Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan (TSP): 29th May 2012

pankajs · Post by **pankajs** » 17 Jun 2012 21:21

Reports claim American supership USS Enterprise is in Pak territorial waters

US moves its nuclear-powered aircraft carrier, the USS Enterprise, into Pakistani territorial waters near Gwadar, media reports said.

"The US has moved its biggest aircraft carrier 65 to 70 nautical miles away from Gwadar in the second week of June", a Pakistani television channel reported.

arun · Post by **arun** » 17 Jun 2012 21:33

Brad Goodman wrote:looks like napakis are furious at yindoos not handing them siachin on platter

Pakistan violates ceasefire again, fires at Indian positions
In second incident of ceasefire violation in the last two days, an army jawan was injured when Pakistani troops today fired at Indian posts along the Line of Control (LoC) in Krishna Ghati sector of the district.

The Islamic Republic of Pakistan fails to turn up for yesterday’s flag meeting called by India to discuss ceasefire violations without assigning any reason:

Pak cancels flag meet without assigning reasons: Army

The Islamic Republic of Pakistan then goes on to commit the fourth cease fire violation within a week:

Pak violates ceasefire again along LoC

Meanwhile ...........................

Anindya wrote:Sometimes juxtaposition helps...you will find most of these reports in the pages herein, but repeating nonetheless.

The ceasefire violations have been going on for the past few days - causing the death of one jawan at least...

Pakistan violates ceasefire for the twelfth time this year
POONCH: In second incident of ceasefire violation in the last two days, an army jawan was injured when Pakistani troops today fired at Indian posts along the Line of Control (LoC) in Krishna Ghati sector of the district.

The Indian troops, however, exercised restraint, he said. An army jawan received gun shot wounds and was air lifted to Command Hospital at Udhampur for treatment.

This is the 12th ceasefire violation by Pakistan this year.

Meanwhile, the BSF jawan who was injured in the ceasefire violation on Monday in the same sector, succumbed to his injuries this morning, officials said.
We Indians on the other hand, have decided to give away electricity, which we do not have, knowing fully well, that we may not receive payments for this...

India to Give away 500MW of power to Pakistan
Continuing its efforts to bridge trust deficit with neighbouring Pakistan, the government on Monday announced to supply 500 MWs of electricity to Pakistan as a major confidence building measure.
"Pakistan has asked us for power. We have decided to supply 500 megawatts to them
immediately. We have power and they are in need," said Union power secretary Dhruv Vijay Singh during the 7th International Hydel Power Convention at SKICC auditorium in Srinagar.

"They (Pakistan) asked us politely, we said sure," said Vijay.

The power ministry has decided to make transmission lines available for Pakistan and the neighbouring country will be asked to pay at the international rates.

"Transmission lines are being laid for this purpose," said Vijay without disclosing the name of the state where these transmission lines are being laid to supply power to Pakistan.

Pakistan, on the other hand, has not changed its stance towards legitimate generation of electricity within India - for quite flimsy reasons...

Pakistan's stance on Indian power generation in Kashmir remains unchanged
The gesture (see above) has come despite Pakistan expressing objections to the construction of 330 MW Kishenganga hydel power project in north Kashmir’s Bandipora district.

"Pakistan is likely to raise objections in each and every dam constructed in Jammu and Kashmir for power generation," said Singh.
For small concessions to India, huge paybacks are asked for by Pakistan...

Pakistan wants large territorial-strategic concessions from Indian for Afghan route
Pakistan must seek to augment its industrial base before being directly exposed to massive Indian economy but the triumph card will be the transit route to Central Asia. While Indian investment in Afghanistan is a strategic move to counter this maneuvering, Pakistan should link this transit route opening to resolution of all outstanding issues like Kashmir, water resources, Siachin etc.
No comments.

pankajs · Post by **pankajs** » 17 Jun 2012 21:43

Im the Dim on warpath again....
PTI to launch pro-judiciary campaign from 18th

LAHORE:

The Pakistan Tehreek-i-Insaf (PTI) will start a campaign of rallies in support of the judiciary from June 18 with a procession led by party chief Imran Khan in Lahore, said PTI Vice Chairman Shah Mehmood Qureshi on Saturday.

All regional PTI offices will also organise rallies in major cities and districts, Qureshi told a press conference, where he was accompanied by PTI Central Information Secretary Shafqat Mahmood and Punjab Information Secretary Andaleeb Abbas.

