Indian Missiles and Munitions Discussion

arun · Post by **arun** » 04 Oct 2011 22:05

Agni-II Prime (AII+ / A2+) to be tested “after the puja vacation” but. “by October 20” failing that during “November first week”.

Article goes on to report that the Agni II Prime has new technologies like Composite Rocket Motor, indigenous Ring Laser Gyro-based Navigation System and Road Mobile Launch ability.

The Agni-II Prime is also reported in the article as being “an improvement in terms of accuracy, distance and strength. In addition to extra fuel-carrying capacity, the missile has a new motor in its re-entry vehicle for better manoeuvrability and increased range, a flex nozzle in the second stage to avoid anti-ballistic missile defences and an improved navigation system. Though the missile is of the size of boosters as in its cousin Agni-II missile it will extend the range by more than 500 km.”:

Agni-II prime trial likely

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 04 Oct 2011 23:22

it would be a major milestone for us if we can make all stages of any n-missile as composite. that would finally match the config of trident d5.

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 04 Oct 2011 23:23

Lots of confused facts to decode. But lets see or wait for TSS in Hindu.

Agni-II prime trial likely

�BALASORE: After the successful user trial of 2,000-km range Intermediate Range Ballistic Missile (IRBM) Agni-II recently, the Defence Research and Development Organisation (DRDO) is readying for a developmental trial of its latest variant Agni-II Prime. The maiden test of the missile with a strike range of 2,750 km in December last was a failure.

Defence sources said preparation for the test would start in the Wheeler Island off the Orissa coast after the puja vacation.

“We are planning to carry out the test by October 20. If the preparation is not complete, we would schedule the test for November first week. The test would, however, be done before the maiden test of Agni-V missile in December,” said a defence official.

It will be the second developmental test of the Agni-II Prime. The DRDO scientists are yet to taste the success of the missile which will pave the way for the technologists to go for the first test of the Agni-V missile.

The indigenously developed Agni-II Prime missile can hit target at ranges between 2,500 km and 3,000 km. It has been developed to bridge the gap between the 2,000-km range Agni-II and 3,500-km range Agni-III missile. The 700-km range Agni-I and Agni-II have already been inducted in the Armed Forces.

The first experimental trial of the surface-to-surface IRBM Agni-II Prime failed on December 10 last year as the missile deviated from the trajectory and nose-dived into the Bay of Bengal nearly 30 seconds after lift-off. “There was no stage separation. The missile covered only about 15 km before plunging down,” said a DRDO scientist.

Even as the defence authorities admitted to the mission’s failure, they said many new technologies like Composite Rocket Motor, indigenous Ring Laser Gyro-based Navigation System and Road Mobile Launch were tested during the trial. “We have made some corrections in the missile system and hope it would cover the desired distance,” the official said.

The Agni-II Prime is an improvement in terms of accuracy, distance and strength.� In addition to extra fuel-carrying capacity, the missile has a new motor in its re-entry vehicle for better manoeuvrability and increased range, a flex nozzle in the second stage to avoid anti-ballistic missile defences and an improved navigation system.

Though the missile is of the size of boosters as in its cousin Agni-II missile it will extend the range by more than 500 km.� Few changes have been incorporated in the missile to make it lighter while the weapon system this time has also been provided with greater thrust.

Flex Nozzle primary purpose is TVC for SS flight. Above stated reason implies something else.

PratikDas · Post by **PratikDas** » 06 Oct 2011 05:33

TOI: Third generation Nag test-firing in Pokhran soon

The optical guidance system of Nag makes it virtually jam-proof unlike infra-red seekers of the Javelin and the Spike. The indigenous development of an imaging seeker, a highly complex and closely guarded technology, is Nag's biggest advantage.

The Nag provides its operator with another important tactical advantage. The plume of burning propellant from the tail of most missiles gives away its flight path and allows the target to get behind cover. The Nag, in contrast, is visible only during the first one second of flight, when the missile's booster imparts 90% of the momentum; after that, a sustainer maintains the missile's speed, burning a smokeless propellant that is practically invisible.

RKumar · Post by **RKumar** » 06 Oct 2011 19:37

Offical status of Missiles (Agni, Prithvi, Nag, Trishul, Akash)

Prithvi

* Completion of Development of Army version and induction in service (with one type of warhead).
* Dev. pf 2 more type of warheads is nearing completion.
* Dev. of Air Force Version of Prithvi.
* User Training and documentation, ESP for Prithvi.

