vic wrote:I think indigenous guns will fail underwater exo-atmospheric plasma firing tests and Army will order first batch of 100 guns subject to successful completion of these tests.
Prasad-ji, Welcome back after hiatus?k prasad wrote:There are so many projects and contracts that my tiny head is spinning. Can some guru here list out all our artillery plans and contracts please, specifically:
a) Our present arty inventory - bore/cal, make, year of acquisition + numbers
b) Which contracts have been called for - type, numbers, bore/cal, make/contenders, status, planned induction year
c) Which guns are presently in development indigenously - type, maker, bore/cal, status, etc
Thanks!
So, Pinaka 2 is in progress, but its not 90/120KM (numbers I've seen thrown about). Its 60 KM, which is still pretty good!Sundaresh said the DRDO was developing the Mark II version of Pinaka, the multi-barrel rocket launcher that fires the Pinaka rockets. While the rocket Pinaka-I has a 10 km to 38 km range, Pinaka-II will have a range of 60 km. It will go for user-trials by the end of next year.
That is the confirmation I personally was waiting for.It will go for user-trials by the end of next year.
IIRC this "Pinaka-II" is not a completely new system but just improvements in the existing rocket design which resulted in the range increase. 90-120 km in the domain of heavy rockets like the Smerch and is probably too much to expect from a lighter system like the Pinaka. Anyway I think it is pointless trying to develop both Prahaar and a Smerch equivalent.Prem Kumar wrote:A tidbit from this Chindu Frontline article:
Powered by young scientists
So, Pinaka 2 is in progress, but its not 90/120KM (numbers I've seen thrown about). Its 60 KM, which is still pretty good!Sundaresh said the DRDO was developing the Mark II version of Pinaka, the multi-barrel rocket launcher that fires the Pinaka rockets. While the rocket Pinaka-I has a 10 km to 38 km range, Pinaka-II will have a range of 60 km. It will go for user-trials by the end of next year.
See, that's my point.Singha wrote:I think army is facing funding crunch in ordering sufficient nos of kit, incl equipping the new mountain formations adequately.
So the Pinaka range extending from 40 km to 60 km sounds right in the same ballpark. But they also probably made changes to other internal components as well.FLIGHT PERFORMANCE RESULTS
With all the required data now established for the missile the flight performance characteristics are evaluated (Figure-7-8). It can be seen that the missile flies to altitude of about 200 km during its flight for a payload of 1000 Kg and can hit a target to a range of around 850 Km. The Mach number during re-entry is around seven and the overall flight time is under nine minutes. Note that it is in fact possible to lower the mass of the payload to receive an extension in range of the missile. A tabulation of such options from the analysis above is presented (Table-4). It is also possible that when the maraging steel structures of the missile are replaced with composite materials, it will allow for up to 40% reduction in structure mass of the missile. This will correspondingly have a dramatic effect on the range of the missile. The improved range and trajectory for a composite designed missile is presented in Figure-8 for a 1000 Kg payload. It is seen that the 850 km range missile can effectively be increased to a range of around 1250 Km as a result of this use. Combined with reduced payload masses, the effective range of the missile can be further improved to around 1500 Km with light warheads.
SANGAREDDY(AP): Indian armed forces will use in 3 months an indigenous version of the 155mm calibre Bofors guns "which are more advanced than Bofors", All India Ordnance Factories Board's (OFB) Director General and Chairman Sudhir Kumar Beri said.
Speaking to reporters at the ordnance factory at Yeddumailaram in Medak district today afternoon, he claimed it is "the biggest ever achievement of Indian ordnance factories to have manufactured an indigenous 155 mm calibre gun for the country's defence needs". Generally, it takes 60 months to develop and manufacture such guns but Indian ordnance factories did it in merely 16 months, he claimed.
"Earlier, we manufactured only 104 mm calibre guns in India and 155 mm calibre guns were imported from foreign companies like Bofors. But now, we manufacture in it India," he said, adding the indigenous 155mm calibre guns have been successfully tested.
Around 65 percent of the technology used in these guns is Indian and 35 percent foreign. In three months, the foreign component will be reduced to 15 percent, he said.
The manufacturing capacity of 2000 Pinaka missiles per annum will be increased to 5000 missiles per annum, he said.
He said "we have moved proposals to the central government to take over three HCL units at Hyderabad, Naini (near Allahabad) and Ramnarayanpur. The proposals are moving at a very fast pace and a decision is expected next month".
