Indo-UK News & Discussion 9th Aug 2011

[Yogi_G]

I wonder when the Bartania opium-trading "Commonwealth" and the "Shared Mughal Legacy" nonsense will die down.

[RamaY]

I do not see any Priest, Ruler, Business and worker class in this society.

[Philip]

The Q is still HOS/Q of Canada and Oz.The Commonwealth Club still serves afternoon tea and G's and T's to its privileged members who get some extra service when compared with ordinary "guests"! The Brits love their monarchy ,they do love a party and their pageants.Great for tourism,esp. the Yanquis who can't get enough.Their displays of pomp and circumstance pale by comparison.Oscar night and Wrestlemania are the high and low ends of Yanqui civilisation,not neccessarily in that order!

But if you really want to experience Brit culture today,don't miss the Notting Hill Carnival,the exuberant expression of West Indian music in August and the Edinburgh Festival,Europe's biggest cultural fete.Dance troupe's from India have performed before and the "fringe" festival,of lesser known performers is a big draw.

http://www.eif.co.uk/
Experience the unique atmosphere of Edinburgh in August during an unforgettable three weeks of the very best in international opera, music, theatre and dance.
more…

Ah...but then the Scots,,always a distinct nation from the English, are to vote on Independence come 2014 and may also ditch the Queen!

[Vayutuvan]

From Wiki

Poverty in the United Kingdom

Poverty rose again from 2005/06 onwards, reaching 22.5% of the population in 2007/08, before falling again to 22.2% in 2008/09.[19]

In 2010, a Eurostat report estimated that 17.1% of Britons were at risk of poverty, after social transfers were taken into account.

I wonder shouldn't they be spend money in reducing poverty and uplifting their own underclasses than on the pomp and pageantry and pampering of the upper crust?

[shyam]

wonder why brf still keeps on thinking that the empire is still alive (decades after it died totally and finally)

They still do carry destructive powers. Currently, you can see the economic destructions originating form City of London.

[Philip]

Industrial production in the UK,once famous for its Victorian factories,has plummeted.A nation of beer swilling lager louts (on the dole) has emerged thanks to the disastrous eco policies and accelerated immigration that Labour pursued as a "vote bank".While the inventive and entrepreneurial spirit is still alive in Britain,there is little incentive for the smaller companies,as policies are skewed to favour the big boys with many MPs acting as touts/lobbyists for them.

[hnair]

Jon Stewart rips apart that sad show of kitsch by that country named after a popular biscuit in India .

The Queen Who Stares at Boats

[Yayavar]

^^it was funny...'fire-work' (no 's' in it) .

[Varoon Shekhar]

"Jon Stewart rips apart that sad show of kitsch by that country ..."

Jon Stewart and Conan O'Brien have been friendly to India, even during the Bush era when George Bush was the object of their humour and/or derision, sometimes rightly. Even when India is referred to in a humorous vein, it's in good taste, never insulting or demeaning. When Bush went to India to negotiate the nuclear deal, Stewart said Bush should give India nuclear technology only on the condition that the Indians stop beating our kids in spelling bees!

[Gerard]

Britain must end its sordid treatment of the Chagossian people now

[Gerard]

Gangs raping and sexually exploiting vulnerable white young girls 'is an Asian problem', top Crown prosecutor admits

'Asian' presumably being someone from Inner Mongolia...

[Haresh]

It's time to stop using the word 'Asians'

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/religio ... sians.html

[vishvak]

Britain must end its sordid treatment of the Chagossian people now

From above

When decolonisation was ordered by the UN in the 1960s, it came with the international law requirement that the whole of a colonial territory should be granted independence.
..
So Britain lied to the UN, pretending that there were no permanent inhabitants on the islands – the 2,000 Chagossians, settled there for almost 200 years, were described as "itinerant labourers". Then, claiming ownership of the archipelago, Britain deported them to Mauritius and leased all the islands to the US until 2016

Did UK got penalized in any way for this imperialism, lies, deceit and deportation of natives?

[Lalmohan]

^^^ yes, they got gubo'ed by unkil to hand over anything they had to keep unkil happy

[nachiket]

^^^ yes, they got gubo'ed by unkil to hand over anything they had to keep unkil happy

No skin off their backs. They gave away land they didn't own in the first place. Besides the article suggests they got Polaris missiles at a discount in return.

[Gerard]

Did UK got penalized in any way for this imperialism, lies, deceit and deportation of natives?

http://www.tni.org/article/man-fridays- ... eturn-home

A 2009 cable on Diego Garcia released by WikiLeaks shows how little has changed in the UK colonialist mindset in the past 50 years.

