Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan (TSP) : 24 July 2012

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 13 Sep 2012 04:37

So EH did say it and is complaining that his private remarks were published and were out of context. Will reduce his standing among WKKs?

He is not deny he had said that. Interesting mindset. He now joins Pagal Sehgal.

Nandu · Post by **Nandu** » 13 Sep 2012 04:40

I had long considerd EH a loon. Didn't know he had any standing among WKKs.

Anujan · Post by **Anujan** » 13 Sep 2012 04:44

EH is famous for such blatherings. He is a dyed in the wool Jihadi paid ISI spokes person who tries very hard to sound reasonable. But occasionally his true colors peek out.

Once he mistook an Indian journo for a Pakistani and told him that "Hindus" do not under power projection, but "Muslims" do. And that is why "Hindus" get cowed when they visit Pakistan and cannot adjust to its powerful image. Another time, he suggested in all seriousness that Mehran base attack was by India to destroy P3C orions. His stance on the Siachen issue is well known. I know of many such juicy tid bits.

The interesting aspect is that he either desires a visa by unkil or wants to embed himself in WKK track II. (Due to personal or professional reasons) so reacts quite promptly and violently when his jihadi kookiness is called out.

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 13 Sep 2012 04:47

So its par for the course vis a vis Joyti Malhotra's article!
His options get reduced if his jihadi colors are revealed.

Rangudu · Post by **Rangudu** » 13 Sep 2012 04:58

EH is a retired TSPA kaptaan. EH's father and two brothers were/are in the service as well. His youngest bro is or was recently in Siachen.

BTW, does anyone remember that EH once wrote a big piece (no pun intended) on how TSPian mards have longer dingdongs than SDRE's?

Also, he once went similarly apeshit when one of his erstwhile buddies called him out on Twitter for his refusal to be candid about TSPA/ISI links to Shia-killing jihadis

Many of the real 'liberals' in TSPA circles openly call him an ISI man.

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 13 Sep 2012 05:19

Wow!!! WKKs better be careful in their run-ins with him.

R, Some miscreant stole your writings. Same ilk?

Hari Seldon · Post by **Hari Seldon** » 13 Sep 2012 05:39

splendid post.

Rangudu wrote:The issue is not abt going to war.

True. If TSP is smart about it, they can get away even with nuking a desi city. Muddying the waters enough and sowing FUD by 3.5's media is sufficient to sufficiently delay a desi second strike response. Perhaps.

What RamaY theorizes is India having better than US covert intel acquisition AND strike capability.

Laughable claim indeed. Heck, SDRE India knows its place and does't have "better than US" covert intel acquisition AND strike capability even within Yindia what to talk of TSP.

If India has such powers then what logical reason exists for it not to have been used to take out 26/11 masterminds until now? After all, if it's covert, then it's deniable, no?

This is becoming like Amartya Sen-ish talking shop where people try to invent convoluted and internally inconsistent reasons for India to bend over and keep taking it while it supposedly has all these super-duper covert capabilities.

Of course, India doesn't have 'em sooper dooper covert capabilities. They can't be bought off the shelf or TOT'ed after all.

If you're a restrained but tough guy and your neighbor rapes your wife, kills your kids and gloats about it, then what use is the toughness?

Maybe I, CRS and a few others are not that sharp or well connected to understand this. So I request anyone who believes what RamaY is saying to explain in plain desi English to us why India chooses not to use all these super duper powers to take out 26/11 chiefs?

Go ahead, enlighten us idiots

Its self-explanatory. Or its Djinn power, perhaps. What to do only.

What gets me wondering is why there hasn't been a 26/11 redux now that TSP knows full well dossier diplomacy is our sternest reaction to such events. Or maybe it has decided to resume the 26/11 style neo-ghouri raids, which is why even reticent MMS was forced to acknowledge the possibility of 'sea-based' attacks. what's the point of MMS warning citizenry anyway, I have to wonder. As if we could do something about it. Hah. Onlee.

