West Asia News and Discussions

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habal
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Re: West Asia News and Discussions

Post by habal »

Was not a prominent Shiite leader killed in Saudi Arabia's eastern region a few weeks before ?

15 Jul 2012
Interior ministry spokesman Mansur al-Turki said a group of four "masked gunmen" on motorbikes opened fire at the main police station in the town of Awamiya, and that one threw a petrol bomb. One man was killed and the rest fled, he said, according to the Saudi Press Agency.

The incident on Friday night occurred less than a week after two protesters were killed when police opened fire on a demonstration in the nearby city of Qatif on July 9, following the arrest of a prominent Shia opposition leader in Awamiya, Sheikh Nimr al-Nimr.
Sheikh Nimr was arrested and then shot dead by Saudi 'security forces'.

Image
Altair
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Re: West Asia News and Discussions

Post by Altair »

ramana wrote:Nightwatch commentary 1 Aug 2012 on same subject:
If he died from an assassination attempt on the 22d, the most obvious and likely culprits are Syria and Iran.
The list is incomplete without Russia. There may be a dozen agencies/terrorist organizations who can put a bomb in KSA Intelligence HQs. But ONLY a few covert agencies can bomb the Saudi intelligence headquarters and make amends to shake hands with them later. The list gets very tiny now, CIA, FSB and Mossad.
Bandar dead or otherwise, Russia had to know about it.
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Re: West Asia News and Discussions

Post by Austin »

Annan resigns as Special Envoy to Syria
Kofi Annan blamed "finger pointing and name calling" within the U.N. Security Council among the reasons for his decision on Thursday to quit as the U.N.-Arab League Joint Special Envoy for Syria.

The world is full of crazy people like me. So don't be surprised if Secretary General Ban Ki-moon can find someone who can do a better job than me," Annan said when asked if he thought someone else would be named to succeed him.

"There may be other plans, other approaches that may work quite effectively," he said, adding that at this stage the focus should still be on a political transition which means "President (Bashar) al-Assad will have to leave sooner or later".
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Re: West Asia News and Discussions

Post by shyamd »

Sheikh Nimr is alive and was shot after a car chase. He is in a hospital in riyadh - last news that he was doing a hunger strike.

The news is that KSA interior minister told the governor that the situation in eastern province is unacceptable - meaning they will have to do a big crack down.

--------------
Very much doubt his deputy or bandar is dead. Although I find it interesting that night watch got official confirmation... People talk and word would get around pretty fast.

If it was true, I would say it would be AQAP as Iran has been asking any enemy to hit western/Gulf shipping or sites in yemen.
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Re: West Asia News and Discussions

Post by Mahendra »

Did diyar supreme leader get his 72?
Did diyar custodian of the holy saudi intelligence get his 72?
too many questions, too few answers
ramana
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Re: West Asia News and Discussions

Post by ramana »

It could even be a faction/succession fight in the Al Saud family.
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Re: West Asia News and Discussions

Post by Kati »

^^^^
...another rumor making rounds is that some elements within the royal family were not very pleased when bandar returned from nearly two decades' of exile (DC), and wanted to play
a significant role within the country......
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Re: West Asia News and Discussions

Post by anmol »

What is this :?: This guy is claiming that "None of the Assad regime's four heads of military intelligence were killed" :---
Where is Prince Bandar?
By Pepe Escobar

Was Prince Bandar "Bush", 63, son of Prince Sultan bin Abdulaziz (perennial Saudi Defense Minister,1963-2001), semi-perennial ambassador to Washington (1983-2005), and secretive jihad financier, killed by a Syrian intelligence death squad?

Thunderous silence prevails on Syrian, Iranian and Arab media (most of it controlled by the Saudis). The same applies for al-Jazeera. This is DEBKA's somewhat fanciful take.

Dates are crucial. Prince Bandar bin Sultan bin Abdulaziz Al Saud may have pulled off operation "Damascus Volcano" on July 18. He was definitely promoted to head of Saudi intelligence on July 19. And he might have been killed in a bomb attack on the Saudi General Intelligence HQ in



Riyadh on July 22.

One Syrian rumor mill version rules that "Damascus Volcano" came from Saudi intel - with logistics provided by the Central Intelligence Agency (CIA). This is highly unlikely; the CIA is clueless on how to penetrate Assad's inner sanctum. The predominant version circulating in the Syrian capital is this was a white coup.

