Indian Education System

hnair · Post by **hnair** » 28 Dec 2011 08:43

Yet another oiropean judgmental study in which we come last. God forbid we came anywhere near top, for that means midnight oil being burnt to change the params of next year's studies to include "cows on the plate to cows on the streets" ratio.

And yet they shamelessly want us to conduct F1 racing, Olimpiks, buy their fighters, fix their supplychain/trade software etc .... lol

A_Gupta · Post by **A_Gupta** » 28 Dec 2011 09:16

Have you bothered to read the detailed report before picking holes? I always disagree with Steve Sailer, but I begin to see merit in his

My vague impression is that Indians tend to make more sophisticated marketers than Chinese do. One American consultant said that the typical Chinese factory owner's idea of marketing is: "Real cheap! You buy now!" But it's important for Indians not to fall for their own marketing. India needs less spin and more China-like grim determination if it's going to improve its fundamental institutions.

By the way, all the talk in the press about Indian benefiting from a "demographic dividend" of a rapidly growing population is respectable Davos Man craziness at its craziest.

More generally, India conforms to the Davos model of elite advancement while not talking about the masses because we, uh, don't want to hurt their feelings. In contrast, Dengist China conforms more to old-fashioned nationalism -- the kind of thing that worked in Japan, Taiwan, South Korea, Singapore, Germany, and, perhaps most of all, in pre-1846 England and in pre-1960s USA.

http://isteve.blogspot.com/2011/12/some ... ndian.html

gakakkad · Post by **gakakkad** » 28 Dec 2011 09:28

Steve sailer is a racist faggot. He was once a "respected" member of stormfront . Probably still is.he has a lot of fans there .

He has written a lot of rubbish on Indian IQ. Says that even well nourished Indians have lower IQ compared to whites. We know what that means . It means he is a racist .In academic circles the chap has no more respect than Dhoti roy .

Even in the US , most top insti's are filled by elites. most MIT kids have well off parents .

ADDED LATER-

I am not saying that we don't need to get our acts together . But we need not give much heed to such surveys whose purpose is to not help , but to prove their superiority . The last thing we should do is take advice from the steve sailer types .

The present regimes scheme are redistributive rather then growth promoting . As a result of which a sizeable proportion of our rural youth are digging holes. Such practice is condemnable . Economic reforms and greater industrialization will solve most of out problem .

If you follow the PRC economy thread , we have found that Chinese bought dozens of super computer from hp , just for H&D sake. They are labelled as "web hosting" computer now . That country will go to any extent to prove its superiority .

I seriously doubt the survey included decent private schools . The high school drop out rate in US is nearly 50% .

http://www.wsws.org/articles/2008/apr20 ... -a03.shtml

A report released Tuesday by an educational advocacy group founded by retired general and former Bush administration Secretary of State Colin Powell finds that almost half of all public high school students in the US’ fifty largest cities fail to graduate.
The report states that only 52 percent of public high school students in these cities graduate after four years, while the national average is 70 percent. Some 1.2 million public high school students drop out every year, according to researchers.
The report finds that, overall, 17 of the public school systems in 50 major cities have graduation rates of 50 percent or lower, and the average graduation rate of all 50 systems is 58 percent. The findings are based on federal Department of Education statistics for the 2003-2004 school year.
The study, sponsored by America’s Promise Alliance and prepared by the Editorial Projects in Education Research Center, also shows a staggering difference between the drop-out rates in major urban school districts and those in adjoining and more affluent suburban districts. Overall, high school graduation rates are 15 percentage points lower in urban schools as compared to those in the suburbs. In twelve cities, the disparities exceed 25 percentage points.
In some cases, the gap between the cities, with their large concentrations of working class and poor residents, and the suburbs is even greater. The widest discrepancies cited in the report are in Baltimore, Maryland, where only 34.6 percent of public high school students graduate, and its suburbs, where 81.5 percent acquire diplomas after four years, and in Columbus, Ohio, with a graduation rate of 40.9 percent as compared to 82.9 percent in the suburbs.
The city-suburb split is also immense in such metropolitan centers as New York (47.4 percent vs. 82.9 percent), Cleveland (42.2 percent vs. 78.1 percent), Philadelphia (49.2 percent vs. 82.4 percent), Chicago (55.7 percent vs. 84.1 percent), Los Angeles (57.1 percent vs. 77.9 percent), and Atlanta (46.1 percent vs. 61.8 percent).
A separate chart showing the graduation rates for the principal school districts in the 50 largest US cities points to the virtual collapse of public education in major urban centers.
Detroit, by many calculations the poorest US city, graduates less than 25 percent (24.9 percent) of its public high school students. Indianapolis Public Schools graduate 30.5 percent of their students, and the figures for the Cleveland Municipal City School District and the Baltimore City Public School System are 34.1 percent and 34.6 percent respectively.
Powell founded America’s Promise Alliance, which is chaired by his wife, Alma, and is described as a joint effort of nonprofit groups, corporations, charities, community leaders, faith-based organizations and individuals. The former Secretary of State said of the study, “When more than 1 million students a year drop out of high school, it’s more than a problem, it’s a catastrophe.”

