J&K News and Discussion-2011

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RajeshA
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Re: J&K News and Discussion-2011

Post by RajeshA »

Published on Oct 28, 2011
By Vikram Sood
Confused on Kashmir: Deccan Chronicle
It has been said so often by so many but it still bears repetition that Pakistan’s foreign policy agenda has only one item on it — India.

For pursuit of this obsession, Pakistan has followed policies in the region that allowed itself to be in a situation where US secretary of state Hillary Clinton rebuked Pakistan while in Pakistan recently.

Those of us here who delude ourselves that this would galvanise Pakistan to now quickly change policy might do well to shed this delusion. The rest of us know that Pakistan will not change its policy and indeed it cannot afford to.

Pakistan’s quest for equality, if not supremacy over India, has rested on the tripod of the nuclear option, terrorism and strategic depth in Afghanistan.

The China-Pakistan nexus was and is a valuable add-on to both because it continues to give Pakistan added muscle to take on India.
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Re: J&K News and Discussion-2011

Post by ramana »

Centre in quandry over Omar's stance
Centre in quandary over Omar’s hardening stance

Friday, 28 October 2011 00:37

PNS | New Delhi/Srinagar

Jammu & Kashmir Chief Minister Omar Abdullah’s “unilateral” decision to remove the Armed Forces Special Powers Act (AFSPA) from four districts of the State has put the Centre in a quandary and widened the chasm between Congress and its coalition partner National Conference.

The Defence Ministry and the Army have vehemently opposed any such move making it difficult for the Home Ministry — which is backing Omar — to take a call. It is against this backdrop that Prime Minister Manmohan Singh chaired a Cabinet Committee on Security (CCS) meeting here on Thursday to discuss the issue with Defence Minister AK Antony and Home Minister P Chidambaram.

Sources said the Centre was not likely to take a decision in haste considering the wider ramifications like escalation in violence and militants taking advantage by taking refuge in the zones where AFSPA was not applicable.

As for the Congress, its J&K president and head of the coordination committee of the coalition, Saifuddin Soz came out openly against Omar saying he was “not consulted”. Backing Soz, the party leadership reminded Omar that running a coalition needed mutual consultations and gently cautioned him that there was also an understanding between the two over an annual performance review of his Government.

Omar, however, not only asserted that his Cabinet would discuss the matter on Friday but also that he would forcefully press for the revocation of the controversial legislation.

{Competetive authoritarian model. He needs INC support to be in power but asserts his right to make unlateral decisiosn. Shows his anti-democratice nature. He is doing that because he has PC's backing which is most likely Rahul baba's stance: Be in power and run with the discontended.}


Sources said the Army had sought to dispel the misgivings about AFSPA and alleged human rights violations by citing the Supreme Court ruling that powers given to the armed forces like search and arrest without warrant and use of force to the extent of causing death under the Act were not in violation of Article 14, 19 or 21 of the Constitution.

The apex court in its ruling in the case, Naga People’s Movement of Human Rights Versus Union of India, unambiguously said the AFSPA could not be regarded as a colourable legislation or a fraud on the Constitution.

Moreover, Army commanders in their discussions with the Cabinet Secretary-headed Central Government team, which visited the State last week, maintained that the situation report card of one year or so cannot be the basis for removing AFSPA from certain areas. They also countered the State Government’s plea for AFSPA’s removal on the ground that the four proposed zones were relatively peaceful by stating that it came about due to AFSPA and relentless pro-active operations against the militants over the last one decade.

The Defence Ministry concurred with the Army’s assessment and it was conveyed to the political leadership at the Centre as well in Jammu & Kashmir, sources said.

Soz said, “The decision is wrong if the country’s Defence Minister is not consulted.” He claimed that the coordination committee of the coalition headed by him also did not know about the decision.

AICC incharge of J&K Mohan Prakash said AFSPA’s withdrawal was a major decision and it should have been taken only after mutual consultations. “Whatever PCC president has said there must be some reasons behind it. It is not a happy situation and there is need for better coordination between the two parties,” Prakash said. However, the Congress has refused to take any stand on the controversial legislation saying it will go by whatever the Centre decides. :rotfl:

While Omar maintained that Deputy Chief Minister Tara Chand, who is a senior Congress leader, was on board over the AFSPA decision, Opposition People’s Democratic Party chief Mehbooba Mufti blamed the coalition bickering for the worsening security situation in J&K. She said revocation of AFSPA was inevitable for restoration of civil liberties in the embattled state.

