is whether after finding traces of ammonium nitrate is it still possible to come to the conclusion that it was a human bomb which carried out the explosions?

Before we delve into this there is a need to understand the difference between a human bomb and a suicide bomber. The concept of a suicide bomber is relatively old and the concept was used by the Japanese during the world war. A suicide bomber is one who carries a bomb with him and attacks a target thus killing himself.

The human bomb is however a concept introduced for the first time during the assassination of Rajiv Gandhi. The entire body forms part of the bomb and the bones and the muscles fly like missiles with the same detonating veolocity. In addition to this there are pellets wrapped around the belt which also cause destruction. Usually in the case of a human bomb, the explosive is concealed into the body. They use RDX as the explosive apart from electrical detonators which is powered by a nine volt battery. Once the detonator heats up this causes the explosion.

Speaking of the serial blasts now, it is unlikely that the bomber would have carried this bomb on his body. The reasons being that unlike RDX ammonium nitrate requires a container. In the case of RDX a cloth or paper is sufficient to conceal the bomb. While RDX acts as an explosive on its own, ammonium nitrate does not become an explosive unless it is mixed with fuel oil which is known as ANFO.

Professor Chandrasekar who was the forensics chief when the Rajiv Gandhi probe was on says that ammonium nitrate unlike the RDX needs to be put into steel tubes of different diameters. If a person carries it on his body it becomes very bulky. Terrorists would usually avoid it since it is easily traceable and could even be visible to the naked eye as the equipment becomes very bulky.

In the case of human bombs terrorists would always prefer the use of RDX. RDX is semi solid and is easier to shape according to the body type. Moreover RDX shaped into the body is not easily detectable unless the person is very closely frisked.

RDX has however proven to be a more powerful explosive but the usage is low in today’s world of terror since it is not easily available unlike ammonium nitrate which still can be purchased off the shelf. The RDX when compared to Ammonium Nitrate mixed with fuel oil is three times more powerful. RDX has a velocity of detonation of 26000 per second as opposed to Ammonium Nitrate mixed with fuel oil which has the VoD of 10700 per second. RDX needs an electric detonator apart from two switches one for arming and the other to initiate the device.

Hence in the case on hand if investigators pick up the fragments of the tube used for the bomb they can infer that it is not a human bomb. Moreover a human bomber will usually have a severed head and his limbs are separated and this case it does not appear to be so.

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Posted in 13/7, Terrorism | Tagged Ammonium Nitrate, ANFO, Human bombs, Professor Chandrasekar, rdx, Vicky Nanjappa | Leave a comment
Did SIMI-IM come together on 13/7
Posted on July 15, 2011 by Vicky Nanjappa

Photo courtesy: India Today

Although investigators continue to remain tight lipped regarding the outfit which carried out the serial blasts, vital clues regarding the sleeper cells of the Indian Mujahideen have emerged.

Officials who are part of the investigation say that all pointers are leading to the IM at the moment. We need to take into consideration all aspects surrounding this case and the clues are leading to the role played by the IM and also some members of the Student’s Islamic Movement of India.

The outlawed SIMI has always been the feeder cadre for the IM and there have been reports of both these groups working in tandem. Although a large part of the SIMI refused to take up arms there is still a considerable number of people in that outfit who believe that violence is the only way out.

This faction of the SIMI falls under the Safdar Nagori faction which had radicalised the SIMI. This faction has always quoted incidents against the Muslims to further their cause. The manner in which they propogated themselves even caught the eye of the ISI which was quick to jump into the ring and provide all support to them. The emergence of the Nagori faction also brought about a sea change in a man called as Abdus Subhan who was only an editor of an English magazine published by SIMI. However once the ban was imposed he subscribed more to the Nagori faction as he too felt strongly about the cause. It was from here that a man called Subhan started to change into a more radical person. As per intel inputs he is today in Pakistan and he had managed to slip out following the series of blasts that rocked India a couple of years back.

The former president of SIMI, Dr Shahid Badr Falahi had in a recent interview said that there is a witch hunt against the organisation and the government was only preparing a case to continue the ban on the outfit.

