Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

sum · Post by **sum** » 20 Jan 2013 09:38

^^ Might actually turn out to be boon for the country since most now know aout what RG is mage of and how capable he is!

If a wild card like Priyanka etc was thrown in, then might have been a real victory for a certain INC led UPA-3

Arjun · Post by **Arjun** » 20 Jan 2013 11:57

Indian media hails Gandhi's promotion

Hmm, wonder what this says about the IQ of Indian mainstream media - to be 'hailing' the ascension of a Dynastic Duffer !

Anand K and Vina: If you are reading this, & as the voice of 'secular and progressives' (Dynasty version) on this forum, would you be available for me to test out a personal hypothesis on the relationship between IQ, values and political beliefs in India ? Other 'secular and progressive' voices can also apply, if interested.

Manish_Sharma · Post by **Manish_Sharma** » 20 Jan 2013 13:54

sum wrote:^^ Might actually turn out to be boon for the country since most now know aout what RG is mage of and how capable he is!

If a wild card like Priyanka etc was thrown in, then might have been a real victory for a certain INC led UPA-3

Priyanka and both her kids failed miserably in UP elections, in fact she even failed bareilly part of UP elections, this is another thing that her slave media didn't highlight it at any time. While Modi's every action is under micro-scope. Even his 115 seats and 3rd term is called to be a defeat. Imagine how much halla media had raised if he were campaigning and the state was lost. I hope they make priyanka now the President and create for sonia the post of cogress-raj-mata. So this hope of congis is also finished quickly.

Manish_Sharma · Post by **Manish_Sharma** » 20 Jan 2013 14:00

Arjun wrote:Indian media hails Gandhi's promotion

Hmm, wonder what this says about the IQ of Indian mainstream media - to be 'hailing' the ascension of a Dynastic Duffer !

Anand K and Vina: If you are reading this, & as the voice of 'secular and progressives' (Dynasty version) on this forum, would you be available for me to test out a personal hypothesis on the relationship between IQ, values and political beliefs in India ? Other 'secular and progressive' voices can also apply, if interested.

Arjun ji don't you know? Only Modi or any challenger of die-nasty is to be under the microscope , every action of theirs sneezing, scratching the forhead is to be interpreted as a shortcoming, while die-nasty is above such analysis

SSridhar · Post by **SSridhar** » 20 Jan 2013 17:49

The Princeling and his Party chamchas think he has given another 'Tryst with Destiny' speech today.

Apart from the pathetic hollowness of his speech, he referred only to his grandmother, father and mother. Didn't the great INC have any other leader of substance in its 100 year existence ? What a family show.

member_20317 · Post by **member_20317** » 20 Jan 2013 17:58

Indian Express - Sushma Swaraj rules herself out but BJP chief race remains open.

So the deal was Modi and RSS take the two positions available. Modi takes political leadership. RSS limits itself to the role it best fulfils.

Advani ji is out of the fight. The vet did great while it lasted. Time moves on Advani ji. Time for you take an emeritus position.

shyamd · Post by **shyamd** » 20 Jan 2013 18:10

Gus wrote:NM has been cultivating ties with TN politicos from many years back. I remember he was Thuglak's (a political weekly) chief guest at its annual meet, many years ago. Cho Ramasamy, a dealmaker of sorts (he was involved in the Moopanar and Rajini combo to bring down JJ, and a Vijaykant and JJ combo to bring down DMK in past election) - always gives positive coverage to NM in his paper. If JJ wins handsomely in TN, these will go to BJP.

Not true - She is doing the right thing and talking with both UPA & NDA - but she does have a soft corner for NDA.

member_20317 · Post by **member_20317** » 20 Jan 2013 18:15

Rahul - "Why people are angry. Because they are alienated from the system,. Their voices are trampled upon. All our systems — justice, education, political, administration — are designed to keep people with knowledge out. Mediocrity dominates discussions,"

csaurabh · Post by **csaurabh** » 20 Jan 2013 19:03

SSridhar wrote:The Princeling and his Party chamchas think he has given another 'Tryst with Destiny' speech today.

Apart from the pathetic hollowness of his speech, he referred only to his grandmother, father and mother. Didn't the great INC have any other leader of substance in its 100 year existence ? What a family show.

You and I may understand that Yuvraj is an idiot, but a lot of people genuinely appreciated his speech. Not because they are stupid, but because it actually makes sense.

