Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan - Oct 4 2012

shiv · Post by **shiv** » 20 Oct 2012 19:11

Rajagopal wrote:The below post is the second one in series of "Don’t blame the Taliban" by Mr. Kunwar Kuldune shahid. The writer is Editor Business/City (Karachi), Pakistan Today.
He either has iron balls (or a death wish) to write the below article clearly pinpointing the source of all problems in Pakistan.
The original article was carried first by Pakistan-Today, which has since developed cold feet and pulled it off their website. You will see both the columns in the UK Telegraph.

Part 1: http://my.telegraph.co.uk/kkshahid/kksh ... e-taliban/

Part 2: http://my.telegraph.co.uk/kkshahid/kksh ... aliban-ii/

I like how he directly questions the violent laws in Islam in part 2.

But If Pakistanis follow a diluted version of Islam what is the difference between Pakistan and filthy Hindu kafirs?

RamaY · Post by **RamaY** » 20 Oct 2012 19:36

Rajagopal wrote:The below post is the second one in series of "Don’t blame the Taliban" by Mr. Kunwar Kuldune shahid. The writer is Editor Business/City (Karachi), Pakistan Today.
He either has iron balls (or a death wish) to write the below article clearly pinpointing the source of all problems in Pakistan.
The original article was carried first by Pakistan-Today, which has since developed cold feet and pulled it off their website. You will see both the columns in the UK Telegraph.

Part 1: http://my.telegraph.co.uk/kkshahid/kksh ... e-taliban/

Part 2: http://my.telegraph.co.uk/kkshahid/kksh ... aliban-ii/

I like how he directly questions the violent laws in Islam in part 2.

I think the author is a Mossad agent masquerading as a Muslim writer. How can a Muslim get such a space on Telegraph otherwise?

Loook how the faith-fools responded when a Kufr questioned the religion of peace in a yindoo news blog
http://blogs.timesofindia.indiatimes.co ... le-muslims

If one compares the comments section between these two writings one can deduce that the telegraph article is a YYY conspiracy.

Islam is a religion of peace. Per Islam even killing one human being is same as killing all humanity (it is a different matter if we kill Kufrs, because they are not humans until they revert to Islam. Munafiqs too are fair game because they are fallen). If anyone questions the peaceful nature of Islam, they will be fair targets for beheading.

Jeehard

arun · Post by **arun** » 20 Oct 2012 19:58

X Posted from the Oppression of Minorities in Pakistan thread.

Oppression of Non Mohammaddens, who are relegated to the lowly status of Dhimmi’s by Mohammadden religious law ie: Shariah Law, by the majority Mohammaddens of the Islamic Republic of Pakistan continues unabated. Place of worship used by followers of Christism attacked in Karachi.

This attack apparently is the sixth attack on a place of worship used by followers of Christism in the city of Karachi this year:

Religious intolerance: Second church attacked in Karachi in 10 days

johneeG · Post by **johneeG** » 20 Oct 2012 20:14

RamaY wrote:
Rajagopal wrote:The below post is the second one in series of "Don’t blame the Taliban" by Mr. Kunwar Kuldune shahid. The writer is Editor Business/City (Karachi), Pakistan Today.
He either has iron balls (or a death wish) to write the below article clearly pinpointing the source of all problems in Pakistan.
The original article was carried first by Pakistan-Today, which has since developed cold feet and pulled it off their website. You will see both the columns in the UK Telegraph.

Part 1: http://my.telegraph.co.uk/kkshahid/kksh ... e-taliban/

Part 2: http://my.telegraph.co.uk/kkshahid/kksh ... aliban-ii/

I like how he directly questions the violent laws in Islam in part 2.
I think the author is a Mossad agent masquerading as a Muslim writer. How can a Muslim get such a space on Telegraph otherwise?

Loook how the faith-fools responded when a Kufr questioned the religion of peace in a yindoo news blog
http://blogs.timesofindia.indiatimes.co ... le-muslims

If one compares the comments section between these two writings one can deduce that the telegraph article is a YYY conspiracy.

Islam is a religion of peace. Per Islam even killing one human being is same as killing all humanity (it is a different matter if we kill Kufrs, because they are not humans until they revert to Islam. Munafiqs too are fair game because they are fallen). If anyone questions the peaceful nature of Islam, they will be fair targets for beheading.

Jeehard

Yep, Munafiqs are worst than Kafirs. It is another matter that every sect or school thinks others are Munafiqs. So, what do you do?

One uncomplicated solution is to do jeeHARD against everyone but yourself. Safe and sound solution.

arun · Post by **arun** » 20 Oct 2012 20:19

X Posted from the Oppression of Minorities in Pakistan thread.

In the Islamic Republic of Pakistan, a country claimed to have been created as a safe haven for the Mohammaddens of the Indian Sub-Continent two separate incidents of Green on Green Intra Mohammadden sectarian violence, with members of the minority Ahmadi / Ahmadiyya sect of Mohammaddenism being victimised.

The first incident of the “more pure” eliminating the “less pure” in Punjab Province:

Local Ahmadi community leader gunned down

The second incident of the “more pure” eliminating the “less pure” in Sindh Province. This particular attack was apparently the fifth such attack in the last couple of months in Karachi targeting Ahmadi Mohammaddens:

Targeted attack leaves one Ahmadi dead, three hurt

Raja Bose · Post by **Raja Bose** » 20 Oct 2012 20:28

lakshmikanth wrote: Can I add two more:
8. Secretly threaten to buy more of Iran's oil
9. Secretly threaten to give noocolar stuff to Iran.

I would say other than 7 (and 1) everything else is feasible

I doubt the good doctor literally meant going to war against massa right now - he is probably in piss-ko mode anyways.