Police sources add that they are studying every possible angle to this case. The CCTV footage according to them will be crucial and currently they are tracking three persons outside the Opera House who are found to be talking on a cell phone for an hour at least. The police believe that these men could have something to do with the case and sketches are being prepared of these persons.

Meanwhile the strongholds of both SIMI and the IM are being scanned for more clues. The men who are close to the Bhatkals, Shahnawazs and others have come under the scanner. What the police is trying to find out is whether any of these persons had been in touch with them in the recent past. We are still tracking down some people who we believe could have something to do with this blast, an intelligence bureau official said.

The forensics team which is also at work has found the material in the bomb used to be IEDs. TNT and a mixture of ammonium nitrate. Sources say that the bomb was triggered off by a cell phone and there was fuel too added in the preparation of the bomb. Going by the material and the composition apart from the prepartion of the bomb, it becomes clear that the explosive was prepared by a professional. Moreover the investigators are also looking into the possibility of a person from outside the country preparing the bombs since most of the expert bomb makers of these outfits in India are behind bars and incidents in the recent past have shown that their bomb makers had failed to prepare a proper bomb.
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Re: Serial Blasts in Mumbai

Post by nachiket »

sum wrote:
IIRC, 2 or 3 more hits on Mumbai and breaking points will be reached for their "patience" and "resilience"
That is 2 or 3 too many. The "breaking point" should have already been reached no? Especially after 26/11? Lets see what happens in the next elections. If the present government is voted back in yet again, there is no hope for the city.
The chances of that happening are quite high, despite all the anger being seen currently. The main opposition, the Shiv Sena has shot themselves in the foot repeatedly with their anti-migrant agenda which will hurt their chances more and more as the number of migrants continues to increase.
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Re: Serial Blasts in Mumbai

Post by negi »

The politics of chair will continue to take precedence over the inane matters like security until an IED goes off under one of the politico's musharraf ; however they are protected by the NSG. As far as Mumbai is concerned isn't is supposed to be certain Power's den ? i.e. Dawood's Pita-mah who co-incidentally holds an office in Mr. Integrity's cabinet. :P
Last edited by negi on 16 Jul 2011 02:27, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: Serial Blasts in Mumbai

Post by shiv »

sum wrote: Isnt Chotta Rajan anyways supposed to be a "Sarkari" gangster?
snip>
IIRC, 2 or 3 more hits on Mumbai and breaking points will be reached for their "patience" and "resilience"
I know you did not coin these expressions. I think these expressions "sarkari gangster", "resilience" etc are complete and pointless bullshit that are stated as a rationalization to explain some other nonsense.

Excuse my language - but if I get buggered today and I still manage to have painful crap tomorrow everyone will praise shiv's "resilience". But I can't help it. I must crap. It has nothing to do with resilience. It's a necessity.

And that "sarkari gangster" bit - what a lovely expression. "Sarkari gangsster". it says less about the gangster and more about the sarkar and that is dead true. A bunch of incompetent idiotic nincompoopps have held pawarful positions in Mumbai for too long. It's just that Mumbai as a city was too goddam rich and powerful to go down despite such governmental buffoonery.

I am certain that the police, Mumbai corporation and D company have "split up" areas of Mumbai where they collect hafta from bars and other business estabishments.

Mumbai is paralysed every monsoon from floods. The trains are overcrowded. the defunct mills occupy prime land that no one uses (IIRC), Decrepit building where the idiotic rent laws have prevented the eviction of tenants or raising of rent collapse every year. Where narrower and narrower buildings on the smallest plots get taller and taller each year?

This is a resilient city? What sort of bullshit statement is that? Its an overcrowded badly run city run by criminals where honest and proud simple citizens try and eke out an existence. It's just that the rich are so rich that they bulldoze the influence needed to keep their parts of the city running. The rest of the Mumbaikars are focked up. No one wants to say it loud. And that focked up Mumbai is getting hit time an time and time again.
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Re: Serial Blasts in Mumbai

Post by nachiket »

^^Very true words Shiv saar.
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Re: Serial Blasts in Mumbai

Post by brihaspati »

Shiv ji,
in all the other metros you pointed out, the community networks are almost disjoint from inter-community connections. Moreover there are distinct tendencies of ghettoization. Except the de-communitized mohallas - like sex-worker concentrations - the localities are very nearly clearly demarcated. In the other cities you mention- "minority" [city specific] areas are well surrounded by "majorities" and the threat of annihilation keep either party within limits. But there is little real penetration of Intel into Islamic areas. The peace is bought by a tacit political brokerage between the two sides.