Elaborating upon so-called wrong perception about the AFSPA, officials said various powers available to the police under the provision of Criminal Procedure Code (CrPC) are more encompassing and it has wider powers relating to arrest, search, seizure, summoning of witnesses, preventive detention as compared to the AFSPA.

Moreover, Section 45 of the CrPC disallows arrest of public servants and Section 197 provides impunity against prosecution. A similar provision in the form of Section 7 is there in the AFSPA which offers protection to personnel acting in good faith in their official capacity. Prosecution is permitted only after sanction of the central government under this section.

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Re: J&K News and Discussion-2011

Post by sunnyP »

What is Papa Abdullah's stance on all of this?

Sometimes I think we have the wrong family member holding power in J&K. At least one of them has some convictions whereas the other is all about popularity and PR.
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Re: J&K News and Discussion-2011

Post by RamaY »

There is a trend to this...

Looks like the coalition mindset is getting into INC core.

While UPA is a coalition govt, even INC itself is a coalition of various groups.

The old group seems to have their own set of coalitions. The new group is forming a new coalition around RG. RG's group seems to be PC, DS, OA, T-INC and few others. We need to watch RG closely to understand the coterie he is developing across the political nation.

Rajmata on the other hand has her own group with likes of AP, GA etc.,

FA seems to belong to another group with likes of PM, MMS etc.,
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Re: J&K News and Discussion-2011

Post by sum »

^^ OA seems to have just as much IQ levels as his idol, the (un)crown prince of the nation if one goes by the harebrained stuff he has managed to do in his short term so far!!
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Re: J&K News and Discussion-2011

Post by shyamd »

RamaY wrote:There is a trend to this...

Looks like the coalition mindset is getting into INC core.

While UPA is a coalition govt, even INC itself is a coalition of various groups.

The old group seems to have their own set of coalitions. The new group is forming a new coalition around RG. RG's group seems to be PC, DS, OA, T-INC and few others. We need to watch RG closely to understand the coterie he is developing across the political nation.

Rajmata on the other hand has her own group with likes of AP, GA etc.,

FA seems to belong to another group with likes of PM, MMS etc.,
Of course this is the same in every country. Every minister is organised like a royal court. THey have their own right hand men to do dirty jobs, and advisors/strategists.

---------------------------------

Antony backs Army on AFSPA
Shishir Gupta, Hindustan Times
New Delhi, October 27, 2011
Email to Author

First Published: 23:24 IST(27/10/2011)
Last Updated: 01:49 IST(28/10/2011)
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Defence minister AK Antony has told Army chief General VK Singh that he is on the same page as the Indian Army on its opposition to the withdrawal of Armed Forces Special Powers Act (AFSPA) from selected areas of J&K and will not allow any adverse decision that will affect the morale of troops in the strife-torn state.


Last week, Antony and General VK Singh had a detailed discussion on CM Omar Abdullah's AFSPA withdrawal proposal with the latter impressing on the minister that it would be impossible for the army to operate in J&K without the cover of the Act as the force would get bogged down in legal battles.

General Singh has told the defence minister that limited withdrawal of AFSPA is only to score political points against opposition parties as no such demand has been raised by people. He also made it clear that it would be politically impossible to impose the Act again in case it was withdrawn.

However, the view of defence ministry and the army is not shared by the home ministry, which wants the AFSPA to be lifted from certain areas as it will be a confidence-building measure for people of the state and will send a strong signal to the international community.

The army top brass is extremely cut up with Sheikh Mustafa Kamal, uncle of Omar and senior National Conference leader, for broadly hinting that the military was behind the grenade attacks in Srinagar on October 25.

Kamal, Hazratbal MLA and NC president Farooq Abdullah's brother, was forced to eat his words after northern army commander Lt General KT Parnaik called up Abdullah and told him that such remarks were unacceptable. Omar told Gen Parnaik that he had no clue about Kamal's statement as he was in Delhi but later forced his uncle to issue a retraction.

Although Omar is trying to mend fences with the army by praising its role in curbing militancy in J&K, the top brass is not impressed.
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Re: J&K News and Discussion-2011

Post by ramana »

RamaY, Good summary. Yes Rahul is creating a new coterie.
They want pwoer and also lead the opposition.