But then being a good good boy in foreign policy gets us nowhere. Twist their tattes and people sit up and take notice. Be nice and quiet and at best they will ignore you and at worst they will offer you up for sacrifice in a heartbeat. See even for a small thing like going hard ball on the briturds regarding the visa issue immediately led them to downhill ski. Somehow I doubt that ridiculous Israeli ad was an honest mistake, portraying India as a helpless wimmens being saved and protected by strong Israeli mard:

Virendra · Post by **Virendra** » 20 Oct 2012 21:34

Deer dies in Karachi zoo due to excessive mating. Bestiality not ruled out.
http://dawn.com/2012/03/19/mystery-surr ... hs-at-zoo/
Excerpt:
A case of bestiality?
He said the case must not be hushed up as it could be an incident of bestiality, which, he added, could be easily verified by samples taken during a post-mortem examination.

It needs to be mentioned here that the zoo is faced with an acute shortage of trained staff while there has been no accountability of officials involved in mismanagement and incidents of negligence in the past.

arun · Post by **arun** » 20 Oct 2012 21:38

X Posted from the Oppression of Minorities in Pakistan thread.

In the Islamic Republic of Pakistan a country claimed to have been created as a haven for the Mohammaddens of the Indian Sub-Continent even the Mohammadden Sabbath of Friday does nothing to damp down Green on Green Intra-Mohammadden religious inspired sectarian violence .

Lawyer belonging to the Shia / Shiite sect of Mohammaddenism, which is the minority sect in the overwhelmingly Mohammadden majority Islamic Republic of Pakistan, is executed by motorcycle borne co-religionists likely angered by his defending the leader of the Shia sect based Sipah-i-Mohammad:

LAHORE, Oct 19: In what appeared to be a target killing, a senior lawyer was shot dead near the Lahore High Court by unknown assailants on Friday morning.

Advocate Shakir Ali Rizvi had left his private chamber at Jain Mandar Chowk along with his driver, Sohail Masih, and nephew Syed Naeem Abbas Rizvi by his car. When the car reached near the Lahore High Court, two armed motorcyclists opened fire on it. ……………..

Family of the deceased said he had been receiving life threats for his role for the Shia community members and pursuing their cases.

Late Riziv was also defending Ghulam Raza Naqvi, a leader of banned outfit Sipah-i-Muhammad, in different cases. Presently, Naqvi is behind the bars. Advocate Rizvi was survived by his wife, nine daughters and a son . ……………………

Dawn

RamaY · Post by **RamaY** » 20 Oct 2012 21:51

^ repeat after me.

Shias are not real Muslims. Ahmedias are not real Muslims.

If he joined the Lawyers procession in support of Qadri, and took a oath under Quran to Represent Qadri, he should be happy to be wa-jub-ul-cutletted for being a Munafiq.

Islam is a religion of peace. Per Islam even killing one human being is same as killing all humanity (it is a different matter if we kill Kufrs, because they are not humans until they revert to Islam. Munafiqs too are fair game because they are fallen). If anyone questions the peaceful nature of Islam, they will be fair targets for beheading.

CRamS · Post by **CRamS** » 20 Oct 2012 22:07

Dipanker wrote: Nobody is debating it because the information content is zero, this thing is going on and known for such a long time.

Show me a single instance, just one, where an Indian policy maker, a respected Indian columnist, just one, who has pointed out that Indian containment is what drives US mollycoddling of TSP. Show me one instance. Even on BR, someone as trusted and respected as R-man says it is nonsense when I say so.

Thus, if a respected Indian were to suddenly say that, I would say that in going from zero to such a narrative, it would encapsulate a huge information content, imagine the number of bits that would be needed to encode that. And I can guarantee you, if someone like say Jassu bhai or AtalJi or even some closet nationalist from Sonia's party were to say that, it would be carried in NYT and WP. Thats not zero information for you.

I know Indian economy is in the tank despite a few elite going gaga over the opening of Starbucks, but one positive side effect of India's travails today is that even the most deluded nut case is no longer singing this "impending superpower" BS. Thus, instead of pretending to be in the same league as China, my feeling is that its worth using whatever minuscule leverage India has over US and its western lackeys and persuade them to choose between India and TSP, or at least recognize the terrorist abomination that TSP is, including against India, and treat it as such.

nakul · Post by **nakul** » 20 Oct 2012 22:11

^^^

Thats like saying the ABM shield in Europe is for Iran. LOL. Every one and his dog knows that a (militarily) strong Pakistan is a threat to India. If a war does not break out, it won't make a difference. But if it did, the weapons used agaisnt India will be from you know whom. That doesn't mean Pakistan's sole use is pinning India. It's other roles are important too. One of the most important is a rentire state. US likes to have a poodle in every corner of the globe. Pakistan does the job for our region.

CRamS · Post by **CRamS** » 20 Oct 2012 22:40

But it cannot and should not be at our expense. And that too when terrorism is the main tool that TSP uses. Nothing wrong with drumbeating this day in and day out. Not the super power, and China BS. Lets master Algebra first and the move on to Calculus.

nakul · Post by **nakul** » 20 Oct 2012 22:46

Please look back at the history of Pakistan waging war against India. Most of the time US had Pakistan's back so to speak. In 1999, the threat of US intervention prevented crossing of Loc. In 1971, it stopped invasion of West Pakistan. These toys give Pakistan ample time to defend itself in war till India is brought to the negotiating table. So, yes this is at our expense.

shyamd · Post by **shyamd** » 20 Oct 2012 22:53

@CustosDivini: #Pakistan: Time to develop biological weapons http://t.co/4E98rPhU #WMD #news

member_23007 · Post by **member_23007** » 20 Oct 2012 23:16

CRamS wrote:
Show me a single instance, just one, where an Indian policy maker, a respected Indian columnist, just one, who has pointed out that Indian containment is what drives US mollycoddling of TSP. Show me one instance. Even on BR, someone as trusted and respected as R-man says it is nonsense when I say so.

