India-US Strategic News and Discussion

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Philip
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Re: India-US Strategic News and Discussion

Postby Philip » 01 Sep 2011 17:06

America Today.These are the kind of lunatics who are determining US policies at home and abroad.Has any MEA team done a serious study on the undercurrents in US society and their "strategic implications" for India? Are we to open our doors to these lunatics to invade and estroy our ancient culture and wisdom?

Gawker vs Fox News: the media battle that divides America
Investigation into TV presenter's private life is latest episode in bitter rivalry

XCpt:
By Guy Adams
Thursday, 1 September 2011

One is a "malevolent" right-wing news organisation run by "fatuous, fat headed people who tell lies". The other is a "lousy" gossip website run by "miserable" 20-somethings who churn out "wall to wall snark" for their dwindling band of left-leaning readers. One employs propagandists who use power, influence, and money to engage in "potentially corrupt" relationships with the police and political class. The other "borders on treason" by eschewing responsible journalistic practices in a relentless pursuit of scoops.

So goes a snowballing war of words between Fox News, the influential cable TV outlet owned by Rupert Murdoch's News Corp, and Gawker, a scurrilous New York-based website devoted to sifting through the dirty laundry of the rich and famous.

Hostilities between the two organisations, which represent polar extremes of the US news media, went into overdrive this week when Gawker published a revelatory investigation into the private life of Bill O'Reilly, the conservative pundit whose evening show is Fox News's most-watched programme.

According to the Gawker article, Mr O'Reilly recently persuaded high-level contacts in his local police force to order an investigation into the professional integrity of an unnamed officer. The man in question was alleged to have begun an extra-marital affair with O'Reilly's wife.

The report, based largely on information from a single, unnamed source, suggested that Mr O'Reilly employed private detectives to track the couple. It accused him of offering to donate money to the police department in Nassau County, Long Island, in return for them granting the favour.

Fox News's host, a stern advocate of family values, has yet to respond. Although he has never formally announced a separation or divorce from Maureen, his wife of 15 years, Gawker claims the couple are living apart after Ms O'Reilly bought a house in her own name this year.

The website has published photographs that appear to show Mr O'Reilly neglecting to wear his wedding ring while posing next to a fragrant brunette at a recent black-tie event. It also printed copies of documents showing that Ms O'Reilly was recently removed as a director of his personal charitable foundation.

It's a tangled web, all right. Gawker's claim that Mr O'Reilly attempted to gain special treatment from a police department is particularly awkwardly timed, given ongoing controversy about the relationship between other influential figures in News Corp and the UK police.

Fox News has so far failed to either confirm or deny any specific details of the article, which was published on Tuesday. But a spokesman for the organisation told Adweek yesterday that: "Gawker has been lying about Fox News for several years... we are not going to dignify this with any further comment."

The network has nonetheless been devoting airtime to attacks on Gawker. Only last week, it interrupted coverage of the hurricane with an item claiming the site's traffic had dropped by 75 per cent in the past year. In that report, a Fox pundit blamed the alleged fall on Gawker's staff: "This sweatshop of 20-somethings, who are post-ironic, sitting in all these cubicles, just pounding out the snarkiest things they can think of.... That's the problem: it's just wall to wall snark... as predictable as the end of a Scooby-Doo cartoon." Quite why this should be of interest to Fox's viewers, who on average are in their 60s and largely unaware of the website, was not explained. But Gawker says it was a pre-emptive strike: the attack was aired a short time after the website first contacted Fox seeking comment about Mr O'Reilly.

A couple of weeks ago, Mick Huckabee, the former Republican presidential contender and a member of Fox's stable, fired a further noisy shot across Gawker's bow in a segment alleging that the behaviour of the site "bordered on treason" because of a revelatory piece it had published about the CIA. "Doesn't their name say it all?" he said. "Gawker? What do you think of when you think of Gawker? Do you think, 'Oh that's the person I want to invite to my son's birthday party?'"

To the website, these attacks are in themselves a kind of vindication: the site has for months been taking potshots at Fox, publishing (among other things) a lengthy series of items on the various eccentricities of its power-broking chief, Roger Ailes. John Cook, the Gawker editor behind Tuesday's item on Mr O'Reilly, told The Independent that its publication followed a month-long investigation involving multiple interviews and Freedom of Information requests.