A US historian studied Rome during the transition from Senate to Imperium and showed by looking at the coterie around Augustus Caesar that the transition as inevitable.

His techniques led studies of Hitler and his gang.

------

Ronald Syme and his book
The Roman Revolution

Wiki article for those who don't have time:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Roman_Revolution
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Re: J&K News and Discussion-2011

Post by anjan »

ramana wrote: A US historian studied Rome during the transition from Senate to Imperium and showed by looking at the coterie around Augustus Caesar that the transition as inevitable.
Very OT but the nature of the power distribution in Rome is what made it inevitable. "Caesar" by Christian Mier does a good job of expounding this case. If it hadn't been Caesar it would have been someone else.
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Re: J&K News and Discussion-2011

Post by ramana »

Same thing with the INC baba gang. They will find a new baba. That was my point.
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Re: J&K News and Discussion-2011

Post by Airavat »

Image
The historians have by and large given fair rating to Dogra rulers, some of whom were deeply interested in public welfare and it was during the period of last ruler that seeds of democracy were sown in Jammu and Kashmir with constitution of Praja Sabha comprising of people's representatives to look after the major public affairs. Some of the plans and programmes of the Dogra rulers, which were found beneficial for common good, are still alive. The rich cultural heritage and the forwarding looking steps inspire confidence among the masses for permanent peace, rapid progress, social and communal harmony in this State....
Story of Dogra Rule

I wish people would not use the term "Dogra" for these rulers. Firstly, because their actual surname was Jamwal.

Secondly, and more importantly, Dogra is the provincial term for the people of Jammu and neighboring regions. Repeatedly talking of Dogra rule or Dogra dynasty gives the impression that the people of Jammu were ruling over the people of Kashmir, Ladakh, and Gilgit, but that was never the case. All regions were under the same administration, which recruited its members from such diverse communities like Kashmiri Pandits, Punjabis, Britons, etc.

Terming them the "Jamwal rulers" or the "Jamwal dynasty" will reduce the still lingering hostility between the two important regions of Jammu and Kashmir. Not by much, but still a start.
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Re: J&K News and Discussion-2011

Post by chetak »




I have one simple question.

What motivates these Indian Army senior idiots from periodically going to the press and shooting off their mouths about how infiltration has decreased ??

Are they being audited or are they going to stand for elections??
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Re: J&K News and Discussion-2011

Post by ramana »

Chetak, You are blaming the wrong people. Its Omar Abdullah who wants to rule Kashmir and sip juice with terrorists. Thats where the problem is. Saifuddin Soz of the J&K Congress, Mehbooba Mufti of PD both want the AFSPA to stay. Its Omar Abdullah hiding behind Rahul that wants to appease terrorists.

One should learn to see clearly and not blame the wrong people.
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Re: J&K News and Discussion-2011

Post by chetak »

ramana wrote:Chetak, You are blaming the wrong people. Its Omar Abdullah who wants to rule Kashmir and sip juice with terrorists. Thats where the problem is. Saifuddin Soz of the J&K Congress, Mehbooba Mufti of PD both want the AFSPA to stay. Its Omar Abdullah hiding behind Rahul that wants to appease terrorists.

One should learn to see clearly and not blame the wrong people.
Ramana ji,

This is a very long standing grouse of mine.

For years together, some idiot came on tv and religiously said infiltration has come down and some months later another idiot came up on TV again and spouted the same nonsense.

WHO is asking for such statistics when no numbers are given most of the time??

What is the purpose of such tomfoolery??

Sirjee, one more thing, Soz and mufti don't want omar to remove the AFSPA, they want to be the ones to do it. :lol:

ALL separatists want the act to be removed and that includes soz, mufti and omar.
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Re: J&K News and Discussion-2011

Post by svinayak »

Conspiracy being hatched to change JK’s demography: Shah
SATURDAY, 29 OCTOBER 2011 20:45 SRINAGAR: KDNN
http://www.kashmirdispatch.com/headline ... inagar.htm

Senior leader of Hurriyat Conference and chairman Freedom Party Shabir Ahmad Shah Saturday asked people to fight conspiracies to change the demography of the Jammu and Kashmir.

Addressing a public gathering at Lar Ganderbal, Shah expressed regret that Indian government has confined the democracy in Jammu and Kashmir to mere lip service, a statement quoted him as saying.

“He also drew the attention of people on changing the demography of the state and said that as per the law, women marrying outside forfeits the citizenship right. But according to a decision by division bench of the high court, these women will continue to enjoy the right,” the statement said.