Trishul

* Proving of 3 beam guidance.
* Proving of Sea skimmer role.
* Development of Trishul combat vehicle (Dev and user version).
* Development fo Airforce launch, Airforce Radar vehicle.
* Dev Trials of Naval version completed.
* Advanced stage in dev. trials of Army and Airforce system.

Akash

* Realisation of Ramjet Propulsion Technology.
* Realisation of phased Array Radar (Dev & user version) and other ground systems like BCC, BSR and 3D-CAR.
* Completion of TOT to BDL for Assembly & Integration.
* Successful flight against electronic target.

Nag

* Realisation of Nag Missile carrier (NAMICA).
* Realisation of Day Versiion Seeker.
* All weather seeker under advanced stage of development.
* Dev. flight from Tube Launcher and NAMICA.

Agni

* Successfully established Re-entry Technology with Carbon-Carbon Heat shield.

host of other products also DRDO Major Products/Technologies

Drishyaman · Post by **Drishyaman** » 06 Oct 2011 21:00

RKumar wrote:Offical status of Missiles (Agni, Prithvi, Nag, Trishul, Akash)
Prithvi

Trishul

* Proving of 3 beam guidance.
* Proving of Sea skimmer role.
* Development of Trishul combat vehicle (Dev and user version).
* Development fo Airforce launch, Airforce Radar vehicle.
* Dev Trials of Naval version completed.
* Advanced stage in dev. trials of Army and Airforce system.

Wasn't the Trishul shelved ? Or, is it that DRDO is keeping it alive without the support of the armed forces or is it that DRDO has missed out on updating the site with the correct info ? Can somebody give some insight on this ?

prithvi · Post by **prithvi** » 06 Oct 2011 21:56

Drishyaman wrote:
Prithvi

Trishul

* Proving of 3 beam guidance.
* Proving of Sea skimmer role.
* Development of Trishul combat vehicle (Dev and user version).
* Development fo Airforce launch, Airforce Radar vehicle.
* Dev Trials of Naval version completed.
* Advanced stage in dev. trials of Army and Airforce system.

Wasn't the Trishul shelved ? Or, is it that DRDO is keeping it alive without the support of the armed forces or is it that DRDO has missed out on updating the site with the correct info ? Can somebody give some insight on this ?

I have no confidence over the frequency of updates of site content from Govt. Organizations.. this page probably has not changed in last 10 years

SSridhar · Post by **SSridhar** » 07 Oct 2011 07:21

India studying NATO offer on joining missile programme - TSS in The Hindu

The North Atlantic Treaty Organisation's (NATO) invitation to India in the first week of September to be a partner in its ballistic missile defence (BMD) programme is being analysed, according to V.K. Saraswat, Scientific Adviser to the Defence Minister.

“We are analysing the report. It is under consideration,” he said on September 30 after the successful launch of the Agni-II ballistic missile from the Wheeler Island on the Orissa coast.

After three successful test-flights of Shourya, Prithvi-II and Agni-II missiles, all surface-to-surface missiles, on September 24, 26 and 30, the DRDO is getting ready to launch Agni-II Prime from the Wheeler Island. “The two stages of Agni-II Prime, their rocket motors and the re-entry vehicle are ready,” the DRDO Director-General said.

Tessy Thomas, Project Director, Agni-II Prime, said: “We are flying” the Agni-II Prime in the first week of November and that “everything is ready” for the launch. The two-stage missile has a range of 3,000 km.

It will lift off from a road-mobile launcher, that is, a huge truck. Ms. Thomas was confident that a problem in the control system of Agni-II Prime in its maiden flight in December 2010 would be overcome this time.

The DRDO is also busy with the maiden launch of the Agni-V ballistic missile in December. The three-stage, surface-to-surface missile can take out targets 5,000 km away.

ranjithnath · Post by **ranjithnath** » 07 Oct 2011 08:57

^^didnt we see another report clarifying that they havent infact offered any co-operation in BMD??

venku_Raj · Post by **venku_Raj** » 07 Oct 2011 09:17

Israeli missile shield for Bengaluru, the tech city

Kanson · Post by **Kanson** » 07 Oct 2011 10:10

from another blog with tantalizing topic......