He said: "We laid out the story in detail, over the telephone and via email, to Fox News and the Nassau County Police Department, as well as their internal affairs department. It has not been denied. In fact it is greeted with a wall of silence. I am very satisfied that the story is accurate based on the knowledge of the source and circumstantial evidence."

Mr Cook said he hoped that the publication of the article, which has so far been viewed 250,000 times, would persuade people to come forward with further information about Mr O'Reilly's marriage. And he seemed happy for his site's attacks on Fox News to be described as a vendetta. "They are a malevolent organisation and any time the truth about them can be expressed, that's a good thing. We like stories about fatuous, fat-headed people who tell lies. And that's what the people at Fox News do."

How the two news groups compare

Gawker

Audience Has 14.3 million unique visitors to its network of websites every month – a healthy number but some way down from its position a year ago, before a controversial redesign that prompted some users to abandon the portal.

Stars John Cook, author of the O'Reilly story, couples investigative reporting with Gawker's trademark snark. The writers are, inevitably, mostly obscure.

Politics Without being primarily focused on politics, it naturally appeals to a liberal, metropolitan audience that skews Democratic. Most of the targets of its political coverage are on the right.

Fox News

Audience Bill O'Reilly's show is the top-rated show on US cable television, with about 2.8 million viewers tuning in for every episode. His channel reached 87.4 million viewers in August, and regularly tops the cable news ratings.

Stars Only Sean Hannity, a fellow right-wing ideologue, can compete with Bill O'Reilly's following, now that Glenn Beck has left the network.

Politics Although O'Reilly's show defines itself as "fair and balanced", its coverage is unabashedly targeted at a rightwing audience in the so-called "heartland" of the US.


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Re: India-US Strategic News and Discussion

Postby ranjbe » 01 Sep 2011 19:18

April Fool's Day cable from US Ambassador to India sent to Foggy Bottom in 2008, and leaked in WikiLeaks:
The U.S. ambassador to New Delhi informed Indian Foreign Secretary Shivshankar Menon "that he will go on a hunger strike until the UPA government submits the IAEA safeguards agreement to the Board of Governor," according to a 2008 cable. In a separate meeting, the U.S. envoy noted "that the alignment of Jupiter and Saturn in April would prevail on the Board to look more favorably on the [nuclear] agreement."

The cable continues in that vein for almost 1,000 words, discussing planetary alignments' effects on Indian politics and requesting $250 million to rotate the U.S. chancery 90 degrees, in order to provide more sunlight and eliminate shade, "which darkens the U.S. perspective towards India."

Had the U.S. ambassador drunk a spiked mango lassi before sending the cable? Not quite -- the explanation for this new age mumbo-jumbo lies in the cable's date: April 1. "Happy April Fool's Day from Incredible India!" it concludes.



http://www.foreignpolicy.com/articles/2011/08/30/10_more_wikileaks_you_missed

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Re: India-US Strategic News and Discussion

Postby Christopher Sidor » 01 Sep 2011 21:36

^^^^
Say what you have to say about the yanks, cant deny their humor.

:rotfl: :rotfl: :rotfl:




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Re: India-US Strategic News and Discussion

Postby Christopher Sidor » 08 Sep 2011 23:23

Mission Accomplished. Finally -- FP

FP is running this piece which basically says that US task in Af-Pak is over. From the article
Al Qaeda's operatives in Pakistan are currently reeling from drone attacks that have killed a series of top commanders. Their capacity to coordinate attacks on the United States has been decimated. Official estimates place the entire Pakistan contingent at 500 or less; and the number of al Qaeda operatives in Afghanistan is fewer than 100.
....
....
The 2001 resolution targeted only the groups responsible for 9/11, and these are disintegrating before our eyes. (This should be read as Al-queda and not Taliban)


With the killing of Osama (good riddance I say) and economic difficulties at home, this has to be expected. We should not be surprised if we end up seeing a Taliban remnant in Kabul, holding reins of power, courtesy Uncle. After screwing up Af-PAK, firstly by the Iraq adventure and then by not tackling the insurgent safe heavens in NWFP and Baluchistan America sowed the seeds of its own disaster.