When US has such a dismal record , they can hardly point fingers towards India . Indian per captita is 10 times lower than US . So we can't be expected to exceed the US . can we ?

vera_k · Post by **vera_k** » 28 Dec 2011 11:54

^^^

Read the report still. A lot of things on why behaviors in India are illogical fall into place when looking at the scores on reading. And I doubt that elite private schools will perform earth shakingly better (math yes, reading no). All those news anchors the forum tends to shake its collective head at did not go to government schools.

gakakkad · Post by **gakakkad** » 28 Dec 2011 17:32

vera_k wrote:^^^

Read the report still. A lot of things on why behaviors in India are illogical fall into place when looking at the scores on reading. And I doubt that elite private schools will perform earth shakingly better (math yes, reading no).

Nonsense . Forget the elite schools , even a middle class cbse/icse school will perform universe shatteringly better than OECD or US . I am quite sure that the median CBSE/ICSE middle class student will stand on 70-80 percentile by the standard they are gauging .
Even better than the obviously manipulated shanghai . I have read the report and the questions .

Even level 6 reading questions (the toughest) are easier than the average comprehension execise of CBSE Class 10 Functional English . (the age group of 15 corresponds to class X ).
It is much simpler than toefl . No one in my class studied for TOEFL . Yet every one top scored. My batch of 150 students produced large number of IITians , doctors . MBAs etc who are doing exceptionally well in both India and the US . I doubt most schools worldwide can beat such a record. There are 1000s of such schools in India .

I am no stranger to these international evaluations . I participated in many . They were of course competitive in nature. A popular one in India is conducted annually by the new south wales university for class 5 onwards. The median score of Indians touches the 70th percentile of Australians .

Regarding the report , the selection criteria mentioned is very vague. Only 143 schools from tamil nadu (total 3600 students )

Himachal Pradesh-India and Tamil Nadu-India did not meet PISA standards for student sampling. Due to
irregularities in the student sample numbers, it was established after the testing that these economies sampled
from student lists that were often incomplete: not all 15-year-olds within the school were listed. It was not
possible to determine whether any bias existed in the obtained sample. Caution should be exercised when using
the data from Himachal Pradesh-India or Tamil Nadu-India and when interpreting the reported analyses.

I am quite sure that they picked the poorest regions within TN/HP and extrapolated the region to the whole state . Thats what typically happens. Alternate possibility is that they selected class 7 students ( Which in India corresponds to 11-12 year olds) rather than class 10 students. The report mentions class 7/15 year olds students . In some countries class 7 corresponds to 15 year olds .

There are plenty of reports in which indians outscore the west .

India has always been in top 5 in the international olympiads (physics , chemistry etc) .

>>All those news anchors the forum tends to shake its collective head at did not go to government schools.

Those an-chors are not idiots. They are paid to tell lies on behalf of the CON party . We all know that. You are talking like OECD is idiot free region .

I am not saying that Indian education system does not need any improvement . It sure needs a lot. A uniform curriculum for one thing. Abolition of state boards . standardised testing . etc

I d love to elaborate more . But I have to take my 7 am rounds in the hospital .

vera_k · Post by **vera_k** » 28 Dec 2011 23:29

gakakkad wrote:Those an-chors are not idiots. They are paid to tell lies on behalf of the CON party . We all know that. You are talking like OECD is idiot free region .

Not the lies, I meant the shouting and stage management. Essentially shows low IQ to not be able to win an argument or at least not be able to get across their point of view. Even more of a clincher is that these formats are still in business which means that enough people watch them.

Our uncivil civil society

The “debate” in India today is defined as more than half a dozen people of varying political and intellectual leanings shouting at you and at each other. Then there is the ubiquitous anchor, who adds to and usually ups the ante in order to achieve maximum cacophony.

What clicked for me is that the comprehension scores would pretty well explain why so many criminals get elected and why political parties have to resort to caste/ethnic/religious appeals to get anywhere.

SureshP · Post by **SureshP** » 15 Jan 2012 07:45

Indian students rank 2nd last in global test
Hemali Chhapia, TNN | Jan 15, 2012, 02.24AM IST

MUMBAI: Across the world, India is seen as an education powerhouse - based largely on the reputation of a few islands of academic excellence such as the IITs. But scratch the glossy surface of our education system and the picture turns seriously bleak.

Fifteen-year-old Indians who were put, for the first time, on a global stage stood second to last, only beating Kyrgyzstan when tested on their reading, math and science abilities.

India ranked second last among the 73 countries that participated in the Programme for International Student Assessment (PISA), conducted annually to evaluate education systems worldwide by the OECD (Organisation for Economic Co-operation and Development) Secretariat. The survey is based on two-hour tests that half a million students are put through.

China's Shanghai province, which participated in PISA for the first time, scored the highest in reading. It also topped the charts in mathematics and science.

"More than one-quarter of Shanghai's 15 year olds demonstrated advanced mathematical thinking skills to solve complex problems, compared to an OECD average of just 3%," noted the analysis.