>>
Rahul said only a handful of people control the political space and power is highly centralised. "We don't empower people at the bottom. People feel they are outside of the system. That happens because we don't respect knowledge. We respect only positions. If you don't have position, you mean nothing.

"Why people are angry. Because they are alienated from the system,. Their voices are trampled upon. All our systems — justice, education, political, administration — are designed to keep people with knowledge out. Mediocrity dominates discussions," he said in his 40-minute speech that was repeatedly cheered by party leaders.
>>

All of this is true. The surprising fact for people is that he has been able to say these things. Till now his utterings have been the following..

-70% of Panjab youths are on drugs
-Politics is in your shirt, it's in your pant
-People from UP go begging in Mahrashtra

So for RG to say something that actually makes sense, is so different that people think that, hey look, RG was not doing anything before, maybe he'll do something now.

Of course, we know better. The congress is playing 'good cop', 'bad cop'.

The weird thing is that the person who told me he appreciated RG's speech and hoped that he would do great things also said that he would support BJP if NM was the PM candidate and thought that the home minister was an idiot for saying Samjauta blast caused by BJP/RSS.

People are complex. Don't extrapolate BRF or facebook to the whole India. Talk to real people.

SaiK · Post by **SaiK** » 20 Jan 2013 19:29

You are making sense to the drug world out there indeed! may be that is the reason, yuvraj ki ma was pointing at listening to middle class and the raped class.

SSridhar · Post by **SSridhar** » 20 Jan 2013 20:50

csaurabh, who are these 'people' you are referring to ? Am I one of them or not ? BTW, how did you so quickly get "people's" assessment of the Princeling's speech ?

vishvak · Post by **vishvak** » 20 Jan 2013 21:09

It is indeed shameful that a young fellow of a dynasty has used so many generic ideas for India to move forward for it shows how the Con party has no better leader even now, more than 65 years since 1947, to improve the common lot of people. Just describe the current situation as not too good at all and not even wonder how such a situation has been brought to the nation. Then claim that the Prince will lead the country, as a part of one political party. Tough times may just be around the corner.

SaiK · Post by **SaiK** » 20 Jan 2013 21:34

The shame is not that dynasty party is suppressing the common man, but the shame is the common man is gullible to accept the dynasty and does not like to think about clean up rather agrees to live in the post-"$h!t hits the fan and stinks" times. This is the same reaction one would expect when you ask for cleaning up the real-estate sector or corruption or bribery or goondas. The gullible large just loves it!, and part parcel of it. The reason, many questions how do we shake up this rot, and replace with a clean system. Only in the hands of the larger section.

Modi needs 2/3rd.. else there is none to clean the $h!t... might not work, as modi needs a system to be formed first with core principles towards the future clean up. The more it is process centric, and correction centric, the better the system will be. Focus on the system replacement. Modi can drive, but he has a big system to counter with.

Supratik · Post by **Supratik** » 20 Jan 2013 22:06

Over the years I have seen a significant section of Indians who blindly believe in the dynasty even when they are highly educated. This speech is directed at them. We have to admit that despite their underachievement a large section of the populace still believe in the INC feudal setup. You can see that in RGs coterie of babalogs who easily get elected. The INC tried experimenting with non-dynasty from Rao to Keshari but the consecutive wins of the BJP jolted them. They have quietly returned to the dynasty. As their vision of India is under challenge from the educated class they have returned to the old formula for fear of loosing power. So dynasty, loan waivers, freebees, election sops, sops for Muslims, etc which were the staple of pre-liberalizaton era are back. The only thing missing is rigging. The INC-pasand media is merely playing to that significant constituency of voters who are still mesmerized by the Gandhis.

chaanakya · Post by **chaanakya** » 20 Jan 2013 22:55

vishvak wrote:It is indeed shameful that a young fellow of a dynasty has used so many generic ideas for India to move forward for it shows how the Con party has no better leader even now, more than 65 years since 1947, to improve the common lot of people. Just describe the current situation as not too good at all and not even wonder how such a situation has been brought to the nation. Then claim that the Prince will lead the country, as a part of one political party. Tough times may just be around the corner.

The life expectancy of Avg India is 67-69 years. By that measure he has already past his prime . How can a 42 year old man is termed youth icon for young India in the age group of 18-35 about 40 Mn people. This fellow is a middle aged man , who has nothing to his credit in terms of worldly success except the fortuitous womb , and has not shown any remarkable talent for being leader pf INC let alone the country. Indeed tough times ahead, for INC.

