J&K News and Discussion-2011

nachiket · Post by **nachiket** » 27 Sep 2011 05:22

hulaku wrote:
And I am now planning to lay claim to a number properties which were never ours but I will give it a shot and go crying to the courts and tell them how we were dislodged out of these properties and the papers to the property were burnt down (so carefully I choose properties that were earlier burnt down). I am sure this act would help.

I love Chanakya.

So what happens to the actual original owners of these properties (who would be in a similar situation to your family)? How does this help exactly?

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 27 Sep 2011 06:15

I one good thing with spat between US and TSP is there are no overtures from US to hand over Cashmere to TSP.

chetak · Post by **chetak** » 27 Sep 2011 07:14

ramana wrote:I one good thing with spat between US and TSP is there are no overtures from US to hand over Cashmere to TSP.

Not yet saar, not yet!

Please understand that the very raison d'être for the pakis welcoming the amrekis after 9/11 was cashmere.

They will not give it up so easily and not after this much of "sacrifice" and taqiya.

Now they are getting f#(#ed on both borders.

shivajisisodia · Post by **shivajisisodia** » 27 Sep 2011 08:17

ramana wrote:I one good thing with spat between US and TSP is there are no overtures from US to hand over Cashmere to TSP.

Sir,

What we (India) needs at this point is not merely making "not making any noises about Cashmere being Paki or even disputed territory", but an unequivocal public statement by the Secretary of State, if not the President, that "Kashmir is undisputed Indian territory", all of it, POK and COK included. That should close this issue once and for all, as it will completely take out the air from the sails of any separatist political outfits in Kashmir. Then there will only remain a militant threat, which without the political support within KAshmir can be easily and summarily dealt with. Whats in it for the US ? Well, this is a cost free way for the US to stick it to the Pakis, where it really really hurts and is also a warning shot, that the next blow and the one after that will be even more painful, if that is possible. There would be nothing more painful for Paki than the settlement of the Kashmir issue purely on Indian terms. It will only be second to their 71 defeat, possibly of equal magnitude and will put to waste all the massive investment the Pakis have made into their Kashmir Jihad since 1992.

I think this is an opportune time and a small window that has opened up where if the US does not understand this approach fully itself or even if it does and for some reason is reluctant to go this route, perhaps Indian diplomacy can kick into high gear and bring about this mutually benefical solution, which is as much in US interest as it is in Indian. There is a total convergence of interests here between US and India, which happens very rarely.

My hypothesis here is that the Indian leadership and even the bureaucracy is too busy making money, to even sense this opportunity, leave aside take advantage of it. The proof of it is the speech that Sardarji made last week in the UN, condemning at this juncture (look at the timing), the West for recklessly "interfering and violating the sovereignty" of other nations, almost echoing the Paki line. It is one thing to be so busy making money that you dont take advantage of opportunities and keep quiet, it is quite another to score a massive self goal by kicking the guy with who you need to converge on some policy of common interest in favor of your arch enemy. Why did Sardarji do that ?

Or we are back to the typical Indian thinking that we dont want to make any pro-active effort in the direction of furthering our policies, we will just sit back and wait for others (US, in this case) to hand over a victory to India on the platter, without India even making an aggressive diplomatic effort, just because we think it is in US interest, so they will do it anyway. Well, events in the subcontinent have proven that despite massive Paki deception of the Americans, the Americans have not tilted the Indian way, despite it being in their obvious interest. So, it doesnt just automatically happen. Indians need to make an effort.

More importantly, and I have posted these thoughts in various threads here, where these are also relevent, over the past couple of days, my question is, why does the US, at this juncture when Paki is kicking it on the shins several times a day, not make this kind of an open and unequivocal statement recognizing all of Kashmir as Indian territory ?

Why do you think ?

Vikas · Post by **Vikas** » 27 Sep 2011 09:44

hulaku wrote: It is actually a very good act.
And I am now planning to lay claim to a number properties which were never ours but I will give it a shot and go crying to the courts and tell them how we were dislodged out of these properties and the papers to the property were burnt down (so carefully I choose properties that were earlier burnt down). I am sure this act would help.

I love Chanakya.

Hulaku ji, I love your idea. Count me in.

P:S Yes moi too loves Chanakya.

