Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan (TSP): Aug 05, 2011

SSridhar · Post by **SSridhar** » 12 Sep 2011 10:25

The Terrorist State of Pakistan vows to eliminate terrorism

TSP places Ad in WSJ on 9/11

"Which country can do more for your peace," asks the advertisement in the Wall Street Journal. "Since 2001, a nation of 180 million has been fighting for the future of the world's 7 billion."

Mash'a Allah

Arjun · Post by **Arjun** » 12 Sep 2011 11:10

Math's answer to Terror

Game theory answer to the LeT problem

skumar · Post by **skumar** » 12 Sep 2011 12:04

parsuram wrote: Well, SKumar, I really do not know how familiar you are with the various Niti and Artha Shastras, but I am afraid I have to shatter some of your illusions in these matters.
<snip>
“Enemies that seek to destroy us should be killed. That is what those well versed in state craft will approve and praise”.

“No matter how great a warrior (parakrami) the individual enemy, seeing him in peril, you should destroy (nasht) him”.

“He has come seeking shelter from me - should not be a consideration in destroying your enemy. Only his destruction will free your land of fear”.

“Concentrate on destroying your enemies, and kill all their supporters and helpers(sahayak aur sambandh rakhne wale sabhi log)”.

“Those (enemies) whome you wish to kill quickly, burn them in their home”.

“Places of commerce, public gathering places, places where (alcoholic) drinks are consumed, public cross roads, public wells, woods, hills, and any place where crowds gather is where you keep your agents for secretly gathering information”
<snip>
recall the burning of Lanka in the Ramayana, and consider that thousands of innocents died in that so just a war
<snip>

Parsuram,

let your army be glorious, not the evil-doer. Rig Veda 1-39:2
With my limited knowledge of "nitis and shastras" (not sure about your reference to the artha shastra), let me try to defend what I meant.
None of what you quote justifies the killing of innocents. They justify the killing of the enemy and there is no debate on that. The only point in what you mention that comes close is
"Those (enemies) whom you wish to kill quickly, burn them in their home".
I would interpret that as follows - if you can kill your enemy in different ways, then it is better / easier to kill them in their homes - again it does not talk about killing of innocents. The Rig Veda laid down the right conduct of war and it should overrule any nitis / commentaries.

Your reference to Hanuman and his burning of Lanka is also misplaced. Hanuman is the messenger and Ravana orders Hanuman's tail to be burnt since he could not kill the messenger. Hanuman burns parts of Lanka down while escaping. To cite this in defense of killing of enemy non-combatants is indefensible.

It might come down to whether it is possible to fight a moral war in these times. The counter to that may be - is there any alternative to fighting a moral war in these self-righteous times?

joygoswami · Post by **joygoswami** » 12 Sep 2011 12:21

I am not sure if this is the right thread to post this. Please remove if necessary. The Video,posted yesterday ,allegedly shows Kashmiri Leader Yasin Malik.

** Deleted **

sum · Post by **sum** » 12 Sep 2011 13:23

Pak woman officer to become first 3-star general

Shahida Badshah, a top officer in the Pakistan Army [ Images ], is in the running to become the country's first woman three-star general later this year.
Click here!

Badshah is the senior-most of the army's two-star generals and is currently posted at the Army Medical College. She is expected to be promoted when five lieutenant generals retire in October, The News daily reported on Monday.

Surgeon General Lt Gen Rehan Burney and four other three-star generals are due to retire in October. Badshah may be elevated to replace Burney, sources said. "The process has already started to promote at least five major generals to the next rank of lieutenant general," a military source said. Of the other two-star generals, National Logistics Cell chief Maj Gen Junaid Rehmat tops the seniority list.

The other three-star generals set to retire are Southern Command chief Lt Gen Javed Zia, Pakistan Ordnance Factories chairman Lt Gen Shujaat Zamir Dar, Lt Gen Mohsin Kamal, military secretary in the general headquarters, and Army Strategic Force chief Lt Gen Jamil Haider.

Pakistan is the only Islamic country to have women major generals.

AoA.... Enlightened moderation onlee.

Lalmohan · Post by **Lalmohan** » 12 Sep 2011 13:44

^^^ surely the women in charge of gadaffi's amazons had higher rank than that?!

menon s · Post by **menon s** » 12 Sep 2011 14:33

Revelation on The New Yorker, Posted on Sep 11.

And then Shahzad changed the subject. What he really wanted to talk about was his own safety. “Look, I’m in danger,” he said. “I’ve got to get out of Pakistan.” He added that he had a wife and three kids, and they weren’t safe, either. He’d been to London recently, and someone there had promised to help him move to England.
The trouble, he said, had begun on March 25th, the day that he published the story about bin Laden’s being on the move. The next morning, he got a phone call from an officer at the I.S.I., summoning him to the agency’s headquarters, in Aabpara, a neighborhood in eastern Islamabad. When Shahzad showed up, he was met by three I.S.I. officers. The lead man, he said, was a naval officer, Rear Admiral Adnan Nazir, who serves as the head of the I.S.I.’s media division.
“They were very polite,” Shahzad told me. He glanced over his shoulder. “They don’t shout, they don’t threaten you. This is the way they operate. But they were very angry with me.” The I.S.I. officers asked him to write a second story, retracting the first. He refused.
And then Admiral Nazir made a remark so bizarre that Shahzad said he had thought about it every day since.
“We want the world to believe that Osama is dead,” Nazir said.
Bin Laden was still alive, his whereabouts presumably unknown, when that conversation occurred. I pressed Shahzad. What did they mean by that?
He shrugged and glanced over his shoulder again. They were obviously trying to protect bin Laden, he said.
“Do you think the I.S.I. was hiding bin Laden?” I asked him.
Shahzad shrugged again and said yes. But he hadn’t been able to prove it. (The I.S.I. calls this claim an “unsubstantiated accusation of a very serious nature.”)