BijuShet · Post by **BijuShet** » 13 Sep 2012 06:20

From The News (news article - posting in full). Details on the owner of the garment factory and the fire that caused 290 deaths.
No killed worker had appointment letter

By Qadeer Tanoli - September 12, 2012 - Updated 2340 PKT
From Web Edition

KARACHI: Not a single deceased employee of the burnt factory at Baldia, Ali Enterprises had appointment letter and thus no one of them was registered with Social Security, Employees Old-Age Benefits Institution and other as such institutes, The News has reliably learnt.

The majority of victims of the worst fire eruption case in industrial areas in Pakistan's history were below the age of 35 years. The factory was setup some 12 years ago at the main road of Hub River and officials concerned of Labour Department could not see extreme labour laws' violation over there. No case was ever registered in some court of law by any government department against this factory which they could have made if some labour inspector had paid the visit of the factory.

The News has got sketchy profile of owner of the factory whose name is reported to be Dr Shahid Bhaila who happened to be in his late forties. He is qualified medical doctor but not practicing medicine anymore due to his business activities.

He is one of the major exporters of garments especially trousers in Pakistan to developed countries and he is the member of Karachi Chamber of Commerce and Industries besides having membership of Readymade Garments Association of Pakistan. The person in question has business family background and was influential enough to keep authorities concerned silent over labour issues.

This is learn that he had to complete consignment order before December for Christmas and he was taking hard labour from his workers to complete the order on time so that he should not bear expenses of by air shipment.

This is learnt that he also had obtained some 'fake certificate' from an audit company that everything was okay in his factory to fulfill developed countries demands.

He had hired the services of around 500 workers and did not bother to register them with any social security institute to get rid of workers' rights in any case.

If his workers were registered with the social security institutes then in case of death incident their family might have been compensated with Rs500,000 from Workers Welfare Fund. The EOBI was supposed to give pension to them if they had been registered with it.

According to some reports some pregnant female workers met with deaths due to fire eruption in the factory. These workers were supposed to enjoy maternity leaves of three months if they had been registered with the government departments concerned.

The deputy general secretary of National Trade Union Federation (NTUF), Nasir Manoor while talking with this correspondent demanded that the chief minister and the governor Sindh should give resign.

He said FIR of murder case under section 302 should be registered against the secretary labour, the labour minister and the minister for industries for criminal negligence on their part in this scenario.

He said due to criminal negligence of Labour Department the factories have become death-traps for the workers.

He said the owner of the factory must have fled from the country so far despite having his name in Exit Control List and he would return only when dust is settled.

He said this is the repercussion of third party contract system that there is no available record of the workers and authorities concerned are taking help of DNA to recognize the victims' bodies.

Mansoor said all victims were skilled workers who were hardly earning Rs8000 per salaries. He said there was only single exist of the factory where the Seth had placed his finished and unfinished merchandise thus making impossible for the innocent workers to come out of this death trap.

BijuShet · Post by **BijuShet** » 13 Sep 2012 06:23

From The News (news article - posting in full).
World Bank approves $220m for Punjab

September 12, 2012 - Updated 139 PKT
From Web Edition

KARACHI: World Bank has approved $220 million loan for the province of Punjab, Geo News reported.

World Bank’s Board of Executive Directors approved two credits totaling $220 million, said a handout issued by the WB here.

The $150 million Punjab Cities Governance Improvement Project is aimed at realizing the growth potential of five largest cities of the province through strengthening systems for improved planning, resource management and accountability.

The additional financing of $70 million for Punjab Land Records Management and Information Systems Project is meant for further strengthening and expanding better service delivery of land record management throughout the province.

BijuShet · Post by **BijuShet** » 13 Sep 2012 06:30

From The News (news article - posting in full). This article is tied to the factory fire story.
Neighbourhoods wail the loss

By Sidrah Roghay - September 12, 2012 - Updated 2344 PKT
From Web Edition
KARACHI: As she stands at the site of the destruction, Rafiq-un-Nisa holds up a framed picture of six beautiful women; her sister, nieces and sister-in-law.