Qureshi said that the Malik Riaz case was a plot against the independent judiciary. He said that the PTI had always backed the judiciary and would do all it could to defend the institution.

svinayak · Post by **svinayak** » 17 Jun 2012 21:55

pankajs wrote:Reports claim American supership USS Enterprise is in Pak territorial waters
US moves its nuclear-powered aircraft carrier, the USS Enterprise, into Pakistani territorial waters near Gwadar, media reports said.

"The US has moved its biggest aircraft carrier 65 to 70 nautical miles away from Gwadar in the second week of June", a Pakistani television channel reported.

LOC violation and this thing is directly related to Def sec visit and the standoff

Anujan · Post by **Anujan** » 17 Jun 2012 22:46

Is it the usual summer pushing in of yahoos that takes place? Pakis usually give covering fire.

Charlie · Post by **Charlie** » 18 Jun 2012 05:08

UP government orders all malls, shops to shut at 7pm due to power shortfall

While we give power to the barbarians across the borders our own people are living in the "dark ages" literally. MMS once said that IM's have the first right to India's resources. Now he can add Pakis to that and say IM's and Pakis have the first right to Hindu riches.

Vivek_A · Post by **Vivek_A** » 18 Jun 2012 06:00

Can the people who think the TTP is a US plot tell us how India giving power to TSP is another American plot?

Get creative....try to link the two conspiracies together...

Some of use could use a good laugh...

abhishek_sharma · Post by **abhishek_sharma** » 18 Jun 2012 06:09

>> how India giving power to TSP is another American plot?

Actually US has been "encouraging" India to improve its ties with Pakistan for a long time. So, yes, America is one among many factors.

You should read newspapers more often.

shiv · Post by **shiv** » 18 Jun 2012 06:34

The power supply to Shitland decision is intriguing. Power lines are being laid. Knowing Pakistan, those lines won't take power very far in but will get tapped and used up as free supply within, I am certain, 50 km of the border. Lahore and parts of Pakjab near the border will probably benefit. Question is what will they do if India stops power supply after 2 months Continue to break the ceasefire?

Vivek_A · Post by **Vivek_A** » 18 Jun 2012 06:47

Why is it that the Indian government isn't going the other things that the US has been "encouraging" it to do? Especially things that would actually be good for India....things that a lot of people here support....

abhishek_sharma · Post by **abhishek_sharma** » 18 Jun 2012 06:53

Maybe you should be more specific and post the question in an appropriate thread?

In any case, your point does not contradict what I said. US is *an* important factor. It is not the only factor which determines our policies. This is just common sense.

pankajs · Post by **pankajs** » 18 Jun 2012 09:23

US to allay Pakistan’s concerns over new Afghan forum

WASHINGTON, June 17: A trilateral forum, which brings the United States and India in a new arrangement with Afghanistan, is not directed against Pakistan, says a senior US official.

Assistant Secretary of State for South and Central Asia Robert Blake claims that the main goal of this forum, announced in Washington this week, was to bring stability and economic development to war-torn Afghanistan.

partha · Post by **partha** » 18 Jun 2012 09:52

Lazy reporting from YAWN. Guess it is because the blasts have become so common, it all gets mixed up while reporting.

Today's Quetta blast report
http://dawn.com/2012/06/18/blast-in-que ... njures-22/

QUETTA: Two people were killed and 25 injured when a bomb exploded at Samungli road in Quetta on Monday, DawnNews reported.

According to police sources, the target of the attack was a bus of IT University.

The bus was passing by Samungli road when a remote-controlled bomb detonated causing the explosion.

The injured, who included students and pedestrians, were shifted to Civil Hospital Quetta. Some among the injured were stated to be in critical conditions.

Law enforcement agencies had cordoned off the area to gather important evidence.

Last week's Peshawar blast report:

http://dawn.com/2012/06/08/blast-report ... eshawar-3/

PESHAWAR: A bomb blast ripped through a bus on Friday, killing 19 people, including seven women and a child, on the outskirts of the northwestern city of Peshawar, police said.

More than 40 others were wounded in the attack on a bus rented by the government to take staff home after work in the province of Khyber Pakhtunkhwa.

Aditya_V · Post by **Aditya_V** » 18 Jun 2012 09:58

shiv wrote:The power supply to Shitland decision is intriguing. Power lines are being laid. Knowing Pakistan, those lines won't take power very far in but will get tapped and used up as free supply within, I am certain, 50 km of the border. Lahore and parts of Pakjab near the border will probably benefit. Question is what will they do if India stops power supply after 2 months Continue to break the ceasefire?