Read more http://www.newyorker.com/reporting/2011 ... z1XjJA8dxd

Pratyush · Post by **Pratyush** » 12 Sep 2011 15:58

Lalmohan wrote:so how do we combat a religious war with a secular viewpoint?

I am 4 days behind on this thread but;

The only way to fight a religious war through a secular viewpoint is to mirror the mindset of the people who are fighting a religious war with you. i.e, do to them what their religious books tell them to do to you.

Force them to moderate their view point or they will become extinct.

SSridhar · Post by **SSridhar** » 12 Sep 2011 18:14

Pakistan wants emergency Dengue-drugs from India

Aditya_V · Post by **Aditya_V** » 12 Sep 2011 18:20

SSridhar wrote:Pakistan wants emergency Dengue-drugs from India

I hope Seculars will put up there personal money for it rather than expect GOI to pay for it.

Rangudu · Post by **Rangudu** » 12 Sep 2011 18:52

Guys,

Read the New Yorker article in full- it is worth it. BTW, here's a nugget from that article:

On March 17th, four missiles fired from a drone hit a group of men who had gathered at a market in the village of Datta Khel, in North Waziristan. As many as forty-four people died. The Pakistani government denounced the strike, claiming that it had killed a number of tribal elders, and demanded an apology.

As with nearly all drone strikes, the precise number and nature of the casualties were impossible to verify. The high-level American official told me that the “tribal elders” were actually insurgent leaders. But he offered another reason that the Pakistani officials were so inflamed: “It turns out there were some I.S.I. guys who were there with the insurgent leaders. We killed them, too

Funnily enough, on the day that drone strike happened, I had said this

Some ISI men some "tribal elders" were in attendance. The ISI men killed is probably why Kayani did a chakka dance

svenkat · Post by **svenkat** » 12 Sep 2011 19:30

Sir,
It is not for nothing that you are known as RAWngudu.

A_Gupta · Post by **A_Gupta** » 12 Sep 2011 20:12

panda wrote: What Iqbal is saying, I think, is that modern social democracy necessarily demands some form of equality among the mango aadmis. Therefore, Hinduism, with its inherent cast discrimination, will be quite uncomfortable with social democracy.

That is the huge question - if caste discrimination is inherent to Hinduism, then to any objective point of view, a joint nation with Hindus would be problematic.

As Two Nation Theory continues to be contested in Pakistan (e.g., the recent Nawaz Sharif dust-up with subsequent Marvi Sirmed/Zaid Hamid debate), now the Hindu casteism angle is being highlighted. If the myth of "casteism as inherent to Hinduism" is exploded, one more leg is shot out from under the Two Nation Theory.

arun · Post by **arun** » 12 Sep 2011 20:16

In the Islamic Republic of Pakistan, self- styled “Land of the Pure”, Mohammadden holy man gives a depravedly warped meaning to the word “Pure”

:

Pir processing: Toddler castrated to ‘free him from temptation’ ……………………

“I castrated him on August 14 because that is Pakistan’s Independence Day. I figured it was the best time to free this child from the cares of the world and all the corruption in it. Now he is pure,”

Express Tribune

Sri · Post by **Sri** » 12 Sep 2011 20:34

SSridhar wrote:Pakistan wants emergency Dengue-drugs from India

SS Saar, there are major issues in this. They have been trying to import these medicines for much longer time, but to no avail. Even during last years floods they actually wanted to buy this stuff. But India wanted to give it for free...

Awww the H&D factor.

Prem · Post by **Prem** » 12 Sep 2011 21:14

Sri wrote:
SSridhar wrote:Pakistan wants emergency Dengue-drugs from India

The dont need Dengu Drug but Daang Treatment to cure them from islamist madness.

svenkat · Post by **svenkat** » 12 Sep 2011 21:15

A-Gupta,
From the mohammedan view,Hindus were inherently casteist.To the jaundiced eye,everything is yellow.We tend to see the world through our distorted eyes.
The mohammedans had a historical memory of fractured hinduism and there was cognitive dissonance as a new avatar of Hinduism arose before their eyes.Islam is unchanging.The ram rod Paki vs the eel like hindu.

but Hinduism comes in many forms.casteism,varna,meritocracy.The white christists have problems with understanding.Because Hinduism has many facets,existing side by side.

We expect whiteys and mohammedans to understand us.But it is not easy.Hinduism is spread across multiple ages,multiple experiences captured in historical memory.Islam and christim were born in specific climes,despite their tall claims.It was never going to be easy for pakhanas(those who rejected their own history) to come to terms with reality,having being brought up on a muslim diet.The British barbaraians and then the amir khan barbarians fuelled their differences by glorifying 'monotheistic' cults while painting Sanatana Dharma in dark hue.So we have the present mess.