Shah, according to the statement, said that change in the state subject law was meant to change the Muslim majority to minority in the state.

He said that settling the slum dwellers was also meant to change the demography. “Shah asked people not to allow these conspiracies of government of India to succeed. India wants to make people stateless in their own state in the same manner as Israel did with the settlement of non-Arab jews among Palestinian Arabs.”

He said state government has moved a bill in state assembly to settle non-state subject slum dwellers.

“He asked people to fight it tooth and nail as it is aimed to change the local demography. Conspiracy is being hatched to change the demography of the state and both leadership and people have to fight against it,” he said.

Shah also expressed his resentment over "growing activities of Christian missionaries and urged Ulemas and Islamic bodies to take strong notice against luring the people with money to change their Islamic religion. "Wherever such incidents have occurred, they need to go there are make people realise about the devotion to Islam,” he said.
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Re: J&K News and Discussion-2011

Post by Anindya »

From http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/indi ... 540522.cms
NEW DELHI: "Bandits and criminals" have been taking advantage of militancy in Jammu and Kashmir and are raping, murdering, extorting money and using mafia practices and later blaming security forces for the crimes, says a Europe-based thinktank.

In its recent report, Belgian Association for Solidarity with Jammu and Kashmir said while bandits and criminals are there in every society, in J&K, however, they are taking advantage of the troubled situation.

"They are abducting people for money, raping, murdering, extorting money, using mafia practices, etc. under the cover of 'the movement'. For them this is a lucrative industry and under the present circumstances, it is easy to blame the security forces of all crimes that are committed," said the report prepared by the Belgium-based organisation after visiting the state in summer this year.

During the visit, the team of the think-tank led by Paul Beersmans met a cross-section of the people including pro-Pakistan Syed Ali Shah Geelani and moderate leaders including Bilal Lone and Abdul Gani Bhat besides politicians from the mainstream political parties.

In its 17-page report, it condemned the separatist leadership for turning a blind eye to human rights violations being committed by terrorists.

"There is no doubt that human rights violations are being committed by the security forces and by the militants. There is also no doubt that not all cases of human rights violations committed by the security forces are disclosed or prosecuted.

"It is also a fact that the security forces always are blamed if something happens. Separatist leaders are not critical on human rights violations committed by militants. A few months back two teenage sisters were abducted by militants and shot dead in cold blood 'to teach them a lesson'. Nobody dared to criticise this heinous crime," the report said.

The report was referring to the killing of Arifa and Akhter who were allegedly done to death by Lashker-e-Taiba terrorists on January 31, this year in Sopore area.....
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Re: J&K News and Discussion-2011

Post by menon s »

conclusions drawn by Belgium based think tank on terrorism in J&K state
http://basjak.org/doc/jkgen1003rap.pdf
Any pressure on India to resume dialogue with Pakistan in connection with the Kashmir-issue is based on
the illusion and misconception that this will wriggle out Pakistan of its internal crisis. Pakistan created and
supported militancy in J&K and the Taliban in Afghanistan. It boomeranged on them. Terrorism has
become a global problem, a global threat. It is foolish to think that there will be peace in the region if the
Government of India gives in to the pressure of the terrorist. At the contrary, the Islamic fundamentalists
will see this as a major victory and they will be emboldened to further their Islamic ideology. India has to
behave as an assertive nation.
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Re: J&K News and Discussion-2011

Post by shiv »

chetak wrote: I have one simple question.

What motivates these Indian Army senior idiots from periodically going to the press and shooting off their mouths about how infiltration has decreased ??

Are they being audited or are they going to stand for elections??
Who is saying that? Here is a link to a Google search on "Kashmir infiltration attempts"

http://zeenews.india.com/news/nation/in ... 60841.html
Infiltration bids have gone up in last 2 months: Army
Last Updated: Monday, October 11, 2010,

New Delhi: Around 25 infiltration attempts have been made by militants from across the Line of Control (LoC) in the last two months and 35-40 terrorists have been killed by the security forces during the same period, Army chief General V K Singh said Monday.

He said the number of infiltration attempts has gone up in the last two months but the Army has been able to control it to a large extent.

"In the last two months, we have had approximately 20-25 attempts and the total number of terrorists killed during this period has been about 35-40," Gen Singh told reporters on the sidelines of a function here.