Logically Wars and Terrorism and cross border artillery shells should have be abrogated IWT and host of other treaties obligations but we still continued with them. I doubt once we supply power we will ever turn down the taps. Pakis seem to have something on our Elite that excudes them confidence.

Prem · Post by **Prem** » 18 Jun 2012 10:10

Blast in Quetta kills three, injures 30

Chotti si IED

According to police sources, the target of the attack was a bus of Ibreeding Technology University.
The bus was passing by Samungli road when a remote-controlled bomb detonated causing the explosion.
The injured, who included students and pedestrians, were shifted to Civil Hospital Quetta. Some among the injured were stated to be in critical conditions.Law enforcement agencies had cordoned off the area to gather important evidence

sum · Post by **sum** » 18 Jun 2012 10:14

According to police sources, the target of the attack was a bus of Ibreeding Technology University.

Ibreeding Tech Univ

JE Menon · Post by **JE Menon** » 18 Jun 2012 10:39

>>MMS once said that IM's have the first right to India's resources.

Is there a link to where he said that? Pls provide. ASAP pls because it would be a very important statement if he made it. If not pls amend.

Rahul M · Post by **Rahul M** » 18 Jun 2012 10:41

sum wrote:
According to police sources, the target of the attack was a bus of Ibreeding Technology University.
Ibreeding Tech Univ

missing 'n'.

abhishek_sharma · Post by **abhishek_sharma** » 18 Jun 2012 10:42

Muslims must have first claim on resources: PM

Prime Minister Manmohan Singh on Saturday said plans for minorities, particularly Muslims, must have the first claim on resources so that benefits of development reach them equitably.

"We will have to devise innovative plans to ensure that minorities, particularly the Muslim minority, are empowered to share equitably the fruits of development. These must have the first claim on resources," he said in his address at the 52nd meeting of the National Development Council here.

Rahul M · Post by **Rahul M** » 18 Jun 2012 10:42

JE Menon wrote:>>MMS once said that IM's have the first right to India's resources.

Is there a link to where he said that? Pls provide. ASAP pls because it would be a very important statement if he made it. If not pls amend.

Muslims must have first claim on resources: PM

http://articles.timesofindia.indiatimes ... es-muslims

JE Menon · Post by **JE Menon** » 18 Jun 2012 10:44

Tragic... I missed that.

SSridhar · Post by **SSridhar** » 18 Jun 2012 11:09

DT Editorial on the current situation

Paradigm shift is called for

Becoming almost a routine thing, bomb blasts draw little sympathy and raise more questions regarding the state of security attained by the government in the tribal areas. The bomb blasts in Landikotal and Kohat the other day claimed altogether 29 lives. The Kohat blast killed four police officers. Normally, it would have seemed reasonable to ascribe the Landikotal blast to Mangal Bagh’s Lashkar-e-Islami (LeI) as this area is their happy hunting ground, but now the Tehreek-i-Taliban Pakistan (TTP) has claimed responsibility. It remains to be seen if this is a ‘genuine’ claim or a red herring. The LeI had a stronghold in the Bara subdivision of Khyber Agency until the paramilitary forces drove the group out in 2009. It has upped the ante against the government since. Now holed up in the Tirah Valley, the group has waged war on the security forces as well as the militias that have joined hands with the authorities since 2008 to frustrate the designs of the militants. These pro-government militias have so far managed to capture or kill many terrorists. The blast in Landikotal is believed to have been aimed at members of the Zakakhel tribe who are fighting alongside the security forces against Mangal Bagh. In January this year, a major operation was launched in Khyber Agency, sending some 20,000 people of the area fleeing to camps for internally displaced persons in Peshawar. Violence abated until March, only to resurface, and has since been getting worse. Mangal Bagh and his accomplices have in the past targeted pro-government militias. In March this year there were reports of skirmishes between the pro-government Tawheed-e-Islami and LeI. The infighting between the lashkars (tribal militias), and the pounding of the security forces on the hideouts of the LeI in the Neka area of the Tirah Valley using gunship helicopters led to the evacuation of hundreds of people from the area.