Manish_Sharma · Post by **Manish_Sharma** » 20 Jan 2013 23:06

http://www.indianexpress.com/news/rahul ... ./1062156/

"My mother came to my room and cried... because she understands that power is poison," Rahul Gandhi said today .......

I remember when maino had kesari beaten up and thrown out thus taking over presidentship and her speeches "main ek vidhwa hoon...." even my congress supporting acquaintances used to be ashamed as I used to tease them. This is pathetic, living in utter luxury , looting Bhartvarsh while enriching italy , these insects make it sound as if a huuuuuuuggee sacrifice. While jawans fighting terrorists of 26/11 are still awaiting pension and benefits..........

Supratik · Post by **Supratik** » 20 Jan 2013 23:10

chaanakya wrote: The life expectancy of Avg India is 67-69 years. By that measure he has already past his prime . How can a 42 year old man is termed youth icon for young India in the age group of 18-35 about 40 Mn people. This fellow is a middle aged man , who has nothing to his credit in terms of worldly success except the fortuitous womb , and has not shown any remarkable talent for being leader pf INC let alone the country. Indeed tough times ahead, for INC.

A lot of people voted for Rajiv because he looked so charming and was fair looking and his mother was so brutally killed. Indians as a whole are still not looking for merit as the main criteria for selecting or electing individuals. You will see that in every sphere from industry to academia to bollywood to media to politics.

member_20317 · Post by **member_20317** » 20 Jan 2013 23:16

Over the years the mechanics of our common lives have been subverted in a manner that is subtle yet potent:
1) people who would normally sport a brahm-bhaav and the part of everybody that sported brahm-bhaav was sought to be shown only the negatives or only the failures of his/their efforts, so that they get frustrated of their own people and are thus waylaid from their dharm;
2) people of normally a kshatra-bhaav and the part of everybody that sported kshatra-bhaav was sought to be branded as risky, evil, or just plain ==;
3) people of vaishya-bhaav and the part of everybody that sported vaishya-bhaav have been threatened with a structure that is build up on favour pulling; and
4) people of shudra-bhaav and the part of everybody that sported shudra-bhaav, have been made to fight over Shahi Tukdas and sleep on innane entertainment and accessorisation.

The Malechas have been super successful with this multi-pronged strategy at all levels. Indics based on their personal assessment driven by their inner complex of strengths and weaknesses have rightly decided they belong together and apart will be mercilessly hunted down are still very low on understanding the nuances of this Medusa.

Just to give you an example pertaining to people of brahm-bhaav who should in the normal course be the leaders:

If anybody hears the line of argueement that says 'Hindutva is against secularism and the basic character of India is secular'.

Then he should ideally have deduced that 'secularism is a foreign ideal', 'he is being made to run after foreign ideals', 'basic character of India is decided by the basic character of the majority here, which is hindu', 'character of hindu is dharmic', 'basic character of India is dharmic', 'dharmic sanskriti is not prima facie meant to threaten', 'hindutva, if threatening, cannot prima facie be made to stick to dharmic' and 'hindutva, if not threatening, is courtsey the dharmic character of the hindu ergo India'.

Then after understanding all this the person ideally should have heard 'Oye, hindu forget that this is your land and your people and we have the right kind of dogs to tear you apart'. This should have been heard because that is what was sought to be communicated. The words are not the communication the whole message is. To get to the message a process of decoding has to be deployed which is basically yogic.

Unfortunately the subtle threat that is held out is entirely missed. The simple failure of logic in the premise gets ignored. Instead what is heard is 'Oh hindus were simpletons and need to be saved by the people who have so comprehensively assessed the situation and are confidently proposing a solution'.

The culprit is not the Malecha. He is doing his dharm of undermining us. The culprit is a frustrated brahm-bhaav that will never be able to tell our people this crucial difference because the brahm-bhaav has been handed over a bunch of jhunjunas. The frustrations will eventually make the prospective brahma-bhaavi feel like he is doing some kind of favour on his own people. Which is basically a trend that gets the 'powers that be' in a negotiating position simply bacause they deal with every 'subject of the kingdom' on an individual basis, the basis where the individual cannot negotiate back with his own strength of 'strength in diversity'.

Chalo bahut hui bakwaasbazi. Baaki teen bhaav ka kya hua wo tum log khud samaj loge.