He said these three units will be taken over with all its 2200 employees and 300 acres of land at Hyderabad, 54 acres of land at Naini and 900 acres of land at Ramnarayanpur, along with infrastructural facilities. Some changes will be made and machinery will be installed as per requirement, he said.
The Pinaka quote is very interesting, and probably more hopeful than realistic. Read the latest CAG report here - jump to Section 8.2 on page 80.putnanja wrote:Ordnance factory introduces indigenous version of 155mm gun
The manufacturing capacity of 2000 Pinaka missiles per annum will be increased to 5000 missiles per annum, he said.
He said "we have moved proposals to the central government to take over three HCL units at Hyderabad, Naini (near Allahabad) and Ramnarayanpur. The proposals are moving at a very fast pace and a decision is expected next month".
He said these three units will be taken over with all its 2200 employees and 300 acres of land at Hyderabad, 54 acres of land at Naini and 900 acres of land at Ramnarayanpur, along with infrastructural facilities. Some changes will be made and machinery will be installed as per requirement, he said.
Against the Army’s indent for supply of 4752 rockets during the period 2007-
12, OF Chanda had supplied only 1561 rockets till March 2011, that too
without proof clearance. During proof firing of the rockets in December 2008,
an accident occurred. Analysis of the reasons for the accident led to
declaration of 407 rockets as unserviceable due to quality problems of the
propellant, and net loss of rockets valuing ` 44.51 crore and propellant valuing
` 4.25 crore. Repeated failure and stoppage of production of Pinaka rocket for
a certain period led to overall delay in operationalisation of the Army units as
per induction plan. The delay in delivery of the rockets at the desired rate of
supply had also affected the training of troops and the war wastage reserve
could not be maintained.
No 'ji' please.ravi_g wrote:srin ji, OF Ambajhari got the go ahead for Pinaka rockets. This bit of news was outed when Pinaka production was around 1000 rockets. If the official claims are for 2000 per annum today, I believe that implies progress though a typical Indian one of stop-go kind.
OF Chanda also being in the picture could imply that OF Ambajhari is facing problems in expanding capacity specific to Pinaka and other OFs have been roped in.
Also read along about the Quality control problems - makes a depressing reading. That being the case, making 5000 rockets per year would probably be a few years down the line.As per the scope of the project, OF Ambajhari was required to manufacture
various rocket components/sub-assemblies and issue the empty hardware of
the rocket to OF Chanda. OF Kanpur was tasked to manufacture stabilizer
assembly for its issue to OF Ambajhari, while OF Medak was assigned
manufacture and issue of pod assembly to OF Chanda. Other designated sister
factories were also required to supply components to facilitate the manufacture
and issue of the rockets.
NAGPUR: A foreign vendor haggling over prices has hit the production of Pinaka rockets, an important weapon system of the artillery. The rockets are made in the ordnance factories including that in Ambajhari and are also suitable for mountain warfare.
Its warheads are filled with tungsten balls to enhance lethality and can be fired up to a range of 40 kms. However, supply of processed tungsten, which comes from France, has been held up as the international prices of the metal have shot from around $35 a kg to close to $50 in recent times. The supplier now wants higher rates and ordnance factory is not willing to shell out the extra amount. This has affected supply of tungsten hampering the production of rockets, said a source closely involved with the affairs. The production has slowed down, said a source in the factory. The army has ordered over 1,500 rockets. However, the current output is almost half of the required quantity. This is almost 30% less than last year's tally in same period, the source said.
Responding to TOI query, a senior officer of the Indian Ordnance Factory Service (IOFS) cadre admitted the stalemate over tungsten prices. "Such problems are routine in course of production and we will overcome it soon," he added. The government is scouting for new vendors but a decision has not been taken yet, added another source.
Earlier, the chairman of Ordnance Factory Board (OFB) had called for self-sufficiency in processing of tungsten. He added that at present its non-availability had not led to a shortfall in production of Pinaka rockets but dependence on foreign vendors was a matter being addressed. Tungsten is key material in making of warheads. Warheads are filled with thousands of tungsten balls which disperse when the rocket hits the target.
This is pre-fragmented high explosive type warhead usually used in the rocket. The tungsten balls are supposed to have a capacity of creating damage in an area of over 10,000 square metres. Another warhead that throws out burning fragments has also been developed.