It seems that the security forces have not been able to achieve their target, i.e. bringing the terrorists to their knees. Perhaps it is time for the military to take stock of the situation anew and define a better strategy to handle the situation in Khyber Agency. Presently, the tactical, piecemeal, Agency-to-Agency approach has failed to deliver results. Given the difficult, porous nature of the terrain, unless their retreat routes are cut off and a concerted offensive mounted against the militants, taking FATA as a whole into account, the security forces and their tribal allies would keep bleeding. Understandably, the area in question is difficult and requires extraordinary combat efforts, yet gaps and loopholes in security and strategy cannot be ruled out. Peace in Khyber Agency, as in FATA as a whole, is closely linked to a paradigm shift in strategy by the security forces for sustainable results.

sum · Post by **sum** » 18 Jun 2012 11:44

X-post:

sum wrote:Came across this snippet in a article on Pranab:
Why Pranab Mukherjee is NOT an ungenerous man

This happened as recently as December 2008. An angry Congress president, Sonia Gandhi, had convened a meeting of the Congress Working Committee after terrorists had attacked Mumbai killing more than 170 people, to send a strong message and also pave the way to sack some ministers.

Gandhi didn't lose her temper but let principal troubleshooter Pranab Mukherjee do as he liked. One after another, senior members of the CWC got up to demand that India launch an attack on Pakistan to teach that country a lesson.

Finally, when veteran Kashmir leader Karan Singh demanded the same, Mukherjee erupted: "Do you understand what you are all saying? If we do that (attack Pakistan), foreign forces will enter Kashmir the next day. We have kept them out of Kashmir all these years. And now you want us to invite them in?"

Prime Minister Manmohan Singh quickly intervened to support Mukherjee and defuse the tension. Meanwhile, some members quietly ascertained that the reporters waiting outside hadn't heard what Mukherjee was saying -- he was speaking so loudly.
What foreign forces is he talking about?

Dhoti-shivering by our future Prez onlee

SSridhar · Post by **SSridhar** » 18 Jun 2012 11:52

sum wrote:Came across this snippet in a article on Pranab:

Finally, when veteran Kashmir leader Karan Singh demanded the same, Mukherjee erupted: "Do you understand what you are all saying? If we do that (attack Pakistan), foreign forces will enter Kashmir the next day. We have kept them out of Kashmir all these years. And now you want us to invite them in?"
Dhoti-shivering by our future Prez onlee

You may call it dhoti-shivering, but I call it 'Chankian', though you should not ask me how.

svinayak · Post by **svinayak** » 18 Jun 2012 11:57

It is to do with international relations

PratikDas · Post by **PratikDas** » 18 Jun 2012 12:06

SSridhar wrote:
sum wrote:Came across this snippet in a article on Pranab:

Finally, when veteran Kashmir leader Karan Singh demanded the same, Mukherjee erupted: "Do you understand what you are all saying? If we do that (attack Pakistan), foreign forces will enter Kashmir the next day. We have kept them out of Kashmir all these years. And now you want us to invite them in?"
Dhoti-shivering by our future Prez onlee
You may call it dhoti-shivering, but I call it 'Chankian', though you should not ask me how.

So you accept that there cannot be a military response to acts of terrorism?

Mahendra · Post by **Mahendra** » 18 Jun 2012 12:08

and social engineering

nachiket · Post by **nachiket** » 18 Jun 2012 12:12

PratikDas wrote:
SSridhar wrote: You may call it dhoti-shivering, but I call it 'Chankian', though you should not ask me how.
So you accept that there cannot be a military response to acts of terrorism?

He is being sarcastic.

PratikDas · Post by **PratikDas** » 18 Jun 2012 12:15

nachiket wrote: He is being sarcastic.

Ah, got a taste of my own medicine. It works.

SSridhar · Post by **SSridhar** » 18 Jun 2012 13:10

Acharya wrote:It is to do with international relations

Ahh, yes. I forgot. Are there any other 'Chankian' explanations ?

symontk · Post by **symontk** » 18 Jun 2012 13:16

shiv wrote:The power supply to Shitland decision is intriguing. Power lines are being laid. Knowing Pakistan, those lines won't take power very far in but will get tapped and used up as free supply within, I am certain, 50 km of the border. Lahore and parts of Pakjab near the border will probably benefit. Question is what will they do if India stops power supply after 2 months Continue to break the ceasefire?

Its actually a loan given to Pakistan (they are not going to pay the bills), just like US giving weapons, Saudia giving oil. Anyway I havent understood the "Chunkian" strategy of doing this

vishvak · Post by **vishvak** » 18 Jun 2012 13:18

symontk wrote:
shiv wrote:The power supply to Shitland decision is intriguing. Power lines are being laid. Knowing Pakistan, those lines won't take power very far in but will get tapped and used up as free supply within, I am certain, 50 km of the border. Lahore and parts of Pakjab near the border will probably benefit. Question is what will they do if India stops power supply after 2 months Continue to break the ceasefire?
Its actually a loan given to Pakistan (they are not going to pay the bills), just like US giving weapons, Saudia giving oil. Anyway I havent understood the "Chunkian" strategy of doing this

Perhaps just Chinese machinery can be allocated for this, just as it is available on the other side of border.