In diplomatic cables declassified a couple years ago, the population of the Chagos Islands was called ‘negligible’, just a few ‘man Fridays’.

Thanks to WikiLeaks we know that UK Office Territories director Colin Roberts assures the US Embassy that continuation of the military operations from Diego Garcia is not in any danger, because the UK will not allow any ‘human footprint’….. ‘no man Fridays’! The use of the Robinson Crusoe reference was painful in the 1960s. it is outrageous in 2009. It shows how little has changed in the mindset of the British world view. With the empire long gone, British imperialism and latent racism are still going strong.

Moreover Roberts admits in the cable that "We do not regret the removal of the population" and triumphantly explains to the US Embassy how they came up with a new trick. They’ll make the whole of Chagos a ‘Marine Protected Area’ a wildlife reserve where no human can go. Well, not the whole of Chagos of course: the US base can stay on Diego Garcia despite its responsibility for fuel leaks and coral reef demolition.

[Gerard]

A telegram sent to the UK mission at the United Nations in November 1965 summed up the problem:

"We recognise that we are in a difficult position as regards references to people at present on the detached islands.

"We know that a few were born in Diego Garcia and perhaps some of the other islands, and so were their parents before them.

"We cannot therefore assert that there are no permanent inhabitants, however much this would have been to our advantage. In these circumstances, we think it would be best to avoid all references to permanent inhabitants."

Sir Paul Gore-Booth, senior official at the Foreign Office, wrote to a diplomat in 1966: "We must surely be very tough about this. The object of the exercise is to get some rocks which will remain ours... There will be no indigenous population except seagulls..."

The diplomat, Dennis Greenhill, replied: "Unfortunately along with the birds go some few Tarzans or Man Fridays whose origins are obscure and who are hopefully being wished on to Mauritius."

As far back as 1965, Colonial Secretary Anthony Greenwood had warned that it was "important to present the United Nations with a fait accompli".

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/politics/1005064.stm

[Sushupti]

Gandhi award for Binayak Sen, Bulu Imam

http://www.indianexpress.com/news/gandh ... m/961053/0

[Lalmohan]

^^^ yes, they got gubo'ed by unkil to hand over anything they had to keep unkil happy

No skin off their backs. They gave away land they didn't own in the first place. Besides the article suggests they got Polaris missiles at a discount in return.

sarcasm on my part old chap

[Kanishka]

Falkland Islands to hold referendum on sovereignty

The Falkland Islands will hold a referendum on its "political status" in a bid to end the dispute with Argentina over the archipelago's sovereignty.

The islands' government made the announcement ahead of the anniversary on marking 30 years since the end of Argentina's 74-day occupation in 1982.

It said it wanted to send a firm message to Argentina that islanders want to remain British.

The UK prime minister said Britain would support the result of the vote.

The referendum will be organised by the Falkland Islands government and will take place in the first half of next year.
'Economic blockade'

The announcement comes amid growing tensions between the UK and Argentina surrounding the anniversary commemorations marking the islands' liberation by British forces on 14 June, 1982.

Foreign Office Minister Jeremy Brown is currently there on an official trip.

Argentina claims sovereignty over the islands it calls the Malvinas, and wants the UK to negotiate over their rule.

Recently, UK ministers have accused Argentina of trying to impose an "economic blockade" on the islands.

The South American country has been turning away cruise ships carrying the British flag and is taking legal action against five British oil firms exploring the coast of the islands.

Gavin Short, chairman of the islands' legislative assembly, said they were holding the referendum "to show the world just how certain we are about it [our future]".

"I have no doubt that the people of the Falklands wish for the islands to remain a self-governing overseas territory of the United Kingdom.

"We certainly have no desire to be ruled by the government in Buenos Aires, a fact that is immediately obvious to anyone who has visited the islands and heard our views.

"But we are aware that not everybody is able to come to these beautiful islands and to see this reality for themselves.

"And the Argentine government deploys misleading rhetoric that wrongly implies that we have no strong views or even that we are being held hostage by the UK military. This is simply absurd."

[Agnimitra]

For the last few months, BBC Farsi (Persian) has been regularly running explicitly anti-India articles. The reportage is clearly biased, and often incomplete. The reportage also often knows which buttons to push, since Persian heads are already chock full of typical prejudices against Indians amongst others. Here is the latest one:

هند 'بدترین کشور در گروه ۲۰ برای زنان' است
"India is the worst country for women in the G-20"

In this survey, Indians are even worse than Arabs.
...
This survey conducted by Thomson Reuters, many criteria such as education of women, hygiene, job opportunities, violence against women were kept in view.