Dipanker · Post by **Dipanker** » 27 Sep 2011 11:20

shivajisisodia wrote: The proof of it is the speech that Sardarji made last week in the UN, condemning at this juncture (look at the timing), the West for recklessly "interfering and violating the sovereignty" of other nations, almost echoing the Paki line. It is one thing to be so busy making money that you dont take advantage of opportunities and keep quiet, it is quite another to score a massive self goal by kicking the guy with who you need to converge on some policy of common interest in favor of your arch enemy. Why did Sardarji do that ?

Answer is Congress votebank politics, never mind that it hurts India's national interest.
How pathetic these people are it's beyond belief.

suryag · Post by **suryag** » 27 Sep 2011 11:30

^^^ I find it hard to believe it is votebank politics. Realistically, who in India is worried about what MMS says in the UN, aam abdul might not even know hes gone to the UN or what the UN is, IMO it is a pathetic sense f affection for the land he was born on

shyamd · Post by **shyamd** » 27 Sep 2011 11:54

Folks FYI, got a message in facebook this morning from Rahul Mehta. He wants freedom for Kashmir... I am shocked as well as disappointed if its true. Someone correct me if I am wrong.

Vikas · Post by **Vikas** » 27 Sep 2011 14:17

^ Should he not go Jury (Referendum) in whole of India as he is so fond of for all the problems

Sanku · Post by **Sanku** » 27 Sep 2011 14:44

shyamd wrote:Folks FYI, got a message in facebook this morning from Rahul Mehta. He wants freedom for Kashmir... I am shocked as well as disappointed if its true. Someone correct me if I am wrong.

You are right, he has been sending such messages to me and others as well.

A class "A" specimen starting with word M if there was one.

I have been hinting that on the forum for a long time since I am aware of his "activism" outside BR.

There are many other juicy pieces too.

Lilo · Post by **Lilo** » 27 Sep 2011 15:23

Maybe his account got hacked?
His website still has this as his solution for J&K.

The administrative change to solve JK problem is as follows: using 3rd suggested change (wherein citizens can register YES/NO in Parliament), we citizens should enact following changes

Merge JK with Uttaranchal and Himachal Pradesh
Repeal Art-370
Enact law that would enable any Indian citizen to lease lands in JK for 25 years
Encourage retired Military and retired Policemen from all over India to settle into Kashmir areas

We shall later describe the details on this web-page.

Sanku · Post by **Sanku** » 27 Sep 2011 15:29

Lilo wrote:Maybe his account got hacked?

No, this is the general refrain. That is him all right.

gakakkad · Post by **gakakkad** » 27 Sep 2011 15:57

W.R.T rahul mehta... the guy is a not the sanest guy I have met.....But his heart is in the right place... He is from Ahemdabad ... He used to moves around campaigning door to door... He was surely not an EJ /wkk/ dhoti roy type... He would in fact seem rational ..till he begins talking... The guy has a flight of ideas ...might believe in one thing today ..another thing tomorrow... but he is nobody .. Not at all popular in Guj due to his anti-Modi stand ... I pity him... He wastes his talent...had he concentrated on IT/CS he would have done better...

But anyway like all of us the guy was wronged by the system and its silly rules and regulations ... he tried to fight it his way...and got lost in the process... Had he been practical , target oriented etc he would have done better...

Sanku · Post by **Sanku** » 27 Sep 2011 16:00

gakakkad wrote:But his heart is in the right place... .

No, he has his personal axes to grind and he hides behind "causes". People like him give causes a bad name.

abhishek_sharma · Post by **abhishek_sharma** » 27 Sep 2011 18:18

Mirwaiz met Fai in US last week

Abbas attended the OIC session, where two resolutions, one on Palestine and the other one on Kashmir, were passed. “He (Abbas) is surely supportive of our cause,” the Mirwaiz said.

So why do we support Palestinians?

Dilbu · Post by **Dilbu** » 27 Sep 2011 18:30

^^
What support? Are we doing anything apart from issuing chai-biskoot statements?

Vikas · Post by **Vikas** » 27 Sep 2011 18:47

What is it with people who want to gift/Donate Kashmir to Pakistan.
They are not the one defending J&K in inhuman conditions, Their kith and kin have not died in the hands of terrorists, they have not been ethically cleaned from the land of their ancestors, They don't face harsh world out there. On the contrary they have made money denigrating India and Indian Defense forces.
Then why this burning desire to give away Kashmir. Why can't for starters they gift away their palatial bungalows to the squatter in the next lane.
Walk the talk and then give silly, idiotic suggestions.