Asked about reports suggesting that Hizbul Mujahideen chief Syed Salahuddin has been visiting terror camps along the LoC with Pakistan Army and ISI officials, the Army chief said, "Salahuddin is on the other side... We are not worried that with whom he goes around. If he tries to infiltrate, he would also be dealt in the same way his accomplices are."
Earlier in June the statistics were different
http://newsblaze.com/story/201106211203 ... story.html
Srinagar, June 21: A senior Indian army official Tuesday said infiltration attempts by militants from across the Line of Control (defacto border between India and Pakistan in Kashmir)) were at a 20-year low.

"The infiltration attempts from across the LoC have come down to a 20-year low as no militant has been able enter Kashmir this year. There have been two infiltration attempts this year but both were unsuccessful. I will not claim that we eliminated the militants but they were not able to cross to this side of LoC," a top army official in Kashmir Lt Gen S A Hasnain told media on sidelines of a function in North Kashmir.
Over the last decade the attempts have indeed gone down largely because of better methods of checking infiltration and killing them at the border. I have a graph somewhere but this is the only one I can find for now

Image

related video
http://khabar.ndtv.com/PlayVideo.aspx?f ... &id=214785
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Re: J&K News and Discussion-2011

Post by vishvak »

Our secular media is yet to get some 'saffron' handle here. If not present, then it could be manufactured.
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Re: J&K News and Discussion-2011

Post by hulaku »

vishvak wrote:
Our secular media is yet to get some 'saffron' handle here. If not present, then it could be manufactured.
Diggy Raja will soon come out with a statement that RSS was behind this.
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Re: J&K News and Discussion-2011

Post by Anindya »

vishvak
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Re: J&K News and Discussion-2011

Post by vishvak »

Apparently Omar Abdulla was a good friend of Raul Gandhi. Guess it is all friends against just non seculars.
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Re: J&K News and Discussion-2011

Post by CRamS »

Guy, I have a simple quiz for you. My gripe with this puke Soumitro Das is not because of his virulent opposition to AFSPA Caught in the act according to him, but in fact some other TSP-like characterization on India's travails in J&K. Can you point that out?
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Re: J&K News and Discussion-2011

Post by Pranay »

http://www.ndtv.com/video/player/news/h ... /215134?hp

AFSPA, Omar Abdullah and the wider question of the "shelf life" of such a law in J&K and elsewhere in India.
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Re: J&K News and Discussion-2011

Post by abhishek_sharma »

'Army should stay away from service delivery': Ansari
The much-applauded development initiative of the Indian army - Operation Sadbhavana - is producing the unintended and undesirable result of further edging out the civil administration in the state, said Professor MM Ansari, one of the three central interlocutors for Jammu & Kashmir.

The key to the government's J&K policy should be to strengthen the state and local body administration and withdraw the army's presence from delivery of basic public services, Ansari told HT in an interview, arguing that there was a need for the "politics of good governance take strong roots".

Operation Sadbhavana (meaning Goodwill) was launched by the army in 1998, famously reinvented in 2002 to win the hearts and minds (Wham, as the army strategists called it) of people.

It has since been replicated by other central forces, who set up medical camps, repair and maintain schools, provide vocational training as well as construct toilet blocks, small bridges and culverts.

"It is simply not their job to provide education, health and other facilities… the objective was to carve an operating space for the armed forces but they have ended up narrowing the scope of the local bodies," Ansari, who was roped in at the instance of the PMO as one of the three interlocutors, said.

"There is no longer an emergency situation as may be in the past…. There should be willingness to accept that normalcy is returning and restore the constitutionally-mandated space for every pillar," he said.

"There are elected bodies such as panchayats… Let them take the responsibility for their mandate," he said, acknowledging that the local machinery may not be as efficient and well-oiled. "Otherwise, it will completely rust".

Ansari -who backed the J&K chief minister Omar Abdullah's move to hasten the phased withdrawal of the Armed Forces Special Powers Act (AFSPA) -asked him to do the same for the state's Public Safety Act (PSA).

"The situation is conducive for gradually withdrawing draconian laws as peace has gained a foothold. People should be rewarded for helping bring peace. Else, they will not trust the government…," Ansari said, insisting that security forces should also be moved out of residential areas which leads to friction with locals and fuels a militant mindset.