Also provided by Russia (via NPO Mashinostroyenia) is the technology for fabricating hermitically sealed cannisters made of maraging steel, which can ‘cold-launch’ missiles weighing up to 50-tonnes (like the Agni-5).

hmm, cannister for Shourya is made of fibre glass not maraging steel. So is this too imported from Russsia? Is such hermetically selaed cannisters so hard to make to get imported from Russia? I dont know where such concoction of stories going to end.

when it comes to the hypersonic MIRV warheads and their terminal guidance sensors for both missiles, there exists no other option for ASL but to import them off-the-shelf, or—depending on Russian generosity and its willingness to be economical with its commitment to the Nuclear Non-proliferation Treaty—fabricate them in-country but with Russian mentoring.

What we are developing is ABM defeating RVs as well as MIRVs. If Agni-II RV is designed to defeat ABM defence, will not MIRV for Agni-V in development could be any different? Russians are in the process of developing and testing such MIRVs in response to the American provocation. Recently failed Russian ballistic missile test is believed to be equipped with such MIRV. How is that Russians share such cutting edge technologies to be fabricated in India with their mentoring, when they themselves are still in the development phase. And who will share such strategic technologies?

Anujan · Post by **Anujan** » 07 Oct 2011 10:56

PSLV can already inject multiple satellites into orbit.

Boreas · Post by **Boreas** » 07 Oct 2011 11:03

Russians are in the process of developing and testing such MIRVs in response to the American provocation.

I am not sure what "such MIRV" refers to. But russian have "the MIRV" technology from decades.

Bulava, Toplov-M, RS-26 are all well tested and currently deployed MIRV warhead missiles. Infact the technology used in Bulava is said to be the best of the time.

negi · Post by **negi** » 07 Oct 2011 11:06

L&T already makes the launcher for Brahmos and it is again cold launched. Not sure why making something similar for Shaurya will be a challenge.

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 07 Oct 2011 11:15

I am not too sure composite tubes for heavy missiles meant to spend months on the backs of trucks and rail wagons is in use anywhere? the missiles themselves may be composite casing ofcourse. are you sure the Shaurya tube is composite?

composites have a tendency to crack if stressed beyond a point (?), while metals being malleable will deform only.

rohitvats · Post by **rohitvats** » 07 Oct 2011 15:14

This may be an idiotic question but please do indulge me - what kind of 'terminal guidance sensors' are mounted on RV to assist them in accurate targeting? Is their any such thing? Thanx.

koti · Post by **koti** » 07 Oct 2011 15:42

^^ One of the link I found.
http://www.google.co.in/url?sa=t&source ... kECmc7Aj2g

Also, I remember reading somewhere that some re-entry vehicles had gravity sensors that could uniquely identify the Gravity anomalies over a target(City say) like a finger print.

Added later. There is also an elusive system called Bus guidance system that is employed in some MIRV vehicles. Couldn't find any useful links on it though.

Link

Austin · Post by **Austin** » 07 Oct 2011 16:00

rohitvats wrote:This may be an idiotic question but please do indulge me - what kind of 'terminal guidance sensors' are mounted on RV to assist them in accurate targeting? Is their any such thing? Thanx.

Its a good question and considering its a classified subject you wont find many good answers on the subject on how different countries dealt with the issue of terminal guidance.

But what is certainly know is how the US Perishing II system used a J band radar for terminal guidance and it was known to accurate enough for Soviets to force into INF treaty , I see a lot of common with Agni 1/2 RV design and that of Perishing 2 system including movable nozzle and control surface on RV (skirt) , they call that Reaction Control System on Agni-3 and it does the same job ( i think the latter uses gas dynamic system instead of steerable nozzle as on Agni-2 )

It wont be a far fetched idea to think Agni uses similar Radar Terminal Guidance and Corelation system post re-entry , you can read and get some idea on how Perishing-2 system terminal guidance worked as its well described in the link.
http://www.flightglobal.com/pdfarchive/ ... 02609.html

Ofcourse in todays world of Laser INS and Mil Grade GLONASS signal being available its less challenging to do the same job as it was in 80's

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 07 Oct 2011 16:45

well the thing is N-missiles must assume no availability of outside help (GPS,glonass, ground based beacons) or even a helpful radar sig / DSMAC etc once they leave the tube.
once they leave the tube, it must be assumed WW3 has started and the shit has hit the fan.