My impression of Mumbai - last almost 6 years ago - but it might have drastically changed - is that there is a great degree of overlap and non-empty intersection geographically, business interest wise, and just sheer daily grind and sustenance. But the community is highly resistant and suspicious of "outside" probes, and they have very good counter surveillance measures. I know this from personal interaction.

The fact of the matter is that those who try to "cross" the border usually carry an ideological baggage if they are coming from the non-community side. Funnily - it is the left-liberal who carry even more baggage than the supposedly fanatical volatile right winger. Whichever intel from the non-community origin tries to penetrate are usually almost always blown cover within a few days if not a few hours - since they are mostly educated and trained in the p-sec hubris without any real appreciation or coverage of the theo-cultural system. As for community origin intel they are always under immense moral and psychological pressure, and would be ineffective for all practical purposes.
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Re: Serial Blasts in Mumbai

Post by sum »

That is 2 or 3 too many. The "breaking point" should have already been reached no?
Yes, true...but, the breaking point for dhimmitude of our DDM seems to be fast approaching.
...... No one wants to say it loud. And that focked up Mumbai is getting hit time an time and time again.
Well, tough to argue with any of the points mentioned!! :oops:

On the point of pawarful people, ex-IPS guy, Y.P.Singh was on TV today and was mentioning about how the entire police is at mercy of Pawar( since NCP is in full charge of the police) and any order has to be approved by Pawar with the CM being only a rubber-stamp like the preqz of India ( his exact words).

So in Mumbai, the D-gang and police are actually reporting to the same set of bosses!!! :eek:
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Re: Serial Blasts in Mumbai

Post by nachiket »

Bji, how do you explain the security forces in J&K geting accurate intel on terrorists hiding amongst civilians ever so often? They are dealing with a larger and far more hostile community where the pigs can hide in than in mumbai aren't they? With homegrown plus paki jehadis against them. The only conclusion can be that the intel can be gathered and acted upon if there is the will. Unfortunately, thanks to political interference in police affairs we are not able to do that in Mumbai. Or any other place for that matter.
Remember, we don't know where the attacks were planned yet. We don't know if the bombers were from Mumbai even. They could have been from anywhere in India or outside it.
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Re: Serial Blasts in Mumbai

Post by brihaspati »

can BRF create a spatial analysis thread for using geo-spatial analytical techniques -starting with Mumbai- the membership of which should be entirely at the discretion of the mods? [Also needing separate passwded login and not open]. A lot of details can be filled on map coordinates by those in touch with local pulse. Coordinate with data info should also suffice, and can be overlaid on regular open source map data. But the pattern analysis may help.
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Re: Serial Blasts in Mumbai

Post by brihaspati »

nachiket wrote:Bji, how do you explain the security forces in J&K geting accurate intel on terrorists hiding amongst civilians ever so often? They are dealing with a larger and far more hostile community where the pigs can hide in than in mumbai aren't they? With homegrown plus paki jehadis against them. The only conclusion can be that the intel can be gathered and acted upon if there is the will. Unfortunately, thanks to political interference in police affairs we are not able to do that in Mumbai. Or any other place for that matter.
Remember, we don't know where the attacks were planned yet. We don't know if the bombers were from Mumbai even. They could have been from anywhere in India or outside it.
That valley community has crossed the "pre-Partition" mentality to post-cleared-everyone-else-out stage. They do not have external communities as the devil to focus on. In this case all Islamic societies turn inwards into factional fights. The breaks come out of a combination of those factional infightings and rashtryia "pressure". But in spite of those breaks, you can see that the overall targets of separatists have not been derailed - and they are on the point of success much closer to their underlying aims than ever before. We have "aantels" clamouring for "political solution" in their favour or givinbg concessions to them.
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Re: Serial Blasts in Mumbai