BijuShet · Post by **BijuShet** » 12 Sep 2011 22:24

Xpost from Af-Pak watch thread
From Tribune (posting in full).
US backs opening Taliban office in Qatar: Report

By AFP - Published: September 12, 2011

The move is designed to allow the West to begin formal peace talks with the Taliban, Western diplomats told the paper. PHOTO: AFP/FILE
LONDON: The United States has endorsed plans for the Taliban to open political headquarters in the Gulf state of Qatar by the end of the year, British newspaper The Times reported on Monday.
The move is designed to allow the West to begin formal peace talks with the Taliban, Western diplomats told the paper.

The office of the self-styled Islamic Emirate of Afghanistan would be the first internationally recognised representation for the Taliban since it was ousted from power by the US-led invasion of Afghanistan in 2001.

Western diplomats told The Times it was hoped that opening a Taliban office in Qatar would push forward the prospect of talks intended to reconcile insurgents with the Afghan government and bring an end to the decade-long war.

Washington is believed to have insisted that the office be located “outside Pakistan’s sphere of influence”, the report said.

“It will be an address where they have a political office,” one Western diplomatic source, who was not named, told The Times.

“It will not be an embassy or a consulate but a residence where they can be treated like a political party.”

The diplomat stressed that the Taliban would not be allowed to use the office in the Qatari capital, Doha, to raise funds.

The Times reported that the Taliban was seeking assurances that its representatives would be free from the threat of harassment or arrest.

Britain, which has the second largest contingent of troops in Afghanistan, declined to say whether it supported the creation of a Taliban office in Qatar. “This is a matter for the United States,” a Foreign Office spokeswoman said.

The US ambassador to Kabul said last week that the Taliban must feel “more pain” from increased military pressure before progress can be made in peace talks.

“The Taliban needs to feel more pain before you get to a real readiness to reconcile,” Ryan Crocker said in an interview with the Wall Street Journal.

BijuShet · Post by **BijuShet** » 12 Sep 2011 22:33

From Tribune - Editorial piece (posting in full).
Chinks in the armour?

By Editorial - Published: September 12, 2011
The Dawat has grown powerful on its own. In October every year, it holds the biggest congregation in Multan. PHOTO: APP

A report in this newspaper says that the military has become alerted to a possible danger from the proselytising activities of the religious organisation Dawat-e-Islami, distinguished by the sporting of green turbans by its followers. A Barelvi variant of the Deobandi Tableeghi Jamaat, Dawat also claims to be apolitical. But the intelligence agencies have warned that “its growing influence in the armed forces will have serious implications”. It has never been under strict watch, but it is financially powerful and has its own 24-hour channel that many cable operators provide.

The Tableeghi Jamaat was considered fit for elite support because of its Deobandi orientation and patronage from the Gulf and the Middle East. The Dawat has remained a poor man’s religious organisation, so to speak, divorced from the state’s patronage of jihad. It is surmised that the army has become sensitive to the penetration of its ranks after a policeman decided to kill Salmaan Taseer, earlier this year. Thereafter, the army confirmed that it had detained a senior officer, along with four other military personnel, for links with the banned Hizbut Tahrir. Has the Dawat-e-Islami, too, become a possible threat to the army? An intelligence report says its influence is increasing: over Rs20 million were collected from the Pakistan Air Force for the organisation during this past Ramazan. The organisation was founded by its present charismatic leader Ilyas Qadri, in 1980, when the Deobandis were getting the green light for jihad and the Barelvis were being ignored simply because the training camps — some of them run by al Qaeda — were located in Afghanistan, where the Deobandis hold sway.

The Dawat has grown powerful on its own. In October every year, it holds the biggest congregation in Multan rivalling the one held by the Tableeghi Jamaat in Raiwind near Lahore. As in the case of the Jamaat, special trains are run by the government to transport the devotees to the venue from all over Pakistan. The congregation is usually 500,000 strong or more, according to media reports.

In Multan, the venue is annually converted into a small city with all facilities provided by the Dawat to rival the annual gathering, of the Tableeghi Jamaat outside Lahore. During three days the city of Multan receives a big economic boost because of the visitors who have to eat and drink and buy their other necessities in the market. In Lahore, the biggest mosque of Dawat-e-Islami is situated on the Mall Canal Bridge near the National Institute of Public Administration academy. Often, green turbans are distributed for free to an increasing number of well-to-do devotees who throng the mosque.

Maulana Ilyas Qadri is, in the true Barelvi tradition, a follower of Ghaus-e-Azam Abdul Qadir Jilani of Iraq and Khan Ahmad Raza Khan Barelvi of Bhopal. His magnum opus is the bestselling book titled Faizan-e-Sunnat consisting of 1,326 pages in small print. It is a treasury of Sunni tradition in the Barelvi branch, every page of which is properly sourced to the greatest saints in the Sunni-Barelvi school. In the Barelvi tradition, there are miracles recounted in the shape of dreams seen by the followers of the Dawat, which all true believers must accept. That said, however, it should not be forgotten that Mumtaz Qadri, the policeman who killed the Punjab governor, was also a follower of the Dawat-e-Islami and motivated to do what he did because he was told that it was the right thing to do. Similarly, several Barelvi organisations have sprung up, especially in Punjab, where they aggressively rally the local population in favour of the controversial blasphemy law and against Ahmadis and Christians. One such organisation is currently involved in distributing hate literature against Ahmadis in Faisalabad, after which one Ahmadi was shot dead in the city last week.