Ansari was one of the three interlocutors who handed their roadmap for peace to home minister P Chidambaram. Journalist Dileep Padgaonkar and academic Radha Kumar were also appointed as interlocutors on a one-year term that expired in early October.
Last edited by abhishek_sharma on 03 Nov 2011 06:43, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: J&K News and Discussion-2011

Post by svinayak »

The authorities have to ensure a friendly media towards security forces and the army in the eyes of the public and the local region. This is very important if such things are to be stopped
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Re: J&K News and Discussion-2011

Post by Jarita »

^^^ Antpathy towards army is top down and comes from 2004 days when one of the factors preventing Rajmaatam's ascendency was opposition from existing and ex army men
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Re: J&K News and Discussion-2011

Post by CRamS »

nobody taking my quiz above?
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Re: J&K News and Discussion-2011

Post by RamaY »

That Ansari article is giving 404 error. Could you pls fix the URL?
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Re: J&K News and Discussion-2011

Post by chetak »

Acharya wrote:
The authorities have to ensure a friendly media towards security forces and the army in the eyes of the public and the local region. This is very important if such things are to be stopped
How can you ensure this when a lot of the DDM, print and electronic media has extra territorial loyalty?? :lol:
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Re: J&K News and Discussion-2011

Post by ramana »

CRamS wrote:Guy, I have a simple quiz for you. My gripe with this puke Soumitro Das is not because of his virulent opposition to AFSPA Caught in the act according to him, but in fact some other TSP-like characterization on India's travails in J&K. Can you point that out?

Here is my take:
A few weeks ago, we had our own Mumtaz Qadri moment. (Qadri was the Pakistani bodyguard who murdered Punjab governor Salman Taseer in January.) Many Indians celebrated the beating up of Prashant Bhushan by two goons for speaking out in support of a plebiscite in Kashmir. It was insinuated that Bhushan committed sedition.
sedition = blasphemy
Prashant Bhushan = Salman Taseer
Two guys = Qadri, a bodyguard who killed his ward

interesting that UK abolished it in 2010 and he wants to know why India didn't follow suit. All these centuries of that law are not to be counted.
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Re: J&K News and Discussion-2011

Post by shiv »

CRamS wrote:Guy, I have a simple quiz for you. My gripe with this puke Soumitro Das is not because of his virulent opposition to AFSPA Caught in the act according to him, but in fact some other TSP-like characterization on India's travails in J&K. Can you point that out?
I will take the bait.

"650,000 men".

CRamS - I have a friend - an intelligent engaging guy who is actually a descendant of Subramanya Bharatiyar. Sometimes you give him a long lecture describing something in great detail and he listens to every word and finally responds with "So what?"

My response to that moronic article is "So what?"

There is pisko here and unfortunately that pisko also includes your specific reaction to that article which is very un-Indian. You are looking for truth in an article intended for rhetoric. The "argumentative Indian" is not interested in the truth. He is forever rearranging facts to make an argument. The writer is one such guy. And he is a Macaulayized descendant of Bong boxwallahs at that, holding ye oldie Brittainne as the holie example. As you know very well there are ten thousand arguments that can be made against him. Most Indians who are not as Macaulayized as I used to be (or as you are) will dismiss the article just as you would gingerly avoid dog turd on the footpath in India.

Best to move on and not raise one's blood pressure. We Indians shit out in the open you know. It's more environment friendly than purifying water just to flush at down at two gallons per crap.
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Re: J&K News and Discussion-2011

Post by ramana »

8)
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Re: J&K News and Discussion-2011

Post by Altair »

Is there a deal between Raul manio and Omar Abdulla?
"I will remove AFSPA and you allow missionaries"?
If so such conspiracy must be exposed to the people of India.
Aditya_V
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Re: J&K News and Discussion-2011

Post by Aditya_V »

Altair wrote:Is there a deal between Raul manio and Omar Abdulla?
"I will remove AFSPA and you allow missionaries"?
If so such conspiracy must be exposed to the people of India.
Boss that's total BS.
Nothing is worse for INC than Christian Muslim fight and nor does the INC leadership care really for religious Muslims or Christians. INC top echelons are not some modern day crusaders. Ask yourself this, does the INC leadership follow the reglious requirements in thier own personal lives- the answer is a big no.

That s why DDM worked overtime to close the Hand chopping incident in Kerala.