Post by gakakkad »

Their is something I would like to say about the journo murder. Why would the underworld want to slay a journalist ? Tons of stuff is written about Dawood et al everyday. When would they murder some journalist ? How would the dons be affected if more info about them is published in the news paper ? The Mafia killed him to help someone . Some "honorable" man of the public whose relation with underworld was about to be exposed by the martyr journalist. My dad had a hospital in bombay over a decade ago. An year or so after the stock exchange blast he had a patient who had to be taken for free as it was "ordered" by some cop. A month after that incident the my dad saw the patient's photo in the local paper that described him as an absconder. He was a henchman for the D-company . He was "believed" to have been fled to Dubai. And the investigating officer was the same cop who referred him to my dad for treatment. Those days were before private news channel's had come into existence. Dad (thankfully) never heard from them again. There were a few other incidences he knows of. But I cannot mention them here.
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Re: Serial Blasts in Mumbai

Post by Atri »

Prithviraj chauhan says, it is bad decision to let home minstry of MH remain in hands of NCP... :P :D

how much more can he say..
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Re: Serial Blasts in Mumbai

Post by Virupaksha »

Atri wrote:Prithviraj chauhan says, it is bad decision to let home minstry of MH remain in hands of NCP... :P :D

how much more can he say..
So as usual with the divine maxim from Madam Ji Sonia huzur, "All power is mine, all responsibility is others."
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Re: Serial Blasts in Mumbai

Post by nachiket »

^^Sorry for nitpicking but its Prithviraj Chavan not Chauhan.
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Re: Serial Blasts in Mumbai

Post by RajeshG »

brihaspati wrote:can BRF create a spatial analysis thread for using geo-spatial analytical techniques -starting with Mumbai- the membership of which should be entirely at the discretion of the mods? [Also needing separate passwded login and not open]. A lot of details can be filled on map coordinates by those in touch with local pulse. Coordinate with data info should also suffice, and can be overlaid on regular open source map data. But the pattern analysis may help.
Not sure if this has been posted before.

http://www.ushahidi.com/
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Re: Serial Blasts in Mumbai

Post by CRamS »

Guys,

Tubelight moment struck me: -). I think this was a revenge attack by TSP in response to India welcoming US holding back aid to TSP. Basically telling India, US aid or no, we can kick your ass anytime of our choosing and show you to be a bunch of "emerging superpower" spineless cowards. Bring on your cold or hot start.
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Re: Serial Blasts in Mumbai

Post by brihaspati »

RajeshG wrote:
brihaspati wrote:can BRF create a spatial analysis thread for using geo-spatial analytical techniques -starting with Mumbai- the membership of which should be entirely at the discretion of the mods? [Also needing separate passwded login and not open]. A lot of details can be filled on map coordinates by those in touch with local pulse. Coordinate with data info should also suffice, and can be overlaid on regular open source map data. But the pattern analysis may help.
Not sure if this has been posted before.

http://www.ushahidi.com/
Thanks for the link! I had something similar in mind amenable to computational processing. But we would not like the conclusions or even the visualization to be generally available. I am assuming that even the agencies would have moles. But we can carefully misrepresent our conclusions in the public threads [in this regard even GDF is public] to drive scents in appropriate directions - so that needs a kind of centralized access and control over the flow of info. This is something some of us can help in contributing to.
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Re: Serial Blasts in Mumbai

Post by brihaspati »

nachiket wrote:^^Sorry for nitpicking but its Prithviraj Chavan not Chauhan.
Same root according to one source.
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Re: Serial Blasts in Mumbai

Post by Tanaji »

Moreover, the sheer stubbornness of Manmohan Singh in engaging Pakistan despite Pakistan's unwillingness to do more on the evidence of 26/11 - the botched list of the most wanted 50 individuals notwithstanding - and also the rehabilitation of politicians like Vilasrao Deshmukh and R R Patil have shown that while India might not be willing, Singh is certainly willing to forgive and forget.[/b]
This is so true.. I remember debating with Parampoojya Somnathji at the time of 26/11, and he had uvacha-ed that there is more accountability in civilian side and the military never punished anyone. Well here we are, *all* politicians are back in their seats, meanwhile the commanders under whose watch Kargil have had their careers for all purposes terminated...