The military can take its precautionary steps inside its own structure and it will only be good for Pakistan; but the last time Interior Minister Rehman Malik said Tableeghi Jamaat was a nursery of terrorists, he was roundly condemned by the opposition led by the PML-N’s Punjab Chief Minister Shahbaz Sharif and leader of the PPP’s coalition partner PML-Q, Chaudhry Shujaat. The minister immediately denied that he ever made the statement. Let’s see what happens this time around.
Published in The Express Tribune, September 13th, 2011.

BijuShet · Post by **BijuShet** » 12 Sep 2011 22:50

From Tribune - Breaking News section. Something fishy about this kidnapping and release within 2 hours of a US citizen of TSP origin.

Abducted US nationals released within hours in Quetta

Published: September 12, 2011

QUETTA: An American national of Pakistani origin and his nephew were released hours after being kidnapped from the Qambrani Road in Quetta on Monday, reported Express 24/7.

Official sources said that Zahid Hussain and his nephew Mubashir were kidnapped from Saryab area on Monday afternoon.

They were reportedly going to the Customs office in the area for a clearance certificate of a vehicle.

They were kidnapped by unidentified armed persons who released them two hours later in Shahbaz Town.

Police started investigations into the case to know the motive behind the kidnapping.

There has been no claim of the kidnapping so far.

Police and Frontier Corps (FC) reached the site and cordoned off the area immediately after reports of their abduction surfaced to conduct a search operation.

...

BijuShet · Post by **BijuShet** » 12 Sep 2011 22:57

From Tribune (posting in full). Glad to see majority of TSPians share the sentiments of a majority of Indians. Otherwise these sewer rats would be living amidst us spreading their dengue fever and polio.

Majority Pakistanis think separation from India was justified: Gallup poll

By PPI - Published: September 12, 2011

ISLAMABAD: An overwhelming majority of Pakistanis believe that separation from India was justified in 1947, revealed a recently released Gilani Poll conducted by Gallup Pakistan.

In a survey, a nationally representative sample of men and women from across the country were asked the following question:

Suppose you were an adult voter in 1947, would you have voted in favour or against the establishment of Pakistan?

The results of the poll revealed that 92% Pakistanis believed the separation from India was justified and they would have voted for Pakistan, while only 8% said they would have voted against it, according to the results of the Gilani Research Foundation survey carried out by Gallup Pakistan on Monday.

The poll reflects a minor but noticeable change of views on the issue, as the figure has gone up from 3% to 8% only in five years.

Responding to a similar survey in 2006, 97% of Pakistanis said they would have voted for Pakistan and only 3% said that they would have voted against Pakistan.

The study was released by the Gilani foundation and carried out by Gallup Pakistan, the Pakistani affiliate of Gallup International.

The recent survey was carried out among a sample of 2694 men and women in rural and urban areas of all four provinces of the country, during August 14 – 20, 2011.

Tamang · Post by **Tamang** » 12 Sep 2011 23:15

True friends: China first country to offer flood aid

ISLAMABAD: The Chinese Ambassador, HE Liu Jian called on Foreign Minister Hina Rabbani Khar Sunday to convey the decision of the Chinese Government to dispatch relief goods worth 30 million RMB (US $4.7million) for the flood affectees.

BijuShet · Post by **BijuShet** » 12 Sep 2011 23:24

From Tribune news. TSPA major doing what his superiors in TSPA have always done and gets arrested for it.

Army Major arrested in Pakistan Railways copper heist case

Published: September 12, 2011

LAHORE: The Pakistan Army on Monday confirmed the arrest of a serving Major in Pakistan Railway’s (PR) copper stealing scam.

PR authorities said a train with copper wire was sent from Khanewal to Lahore where the wire was to be stored at Mughalpura Workshop, however the train, was sent to Kharian where the copper wire worth millions of rupees was stolen.

The army said that Major Ayub was arrested for his alleged involvement in the scam and a complete investigation will be conducted in the case.

Five other people, including a PR officer, were also arrested in the scam.
...

BijuShet · Post by **BijuShet** » 12 Sep 2011 23:28

From Tribune news(posting in full). CJ TSP agrees there is no difference between TSP constitution and toilet paper. They both get flushed down the Toilet at opportune moments.

CJ admits courts breached constitution under dictatorships

Published: September 12, 2011

Chief Justice of Pakistan (CJP) Iftikhar Muhammad Chaudhry, on Monday, regretted the breach of constitution in the past and said the judiciary had learnt from its mistakes.

The Chief Justice made these remarks at a ceremony to mark the start of the new judicial year.

His remarks were an admission of mistakes made by the apex court in the past by supporting military dictatorships, admitting that those autocratic regimes had badly dented the economy and undermined the country’s sovereignty.

The Chief Justice also asked retiring judges not to accept a post contrary to their dignity and stature.

Also speaking at the occasion, Supreme Court Bar Association’s (SCBA) President Asma Jahangir said the jurisdiction of suo motu needs to be defined.