"Damascus Volcano", by the way, was a flop; the swarm of mercenaries - infiltrated via Jordan - who were supposed to take over the capital had to retreat up north. Now the news cycle is fixated on another faux game-changer - the "Battle of Aleppo".

There are serious problems with all the spin around "Damascus Volcano". None of the Assad regime's four heads of military intelligence were killed - they are actually running the (ghastly) show in Aleppo.

There are also problems with a Syrian death squad being able to strike Riyadh's inner sanctum. But Iranian intelligence could certainly pull this off. As for Debka's assumption that Tehran may have hired al-Qaeda jihadis for an inside job against the House of Saud, that is rubbish.

The bottom line; no one knows, because no one is talking.

What is certain is that Bandar as head of Saudi intelligence was part of King Abdullah's hardcore response to the Arab Spring.

In Syria, the House of Saud strategy boils down to regime change - and a fragile, fragmented, Sunni government in Damascus not aligned with Tehran.

Internally, the strategy is to viciously smash any peaceful Shi'ite-majority protest in the eastern provinces. Essentially, there's no Arab Spring in Saudi Arabia because the House of Saud either bribes or intimidates its subjects.

The overall strategy of choice is "blame it on Iran"; as this logic goes, Saudi Shi'ites are Iranian puppets as much as Bahraini Shi'ites. The Obama administration blindly subscribes to this fallacy - totally missing the point; the House of Saud hates any semblance of Western parliamentary democracy as much as it hates Shi'ites - Iranian and otherwise.

So what happened in Riyadh? A graphic Tehran message to the House of Saud? A rogue suicide bomber? An internal Saudi war? The House of Saud is not talking. And Bandar is not moving.
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Re: West Asia News and Discussions

Post by ramana »

At a minimum he is out of commission. At worst could be more.
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Re: West Asia News and Discussions

Post by shyamd »

The article is BS.
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Re: West Asia News and Discussions

Post by Philip »

While the West plot and plan to oust Assad by any means most foul,the FSA for help as it cannot feed its people.Obama has signed a secret order where the US will in actual fact go to war with Syria using proxies and setting up their battle HQ in Turkey.The agony of ordinary people in Syria will prolong as the West plots Assad's demise while the East (Russia and China) will go to equal means to keep his regime in power.While the Russian Navy is in Syrian ports,an IN flotilla of 4 warships remarkably makes a visit to Israel,to "show support" for the West?!

At least Kofi Annan had the good sense to call it a day and not be another pimp for the West as Bunkum Moon is.His mission never had a ghost of a chance of an icicle in hell as long as the west,US in particular keeps on supporting the mercenary mob who posture to be "Syrian" .The Iranians have now upped the ante by threatening to attack Saudi A and the "ghost heavyweight" Qatar,boxing way above its class,if the Syrian regime is in danger of falling."Medal winners" in this Olympic blood sport can be found in the White House and No.10 Downing St. too! Have the West still not learnt their lessons time and time again,not to interfere in the affairs of independent nations according to the UN charter ,as they have screwed up the word in the last half century from Vietnam ,Afghanistan,Iraq,Libya,and now to Israel's doorstep.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2012/au ... els-aleppo

Syrian refugee crisis: we can't feed our people, say advancing FSA rebels
Diplomatic hopes dashed by resignation of Kofi Annan while thousands more join mass exodus from Aleppo
News
World news
Syria

Syrian refugee crisis: we can't feed our people, say advancing FSA rebels

Diplomatic hopes dashed by resignation of Kofi Annan while thousands more join mass exodus from Alep

Martin Chulov in Antakya
guardian.co.uk, Thursday 2 August 2012

Gun battles rocked the streets of Aleppo on Thursdayas rebel groups tried to push from their stronghold in the south of the city. Meanwhile, diplomatic hopes for a resolution to the crisis were crushed by the resignation of the UN's envoy to Syria, Kofi Annan.

For a second day, rebel groups made use of tanks they had captured from a regime base, shelling an airfield in the north of the city and attacking regime positions, forcing thousands more to join a mass exodus of refugees from parts of Syria's second city.

Abu Hamza, a Free Syrian Army colonel from the Jebel al-Zawiya district south of Idlib, told the Guardian that neither the FSA nor local communities could provide shelter or food for the thousands of displaced civilians being forced to sleep in fields or on the streets of towns and villages.