Prem · Post by **Prem** » 28 Sep 2011 03:13

'Set up India-Pak commission to investigate J&K unmarked graves'
( BDYs )
http://www.rediff.com/news/report/set-u ... 110927.htm

Jammu and Kashmir Chief Minister Omar Abdullah Tuesday urged setting of a joint India [ Images ] Pakistan Truth and Reconciliation Commission and said that 'it would be the biggest Jammu and Kashmir centric CBM (confidence building measure)'.Replying to discussions on the issue of discovery of unmarked graves in the state assembly, the chief minister said 'the commission would find answers to many unanswered questions, and to the issue of the unmarked graves'.
"This can be the biggest Jammu and Kashmir centric CBM by the two countries for the people of the state who want to know all about it," he said and urged 'the leadership of India and Pakistan to discuss this issue in the dialogue and come forward with a joint strategy'.
The chief minister, however, said that 'calling these graves as mass graves was a 'misnomer' as the graves contained only one and in some cases two bodies, and not more than that'.
The resolution for discussions on the issue of unmarked graves was tabled in the state assembly by a ruling National Conference member of legislative assembly.The chief minister said that 'those local who apprehend that their missing members were buried in these graves should come forward and help the government by providing their DNA profile, so that facts are ascertained'."My government would give due weight to the report and recommendations of the state human rights commission regarding unmarked graves. We are not here to hide the facts or conceal the truth, but our endeavour is to dig out the facts and bring these before the public", he said.This cannot be done overnight, but we have to take a start in this direction," he added. The chief minister said that 'misinformation is being circulated about these graves by tagging them as 'mass graves'."Most of the graves have only one person and a few are with two persons but no grave has more than two persons", he said. "We are circulating a wrong impression when we give the name of 'mass graves' to these unmarked graves identified recently and reported in the media", he said adding that 'it gives an impression to the outside world as if hundreds of people are buried in few graves, as had been done in Cambodia or during the time of Hitler [ Images ]."

sunnyP · Post by **sunnyP** » 28 Sep 2011 03:19

abhishek_sharma wrote:Mirwaiz met Fai in US last week

Abbas attended the OIC session, where two resolutions, one on Palestine and the other one on Kashmir, were passed. “He (Abbas) is surely supportive of our cause,” the Mirwaiz said.
So why do we support Palestinians?

To appease a certain section of Indian society.

Sanku · Post by **Sanku** » 28 Sep 2011 14:22

http://www.indianexpress.com/news/uproa ... cy/852977/

Jammu and Kashmir Assembly was adjourned for half an hour today after Opposition BJP members demanded that the Speaker drop the resolution seeking clemency for Parliament attack convict Afzal Guru from the list of the day's business.

Lalmohan · Post by **Lalmohan** » 28 Sep 2011 14:54

sunnyP wrote:
abhishek_sharma wrote: So why do we support Palestinians?
To appease a certain section of Indian society.

palestinians and other arabs pay ummah lip service to the K-kause; actually they couldn't give a rat's musharraf...

Sanku · Post by **Sanku** » 29 Sep 2011 14:13

This does not seem to have been getting too much attention, in media or on BRF, which is a little strange since this is a fairly big deal

http://www.indianexpress.com/news/J-K-e ... ad/853368/

J&K encounter lasts third day, Army officer dead

The fierce gunbattle between security personnel and militants continued for the third consecutive day on Wednesday in the forests of Kupwara. An Army officer, two policemen and five militants have been killed during the last three days.

.........................

The encounter started on Monday afternoon when a joint team of the Army’s 18 Grenadiers and Special Operations Group (SOG) of the police launched an operation in the mountains of Kralpora. The Army had inputs about the presence of nine militants. As the joint team of police and Army moved towards the mountains, the militants opened indiscriminate fire. In the initial assault, two SOG personnel — Shiraz Ahmad and Gulzar Ahmad — and Lieutenant Khajuria were critically wounded. The two policemen succumbed on Monday evening while the Army officer died on Tuesday night.

sum · Post by **sum** » 29 Sep 2011 14:17

^^ mentioned in CT dhaga...another jawan succumbed while a pig from karachi was captured alive ( while 5 of his denizens met their 72).

paramu · Post by **paramu** » 01 Oct 2011 07:12

http://www.kashmirprocess.org/reports/graves/toc.html

Check the authors

Unknown, Unmarked, and Mass Graves in Indian-Administered Kashmir

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 01 Oct 2011 08:26

Usual suspects. What is their locus standi?