This survey says that the reason for the lowest rank to India is the tradition of child marriage, female enslavement and female infanticide.

[member_23370]

The Poor Limey's are will kick and scream as India rises and finally when it inevitably happens they will come to lick the boots like they did with USA. The inferiority complex with Indians, french and Germans is entrenched too deeply in them.

[shyamd]

Manufacturing- except the HYundai and a few MNC's rest are all down. I work in accounts/ finance and had to face the harrassement from Excise/ Customs IT, oral demands to meet targets etc.of an org which also tanked, I changed jobs, my replacement in the previous job fired by anther company, 150 workers in my company were sent on VRS, 7000 employees in Mudurai alone have been fired.

Is business doing well anywhere in the world at this moment in time?

And you say harrassment from IT - its the same in every country when fiscal pressure is tight - its SoP when cash is tight for a govt. As for textile in madurai - problem is electricity amongst other issues - this will change once Kudankulam come online. Costs have risen so its not really economical - foreign buyers are under pressure so are squeezing margins - so what do you expect will happen? Eventually producers will move to other states with lower costs and foreign buyers will move to other countries that are leaders in cost - vietnam/bangladesh is the next hotspot.

Cotton prices were once Rs20k when farmers were suiciding, today its gone up a lot - now textile barons are suiciding because all their investments have vapourised due to price rises - of course plenty of people will celebrate when businessmen/entrepeneurs suicide.

[sudarshan]

Has this been posted here before?

http://www.rusi.org/analysis/commentary ... A2F39DAA2/

Apparently, much/most of the UK new clear detergent is in Scotland, and there are no convenient places in the rest of the UK to move this to. Free Alba, anyone?

[Rony]

Partitioning The UK?

[Kanishka]

Partitioning The UK?

Although Scottish public currently is 57% opposed to the idea of Scottish independence.

Wonder why so many are opposed.
The Scotts must not loose this opportunity to come out of the shadows of the Brits.
This may be their only chance in a long time.

[Kashi]

Wonder why so many are opposed.
The Scotts must not loose this opportunity to come out of the shadows of the Brits.
This may be their only chance in a long time.

And lose several billion pounds a year in central grants to make up for revenue deficit? Not a bloody chance.

Also it must be remembered that of the British who plundered, betrayed and stabbed India, many were Scots and Welsh- William Brown (Gilgit Scouts) but one of many.

[Hari Seldon]

^^Agreed. They're all jerkos and deserve every paki they attract x10.

[Kanishka]

Wonder why so many are opposed.
The Scotts must not loose this opportunity to come out of the shadows of the Brits.
This may be their only chance in a long time.

And lose several billion pounds a year in central grants to make up for revenue deficit? Not a bloody chance.

Also it must be remembered that of the British who plundered, betrayed and stabbed India, many were Scots and Welsh- William Brown (Gilgit Scouts) but one of many.

Very True. But a divided UK is better for India for obvious reasons.

[Prem]

="And lose several billion pounds a year in central grants to make up for revenue deficit? Not a bloody chance.Also it must be remembered that of the British who plundered, betrayed and stabbed India, many were Scots and Welsh- William Brown (Gilgit Scouts) but one of many.
Very True. But a divided UK is better for India for obvious reasons.

Division will make it easy to Nibble on them . Scotland can be our Pondichary base. indians can invest and take strategic control over the economy.

[svinayak]

How many Indians in Scotland?
For how many decades they have lived there and number of second gen Indians in scotland.

[Lisa]

How many Indians in Scotland?
For how many decades they have lived there and number of second gen Indians in scotland.

17,000 , http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/British_In ... ion_spread

[Murugan]

Letter from London - Sudeshna Sen

You Still a Member of EU? Eww!

You Still a Member of EU? Eww!

“What would happen,” I asked the kind of people I talk to for these columns, if Europe actually had another war? There’s a war in Syria. There’s one in Afghanistan. There was war in Serbia and Bosnia till 10 years ago. Do we really have to put up with this slow-bleeding economic death around the world, because a generation of old imperialist powers are too afraid of their own history? Why can’t the continent just accept they are now middling powerful countries, maybe even rich, but no longer really world powers? It’s like a senior business editor friend from Colombia told me, “This is the time for us emerging nations. Can the old world please sort their problems out and not sabotage this moment in history for us?” Iwas, of course, told not to be silly. Okay, I was being provocative and doing a worst-case scenario. I’m not really advocating allowing Europe to break up and degenerate into civil or border skirmishes. But like most others of my generation, and the generation of young people across Europe, I don’t really buy into this warphobia that’s being raked up all over Europe by aged supporters of the European dream. If it was a real threat, Greece would have erupted in Arab spring-type revolutions in Brussels by now.

