Statewide and National runup to 2014 General elections

[Muppalla]

If the NG's moving out was a Advani camp plan (btw wasnt NG supposed to be a Advani man and against NaMo till yesterday) -- he would not have hinted IT to be careful when BJP comes to power.

This "dissension" is merely a media hype, something to show when nothing exists.

What next Keshubhai Patel was put up by Advani?

There are CTs and there are CTs but seriously folks, as Nachiket said, things are getting really bizarre now.

The dissentions are not media created though I agree on the hype part. There are dissentions and running to media with their views. Media hypes them for sure. But saying that all is well or even this is an orchestrated chanikyan game is other extreme

[johneeG]

If voted to power, we will form Telangana state within 24 hours of forming govt, says BJP

Hyderabad: As protests continued in Hyderabad for the second day in demand for separate statehood for Telangana, Bharatiya Janata Party spokesperson Mukhtar Abbas Naqvi on Monday said that if voted to power, his party would form Telanagna state within 24 hours of forming the government. The government had earlier promised to announce a decision on Telangana issue on January 28 but on Sunday it said that it still needed time to discuss and decide over the matter.

Defending his party-led UPA government's decision, Congress spokesperson Rashid Alvi said that Telangana was a sensitive issue and the party did not want to take a hasty decision. "Telangana is an issue of emotions and sentiments. We can't take a hasty decision. When we will take a decision, we will inform people," he said.

Meanwhile, a group of pro-Telangana students allegedly entererd the chamber of Vice-Chancellor of Kakatiya University in Warangal and threatened to set themselves on fire if police did not intervene. The Vice-Chancellor was not in the chamber, police said. A demonstration was also staged outside the Nizam College hostel in Hyderabad.

The 36-hour 'Samara Deeksha' protest by the pro-Telangana activists at Indira Park in Hyderabad continued for the second day on Monday. Osmania University Joint Action Committee had planned to take out a protest march today from Indira Park to Gun Park in support of the 'Samara Deeksha' agitation of Telangana Joint Action Committee but police foiled the plan.

Students of OUJAC and other organisations removed the barricades near the protest venue and tried to march towards Gun Park after arguing with the police. But security forces, deployed in large numbers, pushed them back. Some protesters were also taken into custody.

'Samara Deeksha' protest started on Sunday afternoon under the aegis of the TJAC at Indira Park, in a bid to step up the pressure on the Centre to announce separate Telangana state. Hitting out at the ruling Congress for not accepting the separate statehood demand so far, TJAC Chairman M Kodandaram said the future plan of action would aim to increase the pressure on the Congress leaders.

(With additional information from PTI)

----
Modi has a larger vote-attracting power than any other leader in BJP, as agreed by Yashwanth. If BJP does not project Modi as the PM candidate then it will lose a golden opportunity. I hope Modi is against smaller-states business and puts an end to this drama, and instead concentrates on real issues like governance, corruption, development, amenities, EJism and Islamism...etc.

[Muppalla]

-LKA PM for a year a two with NM as his deputy and then LKA resigns and NM takes over. IMVHO.

I have been a long proponent of this method. This also removes the need for polarization amongst a certain community by giving them a excuse if they so chose to take it.

Will the communal forces however be intelligent enough to understand what games are being played by their senapati;s or would they go into a self destruct mode?

This is not going to work anymore. I was a fan of LKA but the time is up at this time. No one in the cities can capture the imagination of a 87 year old PM candidate. This is a battle that is DOA.

All the advantages are loaded in favor of UPA. NDA/BJP is looking to give a decent challenge and make it if they lucky. These theories of LKA as PM candidate are just killing even that decent-challenger options.

[Sushupti]

^^^+1000000000000000.

[Muppalla]

Modi has a larger vote-attracting power than any other leader in BJP, as agreed by Yashwanth. If BJP does not project Modi as the PM candidate then it will lose a golden opportunity. I hope Modi is against smaller-states business and puts an end to this drama, and instead concentrates on real issues like governance, corruption, development, amenities, EJism and Islamism...etc.