Gus · Post by **Gus** » 20 Jan 2013 23:33

shyamd wrote:Not true - She is doing the right thing and talking with both UPA & NDA - but she does have a soft corner for NDA.

look..nothing is impossible, if the price is right. after all..the rationalist, secularist and brahmin bashing DMK (feel free to put quotes on all of them) went with BJP and at that time ADMK was allied with con party, IIRC.

But it is hard to imagine JJ propping up Sonia now..a person she kept referring to as 'Antonio Maino'

dozens of times in a televised speech.

If INC needs more MPs, there are far better people to buy than JJ (from their POV).

SwamyG · Post by **SwamyG** » 20 Jan 2013 23:34

One of the problems with Modi is that he is too good with what he does. And it is dangerous because there seems to be nobody behind him. It becomes a clash between Modi vs Nehru-Gandhi. It is not a fight between two political parties or ideologies. In either case, if the winner or loser is co-opted by the enemies of the country, then there is nobody else to stop them. If Modi goes rogue or adopts a stance that does not gel with his followers, then there is nobody in BJP to counsel him without toppling the government or splitting the party. It is well known that any Nehru-Gandhi family member is never questioned. A country's political fortunes rests with sound parties and good system, right now it is based on individuals. Hero worshiping is good in terms of role models.

Sushupti · Post by **Sushupti** » 20 Jan 2013 23:37

@barbarindian
The most prominent aspect of this dynasty is that the largest section of subjects are NOT part of its plan, they are a hindrance.

chaanakya · Post by **chaanakya** » 20 Jan 2013 23:47

Supratik wrote: ................Indians as a whole are still not looking for merit as the main criteria for selecting or electing individuals. You will see that in every sphere from industry to academia to bollywood to media to politics.

While what you say is happening in the country by and large but even that is not working with RG Jr. Within INC what happens is that neither charm nor merit but the Womb matters. Rest of India is not overly impressed by him. Results and ridicule points to that. And he is yet to get the benefit of huge sympathy wave though that could be generated by some powerful events like INC taking on Pakis and showing them their place or another sagrifise in the name of the country... but who??

disha · Post by **disha** » 20 Jan 2013 23:59

chaanakya wrote:... like INC taking on Pakis and showing them their place or another sagrifise in the name of the country... but who??

Pakis taking on bakis is not going to happen.

As one die-hard congi supporter told me, what is Vadra for? After that note, sometimes I wonder if the rest of the congis are using the family for their own selfish ends or is the family using the congis for their own selfish ends or both? With RG elevation in place, and with his own MMS coming to rescue soon (sachin pilot?)., it may be like the daimyo-emperor situation in medieval Japan.

member_20317 · Post by **member_20317** » 21 Jan 2013 00:08

LOL, disha prahji that was some comment.

Also the ghar jamai has nobody to weep for him.

Sushupti · Post by **Sushupti** » 21 Jan 2013 14:06

Sri Narendra Modi reply on Bhagva Atankwad.

suryag · Post by **suryag** » 21 Jan 2013 14:30

NaMo needs to put down some weight for the better of the country. I guess his powerful oratory will help swing some seats in Western UP(where there is scope for polarisation)

sum · Post by **sum** » 21 Jan 2013 14:36

As expected, honarary PA to RG, Sheela Bhatt, brings in Madam Priyanka to show how it was a family show:

Exclusive: Priyanka tweaked Rahul's speech

ahul Gandhi's speech on Sunday moved the scores of Congress leaders present at the party's Chintan Shivir on Sunday and startled even hardened members of the media.

But what most people don't know is that the emotional flourishes and notes, the memories about Rahul's father Rajiv Gandhi [ Images ] and grandmother Indira Gandhi [ Images ], the point about his mother Sonia coming into his room late on Saturday night and weeping, in the speech were added by his sister Priyanka Gandhi [ Images ].

It was Priyanka who inspired Rahul and tweaked his speech. Rahul is known to use Priyanka as his sounding board before he makes important speeches and Sunday was no different.

Priyanka flew into Jaipur [ Images ] on Sunday and was closeted with her brother in a room on the first floor of the Birla Auditorium where the Chintan Shivir was held this weekend.

Both brother and sister then worked on the speech through the day, burnishing it till it shone and was sure to make the impact it did finally.

Priyanka was anxious not to be seen by the media and wanted to leave as soon as she could. A request was then made to Congress leaders to trim their speeches, so that Rahul could deliver his speech.