SSridhar · Post by **SSridhar** » 18 Jun 2012 13:33

Blast kills 4 Shia students in Quetta

“The bomb targeted the bus as it carried a majority of Shia students,” he [city police chief Mir Zubair] added.

Sagar G · Post by **Sagar G** » 18 Jun 2012 13:38

I haven't seen the news of India supplying power to pukis in any news channels yet, undie tv would have gone berserk with this if this had happened but none of the news channels have reported this yet, maybe there are plans/negotiations going on to supply them power and some dork went ahead reported that we are ready to supply power to them. Nonetheless I am just observing how much GOI is ready to bend backwards to appease pukis to buy some hollow peace.

Rahul M wrote:
JE Menon wrote:>>MMS once said that IM's have the first right to India's resources.

Is there a link to where he said that? Pls provide. ASAP pls because it would be a very important statement if he made it. If not pls amend.
Muslims must have first claim on resources: PM

http://articles.timesofindia.indiatimes ... es-muslims

MMS had also said that Pukis and us have a "shared future" to which then NSA M.K.Narayanan had told him on his face that maybe he has a shared future with Pukistan, India doesn't. MMS's remark had set me thinking how the hell can we have a shared future with pukis, only now I have come to understand MMS's vision. First of all you ****** India's economy, then weaken your defence forces, work towards ensuring water and power shortage and sooner than later we will become a la pakistan hence having a "shared future".

While searching for such nuggets from MMS came across this article by Brahma Chellaney which contains many more such nuggets from our great visionary....

Delhi trusts Terroristan as it sinks into Anarchistan

India is ready to trust Pakistan again, says Foreign Minister S.M. Krishna. The septuagenarian has gone one step further to declare, "We feel Pakistan will not encourage terror-related activities any more." Despite its extended hand being slapped again and again by Pakistan, the Indian Government does not believe in Ronald Reagan's dictum, "Trust and verify." Rather it has coined its own general rule, "Trust, and trust blindly."

Like blind love, the Government's blind trust brooks no rationality. In self-justification, however, New Delhi is recycling self-deluding old myths on Pakistan.

● Political geography is unalterable. "We cannot wish away the fact that Pakistan is our neighbour," Prime Minister Manmohan Singh has said repeatedly. So, "a stable, peaceful and prosperous Pakistan" is in India's "own interest." But political maps are never carved in stone, as the breaking away of Eritrea, East Timor and others have shown. Didn't Indira Gandhi change political geography in 1971? In fact, the most-profound global events in recent history have been the fragmentation of several states, including the Soviet Union and Yugoslavia.

Pakistan — the world's Terroristan rolled into an Anarchistan — looks increasingly decrepit and combustible. US policy, however, is not to let Pakistan fail. In the words of President Barack Obama, "We will provide them all of the cooperation that we can. We want to respect their sovereignty, but we also recognise that we have huge strategic interests, huge national security interests in making sure that Pakistan is stable and that you don't end up having a nuclear-armed militant state."

● India and Pakistan are locked by a shared destiny. Therefore, "Our objective must be a permanent peace with Pakistan, where we are bound together by a shared future and a common prosperity." Despite New Delhi's harping on a "shared destiny," how can a plural, inclusive and democratic India share a common future with a theocratic, militarised and radicalised Pakistan? In fact, Pakistan, with its "war of a thousand cuts," poses an existential threat to the very principles and values on which India is founded.

● The alternative to a policy of appeasement is war. "Unless we want to go to war with Pakistan, dialogue is the only way out," according to Dr Singh. This draws on the classic argument of appeasers that the only alternative to appeasement is provocation or conflict. The simple truth is that between bending backwards and waging aggression lie a hundred different options.

Yet, by greeting each major cross-border terror strike in recent years with complete inaction, the Government has speciously suggested to the nation that the only alternative to such pusillanimity is war. After 26/11, for example, Dr Singh exercised not one of the multiple political, economic and diplomatic options he had — from recalling the high commissioner from Islamabad and disbanding the farcical Joint Anti-Terror Mechanism to designating Pakistan's Inter-Services Intelligence as a terrorist organisation and invoking trade sanctions. As a result, India ended up not taking the smallest of small steps even as a token expression of outrage over Pakistan's role.