Similarly, would you please furnish the instance of a US policy maker, a respected US opinion maker, just one, who has pointed out that Indian containment is what drives US mollycoddling of TSP?

Not being a regular on this forum, I am not in step with your thinking. Are you accusing the Indian policy makers of not being aware of the alleged US scheme against India or willful ignorance? Do you believe it's improbable that they could be aware of the alleged grand conspiracy but choose to quietly combat it? You've deduced the US scheme from the favours she grants to Pakistan - not from an explicit articulation of their policy expressing the long term goal of Indian containment.

Despite this ambiguity, you are not willing to grant that US actions could be the pure result of an avowed pursuit of her own national interest. This pursuit would often come into conflict with Indian interest but this does not necessarily means the existence of a larger conspiracy to limit Indian influence.

Vayutuvan · Post by **Vayutuvan** » 21 Oct 2012 00:18

CRamS ji, one needs to apply Occam's razor. What is more probable? India is a collateral damage or US has a grand plan to contain India? It is a just a hangover from the cold war era. I get a feeling that you are a man in a hurry. As for me, I plan to wait patiently and do what I can quietly to end the alliance. I can understand your frustration that people like you and me are not getting support from India. You have to wait for a long time for such a support if Indian public (and by proxy the Indian leadership) thinks that the Pakistani problem is way down on the list of things to be taken care of. I suspect that is the case. In my day-to-day life am quite removed from Indian aspirations and compulsions and vice-versa. As an Indian American, I want better relations between India and US and no relations between Pakistan and US. Irrespective of the support from India, I will work towards that. It will have to happen eventually given the state of Pakistan and the trajectory.

sanjaykumar · Post by **sanjaykumar** » 21 Oct 2012 00:23

Pardon me, but most of the world considers Pakistanis to be biological weapons.

Mahendra · Post by **Mahendra** » 21 Oct 2012 00:27

^True, they ejaculate poison semen from front end and release poison gas from the back end, from the top end comes out islamo-jihadic vomitus

CRamS · Post by **CRamS** » 21 Oct 2012 00:59

Ashish S wrote: Similarly, would you please furnish the instance of a US policy maker, a respected US opinion maker, just one, who has pointed out that Indian containment is what drives US mollycoddling of TSP?

Plenty. Even now, US state dept, white house say that "regional stability" is a key factor in mollycoddling TSP. This is a euphemism for equal equal. "South Asia" think tanks are even more explicit in formulating the so called "balance of power" between India & TSP. But by far the most explicit enunciation of this doctrine is from former sec of state, Madeline NotBright. In her book, she explicitly calls for India TSP equal equal saying saying they must be balanced down to diplomatic protocol, i.e, she says no US high-level diplomat should visit Delhi without going to TSP. In all this, what stinks is the boxing of India with TSP, no matter what a terrorist abomination TSP is. Just think how disgusting it is when US appeases TSP, the perpetrator of all of Afghanistan's travails, by drawing an equivalence between TSP's sponsorship of terror with India's benign role in Afghanistan.

Not being a regular on this forum, I am not in step with your thinking.

Please come more often and learn.

Are you accusing the Indian policy makers of not being aware of the alleged US scheme against India or willful ignorance? they

Many are aware, but true to our lack of b@lls trait, they are too chicken to call it it out. Heck, they can't even summon the guts to call TSP a terrorist state.

Despite this ambiguity, you are not willing to grant that US actions could be the pure result of an avowed pursuit of her own national interest. This pursuit would often come into conflict with Indian interest but this does not necessarily means the existence of a larger conspiracy to limit Indian influence.

There is no conspiracy, its out in the open, except that India is not willing to challenge that. Sure, US pursues its interest, and part of that is mollycoddling TSP at India's expense. Please note, I am not saying this is some kind of a beauty contest or lover's jilt and India ought to compete with TSP for US's love. I am talking about terror. If TSP is a normal country, India would have no right to question US's aid to TSP. But US aid to TSP is used by TSP to attack India. Thats where the problem is. Why is US so obsessed with India's relationship with Iran? Because that relationship impinges on US interests. Similarly US relationship with TSP abomination affects India.

Karan M · Post by **Karan M** » 21 Oct 2012 01:35

Shiv wrote:Karanji the US record is mixed.

They contributed to a decisive victory in WW2
They lost the Cold war in Korea.
They lost Vietnam, Period
They sat and licked their wounds for decades until they managed to extract revenge for Korea and Vietnam in Afghanistan, using Pakistani help. Pakistanis know their own contribution and fully understand the US's willpower and capability.

Iran, NoKo and Pakistan are all states that will push the US to the limit and the US is unable to show ts much advertised ruthlessness. The US has a bigger reputation than its actual heft and my argument on this thread has been that the US's reputation is maintained by a bunch of people who claim that the US can do a lot of things. But the US will not actually do any of that. It has the capability but not the will. So US ability to take on Pakistan can be dismissed with a derisive laugh. Pakistanis are doing that. I would safely bet that the US's power and ruthlessness is all fluff against Pakistan. The US will always wimp out and pretend that Pakistani aggravation is not enough to declare war. But war between Pakistan and the US is in India's interest.