From pure politics perspective what BJP is doing is good. It will neither gain nor lose anything by putting pressure on INC by means 100 days and 24 hour type rhetoric. However, its main warriors (such as Modi) should not talk one way or other way. Keep it ambiguous. Let the soldiers do all the rhetoric. This is where I did not like LKA, NG and also Sushma Swaraj because they joined the lower level work. Sonia, Rahul, MMS etc talk rarely about Telangana and they all are cause for the situation though.

[RamaY]

^ Agree. It also leaves maneuvering space for leadership.

It is interesting for AP-wallahs, who want BJP to defeat INC. But BJP promises to split AP. I truly hope at the end AP/T will become strong.

[Muppalla]

^ Agree. It also leaves maneuvering space for leadership.

It is interesting for AP-wallahs, who want BJP to defeat INC. But BJP promises to split AP. I truly hope at the end AP/T will become strong.

Right now is the best opportunity to split AP. There is no single party other than INC that is opposed to split. There may not be enthusiasm for the portions of the parties on the non-T side but they are not even getting onto the anti-T stirs and rhetoric. Now the ball is truly in the court of Congress party that rules both AP and India. They should do it actually in less than 24 hours. BJP is inefficient because why do you need 24 hours when there is consensus all over.

[Hari Seldon]

Sonia, Rahul may take a dip at Mahakumbh Mela in Allahabad

They are also expected to take the blessings of Shankaracharya of Jyotirmath Swami Swaroopanand Saraswati in his ashram in the mela area.

Oh, how electoral compulsions force yuvrajmata and yuvraj to hold their noses and jump thru hoops only.... rumor is they'll rush to confessional right afterward to wash away their sin of dippingin the ganga again to, ostensibly, wash away their sins onlee...

Meanwhile, more seriously, twas 24 yrs ago, exactly 2 kumbh melas ago that sadhu samaj decided to revive the RJB agitation and how... 2 yrs later LKA was running riot atop a rath and Laloo soiled his pants and arrested LKA.... what heady days those were....

I've been hoping against hope NM makes a visit to the maha-kumbh and takes the blessing of the sadhu samaj (in general terms, not for any particular project). NM's presence would make waves in UP - both eastern and western. Onlee.

[Sushupti]

Sinha sets up Modi test for Nitish nerves

New Delhi, Jan. 28: BJP leader Yashwant Sinha today pitched Narendra Modi for Prime Minister and put the alliance ball in Nitish Kumar’s court, taking what appears to be a calculated gamble to test if the Bihar ally can afford to walk out of the NDA.

“When I travel, there is a strong demand from common people and (BJP) workers that Modi should be declared as the PM candidate because this will benefit the party. After careful thought, I have concluded that if the BJP declares Modi as its PM candidate, the BJP will benefit hugely in the elections,” said Sinha, a former finance and foreign minister who has been firing the first shots on touchy issues.

Earlier, he told a television channel: “If the Dal (United) willingly leaves the NDA, it will not be stopped. The BJP will look for other options.”

Sinha later told reporters that as one of the NDA’s oldest allies, the Dal (United) would be making a “mistake” if it quit the Opposition alliance. “It should remain in the alliance,” he stressed but demurred at the suggestion that the Bihar chief minister had irreconcilable issues with Modi.

“To target one particular person is unfair. Either the entire party is secular or the entire party is communal. Within the party, you cannot pick and choose. That is a flawed argument,” Sinha contended.

Nitish did not respond till late this evening but Dal (United) chief Sharad Yadav told PTI in a carefully worded response: “Alliances are formed with great difficulty and BJP leader Yashwant Sinha’s statement is uncalled for in the context of alliances.”

In Patna, a close aide to Nitish said the chief minister stood by his earlier condition that the NDA candidate would have to be “secular”.

“We were expecting the orchestra in favour of the Gujarat chief minister. But there are two points. First, Bihar chief minister Nitish Kumar had made it clear about the choice of his candidate for the Prime Minister’s post. Second, it was decided that the BJP would decide the prime ministerial candidate after consulting the NDA constituents. We will make our stand clear whenever that time comes,” the aide said.