Upendra · Post by **Upendra** » 01 Oct 2011 10:13

CONFESSIONS OF A PAKISTANI TERRORIST

vishvak · Post by **vishvak** » 01 Oct 2011 11:39

paramu wrote:http://www.kashmirprocess.org/reports/graves/toc.html

Check the authors

Unknown, Unmarked, and Mass Graves in Indian-Administered Kashmir

The reason that such authors do not say a word against terrorists is so that every confusion and such graves can be made to add up on so-called atrocities by police/para/army/everything that can provide for compensation/state-benefits/etc, thus increasing their propaganda and making money out of absence of clarification. Who funds these compensation and benefits and why are the same people not able to say that there is still lack of complete clarity regarding these?

If the authors are so worried about atrocities, why can't these goto terrorists and tell them not to kill anyone. Everyone is out there to loot the Govt., at the same time if there are issues then these must be dealt with well.

sunnyP · Post by **sunnyP** » 01 Oct 2011 16:37

What an idiotic act:

Jammu and Kashmir chief minister Omar Abdullah on Friday apologised on behalf of his government for revealing the names of women raped in the state during the last five years. ''I tender an unconditional apology. There is a deep sense of shame over revealing the names of the victims,''
Abdullah told the state assembly.

The 90 page list, with the names of 1,326 victims, was submitted as a written reply to a question asked by MLC Abdul Majid on Wednesday.

The MLC had asked tehsil wise details of the rape cases in the last five years as well as their current status. He had also asked for steps taken to prevent such occurances.

The list, submitted by deputy secretary to the home department, has in most cases revealed the victim’s identity by giving out her full name, address as well as her parentage.

The ministry is headed by the chief minister and has a minister of state as his deputy.

http://www.hindustantimes.com/Omar-apol ... 51801.aspx

gakakkad · Post by **gakakkad** » 01 Oct 2011 17:10

SS letter to PM on PC sheds an important light on some of the worrying events that have occurred in JK...

sum · Post by **sum** » 01 Oct 2011 18:50

^^ Could you please point out the letter and how J&K figures in it?

gakakkad · Post by **gakakkad** » 01 Oct 2011 19:58

^^the one we are discussing in the 2g dhaga..

Cross post from the 2g dhaga...

Subramanian Swamy to MMS wrote:
Dear Prime Minister:

I am happy that you finally acted and went over the head of your Home Minister P.Chidambaram (who malafide vacillated), to order the arrest of Joint Secretary in the Home Ministry Mr.Ravi Inder Singh IAS., for betraying the country.

It is now high time for you to consider all my earlier letters regarding Mr.Chidambaram, regarding his being guilty of conduct unbecoming of a Minister. I had written to you earlier about his visiting massage parlours in a seedy Government hotel where Uzbeki girls frequent, driving off in jeans and dark glasses without a driver or anyone else to Greater Kailash in New Delhi-- without informing anyone, and beating up a Times of India photographer for taking pictures of him late night in a Bangalore discotheque and thereby fracturing his own toe in the scuffle. You may also be aware of what I wrote to you about a lady IAS officer in Finance Ministry whose husband (also IAS) had requested her transfer of posting because she was being harassed.

I have been recently informed by my friends in London that the British Intelligence MI-6 had video photographed Mr.Chidambaram while he in the company of an escort service European girl provided by an Indian company with which he has had a formal fiduciary relation, as a paid Director. You also must know that his 2009 elections to Lok Sabha is a complete fraud. His certificate of election from the Returning Officer was extracted under duress by the DMK CM, Mr.Karunanidhi despite Mr.Chidambaram losing the election by 7000 votes to the AIADMK candidate.

But now, it is disturbing to learn that your Government has through Mr.Chidambaram conveyed approval to J&K CM Omar Abdullah to allow return from PoK of all those who had left the troubled State since 1989.