Shivji, if you look at it from another point of view, you are making my point for me. The US is willing to wage wars, unwinnable wars to boot, which cost the lives of tens of thousands of their soldiers, cost them billions & all over some confused dogma or commercial interests, take your pick. In the process, they will devastate the country where that war is fought, leaving it a complete mess for decades, and then leave as soon as possible once it becomes clear that the war is no longer popular domestically. When they can do so, when they have time, they will rope in as many members of the west-NATO cartel - which means most of their media-PR apparatus is also on board, to sell the peace and democracy kool-aid. That is what they did before going into Iraq. All said and done, what all this tells me is that the US establishment IS ruthless and completely brutal in its application of real politik and power. So much so, that they don't care about the lives of their own soldiers - wasting them en masse - let alone the lives of others. But they have become addicted to the use of military force as a means to solve problems. Just take a look at how quickly they bounce back. Libya - run by the US, but sold as an European operation.

So what prevents them from "glassing" Pakistan if they do so militarily? In my opinion, its that their own PR of being well intentioned etc etc can only go so far. To take out Pakistan, they will have to do what Bomber Harris did to Germany (brazenly) and they did to Japan in WW2. Pakistani military apparatus is too well entrenched amongst quasi civilian areas, and will also threaten immediate retaliation against India & Israel at first sign of trouble. So the only option is to take the hammer to the fly, and not do some easy gradual calibration as in first Gulf War. And the problems they had there with even basic Scuds (detecting these mobile units) were legion.

Firebombing, mass civilian casualties, genocide in all but the name. Todays world, with digicams everywhere does not allow for that. So they have all the firepower in the world, but are unable to use it. So, they are stuck in stupid COIN as versus the glorious full contact "manly American" war they learnt, and get visibly dissatisfied when the casualty counter starts ticking, the war becomes unpopular, and they want to disengage.

But all this presupposes that the US will go to war with Pakistan. As I said, the easy approach is to just withdraw from Pakistan-Afghanistan and keep bribing the Pakistanis to make sure the bad Taliban do not attack them with jets. Rest is all OK. Even the occasional American attacked here & there is ok, as long as the attacks don't get to the mainland, because, then that may cause administrations to lose elections.

My point is that the US is not all powerful that cannot be countered. That is why I believe the US's influence on Pakistan, however much it makes things worse for us, can be countered by India. The free aid will not last for ever. Its akin to steroids giving temporary strength - the Pakistanis being stupid as sh** did not spend all that aid on making a sustainable economy that could buy them weapons throughout. They just went and bought stuff, whose operational costs will also need to be paid for, and gives leverage to the US. Tomorrow, they will go broke again. The Chinese will step in, but not so much. The big negative for us was that the US money for conventional stuff, allowed Pakistan to build up its nuclear forces. Again, with some effort, India can counter that too. Once they leave Afghanistan, I doubt the US will continue to give freebies at the rate they are giving, but they will give them even so.

What I am saying however, is that it is this entirely fickle, ruthless behaviour demonstrated by the US - where it ignores the deaths of its soldiers easily (Vietnam defeat comes to mind, China in Korean war comes to mind) to move onto whatever it needs next for its empire building (lines of trade, raw resources) will ensure that they simply don't get or ever agree to Indian concerns regarding Pakistan. Yes, we should complain, keep protesting, but they will not care.

So only thing we have at the end of the day, is to make our own strategy regarding Pakistan, automatically slot the US as one who may oppose significant sections of that view, and then decide how to get our own way nonetheless.

Karan M · Post by **Karan M** » 21 Oct 2012 01:36

Shiv wrote:Karanji the US record is mixed.

They contributed to a decisive victory in WW2
They lost the Cold war in Korea.
They lost Vietnam, Period
They sat and licked their wounds for decades until they managed to extract revenge for Korea and Vietnam in Afghanistan, using Pakistani help. Pakistanis know their own contribution and fully understand the US's willpower and capability.

Iran, NoKo and Pakistan are all states that will push the US to the limit and the US is unable to show ts much advertised ruthlessness. The US has a bigger reputation than its actual heft and my argument on this thread has been that the US's reputation is maintained by a bunch of people who claim that the US can do a lot of things. But the US will not actually do any of that. It has the capability but not the will. So US ability to take on Pakistan can be dismissed with a derisive laugh. Pakistanis are doing that. I would safely bet that the US's power and ruthlessness is all fluff against Pakistan. The US will always wimp out and pretend that Pakistani aggravation is not enough to declare war. But war between Pakistan and the US is in India's interest.

Shivji, if you look at it from another point of view, you are making my point for me. The US is willing to wage wars, unwinnable wars to boot, which cost the lives of tens of thousands of their soldiers, cost them billions & all over some confused dogma or commercial interests, take your pick. In the process, they will devastate the country where that war is fought, leaving it a complete mess for decades, and then leave as soon as possible once it becomes clear that the war is no longer popular domestically. When they can do so, when they have time, they will rope in as many members of the west-NATO cartel - which means most of their media-PR apparatus is also on board, to sell the peace and democracy kool-aid. That is what they did before going into Iraq. All said and done, what all this tells me is that the US establishment IS ruthless and completely brutal in its application of real politik and power. So much so, that they don't care about the lives of their own soldiers - wasting them en masse - let alone the lives of others. But they have become addicted to the use of military force as a means to solve problems. Just take a look at how quickly they bounce back. Libya - run by the US, but sold as an European operation.

So what prevents them from "glassing" Pakistan if they do so militarily? In my opinion, its that their own PR of being well intentioned etc etc can only go so far. To take out Pakistan, they will have to do what Bomber Harris did to Germany (brazenly) and they did to Japan in WW2. Pakistani military apparatus is too well entrenched amongst quasi civilian areas, and will also threaten immediate retaliation against India & Israel at first sign of trouble. So the only option is to take the hammer to the fly, and not do some easy gradual calibration as in first Gulf War. And the problems they had there with even basic Scuds (detecting these mobile units) were legion.