The states of Tamil Nadu and Himachal Pradesh, showpieces for education and development, were selected by the central government to participate in PISA, but their test results were damning.

15-yr-old Indians 200 points behind global topper

Tamil Nadu and Himachal, showpieces of India's education and development, fared miserably at the Programme for International Student Asssment, conducted by the Organisation for Economic Co-operation and Development Secretariat.

An analysis of the performance of the two states showed:

In math, considered India's strong point, they finished second and third to last, beating only Kyrgyzstan

When the Indian students were asked to read English text, again Tamil Nadu and Himachal Pradesh were better than only Kyrgyzstan. Girls were better than boys

The science results were the worst. Himachal Pradesh stood last, this time behind Kyrgyzstan. Tamil Nadu was slightly better and finished third from the bottom

The average 15-year-old Indian is over 200 points behind the global topper. Comparing scores, experts estimate that an Indian eighth grader is at the level of a South Korean third grader in math abilities or a second-year student from Shanghai when it comes to reading skills.

The report said: "In Himachal, 11% of students are estimated to have a proficiency in reading literacy that is at or above the baseline level needed to participate effectively and productively in life. It follows that 89% of students in Himachal are estimated to be below that baseline level."

Clearly, India will have to ramp up its efforts and get serious about what goes on in its schools. "Better educational outcomes are a strong predictor for future economic growth," OECD secretary-general Angel Gurria told The Times of India.

"While national income and educational achievement are still related, PISA shows that two countries with similar levels of prosperity can produce very different results. This shows that an image of a world divided neatly into rich and well-educated countries and poor and badly-educated countries is now out of date."

In case of scientific literacy levels in TN, students were estimated to have a mean score that was below the means of all OECD countries, but better than Himachal. Experts are unsure if selecting these two states was a good idea.

Shaheen Mistry, CEO of Teach For India programme, said, "I am glad that now there is data that lets people know how far we still have to go."

http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/home ... 492508.cms

Bade · Post by **Bade** » 17 Jan 2012 20:49

St. Xavier’s frees students from subject straitjacket

St. Xavier’s frees students from subject straitjacket
A STAFF REPORTER

Here’s to the future St. Xavier’s College graduate: first-class major in physics with chemistry, history and film studies.

Beginning the next academic session, Bengal’s first autonomous college will blur the lines between science and humanities, allowing undergraduate students to pick any combination of subjects in the prospectus.

Yes, you read it right, any combination.

“We will not have honours and pass subjects, we will replace that with major and electives. Students can choose any elective they want to,” Father Felix Raj, the principal of the college, told Metro.

The freedom to straddle disciplines is meant to open the floodgates for customised courses that don’t restrict students to the straitjacket of combinations like math, physics and chemistry or economics, political science and sociology.

So, quirky though it may sound, a student majoring in English can opt for biology as an elective and a chemistry major can widen his or her horizons with history for an elective subject.

The rules require a majoring student to take 16 departmental courses as part of the major subject and six extra-departmental courses, which are all electives. “The degree will be granted on the basis of one’s performance in all the subjects, though the credits for departmental courses will be more than those for the elective subjects,” Felix Raj said.

Not only will students be free to choose the electives, they do not have to study the entire subject. For instance, math as elective will give a student the option of picking between the algebra and calculus papers instead of being forced to study all the papers.

“We want students to enjoy their studies and, at the same time, not ignore their pass subjects, as is the tendency under the present system,” the principal said.

Universities like Cambridge also allow students to combine a variety of subjects and even give them time to understand what suits them. Xavier’s won’t parrot that model.

Students at Xavier’s would need to choose their areas of specialisation at the very beginning, unlike Cambridge where students can start out with a variety of courses before choosing what to specialise in.

At MIT, it is mandatory for science students to take humanities and social science courses.

So what if a humanities student decides to opt for a pure science subject as elective despite not studying science at the plus-two level?

St. Xavier’s has planned a student-support system within the curriculum, under which teachers can offer tutorials to students who are weak in particular subjects. “If a student struggles with a particular subject after two months of studying, there will be the option of tutorials,” Felix Raj said.

The proposed curriculum also aims to rationalise students’ workload by making it more practical.

Internships are being made mandatory for all students. They will also have to complete a project each in the third year that will carry 100 marks.

The revamped curriculum will also allow students to accumulate credits and take sabbaticals between semesters. So a student, with prior permission from the college, can clear all the credits in the first year, then take a break and come back to complete the course.

What it means is that a student can complete graduation in up to 10 years if he or she wishes to study in a staggered manner.

Has Xavier’s stolen a march over Presidency with this innovation?

pgbhat · Post by **pgbhat** » 18 Jan 2012 09:42

http://www.deccanherald.com/content/218 ... led-7.html

The head of Karnataka’s premier technical education umbrella institution, Visvesvaraya Technical University (VTU), failed in seven of the ten semesters of his undergraduate degree course in mechanical engineering.