While conceding to the positive aspects of suo motu, she said it also has some negative affects which need to be curtailed.

Dipanker · Post by **Dipanker** » 12 Sep 2011 23:46

sum wrote:Pak woman officer to become first 3-star general

Hopefully she will have more balls than her male counterpart!

BijuShet · Post by **BijuShet** » 13 Sep 2011 00:20

From Tribune Opinion piece(posting in full). Looks like life in TSP for TFTA Rape is only getting more interesting every day

Heading straight for the abyss

By Zafar Hilaly - Published: September 11, 2011
The writer is an analyst and a former ambassador to Yemen, Nigeria and Italy
Nobody has a good opinion of someone who has a low opinion of himself. And this has become so obvious among Pakistanis living abroad today. They are deeply depressed about what the future has in store for Pakistan and are at a loss to explain why Pakistan and its people should have fallen so low in the esteem of their host societies. As a consequence, they seem to have lost their feistiness, their pride and that cockiness that set them apart from other communities such as the Somalis, the Yemenis and Nigerians, whose homelands are/were similarly mired in turmoil. Pakistanis never used to think they were not good enough. In fact, we were sharply offended when people did not respect us because we felt innately that we were as good, if not better, than many others.

Much of that pride and self confidence has gone. For the first time after many years of travel, I could sense hollowness deep down in their hearts. Time and again, I discovered educated and sensitive Pakistanis acting as if they were reluctant, nay ashamed, to admit they were Pakistanis. When asked directly about their country of provenance, for example, in France and Italy, they preferred to avoid or fudge the question and if pushed the lighter-complexioned ones passed themselves off as Sicilians or Latinos and the darker ones as Sri Lankans or from the “subcontinent”. Asked why, one Pakistani replied: “For God’s sake who the hell wants to explain to a civilised individual abroad what is happening in Pakistan and why. It’s simply too shameful. Besides, I have no explanation for the way we are behaving at home.”

This became more obvious when half a dozen of them recounted incidences why they no longer believed that things would improve in Pakistan. Indeed, they were convinced that the situation would continue to go from bad to worse. Nearly each one of them had a story to tell of what they had either personally experienced or knew of a close relative who had suffered at the hands of the system and the people at home who worked it. Some of these are worth relating.

One Pakistani settled in Slovenia spoke of how just the other day the qabza group of one political party had raided his sister’s apartment in Karachi, broke open the lock of her room and declared that as he was at odds with a co-tenant, and that they had come to “teach her a lesson”. This ‘lesson’ involved ensuring she paid them the royal sum of Rs300,000 to vacate her room. Rather than help her recover his property the other residents of the apartment complex begged him to negotiate and make the payment instead of resisting the attackers. “Otherwise they will kill us,” they pleaded. The retired communications engineer living on a meager Slovenian pension managed to reduce the extortion price to Rs200,000 and, in fact, remitted the money to his terrified nephew to make the payment. Luckily a mutual friend stepped in and through yet another friend in the present Sindh set up had the Rangers pay a visit after which the qabza group vacated the premises.

After recalling this incident to his audience, which included some foreigners and myself, a deeply embarrassed former envoy to Slovenia, the old Pakistani expatriate raised his hands in prayer and called upon God to curse a country and a system where such men held sway. I nearly found myself saying “Ameen”.

Another incident involves a Pakistani, now living in Naples, selling Pakistan-made bedsheets and towels in sizeable quantities. He recounted how just the other day he had been contacted by a friend in the Federal Investigation Agency, who asked him to let him know if he knew of anyone making money illegally by, for example, avoiding paying taxes. Greatly impressed that his friend should be such a conscientious officer in an organisation that is considered a by word for corruption, he asked his friend why he was so keen to have such information. “Because that way we can get some money off him too,” his friend replied. “Of course, please tell him that he can carry on avoiding taxes as long as we get a share of the profits he makes.”

Yet another Pakistani living in Venice, where he owns a restaurant, chipped in to say that a friend of his running a textile factory in Karachi had called the other day to say that people who think Pakistan is a bad place to invest are wrong. Why? Because if anyone wanted to be his partner in setting up yet another textile factory, he could ensure that they wouldn’t have to pay any taxes and would even get free electricity. With such exemptions, he continued, there was no question of the venture failing.

Finally, a young married Pakistani woman presently qualifying for a permanent resident visa in a European country, where her husband works, related how her brother-in-law presently settled in America on a visit to Karachi was shot dead by two gunmen while shopping. According to his wife, who was with him, she heard one gunmen tell the other: “Shit, I think we shot the wrong man” as they hurriedly left the shop.

No wonder the view among our communities abroad, what to speak of foreigners, is that a grotesque chaos confronts Pakistan. Dominated by land grabbing, incredibly greedy, inept and corrupt politicians, Pakistan is heading straight for the abyss. Its leaders have nothing to offer but their own confusion and personal agendas. Their failed self perpetuating policies have pitted the country against just about everybody, neighbours, friends, international financiers and even each other. So self-absorbed they live in perpetual adoration of themselves. Hence, if they hear anything to the contrary then the man speaking so is a resolute liar.