Sources said Sinha, whose statement came a day after Modi said he had detailed discussions with BJP chief Rajnath Singh on the 2014 election, was articulating an opinion gaining ground within the party.

A large section of the BJP, particularly members from Bihar and Uttar Pradesh, has been chafing at Nitish’s “shoddy” treatment of Modi, which reached a flashpoint in Patna during the 2011 national executive.

Upset with Modi’s “fans” plastering the state capital with the Gujarat chief minister’s posters — the Bihar elections were barely months away — Nitish called off a dinner he was to host for the BJP leaders. The posters were removed later.

Officially, the BJP reacted with circumspection to Sinha’s statements, neither fully adopting or rejecting it. Rajnath said in Nagpur: “I have not seen the details of Sinha’s comments. But there is no doubt that Modi is the most popular leader we have.”

Several BJP leaders privately concurred with Sinha, maintaining that “beyond a point” they were unprepared to put up with the Bihar chief minister’s “humiliation” of Modi. “He is the only person with the potential to recover the votes we lost between 1999 and 2009 and possibly add another 2 or 3 per cent,” a spokesperson said.

This section feels that Nitish is no longer invincible in Bihar and he needs the NDA as much as the alliance needs him. If he walks out, the split in the upper caste vote will not be compensated by the gain from minority votes because Lalu Prasad still has considerable backing among Muslims.

The BJP sources said they felt that Nitish would read the signals emerging from a Lok Sabha bypoll in Maharajgunj — where Lalu’s candidate will be pitted against Dal (United’s) — and then drop clues on which way he would tilt.

Asked if Modi was fully ready to don the national mantle, a source close to him said from Gujarat: “Yes, he is not doing it for self-glory. It is a task the party might be handing over to him, he will do it to the best of his ability.”

Until last month, the BJP gave the impression it was in no hurry to grapple with the leadership question. Rahul Gandhi’s frontline projection in Jaipur and the perception that he was sure to spearhead the poll campaign injected an unexpected sense of urgency in the BJP.

http://www.telegraphindia.com/1130129/j ... QcciR0Tg44

[RamaY]

HSji

Completely agree on the idea of NM participating in MahaKumbhamela. That would be a good thing in larger context. The blessings of hundreds of thosands of Risis are need of hour and will not go waste.

Also, NM cannot be everywhere all the time. After RSS, the sadhu-Sant is equally strong network of people and interests.

[ShyamSP]

^ Agree. It also leaves maneuvering space for leadership.

It is interesting for AP-wallahs, who want BJP to defeat INC. But BJP promises to split AP. I truly hope at the end AP/T will become strong.

Right now is the best opportunity to split AP. There is no single party other than INC that is opposed to split. There may not be enthusiasm for the portions of the parties on the non-T side but they are not even getting onto the anti-T stirs and rhetoric. Now the ball is truly in the court of Congress party that rules both AP and India. They should do it actually in less than 24 hours. BJP is inefficient because why do you need 24 hours when there is consensus all over.

INC is playing with INC+TRS in T area and INC+YSRC in non-T. If it wants to split, it is for elections so TDP has less time to overcome emotions it generates in both sides.

On the other hand, it may go for United slogan asking AP leaders/money bags to sponsor for Karnataka.

[sum]

Some secular outpouring:
I would’ve led the mob to demolish Taj: Azam Khan

In a major embarrassment to the Uttar Pradesh government, one of its senior ministers Azam Khan has said he would have gladly led the mob to demolish the Taj, as well as calling the world’s most celebrated monument for love a “gross misuse of public money”.

Just as his chief minister was heaving praise on the marbal mausoleum at an industry-government partnership summit in Agra, attended by industrialists from across the globe, Azam Khan said he would have preferred the mob that razed down the Babri Masjit to have brought down the Taj as well.

“Had the rioters demolished the Taj, I would have led the mob,” the senior minister said while speaking at a function at UP's Muzaffarnagar town on Sunday.