He finally managed to pass the course, but only after many attempts, adding up to a total of 25 marks sheets. He now heads a university which has 200 engineering colleges functioning under it. And the High Court is looking at his claims that he passed in first class. The stack of marks statements of his shows that he passed only 3 semesters of the 10 without failing in any subject, making repeated attempts to pass some of the papers in the rest of the semesters. He could pass two subjects of the seventh semester only after he passed the 9th and 10th semesters.

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 18 Jan 2012 10:39

the trustees of bangalore univ has scuttled a plan by Jindal group to donate 100cr for a school of economics on campus , shouting "land grab land grab"

in disgust, the Jindals have now withdrawn their offer. hopefully they will use the money to setup a pvt management & economics school elsewhere in karnataka.

harbans · Post by **harbans** » 28 Feb 2012 16:52

Really sad this sort of thing surfaces:

Engineering Student Killed for being a Topper

svinayak · Post by **svinayak** » 25 Mar 2012 23:39

PRESS RELEASE NETWORK
http://www.pressreleasenetwork.com

Think for India - Dr Jawahar Surisetti launches a movement for thinking in India

Raipur, India - Mar 25, 2012 (PRN): Dr Jawahar Surisetti, eminent educationist and psychologist and author of international bestseller " Mama and me", has launched a movement " Think for India- Socho to jaane" which raises cudgels against the current education system which feeds children with education but not with the power of thinking. He aims to talk to and convince atleast one crore Indians in the one year to join his movement to introduce thinking in education.

After his 2 year long strenuous research for which he has been awarded the Man of the Year by the US state, he has surveyed 30000 students in India and an equal number in the US and Europe . The findings of this research have alarmed him that the students in the current system use only two of their five senses in the learning process. Secondly only 47% have fun during their learning period. The view of the students is that their teachers do not encourage or like questions being raised in the classroom and reward discipline and adherence. Students also felt that the key to their parents' hearts is success in exams.

Consequent to his research , he innovated the Think! Curriculum which is based on the linear learning process where all the five senses are used for holistic learning and the children are forced to think. The assessment and learning processes are open ended and force the child to come up outcomes which involve thinking. There are a lot of games , activities , life skills in this joyous journey of Think! that the students encounter and love it.

Another problem is that internationally including India, the curriculum available is expensive and could be afforded by elitist schools only, so the access is only to a few students. Life Educare, the company that owns Think! Curriculum wishes to reach out to all private and public schools in India and make this curriculum affordable and available to all.

Think for India, the movement will take off with a series of seminars on The Art of Thinking for students, teachers and parents and in this interesting series of interactive seminars in schools and colleges will kickstart the process of introducing scientific but interesting methods of introducing thinking in the teaching learning process of school as well as higher education institutions. After doing this in India, this will go international.

The website http://www.thinkforindia.com will be launched in April this year.

Once the system and the curriculum force the students to think, they will become more employable. Currently the academics in educational institutions give certificates and degrees but the corporate world says tat only 13% of the available human resources in the country are suitable for employment. This is because there is a lack of development of thinking processes in the education system.

For more information, contact:

Dr Jawahar Surisetti
Tel: 9303277947
Email: [email protected]

###

Information from Press Release Network may be freely distributed to any publication. Wherever applicable, please cite Press Release Network as the news source.

Vipul · Post by **Vipul** » 10 Apr 2012 01:18

The IIT game changers.

Aditya_V · Post by **Aditya_V** » 10 Apr 2012 14:35

A Comment on the Steve Bailer article reflecting the thought process of the author

The simple fact of the matter is that China will always excel over India.

As I noted in the other thread:

"First of all, the average IQ of India is only 81.

Second, on studies of Indians in Africa, Indians don't score much higher than blacks:

http://psychology.uwo.ca/faculty/rushto ... ensIVb.pdf

Third, in just one decade, India has already burned through the very shallow right side of its bell curve:

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB1000142 ... 19826.html

I know that white people like to Romanticize Indians because they've met a few smart ones (i.e. a non-representative sample from the far right of the Indian bell curve) but for those of us who've been to India it's pretty easy to see that Indians aren't much brighter than blacks and are similar to blacks in many of their behaviors."

White man's thinking out again.

gakakkad · Post by **gakakkad** » 10 Apr 2012 17:48

^^ the IQ test they mentioned is invalid for Indian students ... one of the iq tests conducted at JHU showed that Indians in the US had an iq greater than the askenazi population.. When I mentioned this point to a subconsciously racist goraa he felt offended. He argued that higher iq of jews and Indians is due to selection bias.. He said that the best Indians come to the US . And Hitler wiped out most of the jews.. Only the scientists and the smartest jews were able to flee from the nazi's and hence jewish iq is higher..I told him that it is la-whoree laagic onlee.

I have not been able to locate any scientifically conducted iq test which shows the Indian iq to be 81.. the figure is put by steve sailor and his racist goons of the stormfortress ..

Iq tests conducted in my high school and med school showed a mean greater than the ashkenazi population...iq tests conducted in iit co-related with those conducted in MIT..

most of the bullcrap is from the racist book "Intellignece and the wealth of nations".