No sooner had Rahul delivered the last line in his speech, an address which received a standing ovation, its emotional architect had left the venue for Jaipur airport, on the way home to her family.

Standing ovation for this moving family drama!!

RajeshA · Post by **RajeshA** » 21 Jan 2013 16:11

I remember that once when as Ambassador to USA, Meera Shankar referred to Mrs. Sonia Gandhi as a Christian, her comments were not particularly liked by the Congress High Command.

8:00 to 8:30 where Sonia Maino is referred as Christian

Published on Mar 24, 2011
By Maneesh Chhibber
Indian envoy refers to Sonia as ‘Christian,’ reference is deleted: Indian Express

I think there is no need to hide the fact that Mrs. Sonia Maino Gandhi is a Christian, a Catholic, and an Italian, and this is the way she should be projected.

In that spirit, I propose to call Mrs. Sonia Maino Gandhi as Virgin Maria, and Mr. Rahul Gandhi as Baby Gandhi.

Those who are good at photoshopping, you are free to change the faces on these images accordingly and post them over the Internet and use Social Media to show "Indian Secularism" at work.

If one wants to attract attention to this campaign, one should also do it under the banner of a Sonia Gandhi Fan Club! And then let a 100 pictures tell 100 million words.

Arjun · Post by **Arjun** » 21 Jan 2013 18:13

If Modi needs an emotive issue to fire up Hindus - he should consider asking just one single question throughout over the next several months: Are Hindus prepared to live under a government that is likely to consistently demean their religion and associate it with terrorism purely for selfish political purposes whenever the Dynasty wants to a legup on the BJP and win the Islamic vote bank?

The poll bugle was sounded a couple of days back by the Congress - not by announcing Rahul as VP, but by raising the bogey of Hindu & BJP (!!)terrorism again. That fact alone was a 100% indication that the government had started off its poll campaign in earnest.

I think every Hindu needs to deeply reflect on this fact - the Teesta Setalvads of the world who lie, cheat and cook up bestial stories on rampaging Hindus "ripping foeteses" is not a standalone fraud anymore. The Teesta Setalvad mentality is alive and well...and has extended deep roots into Indian society and into government. This mentality can be found on this forum as well, in the persons of Anand K and Vina who would not find anything wrong in outdoing Teesta or looking for the "inner Gujarati" to pin the blame for every riot in India including those against Sikhs perpetrated by Dynasty's mobs...And clearly a government that can accuse the BJP, the only other national party, of terrorism - subscribes to the same copy-book of hate-mongering.

The Dynasty is obviously the core fountainhead of this mentality. Modi, the BJP, Ramdev, the Sangh and others need to work together to show Hindus what the future is likely to be - and it is upto Hindu voters to take a stand.

RajeshA · Post by **RajeshA** » 21 Jan 2013 18:29

Arjun ji,

let's just say that Modi should use other people to ask such questions. He should stick to a positive message. Words used by the candidate can often be twisted and made to sound different! In American Presidential Elections as well, it is the V.P. on the ticket who acts as the attack dog!

RajeshA · Post by **RajeshA** » 21 Jan 2013 18:35

What one needs to do is to expose the Islamo-Christianist Mafia Regime in India for what it is, and the best way to do so is through ridicule. Use Graphic Pictures - Cartoons, Photoshopped Well-Known Motifs, etc. to make the point even better. The more controversial they are the better. Use the Social Media extensively.

An Image is a Hit and Run. Saturate the waves with sarcastic cartoons. Earlier it was the electoral jingles. They still have a place. But one needs to supplement it with graphics.

Complicated Issues can best be described graphically, especially with the use of ridicule.

Hari Seldon · Post by **Hari Seldon** » 21 Jan 2013 19:00

NM's strength is that he's looking beyond a pan-Hindu identity. The latter is a given where NM is concerned. Hindus who identify as Hindus know that NM is one of them.