● India cannot emerge as a world power without making peace with Pakistan. "I sincerely believe India cannot realise its development ambition or its ambition of being a great power if our neighbourhood remains disturbed ... it is in our vital interest, therefore, to try again to make peace with Pakistan," according to the PM. To say that the country cannot emerge as a major power without making peace with an adversary wedded to waging war by terror is to go against the grain of world history and to encourage the foe to hold India's progress hostage.

Next-door China has emerged as a global player by building comprehensive national power, not by coming to terms with Taiwan, which it has continuously kept under a threat of military invasion. Beijing also has pursued a consistently assertive approach toward India for long and, in fact, carried out military aggression against Korea, India, Russia and Vietnam when it was economically backward. Irredentist Pakistan is locked in mortal combat with status quoist India. It seeks its salvation in India's unravelling.

Even if India handed the Kashmir Valley on a platter, Pakistan's war by terror would not end. Yet, by linking India's global rise to the placation of Pakistan, Singh has hyphenated India with that country even more strikingly than any international actor.

Like the ruinous Nehruvian Hindi-Chini bhai bhai policy, a Hindi-Paki bhai bhai approach is on display today, being actively propagated through the Aman Ki Asha slogan.

Let's be clear: India's rise is not dependent on adversarial goodwill.

● As India has nothing to hide and indeed "our conduct is an open book," it can let Pakistan include any issue in the bilateral agenda. It is such logic that has guided New Delhi in permitting Pakistan to turn its terror target, India, into an accused on Balochistan.

It is the same logic that has put India on the defensive on the water issue, although the Indus Waters Treaty is unprecedented in its scale of generosity. Under the treaty, India has reserved the largest three of the six Indus-system rivers for Pakistan's use and agreed to be content with the other rivers whose annual renewable resources are so small that they make up just 19.48% of the total waters in the Indus system. In other words, Pakistan gets more than four-fifths of the Indus waters. Thanks to India's water munificence, Pakistan boasts "the largest contiguous irrigation system in the world" — a system that irrigates an area larger than the land size of Uruguay, England, Bangladesh or Greece.

● Diplomacy of hope and prayer makes sense. "I hope and pray that the leadership in Pakistan will have the strength and the courage to defeat those who want to destroy, not just peace between India and Pakistan, but the future of South Asia," according to Dr Singh. Wishful thinking has long hobbled Indian foreign policy. Now, in the glaring absence of holistic, institutionalised decision-making, prayers are being added to the wishes.

Yet, even God cannot help those praying for Pakistan to kick its terrorism habit. A state that has employed armed proxies against India virtually from its inception cannot do without them. A de-terrorised Pakistan will become an extinct Pakistan.

The old men in power love old myths. The blunt truth is that India's Pakistan policy needs to be anchored in a principle that redefines "trust and verify" as "verify and trust." For that to happen, the Government has to first come out of its blind-trust mode.

Philip · Post by **Philip** » 18 Jun 2012 13:58

How can the current "blind men of Hindoostan" that mislead the nation,deaf,dumb and blind, totally subservient to Uncle Sam ever be able to nzegotiate anything other than an abject unconditional surrender to Pak? All that the Cong. faction of the UPA is desperately looking for is a magic mantra that will bring it an election victory come the next hustings.It fears Modi tremendously and the line of hope by the quislings is a quick "peace in our time" with Pzk.

That shrewd and patient vulture,Gen. Kill-any,threw us bait after the tragic loss of hundreds of Paki troops due to the avalanche at Siachen.The indecent haste with which India/UPA grasped the bait has convinced the Vulture that we are a bunch of spineless mutts,far easier to defeat across the table than on the battlefield! While parts of India reel in power shortages,our worthy "patriots" of the MMS regime prefer to provide the enemy with such succour!

Onze sincerely hopes that the new IA chief does not succumb to the wishes of the straws that bend in the wind and maintains the high honour and prestige of the IA by scuttling any such surrender of Indian interests across thertable.

symontk · Post by **symontk** » 18 Jun 2012 14:15

India is ready to trust Pakistan again, says Foreign Minister S.M. Krishna. The septuagenarian has gone one step further to declare, "We feel Pakistan will not encourage terror-related activities any more." Despite its extended hand being slapped again and again by Pakistan, the Indian Government does not believe in Ronald Reagan's dictum, "Trust and verify." Rather it has coined its own general rule, "Trust, and trust blindly."

Like blind love, the Government's blind trust brooks no rationality. In self-justification, however, New Delhi is recycling self-deluding old myths on Pakistan.