Steve Sailer is a semi-educated farter , who designates himself as "journalist , movie critic and a psychologist." He is typically seen in various racist blogs and has no qualifications to talk about iq or anything else. He is a known India baiter . As bad a George Perv-o-bitch. I was actually perplexed that A_Gupta put a reference of the chap..

ManjaM · Post by **ManjaM** » 11 Apr 2012 06:16

Gakakkad ji, i found a book "IQ and wealth of nations" and the top ranked reviewer is one Steve Sailer
http://www.amazon.com/IQ-Wealth-Nations ... 027597510X

Here is a gem from the review -

"The IQ structures of the two giga-countries, China and India, demand more intense study, in part because the future history of the world will hinge in no small part on their endowments of human capital. The demography of India is especially complex due to its caste system, which resembles Jim Crow on steroids and acid. By discouraging intermarriage, caste has subdivided the Indian people into an incredible number of micro-races. In India, according to the dean of population genetics, L.L. Cavalli-Sforza, "The total number of endogamous communities today is around 43,000..." We know that some of those communities - such as the Zoroastrian Parsees of Bombay - are exceptionally intelligent.

But we can't say with any confidence what is the long run IQ potential of Indians overall. Their current IQ score (81) is low, especially compared to China (100), the other country with hundreds of millions of poor peasants. Yet, keep in mind just how narrow life in rural India was for so long. In 1952, on the fifth anniversary of independence, the Indian government commissioned a survey to find out if the average Indian villager had heard yet that the British had gone. The study was quietly cancelled when early results showed that the average villager had never heard that the British had ever arrived!"

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 11 Apr 2012 07:03

what kind of dog does he have in the fight?
does he try to boost the self-esteem of poorier and angrier section of whites vs these new threats?
is he posing as a scholar on world IQ?
is he planning to sell IQ improvement pills in India and elsewhere?
is he just a nut with a lot of internet time?

gakakkad · Post by **gakakkad** » 11 Apr 2012 09:02

He is the white supremacist type.He is anti-Semitic and particularly anti Indian. According to him,various races in the US should be segregated to "bring out the best potential in them". "Translations - Blacks and hispanics are as good as chimps , so treat them as chimps. "..The use of random statistics and psychology terminology attracts a lot of white,semi-educated red necks who want to feel good about themselves . But the guy demonstrates a clear lack of understanding of statistics , psychology and any other branch of science. He attempts to downplay the Ashkenazi scores. "Hitler killed off most jews , only the smartest survived ." So in a nutshell is a neo-nazi ,Christian supremacist with some college attendance,who earns his slice of meat by writing for the popular press and books targeting the white,semi literates living in the bible belt and elsewhere.

vera_k · Post by **vera_k** » 12 Apr 2012 11:57

SC upholds constitutional validity of Right to Education Act

Something is rotten in the Supreme Court. How can minority and boarding schools be excluded from this right, unless there are no poor students wishing to enroll in minority or boarding schools?

muraliravi · Post by **muraliravi** » 13 Apr 2012 08:49

This 25% quota for poor is another farce by the UPA on India. It is the governments responsibility to provide quality education to the children of the country, why should private players foot the bill while they keep absconding from their job. Someone should file a stronger case with the SC. The private schools in this event should at least get tax exemption, i mean what is their incentive. I am not propagating cut throat capitalism in the education sector, but the education ministry's job cannot be done by hardworking people who have invested their money in schools.

ManishH · Post by **ManishH** » 13 Apr 2012 10:13

I think the bill is to be footed by the Govt, not the private players. Basically the act says Govt pays the school for every child admitted under the quota.

But I'm not sure if it's constitutional for Govt to be able to force private schools to do this. Quite surprised by this judgement.

It'll result in some sort of fee hike + artificial paucity anyway for those in 'general' category. Even more opportunities for graft; as in any situation where Govt 'funds' seats.

vera_k · Post by **vera_k** » 13 Apr 2012 10:24

^^

The bill is to be footed by the school. The government will reimburse the school at a minimal rate, if at all, depending on what each state government decides to do. India will likely see a rise in home schooling and private tutoring similar to how America did, but question is how much?

SRoy · Post by **SRoy** » 13 Apr 2012 21:10

muraliravi wrote:This 25% quota for poor is another farce by the UPA on India. It is the governments responsibility to provide quality education to the children of the country, why should private players foot the bill while they keep absconding from their job. Someone should file a stronger case with the SC. The private schools in this event should at least get tax exemption, i mean what is their incentive. I am not propagating cut throat capitalism in the education sector, but the education ministry's job cannot be done by hardworking people who have invested their money in schools.

Not sure about tax situation.

But AFAIK, atleast in Delhi some schools were pulled up by the courts because they went back on their committment to provide admission to poor students.

And why was the committment given at the first place? Because these so-called "schools" grabbed public lands in prime areas at throwaway prices with tax exemption for few initial years.

While its a fair game to bash sarkari corruption, swindlers and cheats among the public at large go unnoticed.

Victor · Post by **Victor** » 13 Apr 2012 21:17

This is a serious attack on true secular education in India, not to mention Hindu schools. I was heartened by the many English medium schools that have been coming up even in rural areas of Assam that are not run by EJ and ME backed outfits and that are taking taking students away from them. These schools will now be under severe pressure and many will close down. A real disaster.