All but one of them was inside the factory when it caught fire on Tuesday night. Nisa's nephew, also an employee at the factory, was outside the factory at the time. When he saw the blaze, he rushed inside to try and save his family members. He still hasn't been found.
...
Factory workers from adjoining areas flock to the place. It could have been their bodies being pulled out of the remains, for they work in similar conditions, without emergency exits and fire extinguishers.

"Six buses full of workers from our neighbourhood came to this factory every day, around 300 people. Some survived, some lost a limb or two and others were reduced to ash," said an onlooker hailing from Orangi.

"I work in Noor Garments, a nearby factory, and as a general practice they lock us up inside rooms until our shift comes to an end. That is what happened here too."

Firemen say that they had to break down a locked gate to gain entrance to the factory. The workers had been locked inside, with no means of escape.

A teenage boy stumbles out of the mob; unable to cope with the smell of burning flesh and blood, he vomits on the floor in front of him.

....

pentaiah · Post by **pentaiah** » 13 Sep 2012 07:17

My vote and concur with Rangudu saar ji
Latent, potent potential intrinsic covert capabilities take you only that much in the world of protecting citizens and sovereignty
There are times a fraction of ounce of practical demonstration of the inherent capabilities will save pound of effort and loss of credibility what ever exists.

we missed the bus many times rest all is posturing and time pass mooh palli and batana ok pop corn

CRamS · Post by **CRamS** » 13 Sep 2012 07:19

Hari Seldon wrote:
What gets me wondering is why there hasn't been a 26/11 redux now that TSP knows full well dossier diplomacy is our sternest reaction to such events. Or maybe it has decided to resume the 26/11 style neo-ghouri raids, which is why even reticent MMS was forced to acknowledge the possibility of 'sea-based' attacks. what's the point of MMS warning citizenry anyway, I have to wonder. As if we could do something about it. Hah. Onlee.

The reason is simple. TSP is cashing ts 26/11 check. TSP has always said come to the negotiating table and discuss all issues and we'll stop terror. TSP has always linked talks with terror. MMS has accepted that. Why would TSP shoot itself on the foot by conducting a terror attack and undercut their man MMS who is so valiantly batting for them? I must add its not just MMS but a whole slew of assorted WKKs and RNIs who have embraced this approach to TSP.

CRamS · Post by **CRamS** » 13 Sep 2012 07:22

Nandu wrote:I had long considerd EH a loon. Didn't know he had any standing among WKKs.

Indeed, for those who are praising Jyothi whatever, she calls this terrorist her friend, and her prescription after diagnosing the TSP problem is aman ki aasha. So for someone else who was wondering if Jyothi reads BR, I say perhaps, but she is no BRite and neither has she learnt anything despite lurking here.

Satya_anveshi · Post by **Satya_anveshi** » 13 Sep 2012 08:33

Looks like both Pukis and their master did more than just remember/celebrate 911 and aftermath. Celebrate because unrelated wars were fought therefore gaining due to the incident and we know how pukes milked/milking 911.

It would be a CT at this time to link these two incidents but I will not hold my breath to have a puki link show up in Libyan attack.

pentaiah · Post by **pentaiah** » 13 Sep 2012 09:24

just my thought as well

since 9-11 how many billions was received by TSP for GOAT
How many US service men were killed due to ISI and its cohorts
They really made Khan a jack ass after all ISI trained those hijackers in the first place.

member_20292 · Post by **member_20292** » 13 Sep 2012 09:31

ramana wrote:Rangadu, First things first. Never ever put yourself down. The whole world is there to do that.