More than 250,000 refugees are believed to have fled Aleppo in the past fortnight, with large parts of the city of 2.5 million people now empty.

"We can't feed them," he said. "We need help. We don't even have food for our own families, or for ourselves. We cannot survive for much longer under these conditions. We are talking a few weeks."

In southern Turkey, meanwhile, the general formerly responsible for Syria's chemical warfare division said US and Turkish intelligence officers had questioned him about the weapons' location and whether the regime would use them.

Adnan Silou, who fled to Turkey nearly two months ago, said he told his interrogators that the stockpiles of chemicals remained secured, but that regime leaders would likely deploy them if they were cornered. "I am sure about this," he said. "They were a weapon of last resort and what will happen when that day comes."

Silou, who retired from the Syrian military's most controversial unit in late 2008, said he had been consulted by still serving officers throughout the past three years and was able to inspect an inventory of the weapons 10 days before fleeing.

"Every one of the stockpiles was intact, although it appeared that some had been moved," he said. "Not even a centimetre had disappeared from the supplies as I knew them three years ago."

Syria's chemical weapons included Sarin, mustard and nerve gas, which could be deployed via artillery shells, rockets, or aircraft, Silou said. He said making them combat-ready was a difficult process, requiring components to be brought together from various locations across the country.

He identified the main chemical depots as being 10km east of Damascus and 10km south of Homs. "They were called units 417 and 418 and they are heavily protected," he said. Chemicals have also been stored in the eastern desert city of Deir el-Zour.

"All of these things I told the Americans and the Turks when they took me to Ankara," he said. "They wanted to know everything. I told them that only the president could give the order to weaponise them. It would have to be Assad."

With state authority in Syria steadily eroding through defections and sanctions, fears have been raised that the chemical weapons may be used by the embattled regime, or fall into the hands of terror groups.

Syria's foreign ministry spokesman Jihad Makdissi last month added to growing international concerns by warning that the weapons might be used against "foreign aggressors". "Any stock of WMD or unconventional weapons that the Syrian Army possesses will never, never be used against the Syrian people or civilians during this crisis, under any circumstances," he said. "These weapons are made to be used strictly and only in the event of external aggression against the Syrian Arab Republic."

Since then, regional states, including Saudi Arabia, Turkey and Israel, have sharply increased efforts to monitor the location of stockpiles. Israel has suggested it would be prepared to send its military to Syria to safeguard the weapons if the regime fell.

The intractable nature of the conflict was brought into focuson Thursday when Kofi Annan, the United Nations special envoy to Damascus, announced he would not extend his term when it expires at the end of the month.

The diplomat tabled a peace plan in April that had been the linchpin of diplomatic efforts to stop a slide into full-blown civil war. However, none of its main points had taken root, despite three rounds of shuttle diplomacy to Damascus, pleas to both the regime and rebel groups to negotiate, and dire warnings about the failure to find a compromise.

The end of Annan's diplomacy comes amid continuing gridlock at the UN security council, where three attempts by the US and European states to shift Russia and China from their resolute support for the Assad regime have failed.
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Re: West Asia News and Discussions

Post by shyamd »

Ball is in Iran's court

Netanyahu: If Israel attacks Iran, I will take responsibility for the consequences
In closed forum, PM castigates defense officials, accusing them of conducting discussions on Iran in such a way as to absolve themselves of responsibility in any future commission of inquiry.

Speaking in a closed meeting, Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu stated this week that he is not troubled by the possibility that an investigative committee could be formed after a theoretical Israeli strike on Iran.

Netanyahu criticized security establishment officials for their handling of the issue, hinting that they are primarily concerned about avoiding having to take responsibility for their actions.

A number of officials who attended the meeting, who asked to remain nameless, said that the majority of those present left the meeting feeling that Netanyahu remains steadfast in his determination not to rely on the United States, and can be expected to order the IDF to attack Iran in the coming months.

Others present at the meeting, however, pointed out that Netanyahu’s comments seemed to be part of the “psychological warfare” campaign that Netanyahu and Defense Minister Ehud Barak are conducting, in order to pressure the U.S. into attacking Iran itself.