Center will only reimburse part of the cost and that too based on what it spends per student in Central School system which is a fraction of private schools. Remainder to be footed by states which are broke. Net result will be a big hike in fees to hard working Indians who want non-EJ or madrassa private education and this will send more students to the EJ and ME backed schools. This is clearly religion-based bias and must be fought tooth and nail.

Truly a tragedy that we have allowed this cancerous govt to stay for so long.

ManishH · Post by **ManishH** » 13 Apr 2012 23:06

I don't think it'll really hurt schools commercially, they'll just pass the burden to the parents. But yes, it's really sad that only Hindu schools have been singled out to bear the financial brunt. A scenario is very likely where a parent cannot afford admission in the Hindu school and is forced to send the child to a "minority unaided" school which just undercuts on tuition fee. This will really be ironical - where is the "right" to education now.

Abhijeet · Post by **Abhijeet** » 14 Apr 2012 03:10

The dissenting opinion (it was a 2 to 1 judgement) made the most sense. It asked the same thing -- how can the government outsource its educational responsibilities to private schools, even unaided ones, instead of offering enough government run institutions to educate everyone. Unfortunately, this opinion was outnumbered by the two other judges who felt that this was not an "unreasonable burden" on the private schools. 25% of the total student intake sounds very high.

Since this is a Supreme Court judgement, presumably there is no way to challenge this? This is the way it stays forevermore?

vera_k · Post by **vera_k** » 14 Apr 2012 08:27

I doubt there's much chance of changing the mind of the Supreme Court given India is a socialist country. Judges are humans too and would have been exposed to the same state sponsored socialist brainwashing as other citizens. This RTE bill is in fact less usurpative than the formula the Supreme Court "invented" in the Unnikrishnan case.

gakakkad · Post by **gakakkad** » 14 Apr 2012 08:47

the sooner this gov't stfus the better for all of us.. they are planning to introduce a similar bill for hospitals .. that would be a disaster..

Supratik · Post by **Supratik** » 14 Apr 2012 17:15

Although 25% quota sounds a bit high I think it is a good move as it will give bright students of poorer sections the opportunity to use education to move up the value chain. On the negative side the cost of education for others will go up. The private schools should undertake expansion. Ultimately the solution is for the pie to grow so that every child has equal opportunity.

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 14 Apr 2012 17:24

parents of the middle class will likely face a sudden hike of 20-25% in fees next yr if this is implemented. the sum needed for this RTE if 100% subsidized by GOI is more than all the other subsidies combined per TOI. so obviously GOI will pay no more than 5%, states will cover 1% and the fee paying parents forced to cover the remaining 94% or else get their wards into a cheaper school - every school will need to hike fees to cope though so cheaper is relative, and India is not Khan where you can get school seats on demand if you move into a new school distt, its nearly impossible to change schools and get a good school in places like blr from class1 upward.

in effect its a 25% cess "service tax" on whatever school fees you are already paying.

it will also paper over the failure and undernourishment of the Govt run schools, who will languish at the bottom as usual. its strange that the best medical and engg colleges in India are govt run yet we seem to make no headway on improving the quality of govt run schools.

gakakkad · Post by **gakakkad** » 14 Apr 2012 17:55

here is the whole judgement ... I have not bothered reading it but I ll post it so that the legal gurus can read and interpret..

http://www.scribd.com/doc/89368427/School

gakakkad · Post by **gakakkad** » 14 Apr 2012 18:03

folks the judgement will not apply to unaided private schools...It is the DDMitis..

i have not read the whole judgement because it is lengthy and filled with bla..bla..bla..but luckily they have provided a conclusion...

Here conclusion

1. Article 21A casts an obligation on the State to provide

free and compulsory education to children of the age of

6 to 14 years and not on unaided non-minority and

minority educational institutions.

2. Rights of children to free and compulsory education

guaranteed under Article 21A and RTE Act can be

enforced against the schools defined under Section 2(n)

of the Act, except unaided minority and non-minority

schools not receiving any kind of aid or grants to meet

their expenses from the appropriate governments or

local authorities.

krisna · Post by **krisna** » 14 Apr 2012 18:26

gakakkad wrote:

1. Article 21A casts an obligation on the State to provide

free and compulsory education to children of the age of

6 to 14 years and not on unaided non-minority and

minority educational institutions.

2. Rights of children to free and compulsory education

guaranteed under Article 21A and RTE Act can be

enforced against the schools defined under Section 2(n)

of the Act, except unaided minority and non-minority

schools not receiving any kind of aid or grants to meet

their expenses from the appropriate governments or

local authorities.

Can someone correct me in this regards--

1) Virtually all minority educational institutions receive some form of aid or grants or whatever they call from govt(state or central).
2) They are allowed to take their own personnel but salaries are paid by govt.
3) They need not follow state syllabus completely.

For majority institutions
1) They may or may not receive govt support in whatever form.
2) They have to follow state syllabus
3) They have to look after themselves.