Oh well...
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Re: Serial Blasts in Mumbai

Post by ramana »

But the public janata jarandhan re -elected them and thus have to rehabilitate them. To do otherwise is against sprit of democracy!
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Re: Serial Blasts in Mumbai

Post by Anujan »

CRamS wrote:Guys,

Tubelight moment struck me: -). I think this was a revenge attack by TSP in response to India welcoming US holding back aid to TSP. Basically telling India, US aid or no, we can kick your ass anytime of our choosing and show you to be a bunch of "emerging superpower" spineless cowards. Bring on your cold or hot start.
I dont think that the planning / Logistics etc all can be coordinated in such short notice. They could not have been ready waiting for an opportune moment either (basically if you procure materials and assemble the bums, there is far greater danger of being caught with incriminating materials and the entire thing unraveling).

I think that this is an attack to show the faithfool in TFTA army that the Pak army can still carry out missions against India. In a sense, rescuing H&D after mehran attack.
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Re: Serial Blasts in Mumbai

Post by nachiket »

ramana wrote:But the public janata jarandhan re -elected them and thus have to rehabilitate them. To do otherwise is against sprit of democracy!
I really wonder what our people think of when they decide who to vote for. Our national security issues have been greatly exacerbated because of repeatedly voting in the wrong people. But nothing, not even a threat to their lives seems to change people's minds. The situation can't get more hopeless than this. I hope.

Sometimes I actually start wondering if what Rahul Mehta ji used to say about EVMs is true.
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Re: Serial Blasts in Mumbai

Post by deepan gill »

[/quote]This is a resilient city? What sort of bullshit statement is that? Its an overcrowded badly run city run by criminals where honest and proud simple citizens try and eke out an existence. It's just that the rich are so rich that they bulldoze the influence needed to keep their parts of the city running. The rest of the Mumbaikars are focked up. No one wants to say it loud. And that focked up Mumbai is getting hit time an time and time again.[/quote]


Bravo. Finally the truth.
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Re: Serial Blasts in Mumbai

Post by deepan gill »

Lalmohan wrote:lets assume that the BRF hypothesis of ISI's traces will be hard to find on this one is true. What shape will the ongoing investigation take?
You will see NIA implicate some unkown Hindu organization as behind the attacks. After watching the fiasco on Prince Gandhi and Digvijya trying their best to show some type of holocaust being conducted by BSP in UP, I am now convinced that Congress has a very dangerous agenda. They are now totally convinced that majority community is divided and in shambles, they have no political power and they cannot stop Congress. India is being led towards social fragmentation.

Case in point:

Indian Mujhadeen: does it exist? If IM is terrorist org then what is Hurriyat?

Hindu Terrorism: does it exist? Again creation of Congress, and where is the judiciary on this one?? :?:
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Re: Serial Blasts in Mumbai

Post by ramana »

Deepan, How are you? Welcome back.

Meanwhile NVS writes:

http://www.newsinsight.net/archivedebat ... recno=2169
Why 13/7
Pakistani terrorism against India has entered a new phase, says N.V.Subramanian.

15 July 2011: Wednesday's Bombay terror attack is connected in a complicated way to the US military-aid suspension to Pakistan and to other Af-Pak developments. The nature of the 13-July strike also suggests that Pakistani terrorism against India has settled, for the moment, to a type which will provoke horror but not a war between the two countries, while relentlessly sapping Indian growth energies.

It is the classic case of a death inflicted by a thousand cuts.

A Lashkar-e-Toiba (LeT) hand is also indicated in the attack, but by indirect way of an instigation of its Indian assets. Analysis strongly suggests too that the Pakistan army/ ISI gave consent to the LeT for the terror strike, but with adequate deniability built into it.