This is a dangerous step that seems to have been decided by a back channel person who has been hell bent on India parting with J&K by hook or crook. It seriously undermines and jeopardizes the national security of the nation. It will help the ISI of Pakistan to better co-ordinate subversive and terrorist activities in India. The agencies of Pakistan have been meeting Omar Abdullah in Dubai and London. I never thought this promising youngster will go to seed like this. Who has been the baneful influence on him? In any case, I urge you overturn this decision.

Most of all, as a safeguard, I urge you to obtain the resignation of Mr.Chidambaram because has de-facto become a national security risk. He has consistently failed to concentrate on the work of the Ministry.

Yours sincerely,

(SUBRAMANIAN SWAMY)

The recent behaviour of the Omar Abdullah can be explained by the contents written in the above letter...

Prem · Post by **Prem** » 02 Oct 2011 07:57

Old Green Venomous Snake in Grass

Intra-Kashmir talks

The trip could not have been possible without the approval of both New Delhi and Islamabad. At the wedding, the visitor met Chief Minister Omar Abdullah and accepted the offer of a ride on an official helicopter to Pahalgam accompanied by the minister of state for home. He also offered prayers at the mausoleum of Shaikh Abdullah.
The grace of what was courtesy extended to a distinguished visitor was washed away by Omar Abdullah`s all too characteristic blog “Former `Azad Kashmir` premier accepted the hospitality of the elected CM of J&K. I am glad he did.” That was cheap and reflects his desperate attempts to gain acceptance which a flawed electoral verdict in 2008 could not ensure. Twitter is an apt comment on Omar Abdullah`s manner of speaking. Ambassadors of the US and China met for years at Warsaw without any issue of recognition being raised. Did not Omar likewise recognise Azad Kashmir?

gakakkad · Post by **gakakkad** » 02 Oct 2011 08:39

X- Post from 2g thread...

I have got a major piece of Info on Sonia Gandhi... She was willing to sell out Kashmir . She even joined a pro-secession party..

http://www.nancho.net/fdlap/

arun · Post by **arun** » 03 Oct 2011 22:02

X Posted from the ISI History and Discussions thread.

From the Atlantic the story of the ISI / ISID funded anti-Indian propagandist Syed Ghulam Nabi Fai who is currently an involuntary guest of the US Justice system:

The Man Behind Pakistani Spy Agency's Plot to Influence Washington

The same article has also been posted at Pro Publica and is available at the below link:

The Man Behind Pakistan Spy Agency’s Plot to Influence Washington

menon s · Post by **menon s** » 04 Oct 2011 07:39

Militant in exile: Meeting a Kashmiri in Gujranwala, Pakistan
Yoginder Sikands, New Book.
http://www.firstpost.com/ideas/militant ... 98186.html

‘I came here to fight for freedom for Kashmir and now I am selling undergarments in Gujranwala! Can you imagine?’ he said, his eyes brimming with tears. ‘I’ve ruined my life completely.’
Umar had little complimentary to say about Pakistan, where he had spent almost fifteen years. ‘Pakistan’s claim of being an Islamic state and defender of Islam is absolute nonsense. In many ways, it is much worse than India,’ he spat out. The country’s educational system was pathetic, he said. ‘Even Kashmir University, which was never among the better-known Indian universities, is far better than Punjab University in Lahore, Pakistan’s premier university.

sum · Post by **sum** » 04 Oct 2011 08:41

‘Even Kashmir University, which was never among the better-known Indian universities, is far better than Punjab University in Lahore, Pakistan’s premier university.

But Lahore univ has Djinn technology onlee!!!

menon s · Post by **menon s** » 04 Oct 2011 18:57

Prashant Bhushan and his true colors!
Advocating the Azadi Dialogue in Kashmir!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7LbqmuQ9 ... r_embedded

menon s · Post by **menon s** » 06 Oct 2011 09:36

China paints a gruesome picture of unmarked graves in Kashmir
http://articles.timesofindia.indiatimes ... ied-bodies

We should run a campaign on the deaths of Falung Gong followers, how kidneys are extraxted on demand from the prisoners there.
http://one-just-world.blogspot.com/2010 ... -camp.html

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 06 Oct 2011 23:34

What are the basci facts of the custody death of the NC worker in J&K jail? Why is NC in turmoil and INC making clukking noises?

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 07 Oct 2011 00:24

Can go to Link language thread also:

Scripting revival

Story about two Kashmiri newspapers being started.