Tungsten is a preferred due to its hardness. It is processed and received in powdered form and then made into balls at the ordnance factory. It is also used as an armour piercing material in tank shells. Pinaka rockets have been designed by Defence Research and Development Organization (DRDO). After over a decade of being taken for development, the OFB got an order for bulk production in 2007.
) salvos + 1 reserve salvo. add to it .. usual 10% dud rockets... so adequate buffer is needed too....vivek_ahuja wrote:Just to give an idea here:
There must be about three (?) regiments of the Pinaka system within the IA at this point with plans for one (?) per year raising. (Rohitvats et. al., please correct the numbers here if I am out of date or simply wrong)
So lets assume we have 4 regiments at this point.
Each as 12 launchers.
Each Launcher has 12 tubes for a single salvo.
This means that for a single salvo fire from each of the launchers in the 4 regiments, we need about 576 rockets.
That's just one salvo. Assume that we need each regiment to be able to fire at least (and being outrageously conservative given the needs for modern combat) nine (
Then you need 5760 rockets.
Then you need to add a new regiment each year (if we are not at our sanctioned limit already).
So doing 1000/2000 rockets a year is not going to cut it IMVHO.
srin wrote: The Pinaka quote is very interesting, and probably more hopeful than realistic. Read the latest CAG report here - jump to Section 8.2 on page 80.
An excerpt from the closing summary ...Against the Army’s indent for supply of 4752 rockets during the period 2007-
12, OF Chanda had supplied only 1561 rockets till March 2011, that too
without proof clearance. During proof firing of the rockets in December 2008,
an accident occurred. Analysis of the reasons for the accident led to
declaration of 407 rockets as unserviceable due to quality problems of the
propellant, and net loss of rockets valuing ` 44.51 crore and propellant valuing
` 4.25 crore. Repeated failure and stoppage of production of Pinaka rocket for
a certain period led to overall delay in operationalisation of the Army units as
per induction plan. The delay in delivery of the rockets at the desired rate of
supply had also affected the training of troops and the war wastage reserve
could not be maintained.
Note that the guy is talking about increasing capacity, no mention of the actual production rate.putnanja wrote:Ordnance factory introduces indigenous version of 155mm gun
The manufacturing capacity of 2000 Pinaka missiles per annum will be increased to 5000 missiles per annum, he said.
This is good news - the Govt can't blacklist DRDOputnanja wrote:Ordnance factory introduces indigenous version of 155mm gun
SANGAREDDY(AP): Indian armed forces will use in 3 months an indigenous version of the 155mm calibre Bofors guns "which are more advanced than Bofors", All India Ordnance Factories Board's (OFB) Director General and Chairman Sudhir Kumar Beri said.
Speaking to reporters at the ordnance factory at Yeddumailaram in Medak district today afternoon, he claimed it is "the biggest ever achievement of Indian ordnance factories to have manufactured an indigenous 155 mm calibre gun for the country's defence needs". Generally, it takes 60 months to develop and manufacture such guns but Indian ordnance factories did it in merely 16 months, he claimed.
"Earlier, we manufactured only 104 mm calibre guns in India and 155 mm calibre guns were imported from foreign companies like Bofors. But now, we manufacture in it India," he said, adding the indigenous 155mm calibre guns have been successfully tested.
Around 65 percent of the technology used in these guns is Indian and 35 percent foreign. In three months, the foreign component will be reduced to 15 percent, he said.
Suddenly - it seems that everybody and their mother-in-law is developing "indigenous" howitzers.varunkumar wrote:DRDO in dialogue with major Indian firms to develop howitzers
Yearly output can be calculated from above link by Pritiwiraj ji.The army has ordered over 1,500 rockets. However, the current output is almost half of the required quantity. This is almost 30% less than last year's tally in same period, the source said.
Ideally, we would like to have Artillery-FARPs located near the combat zone pre-stocked with ready-to-fire rounds that can be used to supply a surge in MBRL units during times of war. Otherwise, its also a case of resupplying these units that becomes an issue.ravi_g wrote:Also anothe calculus for war time consumption can be derived from the size of the oppenent that we are likely to face. Paki &/or Cheen being x times of Eyeraq which at one time needed around 11000 mbrl rockets to get invaded seriously.
The stocks for India needs to be around 25000 minimum for Grads and another 10000 for Pinakas-1 and Pinaka-2. But then I hope IA comes up with a bigger number.