iirc most ICBMs have a dual INS system and maybe a stellar navigation pkg to x-check once they clear the atmosphere, but mainly they depend on dual INS to cross the earth and touch down with 100m cep.

the MIT instrumentation lab developed the american system over a couple of decades of refinement....
http://nuclearweaponarchive.org/Usa/Weapons/Airs.html

alexis · Post by **alexis** » 07 Oct 2011 16:49

Ravi Karumanchiri wrote:Kersi D,

I have watched the IGMDP for some years now, and have paid closer-than-average attention to the progress reporting and various announcements that have come out of various members of the Indian establishment. I have done a fair bit of Googling, and have read a lot of what has been written online about the various missiles and subsystems under development. Altogether, a few realizations have dawned upon me that I think may help clarify the situation you are asking about:

1. Names (Sagarika, Shaurya, etc.) don’t really mean all that much, particularly during a development program, when specifications are not fixed, and capabilities are being extended and augmented, as the technologies under development are refined and applied. For example, for a long time the Shaurya was reportedly a ballistic missile, but then after its first test it was revealed to be a very high speed cruise missile.

Can you please provide any reference that Shaurya is a cruise missile? I thought it was a maneuverable ballistic missile.

gakakkad · Post by **gakakkad** » 07 Oct 2011 17:19

^^ shaurya is a scramjet... one need to reach to attain an initial velocity of 2.5-4 m for the scramjet to work .(ie they can't work at a 0 velocity)... that initial velocity is provided by a rocket or a ramjet..in case of shaurya that velocity is provided by a rocket... so its a cruise missile... but first stage is rocket ... the function of which is to provide the necessary velocity for the scramjet to start...

koti · Post by **koti** » 07 Oct 2011 17:35

Shaurya is not a Scramjet. It is a conventional Ballistic missile with a suppressed trajectory.

karan_mc · Post by **karan_mc** » 07 Oct 2011 19:30

Hypersonic Glide Missile perhaps

Ravi Karumanchiri · Post by **Ravi Karumanchiri** » 07 Oct 2011 20:04

Shaurya (missile)
From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shaurya_%28missile%29

... [fourth paragraph]

"Shaurya missile was revealed to be designed specifically to be fired from submarines. Top DRDO scientist has confirmed this and said that this missile after taking off and reaching a height of about 50 km will start flying like a Hypersonic cruise missile. Once it reaches the target areas it maneuvers towards the target before striking with an accuracy of 20 to 30 m within the target area.[1]"

"[1]" Shaurya surfaces as India's underwater nuclear missile... "Now top DRDO scientists have revealed that the Shaurya is not a ballistic missile, as it has been thought to be; it is actually a hypersonic cruise missile, which never leaves the atmosphere."

Read the wikipedia article, and follow the links, including this one http://www.indiaresearch.org/Shourya_Missile.pdf

Gentleman,

If it's flying and it's not following a simple ballistic trajectory, then it can only mean that it has guidance. If it has guidance, then it's not ballistic (we're not just talking about MRVs, here). Moreover, who said it was a ramjet or a scramjet? If you look at the thing, you'll see there are no air intakes, which means it is neither a ramjet nor a scramjet. The Shourya/Sagarika are purely rocket powered -- guided, not ballistic -- as in cruise missile.

[End of Missiles 101]

gakakkad · Post by **gakakkad** » 07 Oct 2011 20:05

why is it described as a cruise misslie?

media reporting describes it as cruise citing "top drdo officials"

If it is indeed a quasi-ballistic missile why not call it one...And why the designation "hypersonic".. ballistic missiles are supposed to be hypersonic... I mean no one specially calls agni hypersonic ... that is understood as it is a ballistic missile , they are supposed to have a speed of 5-7 km/s ...

the only question is what propels the 2nd stage..obviously no info in open source....

http://ajaishukla.blogspot.com/2010/02/ ... water.html

"Now top DRDO scientists have revealed that the Shaurya is not a ballistic missile, as it has been thought to be; it is actually a hypersonic cruise missile, which never leaves the atmosphere. A ballistic missile is like a stone being lobbed towards a target. Rockets toss it upwards and towards the target; after the rocket burns out, gravity pulls the missile warhead down towards the target. Buffeted by wind and re-entry forces, accuracy is a problem; and, since the ballistic missile’s path is predictable, shooting it down is relatively easy."

http://www.aviationweek.com/aw/blogs/de ... 4bccb9ab05

"“I would say the Shaurya is a hybrid propulsion missile”, says Saraswat. “Like a ballistic missile, it is powered by solid fuel. And, like a cruise missile, it can guide itself right up to the target.”"