Indeed, there is robust possibility that the LeT suggested the attack to the Pakistan army/ ISI terror establishment, not oppositely, as has been the case thus far. If that is so, the Lashkar-e-Toiba should have emerged enormously powerful to influence the Pakistan army/ ISI to support its terror strategy against India. :mrgreen:

The tail, in other words, may be wagging the dog.

In terms of pure will, the Pakistan military is at its weakest today. It was as infirm after the Bangladesh War defeat. It is also unprecedentedly divided. The killing of Osama Bin Laden in a US military raid, the Al-Qaeda attack on the Mehran base that destroyed two naval Orions, and the $800 million US military-aid suspension to Pakistan have left its armed forces shattered.

Pakistan's plans to gain strategic depth in Afghanistan against India with the assistance of the Al-Qaeda and Taliban forces also lie in tatters. Without US aid, Pakistan will race faster towards collapse. If it accepts US aid again, it will have to go against the Al-Qaeda and Taliban.

{i]{So TSP is on Liquid Oxygen to paraphrase Ajit}[/i]

On that course, it further stokes Pakistani anti-Americanism, and alienates even more the jehadized middle and lower bulk of the military, which could result in a coup. One putsch was reported being narrowly prevented days ago with the arrest of a jihadi brigadier and two other officers.

In the short-term, nevertheless, the Pakistan military may have to accept US dictates. It may hope that once president Barack Obama is reelected, he will be able to stave off US Congressional pressure to punish and tame Pakistan for terrorism. But that is chancy. The US presidential election is still a year-and-a-half away. And there is no guarantee that Obama will return, or that he will oblige Pakistan. :rotfl:

And imagining a glorious future does not make the present any better for Pakistan with the suspension of US military aid.

So this writer believes Pakistan is being forced to make changes (or reorder priorities) in its state policy of terror. That policy of terror was directed both against Afghanistan and India. Now, to get US aid again, it will suspend terror directed against Afghanistan.

That would entail that the Pakistan army hunts for the Al-Qaeda and Taliban leaderships in FATA and Quetta. On the surface, and for American consumption, it may. But it is very likely that before launching military operations, it will warn the FATA and Quetta foreign terrorist groups to evacuate to Afghanistan or to wherever else in the world they fancy getting protection.

But to prevent a backlash within the jehadized military from even nominal anti-Al-Qaeda/ Taliban operations, Pakistan's brass would pledge sustained terrorism against India, but not of a scale to provoke war. Reflexively, you would credit the Pakistan army with such deviousness. But it could as well be the Lashkar leadership's counsel, articulated by, perhaps, none other than the terror chief and 26/11 mastermind, Hafiz Mohammed Sayeed.

This writer is inclined to the position that it may be the LeT's counsel. After the Bin Laden killing, the Mehran shocker and the US aid stoppage, the Pakistan military is too battered and internally torn to be able to think straight. The LeT in all probability initiated the 13 July attack plan and the Pakistan military/ ISI solely ensured they were not implicated in it nor an Indo-Pak war ignited in consequence.

{THisbegs teh question if so why is the GOI hell bent on denying any TSP hand init. In other words they are signalling the TSPA "Bhains, muhe maar!" Come hit me I am cattle!}

If you follow the logic of this analysis, then it means that the scale of attack would be moderate to low, but magnified manyfold by the fact of being put into effect in Bombay. Three bomb blasts killing about twenty people is terrorism. Terrorism cannot be sized. But there was no pressure on the LeT to trigger eight explosions to murder two hundred persons or to show involvement in the Wednesday attack as in 26/11.

Any of LeT's Indian assets adequately could have been charged to carry out the attack.

In this line of LeT/ Pakistan military/ ISI terrorist thinking, however, the attacks against India must not be allowed to exceed a threshold whence restraints against war cannot be exercised. This terrorism-without-war plan should be a provisional tactic until Pakistan manages resumption of US aid, and America leaves Afghanistan.

Once those hurdles are crossed, and Pakistan manages to gain strategic depth in Afghanistan, full-scale terrorism against India will resume. The primary target will be Bombay because of its commercial importance to India. Destroying India's growth drive is the principal reason to attack Bombay. But Bombay also has a huge nuclear establishment. The implications should be clear.