This is why we have to question this concept of shared interests or brotherhood of democracy crap. Everywhere we look, we find that our interests just barely overlap. In Afghanistan our main concern was Taliban, america's main concern was Osama and his band of brothers. We gave up the trilateral relationship between Iran-Russia-India as far as Afghanistan in the mistaken belief that america would take care of our interests. We convinced Northern Alliance to disband, when there was no need to do so. Now we are left in a situation where none of our erstwhile relations, i.e. Iran and Russia, want to involve us in their dealings with Afghanistan. Our relation with Iran has gone south. Russia invites and hosts in Tajikistan the four countries of Afghanistan, pakistan, tajikstan and itself. Pakistan successfully keeps us out of international Afghanistan conferences. In spite of being one of the biggest donors and re-constructors of Afghanistan, we are no where in the picture where it matters.

If this is the situation in Afghanistan then imagine what it is like in east Asia. US president openly signs a document which tells china that it has a significant role to play in south Asia and that too in the capital of China. While US Secretary of State is urging us to get involved in east Asian affairs. US wants us to have a trilateral dialogue US-Japan-India. As a first step to include us in the future Taiwan flare up. If Taiwan's goes under to China, which it eventually will, I do not see any Indian interests getting harmed.

Whose interests are we upholding in Middle East, Afghanistan, East Asia and the wider world? Ours? Or just as we have outsourced solving our Pakistani-terrorism problem to US, we sacrifice the rest of our foreign relationships on the altar or Indo-US strategic relationship. And does upholding our interests mean getting involved in matters which are not of our concern, i.e Taiwan, and get ignored in matters which matter to us immensely, i.e. Afghanistan.

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Re: India-US Strategic News and Discussion

Postby RajeshA » 08 Sep 2011 23:46

Christopher Sidor wrote:Mission Accomplished. Finally -- FP

As a first step to include us in the future Taiwan flare up. If Taiwan's goes under to China, which it eventually will, I do not see any Indian interests getting harmed.

I do not see it that way.
What Israel does in the West, i.e. balance Islam's anti-Kufr thrust with India, the same role is played by Taiwan in the East. Taiwan balances Han Expansionism with India at the other end. If Israel or Taiwan fall, India would be next - either as a target of Islam or as a target of Chinese Expansionism respectively. Israel is strong, it has nukes. Taiwan too needs to get nukes and missiles.

Taiwan must stand, no matter what!

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Re: India-US Strategic News and Discussion

Postby Cosmo_R » 09 Sep 2011 02:25

RajeshA wrote:
Christopher Sidor wrote:Mission Accomplished. Finally -- FP

As a first step to include us in the future Taiwan flare up. If Taiwan's goes under to China, which it eventually will, I do not see any Indian interests getting harmed.

I do not see it that way.
What Israel does in the West, i.e. balance Islam's anti-Kufr thrust with India, the same role is played by Taiwan in the East. Taiwan balances Han Expansionism with India at the other end. If Israel or Taiwan fall, India would be next - either as a target of Islam or as a target of Chinese Expansionism respectively. Israel is strong, it has nukes. Taiwan too needs to get nukes and missiles.

Taiwan must stand, no matter what!


+1 with one proviso: "Taiwan should stand because they can matter"

We would not need convergence with US if we had/have a competent government. Not too long ago, PRC per capita GDP was below India.

We have a dysfunctional/non-functional government system and frankly there is no assurance that it will get any better.

This is why we are forced into an embrace of the US. We have outsourced whatever Pakistan Policy we had to them, and we will have to align ourselves closely with them in order to get the wink/nod to sell stuff to Vietnam and Taiwan on a plausible deniability basis to counter PRC.

Had we done a China on our economy during the 1980s, we would be South Korea x 20 today with an economy 1 1/2 times the size of PRC. We did not and we are not doing so today.

One example: Indian merchandise exports were ~$30 bn in the most recent month. This is without the power, roads, port infrastructure and labor 'peace'. Think of what it would have been with just 2 out of the 4.

"You dance with what brung ya". We need the US to create our strategic space and that's a tall order.

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Re: India-US Strategic News and Discussion

Postby joshvajohn » 09 Sep 2011 09:23

US jobs plan: Barack Obama outlines key proposals
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-14841746

It is interesting to note that Obama is listening to people. he has also understood the need to do something at this time for his jobless people. This is the right move forward. I wish him all sucess for this. I would also like to know whether it affects Indian workers in anyway. The incentives to the industries in employing Americans is a very good idea.

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Re: India-US Strategic News and Discussion

Postby VinodTK » 11 Sep 2011 00:22

India, US enjoy a natural friendship, says Barack Obama
US President Barack Obama telling New Delhi's new ambassador to Washington that he saw the "US-India strategic partnership as a defining and indispensable collaboration for the 21st Century."