At one point during the meeting, a participant asked Netanyahu what he thinks could possibly happen the day after an Israeli strike on Iran. According to one official present at the meeting, the question angered Netanyahu. “If an investigative committee is formed, I’ll go and say that I, I am responsible,” said Netanyahu, as he pounded the table, and his chest, with his fist.

The fuming Netanyahu didn’t stop there. “I’ve had enough of this atmosphere,” he said. “It’s also felt in other discussions [on Iran], people keep showing me presentations prepared as if for an investigative committee. I’ve told them to stop with these presentations, stop speaking on protocol, and get to the point,” said Netanyahu.

Netanyahu made it clear to those present that he prefers that the U.S. “do the work," though he admits that the U.S. is not prepared to pursue a military option at this point.

According to Netanyahu, certain criteria would have to exist before the U.S. would be willing to attack Iran. If Iran were to begin enriching uranium to 90 percent instead of 20, attack American interests in the Persian gulf or carry out a massive attack against Israel, then the U.S. might be prepared to strike, he said.

Netanyahu admitted that the chance of these things happening is low, though if the U.S. does attack Iran’s nuclear facilities, Israel will not need to attack as well, he said, explaining that “the Israeli home front will be hit with ricochets no matter what happens.”

Netanyahu also said he holds a bi-weekly meeting to discuss that issue and prepare for it. “Even if rockets are fired, that would be preferable to a nuclear bomb,” he said.

Netanyahu was also asked if an Israeli attack against Iranian nuclear facilities would be effective enough to stop the Islamic Republic’s nuclear program, or only set it back a year or two.

As he has in the past, Netanyahu referenced the 1981 attack on Iraq’s nuclear reactor. “Then too, people said it would take them two years to rebuild the reactor, but the fact remains that to this day [Iraq] doesn’t have a nuclear weapon,” said Netanyahu.

The Prime Minister’s Office said in response, “We do not comment on issues discussed in closed forces, including when the quotes from them are inaccurate.”
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Re: West Asia News and Discussions

Post by pentaiah »

All this egging is to get collateral from unkil anyway which way hard liners can.
As in the foreign affairs magazine article Iran once gets there it will sit at the table like an equal

If NK which has nothing to lose is still in the periphery of rationality how can Iran which has lot more going to it be irrational to attack after the bomb.

The security of Israel is already beyond reach of any one and is un questioned there fore the issue boils down to curtailment of Israeli unilateral un checked expansion that is at stake when and if Iran has it
ramana
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Re: West Asia News and Discussions

Post by ramana »

The game is for US to be forced to take on Iran to complete the erasure of threats to Israel.
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Re: West Asia News and Discussions

Post by Agnimitra »

Kuwaiti newspaper al-Siyasat reports that officeholders of the Islamic regime of Iran have offered Hezbollah chief Hassan Nasrullah asylum within Iran at this time. It is said this is because of the situation of the Asad regime in Syria. The Iranians feel that Nasrollah's life could be in danger, so they are suggesting he exit Lebanon and come to Iran.
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Re: West Asia News and Discussions

Post by Philip »

Stepping back for a moment and viewing the changing landscape of the M-East,one must give credit to the "realpolitik" of the Israelis,who are rapidly emerging as potential victors in this latest round of the M-E's version of the "Great Game". A decade+ ago,we had ranged against Israel,some very powerful Arab/Muslim states.Iraq has been utterly defanged,Saddam hanged by a kangaroo court,the oil is in control of western oil companies and the Shiites are as of now unable to assert their pro-Iranian stance to be of any danger to Israel for a long time.Eccentrics like Gaddhaffi have been exterminated ,Egypt has had a stubborn refusing-to-leave/hand over Mubarak ousted .While it may not be going all according to plan in Egypt,the last great military danger to Israel,Syria has also almost been eliminated form posing a genuine threat to Israel by the manipulation of the conflict there.