There are some discrepancies/discrimination wrt majority educational institutions since 1947. The reasons are due to partition extra support has gone to minority institutions to help them. Now despite 65 years no changes have been made due to politics of vote. In fact some majority institutions like Ramakrishna Mission at one time approached the SC to make them a minority one as it will help them avail of benefits.
Considering these then minority institutions must be having a pretty good time over majority ones. Of course not to mention of well oiled corruption in these institutions. The corruption is not investigated due to vote politics.

Knowledgeable folks please do clarify !!

Sachin · Post by **Sachin** » 16 Apr 2012 18:03

2. Rights of children to free and compulsory education guaranteed under Article 21A and RTE Act can be enforced against the schools defined under Section 2(n) of the Act, except unaided minority and non-minority schools not receiving any kind of aid or grants to meet their expenses from the appropriate governments or local authorities.

I am not a lawyer, but from what I can make out of it is that unaided schools (be it minority or majority community managed) are exempted from this. At least in my state there are lots of schools started by various managements (or trustees etc.) which have procured their own land and built up their own assets. They recruit teachers from the open market and pay them based on negotiated agreements. Many of these schools go for English as the medium and opt for ICSE or CBSE syllabus. So these sort of schools remain untouched from this act. The state government cannot do any thing to force upon them any idea, which they are not willing to buy.

PS: I know a few schools (or its management) who literally kept the state government (of Kerala) at an arm's length. This was during the time when student union politics was going in full swing in state schools, and the teacher community too equally politicises. These new schools felt that if they got any deal from the local state government, the quid pro quo would be politics entering their schools and finally the new school also becoming the old "government school". Many parents also started preferring such new schools, because they did not want their kids to play politics and waste their lives. These new schools did charge higher fees, because they did not get a paisa from the state governments.

Vipul · Post by **Vipul** » 27 Apr 2012 05:36

200 universities across India in next 5 yrs:Sibal.

Higher education in the country is set to get a boost with the HRD ministry finalising plans worth Rs. 80,000 crore inorder to improve access to colleges and universities.

The UPA government has embarked upon an ambitious plan to double the gross enrollment ratio (GER), from present around 17% to 30% by the year 2020. For this, there would be a need of several new universities and colleges across the country.

HRD minister Kapil Sibal on Wednesday told Lok Sabha that 200 new universities and a degree college in each district of India will be opened in the next five years. “We have asked for Rs. 20,000 crore for opening new universities in the 12th plan,” he said.

In addition to new institutions, many of the existing colleges will be upgraded either into universities or autonomous colleges having powers to award degrees.

The budget for revitalising the higher education will be Rs. 80,000 crore, the biggest ever allocation for higher education.

A large amount of this money will be awarded to state governments to improve higher education in rural areas. This, by increasing the Central government share in higher education funding to the states.

As of now, the Centre shares just 35% of the cost of starting a new higher education institution. In the 12th plan (2012-17), Sibal said, the government proposes to increase the Central share to 65% and 90% for the north-eastern states.

This, according to the ministry, will give an incentive to the state governments to submit proposals for starting new higher education institutes. Many state governments have been reluctant to seek funds from the Centre because they had to assure 65% funds to start the project.

The HRD ministry believes that its new national vocational education framework that allows bachelors degree in vocational education streams will help in increasing the gross enrollment ratio. The seven level framework allows enrollment at class IX level with an easy exit and re-entry module.

On school education in the 12 plan, the HRD ministry has set a 100% retention rate at the primary level of school education.

According to school data for the year 2010, the retention rate is about 74% at the primary level. It will mean opening of new schools in rural areas and better access to schools for girls and other socially deprived sections such as scheduled castes and scheduled tribes.

member_19686 · Post by **member_19686** » 27 Apr 2012 06:15

Religious schools out of RTE loop

OUR SPECIAL CORRESPONDENT
New Delhi, April 24: The Rajya Sabha today passed amendments that exempt madarsas and Vedic pathshalas, which impart religious teachings, from the Right to Education Act and grant reservation in private schools to disabled children.

Another amendment clarified that school management committees in aided minority schools would function only in an advisory capacity and would not be required to prepare the school development plan.

The amendments will now go to the Lok Sabha.

Some aided minority schools had expressed the fear that the management committees, made of students’ parents, could be dominated by non-minority groups that can influence the decision-making process. Such an influence would undermine the minority character of the institute, they felt.

Similarly, certain religious bodies had appealed to the government to keep out institutes imparting religious teachings. The Vedic pathshalas demanded that they be exempt from the act as they do not offer formal education. The HRD ministry accepted the demands.

One amendment seeks to include children with disability in disadvantaged groups. This means kids suffering from any kind of physical disability will be entitled to free education in all schools, except unaided minority institutions, under the 25 per cent quota.