>> These are "Chunkian" stratgies which you will not understand

● Political geography is unalterable. "We cannot wish away the fact that Pakistan is our neighbour," Prime Minister Manmohan Singh has said repeatedly. So, "a stable, peaceful and prosperous Pakistan" is in India's "own interest." But political maps are never carved in stone, as the breaking away of Eritrea, East Timor and others have shown. Didn't Indira Gandhi change political geography in 1971? In fact, the most-profound global events in recent history have been the fragmentation of several states, including the Soviet Union and Yugoslavia.

Pakistan — the world's Terroristan rolled into an Anarchistan — looks increasingly decrepit and combustible. US policy, however, is not to let Pakistan fail. In the words of President Barack Obama, "We will provide them all of the cooperation that we can. We want to respect their sovereignty, but we also recognise that we have huge strategic interests, huge national security interests in making sure that Pakistan is stable and that you don't end up having a nuclear-armed militant state."

>> What can India do here when a supah powah is itself telling Pakistan has to survive

● India and Pakistan are locked by a shared destiny. Therefore, "Our objective must be a permanent peace with Pakistan, where we are bound together by a shared future and a common prosperity." Despite New Delhi's harping on a "shared destiny," how can a plural, inclusive and democratic India share a common future with a theocratic, militarised and radicalised Pakistan? In fact, Pakistan, with its "war of a thousand cuts," poses an existential threat to the very principles and values on which India is founded.

● The alternative to a policy of appeasement is war. "Unless we want to go to war with Pakistan, dialogue is the only way out," according to Dr Singh. This draws on the classic argument of appeasers that the only alternative to appeasement is provocation or conflict. The simple truth is that between bending backwards and waging aggression lie a hundred different options.

Yet, by greeting each major cross-border terror strike in recent years with complete inaction, the Government has speciously suggested to the nation that the only alternative to such pusillanimity is war. After 26/11, for example, Dr Singh exercised not one of the multiple political, economic and diplomatic options he had — from recalling the high commissioner from Islamabad and disbanding the farcical Joint Anti-Terror Mechanism to designating Pakistan's Inter-Services Intelligence as a terrorist organisation and invoking trade sanctions. As a result, India ended up not taking the smallest of small steps even as a token expression of outrage over Pakistan's role.

>> Pakistan planned 26/11, dont you think they wouldnt have considered India's response. Remember what happened to Iraq after they attacked Kuwait. Iraq's argument was Kuwait was stealing of which there were sympathizers, like for India after 26/11

● India cannot emerge as a world power without making peace with Pakistan. "I sincerely believe India cannot realise its development ambition or its ambition of being a great power if our neighbourhood remains disturbed ... it is in our vital interest, therefore, to try again to make peace with Pakistan," according to the PM. To say that the country cannot emerge as a major power without making peace with an adversary wedded to waging war by terror is to go against the grain of world history and to encourage the foe to hold India's progress hostage.

Next-door China has emerged as a global player by building comprehensive national power, not by coming to terms with Taiwan, which it has continuously kept under a threat of military invasion. Beijing also has pursued a consistently assertive approach toward India for long and, in fact, carried out military aggression against Korea, India, Russia and Vietnam when it was economically backward. Irredentist Pakistan is locked in mortal combat with status quoist India. It seeks its salvation in India's unravelling.

>> Most of the weapons used by Chinese are local made, is it the same case with India?

Even if India handed the Kashmir Valley on a platter, Pakistan's war by terror would not end. Yet, by linking India's global rise to the placation of Pakistan, Singh has hyphenated India with that country even more strikingly than any international actor.

Like the ruinous Nehruvian Hindi-Chini bhai bhai policy, a Hindi-Paki bhai bhai approach is on display today, being actively propagated through the Aman Ki Asha slogan.

Let's be clear: India's rise is not dependent on adversarial goodwill.

● As India has nothing to hide and indeed "our conduct is an open book," it can let Pakistan include any issue in the bilateral agenda. It is such logic that has guided New Delhi in permitting Pakistan to turn its terror target, India, into an accused on Balochistan.

>> But did they came back with any evidence? and if also, why are we feeling guilty?

It is the same logic that has put India on the defensive on the water issue, although the Indus Waters Treaty is unprecedented in its scale of generosity. Under the treaty, India has reserved the largest three of the six Indus-system rivers for Pakistan's use and agreed to be content with the other rivers whose annual renewable resources are so small that they make up just 19.48% of the total waters in the Indus system. In other words, Pakistan gets more than four-fifths of the Indus waters. Thanks to India's water munificence, Pakistan boasts "the largest contiguous irrigation system in the world" — a system that irrigates an area larger than the land size of Uruguay, England, Bangladesh or Greece.