Such self-inflicted wounds stemming from moral cowardice and their stubborn indifference are lethal for a nation. Alas, there now seems an inevitability about our fate that nothing can forestall. No wonder then that Pakistanis abroad are hopelessly depressed. Notably the plane, on which I returned only yesterday from London, by PIA flight 788, was by and large empty, while the outbound flights were full as they normally are. It is no wonder why people, like capital, are taking flight.

Published in The Express Tribune, September 12th, 2011.

BijuShet · Post by **BijuShet** » 13 Sep 2011 00:49

^^^ Continuing the theme.

From Tribunes letters section (2 letters) and also from A Welcome to Pakistan section advice column(posting in full). Read through the advice and decide for yourselves if this TSP society can ever be considered to be made part of our society.

Robbed — while stuck in a traffic jam

By Letter - Published: September 12, 2011
KARACHI: On September 6, after heavy rains, all the major roads of Karachi witnessed massive traffic jams for hours. Not only did these cause major delays and fuel shortages, but many of the people who were in their vehicles were also robbed, during the jam.

Many were robbed of their cash, mobile phones and other valuables by organised armed gangs. These gangs did their dastardly deeds with impunity because no law-enforcement personnel were to be found anywhere that evening.

Four days later, the city again received heavy rain. I was held up in traffic for a good four hours, and again, I saw armed gangs of boys roaming around freely between cars, robbing their occupants of cash and other valuables. The places where these gangs are found are on the Natha Khan bridge, the Baloch Colony flyover area, Nursery, Kalapul, Punjab colony, Gulshan-i-Iqbal, Rashid Minhas Road (especially near the Millenum Mall), Manghopir Road bridge over the Lyari river, Lasbela and Essa Nagar.

So what do ordinary motorists do in such a situation?

Ahmad Haroon Husain

Published in The Express Tribune, September 13th, 2011.

Another one as a followup to the prior letter
Robbed — while stuck in a traffic jam (II)

By Letter - Published: September 12, 2011

KARACHI: Thanks to the ineptitude of the police, criminals in the city of Karachi have found yet another way to rob citizens. Now they are targeting motorists caught in traffic jams, especially after a heavy downpour. The modus operandi is generally that they go to a car and knock at its window with a pistol. They ask the person in the driver’s seat to lower the window and then ask them to hand over his cellphone and other valuables. If women happen to be in the car, they ask for their jewellery.

During the recent rains in Karachi, motorists have been robbed at many places, especially after sunset. The situation becomes even more dangerous for motorists when, as a result of rain, all streetlights go off. This is precisely what happened on September 6. After heavy rain, many motorists returning home got stuck in heavy traffic, and the criminals went about robbing people, especially Nursery, the Natha Khan Goth bridge and Lasbela crossing.

The criminals know very well that traffic jams occur when there is no traffic police. Every time it rains, the traffic police are nowhere to be found, and what we have instead are these gun-toting criminals. Those in cars are especially vulnerable because there is nowhere for them to go, as in they can’t drive away at all. The police are clearly failing because such gangs seem to be robbing motorists with increasing regularity and so some measures to pre-empt this should have taken place. One measure could be to deploy police personnel at spots where such incidents of robbing are known to take place. Other than that, people should try and avoid getting stuck in traffic jams after it rains, by selecting a route which is not so prone to flooding. Motorists can also ensure that no valuables such as a laptop, a briefcase, cellphones and so on are visible to those outside their vehicle. Women should remove any jewellery and hide it somewhere inside their car but not in their purse. If one gets stuck in a traffic jam, one should keep doors of one’s car locked and windows rolled up. If someone knocks at the car window, the immediate response should be to keep the window up and perhaps honk, because many criminals do not like commotion as it can attract others and get them caught. If this can’t be done, then a cellphone or wallet should be handed over without any resistance because one’s life is precious and should not be risked over such a thing.

Sqn-ldr (retd) S Ausaf Husain

Published in The Express Tribune, September 13th, 2011.

13 tips to avoid being robbed in traffic jams

Ausaf Husain - September 12, 2011

The crime rate in our cities has steadily increased and after the rains, criminals have found yet another way to rob people. Thanks to the ineptitude of the police, thieves have found easy targets in motorists caught in traffic jams while they are stuck on the road due to knee deep water.

On September 6 it rained heavily in Karachi and numerous people were robbed while they were stuck in traffic jams, trying to return home from work. The situation swiftly got more dangerous when the street lights went off. Criminals have an in-depth understanding of the locations in cities where motorists will be at their weakest; they know the area patrolled by the police, and they know which areas will be susceptible to traffic jams due to water pooling on the roads. Sadly, despite so many robberies, the police has failed to provide adequate security.

It is a well known saying that prevention is better than cure. Thus, I have come up with a few preventative measures that may prove to be useful to people who might find themselves in a situation where they could get robbed.

1. On noticing the gathering of dark clouds, if you are out of your house, try to leave whatever you are doing and get home as soon as possible. This way, you could avoid getting stuck in a traffic jam caused by the rain.

2. Select a route where there are no known sites of water pooling on the road to avoid getting caught in a traffic jam.

3. Both men and women are advised to remove any jewellery they are wearing and to hide it somewhere in the car. Do not, however, hide jewellery in your purse, as robbers might ask you to hand this over too.

4. Before getting in to your car, make sure that your valuables, like your laptop, briefcase, cell phone, and so on are not visible to people outside your car. Hide them under the car seat or in the dashboard. It is a good idea to step outside your car just to make sure that they are indeed not visible.