Firebombing, mass civilian casualties, genocide in all but the name. Todays world, with digicams everywhere does not allow for that. So they have all the firepower in the world, but are unable to use it. So, they are stuck in stupid COIN as versus the glorious full contact "manly American" war they learnt, and get visibly dissatisfied when the casualty counter starts ticking, the war becomes unpopular, and they want to disengage.

But all this presupposes that the US will go to war with Pakistan. As I said, the easy approach is to just withdraw from Pakistan-Afghanistan and keep bribing the Pakistanis to make sure the bad Taliban do not attack them with jets. Rest is all OK. Even the occasional American attacked here & there is ok, as long as the attacks don't get to the mainland, because, then that may cause administrations to lose elections.

My point is that the US is not all powerful that cannot be countered. That is why I believe the US's influence on Pakistan, however much it makes things worse for us, can be countered by India. The free aid will not last for ever. Its akin to steroids giving temporary strength - the Pakistanis being stupid as sh** did not spend all that aid on making a sustainable economy that could buy them weapons throughout. They just went and bought stuff, whose operational costs will also need to be paid for, and gives leverage to the US. Tomorrow, they will go broke again. The Chinese will step in, but not so much. The big negative for us was that the US money for conventional stuff, allowed Pakistan to build up its nuclear forces. Again, with some effort, India can counter that too. Once they leave Afghanistan, I doubt the US will continue to give freebies at the rate they are giving, but they will give them even so.

What I am saying however, is that it is this entirely fickle, ruthless behaviour demonstrated by the US - where it ignores the deaths of its soldiers easily (Vietnam defeat comes to mind, China in Korean war comes to mind) to move onto whatever it needs next for its empire building (lines of trade, raw resources) will ensure that they simply don't get or ever agree to Indian concerns regarding Pakistan. Yes, we should complain, keep protesting, but they will not care.

So only thing we have at the end of the day, is to make our own strategy regarding Pakistan, automatically slot the US as one who may oppose significant sections of that view, and then decide how to get our own way nonetheless. Meanwhile do as China did, keep working with them, and acquire as much high end tech from them as possible, so that we understand it, build our own & get back to our status as a global economic power, which in turn is another point of leverage on the US. But ringfencing our strategic sectors and having a clear vision (working with US is means to the end) is essential. Otherwise, we just end up doing what they say or run the risk of always being confused and facing their pressures.

Dipanker · Post by **Dipanker** » 21 Oct 2012 02:06

CRamS wrote:
Dipanker wrote: Nobody is debating it because the information content is zero, this thing is going on and known for such a long time.
Show me a single instance, just one, where an Indian policy maker, a respected Indian columnist, just one, who has pointed out that Indian containment is what drives US mollycoddling of TSP. Show me one instance. Even on BR, someone as trusted and respected as R-man says it is nonsense when I say so.

Thus, if a respected Indian were to suddenly say that, I would say that in going from zero to such a narrative, it would encapsulate a huge information content, imagine the number of bits that would be needed to encode that. And I can guarantee you, if someone like say Jassu bhai or AtalJi or even some closet nationalist from Sonia's party were to say that, it would be carried in NYT and WP. Thats not zero information for you.

I know Indian economy is in the tank despite a few elite going gaga over the opening of Starbucks, but one positive side effect of India's travails today is that even the most deluded nut case is no longer singing this "impending superpower" BS. Thus, instead of pretending to be in the same league as China, my feeling is that its worth using whatever minuscule leverage India has over US and its western lackeys and persuade them to choose between India and TSP, or at least recognize the terrorist abomination that TSP is, including against India, and treat it as such.

If you believe what you write it means you are just not familiar with history of last 60 years or so. Let me just remind you of 1971, US not only sent the 7th fleet to Bay of Bengal to intimidate India but also asked China to attack India.

That's why I said the whole thing goes a long way back and we all know about it, thus the information content is zero in what you are saying. It is being said for oh may be last 45 -50 years.

Anyway can we all get back to the purpose of this thread, i.e. Paki bashing! Please refrain from derailing this thread again and again. There are a whole bunch of threads on BR where you can post, but let stick to Paki bashing in this thread.

pentaiah · Post by **pentaiah** » 21 Oct 2012 02:13

US can't wage future wars like the way they are doing now, period. It does not have the economic muscle like it used to. Also they have taught the Islamists how to wage low cost terrorist warfare to defeat their erst while adversaries namely SU. This complete proliferation of low cost warfare techniques backed up regional proxies like TSP KSA is now slowly coming home to roost.
So what does unkil do ? now he is again changing the paradigm of wars to low cost automation and remote controling from faraway secure lands. The deployment of large scale Drone acharya this is the new RIMA. now he is again breaking new grounds by throwing down the conventional concepts of declaring war approved by legislators and institutional approvals, so in a way he is again setting precedents for violating sovereign rights of nations who are non combatants but merely collateral to unkils goals. this started in Vietnam war by indiscriminate booming of of Laos and Combodia....now into Yamen, Libya slowly into Syria aka Syriana..
Because of its technological lead this RIMA via technology will hold the fort for a while till the well trained Islamists and others catch up.

It's just matter of time that the Islamist militants will improvise read the Chivers blog how the combatants improvise... For that matter just recall 9/11

Nothing remains permanent its momentary lead in the long run ....

Dipanker · Post by **Dipanker** » 21 Oct 2012 04:00

A more appropriate title would be "Pakistan behind everybody in girl education":

Pakistan behind Nepal, India in girls’ education

ISLAMABAD, Oct 18: Released in the wake of an armed attack on teenage education activist Malala Yousufzai, the Education for All Global Monitoring Report shows that Pakistan’s progress in getting poor girls into schools is less than half that of India’s and Nepal’s and a quarter of Bangladesh’s.