The US President made the remarks when Nirupama Rao, who arrived here earlier this week as India's new envoy, presented her credentials to him at the White House Oval Office on Friday. Obama said, according to the Indian Embassy, that the two countries "enjoy a natural friendship" and that the India-US partnership "has proven to be dynamic and broad and serves to advance peace and prosperity in Asia and the world."

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Re: India-US Strategic News and Discussion

Postby VinodTK » 11 Sep 2011 01:20

Post-9/11, US sought India’s military help for Afghan ops
The demands were fleet support for US military ships in Mumbai and Goa, 'stage-through' facility at Indian Air Force bases for US long range bombers and Indian ground troops in Afghanistan.

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Re: India-US Strategic News and Discussion

Postby Jarita » 11 Sep 2011 07:41

VinodTK wrote:Post-9/11, US sought India’s military help for Afghan ops
The demands were fleet support for US military ships in Mumbai and Goa, 'stage-through' facility at Indian Air Force bases for US long range bombers and Indian ground troops in Afghanistan.




When I read these things it reinforces the belief that the opposing forces within in India have prevented recolonization and the western powers know it which is why they seek polarization.

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Re: India-US Strategic News and Discussion

Postby Prem » 11 Sep 2011 07:50

http://themoderatevoice.com/121936/samu ... ias-cause/
Samuel Stokes: An American Jailed For India’s Cause

At a time when America appears lost, and its leadership continues its reckless bid for global supremacy, it is interesting to recall the story of the only American who participated in India’s freedom struggle and was imprisoned by the British-Indian government. He gave up Western clothes and donned home-spun Khadi dress.A highly impressed Mahatma Gandhi wrote in his Young India: “No Indian is giving such battle to the (British-Indian) Government as Mr. Samuel Evans Stokes Jr. He has veritably become the guide, philosopher and friend of the hill men.” Born into a famous American Quaker family (and son of a Philadelphia millionaire), Samuel Evans Stokes Jr. made India his home when he was only 21. He turned into a political activist. Stokes is also credited with the introduction of “American Delicious variety” of apples in Shimla Hills, which resulted in many significant social and economic changes in the region.
On Stokes’ arrest 17 years after his arrival in India, Mahatma Gandhi wrote: “That he (Stokes) should feel with and, like an Indian, share his sorrows and throw himself into the (freedom) struggle, has proved too much for the (British-Indian) government. To leave him free to criticize the government was intolerable, so his white skin has proved no protection for him…”
Stokes’ portrait adorns the walls of Nehru Memorial Museum and Library at New Delhi (a building where India’s first prime minister Jawaharlal Nehru lived), but few people outside India’s northern State of Himachal Pradesh are aware about the legacy of this great man.
Better known by his Indian name “Satyanand” Stokes, he arrived in India in 1904. Kotgarh in Shimla Hills, overlooking Satluj river, became his new home. It was the last outpost of the British Empire, situated on the Hindustan-Tibet mule track. Rudyard Kipling described the area as “The Mistress of The Hills”, and based one of his stories “Lispeth” on Kotgarh. Stokes soon became the most loved and respected member of this area.
Stokes’ journey to India began on January 9, 1904, when he boarded the old Haverford at Philadelphia, writes his granddaughter, Asha Sharma, in her book An American in Gandhi’s India. “Little did he know this would be a journey of no return. His destination was Subathu, a small town in Shimla Hills, to work in a leper home.“Among the crowds of friends and relatives assembled to bid goodbye to ‘Sam’ were his father, Samuel Evans Stokes, Sr., engineer, holder of numerous patents, successful businessman, pioneer of elevators in America, and founder and proprietor of Stokes and Parish Machines Company in Philadelphia; his mother Florence Spencer Stokes, a devout Christian, devoted mother, an American proud of her heritage and family values: his brother Spencer,20; and sisters Anna, 19; and Florence, 14.”After a short stay in England where he met leading personalities working among leprosy patients in India, Stokes began his India journey aboard “Olympia” in February 1904 and headed towards Shimla Hills. He travelled extensively in Punjab to learn about leprosy work there. Although he himself came as a missionary to spread Christianity, he was soon disillusioned by the work and lifestyle of the missionaries, and differences arose. (See here..) The story of how a “Sahib” Stokes became a “Sadhu” (ascetic mendicant) Stokes is equally fascinating … He grew a beard, wore a saffron choga (a loose cloth) and hemp slippers on his feet. His austere belongings were a blanket, lota, and a degchi to cook food and eat in. Stokes’ family was distraught to get the news of his new life. But more distraught were the Christian missionaries in and around Kotgarh.