All they want is that there is significant fear among minorities to the only opposition which can unseat them at the centre that most regional parties would not touch them. The rest the CPI(M), BSP and SP are their B teams(SP and BSP always vote with INC when the need arises). For INC Minorities are Vote Banks whom they want to convert to Vote FD's.
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Re: J&K News and Discussion-2011

Post by Altair »

Aditya_V wrote:
Boss that's total BS.
Nothing is worse for INC than Christian Muslim fight and nor does the INC leadership care really for religious Muslims or Christians. INC top echelons are not some modern day crusaders. Ask yourself this, does the INC leadership follow the religious requirements in their own personal lives- the answer is a big no.
I really hope I am wrong on this one. But I hope there are no hidden wheels between wheels regarding the way the AFSPA is being handled. There has been conspiracy after conspiracy to undermine Indian armed forces for years.
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Re: J&K News and Discussion-2011

Post by sum »

Omar's 'AFSPA will go' announcement was unilateral, says Army
Cabinet Secretary Ajit Kumar Seth, Defence Secretary Shashikant Sharma and Home Secretary RK Singh were taken by surprise when the Army's Northern Command told them that there had been no consultations on the subject of revocation of the AFSPA even once in 2011. The chief minister's declaration was totally unilateral, the three top secretaries to the Government of India [ Images ] were told.

The central team was told that it was way back in February that the Army had sent its views on the AFSPA and stressed the need to continue the Act's provisions in the state to enable Army troops to operate under a legal cover. But there were no consultations between the various stakeholders, defence ministry sources said.

In fact, during his visit to Kashmir, the defence secretary was given a separate three-hour presentation by the Army's top brass in Srinagar [ Images ] on the current security scenario in J&K.

In it, the army made it clear that the situation was under control and in parts of the state it appeared almost normal, but opposed any dilution or revocation of the AFSPA for the following reasons:

* The situation was still fragile and the gains made in the summer of 2011 needed to be built upon
*
Unless a similar situation prevailed over the next two summers, it cannot be said that normalcy has returned to the Valley.
*
Lifting of the AFSPA from some selected pockets will result in terrorists seeking shelter in such areas and rebuilding their bases. Tactical space once conceded to terrorists, will be extremely difficult to regain.
*
All lines of communication pass through population centres and have to be kept open at all cost, and therefore the Army needs to operate under the AFSPA in these areas.
*
The Army garrison/strategic assets are spread over in population centres and de-notification will render them vulnerable to terrorist action and hence require separate security arrangements.
*
The Army carries out seamless operations across districts of J&K. Partial revocation of the AFSPA will hinder such seamless operations and hence, was impractical.
*
Even if the situation worsens in areas where the AFSPA has been revoked, politically it is unlikely that the decision can be reversed, or at best it will take months. The experience of Manipur is a pointer in this regard.

Abdullah's unilateral announcement caught the Centre by surprise although he insists that Home Minister P Chidambaram [ Images ] was in the loop on this issue and backs him fully.

Perhaps taken aback by the tough stand taken by the Army on the issue of AFSPA, Abdullah now says he only announced an intention and not a decision when he made that speech on October 21, declaring that "AFSPA will be revoked in the next few days."
Good logical points put forward by the army.

If the yuvaraj becomes PM, expect such unilateral pea-brained announcements on policy matters from time to time. OA's tenure as J&K CM is a curtain raiser of the kind of headless chicken like administration we can expect if baba gets the big gaddi ( since OA and RG seem to have more or less the same sort of thinking pattern and have similar privileged background with no previous achievement to boast of).
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Re: J&K News and Discussion-2011

Post by Vikas »

OA used to come across as a decent intelligent man when he was junior MEA. Now seems like he has totally lost it.
Having said that, atleast he is running a state unlike RG who is destined to be "waiting in wings" forever.
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Re: J&K News and Discussion-2011

Post by CRamS »

VikasRaina wrote:OA used to come across as a decent intelligent man when he was junior MEA. Now seems like he has totally lost it.
Having said that, atleast he is running a state unlike RG who is destined to be "waiting in wings" forever.
Its a measure of the sway TSP holds in the valley. He is trying to play nice or a bullet goes through his head.

I don't what all this AFSPA hot air is about. There is nothing India can do, I mean political/diplomatic to which TSP will not respond in some way, shape and thwart India's good intentions. In fact, the KMs themselves will still thumb their noses against India no matter what India does. Omar will get a small respite by appearing tough against India, but thats about it. To get peace in Kashmir, TSP, especially, the pakiJabis must cease to exist :-).
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