Khan, who was in the town to distribute government aid to unemployed boys and girls, also drew parallel between Mughal emperor Shah Jahan and BSP supremo Mayawati, saying that the latter had built statues for herself with public funds just as the emperor did in the 17th century.

[Sushupti]

Some secular outpouring:
I would’ve led the mob to demolish Taj: Azam Khan

In a major embarrassment to the Uttar Pradesh government, one of its senior ministers Azam Khan has said he would have gladly led the mob to demolish the Taj, as well as calling the world’s most celebrated monument for love a “gross misuse of public money”.

Just as his chief minister was heaving praise on the marbal mausoleum at an industry-government partnership summit in Agra, attended by industrialists from across the globe, Azam Khan said he would have preferred the mob that razed down the Babri Masjit to have brought down the Taj as well.

“Had the rioters demolished the Taj, I would have led the mob,” the senior minister said while speaking at a function at UP's Muzaffarnagar town on Sunday.

Khan, who was in the town to distribute government aid to unemployed boys and girls, also drew parallel between Mughal emperor Shah Jahan and BSP supremo Mayawati, saying that the latter had built statues for herself with public funds just as the emperor did in the 17th century.

^^ He is just saying grave worship is haraam,like his coreligionists across the border who blowup dargahas frequently.

[Muppalla]

INC is playing with INC+TRS in T area and INC+YSRC in non-T. If it wants to split, it is for elections so TDP has less time to overcome emotions it generates in both sides.

On the other hand, it may go for United slogan asking AP leaders/money bags to sponsor for Karnataka.

I don't believe that they have any chanikian stuff left. The First Post article is the perfect summary of what INC is here. They screwed the state called AP and disrobed it. The strife that we see is just the shouts of a woman getting raped.

There is no way in the heaven or hell that INC will even win one seat out of 42. Time did really ran out. They only have to go for an unreliable option of depending on YSRC and TRS. It all possible if INC crosses a magical number of 130 seats. I really doubt that if the Thakreys unite.

Regarding spending in KA by AP-INC honchos, they see the game coming to end and even if they have to spend they will first ensure that the T is resolved. They are not paagal to that level.

[RamaY]

Why does he need Hindus do his Islamic duty?

[Aditya_V]

Damn in 2004 , AP was one of India Most progressive states. Yes farmers suffered in the 2002 drought and not enough they felt was done to help them. In 9 years we can all see how the state has developed and Renuka Choudary, INC dream of "PUB Bharo" sirf Dharu Piyo with unprecedented liquor sales happening.

This is the bets example of how not to Govern

[Sanku]

The dissentions are not media created though I agree on the hype part. There are dissentions and running to media with their views. Media hypes them for sure. But saying that all is well or even this is an orchestrated chanikyan game is other extreme

I certainly do not agree with the Chankian theory either, but the current dissension picture is certainly simply a psy-ops tactic by Kangress.

[Sushupti]

Damn in 2004 , AP was one of India Most progressive states. Yes farmers suffered in the 2002 drought and not enough they felt was done to help them. In 9 years we can all see how the state has developed and Renuka Choudary, INC dream of "PUB Bharo" sirf Dharu Piyo with unprecedented liquor sales happening.

This is the bets example of how not to Govern

The State that could have been Gujarat

Speaking as a Telugu and a native of the State of Andhra Pradesh, this columnist finds it inexplicable that in my lifetime the State has had no record of producing a pan-Andhra leader who combined both vision and execution with an unimpeachable political ethic that transcended regions, castes and factions. The late NTR, while being a pan-Andhra phenomenon, was high on rhetoric, low on execution and had little to show on political ethics. The Congress did not have a mass leader in the decades prior and continued to not have one till the perennial dissident YS Rajashekhar Reddy decided to walk the State and win its confidence in 2004.

http://www.niticentral.com/2013/01/the- ... jarat.html

[Yagnasri]

We can not fully write of NTR sir. He did tired to bring in change like basic education, roads and busses with RTC nationalisation, Attempt create a national level front against INC etc are good. But yes he is more into drama and less into work. Further too much Kamma feeling was also there. CBN any day better than INC fellows. But he lacked political vision and now showing too much political drama.