Where do I fit into this narrative? My association with Kotgarh began when I was in school. I would visit my aunt in Kotgarh during my school/college summer holidays, providing much relief from the dust and heat of Delhi. My aunt was married into a local Rajput family who were leading apple growers in the area. Her husband, Govind Ram Bhalaik’s two sisters were married to Prem Chand Stokes and Pritam Chand Stokes, sons of Samuel Evans “Satyanand” Stokes. Hence the children of Prem and Pritam, the third-generation Stokes, were my contemporaries and, in a way, my second cousins. These families are highly talented and we used to have spirited discussions, and wonderful pahari food, at their home “Harmony Hall”, named after their ancestral home in America

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Re: India-US Strategic News and Discussion

Postby AnantD » 11 Sep 2011 08:08

by VinodTK
Post-9/11, US sought India’s military help for Afghan ops

The source said the three demands of Admiral Blair were placed before the cabinet committee on security chaired by PM Vajpayee, and attended by then home minister L K Advani, Fernandes, external affairs minister Jaswant Singh, Mishra and military chiefs.
The meeting saw at least two members of the CCS making "vigorous pitch" for accepting the three US demands. "They cited the global war on terror and wanted us to join without any conditions," the source said.

As the debate heated up, Vajpayee said, "Let's listen to our military chiefs" and turned to the three service chiefs. Admiral Kumar as the chairman of Chiefs of Staff Committee took the opportunity to air the views of the three service chiefs and put forth the Force's opposition to US proposals. The counter argument was that US and its allies operations in Afghanistan did not enjoy UN mandate and also India had not declared war on Afghanistan.

The UN Security Council would approve the setting up of the International Security Assistance Force for Afghanistan only on December 20 - almost a month after the NDA-led government debated the US request for military assistance.


Contrast this and watch Mushy's Interview in Pee Pee Cee at 2:13 onwards
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-south-asia-14857454

I think TSP would have been history as we know it and would have been in 4 or 5 states by now, if what Musharraf says is 400% true. I don't think the toilet article above is 100% accurate, I heard that India had offered its airbases for Afghan operations, the UNSC declaration was a 100% given and was only a technicality at that point.

What do we have now, lets see: TSP in total chaos but still intact, accelerating its nuclear weapon build-up, the dragon entering POK and getting rights to minerals and Gwadar port, lining its best ICBM's on India etc. etc.

Flying military mission from India to Afghanistan would have meant war with TSP and Musharraf did the best thing for TSP, knowing Amritraj had promised to bomb them into the stone age otherwise.

Probably Iraq wouldn't have happened if TSP had to be taken on along with Afghanistan. Instead, the lust for revenge by GOTUS couldn't get enough satisfaction in Afghanistan alone, and Saddam provided the satisfaction.

I know that we think India would have been turned into a "chamcha state", but I seriously doubt the logic. Its like saying the US never left India after WWII, which it did even before 1947 came around. The Colonial times ended decades ago, but we still think its possible!

Now we have anyone speaking slightly pro US labelled a Dhimmi etc by the courageous internet Jingos. And mods shutting down the 9/11 thread elsewhere on the forum because the OP didn't start a 26/11 thread and this is revenge against the Khan, Wah! Also money making schemes by US contractors in Eyerak as reason to not discuss 911 here. Then I hear firsthand that TV in India is full of 911, so whats with BRF? Do you realize that friends, enemies and non-jingos also read here and cross link from other forums? Fantastic impressions we leave sometimes. I hope we don't turn dimmy instead of Dhimmi.

On another thread in the Economic forum I read that if India had opened her economy just 10 years earlier we would be ahead of the Panda today. Now we are waiting for China's population to age or something like that so we catch up.

As much as I love India and its civilization, I hate the mentality sometimes. In my native village, we made sure no one succeded and got to leave the village for good. Same thing, but the village now is India.

I need a stiff double peg and a change of interest on the internet.