The so-far-unsolved Wednesday terror attack and past strikes in Poona, Delhi, Bangalore, Varanasi and elsewhere suggest them as test runs to something bigger and horrific. But it may come in the post-US Afghan withdrawal phase, when Pakistan will be raging to fight "the war to end all wars" with India.

Given all this, it is critical that the government understands the resonant implications of the Wednesday attack. It cannot be downplayed. It certainly cannot be business-as-usual. P.Chidambaram says there was no alert of the attack. That is not the way to pre-empt attacks. Unless you actively and intuitively hunt for alerts, they will elude you. Attacks have to be anticipated and stopped. :mrgreen:

In a commentary on Monday, 11 July ("Between a rock..."), this writer had forecast a strike on India in view of the game-changing nature of the US military-aid cut to Pakistan. With vaster resources, how could the government fail? :((

All terrorism against India emanates from Pakistan. Any crisis that hurtles Pakistan towards failure and extinction (the aid suspension is one instance) will ipso facto provoke terrorism against India. On such signals (and others) must India found a proactive counter-terrorism intelligence strategy. If it had been in place, Wednesday's terrorism could have been prevented and lives saved.
brihaspati
BRF Oldie
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Joined: 19 Nov 2008 03:25

Re: Serial Blasts in Mumbai

Post by brihaspati »

deepan gill wrote:
Lalmohan wrote:lets assume that the BRF hypothesis of ISI's traces will be hard to find on this one is true. What shape will the ongoing investigation take?
You will see NIA implicate some unkown Hindu organization as behind the attacks. After watching the fiasco on Prince Gandhi and Digvijya trying their best to show some type of holocaust being conducted by BSP in UP, I am now convinced that Congress has a very dangerous agenda. They are now totally convinced that majority community is divided and in shambles, they have no political power and they cannot stop Congress. India is being led towards social fragmentation.

Case in point:

Indian Mujhadeen: does it exist? If IM is terrorist org then what is Hurriyat?

Hindu Terrorism: does it exist? Again creation of Congress, and where is the judiciary on this one?? :?:
About IM+Hurriyat - it comes out of rapacious mining and capitalist-imperialist dances as revolutionary reaction. About the other - that happens out of thin air - like shaymbhu - and is part of rapacious mining and capitalist-imperialist penetration of the Indian subcontinent. Give it a judicial format by repeating it for 30 pages.
brihaspati
BRF Oldie
Posts: 12410
Joined: 19 Nov 2008 03:25

Re: Serial Blasts in Mumbai

Post by brihaspati »

deepan gill wrote:
Lalmohan wrote:lets assume that the BRF hypothesis of ISI's traces will be hard to find on this one is true. What shape will the ongoing investigation take?
You will see NIA implicate some unkown Hindu organization as behind the attacks. After watching the fiasco on Prince Gandhi and Digvijya trying their best to show some type of holocaust being conducted by BSP in UP, I am now convinced that Congress has a very dangerous agenda. They are now totally convinced that majority community is divided and in shambles, they have no political power and they cannot stop Congress. India is being led towards social fragmentation.

Case in point:

Indian Mujhadeen: does it exist? If IM is terrorist org then what is Hurriyat?

Hindu Terrorism: does it exist? Again creation of Congress, and where is the judiciary on this one?? :?:
On the contrary they would not further fragment if the risk increases of those fractions getting out of control. The more you divide - up to a certain stage disunity helps in control. but beyond that it comes back to haunt and destroy the initiator of division. The Congress could actually be scared that it is losing control over this division process. The curious statements all add up - (1) raising the bogey of "fascism" of the "saffron type" and deliberately pushing the fascism of the redmullah types as harmless in comparison (2) if "tribals" get arms they will turn against the "state" (3) try to safeguard Pak establishment as well as any domestic connection and pin it on the ephemeral ISI with whom however there will be no engagement - violent or peaceful. Each of these are an attempt to make virtue out of necessity - and cover up the helplessness of the Congress regime and its beginning panic at losing control - bound up in its own political deception of the Indian people.
ramana
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Re: Serial Blasts in Mumbai

Post by ramana »

Chandigarh Tribune reports:
Bombers’ local contacts on radar
n Bombs may have been assembled locally, says police
n email surfaces, experts probe cross-border links, underworld angle
n Scooter used in Zaveri Bazar blast identified
Shiv Kumar/Ajay Banerjee
Tribune News Service

Mumbai/New Delhi, July 15
Investigators probing Mumbai serial blasts are looking for bombers’ local accomplices, who might have provided them extensive logistical support, including premises to assemble the explosive devices.