What does Saraswat mean by hybrid propulsion ?

My interpretation was that it is a scramjet (as he describes it as a cruise missile) in which initial propulsion is by a rocket engine to achieve the mach number necessary to fire up a scramjet... why else would he say hybrid propulsion... Of course one can disagree...I am no raakit scientist....

again the answer depends upon what propels 2nd stage ...

Ravi Karumanchiri · Post by **Ravi Karumanchiri** » 07 Oct 2011 20:11

Again, look closely at the Shourya/Sagarika --- there are no air intakes, which mean's it's not an air breather (neither a ramjet nor a scramjet).

That article I pointed to above, clearly describes both the first stage (rocket motor for boost-phase flight), as well as the second stage (slower-burning rocket motor for sustained flight). Both motors are solid fuelled, which again, does not indicate a ramjet or a scramjet, which would require a liquid fuel.

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 07 Oct 2011 20:14

Gakakkad, Its not a ballistic missile as it does not follow a ballistic trajectory. This class of vehicles are called boost glide vehicles (BGRV). They are rockets which follow a pre-programmed path. The all atmosphere path prevents sat detection. Older vehicle used to fly whats called depressed trajctory for same effect. The last flgiht with max range was important milestone for it shows how far it can travel accurately and the efficay of the thermal control system as the flight is mostly in upper atmosphere.

Arun_S did a ppt which is on slideshare.net you might want to read.(Search for BGRV). It shows the evolution of the Shourya from the Prithvi and where it is in international developments.

gakakkad · Post by **gakakkad** » 07 Oct 2011 20:21

ok got it, thanks...now i read the article BY Arun... the american's abandoned this after 1968 ? I searched BGRV ...ANY THE AMERICAN EXPERIMENT OF 1968 COMES UP...

Drishyaman · Post by **Drishyaman** » 07 Oct 2011 20:31

gakakkad wrote:My interpretation was that it is a scramjet (as he describes it as a cruise missile) in which initial propulsion is by a rocket engine to achieve the mach number necessary to fire up a scramjet... why else would he say hybrid propulsion... Of course one can disagree...I am no raakit scientist....

Quoting from Wiki
A scramjet (supersonic combustion ramjet) is a variant of a ramjet airbreathing jet engine in which combustion takes place in supersonic airflow. As in ramjets, a scramjet relies on high vehicle speed to forcefully compress and decelerate the incoming air before combustion (hence ramjet), but whereas a ramjet decelerates the air to subsonic velocities before combustion, airflow in a scramjet is supersonic throughout the entire engine.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scramjet

Hybrid would not necessarily mean scramjet. So, the below statement seems to be true.

Ravi Karumanchiri wrote:If you look at the thing, you'll see there are no air intakes, which means it is neither a ramjet nor a scramjet. The Shourya/Sagarika are purely rocket powered -- guided, not ballistic -- as in cruise missile.

John · Post by **John** » 07 Oct 2011 20:35

Ravi Karumanchiri wrote: Both motors are solid fuelled, which again, does not indicate a ramjet or a scramjet, which would require a liquid fuel.

Just nitpicking ramjet don't necessarily have to be liquid fueled there other variants that burn solid propellant (SA-6/Akash).

koti · Post by **koti** » 07 Oct 2011 22:15

People, whats more interesting that we fail to observe is that, if the Shaurya/ Sagarika duo instead of taking a quasi ballistic path go for a full ballistic trajectory their range is going to be noticeably higher.

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 08 Oct 2011 00:56

But that defeats its advantages.

Vipul · Post by **Vipul** » 08 Oct 2011 01:02

Agni-5 to fly halfway to Antarctica.

After three successful ballistic missile tests during the past fortnight, the Defence R&D Organisation (DRDO) is finalising preparations for the big one. In December, the giant Agni-5 missile will blast off from Wheeler Island, on the Orissa coast, travelling its full range of 5,000 km to a target in the southern Indian Ocean.