The report released by Unesco here on Thursday reveals that though Pakistan has the second largest number of out-of-school girls in the world, yet it has reduced the amount it spends on education to less than 2.3 per cent of GNP. Only nine low- and lower-middle-income countries spend a smaller share on education. The barriers to education faced by Pakistani girls are stark in comparison with the rest of South Asia.

These findings were issued by the World Inequalities Database of Education, a website of the EFA Global Monitoring Report team, showing how factors such as gender, poverty, location and ethnicity affect a child’s chances at education.

A two-thirds of the out-of-school children in Pakistan are girls; only 16 countries have a worse rate.

Pakistan has the second highest number of out-of-school children in the world – five million.

The country’s progress in reducing the number of poor girls being denied a chance of education has been too slow. The percentage of poorest girls out of school has fallen from 78 per cent to 62 per cent, a much smaller drop than in India (from 66 per cent to 30 per cent), Nepal (52 per cent to 22 per cent) and Bangladesh (91 per cent to 44 per cent).

EFA Global Monitoring Report Director Pauline Rose said that “since 1999 when governments around the world committed to getting all children into school, countries like Pakistan have managed to consistently fail to address” the issue.

“We must put girls first if we’re to crack this challenge. Two-thirds of girls in the poorest areas in Pakistan are still not getting the chance of an education – a rate that is not appropriate for 21st century.”

According to the report, although the number of Pakistani children denied education is surpassed only by Nigeria, the country has reduced spending on education from 2.6 per cent of GNP in 1999 to 2.3 per cent today.

“The hope is that the tragic violence against Malala will bring shame on a country which has ignored the rights of its girls to an education for too long. Pakistan spends less on education than it spends to subsidise just three of its loss-making public sector enterprises – the national airline (and the) steel and electricity companies. Pakistan also spends less on education than it does on the military. Its priorities have to change,” the UN official said.

The Global Monitoring Report 2012 shows over a third of young Pakistanis – 12 million – do not have the skills they need for work. This is the second highest number of unskilled young people in the world.

Dipanker · Post by **Dipanker** » 21 Oct 2012 04:05

Enraged mobs set back cinemas in Pakistan

KARACHI: For as long as Pakistan has existed, film lovers flocked to the Nishat cinema, sinking into seats in its plush auditorium to watch Hollywood imports, Bollywood hits and homegrown productions.

All that came to an end last month when an enraged mob set fire to the building, trashed furniture and looted equipment – on the ‘Yaum-i-Ishq-i-Rasool‘ day that Pakistan observed to protest again an anti-Islam film.

Eight other cinemas were destroyed - in the conservative, northwestern city of Peshawar and the more cosmopolitan financial capital Karachi – dealing a huge blow to Pakistan’s already troubled film industry.

The arson and vandalism has cost scores of jobs and leaves even fewer sources of secular entertainment.

Pakistan doesn't need cinema halls, what Pakistan needs is more Islam.

Anujan · Post by **Anujan** » 21 Oct 2012 04:43

Bollywood and Pakistan provide quite an interesting Pisko insight:

Pakistani movie theaters were doing something even more funny. There is some random ban on importing and running Bollywood movies, so they used to purchase rights to Bollywood movies from UAE (I am sure from some D-company front) and call those movies "Made in Dubai". They called the movie "Raaz 3" as "Made in Britain"!! This kind of denial "I will watch bollywood movies but not those made in India" gives quite a unique pisko insight and satisfies yours truly to no end

The reason why Pakistani movies looks like they were fished out of pakistan is quite simple. As Miss Bakhtiar {A Paki who is Adnan Sami's ex wife an somehow still resides in India! Must be a "Mumbaikar" as Adnan Sami likes to call himself} expounds

(Pakistani) girls and boys were more good-looking than Indian actors but bad lighting and makeup made them look ordinary on screen {Translation: Haseena Atimbum, is tall fair wheat eating with tight Musharraf. Rajnikanth small dark rice eating. He has better lights onlee.}

http://dawn.com/2012/09/16/we-need-to-c ... wn-heroes/

Cosmo_R · Post by **Cosmo_R** » 21 Oct 2012 04:59

Anujan wrote:Bollywood and Pakistan provide quite an interesting Pisko insight:

Pakistani movie theaters were doing something even more funny. There is some random ban on importing and running Bollywood movies, so they used to purchase rights to Bollywood movies from UAE (I am sure from some D-company front) and call those movies "Made in Dubai". They called the movie "Raaz 3" as "Made in Britain"!! This kind of denial "I will watch bollywood movies but not those made in India" gives quite a unique pisko insight and satisfies yours truly to no end

The reason why Pakistani movies looks like they were fished out of pakistan is quite simple. As Miss Bakhtiar {A Paki who is Adnan Sami's ex wife an somehow still resides in India! Must be a "Mumbaikar" as Adnan Sami likes to call himself} expounds
(Pakistani) girls and boys were more good-looking than Indian actors but bad lighting and makeup made them look ordinary on screen {Translation: Haseena Atimbum, is tall fair wheat eating with tight Musharraf. Rajnikanth small dark rice eating. He has better lights onlee.}
http://dawn.com/2012/09/16/we-need-to-c ... wn-heroes/

And it is a tribute to the powers that be in India who encourage the samis. Pakistan and pakis are not the enemy it is our 'elected' reps like Salman Khunshid who does an Azamgarh on that brave but still doofus Kejriwal

Anujan · Post by **Anujan** » 21 Oct 2012 05:38

Since I have the undeniable upper hand in interaction with Pakis, here is a completely unscientific claim.

Powers that be in Pakistan (and their spawn) freely travel to India, form business ties and invest in businesses/own property ityadi. I know a motorma who is a "Book Critic" based out of Karachi and Banglaore (guess her nationality). Another motorma who "resides in Mumbai" is planning to open a chain of "upscale coffee shops and bakeries".