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Re: India-US Strategic News and Discussion

Postby sourab_c » 11 Sep 2011 08:30

^ Why would any sane person want to drag their country into somebody else's war? India has gained more from the US by saying no than it could ever had by saying yes. India's lack of support made the US realize the importance of a strong partnership with India in South Asia. It was only after 9/11 that George Bush pushed forward the so called Indo-US strategic partnership. After running decades of anti-India foreign policy, you can not suddenly expect it to come around and help you when you need it.

Also, India's participation would have been an internal security nightmare. It would have encouraged a lot more of these IM type terrorist groups and strengthened the separatists' agenda in Kashmir. Since India does not have a strong counter-terrorism mechanism in place, it would have also made India a soft target of additional terrorist attacks sponsored by the Taliban. Sort of like Pakistan is experiencing now. Thank your lucky stars that better sense prevailed in the government.

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Re: India-US Strategic News and Discussion

Postby chetak » 11 Sep 2011 08:37

sourab_c wrote:^ Why would any sane person want to drag their country into somebody else's war? India has gained more from the US by saying no than it could ever had by saying yes. India's lack of support made the US realize the importance of a strong partnership with India in South Asia. It was only after 9/11 that George Bush pushed forward the so called Indo-US strategic partnership. After running decades of anti-India foreign policy, you can not suddenly expect it to come around and help you when you need it.

Also, India's participation would have been an internal security nightmare. It would have encouraged a lot more of these IM type terrorist groups and strengthened the separatists' agenda in Kashmir. Since India does not have a strong counter-terrorism mechanism in place, it would have also made India a soft target of additional terrorist attacks sponsored by the Taliban. Sort of like Pakistan is experiencing now. Thank your lucky stars that better sense prevailed in the government.



The amrekis desperately wanted us in Iraq too.

Thank god that saner voices prevailed and we stayed out.

The amrekis were / are basically looking to substitute somebody else's body bags for their own.

Edited spelling mistake :)
Last edited by chetak on 11 Sep 2011 10:05, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: India-US Strategic News and Discussion

Postby AnantD » 11 Sep 2011 09:50

Sourabh amd Chetak, thanks for your civilized responses, I was expecting a lot worse. Any lenghty response would be OT on the thread so I will summarize. The TSP/Panda threat is only going to get worse, not improve through any miracles or "change of heart" from them. I think we just put off something for a later day where the price to India thru blood and treasure if going to be much heavier, and I pray sincerely that I am wrong and don't live to see the day.


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Re: India-US Strategic News and Discussion

Postby Philip » 12 Sep 2011 11:22

It's not just the 111 airliners that a banrupt Air India ordered,but also the 10 C-17s that the IAF have ordered in indecent haste so that Boeing's C-17 line can stay open.There is a huge scandal to be unearthed in these two unsavoury deals with Boeing,but who will unearth it?

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Re: India-US Strategic News and Discussion

Postby SSridhar » 12 Sep 2011 16:47


The US was aware of diversion of funds by Musharraf to fortify PA against India.
The US Ambassador in Pakistan openly solicited the GotUS for funds for the PA against India.
The US knows of the deep nexus between Headley and the ISI
The US knows the twin Kabul attacks on the Indian embassy were made by the iSI
The US knows that 26/11 was executed by the ISI
The US knows that China supplied nukes and missiles to Pakistan to target India and India only.
The US knows that the Khalistani terrorists were aided by the ISI (The US also abetted in this)
The US knows that the wars on India were initiated by Pakistan
The US knows that Pakistan is helping the Taliban & AQAM attack US & NATO forces in Afghanistan.
The US knows that OBL was in a safehouse under the plain sight of the PA even as Musharraf went on proclaiming he was unaware of his whereabouts.
The US knows that the ISI DG transferred money to Mohammed Atta to execute 9/11 even as he was sitting in Washington watching the drama unfold.
The US knows that the same ISI DG sent to Kandahar to negotiate surrender did the opposite instead.
The US knows that the 1993 Mumbai serial blast was executed by the ISI and even helped in destruction of evidence.
The US knows that the F-16s, AMRAAMs, Frigates, Paveway bombs etc are not at all meant for fighting the jihadis in Afghanistan and yet chose to supply these items under the garb of GWOT.
The US knew from c. 1957 that its military programme for Pakistan was a hoax under an anti-Communist alliance.

And, many more. . .