This all came about after the emergence of the Hiz and Hamas as the primary opponents to Israel,in the absence of the Israelis keeping their promises to the Palestinians on the peace settlement.Israeli settlements keep on expanding on Palestinian ancestral held land and the west's capitulation to Israelis hard-line interests have left the opposition to Israel to take to arms.The Hiz and Hamas have dared to attack Israel from their ghettoes in Gaza and Lebanon,with the latter especially surprising the Israeli military in the last round of fighting where the Israelis took heavy losses of tanks,etc..Their primary sponsors therefore needed to be marginalised or exterminated.The greatest of these is undoubtedly Shiite Iran,openly against Israel,and which finances and supports materially the Hiz and Syria.A conglomeration of motley Arab Sunni monarchist entities led by the Saudis are therefore funding the FSA,in reality a mercenary for ce now being trained by NATO nations like Turkey,with the military planning being worked out by western/US planners,as was done in Libya,so that wiht the downfall of Assad ,Iran will be left high and dry!

Unfortunately,the best laid plans of mice and men are this time being obstructed by the Russo-Sino axis,which sees it losing its influence in the region permanently if Syria goes the way of Libya.The more the west is sucked into the conflict,the same will happen on the other side.As long as the conflict doesn't overflow into Israel,the Israelis must be chuckling at how the West and the Gulfers and the latter-day Ottoman pretenders are actually paying the bills and also getting involved in the fighting! Even if Assad or a successor from the same regime survives to rule Syria,It will be severely weakened, in no state to take on Israel militarily and will thus also affect the capabilities of the Hiz in Lebanon to militarily endanger Israel.

One Q remains for the historians though.Why the West has had to remove secular anti-Al Q Islamic/Arab entities instead of the despots? It goes against the stated grain.Is the pursuit of the agenda of "global democracy" and the removal of so-called "WMDs' therefore only a mere fig-leaf to be used to manipulate nations and provide a cover for regime change? Such a cynical lie will not be swallowed every time by the global powers,as we are now seeing with the "obstructionist" Russians and Chinese.
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Re: West Asia News and Discussions

Post by Johann »

Philip wrote:As long as the conflict doesn't overflow into Israel,the Israelis must be chuckling at how the West and the Gulfers and the latter-day Ottoman pretenders are actually paying the bills and also getting involved in the fighting! Even if Assad or a successor from the same regime survives to rule Syria,It will be severely weakened, in no state to take on Israel militarily and will thus also affect the capabilities of the Hiz in Lebanon to militarily endanger Israel.

This all came about after the emergence of the Hiz and Hamas as the primary opponents to Israel,in the absence of the Israelis keeping their promises to the Palestinians on the peace settlement....

One Q remains for the historians though.Why the West has had to remove secular anti-Al Q Islamic/Arab entities instead of the despots? It goes against the stated grain.Is the pursuit of the agenda of "global democracy" and the removal of so-called "WMDs' therefore only a mere fig-leaf to be used to manipulate nations and provide a cover for regime change? Such a cynical lie will not be swallowed every time by the global powers,as we are now seeing with the "obstructionist" Russians and Chinese.
Philip,

You do realise Hamas is backing the anti-regime forces in Syria?

The Israelis were not at all happy about either the departure of Mubarak or the possibility that Syria will become an unpredictable war zone.

Hezbollah losing support is a potential win, but they don't yet know what the costs will be in terms of militancy next door.
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Re: West Asia News and Discussions

Post by gunjur »

Saudi King invites Iran president for summit in Makkah

So Bandar may still be very well there else chances of this happening is unlikely or iraninans are not behind that blast.
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Re: West Asia News and Discussions

Post by Altair »

Gunjur wrote:Saudi King invites Iran president for summit in Makkah

So Bandar may still be very well there else chances of this happening is unlikely or iraninans are not behind that blast.
Very interesting. Need to watch this closely. There seems to be an invisible hand here.
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Re: West Asia News and Discussions

Post by shyamd »

Don't expect anything .... Ahmadinejad is powerless. This is probably just a PR stunt. There is no secret that both are at war with each other..

They haven't announced the reasons for this yet - more will be known in the coming days.
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Re: West Asia News and Discussions

Post by shyamd »

Bomb hits the 3rd floor of Syrian state TV. Standard coup tactics. They are going for the command and control and making people blind. There is a chance of a coup.

The FSA have surrounded a military base in Aleppo.
-------------------
Syrian PM and more ministers defect. Information division general defects to Jordan
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Re: West Asia News and Discussions

Post by Philip »

Johann if the Israelis want stability in the region,esp. in Syria,then why are they allowing the US to fund and arm the FSA (Obama has signed on the dotted line) ,HQ'd in Turkey to wage a proxy war against the Assad regime,by the so-called FSA from a report by a western corresspondent today also comprise of motley gangs of mercenaries includng some from Pak,the UK,Chechenya and elsewhere.