This type of "resident Paki" is highest among moneyed elite and those in arts and literature. Journos on the other hand (apart from traveling on junkets) seem to have a tough time. Aaam Abduls also seem to have a tough time but that might be due to lack of money.

In a perverse way "Increasing people to people contact" seems to be the right policy to correct the imbalance (doest affect the top 1% of abduls in Pakistan anyway, the sliver who funds terrorism in India, why not extend the benefit to all abduls?)

CRamS · Post by **CRamS** » 21 Oct 2012 08:44

CosmoJi,

what does doing a Azamgarh mean? The Uber "secularist" you alluded to threatened Kejriwal. With people like him as our "leaders" do we need TSP as enemies?

shiv · Post by **shiv** » 21 Oct 2012 08:52

CRamS wrote:CosmoJi,

what does doing a Azamgarh mean? The Uber "secularist" you alluded to threatened Kejriwal. With people like him as our "leaders" do we need TSP as enemies?

TSP is not our enemy. They are our brothers. We will soon have a common currency according to one Crapistan minister, but hey I thought the currency was already common - printed in the Islamic Republic of Shitistan and used in India.

You must not forget that we have a common cause with our Pakistani brothers and sistahs.

1. We don't want the US to supply arms to the Pakistan army and our Pakistani brothers too do not want to use those arms to fight the upholders of Islam, the Taliban. We both hate the use of US arms and do not want armies that fight our Islamic brothers
2. Both nations have poverty and illiteracy
3. Both nations share water, WKKs and liberals

Prem · Post by **Prem** » 21 Oct 2012 08:57

CRamS wrote:CosmoJi,
what does doing a Azamgarh mean? The Uber "secularist" you alluded to threatened Kejriwal. With people like him as our "leaders" do we need TSP as enemies?

Check the reputation of Aazzamgarh. The area has monopoly in supplying qualified labor to Majority of India's criminal enterprises. Its a Minnie Moe Pakistan. Almost all of Leftist Islamist Suckular gangs in USA are run by the rotton eggs laid in Aazamgarh.

shiv · Post by **shiv** » 21 Oct 2012 08:59

Meanwhile some utter lies about my blood bahens and ~~bhancho~~ er brothers
http://www.deccanherald.com/content/286 ... ce-jk.html
Pak Army, ISI coerce J&K militants to fight Nato troops

Zulfikar Majid, Sopore (Kashmir), Oct 20, 2012, DHNS:

4,000 Kashmiri men are stranded in PoK: Intelligence

The Pakistan Army and the Inter Services Intelligence (ISI) are coercing Kashmiri militants based in Pakistan-occupied-Kashmir (POK) to fight alongside the Taliban against Nato troops in tribal areas of Pakistan and Afghanistan.

The revelations were made by dozens of militants who returned to Kashmir via Nepal and other routes during de-briefing by the police and Indian intelligence agencies, sources said.

“More than 150 Kashmiri militants have been sent to Waziristan and other tribal areas to fight alongside the Taliban against Nato troops. Kashmiri militants are being handled by Yousuf Baloch and Bakht Zaman – two Al Badr commanders – in Waziristan,” a senior intelligence officer here told Deccan Herald.

Recently a hardcore militant of Hizb-ul-Mujahideen, who surrendered before the police, revealed that he opted to return after he was forced to go to Waziristan.

“The militant told his chief that he will go to Kashmir instead of Waziristan as he feared death there. On arriving, he surrendered and revealed that hundreds of militants who had crossed to PoK in early 90’s want to return,” the officer revealed.

Intelligence sources said there are about 3,000 to 4,000 Kashmiri militants stranded in and around Muzaffarabad, capital of PoK. In August, a Kashmiri militant commander Ahsan Aziz was one of several terrorists killed in a US drone strike in the Shawal Valley in Pakistan’s Taliban-controlled North Waziristan.

“After the killing of Aziz, most of the Kashmiri militants based in PoK are hesitant to go to Waziristan and other tribal areas to fight against NATO troops,” sources said and added that most of them belong to north Kashmir.

A senior police official posted in north Kashmir said that atleast 50 militants hailing from Sopore and Baramulla towns have returned from PoK in the last six months.
“The reason for their return are diminishing support from the Pakistan government, realisation that the ‘Kashmir jihad’ is going nowhere and a promise of amnesty by the government of India,” he added.

A former militant from this apple rich town, who returned back from PoK recently, said, “I was ordered to go to Waziristan. I thought it is better to die in Kashmir than going to the lawless tribal areas of Pakistan and fight against US drones.”

Asked why he chose to come back after staying in PoK for 20 years, he said, “The jihad is over. We were misled by Pakistan and now we have realised that it is better to live and die on your own land and around your own people than in virtual exile where we might be forced to beg for a living.”

shiv · Post by **shiv** » 21 Oct 2012 10:03

I sincerely believe that we need to look upon Pakistan as ~~bhanch~~ younger brothers. We share so much in common that we need to share more rather than live with animosity.

For example I am saddened by the way the US is paying corrupt generals in The Pakistan army and PAF to fight the Taliban. The Taliban are our brothers from NWFP. The Taliban are just good Muslims. They may be misguided, but that does not mean they should be killed. I agree with Imran Khan that the US should get out of the region. It is a shame the way the Pakistani army takes bribes from the US to attack the Taliban.

Suppiah · Post by **Suppiah** » 21 Oct 2012 11:06

Taliban are guided by the book and by that only. Hence it is blasphemy to call them misguided. It is the rest that are unable to read clearly what the Sharia states.

The whole problem of the subcontinent can be traced to the treacherous Hindus stopping the payment of jizya to the momeen ever since British arrived on the scene. The practice of jizya has been praised by such eminent intellectual historians like Romila Thapar and others as the best form of protection for dhimmies.