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Re: India-US Strategic News and Discussion

Postby shyamd » 12 Sep 2011 17:20

Yawwwnnnn.... And the funny thing is all these eminent journo's and "anal-ysts" complain that we are not forging closer partnership with US because of our cold war mentality. They say India missed a historic opportunity with the MRCA deal - never mind the fact that F-18 and F-16 were bottom in performance, possibly compromising national interest.

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Re: India-US Strategic News and Discussion

Postby SSridhar » 12 Sep 2011 17:27

Yawwwnnnn . . . .

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Re: India-US Strategic News and Discussion

Postby RajeshA » 12 Sep 2011 18:14

September 2011 Issue
By Elisabeth Meinecke
Crown Jewel Comeback: Townhall Magazine
Could India be America's next key ally in the War on Terror?
ImageImage
From Townhall Magazine's EXCLUSIVE September feature "Crown Jewel Comeback":

"The current White House has said the United States and India are "natural allies" and their relationship potentially a "defining partnership for the 21st century," considering their compatible values such as democracy and strategic alignment on a number of other issues.

"In fact, the George W. Bush administration's most unheralded foreign policy success was arguably the dramatic upswing in U.S.-Indian ties, opening the door to deeper relations between the world's oldest and biggest democracies.

"Better bonds make a lot of sense for both sides, especially considering people-to-people ties. Not only are there some three million Americans of Indian descent, last year another 650,000 Indians traveled here--an increase of nearly 20 percent over 2009.

....

"Like the United States, India is particularly concerned about the situation in Pakistan. ... In fact, the six-plus decades since Islamabad and New Delhi went their own ways have been interspersed with plenty of violence and conflict."

"New Delhi is also anxious about the future of nearby Afghanistan, just as Washington is." ~ from Peter Brookes in Crown Jewel Comeback..


We ain't nobody's jewel!


Thomas Kolarek
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Re: India-US Strategic News and Discussion

Postby Thomas Kolarek » 13 Sep 2011 09:54

China and US in Central Asia:Role of the SCO and Possibility of Cooperation in Afghanistan
India would be better off facing Pak, then this China-US nexus.

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Re: India-US Strategic News and Discussion

Postby RajeshA » 13 Sep 2011 10:01

Thomas Kolarek wrote:China and US in Central Asia:Role of the SCO and Possibility of Cooperation in Afghanistan
India would be better off facing Pak, then this China-US nexus.

US would cooperate with a country capable of giving it a lifeline where its almost out of oxygen. There are countries which ensure that USA loses its oxygen by puncturing its oxygen tank, often through proxies, and then offering US some of their oxygen, of course at a high cost.

India does not create opportunities! We are content with our domestic issues!

Jai Ho!

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Re: India-US Strategic News and Discussion

Postby abhischekcc » 13 Sep 2011 10:27

What the Anglo Saxons need is several kicks in their jewels. One such kick in the jewel was the rejection of the F16/F18 bids for MMRCA. Another kick in the jewel was refusal to join the US/Japan/Australia axis against China. Another was the refusal for interoperability of Armed forces, etc etc. Some day, the Anglo Saxons will start to understand that the world is not their jewelapple pie. That day will be the first day towards world peace.

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Re: India-US Strategic News and Discussion

Postby RajeshA » 13 Sep 2011 10:35

abhischekcc ji,

that is a strategy of denial, but not necessarily a strategy of creating opportunities.

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Re: India-US Strategic News and Discussion

Postby wong » 13 Sep 2011 15:06

RajeshA wrote:
Christopher Sidor wrote:Mission Accomplished. Finally -- FP

As a first step to include us in the future Taiwan flare up. If Taiwan's goes under to China, which it eventually will, I do not see any Indian interests getting harmed.

I do not see it that way.
What Israel does in the West, i.e. balance Islam's anti-Kufr thrust with India, the same role is played by Taiwan in the East. Taiwan balances Han Expansionism with India at the other end. If Israel or Taiwan fall, India would be next - either as a target of Islam or as a target of Chinese Expansionism respectively. Israel is strong, it has nukes. Taiwan too needs to get nukes and missiles.

Taiwan must stand, no matter what!


LOL. India must be next, because Taiwan is 99.98% Han Chinese.

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Re: India-US Strategic News and Discussion

Postby Lalmohan » 13 Sep 2011 15:09

yes, the locals have been packed off to the hills to work in tourist theme parks

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Re: India-US Strategic News and Discussion

Postby abhischekcc » 13 Sep 2011 15:41

RajeshA wrote:
Christopher Sidor wrote:Mission Accomplished. Finally -- FP

As a first step to include us in the future Taiwan flare up. If Taiwan's goes under to China, which it eventually will, I do not see any Indian interests getting harmed.