5. After leaving a little amount of money in your wallet or purse, hide your money and all other items such as your NIC, credit card, ATM card etc, somewhere inside your car. Never keep any of these items in your pockets, as criminals sometimes make their victims empty their pockets too.

6. If you get stuck in a traffic jam then keep all the doors of your car locked and the windows rolled up. If you require fresh air, do not roll your window down more than two inches.

7. If someone knocks at your window, do not slide it down or open your door. If a criminal threatens you through the window, start honking the horn to attract peoples’ attention. Many criminals leave immediately for fear of being caught. If this fails, then remain calm, and slide your window down.

8. If a robber asks you to hand over your wallet and cell phone, do so without resistance.

9. Try to carry an old (discarded) cell phone in your car, and give this to the criminal rather than your own cell phone. Make sure to keep your cell phone on silent in the car under your seat. Criminals do not bother to check the condition of the cell phone as they are often in a hurry.

10. Try to carry duplicate keys of your car at all time as robbers sometimes take away the keys of your car.

11. Keep your FM radio on to find directions so you can adopt routes which are safe to drive during heavy rains.

12. If you have a licensed pistol or revolver then carry it concealed under your clothes for your protection and the protection of other occupants in your car. Under Section 96 and 97 of Pakistan Penal Code (PPC) you can defend yourself if attacked.

13. Always plan and be mentally prepared to stay at the house of your friend or relative if rains are severe and if your house is a great distance away. It is also a good idea to stay at a hotel if you are stranded till the rain subsides.

Factory workers and students tend to suffer the most during the rains. Organizations and educational institutions should prepare contingency plans to house their employees. They should also ensure that their in-house cafeteria/canteen remains open so that food is also available.

The maxim “better safe than sorry” is indeed true when faced with the very real threat of being robbed.

If you find yourself facing a gun, do not try to pull a heroic stunt – you might lose your life.

Please keep the above points in mind while you venture out on to the roads of Karachi. Perhaps, they will save many of you the damages that might otherwise occur.

The views expressed by the writer and the reader comments do not necessarily reflect the views and policies of The Express Tribune.

A_Gupta · Post by **A_Gupta** » 13 Sep 2011 02:21

http://mobile.reuters.com/article/idUST ... 2?irpc=932

Haqqani network behind Afghan truck blast: Pentagon
Mon, Sep 12 15:57 PM EDT

By David Alexander

WASHINGTON (Reuters) - The Taliban-affiliated Haqqani network was behind a truck bombing that killed four Afghan civilians and wounded 77 U.S. troops on the eve of the 10th anniversary of the September 11 attacks, the Pentagon said on Monday.

ranjbe · Post by **ranjbe** » 13 Sep 2011 02:49

sum wrote:Pak woman officer to become first 3-star general

Shahida Badshah, a top officer in the Pakistan Army [ Images ], is in the running to become the country's first woman three-star general later this year.
Click here!

Pakistan is the only Islamic country to have women major generals.
AoA.... Enlightened moderation onlee.

Pakis really crack me up. On one hand, they define Bakistan as NOT INDIA. On the other hand, Pakis have a knee-jerk reaction to copying every "progressive" move in India. India has women officers? Check, Bakis recruit female officers - and as Shiv has pointed out, TFTA officers use lots of lipstick and makeup. India has a 3-star women general? Check, so do we now, etc. Wonder if she is TFTA?
What a bunch of losers!

Dipanker · Post by **Dipanker** » 13 Sep 2011 03:39

Looks like Joe Biden just read the riots act to the Pakis:
Pakistan must do more in al Qaeda fight, Biden says

(CNN) -- Pakistan has been an unreliable ally of the United States in the war against al Qaeda and other extremist organizations, U.S. Vice President Joe Biden told CNN in an interview set to air in full Monday night.
Biden, who spoke to CNN's John King on the eve of the 10th anniversary of the 9/11 terror attacks, said Pakistan has failed "on occasion" when forced to choose between the United States and al Qaeda.

The price of Pakistan's choices has been the "loss of life of American soldiers in Afghanistan," the vice president said. Islamabad has "been very helpful in other times," he added. "But it's not sufficient. They have to get better. We need a relationship that is born out of mutual interest. And it's in their interest that they be more cooperative with us."

"We are demanding it," he said.

SBajwa · Post by **SBajwa** » 13 Sep 2011 04:13

elections are on the horizon!! Biden has to do it.

KJo · Post by **KJo** » 13 Sep 2011 05:36

BijuShet wrote:From Tribune (posting in full). Glad to see majority of TSPians share the sentiments of a majority of Indians. Otherwise these sewer rats would be living amidst us spreading their dengue fever and polio.

Majority Pakistanis think separation from India was justified: Gallup poll
By PPI - Published: September 12, 2011

ISLAMABAD: An overwhelming majority of Pakistanis believe that separation from India was justified in 1947, revealed a recently released Gilani Poll conducted by Gallup Pakistan.

In a survey, a nationally representative sample of men and women from across the country were asked the following question:

Suppose you were an adult voter in 1947, would you have voted in favour or against the establishment of Pakistan?