NM's projection of governance delivered with a record to back it up is the best way to connect with the new age voter, IMO. The nationalism plank isn't something NM has to try too hard at, unlike the Nehrus.

svenkat · Post by **svenkat** » 21 Jan 2013 19:18

Arjunji,
you misread AnandK on his 'inner gujrati' imvvho.What AnandK meant in my view,though he can clarify hs position,was that the docile hindu can erupt when his patience is exhausted.And that the provocation can be caste,language,religion etc.He cited the example of anti-sikh riots.There were anti-sikh riots throughout India right upto Coimbatore where 13 sikhs were muredered(There was a landmark judgement in Madras high court when the HC held the state to be guilty of dereliction of its fundamental duty-to protect the life of its citizens.A very fine lawyer Ms.Geetha Ramaseshan argued in favour of the aggrieved sikhs).These riots were a 'sort of response' to the Hindu baiting,intimidation of Hindus in those dark days in Punjab.More recently in 1991,13 tamils were killed in Bengaluru during the Kaveri agitation riots,in fact the gazetting of the Interim Tibunal Award providing the trigger.

Even today,the Central govt has not gazetted the Kaveri Tribunal final ruling for fear of repurcussions in KA.The SC has reserved judgement on the controversial TN constitutional amendement(utterly unconstitutional) passed during Jayalalithas reign(she had little choice given Karunanidhis chauvinist response in the 'social justice capital' of the world) on 69% reservation,inclusion of creamy layer in these privileges.

Punjab has shown the middle finger to SC on the SYL canal water dispute.There are entrenched organised trade unions who can bring the nation to a standstill if their privileges are tampered with.We are talking of a nation where million people have trillion aspirations,worldviews and grievances.So theres always the fear of failed aspirations,particularly when the expectations are unrealistically high and the even greater fear that this will rebound on the polity and set off centrifugal forces and damage the social fabric of society.

The Hindu world view is not one of 'jaldbaazi',even if we are slow,we want to be sure,we do not want the wagon to be derailed.We are talking about a big,loose family of more than a billion people,some closely knit,some estranged,some of whom are unwanted cousins,some whom we are ashamed to identify as our own.

I do not want you to underestimate the brahminical underpinnings of Congress and the wide support it enjoys across the Hindu society as a centrist party.

Mav,Stan,Nandu,Arun Gupta,vina,perhaps even AnandK are IITians too.There are IITins on both sides of the divide.From the time of Vasishta,there have been brahmanas who have been against wanton aggression and who have sympathised with the downtrodden.(theres a beautiful verse in Rigveda wherein Vasishta invokes the merciful and compassionate Vishnu on behalf of the weak and lowly).Needless to say,I am not supporting any sectarian vaishnava siddhantha.

I am trying to articulate the 'other' view,which I think has legitimacy.Will not answer too many questions on 'their' behalf.

Arjun · Post by **Arjun** » 21 Jan 2013 19:20

Hari Seldon wrote:NM's strength is that he's looking beyond a pan-Hindu identity. The latter is a given where NM is concerned. Hindus who identify as Hindus know that NM is one of them.

NM's projection of governance delivered with a record to back it up is the best way to connect with the new age voter, IMO. The nationalism plank isn't something NM has to try too hard at, unlike the Nehrus.

A difficult question, I agree.

The fact is, it is the Dynasty which has started off this whole campaign by specifically bringing up an emotive issue / polarization / communal issue and accusing the BJP with the canard of "Hindu terrorism".

Are we sure that the rest of India is as mature as Gujarat where development matters over all other issues ? Is there enough data to justify the trust that we repose in the Indian electorate that it would not be swayed by the Dynasty's blatant communalization and instead connect with Modi's development plank ?

If that is the case - that would truly be the India of our dreams, but is it really so ? In India partly the problem is there is very little feedback loop on all of the theorizing that goes on in political circles. In the US, you would probably have one opinion poll or survey every week as to which candidate has more mindshare - but how do we get the same kind of feedback on strategies in India? All I see is some surveys once every quarter or so. Hopefully the parties have their own more reliable feedback mechanism in place - but the Indian public also deserves better.

Hari Seldon · Post by **Hari Seldon** » 21 Jan 2013 19:27

^^ I have no doubt that mainovadis (rhymes with manuvadis) has been slowly boiling the yindu frog. To what extent do people realize this, I don't know. The few examples there are provide little relief - Kerala will soon become (if it hasn't already) yindu minority and yet we see no pan-yindu consolidation. Here and there in fits and starts, bits and pieces but that grand idea that will unify them has yet to come.

Asom is another sad scene example - the native yindu is or will soon become a minority due to brazen votebanking on part of the sekular polity and yet we are yet to see an existentialist backlash and pan-yindu consolidation.