Agni-5 is debuting with a full-range test for two reasons. First, so that there is no question about how far it can strike. Second, to test not just the missile, but also whether the DRDO’s monitoring networks can cope with such enormous ranges, tracking the Agni-5 every moment en route to a target 5,000 km away. This will involve transporting a DRDO team and its tracking equipment on Indian Navy warships deep into the southern reaches of the Indian Ocean.

“The Agni-5 missile will travel halfway to Antarctica. The missile’s designers are certain (about the range) but we will demonstrate it for the users,” says Avinash Chander, chief controller for missiles and strategic systems at DRDO.

As director of the Hyderabad-based Advanced Systems Laboratory, he oversaw much of Agni-5’s development. Talking exclusively to Business Standard, he describes how the three-stage, 50-tonne, 17.5-metre high missile will be powered off the Wheeler Island launch pad by its giant first stage; within minutes, it will be in space, powered by a new, all-composite second stage. After heading southwards for 2,000 km, will cross the equator. Then, it will hurtle through space for another 3,000 km or so, re-entering the atmosphere over the Tropic of Capricorn and splashing down at the target somewhere between the southern tip of Africa and Australia.

Following international practice, the DRDO will issue advisories before the test, giving out the launch window and warning shipping and air traffic to stay clear of the target area.

Explains Chander: “No Indian missile has ever travelled so far, except for Isro rockets. But those remain in space and there is no requirement to monitor their re-entry. Besides, space is a collaborative environment, with establishments worldwide cooperating in tracking a rocket. For the Agni-5, we have to develop a network of tracking systems, which will do the job out to 5,000 km and beyond. And, our ships will have to be at the target area to collect the data.”

While the Indian Navy had declined to officially comment, senior sources confirm one of their Offshore Patrol Vessels would position itself at the target end, with a DRDO team on board, equipped with tracking and communications equipment.

The DRDO predicts a highly accurate missile, which will strike within a few hundred metres of the designated target, even after travelling 5,000 km. This would allow the operational version of the Agni-5 to carry a smaller nuclear warhead. “Megaton warheads were used when accuracies were low. Now we talk of (accuracy of) a few hundred metres. That allows a smaller warhead, perhaps 150-250 kilotons, to cause substantial damage. We don’t want to cause wanton damage (with megaton warheads),” says Chander.

The Agni-5’s 5,000-km range, say nuclear strategists, is carefully calibrated. It can reach targets across the globe, except for America and Australia. This prevents alarm bells from going off in friendly capitals, while establishing and strengthening nuclear deterrence against all possible enemies.

“Agni-5 will take us to the 5,000-km plus class of missile systems, which meets all our threat requirements,” said V K Saraswat, the DRDO chief, at a public function recently.

The range keeps it just in the class of intermediate range ballistic missiles, whose range is 3,000-5,500 km. DRDO sources indicate the Agni-5 could easily be ramped up into an intercontinental ballistic missile, having a range greater than 5500 km.

Agni-5 is similar in size and weight to its predecessor, the Agni-3, with a range of 3,500 km. The extensive use of composite materials allows Agni-5 to propel a warhead 1,500 km further. While the first stage remains unchanged from Agni-3, the second stage is significantly lighter, made of composites. This has allowed a third stage, also composite, to be fitted, extending the range.

Engineering the third stage was a major technology challenge. “The third stage, which slopes into the warhead stage, has a conical motor. So far, we have only been doing cylindrical motors, never a shaped motor,” explains Chander.

Another distinctive feature is its ‘canisterisation’. Hermetically sealed into an airtight canister that is mounted on a flatbed truck, the missile can be easily transported and fired quickly, by hydraulically raising the canister into the vertical firing position. Made from high-strength maraging steel, the canister must absorb enormous stresses during firing, when a thrust of 300-400 tonnes is generated to eject the 50-tonne missile The canister also provides a hermitically sealed atmosphere, in which the missile is stored safely for years.

Ravi Karumanchiri · Post by **Ravi Karumanchiri** » 08 Oct 2011 07:12

John wrote:
Ravi Karumanchiri wrote: Both motors are solid fuelled, which again, does not indicate a ramjet or a scramjet, which would require a liquid fuel.
Just nitpicking ramjet don't necessarily have to be liquid fueled there other variants that burn solid propellant (SA-6/Akash).