Security agencies have also identified the owner of the two-wheeler in which the explosive material was planted at Zaveri Bazar. The cyber experts are looking into an email, which may have some cross-border links.

The police say the devices built using ammonium nitrate, fuel oil, ball bearings and metal bits were wired with timers would have been assembled at a single location and transported to the target sites. The areas of Dadar, Opera House and Zaveri Bazar are within a 14-km radius and the devices may have been put together somewhere nearby, says the police.

Investigators are also looking for clues at places like Mumbra which is on the outskirts of Mumbai. Lashkar-e-Toiba operatives have been arrested from the area in the past. A number of places have been raided in Mumbra.

“There would have been at least four to five people who would have put together the bombs with at least one person each transporting the devices to the spot where they went off,” said a police officer at one of the blast sites.

The police also claimed to have obtained important clues from the footage obtained from CCTVs installed at Zaveri Bazaar and Opera House.

The Maharashtra ATS and the Mumbai Crime Branch have questioned a number of people, including two arrested Indian Mujahideen (IM) operatives, and those having links with underworld gangs and other anti-social elements.

Investigators are looking at the underworld link. “We are investigating the underworld link to the blast,” sources said. However, they did not specify which underworld gang was under the scanner. Based on the investigation so far, the probe agencies are suspecting the possibility of the underworld providing assistance to the masterminds of the blasts in conducting reccee, procuring explosives and other devices.

The investigators are closely tracking the movement of few underworld figures.

While sifting through the Opera House video footage, investigators have reportedly spotted three to four persons talking on their cell phones. They were seen standing at the same spot for a long duration. The efforts are on to identify them, said authorities.

All mobile numbers which were active in the area of the blasts on July 13 are under surveillance. Officials of the ATS and the Crime Branch have also activated their human intelligence network and are seeking maximum help from their informers across the state.

“We have a reason to believe that the terror suspects may not have used that much technology to execute the blasts. So we are depending on inputs from our informers,” said an official.

CM Prithviraj Chavan said 12 task groups have been formed to probe the terror attacks. In New Delhi, Union Home Secretary RK Singh said the probe agencies have identified the scooter in which one of the bombs was planted.

Several people are being questioned based on their “previous known linkages”.

Asked whether there was any cross-border link to blasts, the Home Secretary said: “We have an email which originated elsewhere. It is being followed up”. RK Singh said the CCTV footages of the three blast sites were being scrutinised by the investigators and they were going through the 11 CDs made from the footages. Asked whether the investigators were working on any definite lead, the Home Secretary said: “We have not yet zeroed in on.” Meanwhile, an ATS raided the house of a suspected SIMI activist in Ranchi. The team left town the same day when the man could not be located. The suspected SIMI activist was identified as Manjar Imam. The ATS had last year interrogated him in connection with the Coimbatore blast case in Kerala, officials said.

(With PTI inputs)


Suicide attack theory bombs

Mumbai: The authorities have ruled out the possibility of suicide bombers carrying out Wednesday's deadly attacks in Mumbai following the identification of a man, whose severed head was recovered from the blast site in Zaveri Bazar. The man has been identified as Kishan Shivcharan Mandal (35), a migrant labourer from Orissa. —TNS

Congress core group to meet

New Delhi: The Congress core group will meet to discuss the security situation in the country in the aftermath of the Mumbai blasts and other current political issues, party sources said. A top team of the party, including Congress president Sonia Gandhi and Prime Minister Manmohan Singh, will meet to assess the “security situation in the country. — IANS
Pretty good summary of the events so far.

Zhaveri Bazar case.
Looks like the poor man was too close to the bomb to have such damage.
RIP.
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