I do not see it that way.
What Israel does in the West, i.e. balance Islam's anti-Kufr thrust with India, the same role is played by Taiwan in the East. Taiwan balances Han Expansionism with India at the other end. If Israel or Taiwan fall, India would be next - either as a target of Islam or as a target of Chinese Expansionism respectively. Israel is strong, it has nukes. Taiwan too needs to get nukes and missiles.

Taiwan must stand, no matter what!


Taiwan is not really the kind of buffer that Israel is.

Taiwan can and most probably will capitulate to Chinese business interests, or perhaps both will merge in the future, so they cannot be depended upon to provide a bulwark against Chinese expansionism in the long term.

But Vietnam can fill the role.

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Re: India-US Strategic News and Discussion

Postby Lalmohan » 13 Sep 2011 17:33

if the KMT had won, our issues with china might have been the same as they are now

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Re: India-US Strategic News and Discussion

Postby Kashi » 13 Sep 2011 18:11

wong wrote:LOL. India must be next, because Taiwan is 99.98% Han Chinese.


Most of whom want sod all to do with the PRC (save for few mainlanders associated with KMT and those with business interests in the mainland) let alone think of unification.

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Re: India-US Strategic News and Discussion

Postby Singha » 13 Sep 2011 18:27

china can make a compelling case for peaceful reunification when its per capita income matches taiwan and when it has the kind of freedoms that taiwanese take for granted. before that, its a hard sell.

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Re: India-US Strategic News and Discussion

Postby Pranav » 13 Sep 2011 18:39

abhischekcc wrote:What the Anglo Saxons need is several kicks in their jewels. One such kick in the jewel was the rejection of the F16/F18 bids for MMRCA. Another kick in the jewel was refusal to join the US/Japan/Australia axis against China. Another was the refusal for interoperability of Armed forces, etc etc. Some day, the Anglo Saxons will start to understand that the world is not their jewelapple pie. That day will be the first day towards world peace.


If benefits can accrue by pretending to be a jewel, then why not. The Chinese were able to leverage the US need to counter Russia, and are now on track to become the world's largest economy. However, one does not have confidence that the current leadership is interested in any such hard-headed pro-Indic strategy.

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Re: India-US Strategic News and Discussion

Postby Prem » 13 Sep 2011 23:50

http://www.indianexpress.com/news/nuke- ... er/845891/
Nuke deal with India not handled as well it should have been: US lawmaker
Nuclear agreement that we have reached, there was a whole lot of criticism on that; lost in that was the importance of what I just said about the relationship with India. This was a positive way to work with them, to show some progress,” said Congressman Adam Smith, ranking member of House Armed Services Committee.
“I don't think we handled that as well as we should. I think we have to do a better job of maintaining and building up a stronger relationship with India. “They're going to be an incredibly powerful regional and global player for a long time to come,” Smith said in response to a question after his address on 'US Commitment to Asia' hosted by the Centre for Strategic and International Studies (CSIS), a Washington-based think tank.
They haven't been regional -- global, at this point; I mean, China is everywhere -- Latin America, Africa. You know, India, while they have grown significantly economically, they've kept it more internal,” he said


( While Hyde is gone, Jackals are still at large)

ramana
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Re: India-US Strategic News and Discussion

Postby ramana » 13 Sep 2011 23:52

Good pun.

Prem
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Re: India-US Strategic News and Discussion

Postby Prem » 14 Sep 2011 00:13

They talked about both symbolism and substance being important part of Yindoo Psyche yet they could not resist rubbing Indian nose on every possible oppertunity while Hyding the internal process. Now the realization of trail getting cold while Chinese and others are blowing hot and French and Russians laughing all the way to the Bank. He is right, the handling of the deal was poor in taste.

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Re: India-US Strategic News and Discussion

Postby devesh » 14 Sep 2011 17:31

once again we are back on topic of how far to go under US umbrella. let us think from their perspective. how far will they let us without us capitulating to some their demands like interoperability, etc. IMVHO, inter-operability is the first step on the slippery slope where eventually they have military bases on Indian soil. once that happens, it's the colonial scramble between France and Britain all over again (the 18th and early 19th century struggle between Fr and Br in India).


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