T agitation killed AP for at least 10 years. Sometimes I wonder if this is all some plan from Chiddu to remove Hyd are a software hub rival to Chennai. We can never know.

[Aditya_V]

We can not fully write of NTR sir. He did tired to bring in change like basic education, roads and busses with RTC nationalisation, Attempt create a national level front against INC etc are good. But yes he is more into drama and less into work. Further too much Kamma feeling was also there. CBN any day better than INC fellows. But he lacked political vision and now showing too much political drama.

T agitation killed AP for at least 10 years. Sometimes I wonder if this is all some plan from Chiddu to remove Hyd are a software hub rival to Chennai. We can never know.

Aw come on, Chiddu alone, what about TRS, YSR & Co. could have a lot of things then to move all Business to CHennai. What about Mumbai, Delhi and others.

Was Chiddu working alone for the Interests of TN, Chiddu becomes a Tamilian only for this and suddenly has B**** to convice the ENtire INC leadership including 2G's to tow their line.

Please stand back back and look at this, I doubt this TN angle has anything to play in this.

Don't you think If Chiddu had such power then he would have extended the TN border from Hosur 25KM northwestwards to cover Electronics CIty and Sarjapur Road.

[RajeshA]

Some secular outpouring:
I would’ve led the mob to demolish Taj: Azam Khan

First Owaisi and now Azam Khan. The "syncretic", the Mughlai high-culture, is slowly giving wave unapologetic Salafism.

[sunnyP]

-LKA PM for a year a two with NM as his deputy and then LKA resigns and NM takes over. IMVHO.

I have been a long proponent of this method. This also removes the need for polarization amongst a certain community by giving them a excuse if they so chose to take it.

Will the communal forces however be intelligent enough to understand what games are being played by their senapati;s or would they go into a self destruct mode?

Do you really think a man in his late 80s could physically handle a post like Prime Minister-ship, even if it's for a year?

The lack of sleep, the travelling, parliamentary duties, press duties, party duties etc etc - I don't think an 87 year old man can do this.

[Singha]

well 80 yr old MMS seems to be managing just fine...

http://www.hindustantimes.com/India-new ... 03357.aspx

ram jethmalani says Modi is 100% sikular and fit to be PM

[Virendra]

Rajasthan Update :-
I talked to some of the guys during my visit.
Some said that BJP is in shambles and Vasundhara keeps shuttling between Delhi and Jaipur. Opposition is like a student bunking college regularly.
Some hoped that BJP would get its act together in the typical 'last-minute' Indian way before elections.
Others said that because there aren't any huge issues/opposition played in the public against Gehlot Govt. the Congress may be coming back in absence of anti-incumbency.
State BJP has some leaders Ghanshyam Tiwari and Gulabchand Kataria who have ambitions but 'Madam' (Vasundhara) holds similar overwhelming weight and aura as what Modi has in Gujarat BJP. Understandably some are suffocated.
Gehlot is playing smart and well timed strokes. He has many infrastructure/facilities inaugurations lined up. Prominent among them is the Metro's first line that opens June-July this year. Elections are in November.
Biggest danger for Congress as of now seems to be the changing dynamics of caste politics. More and more OBC demands are being made and Jats are getting rallied to avoid any partition of their pie. Caste games are getting bitter by the day.
Jats strength is still increasing but they're finding many more enemies in form of Meenas, Gurjars, Rajputs etc and are also finding it difficult to contain infighting.
Even last time they lost a few sure shot seats because as many as 4 Jat candidates stood up on the same constituencies.
Muslims have openly expressed their rigid view of going with Religion / Congress .. no third possibility.
Even when last time my father campaigned for a candidate he supported. The area's muslims accepted candidly that the candidate was a good guy. But said that they were going to vote en masse and it was already fixed. This candidate being a non-muslim from BJP couldn't hope for their votes at all.
Rajasthan's nutshell is that people vote for caste and creed; sometimes even overlooking the work done by a candidate.