The less said about J&K the better. UP is also all set to follow this yindu self-destructive path. Clearly. AP has already shown the way, IMO. Anyway, keeping reality in mind, what can we do but our little bit here and there? Be the change you want to see and all that.

Anand K · Post by **Anand K** » 21 Jan 2013 20:10

Arjun wrote:If Modi needs an emotive issue to fire up Hindus - ....
I think every Hindu needs to deeply reflect on this fact - the Teesta Setalvads of the world who lie, cheat and cook up bestial stories on rampaging Hindus "ripping foeteses" is not a standalone fraud anymore. The Teesta Setalvad mentality is alive and well...and has extended deep roots into Indian society and into government. This mentality can be found on this forum as well, in the persons of Anand K and Vina who would not find anything wrong in outdoing Teesta or looking for the "inner Gujarati" to pin the blame for every riot in India including those against Sikhs perpetrated by Dynasty's mobs....

Man.... I and "my kind" really do get on your tits, eh? Anyway, I see you didn't read that link to the old 2004 Mil Scenario Thread and get the context. These n00bies I tell you!

Yanyway..... Jai Ho and move along. The Mali thread is way more interesting.... there is less caterwauling and "Woe is Me!!!!" over there. I have a personal stake in that part of the world too BTW. Wake me up in the 2014 elections results thread though..... My prophecy is that it will be a whinefest a-la the 2004 results. MUHUHHAHAHAHAHAHA

PS:
SVenkat-ji,
Moi didn't get into IIT. Didn't even try. Took one look at Morrison & Boyd and J.D. Lee and realized I would be lucky if I could scrape past in Chem in even SDRE state entrance exams. Sucked BIG time in Chem!

But I did spend a good deal of time in IITs during Saarangs and Mood Is though..... the p0rn those guys had!

sum · Post by **sum** » 21 Jan 2013 20:27

Strangely frank article in MSM:

Why Rahul Gandhi will be no match for Narendra Modi

The Congress will be wary of wheeling out Rahul Gandhi, when in all likelihood the Bharatiya Janata Party would field Gujarat Chief Minister Narendra Modi as one of its principal campaigners in the next general elections. Modi's image as a doer, a forceful orator, a great catalyst for the faster industrialisation of Gujarat beats the blankness of Rahul's CV, says Virendra Kapoor.

Only a dimwit would be fooled about the real objective of the Congress party's Jaipur Chintan Shivir. The entire charade was enacted to serenade the Congress's not-so-young prince. All else was peripheral to the exercise.

Mani Shankar Aiyar, who otherwise marks himself out to be quite different from the four-anna Congressmen, did not see anything wrong in beseeching Rahul to take his 'rightful place' at the head of the party.

Another Oxbridge-type -- Minister of External Affairs Salman Khursheed -- did not want to be left behind, proclaiming that Rahul was his leader too. How aside from the fact of his birth in the Gandhi family was he qualified to lead the Grand Old Party with a glorious tradition was not explained.

The unsaid reason for such demeaning flattery of someone who had so far failed to distinguish himself in any field of human activity was that the entire sycophantic lot felt that he could still be a vote-getter.

However, Rahul's record in several state elections duly proved that he was no vote-catcher. Maybe the other reason which made seemingly intelligent Congressmen such as Aiyar behave like unthinking supplicants was that they believed that only a member of the Gandhi family could hold the party together.

Whatever the reason, the orchestrated show in Jaipur was meant to sanctify the fait accompli of the Gandhi scion taking over the reins of the family-owned firm from his mother. That limited goal overshadowed any 'chintan' the party leaders might have done about the grave social, political and economic ills confronting the country.

Against the backdrop of the recent public outrage over the gang-rape of a Delhi girl, and Modi's harnessing of the urban youth to foster a vibrant Gujarat, party president Sonia Gandhi in her scripted speech paid homage to the urban middle-class, noting that its concerns could no longer be neglected.

Traditionally, the party had relied on the illiterate and economically backward masses for winning elections. The change in demographics and the faster rate of urbanisation, particularly post-liberalisation, have forced a rethink in the Congress party.

Notably, the 2009 Lok Sabha poll was unusual in the sense that for the first time the Congress had pipped the BJP in a large number of urban constituencies, a feat credited to the sober and un-Congress-like appeal of Prime Minister Manmohan Singh.

With Singh having become a liability due to his do-nothing approach towards governance even as his ministerial colleagues allegedly loot the national treasury, the Congress fears a wipe-out in the urban areas in the coming polls. The prolonged protests triggered by the gang-rape in Delhi seemed to have jolted it out of its complacency.