Amen.

member_20292 · Post by **member_20292** » 13 Sep 2012 09:36

anjan wrote:
KLNMurthy wrote:Taking out a chief, even if replaceable sends a message that there will be a price to pay, hence deterrent. Some things are worth more than money and risk though both need to be managed.
Did taking out al-Mussawi deter Hezbollah? Heads of organizations are often replaceable people. Especially when the organization has the support of an untouched government. Anyway, then what? Take out the next guy after the next terrorist attack and so on? Each time with proportionally increasing risk to your own assets? And then be locked into a cycle where you've lost the initiative to the opponent? It can't be that hard to find 50 people with decent organizational skills who are willing to die for their beliefs in a dysfunctional country that specializes in producing nutjobs. Perhaps there is a point where the individual is so important that the risk is worth it like maybe with people with technical or other skills which are not easily replaceable.

I don't think deterrence can be achieved short of a disproportionate response. With their nuclear capability and given that they have less to lose than us that kind of response is politically difficult.

Not only that, we as Indians do not have the money to pay for a war. Liquid cash. We dont have it.

See how the Pakis are making peaceful noises once they are beggared down and we rise in wealth?

Simply because our strength and capability to wage war is far greater today than in the 1990's.

Let us all work harder and pay more taxes. Then the GOI can go to war if it chooses to.

Anujan · Post by **Anujan** » 13 Sep 2012 10:14

http://dawn.com/2012/09/12/militancy-ke ... of-school/

Around 600,000 children in Khyber Pakhtunkhwa have missed one or more years of education due to militancy, according to a report on ‘The State of Pakistan’s Children-2011

Chandragupta · Post by **Chandragupta** » 13 Sep 2012 11:42

Nandu wrote:I had long considerd EH a loon. Didn't know he had any standing among WKKs.

EH = ?

ArmenT · Post by **ArmenT** » 13 Sep 2012 12:27

Chandragupta wrote:EH = ?

EH = Ejaz Haider. Check out his letter to the editor on the previous page of this thread.

abhijitm · Post by **abhijitm** » 13 Sep 2012 13:24

mahadevbhu wrote: Let us all work harder and pay more taxes. Then the GOI can go to war if it chooses to.

i am sorry couldnt control

SSridhar · Post by **SSridhar** » 13 Sep 2012 15:17

arun wrote:Holding my nose and suppressing my gag reflex:

Aman Ki Asha: How I started loving Pakistan

I wrote to him about wrong & illogical comparisons. He replies to me quoting humanity etc. Have sent him another mail but no reply so far.

member_20292 · Post by **member_20292** » 13 Sep 2012 15:20

abhijitm wrote:
mahadevbhu wrote: Let us all work harder and pay more taxes. Then the GOI can go to war if it chooses to.

i am sorry couldnt control

its funny, sure. its true too.

SSridhar · Post by **SSridhar** » 13 Sep 2012 15:28

BijuShet wrote:From Tribune
Pakistan urges regional peers to repeal non-tariff barriers
"A lot has to be done to bring down the non-tariff barriers for greater intra-regional trade," says Qamar.

The non-tariff barrier issue has to be seen in the context of MFN status to us. The Pakistani Defence Minister is saying that the region has to go a long way in reducing non-tariff barriers. Just recently, Pakistan has been obliquely linking these barriers with MFN. Ms. Khar also mentioned this in the joint press meet with SM Krishna. I am sure Pakistan is building up an excuse to delay MFN which is due before end of this year. They have already got what they wanted, liberalized visa, banking, investment etc. They know that India can be baited with MFN to throw more concessions at them and that is what they are aiming at.

abhijitm · Post by **abhijitm** » 13 Sep 2012 15:47

Did you invite him on BRF?

SSridhar · Post by **SSridhar** » 13 Sep 2012 15:49

Kandahar hijack suspect arrested

Mehrajuddin alias Javed, a close associate of United Jihad Council (UJC) chief Syed Salahuddin and underworld don Dawood Ibrahim, was arrested during an operation in Kishtwar forest belt, a senior police officer told PTI today.