Regards,
Virendra

[RamaY]

Some secular outpouring:
I would’ve led the mob to demolish Taj: Azam Khan

First Owaisi and now Azam Khan. The "syncretic", the Mughlai high-culture, is slowly giving wave unapologetic Salafism.

Does it mean people are going to stop praying at Tajmahal? Do you think they go the Algeria (or is it?) way where the salafists destroyed all symbols of islamic idolworship?

Can secular GoI and constitution stop Muslims destroying their own symbols of idol-worship? Say for example Dargas, Taj Mahals etc.,?

Very confusing onlee...

[Muppalla]

.
State BJP has some leaders Ghanshyam Tiwari and Gulabchand Kataria who have ambitions but 'Madam' (Vasundhara) holds similar overwhelming weight and aura as what Modi has in Gujarat BJP. Understandably some are suffocated.

Thanks for the update. Survey after survey are putting a huge win for BJP and the madam is very popular according to surveys and polls.

Does the above gents can bring any votes? Even for their own seats? Kataria is being propped up by RSS and they are all doing smear campaign. Overall all of them will together look like ....?

[Sanku]

Do you really think a man in his late 80s could physically handle a post like Prime Minister-ship, even if it's for a year?

The lack of sleep, the travelling, parliamentary duties, press duties, party duties etc etc - I don't think an 87 year old man can do this.

You certainly have a point, I have two responses
1) Advani is doing a number of those even now -- he did a rath yatra even last year -- a doughty old man -- and he does not even have the GoI support system which a PM gets.
2) While some of the duties you have outlined are certainly there -- the most important role of a PM is not the babu duty, it is political helmsman-ship, decision making, which others can implement, basically impose political authority on the most important issue.

Here I envisage Advani merely as a father figure to overall moderate the functioning of his cabinet.

[Muppalla]

^^^
The most important thing is not respect or age but should be able to convince his own team that he is capable of getting the BJP supporters to vote for him. Rest is all maya and paper discussion. At this time population is not convinced or the BJP teams are not convinced that Advani can achieve it. Hence he has to exit.

[ramana]

Virendra thanks for the vignette. Wasn't late Shekawat responsible for getting the BJP defeated in order to deny Vasundara Scinida the CM post? He raised some bogus Rajput vs rest issue and ensured BJp gets defeated.


Sanku,
As Home Minster LKA should have driven the nail in the ISI coffin. But he didn't release the white paper.
All he did was to sabotage ABV constantly and get himself the Dy PM post.

Later LKA had a great chance in 2006 to bring no confidence motion and pull down MMS. He didnt do that.

In 2009 he had a great chance to defeat the UAP. Instead he put up dummy candidates and lost the BJP margin by 100 seats.

He then had his nonsense about Jinnah is my friend.

He has had his chance and should retire gracefully instead of being a crab that pulls down the others.
From all accounts he had a big hand in the Karnataka BJP flailing and we see the results now.

[muraliravi]

Do you really think a man in his late 80s could physically handle a post like Prime Minister-ship, even if it's for a year?

The lack of sleep, the travelling, parliamentary duties, press duties, party duties etc etc - I don't think an 87 year old man can do this.

You certainly have a point, I have two responses
1) Advani is doing a number of those even now -- he did a rath yatra even last year -- a doughty old man -- and he does not even have the GoI support system which a PM gets.
2) While some of the duties you have outlined are certainly there -- the most important role of a PM is not the babu duty, it is political helmsman-ship, decision making, which others can implement, basically impose political authority on the most important issue.

Here I envisage Advani merely as a father figure to overall moderate the functioning of his cabinet.

Sanku Sir,

No offence, but i feel for some reason you are obsessed with advani. I can tell you one thing and i believe, i speak for over 90% of potential bjp voters under age 30. We will just not vote for bjp if all they can come up with is this 86 yr old guy for pm. NaMo it is and he is the only one.