Unfortunately, there are more and more people around Europe asking the same questions: I do read the reader write-ins for papers like the Sunor Daily Mail, and when I can get Google translate to work Greek and Spanish papers.

What I do get, and I’ve heard Angela Merkel repeatedly parroting it in every speech of hers, is that her vision of ‘more Europe’ is based on one thing: that unless Europe stays together as a bloc, and everyone cranks up to the productivity and competitive levels of a Germany, it will lose its global superpower clout — and without a union, despite being rich, will no longer be a serious economic power. Now that, to me, sounds like an imperialistic dream of past glory.

I know that trap. I grew up in it. When India was a poverty-stricken third-world nation, we kept harking back to the glories of the Mughal empire, or Mohenjo-Daro, or yoga. Who will Spain, Italy, Ireland and Greece choose to hitch their wagons to if they weren’t already yoked to Europe? I’ve heard Greeks muttering they’d have been better off taking the offers China or Russia were making them two years ago. “Being part of the EU can’t be the end-all of our existence. There’s just this much we’re willing to sacrifice to uphold the European dream,” a Greek student told British television.

Take Cyprus. It’s on its knees, economically, because it is so dependent on Greece. Last I heard, they’re talking to the EU, the Russians and the Chinese for the best deal they can get. Or take Hungary or Serbia. They’re wondering whether their chances in the newly-powerful emerging-economies bloc wouldn’t be better than old Europe.

The last time I met a senior journalist from Turkey, she was telling me the country is thanking all its lucky stars that they’ve been blocked from entering the euro all these years. “It was our national shame that Europe wouldn’t take us, now we are proud. We’re growing, and doing well, we don’t need the euro or Europe,” she told me. “They come to us.”

So, the even more provocative question I want to ask is: is it in the interests of emerging nations if Europe does break up? Europe is now an immense drag on the rest of the world economy, with its inability to either shape up, or break up.

So I asked someone. The kind of person who makes global investment decisions. Yes, there will be a massive upheaval for a time, as the world adjusts to a new reality. It will be bad. But will it, like the decline and fall of the Roman empire, throw the world back into the Dark Ages, which is what euro-supporters would like us to think? He didn’t think so. There are always opportunities for enterprising entrepreneurs during upheavals.

I’m not coming to any conclusions here, please note. But consider, say, an Indian IT company or textile exporter, if you could negotiate migration policies, prices, M&A terms independently with a Spain, Greece, France or Italy, competing with each other for foreign investments, and with the power to make its own FTAs? Ireland stubbornly clings on to its 12% corporate tax rate, but is under immense pressure from EU to give it up. One of the reasons Africa, South America and east Europe have emerged as hubs of outbound investment from China and India is because corporates and negotiators can come to terms independent of EU regulations.

I live in the UK, which is a part of the EU but not part of the euro. About the only thing that has saved this economy from going bust is its ability to control its currency, and the City of London. Would Spain, given that its banking crisis was one cooperative bank betting on real estate, have really been unable to pull out the measly €100 billion it got from the EU to save itself if it didn’t have to submit to EU supervision? Just last week, George Osborne announced a £140-billion stimulus package for UK banks and small businesses. He can, because he doesn’t answer to Merkel or the IMF.

I have no view on whether giving up the European dream is going to be good, bad or ugly for Europeans. But I’m fast coming around to the view that it would be a golden opportunity for emerging nations to take over the world — figuratively. I don’t know, but I bet Chinese analysts who do these things have already worked out the best options for China. I hope someone in India is doing the same.

http://epaper.timesofindia.com/Default/ ... Skin=ETNEW

[Prem]