But by merely saying that the urban middle class was fed up with corruption scams and that the 'aam-aadmi' faced corruption in his dealings with the government at every level, Sonia was following a well-worn formula.

Again, thanks to the deepening of the democratic process and the growth of the mass media, political literacy has grown tremendously in recent years. It was no longer possible to credit the Gandhis for anything good the government might do, and blame all others but them for its failures. People were no longer so gullible.

Shorn of the gloss, the Chintan Shivir also reflected the growing concern about the dipping popularity graph of the party in a year when it is set to face elections in as many as nine states and one Union territory.

And next year there will be the big one, the Lok Sabha poll. Given its terrible record in governance, it is natural for the Congress to be mighty concerned about its prospects, regardless of the unsettled leadership issue in th

The only thing going for Rahul is his birth in the 'Family'; in the case of Modi that is the least important part of his CV. His image as a doer, a forceful orator, a great catalyst for the faster industrialisation of Gujarat beats the blankness of Rahul's CV.
This must worry all those sycophants, including that rabid Shiv Sainik-turned-rabid-Congressman Sanjay Nirupam. The 'Chintan Shivir', in the final analysis, was all about the party's 'chinta' about its sinking public stock. One fails to see how it can be boosted given the formalisation of the Rahul's status as the number two.

He cannot clear the huge mess on the economic front. Nor can he wipe out the taint of humongous corruption on the forehead of the United Progressive Alliance.

Poor Rahul is like the reluctant bridegroom who must go through the motions of marriage because the 'baraatis' are determined to have a feast. Substitute 'baraatis' for Congressmen and you get an idea of the decline and fall of the Grand Old Party from its halcyon days when it was a genuine vehicle for social and economic change.

RamaY · Post by **RamaY** » 21 Jan 2013 21:04

Hari Seldon wrote:NM's strength is that he's looking beyond a pan-Hindu identity. The latter is a given where NM is concerned. Hindus who identify as Hindus know that NM is one of them.

NM's projection of governance delivered with a record to back it up is the best way to connect with the new age voter, IMO. The nationalism plank isn't something NM has to try too hard at, unlike the Nehrus.

+1008

Arjun · Post by **Arjun** » 21 Jan 2013 21:08

Anand K wrote:Man.... I and "my kind" really do get on your tits, eh?

Anand, I wouldn't exactly put it that way. I do find both Vina and you quite interesting...I am building up this hypothesis regarding Dynasty supporters and while my hypothesis fits well with real life - there is always this scientific curiosity to understand the workings of the mind of this species better. You could call it amateur anthropology - the same urge took me earlier to some of the original habitats of this species.

See, what this hypothesis fundamentally says is that the bulk of Dynasty supporters have either a) no basic sense of right and wrong and foundational values that would come naturally to most other well-adjusted folks (ie the Teesta Setalvad type), or b) are somewhat weak in their mental faculties in being able to logically arrive at a political preference from the values that are important to them, whatever they be.

Of course, in some cases it can be both (a) and (b) - but at least one of them is pretty much a given. So, that in a nutshell is my hypothesis. Being a bit of a scientist, have always been somewhat curious to ascertain if the hypothesis fits for every new Dynasty-nut I run across - but haven't come across any exceptions so far.

Hence my scientific interest in validating my hypothesis with both of you honorary 'seculars and progressives' in the forum...From what little I know of you Anand,

- you have expressed the opinion that the BJP and the Sangh may have been involved in 26/11 to 'polarize' Hindu voters and obtain their votes
- you've stated that the Congress excels in 'char-sau-beesi' but they would still (or perhaps because of this ability) be the right choice for running the country
- in response to a question on how Gujaratis are different, you randomly make reference to some God-forsaken post made in the past which talked about the "inner Gujarati in every Indian responsible for anti-Sikh, Mumbai and other riots"

All of the above indicate to me that you satisfy the 'Teesta Setalvad' part (a) of my hypothesis. Doesn't mean that you don't satisfy part 'b' as well, though. Anyway, if you think I have mis-characterized you - feel free to point out where I am wrong.

member_23629 · Post by **member_23629** » 21 Jan 2013 21:08

Poor Rahul is like the reluctant bridegroom who must go through the motions of marriage because the 'baraatis' are determined to have a feast.