Surely the best way to stop the conflict in Syria is first an agreement by the UNSC to stop all arms supplies and outside mercenary force induction to the FSA,with a guaranteed cease-fire from the regime,backed by the combined support of the superpowers? Once the fighting stops talks can begin and the lives of civilians will be less at rsk than as of now.By egging on the FSA,the regime has the legitimate right to prevent its overthrow and fight them with any means as the future of the country is at stake and the danger of it spreading increasing by the day,coupled with an east-west militayry faceoff in the future.
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Re: West Asia News and Discussions

Post by shyamd »

They tried all that for some time. Asad doesn't want to vacate his place.
Theo_Fidel

Re: West Asia News and Discussions

Post by Theo_Fidel »

shyamd wrote:Syrian PM and more ministers defect. Information division general defects to Jordan
Shyam is the big one you were anticipating earlier?
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Re: West Asia News and Discussions

Post by Pranav »

shyamd wrote:They tried all that for some time. Asad doesn't want to vacate his place.
... without an election, for the conduct of which reforms are already in place.
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Re: West Asia News and Discussions

Post by shyamd »

^^ Really? Can all opposition parties participate or only those linked to the party? Has he disbanded his secret police?
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Re: West Asia News and Discussions

Post by Pranav »

shyamd wrote:^^ Really? Can all opposition parties participate or only those linked to the party?
Yes, multi-party system. Old news.
Has he disbanded his secret police?
Come on, which country has disbanded its secret police? Much less one facing a mercenary war.
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Re: West Asia News and Discussions

Post by shyamd »

Theo_Fidel wrote:
shyamd wrote:Syrian PM and more ministers defect. Information division general defects to Jordan
Shyam is the big one you were anticipating earlier?
Yup
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Re: West Asia News and Discussions

Post by shyamd »

Pranav, which parties that were non Baathist? And did he change the Syrian constitution ?
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Re: West Asia News and Discussions

Post by Pranav »

shyamd wrote:Pranav, which parties that were non Baathist? And did he change the Syrian constitution ?
From one year ago:

Assad authorizes multi-party system in Syria after decades of Baath rule - http://english.alarabiya.net/articles/2 ... 60776.html
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Re: West Asia News and Discussions

Post by Philip »

The Syrian defections are in great part due to the huge sums being secretly offered to the defectors,plus the offer of a significant role once Assad is toppled.The same method used in Af-Pak.As long as Assad has control and support of the Armed forces,and the support of Russia and China,he will be able to keep the mercenary mob of the FSA at bay.Howeer,his ability to deploy forces to be everywhere all the time is in serious doubt.He has to systematically decimate the opposing forces whenever they squat in the major towns,but this comes at massive cost in destruction of settlements and lives of innocents,whch in the long run will lose him support from ordinary people.A chunk of the country borderng Turkey might very well become an enclave carved out as a "free" territory for the purposes of the west being able to pour in men and materal and raise a flag of convenience.With the US presidential elections drawing nearer,Assad's window of opportunity to use maximum force against the FSA is fast closing.Once a new US administration,Romney or Obama takes charge,it will be able to devote its fullest attention in trying to remove him at any cost.
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Re: West Asia News and Discussions

Post by Pranav »

^^^ As time passes the savage and brutal nature of the FSA/Al Qaeda mercenaries is becoming clear to the population (even the Sunnis) so Assad comparatively has the moral high ground. Whether civilized governance can survive depends to a very large extent on Russia and China.
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Re: West Asia News and Discussions

Post by shyamd »

Pranav wrote: From one year ago:

Assad authorizes multi-party system in Syria after decades of Baath rule - http://english.alarabiya.net/articles/2 ... 60776.html
yeah but at the same time he was still conducting massacres and torture - stabbing students protesting in aleppo. Very democratic of course. If he was so brave, he could have let in foreign journalists and disbanded the secret police - of course every nation needs an intelligence service but not something like the secret police which looks more at political activity
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Re: West Asia News and Discussions

Post by Aditya_V »

Shyamd- foreign journalists who are openly want to take down the regime.

Even US and UK don't allow all and sundry who are reporters into thier country- least of all who are enemical to them.
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Re: West Asia News and Discussions

Post by shyamd »

^^ Last I checked Press TV and Russia Today, both broadcast routinely anti west stuff are freely available on UK TV.