The results of the poll revealed that 92% Pakistanis believed the separation from India was justified and they would have voted for Pakistan, while only 8% said they would have voted against it, according to the results of the Gilani Research Foundation survey carried out by Gallup Pakistan on Monday.

The poll reflects a minor but noticeable change of views on the issue, as the figure has gone up from 3% to 8% only in five years.

Responding to a similar survey in 2006, 97% of Pakistanis said they would have voted for Pakistan and only 3% said that they would have voted against Pakistan.

The study was released by the Gilani foundation and carried out by Gallup Pakistan, the Pakistani affiliate of Gallup International.

The recent survey was carried out among a sample of 2694 men and women in rural and urban areas of all four provinces of the country, during August 14 – 20, 2011.

I wonder who these 8% kafirs are who voted against Pakistan. Any halaal musalmaans?

KJo · Post by **KJo** » 13 Sep 2011 05:43

Dipanker wrote:
sum wrote:Pak woman officer to become first 3-star general

Hopefully she will have more balls than her male counterpart!

But how do they justify this in Islaaaam?
How can they have a wretched woman defend TFTA PakMards? It does not make sense Islamically.
This is not PBUH's way.

Nandu · Post by **Nandu** » 13 Sep 2011 06:06

^KJoishy, I don't believe people are going to truthfully answer a question like that.

chetak · Post by **chetak** » 13 Sep 2011 06:28

Dipanker wrote:
sum wrote:Pak woman officer to become first 3-star general

Hopefully she will have more balls than her male counterpart!

She is a doctor from their equivalent of the Army Medical Corps.

Airavat · Post by **Airavat** » 13 Sep 2011 06:39

New evidence of Pakistan's hand in the torture and murder of SSS

Shahzad, whose parents migrated from India after Partition, making him a muhajir—Urdu for “immigrant”—was an affable outsider within Pakistan’s journalistic circles. Asia Times Online is not connected to any of the country’s established newspapers; its editorial operations are based in Thailand. Shahzad had no local editor to guide him or restrain him. Only a few other journalists had written as aggressively about Islamist extremism in the military, and not all of them had survived.

Two days after Shahzad’s body was found, an ISI official made a statement denying that its agents had played any role in the killing. Shahzad’s death, he said, was “unfortunate and tragic,” adding, “Baseless accusations against the country’s sensitive agencies for their alleged involvement in Shahzad’s murder are totally unfounded.” Forty-six journalists have been killed in Pakistan since 2001, and the ISI had never before issued such a stark denial. The statement hardly quieted suspicion; in fact, it heightened it. “Everybody knows who did it,” Muhammad Faizan, a colleague of Shahzad’s at Asia Times Online and a friend, told me. “But no one can say.”

Shahzad and I agreed to meet at a Gloria Jean’s coffee shop, not far from his home. The trouble, he said, had begun on March 25th, the day that he published the story about bin Laden’s being on the move. The next morning, he got a phone call from an officer at the ISI, summoning him to the agency’s headquarters, in Aabpara, a neighborhood in eastern Islamabad. When Shahzad showed up, he was met by three ISI officers. The lead man, he said, was a naval officer, Rear Admiral Adnan Nazir, who serves as the head of the ISI’s media division. And then Admiral Nazir made a remark so bizarre that Shahzad said he had thought about it every day since. “We want the world to believe that Osama is dead,” Nazir said.

“Do you think the ISI was hiding bin Laden?” I asked him. Shahzad shrugged again and said yes. But he hadn’t been able to prove it.

The agency’s links to bin Laden continued after the 9/11 attacks. This May, I travelled to Afghanistan to meet an ISI agent named Fida Muhammad, who had been arrested by Afghan intelligence agents. He described himself as a civilian employee of the ISI. For much of the past decade, he said, he had escorted Haqqani fighters from their sanctuaries in Pakistan into Afghanistan, where they fought against the Americans. He had been hired for his knowledge of the trails that wind through the mountainous border. “I can pass right under the noses of the Americans and the Afghans, and they will never see me,” he said. He’d been arrested while spying on Indian agents inside Afghanistan.

A small extract from the ten page article.

dada · Post by **dada** » 13 Sep 2011 06:42

# A_Gupta

Quote: if caste discrimination is inherent to Hinduism, then to any objective point of view, a joint nation with Hindus would be problematic.

I am amused to see casteism in hindu society being used as an argument by pakis to justify TNT. Pure(!) Muslims would never do that , only Converted Muslims would use that argument. If the Foundation of Pk is being questioned-challenged by growing section of pakis , then it is good for us.Think of ways to accelerate this process ! From Paki Establishment point of view, it pays to keep the pakis intellectually stagnant in the days of pre 1947 ! But this struggle to "cap" the collective paki mind is bound to fail.

abhishek_sharma · Post by **abhishek_sharma** » 13 Sep 2011 06:51

After Parliament attack, Pak feared war, sought help

abhishek_sharma · Post by **abhishek_sharma** » 13 Sep 2011 07:14

On FATA: Decade of fear

arun · Post by **arun** » 13 Sep 2011 08:21

X Posted from the Pakistani Role in Global Terrorism thread.

Another three citizens of the Islamic Republic of Pakistan sentenced for indulging in the Islamic Republic’s penchant for indulging in Islamic Terrorism.

AFP via Google:

Three Pakistanis plead guilty to US terror charges