However, the ministry is yet to take the final view on whether unaided minority schools can be fully exempt from the RTE Act or only from the quota for students from underprivileged families.

http://www.telegraphindia.com/1120425/j ... 5ntMLP5Dp5

Amber G. · Post by **Amber G.** » 08 May 2012 03:40

No course correction

If there is one thing that the University of Delhi can't be faulted for, it is about showing any kind of diffidence in announcing new initiatives at a breathtaking pace. Hardly has the dust (and the mess) of a hasty, ill-thought out semesterisation settled, Vice-Chancellor (VC) Dinesh Singh

announced a couple of new initiatives in quick succession: the formation of a Meta University, trans-disciplinary courses, a four-year undergraduate degree, a bachelors in innovation engineering and the latest oxymoron, a BTech in humanities.

Theoretically, as compared to other structures, there is nothing good or bad about any of these schemes. For instance, it will be hard to argue for or against the virtues of a semester system as opposed to an annual one. Both are used effectively by universities across the world. Similarly, it would be difficult to argue against any freedom to take courses in various institutions, the crux of the Meta University plan, though what is particularly 'meta' about it is obscure; then what is so great about replacing the three-year undergraduate degree with a four-year one? After all, these are the hallmarks of the North American university system which, our education bosses are so enamoured of. Conversely, a three-year system works perfectly well in Britain. So for anyone to claim that one of these new models is theoretically and inherently superior to the existing ones is not only fallacious but downright dishonest.

However, when it comes to the implementation of these fancy plans, we notice an utter lack of thinking, an astonishing ignorance of reality and a foolhardy optimism regarding the capacity of the system to take these new pressures. That the existing university system is incapable of taking a massive change like the semesterisation, at the pace at which it was introduced, has by now become too obvious to bear repetition.

The inability of the education bureaucracy to handle the new system is evident. For instance, we have seen the recent confusion over the attendance regulations and the bizarre case of marks being decreased. Incidentally, the decrease and subsequent "rectification" of marks has an interesting sideshow: it is widely rumoured within the university that the examination bureaucracy goofed up by sending the actual (that is the "uninflated") marks to be uploaded on the website since it is common knowledge that marks in the semester examination were inflated hugely to demonstrate the superiority of the system.

Thus, at a practical level, the implementation of these new initiatives is likely to cause immense chaos since it would mean dealing with new systems and paradigms with ancient tools: both infrastructural and intellectual. The devil, as they say, is in the detail. For instance, would all courses at the designated 'meta' universities be eligible for transfer of credit? Or, would there be specified courses whose equivalence with other courses have been established? What about the system of ensuring things like attendance or transfer of credits from one bureaucracy to another? These are not imaginary or trivial issues - if the system has to work, questions like these need to be addressed and resolved.

An argument might be proffered that any change leads to some teething problems and these would be ironed out as it evolves. Unfortunately, the students who are bearing the brunt of these avoidable problems are not going to be there if and when things stabilise. And by then they would have lost their one-off opportunity of getting a good, well-rounded undergraduate education.

It is a truism that in most social systems, whether in business or politics, a buy-in of all stakeholders is an essential prerequisite for any fundamental and lasting change. And the buy-in occurs through a consultative, inclusive process whereby the stakeholders are consulted and persuaded. Unfortunately, none of this has been visible in DU in recent years.

The utter disdain with which the DU administration treats the views of the students and the faculty, and the manner in which it rides over statutory provisions is shocking.

The pattern is by now familiar: the VC announces to the media a new initiative. A coterie of teachers and administrators hurriedly fleshes out the proposals. These proposals are then rammed through the statutory bodies if needed, or implemented using the infamous emergency powers of the VC. The course on 'innovation engineering' is a good example. In its rush to prepare the blueprint, the VC's coterie plagiarised the course and other details from a foreign university website. So much for intellectual honesty and creativity!

A BTech in humanities or an MA in microbiology might amuse us. However, for the lakhs of students it won't be funny because they are the ones who will bear the brunt of such hasty, hare-brained and ill thought-out schemes. And worse, the academic reputation of the institution, built so carefully over decades will suffer a blow. Vice-chancellors will come and go, but the effects of these schemes will be there with us for a long time to come.

Shobhit Mahajan is Professor of Physics and Astrophysics, University of Delhi. The views expressed by the author are personal.

pgbhat · Post by **pgbhat** » 08 May 2012 18:49

the formation of a Meta University, trans-disciplinary courses, a four-year undergraduate degree, a bachelors in innovation engineering and the latest oxymoron, a BTech in humanities.

coffee spill alert.

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 09 May 2012 11:23

http://www.thehindu.com/news/cities/ban ... 398125.ece

what will happen to govt schools now?

Vayutuvan · Post by **Vayutuvan** » 14 May 2012 03:32

New Ranking of Countries' Higher Ed Systems

New Ranking of Countries' Higher Ed Systems

Universitas 21, a group of universities from around the world, has released a new international ranking of nations' higher education systems. Countries were evaluated on a series of measures related to resources (spending by governments and private sources); output (research and its impact and graduates who meet labor market needs); connectivity (international collaboration); and the higher education environment (government policies, diversity and other factors). Population was taken into account. The top five countries: United States, Sweden, Canada, Finland and Denmark.

India is last

Assuming that this ranking is reasonable, a few elite institutions (which are presumably at the level of the highest rated institutions in US) won't cut it if the averages are not brought up.