Sure it is understandable that he banned foreign journo's but if he is throwing everything open and free'ing everything up he could have done that and allowed people to protest. But he didn't and people lost faith eventually.

Its not as if Bashar wasn't aware of the abuses - he was too afraid to reign the secret police etc in. Many friends of his told him too.

---------------------------
Bandar is very much alive.
Pranav
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Re: West Asia News and Discussions

Post by Pranav »

shyamd wrote:
Pranav wrote: From one year ago:

Assad authorizes multi-party system in Syria after decades of Baath rule - http://english.alarabiya.net/articles/2 ... 60776.html
yeah but at the same time he was still conducting massacres and torture - stabbing students protesting in aleppo. Very democratic of course.
For one thing the veracity of such reports will have to be looked into. There have been many fabricated anti-Assad reports pushed by western and Gulf media. Also, the foreign-backed insurgency had already started by then, so some response would be expected.
If he was so brave, he could have let in foreign journalists and disbanded the secret police - of course every nation needs an intelligence service but not something like the secret police which looks more at political activity
Syria has been a fairly open country since Bashar took over. No restrictions on travel etc. As for police looking at political activity, that is nothing new in most nations. Read works of Maloy Dhar on Intelligence Bureau, for example.
shyamd
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Re: West Asia News and Discussions

Post by shyamd »

Pranav wrote: For one thing the veracity of such reports will have to be looked into. There have been many fabricated anti-Assad reports pushed by western and Gulf media. Also, the foreign-backed insurgency had already started by then, so some response would be expected.
Sure, but some protests were broadcast live - there are many videos on youtube of people getting gunned/attacked by regime thugs in peaceful protests.

Also people protesting in the west outside the syrian embassy - many received threats/intimidation.
Syria has been a fairly open country since Bashar took over. No restrictions on travel etc. As for police looking at political activity, that is nothing new in most nations. Read works of Maloy Dhar on Intelligence Bureau, for example.
IB doesn't torture ordinary people for their political affiliations - as you can see with the NCTC drama and powers of arrest. Spying on political affiliations is one thing - systematic kidnap/torture because of their political affiliation is another. For example, in the UK - yes they are doing randomly spying on people from certain communities - but they aren't kidnapping & torturing them systematically.

Its a lot more open than his fathers time but the regime secret police still operates. My friend who lived in Damascus (he was studying there) for a year before all this started - said he used to get visits from the secret police and interrogations - like what are you doing here? why are you here etc? Its one thing being asked this at immigration another - getting random knocks on your door at random times.
shyamd
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Re: West Asia News and Discussions

Post by shyamd »

Seriously hurtling towards intervention now...
New intelligence reveals Iranian military nuclear program advancing faster than previously thought
Western diplomat and Israeli officials who asked not to be named say U.S., Britain, France, Germany and Israel share same intelligence information, agree that assessment.
By Barak Ravid | Aug.07, 2012 | 1:37 AM


New intelligence information obtained by Israel and four Western countries indicates that Iran has made greater progress on developing components for its nuclear weapons program than the West had previously realized, according to Western diplomats and Israeli officials who are closely involved in efforts to prevent Iran from building a nuclear bomb.

A Western diplomat who asked not to be named because he was not authorized to discuss intelligence information said the United States, Britain, France, Germany and Israel agree on that assessment.


According to the source, this assessment began to take shape in February, when Iran refused to allow inspectors from the International Atomic Energy Agency to visit the base at Parchin, where it is believed Iran is carrying out part of the research and development of its military nuclear program. Visits of IAEA inspectors in Iran, and especially revelations of information the Iranians had been trying to hide, intensified suspicions that Tehran was developing nuclear weapons at a faster pace than it had previously seemed.

Last month Britain's Daily Telegraph reported that the Iranian Revolutionary Guards has established a new team of 60 nuclear scientists to develop Iran's military nuclear program at the Lavizan base near Tehran. In 2006, IAEA inspectors visited that base, which belongs to the Guards' missile development agency.

The Daily Telegraph based its report on information from the Iranian opposition group Mujahideen al-Khalq. Members of the group told the paper that the work of the Iranian scientists in the "weapons group" is at an advanced facility involved warheads and detonators.