India should immediately restart such payments and as the purest, Islam-est of the Muslims, the Taliban should be paid this directly on monthly basis so that they can take on the semi-green Pakistan army and the totally non-green PPP and others.

chetak · Post by **chetak** » 21 Oct 2012 11:22

What a capital idea!!!

They can play an eager greece to our reluctant germany.

and get us to pay for all their jehadi enterprises.

Pak leader moots common currency for India, Pakistan

The time has come for Pakistan and India to think of introducing a common currency for countering the pressure of the US dollar, British pound and Euro and to boost bilateral trade, he said.

Suppiah · Post by **Suppiah** » 21 Oct 2012 11:32

We should tell them ISI is already working towards making Indian Rupee their currency by printing it by millions..

Raja Bose · Post by **Raja Bose** » 21 Oct 2012 11:44

shiv wrote:
TSP is not our enemy. They are our brothers. We will soon have a common currency according to one Crapistan minister, but hey I thought the currency was already common - printed in the Islamic Republic of Shitistan and used in India.

You must not forget that we have a common cause with our Pakistani brothers and sistahs.

1. We don't want the US to supply arms to the Pakistan army and our Pakistani brothers too do not want to use those arms to fight the upholders of Islam, the Taliban. We both hate the use of US arms and do not want armies that fight our Islamic brothers
2. Both nations have poverty and illiteracy
3. Both nations share water, WKKs and liberals

4. Both nations have extremists. As a wise man once said, there are extremists on both sides - Pakistani extremists are in Karachi and Pakistani extremists are in Mumbai.

Narad · Post by **Narad** » 21 Oct 2012 11:47

Usual demonstration of paki IEDology and Cycle-ogy in Shitistan.

IED blast kills three, injures six

HANGU / JAMRUD: Three people were killed and another six were injured when an improvised explosive device (IED) planted by a roadside in Zeridar area of Lower Orakzai Agency exploded on Friday.
: Express tribune

Cycle bomb, attack kills 4 FC men

QUETTA - Three Frontier Corps (FC) men were killed and 10 others wounded in a bomb attack in Quetta, claimed by the banned Baloch Liberation Army (BLA), on the outskirts of Quetta on Friday. Another FC?soldier was killed in an attack in Dera Bugti.
: nation

venkat_r · Post by **venkat_r** » 21 Oct 2012 16:17

shiv wrote: You have answered your question yourself

Why do I have taqleef? Read your own post minus all the fluff I have removed. I have taqleef because too many Indians, including you (in your post above) act as if you are being realistic and have no taqleef from the US arming Pakistan and take a stand that appears like patriotism towards the USA. Your "understanding and realism" of the US position is totally indistinguishable from US-rakshakism, although you have to make a long post to try and cover that up and deny it in exactly the same way that the US has always denied that its aid to Pakistan is inimical to India.

If your attitude as an Indian, and that of the US are one and the same, why do you want me to suck it up and imagine even for a minute that you are not a mouthpiece of the US. Your words sound exactly like that to me. And your repeated defence of the US couched in the incredible excuse that you are real and I am delusional only confirm to me what you are merely denying to yourself.

Only had a doubt before, now have to admire this delusion!! Yeah!! you are purer than the 'Other' Indians and what we need is more purity, hmmm sounds interesting?

If you had cared to read the 'fluff' that you conviniently ignored ..... Well I say again that you are not the only person who has issues with USA arming PA. But you seem to have developed a special takleef against that and also against any Indian who does not hate it as much as you do.

If you do not want to make an attempt to understand the others position, how can you make right judgements? By conviniently name calling? You have to understand where the US is coming from to understand what it is trying to do. Weather you like it or not USA, has a tiny bit influence in the world and a tiny bit more influencial than India. Well USA (Yeah Nato) is the only entity that is actively engaged in dealing with the Taliban (yeah yeah, through proxies, but also have their troups on the ground). others have neither the will nor the resources to deal with that. Is it that difficult to understand that USA will do what needs to be done to accomplish that? One does not have to be US to understand that?
Your argument that USA's support should not be given is good but deluded, but I have to call it "Frog in the well" and "Face in the sand with your butt sticking out", but to you it is all fluff!! Your position is no better than the average Abdul's from Pakistan, who questions why USA has given nuclear weapons to India and not to Pakistan and develops a bile over it.

shiv · Post by **shiv** » 21 Oct 2012 16:40

venkat_r wrote: You have to understand where the US is coming from to understand what it is trying to do. Weather you like it or not USA, has a tiny bit influence in the world and a tiny bit more influencial than India. Well USA (Yeah Nato) is the only entity that is actively engaged in dealing with the Taliban (yeah yeah, through proxies, but also have their troups on the ground). others have neither the will nor the resources to deal with that. Is it that difficult to understand that USA will do what needs to be done to accomplish that? One does not have to be US to understand that?

Your argument that USA's support should not be given is good but deluded, but I have to call it "Frog in the well" and "Face in the sand with your butt sticking out", but to you it is all fluff!! Your position is no better than the average Abdul's from Pakistan, who questions why USA has given nuclear weapons to India and not to Pakistan and develops a bile over it.

Sir, the US is much more powerful than India and can do a lot of things. But why are you begging me to understand the US's position? Because it is more powerful? You are once again imploring me to understand the US position when I have clearly stated that I have no intention of doing that. Are you unable to understand that yourself? Why do you repeatedly demand understanding and respect for the USA from me? You seem to feel personally insulted that I don't slobber over the US as you clearly do. To me that is a clear indicator of where you are coming from. And shows exactly which buttons I can push to get you worked up. You are entitled to your opinion. You don't need my permission. And I will hold my opinion.