I just dont understand this convoluted logic to support advani

[fanne]

Advani is great. He was responsible for making the NDA government and making ABV PM. He did mobilize the right wing like nothing before with the Rath Yatra (which was a copy of nyay yatra of Gujarat before which one NM had brainchild). He was a great candidate for PM from 1990 to 2004. I would have voted him over ABV myself. In 2009 he was past his selling point (age is some respect as dhimmified and brainwashed youth vote would have not voted for him, but more so, he was no longer LKA of 1990s, politics was more SoundBits and tactical compromises and most importantly, his team of yesteryear was gone - Nana Deshmukh, OP Mathur, NM, UB, it was replaced by 'intellectuals and Drawing room politicians' like SK, SS, mythical D4). In 2014 he has all that baggage and most importantly he will not bring the votes that NM can. He can however bring more partners than NM. This is just a matter of cold calculation for BJP. Have many (repeat many) independent surveys to see what is gained by bringing NM (AND BEFORE IT HAS HAPPENNED THAT BJP lost after all parties had selected their candidates). If he brings more than potential partners (I can think 3 - JDU/Naveen and Mamta), then he is the way to go. Rest that advani is handsome or Sushma is Gandhi'S great granddaughter or D4 fart smells better is irrelevant to the discussion. If you can win the election you lead, your history/pedigree/look/skills/character/leadership skills/ team playerness/liking/disliking/oratory should have no bearing. Not to say that NM does not have some of the qualities mentioned, but even if he is a scum, but can win election for BJP he should lead.
rgds,
fanne

[Sanku]

I just dont understand this convoluted logic to support advani

murali-ji. fanne-ji in the above post said it better than I could. Advani has a great advantage (which you see as disadvantage) -- age -- be can easily be via media to smoothly work out the leadership issue, owing to his seniority, he can act as a means to solve the conundrum.

Everyone has a role, its just that people should approach it with due understanding.

[muraliravi]

Advani is great. He was responsible for making the NDA government and making ABV PM. He did mobilize the right wing like nothing before with the Rath Yatra (which was a copy of nyay yatra of Gujarat before which one NM had brainchild). He was a great candidate for PM from 1990 to 2004. I would have voted him over ABV myself. In 2009 he was past his selling point (age is some respect as dhimmified and brainwashed youth vote would have not voted for him, but more so, he was no longer LKA of 1990s, politics was more SoundBits and tactical compromises and most importantly, his team of yesteryear was gone - Nana Deshmukh, OP Mathur, NM, UB, it was replaced by 'intellectuals and Drawing room politicians' like SK, SS, mythical D4). In 2014 he has all that baggage and most importantly he will not bring the votes that NM can. He can however bring more partners than NM. This is just a matter of cold calculation for BJP. Have many (repeat many) independent surveys to see what is gained by bringing NM (AND BEFORE IT HAS HAPPENNED THAT BJP lost after all parties had selected their candidates). If he brings more than potential partners (I can think 3 - JDU/Naveen and Mamta), then he is the way to go. Rest that advani is handsome or Sushma is Gandhi'S great granddaughter or D4 fart smells better is irrelevant to the discussion. If you can win the election you lead, your history/pedigree/look/skills/character/leadership skills/ team playerness/liking/disliking/oratory should have no bearing. Not to say that NM does not have some of the qualities mentioned, but even if he is a scum, but can win election for BJP he should lead.
rgds,
fanne

Fanne,

Advani will give this logic that he can bring naveen, nitish and mamta, so make me the face. But he will not tell you, that because of him bjp will lose 60 odd seats elsewhere. Naveen can come with modi also. Modi does not need nitish to win bihar. Mamta will not touch bjp anymore, period.

Advani pack ur bags, with u as face under 30 india will kill bjp in 100 odd urban seats. He can never compensate that with any ally. On top of all this, tomorrow jaya might say she will support ONLY modi and she brings 30+ seats.

[Muppalla]

murali-ji. fanne-ji in the above post said it better than I could. Advani has a great advantage (which you see as disadvantage) -- age -- be can easily be via media to smoothly work out the leadership issue, owing to his seniority, he can act as a means to solve the conundrum.

Everyone has a role, its just that people should approach it with due understanding.