An American think tank called the Institute for Science and International Security released a satellite photo of the Parchin base showing, according to Western intelligence, that Iran is developing nuclear weapons there. Taken on July 25 and released on August 1, the picture shows that the Iranians have completed what the American think tank called "cleanup" of the site where the base was.

According to researchers at the institute, the photos they received show that the Iranians have bulldozed a number of structures at the base and leveled the surrounding land, which the institute's staff suspect was done to erase evidence of nuclear activity at the site.

Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu reportedly said in a closed meeting last week that he was not deterred by the prospect of an inquiry committee investigating a possible Israeli attack on Iran.

Iran's defense minister, General Ahmad Vahidi, told reporters in Tehran that an Israeli attack on Iran "is impossible unless the Zionist entity wants to commit suicide ... Iran is completely prepared to respond to an attack against it."

The Ugandan option

Netanyahu told U.S. Republican presidential candidate Mitt Romney that an Israeli or American military attack on Iran's nuclear facilities was likely to help topple the ayatollah regime, just as the 1976 Entebbe raid led to the defeat of Ugandan dictator Idi Amin, according to a senior Israeli official.

The comment came when Romney asked Netanyahu during their July 29 meeting in Jerusalem whether he thinks an Israeli attack on the nuclear facilities would unite Iranians, ultimately strengthening the regime, the official said.


In explaining why he thinks that would not happen, Netanyahu recounted what he said was Ugandan President Yoweri Museveni's statement to him that the raid ultimately led to Amin's downfall three years later.

"Ugandan President Museveni told me the Entebbe raid was a turning point in the effort to topple Idi Amin," the Israeli official quoted Netanyahu as saying. "He said the operation strengthened Amin's rivals because it revealed how vulnerable his regime was."

Museveni made the comments when Netanyahu visited Uganda in 2005 to dedicate a memorial for his brother Yoni Netanyahu, the commander who was killed while rescuing 100 hostages from pro-Palestinian hijackers at Entebbe airport in Uganda, the official said.

Museveni took part in the war that deposed Amin in 1979.
Pranav
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Re: West Asia News and Discussions

Post by Pranav »

shyamd wrote:
Pranav wrote: For one thing the veracity of such reports will have to be looked into. There have been many fabricated anti-Assad reports pushed by western and Gulf media. Also, the foreign-backed insurgency had already started by then, so some response would be expected.
Sure, but some protests were broadcast live - there are many videos on youtube of people getting gunned/attacked by regime thugs in peaceful protests.

Also people protesting in the west outside the syrian embassy - many received threats/intimidation.
Syria has been a fairly open country since Bashar took over. No restrictions on travel etc. As for police looking at political activity, that is nothing new in most nations. Read works of Maloy Dhar on Intelligence Bureau, for example.
IB doesn't torture ordinary people for their political affiliations - as you can see with the NCTC drama and powers of arrest. Spying on political affiliations is one thing - systematic kidnap/torture because of their political affiliation is another. For example, in the UK - yes they are doing randomly spying on people from certain communities - but they aren't kidnapping & torturing them systematically.

Its a lot more open than his fathers time but the regime secret police still operates. My friend who lived in Damascus (he was studying there) for a year before all this started - said he used to get visits from the secret police and interrogations - like what are you doing here? why are you here etc? Its one thing being asked this at immigration another - getting random knocks on your door at random times.
Live broadcasts can also be staged sometimes ... See for example



Be that as it may, what is on offer to the "rebels" (actually mercenaries) is free and fair elections under international observation. Since the mercenaries are rejecting every reasonable offer one can only hope that the government will be able to do whatever it takes to restore the rule of law.
shyamd
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Re: West Asia News and Discussions

Post by shyamd »

Of course they can be staged but the vast majority of evidence is that there is a genuine protest movement out there and vast majority of syrians participate in the revolution.

Rebels are majority are Syrians and are the people of the land - only a small component are foreign. Again - its too late - he is not going to vacate his position and is directly responsible for massacres and then when the tide has turn against him he wants to offer free and fair elections? If he did that from day 1 as others adviced him to do, then we wouldn't be in the current position, its only when he realised that the tide was turning that he allowed the free elections. He had committed too many killings for people to just sit quiet - it would be natural that people ask for retribution/investigation for the people he killed.
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