His name had figured in the IC-814 hijack case as he had provided logistic support for hijacking of the Indian aircraft to Kandahar from Nepal, the officer said.

Rangudu · Post by **Rangudu** » 13 Sep 2012 17:05

ramana wrote:R, Some miscreant stole your writings. Same ilk?

Are you talking about Amir Mir?

CRamS · Post by **CRamS** » 13 Sep 2012 18:26

SSridhar:

I agree with your analysis on TSP perfidy wrt MFN. But question is why does TSP have to go to such lengths? Even if TSP were to overtly declare NO MFN (and I must confess, I am not "chanakyan" and so I am mystified as to why India is begging this abomination for MFN), do you think MMS & Co will stop aman ki tamasha? The number of people who "learn to love TSP" will only grow as TSP insults India even more and gets away with it.

I've also noticed another cowardly manifestation of "how I started to love TSP". I have been seeing any number of present and ex TSP kirket players quoted by Indian media: Imran says this or Qaudir says that or some other terrorist said something else about Tendulkar. When I see those links, I ignore them like plague.

SS, I have a question for you. You have diligently documented the TSP 26/11 court tamasha. I am just still shell shocked that after at least 2 or so years when India was fairly united in doing no business with TSP until 26/11 was addressed, when did that sentiment melt down en mass?

As an aside, Ramana/RamaY, even though I don't buy your claims that India has awesome, let alone any credible offensive capabilities to punish TSP for its perfidy, I am convinced beyond a shadow of doubt that India's defensive capabilities are are strong. Once again I am not relying on any insider info or anything, just the big picture. Having followed TSP's neurotic obsession to undo India, if TSP could, they would have overrun India by now if not for the brave & courageous Indian armed forces defending India. I recall during mid to late 90's when nutty nation would have editorials every day fantasizing about their green crescent flying over downtown Srinagar, and how India's 80,000 insurgencies will engulf India with a little bit of push from TSP. Viewed from that vantage point, India is doing quite well

.

SS, coming back to my question, when did India's 26/11 outrage melt away en mass? I know MMS's SeS surrender etc. But that alone cannot explain why so many Indian elites including media, even section of so called "Hindu nationalist" BJP are partaking in this aman ki tamasha. Is there a time line highlighting the descent from India's united outrage post 26/11 to the shameful surrender we are witnessing now? Is there a rational explanation for that rather than the usual explanations that come to mind: lack of capability, cowardice, WKKism, need to grow economy at 10% etc? I mean these factors notwithstanding, I mean 26/11 was a Lakshamn Rekha TSP crossed which should never be forgotten until TSP pays some price. What am I missing?

Gus · Post by **Gus** » 13 Sep 2012 18:57

^you are missing that very few people care about terrorism (and all that it has caused to India). BRF is populated by people who care about it. Since my RTI, I have probably interacted with 1000 plus people here. Very few are aware of what's happening. People simply are overwhelmed with daily grind of life.

SBajwa · Post by **SBajwa** » 13 Sep 2012 20:18

by AbhijitM
Did you invite him on BRF?

I just wrote following email to Mr. Kapoor!

----------------
Dear Mr. Kapoor,

Namaskar!

Please join us at Bharat-Rakshak.com to debate on how we can also start loving Pakistanis.

thanks
Sandeep Singh Bajwa

-----------

so I urge my fellow BRites to not to overwhelm him ! let him speak! may be we can all start loving the naPakis!

abhijitm · Post by **abhijitm** » 13 Sep 2012 20:37

CRamS wrote:when did India's 26/11 outrage melt away en mass? I know MMS's SeS surrender etc. But that alone cannot explain why so many Indian elites including media, even section of so called "Hindu nationalist" BJP are partaking in this aman ki tamasha.

For all the classes you mentioned here 26/11 didn't change a bit. They were pro-pakistani before 26/11 and even after business as usual for them.