Let us be practical. That work through media is impossible. BJP is something like a situation like this:

One of Indian General (not the young commando) is dropped in the midst of Paki-Talibs (no non-sense or who will not listen type varieties) and asked him to do a mission. If it is a commando he has a chance (not success) but a General inspite of all his experiance will not survive.

Propping up LKA is done these day by folks who just even cannot win a ward in a panchayat election. I hope you are not falling in the trap.

[muraliravi]

I just dont understand this convoluted logic to support advani

murali-ji. fanne-ji in the above post said it better than I could. Advani has a great advantage (which you see as disadvantage) -- age -- be can easily be via media to smoothly work out the leadership issue, owing to his seniority, he can act as a means to solve the conundrum.

Everyone has a role, its just that people should approach it with due understanding.

Boss, advani had his chance in 2009 and partially even in 2004. What has changed now and why do you think he can win elections for bjp in 2014 if he cud not do it in 2009.

Media will love advani, u know why? "BECAUSE HE CANT WIN THE ELECTION FOR BJP"

[member_20317]

Sanku ji nothing can be done via the Indian media.

The financials and operations of the business are such that Indian media will have a strong networking with Kongis and various B teams. Indian Media is a socil engineering vehicle with drivers behind tinted glasses.

The best Sangh can hope for in a BJP dispensation is that they will have the initiative to deflect/misdirect/harass the drivers. But Sangh can pretty much forget to be in the drivers seat. And without the drivers seat no leader can create a favourable atmosphere for his understudy. Assuming the understudy-trainer relationship comes into being in the first place. Vishkanya is trying that for Man-baby and despite the stranglehold on the Indian Media you have the results we witness.

[Sanku]

Boss, advani had his chance in 2009 and partially even in 2004. What has changed now and why do you think he can win elections for bjp in 2014 if he cud not do it in 2009.

Media will love advani, u know why? "BECAUSE HE CANT WIN THE ELECTION FOR BJP"

ravi_g, muppalla ji folks, I meant

via media, as in medium to solve , not as in using media.


I do not agree with the analysis on Advani and number of votes, in fact I do not agree that a "leader" pulls in vote esp for BJP. What pulls in votes in the Sangh, the organization. The leaders are only important to an extent. What failed in 2009 was BJP as a party, and also Indian electorate.

And I am not impressed with the voting of 30s something. We have yet to see if they vote in large numbers and for who in any reasonable manner.

[muraliravi]

Boss, advani had his chance in 2009 and partially even in 2004. What has changed now and why do you think he can win elections for bjp in 2014 if he cud not do it in 2009.

Media will love advani, u know why? "BECAUSE HE CANT WIN THE ELECTION FOR BJP"

ravi_g, muppalla ji folks, I meant

via media, as in medium to solve , not as in using media.


I do not agree with the analysis on Advani and number of votes, in fact I do not agree that a "leader" pulls in vote esp for BJP. What pulls in votes in the Sangh, the organization. The leaders are only important to an extent. What failed in 2009 was BJP as a party, and also Indian electorate.

And I am not impressed with the voting of 30s something. We have yet to see if they vote in large numbers and for who in any reasonable manner.

Yah rite, the sangh pulled in votes for bjp in gujarat. Of course they can also help bjp win in rajasthan without vasundhara raje. Fact is in both cases they were against bjp in gujarat and rajasthan.

[Sanku]

Yah rite, the sangh pulled in votes for bjp in gujarat. Of course they can also help bjp win in rajasthan without vasundhara raje. Fact is in both cases they were against bjp in gujarat and rajasthan.

Yes, Sangh pulled in votes for BJP in Gujarat. When even a small section of Sangh breaks away NaMo loses 4 seats despite gaining vote shares.

BJP is part of sangh, the statement that sangh was against BJP makes no sense whatsoever, this sort of discussion is in MSM not for BRF.

[fanne]

I guess the point was lost in my long winded reply. I personally believe NM may be better than Advani to lead. If BJP gains 60 seats because of NM but loses these three allies (say they also bring +- 60 seats), one should go with NM. But that homework needs to be done and I hope they are doing it.
rgds,
fanne
Ps- Btw does anyone have the pdf of Nielson survey?