>> Did it stop us building dams?

● Diplomacy of hope and prayer makes sense. "I hope and pray that the leadership in Pakistan will have the strength and the courage to defeat those who want to destroy, not just peace between India and Pakistan, but the future of South Asia," according to Dr Singh. Wishful thinking has long hobbled Indian foreign policy. Now, in the glaring absence of holistic, institutionalised decision-making, prayers are being added to the wishes.

Yet, even God cannot help those praying for Pakistan to kick its terrorism habit. A state that has employed armed proxies against India virtually from its inception cannot do without them. A de-terrorised Pakistan will become an extinct Pakistan.

The old men in power love old myths. The blunt truth is that India's Pakistan policy needs to be anchored in a principle that redefines "trust and verify" as "verify and trust." For that to happen, the Government has to first come out of its blind-trust mode.

>> when you say government, when it went to a blind-trust mode? MMS dreams are his dreams, there are other things which are important to nation. So for MMS dreams to fulfill, there has to be equal response from Pakis. Pakis being Pakis, it will never happen, so dont worry. If it does, its good for India anyway, right?

Kanishka · Post by **Kanishka** » 18 Jun 2012 14:53

What's Wrong with Pakistan?

Perversity characterizes Pakistan. Only the worst African hellholes, Afghanistan, Haiti, Yemen, and Iraq rank higher on this year's Failed States Index. The country is run by a military obsessed with -- and, for decades, invested in -- the conflict with India, and by a civilian elite that steals all it can and pays almost no taxes. But despite an overbearing military, tribes "defined by a near-universal male participation in organized violence," as the late European anthropologist Ernest Gellner put it, dominate massive swaths of territory. The absence of the state makes for 20-hour daily electricity blackouts and an almost nonexistent education system in many areas.

The root cause of these manifold failures, in many minds, is the very artificiality of Pakistan itself: a cartographic puzzle piece sandwiched between India and Central Asia that splits apart what the British Empire ruled as one indivisible subcontinent. Pakistan claims to represent the Indian subcontinent's Muslims, but more Muslims live in India and Bangladesh put together than in Pakistan. In the absence of any geographical reason for its existence, Pakistan, so the assumption goes, can fall back only on Islamic extremism as an organizing principle of the state.

But this core assumption about what ails Pakistan is false. Pakistan, which presents more nightmare scenarios for American policymakers than perhaps any other country, does have geographical logic. The vision of Pakistan's founder, Muhammad Ali Jinnah, in the 1940s did not constitute a mere power grab at the expense of India's Hindu-dominated Congress party. There was much history and geography behind his drive to create a separate Muslim state anchored in the subcontinent's northwest, abutting southern Central Asia. Understanding this legacy properly leads to a very troubling scenario about where Pakistan -- and by extension, Afghanistan and India -- may now be headed. Pakistan's present and future, for better or worse, are still best understood through its geography.

SSridhar · Post by **SSridhar** » 18 Jun 2012 15:27

Kanishka wrote:What's Wrong with Pakistan?
. . . the very artificiality of Pakistan itself: a cartographic puzzle piece [/b] . . .

It was even worse until 1971.

Suppiah · Post by **Suppiah** » 18 Jun 2012 16:16

Taliban now tries taqiyya...

http://paktribune.com/news/Taliban-hail ... 50721.html

BTW did not know the bunnies are so clever the managed to figure out the American conspiracy to 'sterlise' the faithfools in the name of polio vaccination..

anupmisra · Post by **anupmisra** » 18 Jun 2012 16:32

shiv wrote:Power lines are being laid. Knowing Pakistan, those lines won't take power very far in but will get tapped and used up as free supply within, I am certain, 50 km of the border. Lahore and parts of Pakjab near the border will probably benefit.

This is a sign of Indian conspiracy only. How, you ask?

First the Baniyas pretend to supply free bijli (electricity) @ 60 Hz through those special BEL-built power lines with hollow cores and when the nanha faithfuls get used to free bijli, the evil baniyas will then supply polio vaccine and other cheap medicines at 50 Hz that cause impotency and low IQ through the same electrical wires the moment they flick on the light switches. The Yindoos can never be trusted even with their free gifts. Chankian evil has no limit. All pak lurks, please alert your people living in border areas.

Diabolical.