Very cool.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Akash_missile
http://knol.google.com/k/akash-missile#
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ramjet
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scramjet
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9YpHtSQmfxM

gakakkad · Post by **gakakkad** » 08 Oct 2011 08:02

@ Drishyaman - Thats what I was trying to say ... that a scramjet cannot be fired at 0 speed...You need to push it to a particular speed for it to work ..

As far as air intakes are concerned , the picture /video is not high res enough for us to comment definitively on air Intakes... I mean in the tomahawk they are present under the belly.. But if you look at the video you don't notice them.. Is there a panoramic view of the Shaurya available ? Especially the tip ?

Though the guy Arun seems to have a highly placed chaiwala..his article seems accurate ..so I believe that Shaurya is a unique cruise missile that is rocket propelled ....

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 08 Oct 2011 08:20

> full range A5 test

subhan allah, thats been a brf maximalist warmonger agenda rant for quite a while now.

hopefully it will be night near antarctica with the test being fired pre-dawn...so that we can get a soothing shot like this from ship cameras....

this is from a MX MIRV re-entry test over the pacific
http://catholicphoenix.com/wp-content/u ... issile.jpg

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 08 Oct 2011 08:24

btw the trident apart from being all composite for its phenomenal speed seems to have a amazing third stage conical motor that actually is a annular ring engulfing the warhead section within. this reduces its length vs having a separate warhead section.

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/c ... System.png

M51 also seems on similar lines though not explained overtly
http://forum.valka.cz/attachments/5029/ ... 51_003.jpg

something to think about how our K-4 weapon could be like....

koti · Post by **koti** » 08 Oct 2011 08:37

Vipul wrote:Agni-5 to fly halfway to Antarctica.

After three successful ballistic missile tests during the past fortnight, the Defence R&D Organisation (DRDO) is finalising preparations for the big one. In December, the giant Agni-5 missile will blast off from Wheeler Island, on the Orissa coast, travelling its full range of 5,000 km to..............

What I found interesting are

The range keeps it just in the class of intermediate range ballistic missiles, whose range is 3,000-5,500 km. DRDO sources indicate the Agni-5 could easily be ramped up into an intercontinental ballistic missile, having a range greater than 5500 km.

This would allow the operational version of the Agni-5 to carry a smaller nuclear warhead. “Megaton warheads were used when accuracies were low. Now we talk of (accuracy of) a few hundred metres. That allows a smaller warhead, perhaps 150-250 kilotons, to cause substantial damage.

Since it is going to be much similar to Agni III its payload should be similar too. This could imply we might also be working on a MIRV'd payload in the making.

dinesha · Post by **dinesha** » 08 Oct 2011 08:43

Vipul wrote:Agni-5 to fly halfway to Antarctica.
That allows a smaller warhead, perhaps 150-250 kilotons, to cause substantial damage. We don’t want to cause wanton damage (with megaton warheads),” says (Avinash ) Chander ( chief controller for missiles and strategic systems at DRDO)..

What does it say about the strategic nuclear arsenal? Flaws with the thermonuclear design has been sorted out and confidence on its functioning with reasonable desired result has been achieved?

prithvi · Post by **prithvi** » 08 Oct 2011 08:49

Vipul wrote:Agni-5 to fly halfway to Antarctica.

After three successful ballistic missile tests during the past fortnight, the Defence R&D Organisation (DRDO) is finalising preparations for the big one. In December, the giant Agni-5 missile will blast off from Wheeler Island, on the Orissa coast, travelling its full range of 5,000 km to a target in the southern Indian Ocean.

“The Agni-5 missile will travel halfway to Antarctica. The missile’s designers are certain (about the range) but we will demonstrate it for the users,” says Avinash Chander, chief controller for missiles and strategic systems at DRDO.

As director of the Hyderabad-based Advanced Systems Laboratory, he oversaw much of Agni-5’s development. Talking exclusively to Business Standard, he describes how the three-stage, 50-tonne, 17.5-metre high missile will be powered off the Wheeler Island launch pad by its giant first stage; within minutes, it will be in space, powered by a new, all-composite second stage. After heading southwards for 2,000 km, will cross the equator. Then, it will hurtle through space for another 3,000 km or so, re-entering the atmosphere over the Tropic of Capricorn and splashing down at the target somewhere between the southern tip of Africa and Australia.

God forbid .. if something goes wrong.. can the dummy warhead fall into a populated region--different country and all.. what is the international convention in those scenarios... i remember a year back failure of Bulava in Scandinavia...