I have also noticed a false sense of enlightenment within certain people in limelight. I think they have made themselves believe that by taking position against a mass opinion they distinguish themselves. Like when a mob yell 'yesss' and someone shouts 'nooo' you can actually here it and draws your attention. Same thing is in journalism. Tell people something they don't agree and whooop you are an expert because you could then be able to plant a suspense in other's mind that you probably know something which common man is unaware of! And there is no danger of you being outrightly declared to be an idiot.

Any common man who has eyes and ears open can give a step by step reasoning of why pakistan should be punished. How many pro-pakistani Indians can give such reasoning for bhaichara with pakis? They hide behind the burkha of 'moral', 'humanity', 'peace', words that have little or no value in geopolitics.

There is no medicine for these viruses. They in fact thrive on criticism.

Aditya_V · Post by **Aditya_V** » 13 Sep 2012 20:38

Gus wrote:^you are missing that very few people care about terrorism (and all that it has caused to India). BRF is populated by people who care about it. Since my RTI, I have probably interacted with 1000 plus people here. Very few are aware of what's happening. People simply are overwhelmed with daily grind of life.

I think the Media, Education system and CInema which white washes these crimes also has a huge part to play.

Singers and Actors get unusual amount of space with People thinking about AR Rehaman Amitabh Bhackan, Rajni etc. They cannot name 1 good scientist or anything positive about History or any crime by TSP- like say 7/11 bombings in Mumbai.

For most Indians either travelling to US or taking part in a Film or TV show is the epitome of estacy.

nakul · Post by **nakul** » 13 Sep 2012 21:19

Film stars & TV stars are sheep in fields other than their own. They simple regurgitate whatever the tabloids print. The tabloids print this regurgitation & we get a vicious cycle. Moreover, image is everything for the page 3 types. You can't appear to be too different from the crowd. Peer pressure that is usually seen among teenagers is common among adults in such circles. They need to look hip, cool, & mature at the same time.

RSoami · Post by **RSoami** » 13 Sep 2012 21:44

http://www.business-standard.com/genera ... tan/55900/

Ten meet their 72 in Baluchistan

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 13 Sep 2012 22:05

Ruminating (what to do am a cow worshipper!) on EH's mutterings to Jyoti Malhotra, I recalled that when India presented pictures of TSP army turcks transporting the jihadis for the invasion of J&K in 1948 at the UN, the Pak UN representative claimed that India might have changed the number plates on the trucks to implicate TSP and took the pictures!
So the meme of blaming India when caught with their perfidy, runs long and true in TSP jaguar veins.

Prem · Post by **Prem** » 13 Sep 2012 23:14

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NCvSm7QMagA

Watch this to know the real nature of EH=Excremento Humungous. But Ramana,
There more Pig Slaughterer and Eater in india than Cow worshippers and Paki do know this.

Anujan · Post by **Anujan** » 13 Sep 2012 23:18

Aslam Beg was ex DG ISI. Post OBL getting his 72 he wrote an article saying that Osama's clone was transported from Bagram and killed in abbottabad. Sometimes I wonder if pakis really believe all this or merely say it to infuriate others. I have some nice pisko post about this too.

RamaY · Post by **RamaY** » 13 Sep 2012 23:40

^ It is built into the system. The prophet himself had revelations that had no relationship with the reality but would somehow put the blame on the others. These guys are just being greens. It is part of green consciousness. You cannot pull it out with education, money, equal-rights etc., The only way is to pull the green out of the individual.

nakul · Post by **nakul** » 13 Sep 2012 23:45

^^^

There is a need to keep them stupid. If you worship a God & believe that killing his creations will give you entry to a land of honey with 72 virgins at your service, you are plain retarded. If a sensible man believes it, he will start believing whatever is told to him. This makes them easy to exploit. In Islam, its all about 'yakeen' (Trust)

Prem · Post by **Prem** » 14 Sep 2012 00:58

From DZinnah to Zardari , Paki Foreign Policy can be summed up in the green droppings, Pinnochio nose and Piggy with thick Lisptick.