Exclusive: Western firms tap China cash to bid for UK nuclear

Urinal Kingdom to Pee Kingdom

Reuters) -

China may soon control one of Britain's top nuclear projects after two Chinese state firms teamed up with Western players to bid for the $24 billion development, industry and financial sources told Reuters.China, which has the world's largest foreign exchange reserves of $3.3 trillion, has been expanding into Europe's energy and infrastructure sectors by buying stakes in firms such as Britain's Thames Water and Portuguese utility EDP (EDP)he British government wants to see new nuclear plants built, but cost overruns in the wake of the Fukushima nuclear disaster and the slowing global economy have made it increasingly difficult for Western developers to find the billions of dollars needed for these projects.Nuclear reactor builders Areva (AREVA.PA) and Toshiba-owned (6502.T) Westinghouse, which both want Horizon to use their reactor designs in Britain, have picked separate Chinese nuclear companies to help bid for Horizon."Areva and Westinghouse have both assembled consortiums of their own," said one source, who is familiar with the bidding process but who refused to be identified, while a second source in the banking sector confirmed the bidders.Both the AP1000 and EPR designs have reached the final stages of regulatory approval in the UK.Britain is trying to woo nuclear investors by reforming its electricity market in a way that guarantees a minimum price for producers of low-carbon energy, including nuclear power.Energy Minister Charles Hendry last month called Horizon's nuclear sites at Wylfa and Oldbury two of the most attractive sites in Europe to invest in new nuclear, adding that there had been strong interest in buying the joint venture.

[AbhiJ]

Seems the Queen is Barking again:

Ship 'carrying Russian attack helicopters to Syria' halted off Scotland

The UK has made moves to stop a cargo vessel allegedly carrying refurbished Russian-made attack helicopters from completing its journey to Syria.

The MV Alaed had its insurance withdrawn by The Standard Club in London while it was about 50 miles (80.4km) off Scotland's north coast.

Withdrawal of insurance prevents the MV Alaed from sailing until its owner can secure new cover.

The Russian embassy in London has not yet commented.

In a statement, the FCO said: "We are aware of a ship carrying a consignment of refurbished Russian-made attack helicopters heading to Syria.

"The foreign secretary made clear to Russian Foreign Minister Lavrov when they met on 14 June that all defence shipments to Syria must stop.

"We are working closely with international partners to ensure that we are doing all we can to stop the Syrian regime's ability to slaughter civilians being reinforced through assistance from other countries."

It said the cover was withdrawn because the owners of the ship had "broken internal rules" of the club - a mutual insurance association - and not on the instructions of the UK government.

"There are exclusion clauses in our cover and, for anyone involved in improper or unlawful trade, we can cancel cover.

In December last year, Russian warships and support vessels believed to have been headed for Syria took shelter in Scotland's Moray Firth during bad weather.

HMS York tracked aircraft carrier Admiral Kuznetsov, a destroyer, two frigates, an ocean-going tug and three oil tankers until the task group left and headed into the Atlantic.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-h ... s-18503421

[Singha]

> HMS York tracked aircraft carrier Admiral Kuznetsov, a destroyer, two frigates, an ocean-going tug and three oil tankers until the task group left and headed into the Atlantic.

RuN must be truly bad sailors if any of these needed to seek shelter in a storm! all of these should be designed and built to tackle the worst possible weather.

[Prem]

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/ ... ement.html
£1 billion deal paves the way for Trident nuclear deterrent replacement

Philip Hammond, the Defence Secretary, will reveal the scheme to build a new nuclear deterrent in a move which will cause tensions with the Liberal Democrats. He will announce a deal ordering nuclear reactors for a new class of submarines to replace the current Vanguard fleet, which carries Britain’s Trident nuclear arsenal. The decision is the most public statement yet that the Government is committed to a full-scale replacement of Trident - something opposed by the Lib Dems, who want a cheaper way of maintaining nuclear weapons. Mr Hammond will say that a Rolls-Royce plant at Raynesway, in Derby, will be given the order to build the reactors, and that the Ministry of Defence will fund an 11-year refit of the plant. The contract will create 300 jobs and many more in the factory’s supply chain. A £350million contract to design the new submarines went to BAE Systems, Babcock and Rolls-Royce. But the symbolism of ordering reactors is far greater.
The new nuclear submarine contract with Rolls-Royce will be seen as one in a series of policies launched by the Tories which are designed to reconnect with the party’s grassroots. In recent weeks, Conservative ministers have unveil a crackdown on illegal immigrants and foreign prisoners, pledged new action on anti-social families and given ground on the prospect of a referendum on Britain’s membership of the EU.

[kish]

Call me Daddy: What ringleader of Rochdale sex grooming gang convicted of 30 rapes told child victims to call him

Yesterday the court in the new case heard he repeatedly raped and sexually abused a young Asian girl for more than a decade, treating her as a 'possession' to use for his own sexual gratification.

Pray and hope this "Young Asian girl" is not Indian. But, this term "possession" is usually reserved for Non-muslims.

My blood boils whenever they say their cult is "Religion of peace".

[jiteshn]

Cherie Blair and Cilla Black lead goats across London Bridge

International Widows Day procession

The goat is a symbol of wealth and prosperity

[Rony]

EAST INDIA SHIPS REGISTRY BILL, House of Lords, June 1815

Lot of important data points on Indian ship building during late 1700s - mid 1800s period.